---------------------------------------------------------- RotaxEngines-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 05/29/13: 4 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 09:10 AM - repair vs new vs overhaul (bjones@dmv.com) 2. 10:08 AM - Re: repair vs new vs overhaul (Pete Christensen) 3. 03:14 PM - Touring USA with folding wing plane and RV (bjones@dmv.com) 4. 03:55 PM - Re: repair vs new vs overhaul (Roger Lee) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 09:10:16 AM PST US Subject: RotaxEngines-List: repair vs new vs overhaul From: bjones@dmv.com Roger, My early s/n 912 in a model IV Kitfox shows evidence of right rear exhaust leakage at the head to exhaust pipe. Upon removal of the exhaust system I note that both rear exhaust pipes are sloppy in their fit to the heads, so I suspect an overheat problem, at least right at the exhaust ports?? So I bet I am in for two new heads (ouch $) and two new exhaust pipe ends welded onto the existing pipes. Does this sound right? Oh, the two rear exhaust pipes do not push up into the front head exhaust ports, probably because of a bit of exhaust crud build up on the old pipes, however the pipes do look round to my lay person's eye with a bit of surface crud on the outside where they fit into the exhaust port. I bought the plane about 15 years ago with 60 hours at that time, have flown it another roughly 400 and have never seen any indication of overheating on gauges, no leaking of oil at heads indicating warpage of heads nor has the coolant boiled over at least since I have owned it? So next question, what might be the cause? If I put two new heads on is the problem likely to recur? Any guidance here could be very useful. Since new heads are expensive, what are the rules of thumb about just selling the engine and getting a "factory overhaul" if such exists, or getting aa new engine on exchange from Rotax? I recall hearing that Rotax offered a "good deal" on new engines in exchange for old engines, if the case of the old engine is good? I bet others would be interested in some general guidelines on this from a trained and experienced Rotax specialist such as yourself. Thanks in advance for any guidance! BJ Kitfox IV 1050, Rotax 912 bjones@dmv.com 443-480-1023 > > Hi Hugh, > > The problem has been that not everyone has a gascolator or a fuel filter > far enough downstream. the main hose offenders isn't from hose before the > fuel pump because it has a filter screen inside, but from hose past the > pump. The fuel hose from the pump pressure side out is a problem at times. > Some 912's have the stainless steel lines mounted from the fuel > distribution block mounted on the carb balance tube, some don't. Some have > the red Teflon fuel line from this point and some have just rubber fuel > line right out of the pump to the carbs. > > Read this and you'll get a better handle on what some of the issues have > been. My original post here was to just give you another tool in your > mental toolbox for the "just in case" scenario. > > http://www.rotax-owner.com/rotax-blog/item/21-rotax-5-year-rubber-replacement-the-installation-considerations > > -------- > Roger Lee > Tucson, Az. > Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated > Rotax Repair Center - Heavy Maint. Rated > Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST > Cell 520-349-7056 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=399964#399964 > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:08:25 AM PST US Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: repair vs new vs overhaul From: Pete Christensen Your not flying enough. ;-) Pete On May 29, 2013, at 11:09 AM, bjones@dmv.com wrote: > > Roger, > > My early s/n 912 in a model IV Kitfox shows evidence of right rear exhaust > leakage at the head to exhaust pipe. > > Upon removal of the exhaust system I note that both rear exhaust pipes are > sloppy in their fit to the heads, so I suspect an overheat problem, at > least right at the exhaust ports?? > > So I bet I am in for two new heads (ouch $) and two new exhaust pipe ends > welded onto the existing pipes. Does this sound right? > > Oh, the two rear exhaust pipes do not push up into the front head exhaust > ports, probably because of a bit of exhaust crud build up on the old > pipes, however the pipes do look round to my lay person's eye with a bit > of surface crud on the outside where they fit into the exhaust port. > > I bought the plane about 15 years ago with 60 hours at that time, have > flown it another roughly 400 and have never seen any indication of > overheating on gauges, no leaking of oil at heads indicating warpage of > heads nor has the coolant boiled over at least since I have owned it? > > So next question, what might be the cause? If I put two new heads on is > the problem likely to recur? Any guidance here could be very useful. > > Since new heads are expensive, what are the rules of thumb about just > selling the engine and getting a "factory overhaul" if such exists, or > getting aa new engine on exchange from Rotax? I recall hearing that Rotax > offered a "good deal" on new engines in exchange for old engines, if the > case of the old engine is good? > > I bet others would be interested in some general guidelines on this from a > trained and experienced Rotax specialist such as yourself. > > Thanks in advance for any guidance! > > BJ > Kitfox IV 1050, Rotax 912 > bjones@dmv.com > 443-480-1023 > > > > >> >> Hi Hugh, >> >> The problem has been that not everyone has a gascolator or a fuel filter >> far enough downstream. the main hose offenders isn't from hose before the >> fuel pump because it has a filter screen inside, but from hose past the >> pump. The fuel hose from the pump pressure side out is a problem at times. >> Some 912's have the stainless steel lines mounted from the fuel >> distribution block mounted on the carb balance tube, some don't. Some have >> the red Teflon fuel line from this point and some have just rubber fuel >> line right out of the pump to the carbs. >> >> Read this and you'll get a better handle on what some of the issues have >> been. My original post here was to just give you another tool in your >> mental toolbox for the "just in case" scenario. >> >> http://www.rotax-owner.com/rotax-blog/item/21-rotax-5-year-rubber-replacement-the-installation-considerations >> >> -------- >> Roger Lee >> Tucson, Az. >> Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated >> Rotax Repair Center - Heavy Maint. Rated >> Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST >> Cell 520-349-7056 >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=399964#399964 > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:14:11 PM PST US Subject: RotaxEngines-List: Touring USA with folding wing plane and RV From: bjones@dmv.com Pete, You are right, I don't fly enough. On the flip side of that coin the flying that I do in the Kitfox is pretty unusual and spectacular. Each year I spend several weeks at a time in great flying locations, flying low and slow down in the scenery in Monument Valley, Canyon Lands, Valley of the Gods, Lake Powell, the Florida Keys, the Down East Maine coast line, in the Grand Canyon, along the Texas Gulf Coast playing on those desolate beaches, among many other beautiful spots. For the last ten years or so, I have towed the Kitfox in an enclosed car trailer-mobile hanger-shop behind a slick little motorhome, flying at these great locations when the weather is near perfect and enjoying touring by road in the little motorhome otherwise. (With over a decade of doing this I have learned a lot in terms of trailer selection, protecting the plane while towing, accessing airports or "getting thru the airport gate after 911", quick and easy loading and loading the plane from the trailer, saving on costs and where to enjoy flying. At the suggestion of EAA's Sport Plane representative, Ron Wagner, and EAA's senior magazine editor, Mary Jones, I recently started sharing my love of flying by doing forums at Sun N Fun, Sebring Sport Plane Expo, etc. on "Tips On How To Tow Your Folding Wing Plane and Tour The USA By LSA And Chevrolet". ) Being retired - Life Is Good! BJ Kitfox IV 1050 Rotax 912 80hp > > > Your not flying enough. ;-) > > Pete > > > On May 29, 2013, at 11:09 AM, bjones@dmv.com wrote: > >> >> Roger, >> >> My early s/n 912 in a model IV Kitfox shows evidence of right rear >> exhaust >> leakage at the head to exhaust pipe. >> >> Upon removal of the exhaust system I note that both rear exhaust pipes >> are >> sloppy in their fit to the heads, so I suspect an overheat problem, at >> least right at the exhaust ports?? >> >> So I bet I am in for two new heads (ouch $) and two new exhaust pipe >> ends >> welded onto the existing pipes. Does this sound right? >> >> Oh, the two rear exhaust pipes do not push up into the front head >> exhaust >> ports, probably because of a bit of exhaust crud build up on the old >> pipes, however the pipes do look round to my lay person's eye with a bit >> of surface crud on the outside where they fit into the exhaust port. >> >> I bought the plane about 15 years ago with 60 hours at that time, have >> flown it another roughly 400 and have never seen any indication of >> overheating on gauges, no leaking of oil at heads indicating warpage of >> heads nor has the coolant boiled over at least since I have owned it? >> >> So next question, what might be the cause? If I put two new heads on is >> the problem likely to recur? Any guidance here could be very useful. >> >> Since new heads are expensive, what are the rules of thumb about just >> selling the engine and getting a "factory overhaul" if such exists, or >> getting aa new engine on exchange from Rotax? I recall hearing that >> Rotax >> offered a "good deal" on new engines in exchange for old engines, if the >> case of the old engine is good? >> >> I bet others would be interested in some general guidelines on this from >> a >> trained and experienced Rotax specialist such as yourself. >> >> Thanks in advance for any guidance! >> >> BJ >> Kitfox IV 1050, Rotax 912 >> bjones@dmv.com >> 443-480-1023 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:55:56 PM PST US Subject: RotaxEngines-List: Re: repair vs new vs overhaul From: "Roger Lee" Hi BJ, I doubt that high temp issue caused this. The most likely cause is the pulsation from the exhaust causes the tubes to vibrate and move which wears down the metal. Some wear completely through. I would bet your engine is just fine and wouldn't think about a new one or rebuilding. I would however replace the exhaust. The joints should be lubed every couple hundred hours with copper anti seize. Also make sure any nuts, bolts and springs on the exhaust are tight and or up at torque. This will help eliminate the wear. -------- Roger Lee Tucson, Az. Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated Rotax Repair Center - Heavy Maint. 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