Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:22 AM - Re: Painting the RV Silver? (Dean Pichon)
2. 05:56 AM - Re: Painting the RV Silver? (Cy Galley)
3. 09:04 AM - Re: RV6 Parts Needed (kempthornes)
4. 11:10 AM - Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Dwpetrus@aol.com)
5. 11:50 AM - Re:SEM Color Coat (Jerry2DT@aol.com)
6. 12:22 PM - Honda engine news ay SnF? (Rob Lasater)
7. 12:58 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Alex Peterson)
8. 01:16 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Randy Lervold)
9. 02:13 PM - Re: Honda engine news ay SnF? (RV8ter@aol.com)
10. 02:31 PM - Re: Electric Bob (Randall Henderson)
11. 04:04 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Stein Bruch)
12. 04:55 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Cy Galley)
13. 05:06 PM - DIY VHF Antenna (Martin Hone)
14. 06:08 PM - Back to the list (Paul Besing)
15. 06:17 PM - Low and Slow (Donald Mei)
16. 06:34 PM - Re: Low and Slow (Joe Hine)
17. 06:37 PM - Re: Low and Slow, SNF return trip, etc. (Brian Denk)
18. 06:56 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Charlie & Tupper England)
19. 07:01 PM - Re: Low and Slow (Kevin Horton)
20. 07:10 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Jerry Springer)
21. 07:32 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Kyle Boatright)
22. 07:37 PM - Re: Low and Slow (Hal Rozema)
23. 07:43 PM - Re: Low and Slow (Paul Besing)
24. 08:38 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (RV6 Flyer)
25. 08:51 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Stein Bruch)
26. 09:39 PM - Re: SF Bay Area Airports (Scott Vanartsdalen)
27. 09:45 PM - Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight (Jerry Springer)
28. 10:12 PM - Type "A" (Wheeler North)
29. 10:51 PM - Re: Electric Bob (Art Glaser)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Painting the RV Silver? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dean Pichon" <DeanPichon@msn.com>
I painted my RV-4 in a metallic silver with clear coat. I used DuPont Imron.
My paint scheme is not a fighter motif, however, a builder in Nashua, NH did use
silver to obtain a P-51 motif. I've seen only pictures, but it looks great.
My paint job is only 18 months old, but so far, it's holding up well. If you
contact me off line, I will try to e-mail you a photo or two.
Good luck,
Dean
----- Original Message -----
From: dag adamson
Subject: RV-List: Painting the RV Silver?
--> RV-List message posted by: dag adamson <dag_adamson@yahoo.com>
Hello-
I was wondering if anyone out there has painted their
plane silver (rather than raw-aluminum) with a WWII
figher motif.
If anyone has some links of photos or has comments,
please forward.
Thanks
Dag
Rv-8A
FW Fwd / Plumbing...
...only 50% to go
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Painting the RV Silver? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
I believe both Lyle Hafel and Dave Wilson's RV-8s are military paint jobs
with silver paint.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley@qcbc.org or experimenter@eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "dag adamson" <dag_adamson@yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: Painting the RV Silver?
> --> RV-List message posted by: dag adamson <dag_adamson@yahoo.com>
>
> Hello-
>
> I was wondering if anyone out there has painted their
> plane silver (rather than raw-aluminum) with a WWII
> figher motif.
>
> If anyone has some links of photos or has comments,
> please forward.
>
> Thanks
> Dag
> Rv-8A
> FW Fwd / Plumbing...
> ...only 50% to go
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: RV6 Parts Needed |
--> RV-List message posted by: kempthornes <kempthornes@earthlink.net>
I have a pair of early type wheel pants. The slender slower more ground
clearance type.
Best offer.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
At 12:24 AM 4/6/2003 -0600, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
>Hi All,
>
>Looking to buy the following for an RV6 project:
>
>Cowling (New or old style).
>Engine Mount (0-320 Dyn/Con).
>Gear Legs, et.al (Wheels, etc..).
>CHEAP Mid/High Time 0-320 (160hp).
>CHEAP Prop for said engine.
>Wheel Pants.
>Gear Leg Fairings.
>Empennage Fairing (New or Old style).
>Any Other Misc. FwF or finish kit "stuff" for sale.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new XP-360
with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was sluggish
and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed to
be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our group
does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix (Precision)
fuel injection.
Thaniks,
Wayne Petrus
RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re:SEM Color Coat |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry2DT@aol.com
Randy...
Don't let this get out, but Bob Haan steered me toward Krylon in a rattle
can, available wholesale at Federal Distributing in Portland, 503 232 7108.
They can even provide custom colors in a rattler with 10 day delivery. It
goes on easy, and looks good... in my garage that is :)
Jerry Cochran
Wilsonville, OR
RV6a/fwf
<<From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: RV-List: SEM Color Coat
--> RV-List message posted by: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Listers,
I seem to recall at least a few guys mentioning that they'd used SEM
products in rattle cans to paint their interior. SEM Color Coat would be the
likely product from their line for this...
http://www.semproducts.com/sempages/semcolorcoat.html
This product was designed to color plastic surfaces, but I'm told also works
on hard surfaces. I'd like to know how it's holding up for those who may
have used it. The reason for my inquiry is that I'm re-finishing the
interior of my glider with it and am curious about it's durability,
especially on the hard metal parts.
TIA,
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 302 hrs
www.rv-8.com >>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Honda engine news ay SnF? |
--> RV-List message posted by: Rob Lasater <av8rrob@swbell.net>
As someone who is planning on starting my RV-8 project
in a few months, I was excited to hear that Honda will
finally jump into the aviation biz. Did anyone hear
any news at Sun n' Fun about their plans and can I
hope to use this engine in a few years?
Thanks
Av8rRob
Message 7
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| Subject: | Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson@usjet.net>
Does he have a fuel flow meter? Should indicate something like 16 gph
2700rpm, 28", full rich. Are you sure the flaps were fully up? I hear
that even with a couple inches of flaps, they act really sluggish (of
course, I wouldn't know this from experience...). Easiest way to check
the Lasar is to shut it down after startup and see if there is any
difference. Timing? Need to check that, and you'll need the special
Lasar timing rig.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 291 hours
www.rvforum.org MAY 31st, MARK YOUR CALENDARS!!
www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Dwpetrus@aol.com
> Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2003 1:07 PM
> To: RV-LIST@matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
>
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
>
> First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing.
> His new XP-360
> with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power.
> The vision
> guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the
> airplane was sluggish
> and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in
> flight (seemed to
> be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today
> and trying to
> narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be
> appreciated. Our group
> does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the
> Bendix (Precision)
> fuel injection.
>
> Thaniks,
> Wayne Petrus
> RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
>
>
> ==========
> Matronics Forums.
> ==========
> List members.
> ==========
> ==========
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Although it's probably something to do with the fuel injection the timing on
the LASAR should be checked/verified, and should have been anyway before the
first flight. Did the LASAR fault/backup light come on indicating a problem?
If not, and if the timing's correct, then check the injection: mixture,
proper flow from the injectors, etc. This still sounds strange because any
RV with one person should climb way faster than 500 fpm if you're getting
2700 rpm and 28 inches.
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 302 hrs
> First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new XP-360
> with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
> guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was
sluggish
> and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed
to
> be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
> narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our group
> does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix (Precision)
> fuel injection.
>
> Thaniks,
> Wayne Petrus
> RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Honda engine news ay SnF? |
--> RV-List message posted by: RV8ter@aol.com
no and I serously doubt it.
do not archive.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Bob |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Randall Henderson" <randallh@attbi.com>
Bob's phone number is 316-685-8617. Maybe you should try that before
slamming him on the list -- email isn't infallible....
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling@earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Electric Bob
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling@earthlink.net>
>
> Has anyone heard from electric Bob lately? I ordered some products from
him
> over a month ago and havent had a reply to any of my two messages in the
> last 30 days! Looks like he may have blown a fuse; and with my cash.
>
> Jeff Dowling
Message 11
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| Subject: | Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Hi Wayne,
Something is awry here. With 2700RPM and 28"MP, and only 500fpm climb,
something doesn't add up. The RPM/MP combination look pretty good, but like
Alex suggested, you should be burning somewhere around 14-16gph at full
bore.
It's hard to know where to start when the RPM and MP indications look good.
Next step is of course timing, fuel flow, etc..
Make sure whatever you do during the troubleshooting it is carefully
examined and whatever is done, Do NOT start replacing things haphazardly
because it "might make a difference". Troubleshoot only ONE system at a
time and then look at the results.
Sorry I can't be of more help, 1+1 just isn't equally 2 here.
Good Luck and keep us posted,
Stein Bruch
RV6, Minneapolis
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dwpetrus@aol.com
Subject: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
--> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new XP-360
with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was
sluggish
and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed to
be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our group
does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix (Precision)
fuel injection.
Thaniks,
Wayne Petrus
RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
Was the boost pump off?
----- Original Message -----
From: <Dwpetrus@aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
> --> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
>
> First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new XP-360
> with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
> guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was
sluggish
> and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed
to
> be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
> narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our group
> does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix (Precision)
> fuel injection.
>
> Thaniks,
> Wayne Petrus
> RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
>
>
Message 13
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Martin Hone" <martin.hone@tradergroup.com.au>
=09
G'Day Listers,
I am considering building my own antenna using Van's copper tape set in a streamlined
glassfibre strip and mounting on the RV belly. Anyone done something similar,
or can direct me to to info on DIY antenna construction ? I seem to recall
something, maybe by Jim Weir, on the subject but couldn't find it in the
archives.
Regards
Martin in Oz
Message 14
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| Subject: | Back to the list |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Besing" <azpilot@extremezone.com>
Hello everyone, I made it back to the RV-List and am residing in southern Alabama
at Fort Rucker. Any RV's in the area?
do not archive
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold
Waiting on RV-10
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
Message 15
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Donald Mei" <don_mei@hotmail.com>
Dear All,
I recently got back from Sun-N-Fun and had the absolute best time hanging
out watching the ultralights. I even had a couple of offers for rides but
couldn't haul my butt out of bed early enough to take anyone up on their
offer.
Well after watching all this fun, I noticed a really ugly little airplane at
the show. It wasn't in the ultralight area, but could fly as slowly as any
ultralight. It was really ugly. Purposeful but ugly. Kindof like an old
stake body pickup truck. You might even say it was beautiful from a form
follows function perspective.
Well anyway, this beast/beauty was the Zenith CH-701. Ugly or not its hard
to argue with a 24 know stall speed. I had visions of flying at 50 mph at
200 ft with the doors open. (hinged at the top like a cub) (kids running
outside waving, you know the scene)
And best of all its all Metal. It even looks good (purposeful) with that
training wheel out front.
Now my question is. Do any of you have any experience with the Zenith kits.
Have any of you dealt with the Zenith factory. Have you heard anything
about the CH-701?
Any and all input is appreciated.
No I am not selling my RV-4 to finance this.
The tail kit is only $1300, and by the time my wife figures out what she's
in for, it will be too late.
Amusing "what the hell do you want one of those for" replies are also
appreciated, but will not be heeded.
Thanks for all of your help.
Please send replies to my personal address in addition to the list.
don_mei@hotmail.com
Don Mei
RV-4
3B9 - Chester, CT
p.s. Did you all see the guy in the Stearman biplane at SnF. Nothing like
a tail slide with the engine out at 300 ft. Best act of the show.
Message 16
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Joe Hine" <joehine@rogers.com>
Hi Donald
Zenair,(the maker of the Zenith kits) has been around for many years here in
Canada, making very solid, well engineered airplane kits. There are many
flying around the world. In my opinion the one thing that binds all Chris
Heinz designs together is that they are all butt ugly.
Your are correct though they all function very well. I had a friend here
who build one of their kits, and flew it from the east coast of Canada to
British Columbia. He left here with 9 hours on the airplane. He was on a
ferry permit. Had no problems.
I think they have a web site, they also have a division, that I think
operates in the US, that makes a certified version of one of their aircraft.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Donald Mei
Subject: RV-List: Low and Slow
--> RV-List message posted by: "Donald Mei" <don_mei@hotmail.com>
Dear All,
I recently got back from Sun-N-Fun and had the absolute best time hanging
out watching the ultralights. I even had a couple of offers for rides but
couldn't haul my butt out of bed early enough to take anyone up on their
offer.
Well after watching all this fun, I noticed a really ugly little airplane at
the show. It wasn't in the ultralight area, but could fly as slowly as any
ultralight. It was really ugly. Purposeful but ugly. Kindof like an old
stake body pickup truck. You might even say it was beautiful from a form
follows function perspective.
Well anyway, this beast/beauty was the Zenith CH-701. Ugly or not its hard
to argue with a 24 know stall speed. I had visions of flying at 50 mph at
200 ft with the doors open. (hinged at the top like a cub) (kids running
outside waving, you know the scene)
And best of all its all Metal. It even looks good (purposeful) with that
training wheel out front.
Now my question is. Do any of you have any experience with the Zenith kits.
Have any of you dealt with the Zenith factory. Have you heard anything
about the CH-701?
Any and all input is appreciated.
No I am not selling my RV-4 to finance this.
The tail kit is only $1300, and by the time my wife figures out what she's
in for, it will be too late.
Amusing "what the hell do you want one of those for" replies are also
appreciated, but will not be heeded.
Thanks for all of your help.
Please send replies to my personal address in addition to the list.
don_mei@hotmail.com
Don Mei
RV-4
3B9 - Chester, CT
p.s. Did you all see the guy in the Stearman biplane at SnF. Nothing like
a tail slide with the engine out at 300 ft. Best act of the show.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Low and Slow, SNF return trip, etc. |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>Dear All,
>
>I recently got back from Sun-N-Fun and had the absolute best time hanging
>out watching the ultralights. I even had a couple of offers for rides but
>couldn't haul my butt out of bed early enough to take anyone up on their
>offer.
>
>Well after watching all this fun, I noticed a really ugly little airplane
>at
>the show. It wasn't in the ultralight area, but could fly as slowly as any
>ultralight. It was really ugly. Purposeful but ugly. Kindof like an old
>stake body pickup truck. You might even say it was beautiful from a form
>follows function perspective.
>
>Well anyway, this beast/beauty was the Zenith CH-701. Ugly or not its hard
>to argue with a 24 know stall speed. I had visions of flying at 50 mph at
>200 ft with the doors open. (hinged at the top like a cub) (kids running
>outside waving, you know the scene)
>
>And best of all its all Metal. It even looks good (purposeful) with that
>training wheel out front.
>
>Now my question is. Do any of you have any experience with the Zenith
>kits.
> Have any of you dealt with the Zenith factory. Have you heard anything
>about the CH-701?
>
>
>Any and all input is appreciated.
>No I am not selling my RV-4 to finance this.
>
>The tail kit is only $1300, and by the time my wife figures out what she's
>in for, it will be too late.
>
>Amusing "what the hell do you want one of those for" replies are also
>appreciated, but will not be heeded.
>
>Thanks for all of your help.
>
>Please send replies to my personal address in addition to the list.
>don_mei@hotmail.com
>
>Don Mei
>RV-4
>3B9 - Chester, CT
Don,
As much as I'd love to give ya a healthy ribbing for choosing such a goofy
looking bird, I have to admit it's one helluva performer. It just so
happens that I got to spend a couple of days with it's pilot from Zenair,
while both of us were stuck behind/under/inside that nasty wx that closed
off Florida after the show. I left Tampa International in my -8 on
Wednesday, but made it only as far a Cross City, Fla. I saw parked on the
ramp a few of the Ran's factory planes, and the Zenith you saw. All the
guys were in the same predicament as I: shut down due to really wicked
thunderstorms and low vis along our route of flight. We managed to find a
hotel and restaurant, and yakked about all things aviation through the
evening. Roger Dubbert is the Zenith guy, and is quite straight forward and
never came across as being overly liberal in stating the performance specs
of the airplane. The company seems to be sound, responsible, and in it for
the long haul. We all took off together the next day, with a leaden ceiling
overhead, but no showers were seen anywhere. I couldn't keep up (down?) with
the Zenith and a couple other ultralights, (just too slow) and grouped with
two of the Rans S-7C's, which are really neato planes. Randy Schlitter
(founder of the company) is a total nutso, and has been in the kit business
a long time. I really enjoyed my time spent with him and all of these folks
from "the other side" of the airplane kit industry. They love their
designs, and I (WE!) love the RV. Never once did any of the seven guys in
this group say a single thing bad about Van's. Impressive.
So, even though it's a goofy looking bird, I say that if it lights your
fire, then go for it!
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England <cengland@netdoor.com>
In addition to fuel flow confirmation, don't assume that the Vision
guage is correct or that the prop stops are set correctly.
That is working with the assumption that it's a constant speed prop.
If it's fixed pitch & you're turning 2700 on takeoff, there's your problem.
Charlie
Stein Bruch wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
>Hi Wayne,
>
>Something is awry here. With 2700RPM and 28"MP, and only 500fpm climb,
>something doesn't add up. The RPM/MP combination look pretty good, but like
>Alex suggested, you should be burning somewhere around 14-16gph at full
>bore.
>
>It's hard to know where to start when the RPM and MP indications look good.
>Next step is of course timing, fuel flow, etc..
>
>Make sure whatever you do during the troubleshooting it is carefully
>examined and whatever is done, Do NOT start replacing things haphazardly
>because it "might make a difference". Troubleshoot only ONE system at a
>time and then look at the results.
>
>Sorry I can't be of more help, 1+1 just isn't equally 2 here.
>
>Good Luck and keep us posted,
>
>Stein Bruch
>RV6, Minneapolis
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dwpetrus@aol.com
>To: RV-LIST@matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
>
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
>
>First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new XP-360
>with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
>guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was
>sluggish
>and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed to
>be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
>narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our group
>does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix (Precision)
>fuel injection.
>
>Thaniks,
>Wayne Petrus
>RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Low and Slow |
--> RV-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorto1537@rogers.com>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Donald Mei" <don_mei@hotmail.com>
>
>
>Dear All,
>
>I recently got back from Sun-N-Fun and had the absolute best time hanging
>out watching the ultralights. I even had a couple of offers for rides but
>couldn't haul my butt out of bed early enough to take anyone up on their
>offer.
>
>Well after watching all this fun, I noticed a really ugly little airplane at
>the show. It wasn't in the ultralight area, but could fly as slowly as any
>ultralight. It was really ugly. Purposeful but ugly. Kindof like an old
>stake body pickup truck. You might even say it was beautiful from a form
>follows function perspective.
>
>Well anyway, this beast/beauty was the Zenith CH-701. Ugly or not its hard
>to argue with a 24 know stall speed. I had visions of flying at 50 mph at
>200 ft with the doors open. (hinged at the top like a cub) (kids running
>outside waving, you know the scene)
>
Just one comment - don't get sucked in by any claim of a 24 kt stall
speed. It is simply not credible, as it implies an unreasonably high
lift coefficient, or a very, very light weight.
The CH-701 has a gross weight of 1100 lb, and a wing area of 122 sq
ft (numbers from Zenair's web site). 24 kt CAS would require a
maximum lift coefficient (CLmax) of 4.6. Just for reference, Van's
claimed stall speed for the RV-8 translates to a CLmax of 1.9, which
is quite believable. Sure, the CH-701 has a fixed slot on the
leading edge, and a different flap system, but any claims of a CLmax
over 3.2 are very difficult to believe, and I think a CLmax of 3.0 is
more likely. These values are for idle power. CLmax will be a bit
higher with power on.
24 KIAS I could believe. 24 KCAS no chance. There is often a large
error in the indicated airspeeds near the stall. Let me mess with
the pitot tube and static ports and I can make your RV stall at 24
KIAS or lower too, but of course you would know that the calibrated
airspeed at the stall hadn't changed one bit.
I still agree that the CH-701 is a tremendously capable STOL
aircraft, with a stall speed much lower than our RVs. But, man are
they ever ugly.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv@earthlink.net>
Charlie & Tupper England wrote:
>
> If it's fixed pitch & you're turning 2700 on takeoff, there's your problem.
>
> Charlie
>
Explain please!!!
Jerry
do not archive
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright@adelphia.net>
Like others have posted, 2700 rpm and 28" of MP should deliver excellent
performance. Has the owner checked the tach? How about the accuracy of the
MP gauge? 28" *could* indicate that there is a big leak in the plumbing for
your gauge.
On the other end of the scale, has anyone verified that the ASI, VSI, and
altimeter are working properly? Could a bad pitot/static system be leading
your friend to *think* the airplane is performing poorly, when it isn't?
Also, what type of prop is installed? Constant Speed? Fixed pitch metal,
pitched correctly for the RV? Wooden prop carved with an axe? I assume it
would be possible to get a bad enough wood prop that the airplane's
performance would be awful.
Regarding the leaning. Is it possible that the fuel injection system is
improperly set? Did someone knowingly fly an airplane that wasn't *quite
right* for a first flight? Be very careful there. We lost a lister last
year (to unknown causes, as far as I know) in an airplane with several known
problems which, unfortunately, he will never have the chance to correct.
KB
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charlie & Tupper England" <cengland@netdoor.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
> --> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England
<cengland@netdoor.com>
>
> In addition to fuel flow confirmation, don't assume that the Vision
> guage is correct or that the prop stops are set correctly.
> That is working with the assumption that it's a constant speed prop.
>
> If it's fixed pitch & you're turning 2700 on takeoff, there's your
problem.
>
> Charlie
>
> Stein Bruch wrote:
>
> >--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
> >
> >Hi Wayne,
> >
> >Something is awry here. With 2700RPM and 28"MP, and only 500fpm climb,
> >something doesn't add up. The RPM/MP combination look pretty good, but
like
> >Alex suggested, you should be burning somewhere around 14-16gph at full
> >bore.
> >
> >It's hard to know where to start when the RPM and MP indications look
good.
> >Next step is of course timing, fuel flow, etc..
> >
> >Make sure whatever you do during the troubleshooting it is carefully
> >examined and whatever is done, Do NOT start replacing things haphazardly
> >because it "might make a difference". Troubleshoot only ONE system at a
> >time and then look at the results.
> >
> >Sorry I can't be of more help, 1+1 just isn't equally 2 here.
> >
> >Good Luck and keep us posted,
> >
> >Stein Bruch
> >RV6, Minneapolis
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> >[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dwpetrus@aol.com
> >To: RV-LIST@matronics.com
> >Subject: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
> >
> >
> >--> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
> >
> >First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new
XP-360
> >with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
> >guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was
> >sluggish
> >and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed
to
> >be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
> >narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our
group
> >does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix
(Precision)
> >fuel injection.
> >
> >Thaniks,
> >Wayne Petrus
> >RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
> >
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Low and Slow |
--> RV-List message posted by: Hal Rozema <hartist1@cox.net>
I'm nearly ready for the engines installation in my Zenith CH 701 and you're
right. Correctly stated per the Air Force definition it should be noted as a
VSTOL. Take-off before the engine gets to max revs... in less than 100 feet (no
wind) clear 50 feet in 250 to 300 feet. better than most ultralites. Putting
a
Jabiru 3300 engine in mine for high density altitude in AZ summers. I'm keeping
accurate construction time including about half of the "What comes next" thought
time. Zenith plans and chronological photo construction directions are
excellent. I have 485 hours in it thus far. Building in a downtown Phoenix
condo with my wife's understanding, help, and blessing. Write me off list at
hal@theplanefolks.net for more info. The design was introduced in the 80's and
my serial number (now a year old) is 4718. It's a bush plane and used all over
the world. Several factories in foreign countries are producing it and many are
copying it off license.
See http://ZENITHAIR.com/stolch701/index1.html
Hal and jackie
theplanefolks.net, INC.
Donald Mei wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Donald Mei" <don_mei@hotmail.com>
>
> Dear All,
>
> I recently got back from Sun-N-Fun and had the absolute best time hanging
> out watching the ultralights. I even had a couple of offers for rides but
> couldn't haul my butt out of bed early enough to take anyone up on their
> offer.
>
> Well after watching all this fun, I noticed a really ugly little airplane at
> the show. It wasn't in the ultralight area, but could fly as slowly as any
> ultralight. It was really ugly. Purposeful but ugly. Kindof like an old
> stake body pickup truck. You might even say it was beautiful from a form
> follows function perspective.
>
> Well anyway, this beast/beauty was the Zenith CH-701. Ugly or not its hard
> to argue with a 24 know stall speed. I had visions of flying at 50 mph at
> 200 ft with the doors open. (hinged at the top like a cub) (kids running
> outside waving, you know the scene)
>
> And best of all its all Metal. It even looks good (purposeful) with that
> training wheel out front.
>
> Now my question is. Do any of you have any experience with the Zenith kits.
> Have any of you dealt with the Zenith factory. Have you heard anything
> about the CH-701?
>
> Any and all input is appreciated.
> No I am not selling my RV-4 to finance this.
>
> The tail kit is only $1300, and by the time my wife figures out what she's
> in for, it will be too late.
>
> Amusing "what the hell do you want one of those for" replies are also
> appreciated, but will not be heeded.
>
> Thanks for all of your help.
>
> Please send replies to my personal address in addition to the list.
> don_mei@hotmail.com
>
> Don Mei
> RV-4
> 3B9 - Chester, CT
>
> p.s. Did you all see the guy in the Stearman biplane at SnF. Nothing like
> a tail slide with the engine out at 300 ft. Best act of the show.
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Low and Slow |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Besing" <azpilot@extremezone.com>
I started to build a CH601HDS before I got wise and built the RV. I thought
the plans and manual were substandard of the rest that I have seen, even
Van's. I know many don't like Van's drawings and manuals, but they are some
of the best in the industry. Chris's plans for the rudder kit had little
hand written notes that were barely legible. The quality of the rudder kit
was acceptable. Nothing to write home about, it's only some ribs, spar, and
skin. After I finished the rudder, I found many tales about how the 601
performance figures were grossly inflated. After doing some digging around,
I realized it wasn't all that much of an airplane, and found that there were
far more RV's being built in my area.
Can't speak much for the 701. I know it's slow and most are happy with it.
My personal experience with Zenith was not very favorable, so the RV was a
slam dunk. It is not really the same type of comparison, obviously, but as
far as a kit aircraft company is concerned, there wasn't any competition to
Van's. Stable, yes, they have been around, and should be for a long time,
so there is a plus there. You might want to get the opinions of some real
Zenith builders on the Zenith-List. I know there are some builders lurking
around there.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold
Waiting on RV-10
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Donald Mei" <don_mei@hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Low and Slow
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Donald Mei" <don_mei@hotmail.com>
>
>
> Dear All,
>
> I recently got back from Sun-N-Fun and had the absolute best time hanging
> out watching the ultralights. I even had a couple of offers for rides but
> couldn't haul my butt out of bed early enough to take anyone up on their
> offer.
>
> Well after watching all this fun, I noticed a really ugly little airplane
at
> the show. It wasn't in the ultralight area, but could fly as slowly as
any
> ultralight. It was really ugly. Purposeful but ugly. Kindof like an old
> stake body pickup truck. You might even say it was beautiful from a form
> follows function perspective.
>
> Well anyway, this beast/beauty was the Zenith CH-701. Ugly or not its
hard
> to argue with a 24 know stall speed. I had visions of flying at 50 mph at
> 200 ft with the doors open. (hinged at the top like a cub) (kids running
> outside waving, you know the scene)
>
> And best of all its all Metal. It even looks good (purposeful) with that
> training wheel out front.
>
> Now my question is. Do any of you have any experience with the Zenith
kits.
> Have any of you dealt with the Zenith factory. Have you heard anything
> about the CH-701?
>
>
> Any and all input is appreciated.
> No I am not selling my RV-4 to finance this.
>
> The tail kit is only $1300, and by the time my wife figures out what she's
> in for, it will be too late.
>
> Amusing "what the hell do you want one of those for" replies are also
> appreciated, but will not be heeded.
>
> Thanks for all of your help.
>
> Please send replies to my personal address in addition to the list.
> don_mei@hotmail.com
>
> Don Mei
> RV-4
> 3B9 - Chester, CT
>
>
> p.s. Did you all see the guy in the Stearman biplane at SnF. Nothing
like
> a tail slide with the engine out at 300 ft. Best act of the show.
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer@hotmail.com>
Had a 180 HP Injected RV-6 on the field where I am based with a bad fuel
pump. We would depart the area and his 180 could not keep up with my 160
(or any of the 180s that I fly with). This went on for over a year. He
took off one day without the boost pump on and lost power. Was able to keep
it flying and landed safely. His mechanical fuel pump was not putting out
enough fuel.
If the gauges are accurate, 28" and 2700 RPM, then the only other thing
necessary is FUEL.
Was a fuel flow test done before test flying? What was fuel pressure with
the poor performance? Was a full power run-up done on the ground before
first flight? You need to tie the tail down as the RV is not heavy enough
with a constant speed prop to keep from skidding the tires.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,262 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
Message 25
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| Subject: | Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
If it's a FP and you're turning 2700 on takeoff the thing should climb like
the proverbial "homesick angel"!
Do Not Archive
Stein.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charlie & Tupper
England
Subject: Re: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first
flight
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England
<cengland@netdoor.com>
In addition to fuel flow confirmation, don't assume that the Vision
guage is correct or that the prop stops are set correctly.
That is working with the assumption that it's a constant speed prop.
If it's fixed pitch & you're turning 2700 on takeoff, there's your problem.
Charlie
Stein Bruch wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
>Hi Wayne,
>
>Something is awry here. With 2700RPM and 28"MP, and only 500fpm climb,
>something doesn't add up. The RPM/MP combination look pretty good, but
like
>Alex suggested, you should be burning somewhere around 14-16gph at full
>bore.
>
>It's hard to know where to start when the RPM and MP indications look good.
>Next step is of course timing, fuel flow, etc..
>
>Make sure whatever you do during the troubleshooting it is carefully
>examined and whatever is done, Do NOT start replacing things haphazardly
>because it "might make a difference". Troubleshoot only ONE system at a
>time and then look at the results.
>
>Sorry I can't be of more help, 1+1 just isn't equally 2 here.
>
>Good Luck and keep us posted,
>
>Stein Bruch
>RV6, Minneapolis
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dwpetrus@aol.com
>To: RV-LIST@matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
>
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
>
>First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new XP-360
>with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
>guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was
>sluggish
>and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed
to
>be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
>narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our group
>does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix (Precision)
>fuel injection.
>
>Thaniks,
>Wayne Petrus
>RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: SF Bay Area Airports |
--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Vanartsdalen <svanarts@yahoo.com>
Good point. Fremont is really a sprawling town. The gentleman planning his flight
would be best served if he knew it was northern or southern Fremont. If
it's northern, head to Hayward. If it's Southern, RHV is your best bet!
Terry Williams <7ecapilot@attbi.com> wrote:--> RV-List message posted by: Terry
Williams <7ecapilot@attbi.com>
It was last year. I lived in the Mission San Jose area of Fremont and
I-680 was pretty convenient. For me to get to HWD I would have to drive
pretty much through all of Fremont to get to I-880. So, I could jump on
680 and go straight to RHV. Besides, at the time, my office was in
Campbell. So, RHV was on the way in the both directions. Bug out early
and go do a few landings. :) Put a smile on my face before I had to
deal with screaming kids and dog tired wife, or in the morning before a
tough day at work.
Anyway, to me, it seemed like a wash. Though, I do think that you are
pretty much right. Hayward is probably a bit closer, but I could get to
Reid in about 35 to 40 mins. and rental buckets were a little cheaper.
Heading over to Livermore at that time would've been about the same, I
think.
tw
On Monday, April 7, 2003, at 07:31 AM, Van Artsdalen, Scott wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Van Artsdalen, Scott"
>
>
> How long ago was that?? That would depend on what part of Fremont.
> The
> Niles district where I lived was only 15 min drive to Hayward. Now if
> you
> lived down on the border of Milpitas or maybe the Irvington district it
> *might* be quicker but I doubt it being as RHV is in southish San Jose.
> Traffic patterns change almost by the month in the Bay Area.
>
> *Actually* PAO might be quicker than either one.
> --
> Scott VanArtsdalen
> Network Manager
> Union Safe Deposit Bank
> 209-946-5116
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Terry Williams [mailto:7ecapilot@attbi.com]
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: SF Bay Area Airports
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Terry Williams <7ecapilot@attbi.com>
>
> O.K. I have to weigh in on this a bit.
>
> I used to live in Fremont and flew out of Reid-Hillview. I seem to
> recall that takes just about as long to drive from Fremont to Hayward
> as it did to get to RHV. So, I don't necessarily buy that Hayward is
> easier or faster to get to. RHV is well outside of the SF Class B and
> just outside of the SJC Class C. HWD is under both the SF Class B and
> the OAK Class C. If your xpndr is wacked you can't get in to HWD. LVK
> is east of Fremont about a 20 mins by car. It has quite a bit of
> transient space and is very close to the freeway (I-580). It has an ILS
> and all amenities, including rental cars. LVK is well outside of SF
> Class C airspace. There is a BART station in Dublin, which is about 3
> miles west on the freeway.
>
> All in all, using Bay Approach is no problem for any of the SFBA
> airports (OAK Center for LVK flight following), but why bother if you
> just need a convenient airport. Livermore isn't really any further away
> and I think it costs a little less (don't know what fees there might
> be). I think that LVK is just as convenient and any others in the SFBA.
> Maybe even a little more friendly. ;) Besides, everything in the SFBA
> is 45 minutes away by car. :
> o
>
> BTW... I live in Livermore now and my house is about 3/4 of mile from
> the approach end of 25R. Rock your wings on final and I'll wave back.
> Please, just keep your RPMs low for the sensitive ears of those who
> don't appreciate our passion.
>
> tw
>
>
> On Sunday, March 30, 2003, at 01:12 PM, JusCash@aol.com wrote:
>
>> --> RV-List message posted by: JusCash@aol.com
>>
>> Hayward would be a better choice for Fremont. Second choice is Reid
>> Hillview
>> in San Jose. Hayward has several procedures for IFR arrivals and
>> departures.
>> I am located in Hanger J1 in the West Tee's. Drop by and say hello.
>>
>> Cash Copeland
>> RV6 N46FC
>> Hayward, Ca
>>
>>> Time: 08:36:40 PM PST US
>>> From: "Michael J. Robbins"
>>> Subject: RV-List: SF Bay Area Airports
>>>
>>> --> RV-List message posted by: "Michael J. Robbins" <
>>> michael.j.robbins@verizon.net>
>>>
>>> To those of you in the bay area, I'm planning on visiting a friend in
>>> Fremont and it looks like San Jose Muni is the closest airport. Is
>>> it
>>> friendly to us little guys? Last time I flew out of SJC was in 1969.
>>> I
>>> know things have changed a lot. I have the option of filing IFR if
>>> necessary. I'm planning on arriving next Saturday or Sunday.
>>>
>>> Mike Robbins
>>> RV-8 N88MJ 185 hours
>>> Seattle area
>>>
>>> do not archive
>>>
>>
>>
>> _-
>> ======================================================================
>> _-
>> ======================================================================
>> _-
>> ======================================================================
>> _-
>> ======================================================================
>>
>>
>
>
> _-
> ======================================================================
> _-
> ======================================================================
> _-
> ======================================================================
> _-
> ======================================================================
>
>
--
For God says, "At just the right time, I heard you. On the day of salvation, I
helped you." Indeed, God is ready to help you right now. Today is the day of
salvation.
2 Corinthians 6:2, New Living Translation
---------------------------------
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv@earthlink.net>
Stein, that was my point when I asked Charles to explain. Even a CS at
28 and 2700 should make it really climb.
Jerry
do not archive
-----------------------------------------------------
Stein Bruch wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> If it's a FP and you're turning 2700 on takeoff the thing should climb like
> the proverbial "homesick angel"!
>
> Do Not Archive
>
> Stein.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charlie & Tupper
> England
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first
> flight
>
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England
> <cengland@netdoor.com>
>
> In addition to fuel flow confirmation, don't assume that the Vision
> guage is correct or that the prop stops are set correctly.
> That is working with the assumption that it's a constant speed prop.
>
> If it's fixed pitch & you're turning 2700 on takeoff, there's your problem.
>
> Charlie
>
> Stein Bruch wrote:
>
>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>>
>>Hi Wayne,
>>
>>Something is awry here. With 2700RPM and 28"MP, and only 500fpm climb,
>>something doesn't add up. The RPM/MP combination look pretty good, but
>
> like
>
>>Alex suggested, you should be burning somewhere around 14-16gph at full
>>bore.
>>
>>It's hard to know where to start when the RPM and MP indications look good.
>>Next step is of course timing, fuel flow, etc..
>>
>>Make sure whatever you do during the troubleshooting it is carefully
>>examined and whatever is done, Do NOT start replacing things haphazardly
>>because it "might make a difference". Troubleshoot only ONE system at a
>>time and then look at the results.
>>
>>Sorry I can't be of more help, 1+1 just isn't equally 2 here.
>>
>>Good Luck and keep us posted,
>>
>>Stein Bruch
>>RV6, Minneapolis
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
>>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dwpetrus@aol.com
>>To: RV-LIST@matronics.com
>>Subject: RV-List: Lasar and/or fuel injection problems on first flight
>>
>>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: Dwpetrus@aol.com
>>
>>First flight of a friends RV7A was a little disappointing. His new XP-360
>>with fuel injection and Lasar would not develop full power. The vision
>>guages indicated 2700 rpm with 28 in man press. but the airplane was
>>sluggish
>>and climbed at only 500 fpm and required leaning to run in flight (seemed
>
> to
>
>>be flooding out). We plan to start trouble shooting today and trying to
>>narrow down the problem. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Our group
>>does not have any experience with the Lasar sys. or the Bendix (Precision)
>>fuel injection.
>>
>>Thaniks,
>>Wayne Petrus
>>RV8A flying (carberated/standard mags)
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 28
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--> RV-List message posted by: Wheeler North <wnorth@sdccd.cc.ca.us>
Harry,
its been a long time since I looked that one up, but it was either in the MS
standards or it was in the older AN standards, of which we have some at the
college. I also went down to the San Diego Aerospace museum a few years ago
to look some stuff up, and may have seen it then.
The gist is that the older type A fittings were soldered on joints and the
newer type B just needed to be flared to 37 degrees. I would expect that
this comes out of the SAE standards like so much else in airmotive does, but
I haven't researched this that far.
do not archive
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Bob |
--> RV-List message posted by: Art Glaser <airplane@megsinet.net>
I also think you will find him to be completely above board. Speak with him.
Art Glaser
Randall Henderson wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Randall Henderson" <randallh@attbi.com>
>
> Bob's phone number is 316-685-8617. Maybe you should try that before
> slamming him on the list -- email isn't infallible....
>
> do not archive
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling@earthlink.net>
> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RV-List: Electric Bob
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling@earthlink.net>
> >
> > Has anyone heard from electric Bob lately? I ordered some products from
> him
> > over a month ago and havent had a reply to any of my two messages in the
> > last 30 days! Looks like he may have blown a fuse; and with my cash.
> >
> > Jeff Dowling
>
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