Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Fri 01/05/18


Total Messages Posted: 8



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 04:16 AM - FW: Wing Strut Attachment (Greg Cardinal)
     2. 08:57 AM - Re: Wing Strut Attachment (jarheadpilot82)
     3. 11:26 AM - Re: Wing Strut Attachment (Bill Church)
     4. 03:22 PM - FW: Wing Strut Attachment (Greg Cardinal)
     5. 03:38 PM - Re: Wing Strut Attachment (John C Black)
     6. 04:02 PM - Re: No Title (jarheadpilot82)
     7. 09:47 PM - Re: Re: No Title (Steven Dortch)
     8. 09:48 PM - Re: Re: No Title (Steven Dortch)
 
 
 


Message 1


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 04:16:35 AM PST US
    From: "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
    Subject: Wing Strut Attachment
    John, A rod end bearing was used when the steel struts were replaced with the Carlson aluminum struts on NX18235. The Aurora HX Series rod-end bearing is a good choice because it has a wider ball dimension to fit between the spar strap fitting. A drilled and tapped =C2=BE=9D square steel bar was inserted in the strut instead of using the Carlson aluminum block. When doing the engineering analysis of your assembly pay attention to the edge loading of the bolt holes that are drilled through the struts to determine how many bolts to use to secure the strut to the insert. Greg Cardinal Minneapolis From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John C Black Sent: Thursday, January 4, 2018 10:15 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Strut Attachment Today I am worrying about how to attach the Struts. What are you guys doing to attach the Struts ? The top Strut fitting is especially challenging. I am using a Carlson Aircraft extrusion for my struts. To attach the strut, Carlson sells a 1=9Dx3/4=9D aluminum extrusion that slides into the end of the strut. Then you bolt it in place. I cut this extrusion into 8=9D lengths. I put this 8=9D piece in the lathe and end drilled and threaded a 7/16 hole 2=9D deep into the strut. On the lower end I plan to use this wing strut adjustment fork from Aircraft Spruce. https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/strutadjfbsets2.php The top end is more challenging. The wing may move forward or back to adjust weight/balance. This movement changes the angle that the strut meets the wing so the attachment needs to be flexible. I see that some builders have used a helm joint. This is a simple solution, but I wonder about the loads on the fitting. The strongest Helm joint that I could find is rated at 14,000 lbs : That is a little weaker than the strut. What are you guys doing ? John


    Message 2


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:57:34 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Wing Strut Attachment
    From: "jarheadpilot82" <jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com>
    Oscar, I know that you love this stuff, so how about doing all of us non-engineer types a favor and do the math. I have done my initial w&b and my cabanes definitely lean back so I am most likely going to need to use a ball joint rod end as well for connecting at the wing strut end. And Oscar, FWIW, my daughter is a Junior at Alabama and is a Metallurgical Engineering major there. I told her that I couldn't even spell metallurgical engineering without spell check, much less study it. And a 3.3 GPA to boot! (Statics and Physics beat her up pretty good last semester.) -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=477102#477102


    Message 3


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:26:13 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Wing Strut Attachment
    From: "Bill Church" <billspiet@sympatico.ca>
    The data posted on Carlson's website definitely appears to be suspect. The raw material of the struts, 6061-T6 Aluminum has an Ultimate Tensile strength of about 42000 psi, which, when applied on a cross-sectional area of 0.431 square inches would translate into an ultimate load of just over 18000 pounds (assuming that the listed 0.431 square inch area is correct.) The topic of appropriate size for rod ends on lift struts was discussed several years ago. This link should answer the original question: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=50044&start=0 Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=477106#477106


    Message 4


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 03:22:00 PM PST US
    From: "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
    Subject: Wing Strut Attachment
    John, A rod end bearing was used when the steel struts were replaced with the Carlson aluminum struts on NX18235. The Aurora HX Series rod-end bearing is a good choice because it has a wider ball dimension to fit between the spar strap fitting. A drilled and tapped =C2=BE=9D square steel bar was inserted in the strut instead of using the Carlson aluminum block. When doing the engineering analysis of your assembly pay attention to the edge loading of the bolt holes that are drilled through the struts to determine how many bolts to use to secure the strut to the insert. Greg Cardinal Minneapolis From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John C Black Sent: Thursday, January 4, 2018 10:15 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Strut Attachment Today I am worrying about how to attach the Struts. What are you guys doing to attach the Struts ? The top Strut fitting is especially challenging. I am using a Carlson Aircraft extrusion for my struts. To attach the strut, Carlson sells a 1=9Dx3/4=9D aluminum extrusion that slides into the end of the strut. Then you bolt it in place. I cut this extrusion into 8=9D lengths. I put this 8=9D piece in the lathe and end drilled and threaded a 7/16 hole 2=9D deep into the strut. On the lower end I plan to use this wing strut adjustment fork from Aircraft Spruce. https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/strutadjfbsets2.php The top end is more challenging. The wing may move forward or back to adjust weight/balance. This movement changes the angle that the strut meets the wing so the attachment needs to be flexible. I see that some builders have used a helm joint. This is a simple solution, but I wonder about the loads on the fitting. The strongest Helm joint that I could find is rated at 14,000 lbs : That is a little weaker than the strut. What are you guys doing ? John


    Message 5


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 03:38:02 PM PST US
    From: John C Black <john@jcblack.com>
    Subject: Re: Wing Strut Attachment
    THANK YOU EVERYONE for great posts, but I still don=99t know exactly what I should do. I have read as suggested. learned a lot. I take back my errors. Thank you again. Here are the questions that I still have : 1) Is Aluminum 6061-T6 adequate for the 1=9Dx3/4=9D Bar Stock that inserts into the Carlson Small Strut and is end drilled plus tapped to accept the 7/16=9D 20 male end fittings ? Or do I need to use steel which about triples the weight of the Bar Stock ? I get lost trying to understand if at least 1=9D of 7/16=9D-20 threads in 6061-T6 aluminum is strong enough ? Or Is steel needed ? 2) Does the side wall of the Carlson Small Strut need to be reinforced ? If so, Is it enough to weld aluminum washers at the bolt holes or should a 3/4=9D or 1=9D plate be welded on that spans all 3 of the 5/16=9D bolts that I plan to use ? 3) Who has a Tension Test machine ? I am beginning to look for a Tension Test stand. I want to build a test piece and test it to destruction. Thank you Ken Bickers for reminding me that the aluminum strut arrangement probably is adequate if it is stronger than the Sitka Spruce struts that are flying around. John On Jan 4, 2018, at 8:14 AM, John C Black <john@jcblack.com> wrote: Today I am worrying about how to attach the Struts. What are you guys doing to attach the Struts ? The top Strut fitting is especially challenging. I am using a Carlson Aircraft extrusion for my struts. To attach the strut, Carlson sells a 1=9Dx3/4=9D aluminum 6061-T6 bar that slides into the end of the strut. Then you bolt it in place. I cut this bar into 8=9D lengths. I put this 8=9D piece in the lathe and end drilled and tapped a 7/16 hole 2=9D deep into the strut. On the lower end I plan to use this wing strut adjustment fork from Aircraft Spruce. https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/strutadjfbsets2.php <https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/strutadjfbsets2.php> The top end is more challenging. The wing may move forward or back to adjust weight/balance. This movement changes the angle that the strut meets the wing so the attachment needs to be flexible. I see that some builders have used a helm joint. This is a simple solution, but I wonder about the loads on the fitting. The strongest Helm joint that I could find is rated at 14,000 lbs : That is a little weaker (I was wrong apparently stronger) than the strut. What are you guys doing ? John


    Message 6


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 04:02:17 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: No Title
    From: "jarheadpilot82" <jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com>
    Steve, What? No pictures? I have never seen a mangled iPad before. ;0) Congrats on the work that you did get finished. One more small step and youve got it. Piece of cake! -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=477116#477116


    Message 7


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 09:47:48 PM PST US
    From: Steven Dortch <steven.d.dortch@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: No Title
    UGljcw0KDQpPbiBKYW4gNSwgMjAxOCA2OjAzIFBNLCAiamFyaGVhZHBpbG90ODIiIDxqYXJoZWFk cGlsb3Q4MkBob3RtYWlsLmNvbT4gd3JvdGU6DQoNCj4gLS0+IFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0IG1lc3Nh Z2UgcG9zdGVkIGJ5OiAiamFyaGVhZHBpbG90ODIiIDwNCj4gamFyaGVhZHBpbG90ODJAaG90bWFp bC5jb20+DQo+DQo+IFN0ZXZlLA0KPg0KPiBXaGF0PyBObyBwaWN0dXJlcz8gSSBoYXZlIG5ldmVy IHNlZW4gYSBtYW5nbGVkIGlQYWQgYmVmb3JlLiA7MCkNCj4NCj4gQ29uZ3JhdHMgb24gdGhlIHdv cmsgdGhhdCB5b3UgZGlkIGdldCBmaW5pc2hlZC4gT25lIG1vcmUgc21hbGwgc3RlcCBhbmQNCj4g eW914oCZdmUgZ290IGl0LiBQaWVjZSBvZiBjYWtlIQ0KPg0KPiAtLS0tLS0tLQ0KPiBTZW1wZXIg RmksDQo+DQo+IFRlcnJ5IEhhbmQNCj4gQXRoZW5zLCBHQQ0KPg0KPg0KPg0KPg0KPiBSZWFkIHRo aXMgdG9waWMgb25saW5lIGhlcmU6DQo+DQo+IGh0dHA6Ly9mb3J1bXMubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS92 aWV3dG9waWMucGhwP3A9NDc3MTE2IzQ3NzExNg0KPg0KPg0KPg0KPg0KPg0KPg0KPiBfLT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PQ0K PiBfLT0gICAgICAgICAgLSBUaGUgUGlldGVucG9sLUxpc3QgRW1haWwgRm9ydW0gLQ0KPiBfLT0g VXNlIHRoZSBNYXRyb25pY3MgTGlzdCBGZWF0dXJlcyBOYXZpZ2F0b3IgdG8gYnJvd3NlDQo+IF8t PSB0aGUgbWFueSBMaXN0IHV0aWxpdGllcyBzdWNoIGFzIExpc3QgVW4vU3Vic2NyaXB0aW9uLA0K PiBfLT0gQXJjaGl2ZSBTZWFyY2ggJiBEb3dubG9hZCwgNy1EYXkgQnJvd3NlLCBDaGF0LCBGQVEs DQo+IF8tPSBQaG90b3NoYXJlLCBhbmQgbXVjaCBtdWNoIG1vcmU6DQo+IF8tPQ0KPiBfLT0gICAt LT4gaHR0cDovL3d3dy5tYXRyb25pY3MuY29tL05hdmlnYXRvcj9QaWV0ZW5wb2wtTGlzdA0KPiBf LT0NCj4gXy09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT0NCj4gXy09ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgLSBNQVRST05JQ1MgV0VCIEZPUlVNUyAt DQo+IF8tPSBTYW1lIGdyZWF0IGNvbnRlbnQgYWxzbyBhdmFpbGFibGUgdmlhIHRoZSBXZWIgRm9y dW1zIQ0KPiBfLT0NCj4gXy09ICAgLS0+IGh0dHA6Ly9mb3J1bXMubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbQ0KPiBf LT0NCj4gXy09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT0NCj4gXy09ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAtIE5FVyBNQVRST05JQ1MgTElTVCBXSUtJ IC0NCj4gXy09IEFkZCBzb21lIGluZm8gdG8gdGhlIE1hdHJvbmljcyBFbWFpbCBMaXN0IFdpa2kh DQo+IF8tPSAgIC0tPiBodHRwOi8vd2lraS5tYXRyb25pY3MuY29tDQo+IF8tPT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09DQo+IF8tPSAg ICAgICAgICAgICAtIExpc3QgQ29udHJpYnV0aW9uIFdlYiBTaXRlIC0NCj4gXy09ICBUaGFuayB5 b3UgZm9yIHlvdXIgZ2VuZXJvdXMgc3VwcG9ydCENCj4gXy09ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgLU1hdHQgRHJhbGxlLCBMaXN0IEFkbWluLg0KPiBfLT0gICAtLT4gaHR0cDovL3d3 dy5tYXRyb25pY3MuY29tL2NvbnRyaWJ1dGlvbg0KPiBfLT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PQ0KPg0KPg0KPg0KPg0K


    Message 8


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 09:48:19 PM PST US
    From: Steven Dortch <steven.d.dortch@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: No Title
    Pic 2 On Jan 5, 2018 11:47 PM, "Steven Dortch" <steven.d.dortch@gmail.com> wrote: > Pics > > On Jan 5, 2018 6:03 PM, "jarheadpilot82" <jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com> > wrote: > >> jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com> >> >> Steve, >> >> What? No pictures? I have never seen a mangled iPad before. ;0) >> >> Congrats on the work that you did get finished. One more small step and >> you=99ve got it. Piece of cake! >> >> -------- >> Semper Fi, >> >> Terry Hand >> Athens, GA >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=477116#477116 >> >> >> >> >> >> =========== =========== =========== =========== =========== >> >> >> >>




    Other Matronics Email List Services

  • Post A New Message
  •   pietenpol-list@matronics.com
  • UN/SUBSCRIBE
  •   http://www.matronics.com/subscription
  • List FAQ
  •   http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
  • Web Forum Interface To Lists
  •   http://forums.matronics.com
  • Matronics List Wiki
  •   http://wiki.matronics.com
  • 7-Day List Browse
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Pietenpol-List Digests
  •   http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Other Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse
  • Live Online Chat!
  •   http://www.matronics.com/chat
  • Archive Downloading
  •   http://www.matronics.com/archives
  • Photo Share
  •   http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
  • Other Email Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
  • Contributions
  •   http://www.matronics.com/contribution

    These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.

    -- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --