---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 02/12/16: 4 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 11:45 AM - Re: Re: Ordering metal (Charles N. Campbell) 2. 05:02 PM - Cabane strut angle with heavy engine (Paul Siegel) 3. 05:25 PM - Re: Cabane strut angle with heavy engine (aviken) 4. 07:50 PM - Re: Cabane strut angle with heavy engine (taildrags) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 11:45:00 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Ordering metal From: "Charles N. Campbell" Hey! Good idea. I was going to use just regular nuts with plastic locking on them. I'll use castellated nuts with cotter pins. C On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 10:13 PM, Ray Krause wrote: > I put the bolts in the bottom strut fitting upside down and just used > castellated nuts and cotter pins, I'm pretty sure the nuts won't come off! > Ray Krause > > Sent from my iPad > > On Feb 11, 2016, at 11:47 AM, Charles N. Campbell < > charlescampbell1924@gmail.com> wrote: > > Now you tell me. Fooey on it. I'll just run the bolts upside down. The > nuts are not coming off anyway! C > > On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 11:23 AM, taildrags wrote: > >> >> John; >> >> Many people have mentioned this over the years but I'll repeat it: some >> of the metal fittings on the Air Camper can benefit by being made a little >> bit longer and you would do well to study photos (Westcoastpiet is a great >> place to see lots of photos). I'll give you two quick examples. First, >> the wing lift strut attach fittings on the wing spars, where they protrude >> out the bottom of the wing, end up with the strut mounting holes so close >> to the fabric that you can't get a ratchet or a box-end ratcheting wrench >> on them. Tightening the bolts becomes a flat-by-flat exercise using two >> open-end wrenches. Lengthening the fittings just a little bit would really >> help. Next, down at the landing gear/lift strut attach fittings at the >> bottom of the fuselage, the lift struts are typically attached to the >> fittings using adjustable fork ends. The bolt that holds the fork end to >> the attach fitting is a stubby AN5- or -6 bolt (I don't remember which), >> and it has to go in at an angle. ! >> If you build everything per plans, it's very difficult to insert that >> bolt as it should be (with the head up) because the bolt contacts the lower >> longeron and fabric. >> >> If you don't have Mike Cuy's excellent build-and-fly video, by all means >> get a copy! Mike does a very thorough walk-around of his airplane and >> points out some of the spots where the fittings should be made a little >> longer to make installation of the hardware less of a pain. The video is >> great rainy day viewing, too. >> >> -------- >> Oscar Zuniga >> Medford, OR >> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" >> A75 power >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=452766#452766 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ========== >> br> fts!) >> r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"> >> www.buildersbooks.com >> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >> ========== >> br> enpol-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"> >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========== >> FORUMS - >> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com >> ========== >> b Site - >> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> ========== >> >> >> >> > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:02:59 PM PST US From: Paul Siegel Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cabane strut angle with heavy engine Preparing to weld up the six cabane struts. Will raise wing 2 for more cockpit clearance. With Continental A65 top of cabane struts is usually leaned aft 4. I will be using Continental O-200 D (light sport) with starter, on long fuselage version. This will be about 40 lbs heavier than A65. Any suggestions on how much of the aft lean to eliminate? Should cabanes be straight up with heavier engine (no clean back)? I will use third diagonal cabane strut angled to top motor mount on both sides to set angle of cabanes. I guess I can remake those angled front struts after weight and balance performed. Any suggestion on starting point though? Please dont tell me to go to the search engine. Standing by Paul Siegel psiegel@fuse.net ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:25:40 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Cabane strut angle with heavy engine From: "aviken" Hi I am also dealing with a heavy engine / Jeep 134 / I decided to just build the cabines straight and hope it is in the ball park. if I have to I can re-do the angle after weight and balance. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=452789#452789 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:50:55 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Cabane strut angle with heavy engine From: "taildrags" Okay, so please don't take any of this to be exact science and please don't substitute this for a more careful analysis and certainly a careful W&B, and I know there are a lot of approximations and inaccuracies but it's just a simple little study. 41CC's cabanes are canted so as to move the wing aft about 4" and my engine is an A75, so it's the same as an A65 for weight. Basic empty weight of 41CC is 636 lbs and the empty CG is about 12" aft of the wing leading edge. If I take the 4" out and set the cabanes vertical, I've moved most of the empty weight (not the wings though) 4" aft of the datum. Just to use round numbers, let's say the wings weigh 86 lbs so I've moved 550 lbs of empty weight 4" aft of the datum, creating a increased moment of 2200 lb-in. My oil is on a moment arm of about 26" forward of the datum (rounding the numbers to make them simple, and remembering that moment arms forward of the datum create a negative moment), so if I move the engine the same 4", I've reduced its moment arm to about 22" forward of the datum. For the aircraft to once again balance, I would need to have an engine that's 100 lbs heavier than before since it would be acting on a moment arm of 22" to create an equal 2200 lb-in to offset the shift in the aircraft's empty weight. If any of the above is close to accurate, a quickie rule of thumb might be that for my airplane, I could take out 1" of cabane offset for every 25 lbs of weight that I add to the engine. From there, I can't help you because I have no idea what your O200 might weigh compared to my A65/75. -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=452790#452790 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.