---------------------------------------------------------- RotaxEngines-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 02/24/09: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:12 AM - Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE (ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk) 2. 02:21 AM - Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE () 3. 09:45 AM - Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE (Roger Lee) 4. 10:54 AM - Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE (Noel Loveys) 5. 01:56 PM - Re: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE (Ivan) 6. 02:08 PM - Re: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE () ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:12:16 AM PST US From: "ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk" Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE Hi!Bob Lindsey I had some "airating" oil problems with the 3300 Jabiru at one stage which showed ip as fluctuating pressure. I'd have thought Rotax being somewhat more pedantic would have a "de-airating tray" prior to the oil pump? I didn't notice any oil pressure deterioration at 10,000ft on mine. Regards Bob Harrison G-PTAG (Now with 914) ----Original Message---- From: RLINDSA2@san.rr.com Subj: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE I don't know what actually causes oil to foam. Honda GN-4 was recommended by Rotax rep Eric Tucker. I plan on trying to repeat the situation on a forthcoming high altitude flight. ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul McAllister Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 6:02 PM Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE Hi Bob, One possibility is that you are getting oil foaming at altitude. I seem to recall John Hurst back in the days he was at Europa that he had a problem with some oils doing this. I can't remember which oil he had the most trouble with, but I seem to recall that he got good results with Valvoline Durablend. Paul --- On Mon, 2/23/09, ROBERT LINDSAY wrote: From: ROBERT LINDSAY Subject: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE Recently I had the need to climb to FL180 on a below standard temp day. Oil press in Rotax 914 UL3 (ser 4417756, 475 hrs) has always been normal, but on this occasion while climbing 34 inches 5500 rpm thru 15000 ft, oil pressure began decreasing (OAT was 10 deg below stnd). At 18000 ft Grand Rapids EIS oil pressure alarmed at 25 psi. Power was retarded to below 65 percent and descent commenced. Oil pressure returned to normal (about 50 psi) below 15 Kft where OAT was near stnd. Flight continued at 12Kft at 75 percent power, all engine parameters indicating normal. Oil quantity checked after landing indicated near full. Oil is Honda GN-4 10W40. Oil pressure on several flights since (altitude below 10 Kft) has been normal. Why would oil pressure drop under the above conditions? I suspect a sensing/indication problem. font face="Arial" size="2">Thanx, all. Bob Lindsay, Europa XS monogear N77EU, San Diego CA ist">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List ics.com .matronics.com/contribution Get up to 50% off Norton Security 2009 only from Tiscali - http://www.tiscali.co.uk/securepc __________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:21:03 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE Hi Bob Rotax do have a Mesh Baffle insert in the Oil tank just for that purpose, A couple of years back Rotax remove some oil Manufacturers from there recommended list because of foaming, I would stick with the recommended oil only, regards Ivor ---- "ptag.dev@tiscali.co.uk" wrote: > > Hi!Bob Lindsey > > I had some "airating" oil problems with the 3300 Jabiru at one stage which showed ip as fluctuating pressure. I'd have thought Rotax being somewhat more pedantic would have a "de-airating tray" prior to the oil pump? > > I didn't notice any oil pressure deterioration at 10,000ft on mine. > > Regards > > Bob Harrison G-PTAG (Now with 914) > > > > > ----Original Message---- > From: RLINDSA2@san.rr.com > Date: 24/02/2009 4:12 > To: > Subj: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE > > > > > I don't know what actually causes oil to foam. Honda GN-4 was recommended by Rotax rep Eric Tucker. I plan on trying to repeat the situation on a forthcoming high altitude flight. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Paul McAllister > To: rotaxengines-list@matronics.com > Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 6:02 PM > Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE > > > > > > Hi Bob, > > One possibility is that you are getting oil foaming at altitude. I seem to recall John Hurst back in the days he was at Europa that he had a problem with some oils doing this. > > I can't remember which oil he had the most trouble with, but I seem to recall that he got good results with Valvoline Durablend. > > Paul > > --- On Mon, 2/23/09, ROBERT LINDSAY wrote: > > From: ROBERT LINDSAY > Subject: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE > To: rotaxengines-list@matronics.com > Date: Monday, February 23, 2009, 5:14 PM > > > > Recently I had the need to climb to FL180 on a below standard temp day. Oil press in Rotax 914 UL3 (ser 4417756, 475 hrs) has always been normal, but on this occasion while climbing 34 inches 5500 rpm thru 15000 ft, oil pressure began decreasing (OAT was 10 deg below stnd). At 18000 ft Grand Rapids EIS oil pressure alarmed at 25 psi. Power was retarded to below 65 percent and descent commenced. Oil pressure returned to normal (about 50 psi) below 15 Kft where OAT was near stnd. Flight continued at 12Kft at 75 percent power, all engine parameters indicating normal. > > Oil quantity checked after landing indicated near full. Oil is Honda GN-4 10W40. Oil pressure on several flights since (altitude below 10 Kft) has been normal. > > Why would oil pressure drop under the above conditions? I suspect a sensing/indication problem. > > font face="Arial" size="2">Thanx, all. Bob Lindsay, Europa XS monogear N77EU, San Diego CA > > ist">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List > ics.com > .matronics.com/contribution > > > > > > > > Get up to 50% off Norton Security 2009 only from Tiscali - http://www.tiscali.co.uk/securepc > __________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:45:12 AM PST US Subject: RotaxEngines-List: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE From: "Roger Lee" Oil foaming used to be a bigger issue a number of years back. That is why Rotax raised the oil level in the tank a few years back to help reduce the chance of sucking in air through the oil tank. Some oils do do have a propensity to foam more than others, but the semi synthetic and full synthetics of today are not as bad as they were many years ago or as bad as a straight dino oil. The least foaming of all the oils seems to be Amsoil (10-40 or 20-50 motorcycle oil). Mobile 1 Racing 4T, Aero Shell Sport Plus 4 and the Honda GN-4 oil are all good oils. I have seen Amsoil flown to 17K. You should not have any foaming issues with these oils. As Ivor pointed out Rotax has the wire mesh and the baffle plate inside the tank to help with sloshing and foaming. -------- Roger Lee Tucson, Az. Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated Rotax Service Center 520-574-1080 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=231830#231830 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/oil_comparison_727.pdf ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:54:54 AM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE Oil foams when it gets hot and viscosity drops a little. Teh beating of the oil pump is what froths it up. Usually somewhere int the system there is a place where the oil is spun before the cooler to try to centrifugally remove the air form the oil. The 912 oil tank I have has the return line to the side of the tank in such a way as to spin the oil entering it... Airbubbles then rise and the pick up for the oil pump is at the bottom. The idea being to avoid getting too much air in the oil returning to the cooler then to the engine. Noel From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ROBERT LINDSAY Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 12:42 AM Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE I don't know what actually causes oil to foam. Honda GN-4 was recommended by Rotax rep Eric Tucker. I plan on trying to repeat the situation on a forthcoming high altitude flight. ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul McAllister Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 6:02 PM Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE Hi Bob, One possibility is that you are getting oil foaming at altitude. I seem to recall John Hurst back in the days he was at Europa that he had a problem with some oils doing this. I can't remember which oil he had the most trouble with, but I seem to recall that he got good results with Valvoline Durablend. Paul --- On Mon, 2/23/09, ROBERT LINDSAY wrote: From: ROBERT LINDSAY Subject: RotaxEngines-List: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE Recently I had the need to climb to FL180 on a below standard temp day. Oil press in Rotax 914 UL3 (ser 4417756, 475 hrs) has always been normal, but on this occasion while climbing 34 inches 5500 rpm thru 15000 ft, oil pressure began decreasing (OAT was 10 deg below stnd). At 18000 ft Grand Rapids EIS oil pressure alarmed at 25 psi. Power was retarded to below 65 percent and descent commenced. Oil pressure returned to normal (about 50 psi) below 15 Kft where OAT was near stnd. Flight continued at 12Kft at 75 percent power, all engine parameters indicating normal. Oil quantity checked after landing indicated near full. Oil is Honda GN-4 10W40. Oil pressure on several flights since (altitude below 10 Kft) has been normal. Why would oil pressure drop under the above conditions? I suspect a sensing/indication problem. font face="Arial" size="2">Thanx, all. Bob Lindsay, Europa XS monogear N77EU, San Diego CA ist">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List ics.com .matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:56:34 PM PST US From: "Ivan" Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE I also had some fluctuating oil pressures in the past. After changing out three sending units and having the same thing happen again, I figured that it was impossible for it to be a defective sending unit. Sure enough I concentrated on tidying us the wire connections a bit and it never happened again. Ivan Phoenix, AZ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Lee" Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 5:24 PM Subject: RotaxEngines-List: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE > > Most of these oil pressure issues tend to be sending units or bad grounds. > If you really lose oil pressure you'll have some other serious issues to > contend with. > > -------- > Roger Lee > Tucson, Az. > Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated > Rotax Service Center > 520-574-1080 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=231712#231712 > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:08:08 PM PST US From: "" Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE I had a problem with wildly fluctuating oil pressure. Turned out to be a bad ground. --- imap8ntr@cox.net wrote: From: "Ivan" Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE I also had some fluctuating oil pressures in the past. After changing out three sending units and having the same thing happen again, I figured that it was impossible for it to be a defective sending unit. Sure enough I concentrated on tidying us the wire connections a bit and it never happened again. Ivan Phoenix, AZ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Lee" Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 5:24 PM Subject: RotaxEngines-List: Re: ROTAX 914 LOW OIL PRESSURE > > Most of these oil pressure issues tend to be sending units or bad grounds. > If you really lose oil pressure you'll have some other serious issues to > contend with. > > -------- > Roger Lee > Tucson, Az. > Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated > Rotax Service Center > 520-574-1080 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=231712#231712 > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rotaxengines-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RotaxEngines-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rotaxengines-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rotaxengines-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.