Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:52 AM - Re: No Title (N395V)
2. 06:28 AM - ()
3. 07:17 AM - Re: Rocket-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/07/08 (Ron Carter)
4. 08:28 AM - Sport wing for sale (f1rocket@telus.net)
5. 09:07 AM - Re: Sport wing for sale (Noel Rodman)
6. 12:11 PM - Re: Re: Rocket-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/07/08 (Gregory V Stone)
7. 07:15 PM - Re: (nico css)
Message 1
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Do you have the Christen inverted oil system?
--------
Milt
2003 F1 Rocket
2006 Radial Rocket
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=162977#162977
Message 2
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No inverted oil system. Plain oil system with an air oil
seperator on the breather.
Yep, I know 10,000 in 30 minutes but I was just putting
along at 200kts and climbing slowly during the flight.
You can go from calm air here in colorado springs to
severe turbulence in about 100 feet in the winter and you
never know when it will hit you...so I was climbing
slowly.
I got a kick out of being that high, I have never flown
any plane myself over 13. Was higher than pikes peak.
I've had friends here on final lose 400 feet completely
out of control with turbulence. We get the roll offs from
the huge mountains. He was in a much smaller plane and
got back under control about 80 feet from the
ground....there was known turbulence, some days it's
better to stay on the ground here.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Rocket-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/07/08 |
4.5 qts in 2.5 hrs is potentially catastrophic!! There is something
SERIOUSLY wrong with your engine. Here are a few ideas.
You do know the engine is not designed to fly zero or negative G's with out
an inverted oil system, right? even mild negative G's will throw oil out of
the sump and down the vent and onto your belly.
Your normal operating ( warm) oil pressure should be 65-75 psi.
Next, a compression check tells you that the rings, valves and cylinder
heads are not broken, leaking or cracked. I am a little suspect of the
compression check if it was done when the engine was HOT. It should be done
when the engine is at normal operating temp such as 385 F or less.I think
you could conceivably get a good compression check on a hot engine that has
choked cylinders even though the rings were cracked.
If I recall correctly- Lycoming plain steel cylinders are choked .017 in
from the base to the top. This could allow more blow by at the bottom of the
stroke than at the top. are your cyl's choked? Try a compression check at
bottom dead center and see how much they leak.
Next, The oil sump and pick up system in these engines is dead simple. There
isint much to go wrong here assuming you dont have an inverted system.
Run your vent line as high as possible before it turns down to exit the
cowl. A little more up hill distance in the tube will allow more oil to
drain back into the engine before making it over the hump and out of the
engine. These tubes often have coil springs inside to prevent collapse at
tight bends. Is yours collapsed anywhere?
The vent line hould be 3/4" id. Smaller diameters will let the oil bridge in
the tube and consequently blow out the tube easier.
An experiment- Add a length of hose to the vent tube, run the engine and
see how much blow by you are getting. It should feel like a light smooth air
stream- hardly perceptable.
Thats all I can think of. If you are not flying negative G's and are loosing
as much oil as you say you are, you have a serious engine malfunction. These
engines are tough but not actually bullet proof. FYI- some of this oil is
leaking into all the sheetmetal joints it runs over and will stink up your
planes' interior. Keep it clean until you get it fixed.
Good luck. I really want to hear about the solution. Keep us posted.
Ron Carter
Skypark Airport, Bountiful, UT
HR2 # 49 675 TTSN
On 2/8/08, Rocket-List Digest Server <rocket-list@matronics.com> wrote:
>
> *
>
> =================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> =================================================
>
> Today's complete Rocket-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
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>
> HTML Version:
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> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 08-02-07&Archive=Rocket
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>
> ===============================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ===============================================
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Rocket-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Thu 02/07/08: 3
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 07:37 AM - Re: Rocket-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 02/06/08 (Bob & Toodie
> Marshall)
> 2. 06:51 PM - ()
> 3. 10:01 PM - Re: (nico css)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message
> 1 _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:37:56 AM PST US
> From: "Bob & Toodie Marshall" <rtmarshall@osbtown.com>
> Subject: Rocket-List: Re: Rocket-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 02/06/08
>
>
> Its called the wife's turn, looking to do something different. Its a
> beautiful ship, all the good stuff while being built, a thinking mans
> airplane, Anyway contact me off list if anyone's interested. I do not want
> to burn the bandwidth here on the list. Bob
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rocket-List Digest Server" <rocket-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 11:57 PM
> Subject: Rocket-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 02/06/08
>
>
> > *
> >
> > ================================================
> > Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> > ================================================
> >
> > Today's complete Rocket-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> > two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
> formatted
> > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
> > and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
> > of the Rocket-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> > such as Notepad or with a web browser.
> >
> > HTML Version:
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter08-02-06&Archive=Rocket
> >
> > Text Version:
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter08-02-06&Archive=Rocket
> >
> >
> > ==============================================
> > EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> > ==============================================
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > Rocket-List Digest Archive
> > ---
> > Total Messages Posted Wed 02/06/08: 2
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > Today's Message Index:
> > ----------------------
> >
> > 1. 11:35 AM - HR II (Bob & Toodie Marshall)
> > 2. 01:03 PM - Re: HR II (Fred Weaver)
> >
> >
> > ________________________________ Message 1
> > _____________________________________
> >
> >
> > Time: 11:35:56 AM PST US
> > From: "Bob & Toodie Marshall" <rtmarshall@osbtown.com>
> > Subject: Rocket-List: HR II
> >
> > Hello Rocketeers, Sad to say but my HR II is going up for sale, If
> > anyone is interested please contact me off list, It will go in Trade a
> > Plane soon. Thanks, Bob rtmarshall@osbtown.com
> >
> > ________________________________ Message 2
> > _____________________________________
> >
> >
> > Time: 01:03:52 PM PST US
> > From: Fred Weaver <Mytyweav@earthlink.net>
> > Subject: Re: Rocket-List: HR II
> >
> > WHY?
> >
> > Bob & Toodie Marshall wrote:
> >> Hello Rocketeers, Sad to say but my HR II is going up for sale, If
> >> anyone is interested please contact me off list, It will go in Trade
> >> a Plane soon. Thanks, Bob rtmarshall@osbtown.com
> >> <mailto:rtmarshall@osbtown.com>
> >> *
> >>
> >>
> >> *
> >>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > 8:14 PM
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message
> 2 _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:51:56 PM PST US
> From: <laboggan@mywdo.com>
> Subject: Rocket-List:
>
>
> Had another great day of flying my bullet...ie Rocket.
>
> I'm still having oil running down the belly. I ran the
> engine at full power today for a full hour just to see the
> fuel burn, plus another hour and a half before I landed
> and saw the most oil I've had so far all over the bottom.
> It threw it down to three quarts from a start of 7 and
> 1/2....
> Seems someone wrote about having a new top overhaul and
> theirs quit the oil throwing.
> I had a professional mechanic do a compression check on my
> engine after I landed and every cylinder is 80/80 or so
> close it was not worth worrying about...worse one was 78.
> Seems if I start out at 9 quarts it only throws out about
> one every two hours.
> The mechanic also told me to try using straight shell 50w.
> I'm using exxon 20/50.
> Anyone have any other good ideas.
> This oil throwing is driving me up a wall.
>
> I live at 6600 msl but climbed up to 17,600 msl today. It
> is much higher than my tri pacer would ever go.
> and I was up there within 30 minutes not even trying.
> We sure have great airplanes.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message
> 3 _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:01:11 PM PST US
> From: "nico css" <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
> Subject: RE: Rocket-List:
>
>
> Are you sure? 10,000 in 30 minutes? That sounds wrong. That's the pace a
> Piper Colt climbs at (not above 8,000 but still).
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> laboggan@mywdo.com
> Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 6:49 PM
> Subject: Rocket-List:
>
>
> Had another great day of flying my bullet...ie Rocket.
>
> I'm still having oil running down the belly. I ran the engine at full
> power
> today for a full hour just to see the fuel burn, plus another hour and a
> half before I landed and saw the most oil I've had so far all over the
> bottom.
> It threw it down to three quarts from a start of 7 and 1/2....
> Seems someone wrote about having a new top overhaul and theirs quit the
> oil
> throwing.
> I had a professional mechanic do a compression check on my engine after I
> landed and every cylinder is 80/80 or so close it was not worth worrying
> about...worse one was 78.
> Seems if I start out at 9 quarts it only throws out about one every two
> hours.
> The mechanic also told me to try using straight shell 50w.
> I'm using exxon 20/50.
> Anyone have any other good ideas.
> This oil throwing is driving me up a wall.
>
> I live at 6600 msl but climbed up to 17,600 msl today. It is much higher
> than my tri pacer would ever go.
> and I was up there within 30 minutes not even trying.
> We sure have great airplanes.
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Sport wing for sale |
Hi all,
There is a rumor that there is a set of sport wings out there for sale?
If anyone knows anything, please contact me off line.
Thanks,
Jeff
Message 5
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| Subject: | Sport wing for sale |
Try Doug Stenger, Banks Oregon.
He has a set and might sell them.
> Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2008 08:24:21 -0800
> From: f1rocket@telus.net
> To: rocket-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Rocket-List: Sport wing for sale
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> There is a rumor that there is a set of sport wings out there for sale?
> If anyone knows anything, please contact me off line.
>
> Thanks,
> Jeff
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser!
http://biggestloser.msn.com/
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Rocket-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/07/08 |
How far your vent tube extends into the airstream and how it is cut can
change this dramatically!!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ron Carter
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 10:08 AM
Subject: Rocket-List: Re: Rocket-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/07/08
4.5 qts in 2.5 hrs is potentially catastrophic!! There is something
SERIOUSLY wrong with your engine. Here are a few ideas.
You do know the engine is not designed to fly zero or negative G's with
out
an inverted oil system, right? even mild negative G's will throw oil out
of
the sump and down the vent and onto your belly.
Your normal operating ( warm) oil pressure should be 65-75 psi.
Next, a compression check tells you that the rings, valves and cylinder
heads are not broken, leaking or cracked. I am a little suspect of the
compression check if it was done when the engine was HOT. It should be
done
when the engine is at normal operating temp such as 385 F or less.I
think
you could conceivably get a good compression check on a hot engine that
has
choked cylinders even though the rings were cracked.
If I recall correctly- Lycoming plain steel cylinders are choked .017 in
from the base to the top. This could allow more blow by at the bottom of
the
stroke than at the top. are your cyl's choked? Try a compression check
at
bottom dead center and see how much they leak.
Next, The oil sump and pick up system in these engines is dead simple.
There
isint much to go wrong here assuming you dont have an inverted system.
Run your vent line as high as possible before it turns down to exit the
cowl. A little more up hill distance in the tube will allow more oil to
drain back into the engine before making it over the hump and out of the
engine. These tubes often have coil springs inside to prevent collapse
at
tight bends. Is yours collapsed anywhere?
The vent line hould be 3/4" id. Smaller diameters will let the oil
bridge in
the tube and consequently blow out the tube easier.
An experiment- Add a length of hose to the vent tube, run the engine
and
see how much blow by you are getting. It should feel like a light smooth
air
stream- hardly perceptable.
Thats all I can think of. If you are not flying negative G's and are
loosing
as much oil as you say you are, you have a serious engine malfunction.
These
engines are tough but not actually bullet proof. FYI- some of this oil
is
leaking into all the sheetmetal joints it runs over and will stink up
your
planes' interior. Keep it clean until you get it fixed.
Good luck. I really want to hear about the solution. Keep us posted.
Ron Carter
Skypark Airport, Bountiful, UT
HR2 # 49 675 TTSN
On 2/8/08, Rocket-List Digest Server <rocket-list@matronics.com> wrote:
*
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
Today's complete Rocket-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Rocket-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701
<http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html
&Chapte
r 08-02-07&Archive=Rocket>
&View=html&Chapter 08-02-07&Archive=Rocket
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701
<http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&
Chapter
08-02-07&Archive=Rocket>
&View=txt&Chapter 08-02-07&Archive=Rocket
======================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
======================
----------------------------------------------------------
Rocket-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Thu 02/07/08: 3
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:37 AM - Re: Rocket-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 02/06/08 (Bob &
Toodie
Marshall)
2. 06:51 PM - ()
3. 10:01 PM - Re: (nico css)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 07:37:56 AM PST US
From: "Bob & Toodie Marshall" <rtmarshall@osbtown.com>
Subject: Rocket-List: Re: Rocket-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 02/06/08
Its called the wife's turn, looking to do something different. Its a
beautiful ship, all the good stuff while being built, a thinking mans
airplane, Anyway contact me off list if anyone's interested. I do not
want
to burn the bandwidth here on the list. Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rocket-List Digest Server" <rocket-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 11:57 PM
Subject: Rocket-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 02/06/08
> *
>
>
=======================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
>
=======================
>
> Today's complete Rocket-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked
Indexes
> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
version
> of the Rocket-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701
<http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html
&Chapte
r> &View=html&Chapter 08-02-06&Archive=Rocket
>
> Text Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701
<http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&
Chapter
> &View=txt&Chapter 08-02-06&Archive=Rocket
>
>
>
=====================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
>
=====================
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Rocket-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Wed 02/06/08: 2
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 11:35 AM - HR II (Bob & Toodie Marshall)
> 2. 01:03 PM - Re: HR II (Fred Weaver)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 11:35:56 AM PST US
> From: "Bob & Toodie Marshall" <rtmarshall@osbtown.com>
> Subject: Rocket-List: HR II
>
> Hello Rocketeers, Sad to say but my HR II is going up for sale, If
> anyone is interested please contact me off list, It will go in Trade a
> Plane soon. Thanks, Bob rtmarshall@osbtown.com
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:03:52 PM PST US
> From: Fred Weaver <Mytyweav@earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: Rocket-List: HR II
>
> WHY?
>
> Bob & Toodie Marshall wrote:
>> Hello Rocketeers, Sad to say but my HR II is going up for sale, If
>> anyone is interested please contact me off list, It will go in Trade
>> a Plane soon. Thanks, Bob rtmarshall@osbtown.com
>> <mailto:rtmarshall@osbtown.com>
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> 8:14 PM
>
>
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 06:51:56 PM PST US
From: <laboggan@mywdo.com>
Subject: Rocket-List:
Had another great day of flying my bullet...ie Rocket.
I'm still having oil running down the belly. I ran the
engine at full power today for a full hour just to see the
fuel burn, plus another hour and a half before I landed
and saw the most oil I've had so far all over the bottom.
It threw it down to three quarts from a start of 7 and
1/2....
Seems someone wrote about having a new top overhaul and
theirs quit the oil throwing.
I had a professional mechanic do a compression check on my
engine after I landed and every cylinder is 80/80 or so
close it was not worth worrying about...worse one was 78.
Seems if I start out at 9 quarts it only throws out about
one every two hours.
The mechanic also told me to try using straight shell 50w.
I'm using exxon 20/50.
Anyone have any other good ideas.
This oil throwing is driving me up a wall.
I live at 6600 msl but climbed up to 17,600 msl today. It
is much higher than my tri pacer would ever go.
and I was up there within 30 minutes not even trying.
We sure have great airplanes.
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 10:01:11 PM PST US
From: "nico css" <nico@cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: RE: Rocket-List:
Are you sure? 10,000 in 30 minutes? That sounds wrong. That's the pace a
Piper Colt climbs at (not above 8,000 but still).
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
laboggan@mywdo.com
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 6:49 PM
Subject: Rocket-List:
Had another great day of flying my bullet...ie Rocket.
I'm still having oil running down the belly. I ran the engine at full
power
today for a full hour just to see the fuel burn, plus another hour and a
half before I landed and saw the most oil I've had so far all over the
bottom.
It threw it down to three quarts from a start of 7 and 1/2....
Seems someone wrote about having a new top overhaul and theirs quit the
oil
throwing.
I had a professional mechanic do a compression check on my engine after
I
landed and every cylinder is 80/80 or so close it was not worth worrying
about...worse one was 78.
Seems if I start out at 9 quarts it only throws out about one every two
hours.
The mechanic also told me to try using straight shell 50w.
I'm using exxon 20/50.
Anyone have any other good ideas.
This oil throwing is driving me up a wall.
I live at 6600 msl but climbed up to 17,600 msl today. It is much
higher
Message 7
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OK, so you had a good reason. 200kts is a whole load of fun.
I would take issue with your reasoning, however, that flying fast climbing
slow is safer to be better prepared for turbelence than climbing fast and
flying slower. But, it's every man's own domain to fly as he enjoys best.
And the Rocket certainly makes for plenty of that.
Nico
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rocket-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
laboggan@mywdo.com
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 6:23 AM
Subject: Rocket-List:
No inverted oil system. Plain oil system with an air oil seperator on the
breather.
Yep, I know 10,000 in 30 minutes but I was just putting along at 200kts and
climbing slowly during the flight.
You can go from calm air here in colorado springs to severe turbulence in
about 100 feet in the winter and you never know when it will hit you...so I
was climbing slowly.
I got a kick out of being that high, I have never flown any plane myself
over 13. Was higher than pikes peak.
I've had friends here on final lose 400 feet completely out of control with
turbulence. We get the roll offs from the huge mountains. He was in a much
smaller plane and got back under control about 80 feet from the
ground....there was known turbulence, some days it's better to stay on the
ground here.
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