Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:29 AM - Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (danhelsper@aol.com)
2. 04:33 AM - Re: steel tube fuselage (womenfly2)
3. 06:06 AM - Re: Jack's new Piet (AircamperN11MS)
4. 06:58 AM - Re: steel tube fuselage (William Wynne)
5. 07:10 AM - Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (Jack)
6. 07:20 AM - Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (John Hofmann)
7. 09:22 AM - Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (Ben Charvet)
8. 09:47 AM - Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (jarheadpilot82)
9. 10:06 AM - Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (William Wynne)
10. 01:04 PM - Re: Re: steel tube fuselage (Bill Budgell)
11. 02:14 PM - Re: steel tube fuselage (stearmandriver)
12. 02:43 PM - Re: Re: steel tube fuselage (Michael Conkling)
13. 06:10 PM - Re: Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (Yahoo! Account Service)
14. 06:58 PM - Re: Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? (Ben Charvet)
15. 11:01 PM - Official Pietenpol-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
16. 11:05 PM - Official Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
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Subject: | Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
Mr. Fernando Risso from Argentina monitors this list. He is planning to build a
Pietenpol, and has asked me off-list whether there will be any folks at Sun N
Fun that own Pietenpols that he can talk with when he visits there? Please chime-in
if you can.
Dan Helsper
Loensloe Airfield
Puryear, TN
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: steel tube fuselage |
For a Steel tube fuselage I would gas weld, lower cost for the welding setup and
easier for a beginner to learn.
I would suggest you look at a DVD from TM Technologies, AKA: Kent White. He has
a great video on 4130 Airframe Construction, plus you can rent the DVD's too.
He also has great products that do work for aircraft building. I love the Meco
Torch he has for welding Fuselages and Aluminum brazing & welding fuel tanks,
sheet metal and such. He DVD's are very educational, will worth the time to
watch.
Just a miss conception here, Piper, Taylorcraft, & Boeing did use 1020 tubing but
only in the up rights and diagonal bracing, basically in low load areas. All
the longerons were 4130 and any high load tubes were too e.g. wing support structures,
landing gears, motor mounts, etc.
I say ... do it.
My 5 worth,
WF2
--------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440136#440136
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Subject: | Re: Jack's new Piet |
Congratulations Jack for the completion and first flight of your beautiful looking
Piet. I watched the video during lunch yesterday. Whoever did that did a
great job.
May you have many wonderful hours flying your machine.
Cheers,
--------
Scott Liefeld
Flying N11MS since March 1972
Steel Tube
C-85-12
Wire Wheels
Brodhead in 1996
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440140#440140
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Subject: | Re: steel tube fuselage |
Builders,
Small but important correction: Many pre-war light planes were built of 1025 tubing,
not 1020. there is a difference in strength, but mostly I wanted to point
that out because I didn't want anyone to read it and get started shopping and
mistakenly buy 1020 tubing because it is cheap. It isn't up for the job. And
by the time you find 1025, you might as well buy 4130.
There is less than 50 pounds of tubing in a Piet, including waste cut off. The
average price of 4130 is less than $10 a pound from aircraft spruce. $500 for
the tubing in a fuselage isn't a fortune, and choosing to try to save money there
is poor judgment. It is a myth that 1025 is significantly easier to weld;
If you could only weld one, but couldn't do another that was 10% harder, you need
a lot more practice because that isn't an acceptable margin of skill for welds
that fly
Start with a tig, learn the skill, invest in yourself. If you don't have the money,
go back to wood as a material. First time gas welded fuselages often have
poor fitting attachments, and the same weldor would have done a much better job
with a tig, even a cheap one.
Our own plane, the Wagabond started life as a 1964 Piper PA-22-108. It was the
10th to last Piper ever built at Lockhaven, Were 50,000 steel tube fuselages were
gas welded. The welds are magnificent on it, done by people who all lost their
jobs the following week. That kind of gas welding takes longer to learn than
tig welding with the advancements of auto helmets and superimposed HF for
starting.
More stories on welding: http://flycorvair.net/2014/01/23/cc28-last-call-for-motor-mounts-etc-2/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440144#440144
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
Dan,
I will be at Sun N Fun all week. I'm an aircraft judge and he can look me up
at the judges area behind the antique type tent. I'll be glade to share wit
h him all little that I know=F0=9F=98=9C
Jack
Sent from my iPad
> On Apr 1, 2015, at 6:28 AM, danhelsper@aol.com wrote:
>
> Mr. Fernando Risso from Argentina monitors this list. He is planning to bu
ild a Pietenpol, and has asked me off-list whether there will be any folks a
t Sun N Fun that own Pietenpols that he can talk with when he visits there? P
lease chime-in if you can.
>
> Dan Helsper
> Loensloe Airfield
> Puryear, TN
>
>
==========================
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==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
I will be in the type club tent all week and will also be doing a
Pietenpol forum for those wanting to build. I will post the times soon.
Best,
-john-
> On Apr 1, 2015, at 9:09 AM, Jack <fastnaught@windstream.net> wrote:
>
> Dan,
> I will be at Sun N Fun all week. I'm an aircraft judge and he can look
me up at the judges area behind the antique type tent. I'll be glade to
share with him all little that I know=F0=9F=98=9C
> Jack
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Apr 1, 2015, at 6:28 AM, danhelsper@aol.com
<mailto:danhelsper@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> Mr. Fernando Risso from Argentina monitors this list. He is planning
to build a Pietenpol, and has asked me off-list whether there will be
any folks at Sun N Fun that own Pietenpols that he can talk with when he
visits there? Please chime-in if you can.
>>
>> Dan Helsper
>> Loensloe Airfield
>> Puryear, TN
>>
>>
>> ========================
>> >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
>> ========================
>> cs.com
>> ========================
>> matronics.com/contribution
>> ========================
>>
>
>
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
<http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
I will be in the wood workshop all week. We will be making ribs and tailfeat
hers
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 1, 2015, at 10:19 AM, John Hofmann <jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com> wrot
e:
>
> I will be in the type club tent all week and will also be doing a Pietenpo
l forum for those wanting to build. I will post the times soon.
>
> Best,
> -john-
>
>
>> On Apr 1, 2015, at 9:09 AM, Jack <fastnaught@windstream.net> wrote:
>>
>> Dan,
>> I will be at Sun N Fun all week. I'm an aircraft judge and he can look me
up at the judges area behind the antique type tent. I'll be glade to share w
ith him all little that I know=F0=9F=98=9C
>> Jack
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Apr 1, 2015, at 6:28 AM, danhelsper@aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>> Mr. Fernando Risso from Argentina monitors this list. He is planning to b
uild a Pietenpol, and has asked me off-list whether there will be any folks a
t Sun N Fun that own Pietenpols that he can talk with when he visits there? P
lease chime-in if you can.
>>>
>>> Dan Helsper
>>> Loensloe Airfield
>>> Puryear, TN
>>>
>>>
>>> =========
>>> >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
>>> =========
>>> cs.com
>>> =========
>>> matronics.com/contribution
>>> =========
>>>
>>
>>
>> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List" class="">htt
p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
>> class="">http://forums.matronics.com
>> class="">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>
>
>
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
Skip Gadd is already there and will be there for the entire time working with Ben
(I assume) in the Hands On Woodworking Area.
--------
Semper Fi,
Terry Hand
Athens, GA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440161#440161
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
Dan,
Since Mr. Risso is traveling 5,000 miles, I would like to see if we can get him
a flight in a Piet if possible. I Don't know if Ben or any of the other SnF gang
will be flying in, and that airshow is really a restrictive setting for a
demonstration. As an alternative, if it can be put together, We will have Bob
Lester's Piet at Corvair College #33 90 miles up the road at the Eustis airport,
which is the perfect setting for a Piet flight.
.
Bob's Plane is the last picture at this link: http://flycorvair.net/2014/11/18/pietenpol-builders-and-pilots-at-corvair-college-31/ At Barnwell he gave a number of flights, and his plane is powerful enough to safely pull the weight of any passenger who can fit into the front pit. Some of the people he flew at at Barnwell were 260+ pounds, and the plane still has a very strong climb rate. He has a first class engine with a 5th bearing and an MA3-spa arrangement.
.
Normally we need to have everyone headed to a college sign up, but in the case
of Mr. Risso, Grace and I will be glad to have him as a personal guest. If any
of you guys are going to be his guide/driver in Florida, we will be glad to have
you for the day also. The College is a little before SnF, but if can be made
to work, I will coordinate stuff on our end. If one of you guys would like
to put this together, email me off list at WilliamTCA@aol.com. -ww.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440162#440162
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: steel tube fuselage |
My piper drawings from the factory show 1025 mild steel tube threw out the
complete aircraft right up to PA-18 cub
=C2- From: womenfly2 <Love2Fly.KAP@gmail.com>
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 1, 2015 7:33 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: steel tube fuselage
For a Steel tube fuselage I would gas weld, lower cost for the welding setu
p and easier for a beginner to learn.
I would suggest you look at a DVD from TM Technologies, AKA: Kent White. He
has a great video on 4130 Airframe Construction, plus you can rent the DVD
's too. He also has great products that do work for aircraft building. I lo
ve the Meco Torch he has for welding Fuselages and Aluminum brazing & weldi
ng fuel tanks, sheet metal and such. He DVD's are very educational, will wo
rth the time to watch.
Just a miss conception here, Piper, Taylorcraft, & Boeing did use 1020 tubi
ng but only in the up rights and diagonal bracing, basically in low load ar
eas. All the longerons were 4130 and any high load tubes were too e.g. wing
support structures, landing gears, motor mounts, etc.
I say ... do it.
My 5=C3=82=C2=A2 worth,
WF2
--------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440136#440136
S -
-
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: steel tube fuselage |
Thanks for the civil replies to my ramblings! I have all the drawings for early
Pipers and the A75N1 from Boeing. I must have missed the 4130N for the high
stress areas. Absolutely correct on 1020 vs. 1025. TIG welding is so precise
and enjoyable for me, but I still think a beginning welder is well served by
learning puddle control with a gas setup. A good gas welder will be an excellent
TIG welder once the myriad of subtleties are learned. I think gas welding
is a great training tool for people wanting to get started with TIG.
Best Regards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440170#440170
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: steel tube fuselage |
Hello Folks,
When my TIG instructor asked about what welding experience I did have, I
told him it was mainly gas welding & brazing on bicycle frames -- His
response was " all you need to do is make smaller circles..."
Mike C.
Pretty Prairie, KS
On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 4:13 PM, stearmandriver <pwr2800@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Thanks for the civil replies to my ramblings! I have all the drawings for
> early Pipers and the A75N1 from Boeing. I must have missed the 4130N for
> the high stress areas. Absolutely correct on 1020 vs. 1025. TIG welding is
> so precise and enjoyable for me, but I still think a beginning welder is
> well served by learning puddle control with a gas setup. A good gas welder
> will be an excellent TIG welder once the myriad of subtleties are learned.
> I think gas welding is a great training tool for people wanting to get
> started with TIG.
>
> Best Regards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440170#440170
>
>
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
Yes, I will be here all week in the Hands On Woodworking Area, just across the
street from the International Welcome Tent. Ben and Jack will also be there and
Piet people usually drop by all the time. If Mr. Risso can make it by I'm sure
he will get lots of Piet talk, and we will make him feel welcome.
Skip
-----Original Message-----
>From: jarheadpilot82 <jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com>
>Sent: Apr 1, 2015 12:46 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun?
>
>
>Skip Gadd is already there and will be there for the entire time working with
Ben (I assume) in the Hands On Woodworking Area.
>
>--------
>Semper Fi,
>
>Terry Hand
>Athens, GA
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440161#440161
>
>
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun? |
If you hang around a while we will put you to work!
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 1, 2015, at 9:10 PM, Yahoo! Account Service <skipgadd@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
> Yes, I will be here all week in the Hands On Woodworking Area, just across the
street from the International Welcome Tent. Ben and Jack will also be there
and Piet people usually drop by all the time. If Mr. Risso can make it by I'm
sure he will get lots of Piet talk, and we will make him feel welcome.
> Skip
>
> -----Original Message-----
>> From: jarheadpilot82 <jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com>
>> Sent: Apr 1, 2015 12:46 PM
>> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet owners at Sun N Fun?
>>
>>
>> Skip Gadd is already there and will be there for the entire time working with
Ben (I assume) in the Hands On Woodworking Area.
>>
>> --------
>> Semper Fi,
>>
>> Terry Hand
>> Athens, GA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440161#440161
>
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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Subject: | Official Pietenpol-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the Pietenpol-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below. The
complete Pietenpol-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Pietenpol-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
[ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as
Courier. Proportional fonts will cause display formatting errors. ]
This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
************************************************************
******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS *******
************************************************************
PLEASE READ. This document contains Pietenpol-List policies and information
for new and old subscribers. Understanding the Pietenpol-List policies will
minimize problems for the Administrator, and will help keep the Pietenpol-List
running smoothly for all of us.
******************************************
*** Quick Start Guide to List Features ***
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There are many features available on the Matronics Email Lists and each
one is described in detailed below. However, using the List Navigator
you can quickly access the complete set of features available for this
List. The List Navigator can be found at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
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select the List(s) that you wish to subscribe or unsubscribed from. You
may also use the handy "Find" function to determine the exact syntax of
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complete instructions at the top of the Web Page for more information.
The Subscribe/Unsubscribe web page is:
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you will receive TWO conformation emails regarding your subsciption
process. The first verifies that your subscription/unsubsciption request
was received, and the second confirms that the process has been completed.
You should receive the first email within a few minutes of your request.
The second conformation will arrive in less than 24 hours. You cannot post
until you receive the second conformation email message.
*****************************
*** How to Post a Message ***
*****************************
Send an email message to:
pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Your message will be redistributed to everyone currently subscribed
to the List.
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Remember, however, that the syntax of your email address is very important
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Each day, starting at 12 midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be started.
This digest will contain the same information that is currently appended
to the archive file. It has all of the headers except for the "From:"
and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator consisting
of a line of underscores.
Each day at 23:55 PST US, the day's messages as described above will be
combined and sent as a single message to everyone on the digest email list.
To subscribe to the digest list, use the same subscription web form
described above, and just select the Digest version of the List.
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you *can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions
of the List at the same time. This is perfectly acceptable.
Now some caveats:
* Messages sent to "pietenpol-list-digest" will be forwarded to the standard
email list. In other words, you cannot post messages only to the
digest List.
* If you are subscribed to both the regular List and the digest List, you
will receive the realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of
the day.
* If you reply to the digest email, your message will be forwarded to the
normal list associated with the digest. Important Note: Please change
the subject line to reflect the topic of your response! Also, please
*do not include all or most of the digest in your reply*.
****************************
*** List Digest Browser ***
****************************
An archive of all the List Digests can be found online in either plain text
or HTML format. These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted to
the Digest email list on the given day. The Digest Archives can be found
at the following location:
http://www.matronics.com/digest
*****************************************
*** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag ***
*****************************************
At times, your message may concern something that is revelent only to a very
small number of persons or to a limited area, and you may not wish to archive
it. In such a case, simply put the following phrase anywhere in the
message:
do not archive
Your message will not be appended to the archive, but will be sent to List
email distribution as normal.
**********************************************
***** READ THIS - Automatic Unsubscribes *****
**********************************************
Note that if your email address begins to cause problems such as bounced
email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your address will be promptly
removed from the List. If you discover that you are no longer receiving
messages from the Pietenpol-List, go to the following Web page, and look
for your email address and a possible reason for your removal.
The Matronics Email List uses utility called the "Email Weasel" that
automatically looks though the day's bounced email for addresses that
caused problems due to common things like "user is unknown", "mailbox
full", etc. If the Email Weasel removes your email address from the
Lists you will find record of it at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/unsubscribed
If the problem listed on the web site above has been resolved, please feel
free to resubscribe to the Lists of your choice.
*******************************
*** List Member Information ***
*******************************
If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and
paper mail address in the following format:
smith@somehost.com
Joe Smith
123 Airport Lane
Tower, CA 91234-1234
098-765-1234 w
123-456-7890 h
Please forward this information to the following email address:
requests@matronics.com
I have a file of such things, that I typically use to contact you when
there are problems with your email address. The information will NOT
be used for any other commercial purpose.
****************************************
*** Realtime Web Email List Browsing ***
****************************************
Recent messages posted to the Pietenpol-List are also made available on
the Web for realtime browsing. Seven days worth of back postings are
available with this feature. The messages can be sorted by Subject,
Author, Date, or Message Thread. The Realtime List Browser indexes are
updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45. You can also reply to a message
or start a new message directly from the List Browser Interface (coming soon).
You do not have to be subscribed to the given list to use the List
Browser Interface in view-mode.
http://www.matronics.com/browselist/pietenpol-list
*******************************************
*** Web Forums Bulletin Board Interface ***
*******************************************
A phpBB BBS web Forums front end is available for all Pietenpol-List content.
content. The Forums contain all of the same content available via the email
distribution and found on the various archive viewing formats such as the
List Browse, etc. Any posts on the web Forums will be cross posted to the
respective email List, and posts to the Email List will be cross posted to
the web Forums.
You may view all List content on the Forums without any special login.
If you wish to post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you
will need to Register. This is a simple process that takes only a few
minutes. A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the
main web Forums page. Note that registering on the Forum web site also
enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well. You will also need to
Subscribe to the respective Email List as described above to receive the
Email Distribution of the List, however.
The Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following URL:
http://forums.matronics.com
*********************************
*** Matronics Email List Wiki ***
*********************************
In an attempt to make it easy to store and find structured and often accessed
information, Matronics has installed a Wiki at:
http://wiki.matronics.com
The Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful information
for other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an ordinary web page
where the content needs to be submitted to Matronics for inclusion, the Wiki
permits the users to construct their own pages and have them visible immediately.
While constructing pages for the Wiki is not difficult, some may not be
comfortable building pages. In that case, simply prepare the text and any
images and email it to:
wiki-support@matronics.com
One of the volunteers on that list will take your submission and construct
a Wiki page for you.
Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the
Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take that
post and convert it into a Wiki page.
*********************
*** List Archives ***
*********************
A file containing of all of the previous postings to the Pietenpol-List is
available on line. The archive file information is available via the
Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below:
* Pietenpol-List.FAQ
- Latest version of the Pietenpol-List Frequently Asked Question
page (this document).
* Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete
- Complete file with most of the email header info removed and
page breaks inserted between messages.
* Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-??
- Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that
can more easily handled.
* Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete.zip
- Same as the Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
* Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete.Z
- Same as the Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in
UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
Download Via FTP
----------------
The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com
in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in
a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.)
ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives
Download Via Web
----------------
The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found
toward the bottom of the following web page:
http://www.matronics.com/archives
******************************************
*** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***
******************************************
All messages posted to the Pietenpol-List are also available using the
Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages
in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed.
http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?Pietenpol
*****************************************
**** High-Speed Archive Search Engine ***
*****************************************
You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine
to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the
List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently
available List archives.
http://www.matronics.com/search
****************************
*** File and Photo Share ***
****************************
With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures
and other data with members of the List without having to forward a
copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email
them to:
pictures@matronics.com
!! ==> Please including the following information with each submission:
1) Email Lists that they are related to.
2) Your Full Name.
3) Your Email Address.
4) One line Subject description.
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic.
6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file
Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned
for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and
photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to
process them every few days.
Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be
sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new
Share is available and what the direct URL to it is.
For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
Index Page:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
**************************
*** List Archive CDROM ***
**************************
A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives
for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search
engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it
and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make
great gifts!
http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM
**********************************
*** List Support Contributions ***
**********************************
The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it members.
You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of
annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages
associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November
I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month,
I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they
are comfortable.
I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the
Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated
by companies that are themselves List members.
Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists
including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server
system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many
many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the
variety of services found here.
Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary
and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains
value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude.
Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just
subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in.
The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There are
a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and
sending a personal check.
If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to
support its continued operation?
http://www.matronics.com/contributions
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Pietenpol-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the Pietenpol-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
Pietenpol-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the Pietenpol-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
Message 16
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|
Subject: | Official Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
Pietenpol-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Pietenpol-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Pietenpol-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the Pietenpol-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
Pietenpol-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the Pietenpol-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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