---------------------------------------------------------- Rocket-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 12/20/07: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:34 AM - Re: Pro-seal (David Miller) 2. 08:08 AM - Re: Pro-seal (Wernerworld) 3. 08:33 AM - Re: Pro-seal (Fred Weaver) 4. 09:48 AM - Re: Pro-seal (Bob J.) 5. 09:56 AM - Re: Pro-seal (Jim Stone) 6. 02:33 PM - Re: Pro-seal (FRED LA FORGE) 7. 06:48 PM - Re: Pro-seal (Bob J.) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:34:08 AM PST US From: "David Miller" Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Time: 12:39:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pro-seal From: bluebird266@dslextreme.com why do you want to use auto fuel in an IO540? -------------------------------------------------------------------------- 100LL around here is about $1.50 higher than Amoco 93 that about $20 an hour, give or take, difference in fuel expense. That adds up quickly over time, that's $40000 on a 2000hr engine life. I don't plan on using high compression pistons and I've heard the Airflow fuel systems work fine with auto-fuel. I have used, and have friends that use, auto fuel regularly with little if any issues. The only issue I've ever had was having to replace 0-rings in my fuel primer on a 172, although I don't know if it was the auto fuel or old o-rings. Also, if you have a private strip, auto fuel is much easier to come by. I'd appreciate any feedback/experiences on the use of auto fuel. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:08:32 AM PST US From: "Wernerworld" Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Only downside to cargas that I can see is you can't get enough HP. I want every horse and then some. If it means low compression and low HP while still hauling around this heavy engine, I'll pass! Russ ----- Original Message ----- From: David Miller Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2007 8:27 AM Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Time: 12:39:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pro-seal From: bluebird266@dslextreme.com why do you want to use auto fuel in an IO540? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- - 100LL around here is about $1.50 higher than Amoco 93 that about $20 an hour, give or take, difference in fuel expense. That adds up quickly over time, that's $40000 on a 2000hr engine life. I don't plan on using high compression pistons and I've heard the Airflow fuel systems work fine with auto-fuel. I have used, and have friends that use, auto fuel regularly with little if any issues. The only issue I've ever had was having to replace 0-rings in my fuel primer on a 172, although I don't know if it was the auto fuel or old o-rings. Also, if you have a private strip, auto fuel is much easier to come by. I'd appreciate any feedback/experiences on the use of auto fuel. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:33:38 AM PST US From: Fred Weaver Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Our Rotax's run just great on 91 octane. They have 10.5 to 1 compression and no detenation at all. Timing is set very close to the Lycoming's @ 25 degrees BTDC. I see no reason not to run it in the 540. I run it in my 0-360 all the time. Compression there is 8.2. The only issue with car gas is letting it sit in the tanks. Undesireable... and can be cured fairly quick by simply filling it up with some 100LL if it's going to be sitting still for an extended period. If I'm zipping out to Wyoming or up to Idaho, you can bet I fill it up with car gas........although the difference here in California is much less in cost. Our 100LL is $4.19 and the car gas is $3.45. Still amounts to almost $10 an hour....and the plugs don't get gooed up with lead. Weav Wernerworld wrote: > Only downside to cargas that I can see is you can't get enough HP. I > want every horse and then some. If it means low compression and low > HP while still hauling around this heavy engine, I'll pass! > > Russ > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* David Miller > *To:* rocket-list@matronics.com > *Sent:* Thursday, December 20, 2007 8:27 AM > *Subject:* Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal > > *Time: * */12:39:41 PM PST US/* > > *Subject: * /*_Re: Pro-seal_*/ > > *From: * */bluebird266@dslextreme.com > /* > > > > > why do you want to use auto fuel in an IO540? > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > 100LL around here is about $1.50 higher than Amoco 93 that about $20 > an hour, give or take, difference in fuel expense. That adds up > quickly over time, that's $40000 on a 2000hr engine life. I don't > plan on using high compression pistons and I've heard the Airflow fuel > systems work fine with auto-fuel. I have used, and have friends that > use, auto fuel regularly with little if any issues. The only issue > I've ever had was having to replace 0-rings in my fuel primer on a > 172, although I don't know if it was the auto fuel or old o-rings. > Also, if you have a private strip, auto fuel is much easier to come by. > > I'd appreciate any feedback/experiences on the use of auto fuel. > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > > * > * > > > * > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:48:45 AM PST US From: "Bob J." Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal That's incorrect. Octane is the measure of resistance to detonation, hot how much latent energy is present in the fuel. 87 octane has the same BTU content as 100LL. Lowering compression is another story, but for a stock 8.5:1 Lyc there is no speed loss running mogas. I can't tell any difference running mogas but my wallet sure can. The last six months in my RV I have only put in 20 gals. of 100LL. Cut the filter recently, it absolutely no junk in it, analysis came back good. There's no reason to not run mogas in an injected 540, I have two friends with rockets that do it all the time. Regards, Bob Japundza RV-6 flying F1 under const. On Dec 20, 2007 11:08 AM, Wernerworld wrote: > Only downside to cargas that I can see is you can't get enough HP. I > want every horse and then some. If it means low compression and low HP > while still hauling around this heavy engine, I'll pass! > > Russ > > > ----- Original Message ----- *From:* David Miller > *To:* rocket-list@matronics.com > *Sent:* Thursday, December 20, 2007 8:27 AM > *Subject:* Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal > > *Time: * *12:39:41 PM PST US* *Subject: * *Re: Pro-seal* *From: * * > bluebird266@dslextreme.com* > > > why do you want to use auto fuel in an IO540? > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > 100LL around here is about $1.50 higher than Amoco 93 that about $20 an > hour, give or take, difference in fuel expense. That adds up quickly over > time, that's $40000 on a 2000hr engine life. I don't plan on using high > compression pistons and I've heard the Airflow fuel systems work fine with > auto-fuel. I have used, and have friends that use, auto fuel regularly with > little if any issues. The only issue I've ever had was having to replace > 0-rings in my fuel primer on a 172, although I don't know if it was the auto > fuel or old o-rings. Also, if you have a private strip, auto fuel is much > easier to come by. > > I'd appreciate any feedback/experiences on the use of auto fuel. > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > * > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:56:13 AM PST US From: "Jim Stone" Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Amen Russ, I'm still trying to figure out how to get afterburner working in mine and I have 300 HP already. Jim Stone Louisville In paint ----- Original Message ----- From: Wernerworld To: rocket-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2007 11:08 AM Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Only downside to cargas that I can see is you can't get enough HP. I want every horse and then some. If it means low compression and low HP while still hauling around this heavy engine, I'll pass! Russ ----- Original Message ----- From: David Miller To: rocket-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2007 8:27 AM Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Time: 12:39:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pro-seal From: bluebird266@dslextreme.com why do you want to use auto fuel in an IO540? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- - 100LL around here is about $1.50 higher than Amoco 93 that about $20 an hour, give or take, difference in fuel expense. That adds up quickly over time, that's $40000 on a 2000hr engine life. I don't plan on using high compression pistons and I've heard the Airflow fuel systems work fine with auto-fuel. I have used, and have friends that use, auto fuel regularly with little if any issues. The only issue I've ever had was having to replace 0-rings in my fuel primer on a 172, although I don't know if it was the auto fuel or old o-rings. Also, if you have a private strip, auto fuel is much easier to come by. I'd appreciate any feedback/experiences on the use of auto fuel. href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matron href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:33:38 PM PST US From: "FRED LA FORGE" Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Bob, Have you had any vapor pressure problems at altitude? As I understand this is where the problem lies. Fred LaForge EAA tech counselor,RV-4, HR-II project ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob J. To: rocket-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2007 9:48 AM Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal That's incorrect. Octane is the measure of resistance to detonation, hot how much latent energy is present in the fuel. 87 octane has the same BTU content as 100LL. Lowering compression is another story, but for a stock 8.5:1 Lyc there is no speed loss running mogas. I can't tell any difference running mogas but my wallet sure can. The last six months in my RV I have only put in 20 gals. of 100LL. Cut the filter recently, it absolutely no junk in it, analysis came back good. There's no reason to not run mogas in an injected 540, I have two friends with rockets that do it all the time. Regards, Bob Japundza RV-6 flying F1 under const. On Dec 20, 2007 11:08 AM, Wernerworld wrote: Only downside to cargas that I can see is you can't get enough HP. I want every horse and then some. If it means low compression and low HP while still hauling around this heavy engine, I'll pass! Russ ----- Original Message ----- From: David Miller To: rocket-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2007 8:27 AM Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal Time: 12:39:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pro-seal From: bluebird266@dslextreme.com why do you want to use auto fuel in an IO540? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- - 100LL around here is about $1.50 higher than Amoco 93 that about $20 an hour, give or take, difference in fuel expense. That adds up quickly over time, that's $40000 on a 2000hr engine life. I don't plan on using high compression pistons and I've heard the Airflow fuel systems work fine with auto-fuel. I have used, and have friends that use, auto fuel regularly with little if any issues. The only issue I've ever had was having to replace 0-rings in my fuel primer on a 172, although I don't know if it was the auto fuel or old o-rings. Also, if you have a private strip, auto fuel is much easier to come by. I'd appreciate any feedback/experiences on the use of auto fuel. href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href=" http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref=" http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:48:25 PM PST US From: "Bob J." Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal No problems with altitude, I've run mogas up to 11500. Only once I had a hint of vapor lock on takeoff on a 95 degree day when I left the boost pump off; turning the pump cleared up the occasional miss. I have a hodges fuel volatility tester and the autogas I use tests similarly as 100LL. 100LL boils just as easily as the mogas in the tester. Regards, Bob On Dec 20, 2007 5:26 PM, FRED LA FORGE wrote: > Bob, Have you had any vapor pressure problems at altitude? As I > understand this is where the problem lies. > Fred LaForge EAA tech counselor,RV-4, HR-II project > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Bob J. > *To:* rocket-list@matronics.com > *Sent:* Thursday, December 20, 2007 9:48 AM > *Subject:* Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal > > That's incorrect. Octane is the measure of resistance to detonation, hot > how much latent energy is present in the fuel. 87 octane has the same BTU > content as 100LL. Lowering compression is another story, but for a stock > 8.5:1 Lyc there is no speed loss running mogas. I can't tell any > difference running mogas but my wallet sure can. > > The last six months in my RV I have only put in 20 gals. of 100LL. Cut > the filter recently, it absolutely no junk in it, analysis came back good. > There's no reason to not run mogas in an injected 540, I have two friends > with rockets that do it all the time. > > Regards, > Bob Japundza > RV-6 flying F1 under const. > > On Dec 20, 2007 11:08 AM, Wernerworld wrote: > > > Only downside to cargas that I can see is you can't get enough HP. I > > want every horse and then some. If it means low compression and low HP > > while still hauling around this heavy engine, I'll pass! > > > > Russ > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- *From:* David Miller > > *To:* rocket-list@matronics.com > > *Sent:* Thursday, December 20, 2007 8:27 AM > > *Subject:* Re: Rocket-List: Pro-seal > > > > *Time: * *12:39:41 PM PST US* *Subject: * *Re: Pro-seal* *From: * * > > bluebird266@dslextreme.com* > > > > > > why do you want to use auto fuel in an IO540? > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > 100LL around here is about $1.50 higher than Amoco 93 that about $20 an > > hour, give or take, difference in fuel expense. That adds up quickly over > > time, that's $40000 on a 2000hr engine life. I don't plan on using high > > compression pistons and I've heard the Airflow fuel systems work fine with > > auto-fuel. I have used, and have friends that use, auto fuel regularly with > > little if any issues. The only issue I've ever had was having to replace > > 0-rings in my fuel primer on a 172, although I don't know if it was the auto > > fuel or old o-rings. Also, if you have a private strip, auto fuel is much > > easier to come by. > > > > I'd appreciate any feedback/experiences on the use of auto fuel. > > > > * > > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref=" > > http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > > * > > > > * > > > > * > > > > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > * > > * > > * > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rocket-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Rocket-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rocket-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rocket-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.