Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:45 AM - Re: More on ethanol (dave)
2. 06:05 AM - Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol (catz631@aol.com)
3. 06:30 AM - Prop bolts (catz631@aol.com)
4. 06:31 AM - Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol (tom463@aol.com)
5. 06:48 AM - Re: Prop bolts (lucien)
6. 06:57 AM - Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol (lucien)
7. 06:59 AM - Re: oozing valve covers (Peter Thomson)
8. 07:22 AM - Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol (Hugh MCKAY III)
9. 07:22 AM - Re: Re: More on ethanol (blumax008@aol.com)
10. 07:37 AM - Re: Prop bolts (Bob Borger)
11. 08:31 AM - Re: Re: More on ethanol (Dave Fisher)
12. 08:36 AM - Rotax 582 Carb icing (Dave Fisher)
13. 01:54 PM - Re: Prop bolts (Roger Lee)
14. 05:29 PM - Re: Re: More on ethanol (FLYaDIVE)
15. 05:44 PM - Re: Re: More on ethanol (Dave Austin)
16. 05:48 PM - Re: Re: Exhaust wrap/insulation ? (Noel Loveys)
17. 05:58 PM - Re: Exhaust wrap/insulation ? (Roger Lee)
18. 05:58 PM - Re: Prop bolts (Roger Lee)
19. 06:06 PM - Re: oozing valve covers (Roger Lee)
20. 07:03 PM - Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol (Noel Loveys)
21. 08:09 PM - Re: Re: More on ethanol (E. D. Eliot)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanol |
[quote="blumax008(at)aol.com"]In a message dated 1/18/2010 6:47:36 A.M. Eastern
Standard Time, dave@cfisher.com writes:
> I have 8 other aircraft at my strip that all are 2 strokes and use regular
grade gas with ethanol or what ever the cheapest station sells. No problems
yet.
>
Keep your fingers crossed. You're an exception to the rule. Are you using any
sort of additive?
> [b]
No additives at all. Just regular grade 87 I guess. What ever I get 98% of it
goes in throught a filter with a screen .
I had a can of gas about 3 months old I found in hanger on weekend that came back
from cottage in Oct ( it could have been bought in summer too ) I only had
about 2 gallons left in plane so I dumped in 5 gallons . WOrked fine but on a
few full power pull ups I think that Iheard some pinging twice under load only.
EGTs running abit high right now but I am still on summer needle settings and prop
a tad course still so this keeps the load on engine and EGTs close to in line.
I hear about tank issues with fiberglass but have not see any yet. If I do I will try these likely www.wingtanks.com
Dave
--------
Rotax Dealer, Ontario Canada
http://www.cfisher.com/
Awesome *New Forum *
http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol |
Noel,
The carbs on my British cars have all been rebuilt with alcohol resistant
rubber. The problem with the bad running has to do with the age of the fuel.
In a few weeks the fuel turns to "sour milk" ! Draining all the fuel and
refilling solves the problem of bad running (until the next time)
In referance to the dieseling in my aircraft, I poured Lucas Racing Octane
booster in my airplane tanks, shook the tar out of the wings to mix, and
then flew it. This was the same load of fuel that dieseled on me three times at
shut down previously. I have since flown the airplane a few times without
adding fuel and it has not dieseled. It made a believer out of me. If I
cannot fly the aircraft enough to keep recycling the fuel then I will use the
octane booster. I am also starting to use premium vs regular in my aircraft, in
an effort to lengthen the life of the fuel. My engine only requires regular.
Dick Maddux
912UL
Milton,Fl
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The prop flange is part of the engine so I thought I would bring this up
here. I am replacing the prop on my aircraft with a Kiev prop (removing my
Warp) The prop flange looks like a "swiss cheese" on my older Rotax 912. I have
three sizes of holes. The outer holes are bigger and with the Warp I used
prop bushings. The Kiev uses 6 of the inner holes (out of the 12) All of the
inner holes are threaded and are two different sizes. The ones I use for the
Kiev hub take an 8mm bolt as did the Warp (with the bushes) Confused yet
?....me too
Anyway,I am trying to find good grade 8 ,8mm bolts. The importer says the
Chinese are the only ones that have 8mm prop bolts. I don't want to use
Chinese prop bolts. I know AN bolts are not metric but does anyone know where I
can get the proper bolts ?
Thanks !
Dick Maddux
912UL
Milton,Fl
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol |
The 200 hour service on my one-year-old Rotax 912ULS run on 93 Octane 10%
Ethanol showed significant flaking of the carburetor floats. I now drive
30 miles each way to get non-ethanol gas. Could have been a bad batch of
resin used to make the floats, or could have been the Ethanol. Can't afford
the risk, no more Ethanol!!!!
Tom
N569AT
Florida
Message 5
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[quote="Dick Maddux"]The prop flange is part of the engine so I thought I would
bring this up here. I am replacing the prop on my aircraft with a Kiev prop (removing
my Warp) The prop flange looks like a "swiss cheese" on my older Rotax
912. I have three sizes of holes. The outer holes are bigger and with the Warp
I used prop bushings. The Kiev uses 6 of the inner holes (out of the 12) All
of the inner holes are threaded and are two different sizes. The ones I use
for the Kiev hub take an 8mm bolt as did the Warp (with the bushes) Confused yet
?....me too
Anyway,I am trying to find good grade 8 ,8mm bolts. The importer says the Chinese
are the only ones that have 8mm prop bolts. I don't want to use Chinese prop
bolts. I know AN bolts are not metric but does anyone know where I can get
the proper bolts ?
Thanks !
Dick Maddux
912UL
Milton,Fl
> [b]
Aircraft grade metric hardware is unavailable in the US. I've looked everywhere
for it in the past and got only puppy-dog looks from everyone I've ever asked
about it. So forget it ;)
Your only choice is grade 8.8 8MM bolts available at hardware stores and fastener
outfits like Fastenal (highly recommended). Fortunately, those fasteners work
just fine, they're plenty strong and the QC on them is generally good enough.
Do NOT use aluminum hardware _with backing locknuts only_ - they're not strong
enough with only backing nuts. Don't ask me why I know this. If they thread into
something substantial, such as the threads in the prop flange or the lugs in
the outer ring if equipped, they'll be fine.
5/16" grade 5 is another option for the unthreaded holes. AN5 bolts with AN locknuts
should work too, tho the tightening torque specified for most props are
for coarse thread. AN bolts/nuts are UNF so you'd have to adjust the tightening
torque accordingly to get the same preload.
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=282447#282447
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol |
[quote="tom463(at)aol.com"]The 200 hour service on my one-year-old Rotax 912ULS
run on 93 Octane 10% Ethanol showed significant flaking of the carburetor floats.
I now drive 30 miles each way to get non-ethanol gas. Could have been
a bad batch of resin used to make the floats, or could have been the Ethanol.
Can't afford the risk, no more Ethanol!!!!
Tom
N569AT
Florida
> [b]
The floats should be OK with ethanol. As per the Rotax bulletin posted this summer,
there should be nothing inside the engine that can't deal with up to 10%
ethanol.
The flaking in your case I suspect was probably due to something else (I've heard
of this before even where pure gas was being used).
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
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| Subject: | Re: oozing valve covers |
500hrs, no oil leaks, runs cold
Peter
CH710SP/912ULS
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanolMore on ethanol |
Tom:=0A=0AYour problem may not be the Ethanol. It may be simply a set of ba
d floats from the manufacturer. Carefully read and follow Rotax Service Ins
truction SI-912-021, and without question replace the floats! The internal
Carb.-floats should be fine using fuel with up to 10% Ethanol.=0A=0AHugh
McKay=0ARotax 912 UL=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom:
"tom463@aol.com" <tom463@aol.com>=0ATo: rotaxengines-list@matronics.com=0A
Sent: Wed, January 20, 2010 9:25:52 AM=0ASubject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Mo
re on ethanolMore on ethanol=0A=0AThe 200 hour service on my one-year-old R
otax 912ULS run on 93 Octane 10% Ethanol showed significant flaking of the
carburetor floats.- I now drive 30 miles each way to get non-ethanol gas.
- Could have been a bad batch of resin used to make the floats, or could
have been the Ethanol.- Can't afford the risk, no more Ethanol!!!!=0A=0AT
===
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanol |
In a message dated 1/20/2010 4:46:01 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
dave@cfisher.com writes:
I hear about tank issues with fiberglass but have not see any yet.
Here's a strange one for you. I have a DFS trike with a fiberglass fuel
tank. BEFORE I started using Ethanol laced fuel, it was leaking fuel. AFTER I
began using Ethanol fuel...it stopped leaking!
So Ethanol is good for something after all! It melts fiberglass fuel tanks
& stops leaks!
Message 10
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Dick,
McMaster-Carr has Grade 8.8, DIN 931 (1.25 pitch, partially threaded) and DIN 960
(1.00 pitch, partially threaded) metric bolts. I have no idea where they are
manufactured. I have no idea if they are exactly what you need for prop bolts.
But you can check them out and see what you think.
http://www.mcmaster.com/ Go to Cap Screws. Scroll down and select Metric under "System of Measurement." Select Class 8.8 under "Material." See what they have from there..
Good luck,
Bob Borger
Europa XS Monowheel, Intercooled Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S prop
On Wednesday, January 20, 2010, at 08:20AM, <catz631@aol.com> wrote:
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanol |
Good one !!
You should post that here
http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=35
Ethanol thread
Glad to hear !!
----- Original Message -----
From: blumax008@aol.com
To: rotaxengines-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 10:21 AM
Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Re: More on ethanol
In a message dated 1/20/2010 4:46:01 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
dave@cfisher.com writes:
I hear about tank issues with fiberglass but have not see any yet.
Here's a strange one for you. I have a DFS trike with a fiberglass
fuel tank. BEFORE I started using Ethanol laced fuel, it was leaking
fuel. AFTER I began using Ethanol fuel...it stopped leaking!
So Ethanol is good for something after all! It melts fiberglass fuel
tanks & stops leaks!
Message 12
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| Subject: | Rotax 582 Carb icing |
http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=168&start=0
Message 13
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Hi Dick,
Believe it or not Ace Hardware has the metric grade 8.8.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Repair Center
520-574-1080
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=282558#282558
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanol |
That is SCARY!
Think what is happening that would cause it to stop leaking? Some thing is
swelling ... E10 will cause that in FIBERGLASS. Notice I say fiberglass,
not EPOXY. There are some EPOXYs that can handle E10.
Barry
On Wed, Jan 20, 2010 at 10:21 AM, <blumax008@aol.com> wrote:
> In a message dated 1/20/2010 4:46:01 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> dave@cfisher.com writes:
>
> I hear about tank issues with fiberglass but have not see any yet.
>
> Here's a strange one for you. I have a DFS trike with a fiberglass fuel
> tank. BEFORE I started using Ethanol laced fuel, it was leaking fuel. AFTER
> I began using Ethanol fuel...it stopped leaking!
>
> So Ethanol is good for something after all! It melts fiberglass fuel tanks
> & stops leaks!
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanol |
How does a vinyl-ester gas tank handle ethanol as apposed to epoxy or
poly? Anyone know?
Dave Austin
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Exhaust wrap/insulation ? |
Where do you get the wrap?
I was thinking like the bikes where the exhaust is wrapped from stem to
stern. The short bit you describe wouldn't cause an internal overheat.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Lee
Sent: January 20, 2010 12:19 AM
Subject: RotaxEngines-List: Re: Exhaust wrap/insulation ?
On our exhaust we are only covering about 15" of exhaust so it does not
effect EGT's at all. You wrap from the exhaust port at the cylinder and only
down over the knuckle by the springs. I have done many and have never had
any issues or complaints and I keep doing more as people keep requesting it.
I have one to do Jan. 30 from a guy out of San Antonio. I'll pull the engine
and put on a firewall blanket, Matco brakes, pull the wings for an
inspection and an engine inspection.
Just don't cover or have the wrap around the EGT probes. To apply anti-seize
you loosen the clamp at the knuckle slide the wrap up some and drop or pull
away the muffler an few inches. Then pull the wrap back the 1"-1.5" you
moved it and re-clamp. If you land and pull off your cowling would you grab
your exhaust pipe? Not with any common since no one would, but with the wrap
I can put my hand on it. They Mfg. of the wrap claims it reduces radiated
heat by 70%. I don't know how accurate that number is, but what a
difference.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Repair Center
520-574-1080
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=282377#282377
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Exhaust wrap/insulation ? |
The header warp is called just that. It comes in 1" and 2" wide rolls and 50' long.
Just use the 2". It comes in a light tan color or a darker black color. Either
will work, but I would recommend the black as it has a nice protective coating
already applied. Some want you to paint the light tan for a coating, but
it is not that big a deal for us.
Racers or high performance guys use this to eek out more HP. They wrap from the
exhaust port all the way down the entire exhaust. This keeps the exhaust gases
hot and makes them exit the exhaust pipe faster. If your pipes are not wrapped
like our passenger cars then the exhaust gas cools and slows down in the pipe
which robs a small amount of HP. Not enough for us to worry about. The high
performance guys want it all.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Repair Center
520-574-1080
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=282597#282597
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Hi Dick,
Ace Hardware has these bolts in metric.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Repair Center
520-574-1080
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=282598#282598
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: oozing valve covers |
The oil leaks that I'm talking about don't come from an over heat or a hot engine.
They are vibration caused or the cast valve covers have high and low spots.
I think I have a good solution that seems to be working well. Sand the valve covers
on a flat surface with some 220 grit to make sure the surface is flat all
the way around the valve cover. Don't be afraid it takes more than a couple of
strokes. Clean the "O" ring groves and mating metal surfaces with a solvent.
The put the "O" rings in place and coat them with Loctite 574 (orange), both
the "O" ring side and the engine mating surface. You do not need to glob it on,
but a film around both surfaces and the small "O" ring in the center where the
valve cover screw goes through. Them re-mount the valve cover and torque to
115 in/lbs. The normal torque is 105 in/lbs so the additional 10 in/lbs won't
hurt anything. So far very good success.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Repair Center
520-574-1080
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=282602#282602
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| Subject: | More on ethanolMore on ethanol |
Thanks Dick
I've had more than a little experience with the English cars and, thank god,
no experience with ethanol fuel... My recommendation to you would be to add
a sump drain at the lowest point of your fuel system and drain the tanks
after every flight... do the same with your car. Ethanol evaporates faster
than the gas it's in and that changes your fuel doublequick... Best thing
is not to have it there. If your car is old enough a little 100LL probably
wouldn't hurt either.
I'm looking for some good octane booster for my Miata... It only has a ten
gal tank (45L) and most of the local pumps have gone unisex... one nozzle
for three grades of gas. The hose and internal plumbing are supposed to
take almost two gallons to fill which means that for a dry tank I end up
with 20% low octane gas. The engine is around 11:1 CR and doesn't like low
octanes at all!
About the Miata, one of the first 224 in North America, I'd swap it today
for an MG... TF or TD... I'd think long and hard about a model A too even
though I'm not fussy about the front suspension on that car.
Noel
From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
catz631@aol.com
Sent: January 20, 2010 10:35 AM
Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: More on ethanolMore on ethanol
Noel,
The carbs on my British cars have all been rebuilt with alcohol resistant
rubber. The problem with the bad running has to do with the age of the fuel.
In a few weeks the fuel turns to "sour milk" ! Draining all the fuel and
refilling solves the problem of bad running (until the next time)
In referance to the dieseling in my aircraft, I poured Lucas Racing Octane
booster in my airplane tanks, shook the tar out of the wings to mix, and
then flew it. This was the same load of fuel that dieseled on me three times
at shut down previously. I have since flown the airplane a few times without
adding fuel and it has not dieseled. It made a believer out of me. If I
cannot fly the aircraft enough to keep recycling the fuel then I will use
the octane booster. I am also starting to use premium vs regular in my
aircraft, in an effort to lengthen the life of the fuel. My engine only
requires regular.
Dick Maddux
912UL
Milton,Fl
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: More on ethanol |
Sold it - sorry.
From: dave@cfisher.com
Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Re: More on ethanol
Good one !!
You should post that here
http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=35
Ethanol thread
Glad to hear !!
----- Original Message -----
From:
blumax008@aol.com
To: rotaxengines-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday=2C January 20=2C 2010 10:21
AM
Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Re: More
on ethanol
In a message dated 1/20/2010 4:46:01 A.M. Eastern Standard Time=2C dave@c
fisher.com writes:
I hear
about tank issues with fiberglass but have not see any
yet.
Here's a strange one for you. I have a DFS trike with a fiberglass fuel
tank. BEFORE I started using Ethanol laced fuel=2C it was leaking fuel. A
FTER I
began using Ethanol fuel...it stopped leaking!
So Ethanol is good for something after all! It melts fiberglass fuel
tanks & stops leaks!
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List">http://www.ma
tronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
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