---------------------------------------------------------- RV-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 05/15/03: 41 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:52 AM - Re: More RV-10 PIX (lmrowles) 2. 01:52 AM - Re: More RV-10 PIX (lmrowles) 3. 02:06 AM - Re: Twelfth Annual Homewing RV Fly-In (Randall Henderson) 4. 04:18 AM - Re: More RV-10 PIX (Ken Balch) 5. 05:07 AM - Re: RV10: Oh my God!!!! (graham jones) 6. 06:42 AM - Coffee (Wheeler North) 7. 07:25 AM - Re: O-320 B3B (P M Condon) 8. 07:26 AM - Re: RV10: Oh my God!!!! (C. Rabaut) 9. 09:03 AM - Re: Re: Electroluminescent Lighting (Wayne R. Couture) 10. 09:38 AM - Eyeball Swivel Vent (Wallace Enga) 11. 09:51 AM - Arms (Bill VonDane) 12. 10:08 AM - Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent (Ross Schlotthauer) 13. 10:13 AM - smallest eyeball vents? (Dan Checkoway) 14. 10:17 AM - RV Building Question (HCRV6@aol.com) 15. 10:22 AM - waxing the airframe: handling effects (SportAV8R@aol.com) 16. 10:24 AM - Re: Arms (SportAV8R@aol.com) 17. 10:28 AM - Re: smallest eyeball vents? (SportAV8R@aol.com) 18. 10:33 AM - Re: Electroluminescent Lighting (pauls@kc.rr.com) 19. 10:34 AM - Re: More RV-10 PIX (Garry LeGare) 20. 10:39 AM - Re: RV Building Question (Brian Denk) 21. 10:55 AM - Re: waxing the airframe: handling effects (Scott Bilinski) 22. 11:28 AM - Re: waxing the airframe: handling effects (Rob Miller) 23. 11:46 AM - Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent (Wallace Enga) 24. 12:04 PM - Re: smallest eyeball vents? (Keith Vasey) 25. 01:23 PM - Re: Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent () 26. 02:49 PM - Re: More RV-10 PIX (Bob Newman) 27. 03:01 PM - Re: More RV-10 PIX (Boyd C. Braem) 28. 03:10 PM - Re: Re: RV List Dimple Sizes (Bob Newman) 29. 03:22 PM - Re: Re: RV List Dimple Sizes (DWENSING@aol.com) 30. 03:46 PM - Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent (Dave Bristol) 31. 04:10 PM - Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent (Dave Bristol) 32. 05:55 PM - alternator installation (Amit Dagan) 33. 06:08 PM - Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent (Tom & Cathy Ervin) 34. 07:11 PM - Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent (N223RV@aol.com) 35. 07:11 PM - Re: O-320 B3B (Eustace Bowhay) 36. 07:41 PM - Re: alternator installation (Tom Webster) 37. 07:53 PM - Re: Eyeball Swivel Vent (Al Mojzisik) 38. 08:51 PM - Re: Dimple die sizes (Karie Daniel) 39. 09:13 PM - Outstanding IFR RV-6A for sale (Doug Weiler) 40. 09:53 PM - Re: waxing the airframe: handling effects (Jeff Bertsch) 41. 10:41 PM - Alligator Pneumatic Squeezer () ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:52:26 AM PST US From: lmrowles Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX --> RV-List message posted by: lmrowles At 05:48 PM 14/05/2003 -0500, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Jeff Orear" > > > Sorry, but I think the RV-3 still has the best >> lines in the fleet and this airplane will not change that. >> >> Tailwinds, >> Doug Rozendaal >> RV-4 >> >> That oughtta throw some gas on the fire ;-) >> >> >> _- > >That's only because you haven't seen my RV6A Doug........... > >That does it....no beer for you at OSH! How you gonna get him to sleep Jeff? ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:52:28 AM PST US From: lmrowles Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX --> RV-List message posted by: lmrowles At 05:48 PM 14/05/2003 -0500, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Jeff Orear" > > > Sorry, but I think the RV-3 still has the best >> lines in the fleet and this airplane will not change that. What would a b25 driver know any way??? ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:06:52 AM PST US From: "Randall Henderson" Subject: Re: RV-List: Twelfth Annual Homewing RV Fly-In --> RV-List message posted by: "Randall Henderson" Wups! I go to 56S so often I must have it's ID on the brain -- I meant SPB... hopefully there won't be a flock of RVs at the wrong airport, saying "Well I put it into my GPS and this is where I ended up...!" > Mark your calendars! The Twelfth Annual Home Wing RV Fly-In is coming up, > Saturday June 14 at Scappoose, OR Airport (56S). Check out the web page > www.vanshomewing.org for all the details (including a sneak preview of this > year's T-shirt art.) See you there! ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:18:43 AM PST US From: Ken Balch Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX --> RV-List message posted by: Ken Balch Just to throw some more fuel on the fire: I really like the full bubble canopy look and I wouldn't trade it (or my slider) for that butt ugly 'fastback' mod. What a horrible thing to do to a beautiful airplane... Ken Balch RV-8 N118KB Dr. Leathers wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Dr. Leathers" > >If we are going to talk about beautiful lines, go see what is soon to be available to RV-8 builders at www.showplanes.com Personally, I can't wait to see what these mods do for speed!! Combine this fastback mod with the Super-8 stuff we are seeing now, and WOW!!!! Pre-punched kit, improved lines and Rocket Power!! Am I right?? > >Doc > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "John Starn" >To: ; >Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX > > > > >>--> RV-List message posted by: "John Starn" >> >>Using that logic where does the HR2 or F-1 fit in. KABONG Do Not Archive >> >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Doug Rozendaal" >>To: >>Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX >> >> >> >> >>>then alpha, of course ;-) ) Sorry, but I think the RV-3 still has the >>> >>> >>best >> >> >>>lines in the fleet >>> >>> ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:07:52 AM PST US From: graham jones Subject: Re: RV-List: RV10: Oh my God!!!! --> RV-List message posted by: graham jones Alas! There is a solution..... Make it in alloy.... What's an English wheel for anyway ?? The people with the metal work skills like shot bagging and wheel rolling are dying out...... We need something like this to keep their skills and abilities alive..... There have only been two pieces of metal work that have bought a lump into my throat. The first was a replacement one piece front end skin for a Dino Ferrari like race car a fellow built out here in OZ and the other was the nose bowl and engine cowl of a tiger moth a friend restored. When I looked into it they were done totally independantly and years apart, by a father (the car) and son (Tiger).... Both were wheel formed, gas welded and shot bagged finish jobs and you couldn't tell where the seams were and they weren't fully polished when I saw them..... So you don't have to have a F$%#& glass top on your 10..... just be creative..... Jonesy in OZ ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: RV-List: RV10: Oh my God!!!! > --> RV-List message posted by: > > It's true, I know the truth, and have seen the light. But what are you glass blasphemies going to do? Oh my God, the whole top half of the 10 is, DO I DARE SAY IT???? > > Fiberglass!!!!! > > Can't wait to see it in person. Glass is nice!!! > > Darwin N. Barrie > Chandler AZ > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:42:39 AM PST US From: Wheeler North Subject: RV-List: Coffee --> RV-List message posted by: Wheeler North Well, Since I started this, I must admit that I had no intent of driving aluminum rivets in Leadville, given the probability of cross contamination during the low density cold working process thereby creating a whole new alloy. Now that I know they can't make good coffee, this is particularly poignant given that the boiling temparature of this new alloy will be undetermanent due to the fact that I will be nodding from a lack of oxygen, and more importantly, a lack of hi test caffine. One would think that since Starbucks owns the universe of coffee shops that they should now have the political leverage to have the laws of physics changed. Go figure... do not archive ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:25:11 AM PST US From: P M Condon Subject: RE: RV-List: O-320 B3B --> RV-List message posted by: P M Condon And the carb attach point on the bottom of the sump is shifted from the center line a wee bit. Can't recall how much in inches, but its minor. I do recall that it isn't dead-nuts on the center line like the -D1A is. I had to sand a radies on the FAB air box bottom to clear the bottom cowl. All-in-all no problem. BESURE to contact Vetterman to see if his exhaust will clear the intake risers.(I think it will) ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:26:14 AM PST US From: "C. Rabaut" Subject: Re: RV-List: RV10: Oh my God!!!! --> RV-List message posted by: "C. Rabaut" Forget the Glass... look at those tiny ailerons and those HUGE flaps. The roll rate has got to be about 15 degrees a minute. do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Jerry Springer Subject: Re: RV-List: RV10: Oh my God!!!! > --> RV-List message posted by: Jerry Springer > > Well not the whole top half, just the cabin area. > > do not archive > Jerry > > ktlkrn@cox.net wrote: > > --> RV-List message posted by: > > > > It's true, I know the truth, and have seen the light. But what are you glass blasphemies going to do? Oh my God, the whole top half of the 10 is, DO I DARE SAY IT???? > > > > Fiberglass!!!!! > > > > Can't wait to see it in person. Glass is nice!!! > > > > Darwin N. Barrie > > Chandler AZ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:03:08 AM PST US From: "Wayne R. Couture" Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Electroluminescent Lighting --> RV-List message posted by: "Wayne R. Couture" Paul, Some questions. What color did you use? Did you use the strips or the wire? Do you have any other type of lighting for your flight gages? Do the gages reflect the light so you can see them clearly at night? How long a strip did you use? Where did you mount it? Thanx Wayne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Stratman" Subject: RV-List: Re: Electroluminescent Lighting > --> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Stratman" > > I have EL lighting strip across the under side of my glare shield. LOVE it. > > Got it at beingseen.com , called the guy, great to work with. A little slow > in shipping > from what I remember, but the stuff is fantastic at lighting the panel in my > 6A > > > Paul > RV-6A N21PS > "Taylor Maid" > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:38:41 AM PST US From: Wallace Enga Subject: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga I didn't like Van's plastic air vents so ordered the eyeball swivel vents from Aircraft Spruce. However these vents have a nozzle outlet of only about 7/8" diam compared to 1.5 " diam for Vans or about 40% of the outlet area. Anyone tried using these --- will they provide sufficient air on a warm day? Wally Enga RV7 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:51:07 AM PST US From: "Bill VonDane" "vansairforce" Subject: RV-List: Arms --> RV-List message posted by: "Bill VonDane" Anyone done up a weight and balance spreadsheet that includes the ARM for adding weight in the tail? Does anyone have the arms for the tail area of an RV-8? Thanks! -Bill VonDane RV-8A www.vondane.com do not archive ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:08:06 AM PST US From: Ross Schlotthauer Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: Ross Schlotthauer Wally, I am in the same boat. What did you give for them? -Ross Schlotthauer RV-7 Fuse, Picking up the finish kit today --- Wallace Enga wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga > > > > I didn't like Van's plastic air vents so ordered the > eyeball swivel vents from Aircraft Spruce. > > However these vents have a nozzle outlet of only > about 7/8" diam compared to 1.5 " diam for Vans > or about 40% of the outlet area. > > Anyone tried using these --- will they provide > sufficient > air on a warm day? > > Wally Enga > RV7 > > > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > latest messages. > List members. > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm > Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv-list > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > __________________________________ http://search.yahoo.com ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:13:52 AM PST US From: "Dan Checkoway" Subject: RV-List: smallest eyeball vents? --> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" I'm looking for the smallest possible eyeball vents that are still functional. Really it's the mounting flange that I want to be as small as possible. I think it's one of the Lancair vents that I saw which has no flange, just a retaining nut? I'd love to find something that's in the 1.5" to 2" size range. Any ideas? Thanks in advance, )_( Dan RV-7 N714D http://www.rvproject.com ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:17:43 AM PST US From: HCRV6@aol.com Subject: RV-List: RV Building Question --> RV-List message posted by: HCRV6@aol.com Can anyone out there tell me what the correct torque is for the "O" ring fuel pump fittings on my O-360. I checked the Lyc O'haul manual but don't see it in there. Harry Crosby Pleasanton, California RV-6, firewall forward ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:22:31 AM PST US From: SportAV8R@aol.com Subject: RV-List: waxing the airframe: handling effects --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com This post contains a lot of subjective speculations, and may prove frustrating. Delete now if you simply must have "data" to deal with a question posed to the list :-) After yesterday, I find myself wondering if anyone else has noticed a fairly striking difference in their RV's handling characteristics after buffing their paint job and waxing the airframe and propeller for the first time... Figuring 5 years was long enough to wait, I decided to buy an electric buffer and some compound and finally get around to rubbing out my basecoat/clearcoat paint job. Alright, I admit it, I had done some recent repainting on a few of the fiberglass parts and they looked crappy enough that I wanted to try anything that might inprove the finish. My body shop friend told me that I could buff without fear of damage on a paint job as old as mine, as it should have cured hard as glass by now. Boy, was he right. Most of the pebbly areas and nibs in the clearcoat are there to stay unless I go back to wet sanding with 1200 or similar. Still, the compound did seem to restore the luster, and the surface smoothness was improved somoewhat by my efforts. The Meguiar's liquid wax really made the paint glow. Now I have to be careful leaning against the plane that I don't slide off and lose my balance! Having done the prop, spinner, cowl, upper surfaces of both wings, and the upper surfaces of the horizontal stab and elevators plus the entire vertical stab and rudder, I decided to get in a quick flight before dark. It was a dead calm evening. The tanks held only about 5 gallons each, enough for a ten minute mission. The runway had just been mowed. A billion bugs were loitering around, waiting to leave their dying impression on my shiny airframe and canopy. Under such conditions, there is only one thing to do... After a normal taxi and run-up, I advanced the throttle. The ground run was normal. Clinb-out felt really flat, like I wasn't seeing all the power I was accustomed to. ROC was a bit below normal, but then I noticed the airspeed was higher than usual - already 120mph. Trim was set where it always was, but this...? As I pulled skyward, weighing my options should the engine falter, I noticed a "thrumming" vibration in the joystick that felt unfamiliar. I started to envision a rag streaming from the elevator, left behind by a fool pilot with a wax job on his mind. I circled the field at 1000 msl and reduced power. The engine was running strong but sounded different - check the LightSpeeds: yep, they're powered up and batteries are in the green; the ANC is functional. What's the deal? Is it "automatic rough," knowing I only have 10 gallons aboard and approaching darkness? Nah. Let's pour the coal on and see what she does straight and level. Way before I expected it, the GRT engine monitor master alarm light is on for a propeller overspeed condition, and I'm seeing 180 mph IAS and, at least momentarily, about 250 fpm climb. Normally, when I get a prop redline light, the tach will show 2610, where the light is set to come on, and there is no need to hurry with power reduction or pitch up unless I'm in a shallow dive. This time the tach said 2640...2650... yikes! - don't like to experiment with 10th order vibrations when Ed Z has already done that for me. Now I'm wondering if this greased cat is going to want to blow through the pattern and float off the runway in a minute; these are airspeeds and rpm's that I am not used to seeing below about 5000 DALT. Landing was surprisingly tame and conventional, with the joystick "rumble" not really noticable anymore below about 120 mph, but getting her down to the top of the white arc ate up much more of the downwind leg than is normal; the airframe seems (subjectively) to be an order of magnitude more slippery. Never did find anything amiss with the controls; no rags hanging from the elevators. One thing I forgot to check after shut-down is whether the exhaust pipe may have slipped a bit in its vibration mount and touched the lower cowl exit, which has happened before and makes a noticable difference in cockpit vibration level. Well, maybe I got spooked and psyched myself into thinking the plane was falling apart because of a wax job, or maybe there are some real changes that occur when minor surface imperfections are buffed out on so large an area; maybe it was waxing the prop that did it. I do know that there was so much bug juice dried on the back of the prop blades when I shut down that the prop was not super-sleek for very long on that flight! But I wanted to share my subjective impressions and see if anyone else ever had their plane change personalities on them unexpectedly. I admit more data is needed. This report is long on fluff and short on hard numbers. 0.2 hrs is not much of a test flight. If any of this apparent speed gain is real, it does make me more motivated to get on my back on a creeper and buff and wax the underside! Orthopedic wellness is a small thing to sacrifice for additional knots! Any takers on this one? Bill B RV-6A 288hrs O-320-E2D 160 hp with Sensenich FP ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:24:53 AM PST US From: SportAV8R@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Arms --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com In a message dated 05/15/2003 12:52:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, bill@vondane.com writes: > Anyone done up a weight and balance spreadsheet that includes the ARM for > adding weight in the tail? > > Does anyone have the arms for the tail area of an RV-8? > > Bill: might want to check with your Browning .50 cal dealer. While you're at it, order some for the wings. -Bill B do not archive ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 10:28:29 AM PST US From: SportAV8R@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: smallest eyeball vents? --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com In a message dated 05/15/2003 1:18:01 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dan@rvproject.com writes: > I'm looking for the smallest possible eyeball vents that are still > functional. Really it's the mounting flange that I want to be as small as > possible. > > I think it's one of the Lancair vents that I saw which has no flange, just > a > retaining nut? > > I'd love to find something that's in the 1.5" to 2" size range. > I think my "next" panel for the -6A will feature rectangular vents liberated from some junked luxury car. I know enough about fiberglass work by now to fashion my own reducers to connect these to any size SCAT that is needed, and I bet you do, too :-) Just a thought. -Bill B do not archive ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 10:33:09 AM PST US From: "pauls@kc.rr.com" Subject: RV-List: Re: Electroluminescent Lighting --> RV-List message posted by: "pauls@kc.rr.com" I used the El Flat line 1/2" wide and I think it was about 3' long. It is installed under the glare shield and the color is blue. Then I wired the power through a cheap Radio Shack rehostat for dimming. The flight instrument is a Dynon-self lit. The flatline with dimmer turned up lights everything else. Paul Stratman ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 10:34:10 AM PST US From: Garry LeGare Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX --> RV-List message posted by: Garry LeGare Rob, It's called progress. Gotcha. Casper (putting on Nomex outfit) do not archive Rob Prior wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: Rob Prior > > Doug Rozendaal wrote: > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" > > > >>http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/rv-10int8.htm#latest > > > > The more new RV designs I see, the more I believe that the model number of > > an RV is inversely proportional to its attractiveness. (sorted numerically, > > then alpha, of course ;-) ) Sorry, but I think the RV-3 still has the best > > lines in the fleet and this airplane will not change that. > > Now if they'd put a *tailwheel* on it instead of a nosewheel, it would > look better... 8-) But i'm more concerned with the increased percentage > of fibreglass in the construction. Soon we won't be able to turn our > noses up at the fast glass crowd, if the current trend keeps up... > > -RB4 > rv7 "at" b4.ca > > do not archive > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 10:39:43 AM PST US From: "Brian Denk" Subject: Re: RV-List: RV Building Question --> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" >--> RV-List message posted by: HCRV6@aol.com > >Can anyone out there tell me what the correct torque is for the "O" ring >fuel >pump fittings on my O-360. I checked the Lyc O'haul manual but don't see >it >in there. > >Harry Crosby Harry, These fittings rely on the O-rings for sealing. The threads don't perform this function, like with a tapered pipe thread. Get a firm seat..metal on metal, just snug, and that's enough. Brian Denk RV8 N94BD ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 10:55:27 AM PST US From: Scott Bilinski Subject: Re: RV-List: waxing the airframe: handling effects --> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski I read a book about WWII fighters years ago and they claimed 10 MPH increase after a good wax job. Also, all the Reno racers wax their planes far more speed. I bet high speed race cars do the same....like the bonnevile cars. At 01:19 PM 5/15/03 -0400, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com > >This post contains a lot of subjective speculations, and may prove >frustrating. Delete now if you simply must have "data" to deal with a >question posed to the list :-) > >After yesterday, I find myself wondering if anyone else has noticed a fairly >striking difference in their RV's handling characteristics after buffing >their paint job and waxing the airframe and propeller for the first time... > >Figuring 5 years was long enough to wait, I decided to buy an electric buffer >and some compound and finally get around to rubbing out my basecoat/clearcoat >paint job. Alright, I admit it, I had done some recent repainting on a few >of the fiberglass parts and they looked crappy enough that I wanted to try >anything that might inprove the finish. My body shop friend told me that I >could buff without fear of damage on a paint job as old as mine, as it should >have cured hard as glass by now. Boy, was he right. Most of the pebbly >areas and nibs in the clearcoat are there to stay unless I go back to wet >sanding with 1200 or similar. Still, the compound did seem to restore the >luster, and the surface smoothness was improved somoewhat by my efforts. The >Meguiar's liquid wax really made the paint glow. Now I have to be careful >leaning against the plane that I don't slide off and lose my balance! > >Having done the prop, spinner, cowl, upper surfaces of both wings, and the >upper surfaces of the horizontal stab and elevators plus the entire vertical >stab and rudder, I decided to get in a quick flight before dark. It was a >dead calm evening. The tanks held only about 5 gallons each, enough for a >ten minute mission. The runway had just been mowed. A billion bugs were >loitering around, waiting to leave their dying impression on my shiny >airframe and canopy. Under such conditions, there is only one thing to do... > >After a normal taxi and run-up, I advanced the throttle. The ground run was >normal. Clinb-out felt really flat, like I wasn't seeing all the power I was >accustomed to. ROC was a bit below normal, but then I noticed the airspeed >was higher than usual - already 120mph. Trim was set where it always was, >but this...? As I pulled skyward, weighing my options should the engine >falter, I noticed a "thrumming" vibration in the joystick that felt >unfamiliar. I started to envision a rag streaming from the elevator, left >behind by a fool pilot with a wax job on his mind. I circled the field at >1000 msl and reduced power. The engine was running strong but sounded >different - check the LightSpeeds: yep, they're powered up and batteries are >in the green; the ANC is functional. What's the deal? Is it "automatic >rough," knowing I only have 10 gallons aboard and approaching darkness? Nah. > Let's pour the coal on and see what she does straight and level. Way before >I expected it, the GRT engine monitor master alarm light is on for a >propeller overspeed condition, and I'm seeing 180 mph IAS and, at least >momentarily, about 250 fpm climb. Normally, when I get a prop redline light, >the tach will show 2610, where the light is set to come on, and there is no >need to hurry with power reduction or pitch up unless I'm in a shallow dive. >This time the tach said 2640...2650... yikes! - don't like to experiment >with 10th order vibrations when Ed Z has already done that for me. Now I'm >wondering if this greased cat is going to want to blow through the pattern >and float off the runway in a minute; these are airspeeds and rpm's that I am >not used to seeing below about 5000 DALT. > >Landing was surprisingly tame and conventional, with the joystick "rumble" >not really noticable anymore below about 120 mph, but getting her down to the >top of the white arc ate up much more of the downwind leg than is normal; the >airframe seems (subjectively) to be an order of magnitude more slippery. >Never did find anything amiss with the controls; no rags hanging from the >elevators. One thing I forgot to check after shut-down is whether the >exhaust pipe may have slipped a bit in its vibration mount and touched the >lower cowl exit, which has happened before and makes a noticable difference >in cockpit vibration level. > >Well, maybe I got spooked and psyched myself into thinking the plane was >falling apart because of a wax job, or maybe there are some real changes that >occur when minor surface imperfections are buffed out on so large an area; >maybe it was waxing the prop that did it. I do know that there was so much >bug juice dried on the back of the prop blades when I shut down that the prop >was not super-sleek for very long on that flight! But I wanted to share my >subjective impressions and see if anyone else ever had their plane change >personalities on them unexpectedly. I admit more data is needed. This >report is long on fluff and short on hard numbers. 0.2 hrs is not much of a >test flight. > >If any of this apparent speed gain is real, it does make me more motivated to >get on my back on a creeper and buff and wax the underside! Orthopedic >wellness is a small thing to sacrifice for additional knots! > >Any takers on this one? > >Bill B >RV-6A 288hrs >O-320-E2D 160 hp with Sensenich FP > > Scott Bilinski Eng dept 305 Phone (858) 657-2536 Pager (858) 502-5190 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 11:28:58 AM PST US From: Rob Miller Subject: Re: RV-List: waxing the airframe: handling effects --> RV-List message posted by: Rob Miller Bill I am wondering the same thing about my -8 but have to wait another month for the paint to cure. When Cafe tested a Mooney 201 they caliculated a speed increase of 2.8 knots when wax was applied to the entire airframe. If you check the Cafe site you can read the article for yourself. Interesting stuff. Rob Miller -8 N262RM "Bad Cat" Photos available on www.homebuiltairplanes.com --- SportAV8R@aol.com wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com > > This post contains a lot of subjective speculations, and may prove > frustrating. Delete now if you simply must have "data" to deal with a > question posed to the list :-) > > After yesterday, I find myself wondering if anyone else has noticed a > fairly > striking difference in their RV's handling characteristics after buffing > > their paint job and waxing the airframe and propeller for the first > time... > > Figuring 5 years was long enough to wait, I decided to buy an electric > buffer > and some compound and finally get around to rubbing out my > basecoat/clearcoat > paint job. Alright, I admit it, I had done some recent repainting on a > few > of the fiberglass parts and they looked crappy enough that I wanted to > try > anything that might inprove the finish. My body shop friend told me > that I > could buff without fear of damage on a paint job as old as mine, as it > should > have cured hard as glass by now. Boy, was he right. Most of the pebbly > > areas and nibs in the clearcoat are there to stay unless I go back to > wet > sanding with 1200 or similar. Still, the compound did seem to restore > the > luster, and the surface smoothness was improved somoewhat by my efforts. > The > Meguiar's liquid wax really made the paint glow. Now I have to be > careful > leaning against the plane that I don't slide off and lose my balance! > > Having done the prop, spinner, cowl, upper surfaces of both wings, and > the > upper surfaces of the horizontal stab and elevators plus the entire > vertical > stab and rudder, I decided to get in a quick flight before dark. It was > a > dead calm evening. The tanks held only about 5 gallons each, enough for > a > ten minute mission. The runway had just been mowed. A billion bugs > were > loitering around, waiting to leave their dying impression on my shiny > airframe and canopy. Under such conditions, there is only one thing to > do... > > After a normal taxi and run-up, I advanced the throttle. The ground run > was > normal. Clinb-out felt really flat, like I wasn't seeing all the power > I was > accustomed to. ROC was a bit below normal, but then I noticed the > airspeed > was higher than usual - already 120mph. Trim was set where it always > was, > but this...? As I pulled skyward, weighing my options should the engine > > falter, I noticed a "thrumming" vibration in the joystick that felt > unfamiliar. I started to envision a rag streaming from the elevator, > left > behind by a fool pilot with a wax job on his mind. I circled the field > at > 1000 msl and reduced power. The engine was running strong but sounded > different - check the LightSpeeds: yep, they're powered up and batteries > are > in the green; the ANC is functional. What's the deal? Is it "automatic > > rough," knowing I only have 10 gallons aboard and approaching darkness? > Nah. > Let's pour the coal on and see what she does straight and level. Way > before > I expected it, the GRT engine monitor master alarm light is on for a > propeller overspeed condition, and I'm seeing 180 mph IAS and, at least > momentarily, about 250 fpm climb. Normally, when I get a prop redline > light, > the tach will show 2610, where the light is set to come on, and there is > no > need to hurry with power reduction or pitch up unless I'm in a shallow > dive. > This time the tach said 2640...2650... yikes! - don't like to > experiment > with 10th order vibrations when Ed Z has already done that for me. Now > I'm > wondering if this greased cat is going to want to blow through the > pattern > and float off the runway in a minute; these are airspeeds and rpm's that > I am > not used to seeing below about 5000 DALT. > > Landing was surprisingly tame and conventional, with the joystick > "rumble" > not really noticable anymore below about 120 mph, but getting her down > to the > top of the white arc ate up much more of the downwind leg than is > normal; the > airframe seems (subjectively) to be an order of magnitude more slippery. > > Never did find anything amiss with the controls; no rags hanging from > the > elevators. One thing I forgot to check after shut-down is whether the > exhaust pipe may have slipped a bit in its vibration mount and touched > the > lower cowl exit, which has happened before and makes a noticable > difference > in cockpit vibration level. > > Well, maybe I got spooked and psyched myself into thinking the plane was > > falling apart because of a wax job, or maybe there are some real changes > that > occur when minor surface imperfections are buffed out on so large an > area; > maybe it was waxing the prop that did it. I do know that there was so > much > bug juice dried on the back of the prop blades when I shut down that the > prop > was not super-sleek for very long on that flight! But I wanted to share > my > subjective impressions and see if anyone else ever had their plane > change > personalities on them unexpectedly. I admit more data is needed. This > report is long on fluff and short on hard numbers. 0.2 hrs is not much > of a > test flight. > > If any of this apparent speed gain is real, it does make me more > motivated to > get on my back on a creeper and buff and wax the underside! Orthopedic > wellness is a small thing to sacrifice for additional knots! > > Any takers on this one? > > Bill B > RV-6A 288hrs > O-320-E2D 160 hp with Sensenich FP > > > > > > __________________________________ http://search.yahoo.com ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 11:46:40 AM PST US From: Wallace Enga Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga Ross, I paid about $45 each for them --- Aircraft Spruce also sells some other aluminum air vents that may be a little larger but they are in the $160 each price range - yikes. I have some doubts though if enough air can be pushed through a couple of 7/8" diam holes to cool the cockpit down. At 10:04 AM 5/15/03 -0700, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: Ross Schlotthauer > >Wally, > >I am in the same boat. What did you give for them? > >-Ross Schlotthauer >RV-7 Fuse, Picking up the finish kit today > > >--- Wallace Enga wrote: > > --> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga > > > > > > > > I didn't like Van's plastic air vents so ordered the > > eyeball swivel vents from Aircraft Spruce. > > > > However these vents have a nozzle outlet of only > > about 7/8" diam compared to 1.5 " diam for Vans > > or about 40% of the outlet area. > > > > Anyone tried using these --- will they provide > > sufficient > > air on a warm day? > > > > Wally Enga > > RV7 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 12:04:51 PM PST US From: "Keith Vasey" Subject: RE: RV-List: smallest eyeball vents? --> RV-List message posted by: "Keith Vasey" I got the "no-flange" eyeball vent from the Lancair (Columbia) guys. Their supplier is Kit Components. See www.kitcomponents.com Keith Vasey Seattle RV-8 Nearly canopy cutting time Dan Checkoway sez: I'm looking for the smallest possible eyeball vents that are still functional. Really it's the mounting flange that I want to be as small as possible. I think it's one of the Lancair vents that I saw which has no flange, just a retaining nut? I'd love to find something that's in the 1.5" to 2" size range. Any ideas? Thanks in advance, )_( Dan RV-7 N714D http://www.rvproject.com ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 01:23:55 PM PST US From: Subject: Re: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: J.C. Whitney has some that look interesting. They are cheap enough for experimenting without risking a bunch of money. Darwin N. Barrie Chandler AZ > > From: Wallace Enga > Date: 2003/05/15 Thu PM 02:47:21 EDT > To: rv-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent > > --> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga > > > Ross, > > I paid about $45 each for them --- Aircraft Spruce also > sells some other aluminum air vents that may be a > little larger but they are in the $160 each price range - yikes. > > I have some doubts though if enough air can be pushed through > a couple of 7/8" diam holes to cool the cockpit down. > > At 10:04 AM 5/15/03 -0700, you wrote: > >--> RV-List message posted by: Ross Schlotthauer > > > >Wally, > > > >I am in the same boat. What did you give for them? > > > >-Ross Schlotthauer > >RV-7 Fuse, Picking up the finish kit today > > > > > >--- Wallace Enga wrote: > > > --> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga > > > > > > > > > > > > I didn't like Van's plastic air vents so ordered the > > > eyeball swivel vents from Aircraft Spruce. > > > > > > However these vents have a nozzle outlet of only > > > about 7/8" diam compared to 1.5 " diam for Vans > > > or about 40% of the outlet area. > > > > > > Anyone tried using these --- will they provide > > > sufficient > > > air on a warm day? > > > > > > Wally Enga > > > RV7 > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 02:49:10 PM PST US From: "Bob Newman" Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX --> RV-List message posted by: "Bob Newman" How is rollover protection provided for the cabin? do not archive Bob newmanb@rocketmail.com newmanb@rocketmail.com ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 03:01:27 PM PST US From: "Boyd C. Braem" Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX --> RV-List message posted by: "Boyd C. Braem" No, you're not. A fast-back turle deck for the -8 is hardly a new idea and it's been done on the -4 for years. Perhaps you've seen a Harmon Rocket and esp. the newer single-seat HR III, which has been flying for a while now. Putting a -540 in a RV does not necessarily make it "Super". My airplane, designed and built by Tom Hallendorf, was the first RV to use the "Super" designation when it flew in 1998. Along with substantial airframe mods it has one kick-as* engine from LyCon that just, uh, goes like stink. It flies just like a little military jet except that there's this twirly thing in front of you. Making a slow airframe go faster is not always the best idea. It might help to make some basic/simple airframe mods to beef things up so that the pilot can actually use that extra hp. This would probably help Van sleep better at night, also. Generically speaking, for a "standard" GA airframe, doubling the horsepower can get you a 20-25% increase in top speed--theoritically, you could get 33% out of a really slick little poodle.. Whoa, there, Gilligan, little buddy! And then you get to watch your wings fall to Earth, beneath you, because you flew into the turbulence at a too great rate of speed--at least, that's the story from the "Super-8" guys. If this sounds grumpy, well, I'm off to see my probation officer and to check in for alcohol rehab--what???---no detox pills??? Boyd RV-Super 6/N600SS Dr. Leathers wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Dr. Leathers" > >If we are going to talk about beautiful lines, go see what is soon to be >available to RV-8 builders at www.showplanes.com Personally, I can't wait to >see what these mods do for speed!! Combine this fastback mod with the >Super-8 stuff we are seeing now, and WOW!!!! Pre-punched kit, improved lines and Rocket Power!! Am I right?? > >Doc > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "John Starn" >To: ; >Subject: Re: RV-List: More RV-10 PIX > > > > ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 03:10:49 PM PST US From: "Bob Newman" Subject: RE: RV-List: RE: RV List Dimple Sizes --> RV-List message posted by: "Bob Newman" Agreed. There is a nice table at http://www.metalwebnews.com/howto/drill- tables/screw2.html . For clearance hole for #8 screw in al materials, calls for #8 drill for close fit and #16 frill for free fit. Bob > A #12 drill seems kinda big for a #8 screw. I use a #19 or #20 for > those. I think you must be prepping for a #10 (3/16) screw if you're > drilling #12. Bob newmanb@rocketmail.com newmanb@rocketmail.com ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 03:22:25 PM PST US From: DWENSING@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: RE: RV List Dimple Sizes --> RV-List message posted by: DWENSING@aol.com In a message dated 5/15/03 6:12:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, newmanb@rocketmail.com writes: > For clearance hole for #8 screw in al materials, calls > for #8 drill for close fit and #16 frill for free fit. > > I think #8 above should #18 for close fit. do not archive ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 03:46:08 PM PST US From: Dave Bristol Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: Dave Bristol I don't know why people don't like the eyeballs that Van's sells - they look good and work very well. Dave do not archive Wallace Enga wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga > > >I didn't like Van's plastic air vents so ordered the >eyeball swivel vents from Aircraft Spruce. > >However these vents have a nozzle outlet of only >about 7/8" diam compared to 1.5 " diam for Vans >or about 40% of the outlet area. > >Anyone tried using these --- will they provide sufficient >air on a warm day? > >Wally Enga >RV7 > > > > ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 04:10:14 PM PST US From: Dave Bristol Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: Dave Bristol I don't know why people don't like the eyeballs that Van's sells - they look good and work very well. Dave do not archive Wallace Enga w Wallace Enga wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga > > >I didn't like Van's plastic air vents so ordered the >eyeball swivel vents from Aircraft Spruce. > >However these vents have a nozzle outlet of only >about 7/8" diam compared to 1.5 " diam for Vans >or about 40% of the outlet area. > >Anyone tried using these --- will they provide sufficient >air on a warm day? > >Wally Enga >RV7 > > > > ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 05:55:40 PM PST US From: "Amit Dagan" Subject: RV-List: alternator installation --> RV-List message posted by: "Amit Dagan" This is for those of you who have the 60 amp alternator kit from VANS - Can anyone email me a scan or picture of the installation diagram included in the kit ? otherwise I'll just have VANS send me a copy in the slow mail. Thanks, Amit. ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 06:08:52 PM PST US From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" I got mine from Wick's in Black for $59.95 ea. The vents are aluminum, swivel and seal tight......see page 57 in their 2003 Catalog. Tom in Ohio ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ross Schlotthauer" Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent > --> RV-List message posted by: Ross Schlotthauer > > Wally, > > I am in the same boat. What did you give for them? > > -Ross Schlotthauer > RV-7 Fuse, Picking up the finish kit today > > > --- Wallace Enga wrote: > > --> RV-List message posted by: Wallace Enga > > > > > > > > I didn't like Van's plastic air vents so ordered the > > eyeball swivel vents from Aircraft Spruce. > > > > However these vents have a nozzle outlet of only > > about 7/8" diam compared to 1.5 " diam for Vans > > or about 40% of the outlet area. > > > > Anyone tried using these --- will they provide > > sufficient > > air on a warm day? > > > > Wally Enga > > RV7 > > > > > > > > Contributions > > any other > > Forums. > > > > latest messages. > > List members. > > > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm > > Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv-list > > http://www.matronics.com/archives > > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > http://search.yahoo.com > > ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 07:11:42 PM PST US From: N223RV@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: N223RV@aol.com Some Rocket guy had some very large all Aluminum ones for sale at SNF this year. I met him at the beer tent but don't recall his name. He was asking somewhere around $135 each for them but they were very nice.... Vents seem overpriced to me, but compared to others they were well worth it. Maybe someone on the rocket list knows who this was and has contact information? If so, please cross post on the RV-List. Thanks -Mike Kraus N223RV ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 07:11:56 PM PST US From: "Eustace Bowhay" Subject: Re: RV-List: O-320 B3B --> RV-List message posted by: "Eustace Bowhay" Hi Dana: As I recall it has a vertical mounted carb at the bottom rear of the sump. This will mean a sump change if it is to be used in a tri-gear RV. Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dana Overall" Subject: RV-List: O-320 B3B > --> RV-List message posted by: "Dana Overall" > > Anybody know anything about this engine? I am particularly intersted in the > last B designation and the position and type of carb. Looking to spend > money, just want to make sure it is good money. > > > Dana Overall > Richmond, KY > RV-7 slider/fuselage > http://rvflying.tripod.com > do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 07:41:22 PM PST US From: "Tom Webster" Subject: Re: RV-List: alternator installation --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Webster" Amit, I have a three page doc. from Van's. It has a 1 page write-up, a mechanical drawing page and an electrical drawing page. Do you want the whole doc, or just the electrical or mechanical page? Let me know. My full page scans get a little big in size. Tom P.S. I have been lurking on and off on this list. My RV-7AQB finish kit arrived this week. The FWF kit came also. do not archive >From: "Amit Dagan" >Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com >To: rv-list-digest@matronics.com >Subject: RV-List: alternator installation >Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 00:54:24 +0000 > >--> RV-List message posted by: "Amit Dagan" > >This is for those of you who have the 60 amp alternator kit from VANS - >Can anyone email me a scan or picture of the installation diagram included >in the kit ? >otherwise I'll just have VANS send me a copy in the slow mail. > >Thanks, >Amit. > > ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 07:53:59 PM PST US From: Al Mojzisik Subject: Re: RV-List: Eyeball Swivel Vent --> RV-List message posted by: Al Mojzisik That was the guy I shared a booth with at Sun-N-Fun Here's the info. Contact Todd Reiffers at (317) 576-9565 or dharmon@iquest.net or www.tail-mate.com before you get any vents. He has a friend who makes vents exactly like Van's but in all aluminum. They are a work of art and close so tight that NO air gets through when you don't want it. They aren't cheap but what is for an airplane? HTH, Al At 10:10 PM 5/15/03 -0400, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: N223RV@aol.com > >Some Rocket guy had some very large all Aluminum ones for sale at SNF this >year. I met him at the beer tent but don't recall his name. He was asking >somewhere around $135 each for them but they were very nice.... Vents seem >overpriced to me, but compared to others they were well worth it. Maybe >someone on the rocket list knows who this was and has contact information? >If so, please cross post on the RV-List. Thanks >-Mike Kraus >N223RV > > ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 08:51:59 PM PST US From: "Karie Daniel" Subject: Re: RV-List: Dimple die sizes --> RV-List message posted by: "Karie Daniel" I tried to get around buying a #12 die set and really messed this up. My advice, just buy the die set. If your in the Seattle area just borrow mine! Or send me your address and I'll ship this to you and you can return them when your done. Karie Daniel RV-7A QB in progress Sammamish, WA. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Antenbring" Subject: RV-List: Dimple die sizes > --> RV-List message posted by: Mark Antenbring > > In the RV-7 rudder tip rib it says to "enlarge hole to #12, and dimple". > Geez, I thought I had all the tools. What size dimple die do I need for #12, > and are there any other oddball sizes I need to order? > Thanks, > Mark > do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 09:13:34 PM PST US From: "Doug Weiler" Subject: RV-List: Outstanding IFR RV-6A for sale --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Weiler" Fellow Listers: A wonderful RV-6A has been put up for sale by one of our members. It is a 1998 quickbuild, 180 hp, Hartzell prop, IFR certified, Garmin 430, autopilot. It is a jewel. I invite you to see the following website for details. Many thanks Doug Weiler pres, MN Wing http://www.pressenter.com/~dougweil/N131LD/index.htm ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 09:53:12 PM PST US From: Jeff Bertsch Subject: Re: RV-List: waxing the airframe: handling effects --> RV-List message posted by: Jeff Bertsch Here is a link to the study on plane waxing done by the Cafe Foundation. http://www.cafefoundation.org/aprs/Wax%20Job%20with%20PICT.pdf Bill, what brand of wax did you use? Anyone have a favorite wax that they strongly recommend? Has anyone tried the Rejex stuff and what do you think? I know one fellow who swears by it, and another that says it is just an overpriced wax and to stick with the basics. Jeff Bertsch noms1reqd@swbell.net --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 10:41:35 PM PST US Subject: RV-List: Alligator Pneumatic Squeezer From: "" --> RV-List message posted by: "" All, I just bought an alligator pneumatic squeezer and am having several problems. Any help would be appreciated: * Are there any unique tips to adjust the plunger dpeth? I read in the archive to use washers, but that only allows so much adjustment. I also heard of an adjustable stop that Avery makes, but I think it is 60 or 70 dollars. * How do people keep the rivet from bending over when squeezing? Since one arm of the squeezer goes through an arc, it seems it would always compress at a slight angle. * Is 90 psi about right for the squeezer pressure setting? I wonder if people using the c-type have the same problems. I bought this tool to make life easier, but right now it is much harder. Between adding and removing washers and angling rivets, I'm about ready to go back to the old standby manual. Thanks, Scott 7A Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com The most personalized portal on the Web!