Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:47 AM - Books for an idiot? (BritishJim)
2. 07:13 AM - Re: Books for an idiot? (glenschweizer@yahoo.com)
3. 07:37 AM - Re: Books for an idiot? (Steven Dortch)
4. 08:34 AM - Re: Books for an idiot? (tools)
5. 11:13 AM - Re: Books for an idiot? (THOMAS.233327)
6. 11:24 AM - Re: Books for an idiot? (nightmare)
7. 04:24 PM - Re: Books for an idiot? (jarheadpilot82)
8. 05:30 PM - Re: Books for an idiot? (Jack Philips)
9. 08:09 PM - Re: Some workshop ideas...... (aerocarjake)
Message 1
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Subject: | Books for an idiot? |
Greetings!
Looking to start my build ASAP. But there is just one problem....
....I've no darn idea how to build from wood and plans!
Are there any books covering the plans and wood building process geared for total
newbies? My main concern is how I translate plans that are not full-sized into
full-scale components.
I hear great things about the Bingelis books, but I am not sure if they cover the
plans-building process from scratch?
Any suggestions of resources would be greatly appreciated. I'm a fast learner -
but up until this point in life have been too ignorant of building and far too
concentrated on the actual flying bit!
Many thanks,
Jim.
--------
Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440631#440631
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Books for an idiot? |
Hi Jim
Although uncle Tony's books are a treasure trove of valuable skills, they don't
specifically address your question. May I suggest that your first project
will be to build a sturdy work bench about 4'x16' in size, then layout directly
on that. Read the flying and glider manuals republished by EAA, and get Tony
Bingelis' books as well.
I'm building from plans presented in the Flying and Glider manuals. They're
not hard to follow. Sometimes you have to dig a little for specific info, but
it's all about learning
Enjoy you're build. Glen. Aerial in progress(fuse off bench, tail feathers
of bench, Corvair engine for WW conversion being disassembled)
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 11, 2015, at 6:44 AM, "BritishJim" <james@pieceofcakepr.com> wrote:
>
>
> Greetings!
>
> Looking to start my build ASAP. But there is just one problem....
>
> ....I've no darn idea how to build from wood and plans!
>
> Are there any books covering the plans and wood building process geared for total
newbies? My main concern is how I translate plans that are not full-sized
into full-scale components.
>
> I hear great things about the Bingelis books, but I am not sure if they cover
the plans-building process from scratch?
>
> Any suggestions of resources would be greatly appreciated. I'm a fast learner
- but up until this point in life have been too ignorant of building and far
too concentrated on the actual flying bit!
>
> Many thanks,
> Jim.
>
> --------
> Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440631#440631
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Books for an idiot? |
British Jim, I strongly recommend finding a mentor. Usually an older
builder. Preferably someone who has built a Piet. But a flybaby is good too.
Mine has told me great things like "try putting the bolt in the other way."
Internet videos are also great. The EAA has great series.
Blue Skies,
Steve D
On Apr 11, 2015 8:49 AM, "BritishJim" <james@pieceofcakepr.com> wrote:
> james@pieceofcakepr.com>
>
> Greetings!
>
> Looking to start my build ASAP. But there is just one problem....
>
> ....I've no darn idea how to build from wood and plans!
>
> Are there any books covering the plans and wood building process geared
> for total newbies? My main concern is how I translate plans that are not
> full-sized into full-scale components.
>
> I hear great things about the Bingelis books, but I am not sure if they
> cover the plans-building process from scratch?
>
> Any suggestions of resources would be greatly appreciated. I'm a fast
> learner - but up until this point in life have been too ignorant of
> building and far too concentrated on the actual flying bit!
>
> Many thanks,
> Jim.
>
> --------
> Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the
> ground....
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440631#440631
>
>
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: Books for an idiot? |
Plus one on the mentor.
However, given your rather general lack of knowledge of the process, rather than
lack of specifics, consider woodworkers, shop teachers, even model builders
as they all build stuff from wood, from other than full sized plans.
Once that process sort of sinks in, and I imagine it will very quickly, other plane
builders, bingelis books and even other eaa home building publications will
make a lot more sense.
Oh, even plywood kayak builders employ many of the same disciplines as wood airplane
building.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440641#440641
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Books for an idiot? |
Jim
Find and join your local EAA chapter. The quickest way to get to know everyone
is to become an officer (personally I like treasurer). There you will find other
builders who can help you.
Get the Bingelis books. Also the EAA book "WOOD".
Post your questions here, and use the archives of this list. There are no dumb
questions.
It might be helpful to get one or two of the classic books on boat building.
Work on the project every day, even if for only 10 minutes. Cleaning up the shop
counts. Figuring out what the drawings and text say counts.
The whole thing devolves into building one part at a time until you have enough
parts to put together to make a bigger assembly, then putting together that assembly.
If you don't like the quality of your work on something, throw it away and build
it again. In building from plans it is common to build the airplane two or three
times, to have a bigger scrap pile than finished airplane.
You are going to have one heck of an adventure!
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "BritishJim" <james@pieceofcakepr.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 6:44:30 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Books for an idiot?
Greetings!
Looking to start my build ASAP. But there is just one problem....
....I've no darn idea how to build from wood and plans!
Are there any books covering the plans and wood building process geared for total
newbies? My main concern is how I translate plans that are not full-sized into
full-scale components.
I hear great things about the Bingelis books, but I am not sure if they cover the
plans-building process from scratch?
Any suggestions of resources would be greatly appreciated. I'm a fast learner -
but up until this point in life have been too ignorant of building and far too
concentrated on the actual flying bit!
Many thanks,
Jim.
--------
Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440631#440631
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Books for an idiot? |
heres the basics..more an overview than step by step. first get comfortable with
your power tools after you've got the bench built, get a framing square, pencil
and wooden blocks. start with an elevator or rudder and just draw out the
part onto the bench and nail or screw down some blocks on the perimeter line you
drew for your part. cut the plywood that ties together the perimeter wood pieces.
t88 it in place using clamps or staples or weights. let set for atleast
6 hours, flip it over and t88 the oposite side plywood bits. then start marking
out, cutting and epoxying in place the interior structural pieces. then the
same with the capstrip pieces. let dry then plenty of sanding to get the shape
you want.
you may want to do all the above with some pine just for practice. if your comfortable
working with a table saw it should all fall into place easily after
looking over the plans for that part several times. if you just concentrate on
one piece at a time it is much less overwhelming.
if the piece is not completed to your satisfaction you can either fix it or
start over .
also one of the pics top left corner shows the bottom of an aluminum soda can
attached to a block of wood. use that with little wood coffee stir sticks to
mix and appktappky t88.
--------
Paul Donahue
Started 8-3-12
do not archive
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Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Books for an idiot? |
Jim,
The idiot is the guy that doesn't ask and just builds blindly. You are no idiot.
All the responses have been good, and you should follow them. My advice is read
everything you can, and watch YouTube as there is a lot of advice there ( some
good, some not so much...). I have found that watching the EAA videos has been
a great help.
I know you are up in the Great White North, but another place to go is to download
your own copy of AC 43.13-1b, the FAA's book of acceptable construction practices.
http://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/advisory_circulars/index.cfm/go/document.information/documentID/99861
Hope that helps.
--------
Semper Fi,
Terry Hand
Athens, GA
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Message 8
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Subject: | Books for an idiot? |
Jim,
You've gotten some good advice already, although nothing that actually
answers your "main concern".
If you can possibly make it to Sun 'n' Fun in a couple of weeks, spending
some time at the woodworking tent would be invaluable to you. If you can't
make that venue, perhaps you can make it to Oshkosh (and if you go to
Oshkosh you should certainly come to Brodhead the weekend before). There's
nothing like seeing the jigs laid out in front of you and seeing how the
pieces of wood are forced to take shape, and seeing it with your own eyes,
rather than looking at pictures in a book.
As for translating plans that are not full sized into full sized components,
that is fairly easy. The plans just show the general layout and arrangement
of the wooden members. The dimensions on the plans are the important thing,
and every piece is dimensioned fully in the plans (well, for the most part).
Generally individual pieces such as the capstrips and uprights in the ribs
are made with a common sized material, such as 1/4" thick and 1/2" wide.
Then the only thing you need to find is the length, which should be shown
somewhere on the plans.
For pieces like wing ribs, the plans include a full size template for the
ribs. They also give the coordinates for laying out the ribs full size
yourself. If you want to use the paper template, first make some
measurements to see how true it is. The distance between the spars should
be 27-3/4". If it measures within 1/16" of that, go ahead and use the
template (that's what I did). If it varies more than that you should
probably lay it out from the coordinates.
Once you have the outline of the rib laid out, you can position small blocks
of wood to hold the capstrip to that shape, and build a jig so that each of
the 30 ribs are identical.
One thing you should understand in building a wooden airplane is that about
90% of the strength of a wooden joint comes from the plywood gusset that
covers the joint. If you notice when looking at the plans, every single
joint in the airplane is covered with plywood. The plywood serves two
purpose - it greatly increases the glue area and it provides most of the
shear strength of the joint. A glued butt joint is not very strong - it
relies completely on the glue in tension, which is not good. Putting a
gusset on that joint changes the loading to shear loading (trying to slide
the wood past the plywood gusset) and glue is very good at resisting shear.
One thing any builder should do as they are building their structure is to
build some test joints using the same materials and the same glue as they
build the real structure. Then, once the glue has fully cured, break the
test pieces by pulling on the wood in the same direction that flight loads
will impose. Once the joint has broken, examine it to be sure that the wood
actually broke, not the glue joint. That is the mark of a well made glue
joint.
Look at the pictures Chris Tracy has put on his West Coast Piet website.
I'm sure you can find a few that will show the jigs used for the various
components. Virtually no part of an airplane is made without some sort of
jig to hold the pieces accurately. Building an airplane is really a series
of one alignment problem after another. Sometimes it takes great ingenuity
to figure out how to hold the various pieces in alignment.
Hang in there and never refrain from asking questions if you don't know how
to proceed.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of BritishJim
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 9:45 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Books for an idiot?
--> <james@pieceofcakepr.com>
Greetings!
Looking to start my build ASAP. But there is just one problem....
....I've no darn idea how to build from wood and plans!
Are there any books covering the plans and wood building process geared for
total newbies? My main concern is how I translate plans that are not
full-sized into full-scale components.
I hear great things about the Bingelis books, but I am not sure if they
cover the plans-building process from scratch?
Any suggestions of resources would be greatly appreciated. I'm a fast
learner - but up until this point in life have been too ignorant of building
and far too concentrated on the actual flying bit!
Many thanks,
Jim.
--------
Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the
ground....
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440631#440631
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Some workshop ideas...... |
Great set of drawers - nice dovetails....!
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
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