Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:11 AM - Re: Discounts at OSH (Kevin Horton)
2. 04:16 AM - Re: Forward Rudder Bottom Fairing/Fiberglass and Tail Wheel Problem (N223RV@aol.com)
3. 04:55 AM - Addison, TX (Fesenbek, Gary)
4. 07:49 AM - Interior paint, Rustoleum Hammered (D. Jones)
5. 08:35 AM - Re: Discounts at OSH (Rob Prior)
6. 09:20 AM - CH Products Joysticks (Mark Phillips)
7. 10:19 AM - Re: Discounts at OSH (Tedd McHenry)
8. 11:47 AM - Looking for LED for Wig Wag (Don Mack)
9. 11:54 AM - Re: Looking for LED for Wig Wag (VFT@aol.com)
10. 01:32 PM - Fw: Forward Rudder Bottom Fairing/Fiberglass and Tail Wheel Problem (LarryRobertHelming)
11. 04:16 PM - Question about the "P" word (Ken Simmons)
12. 04:45 PM - Re: Interior paint, Rustoleum Hammered (Paul Besing)
13. 05:17 PM - Re: RV-8 rollbar installation (Geoff Evans)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Discounts at OSH |
--> RV-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorto1537@rogers.com>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch@earthlink.net>
>
>Does anyone know if Van's offers discounts on orders at OSH,
>especially sub-kits? Thanks in advance. Glenn in Arizona, -9A
>about to order wings. DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
I've been travelling to OSH for many years, and Van has never offered
any discounts there. He seems to prefer to offer the lowest possible
price all year, rather than have a slightly higher base price, and
airshow discounts. He probably already has enough of a post-OSH
orders bubble as it is.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Forward Rudder Bottom Fairing/Fiberglass and Tail Wheel Problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: N223RV@aol.com
In a message dated 6/19/2003 7:32:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time, stanb@door.net
writes:
> I'm planning on filling
> the front of the fairing with some pour foam and then cutting away the front
> and laying up new glass to fit.
>
I ended up cutting the front off, removing about 1/2", then re-glassing it
together. It turned out real nice.
-Mike Kraus
N223RV, Flying!
Message 3
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Fesenbek, Gary" <Gary.Fesenbek@mkcorp.com>
There are a number of nice FBOs to park your airplane here at Addison.
As already mentioned Millionaire, Monarch and Addison Express come to
mind. If you really want to go on the cheap (as I often do!) here is a
recommendation for you. Gas up either before you get here. I'm not
sure the direction you are coming from but if it is from the North I
would recommend Gainsville (GLE) (40 miles NNW) or Sherman Muni (SWI)
(35 miles NNE). Gassing up at one of these places will save you $1 per
gallon or more at some times. Last time I tried to purchase gas there I
think the price was something like $2.89 per gallon whereas GLE and SWI
regularly have fuel for $1.80 or lower. If you get your gas elsewhere
you probably don't want to park at one of those FBOs so they can gouge
you on parking fees so just ask Addison Ground to park on the Millenium
ramp. It's a place that used to have a self-serve gas pump (no longer
working) and I often park there for free. I'm not sure how you are
getting around when you get there. If it's a rental car the Avis dealer
is just two blocks from the millennium ramp whereas the Dart
Station(rapid transit, ie. Busses) are about three blocks away. Other
factors could make me want to park at Addison Express such as I am tight
on time and want to get in and out, etc, etc. However, these tips could
save you as much as $50 on a weekend stay.
Gary Fesenbek
Dallas, TX
RV6A
Message 4
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| Subject: | Interior paint, Rustoleum Hammered |
--> RV-List message posted by: "D. Jones" <dljinia@yahoo.com>
Group:
Has anyone successfully used Rustoleum Hammered
paint for painting the interior? I really like how
this looked on a test piece using the rattle can. I
spent a Saturday morning painting the removeable
interior pieces. When I painted the larger pieces, I
couldn't get a consistent finish. I spent a Saturday
afternoon removing the paint from the removable
interior pieces (:
You can buy this in the quart. Has anyone sprayed it
with a paint gun? What were the results? Did you
thin the paint???
Any other alternatives that give the same type of
"hammered" finish?
TIA,
Doug -7A Finish
http://www.oncloud7.com/rv7.htm
__________________________________
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Discounts at OSH |
--> RV-List message posted by: Rob Prior <rv7@b4.ca>
Kevin Horton wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorto1537@rogers.com>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch@earthlink.net>
>>
>>Does anyone know if Van's offers discounts on orders at OSH,
>>especially sub-kits? Thanks in advance. Glenn in Arizona, -9A
>>about to order wings. DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
> I've been travelling to OSH for many years, and Van has never offered
> any discounts there. He seems to prefer to offer the lowest possible
> price all year, rather than have a slightly higher base price, and
> airshow discounts.
As a consumer I prefer the way Van does it now, with one lowest possible
price year round. If he discounted at OSH, those of us who couldn't attend
OSH would be subsidizing the kits bought there.
--
---------
Rob Prior
rv7 "at" b4.ca
-----------------------------
Stop dreaming... Start flying
Message 6
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| Subject: | CH Products Joysticks |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mark Phillips <ripsteel@edge.net>
Howdy list-
I have been looking at these sticks since last summer and curious if any
of y'all are using them & if so the goods & bads- would love to see a
decent photo of the front of one to determine switch layout- their
website has no such photos.
http://www.chproducts.com/retail/CS.htm
If anyone has run across some slick sticks I'd sure like to hear about
them (not interested in the military style sticks- just too much stuff
sprouting out of them for my likes!)
Thanks,
Mark - RV-6A do not archive
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Discounts at OSH |
--> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry <tedd@vansairforce.org>
> If he discounted at OSH, those of us who couldn't attend
> OSH would be subsidizing the kits bought there.
How so? In general, a discount is offered to generate additional orders, which
are fulfilled at marginal cost, making the discounted orders equally profitable
to regular orders (more profitable, ideally). Van, specifically, probably has
a pretty steady flow of orders year-round, and may not find that Oshkosh itself
generates a lot of new orders relative to his yearly total. Not much
savings-on-margin, hence no discount.
If Van offered a discount and failed to generate enough additional orders, he'd
have to eat the loss. Either way, the term "subsidize" doesn't make any sense
in an open market.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
Message 8
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| Subject: | Looking for LED for Wig Wag |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Don Mack" <don@dmack.net>
I am installing the Wig Wag II landing/taxi light flasher. It has
connections for 20Ma/12V LEDs to indicate a main bulb failure. I can not
find a source for them. Most of the 12V LEDs I find are 12Ma or less. If
anyone has a source, I would appreciate it.
Don Mack
don@dmack.net www.dmack.net
Do not archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Looking for LED for Wig Wag |
--> RV-List message posted by: VFT@aol.com
www.ledtronics.com
Danny Melnik
F1 #25
Melbourne (FL) Rocket Factory
Message 10
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| Subject: | Fw: Forward Rudder Bottom Fairing/Fiberglass and Tail Wheel Problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
Here is the response from Vans ( Gus Funnell ) on the rudder bottom problem
for tail draggers.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gus Funnell" <gusf@vansaircraft.com>
Subject: Re: Forward Rudder Bottom Fairing/Fiberglass and Tail Wheel Problem
> The fairing comes oversize, it is a trim to fit item. You can trim it
> off, but not do it uniformly along the length so the light is not
> affected. More comes off the front than the back.
>
> Vans
>
> On 19 Jun 03, at 11:45, LarryRobertHelming wrote:
>
> > Re: Rudder Bottom RV7 Fairing Fiberglass tail wheel interference
> >
> > I am fitting rudder bottom to new rudder ( mounted on VS ) and I have
> > about 1 1/4" interference with lower portion of fiberglass bottom
> > starting, and most noticeably, at front by the tail wheel rod/spring.
> > I am considering possibilities with tail light already fitted in the
> > other end. Trimming the needed 1 1/4" along the entire length of
> > the faring for uniformity would be possible if it were not for the
> > light.
> >
> > What are you suggesting to others with this problem?
> >
> > Thanks, Builder 70047, Larry Robert Helming
> >
> > Larry in Indiana, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360
> > Working on Finish Kit
> >
> > Aviation in itself is not inherently dangerous. But ..... is terribly
> > unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity or neglect. Author
> > unknown
> >
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Question about the "P" word |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Simmons" <ken@truckstop.com>
The following is a primer question. If you're not interested, please
delete now.
I've read about some builders just priming the mating services of parts
(i.e. the rib flanges and the rivet lines on the skins). Is there anyone
doing this with epoxy primer that "requires" etching and alodining?
It's seems to be a difficult task to prepare and prime just the rivet
lines on the skins. Is it worth the hassle to do just the rivet lines
and save a little weight?
Thanks.
Ken
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Interior paint, Rustoleum Hammered |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Besing" <azpilot@extremezone.com>
For the steel parts, you might try powder coating the hammertone on. It
goes on flawlessly in a powder coat. I restored an old soda machine, and we
sent all the interior parts to be powdercoated in a hammertone finish.
Looks beautiful.
I did have to paint a few pieces that we forgot, and I used the spray can
version. Not nearly the same results. The flow patterns of the "hammer"
portion of color just doesn't blend evenly like it does with powder coat.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "D. Jones" <dljinia@yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: Interior paint, Rustoleum Hammered
> --> RV-List message posted by: "D. Jones" <dljinia@yahoo.com>
>
> Group:
> Has anyone successfully used Rustoleum Hammered
> paint for painting the interior? I really like how
> this looked on a test piece using the rattle can. I
> spent a Saturday morning painting the removeable
> interior pieces. When I painted the larger pieces, I
> couldn't get a consistent finish. I spent a Saturday
> afternoon removing the paint from the removable
> interior pieces (:
>
> You can buy this in the quart. Has anyone sprayed it
> with a paint gun? What were the results? Did you
> thin the paint???
>
> Any other alternatives that give the same type of
> "hammered" finish?
>
> TIA,
> Doug -7A Finish
> http://www.oncloud7.com/rv7.htm
>
>
> __________________________________
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: RV-8 rollbar installation |
--> RV-List message posted by: Geoff Evans <hellothaimassage@yahoo.com>
Dave,
>>
My weldment was purchased in 2000 & I hope the quality of fit has been
improved greatly since then.
<<
Well, mine was purchased at the end of 2002, so obviously the quality hasn't
changed significantly.
I spoke with Scott at Vans this afternoon. Here are some of the things he
recommended.
>>
Then to avoid putting a big bending moment on the bolts and gouging the
longeron with the heads, I drilled the bolt holes at an angle to the rollbar
surface so the heads would line up flush with the underside of the longeron.
<<
He said to do this. I didn't have bolt head interference with the longeron,
but rather with the gusset that is inboard of the longeron. It adds just
enough thickness that there isn't room for the bolt heads if the holes are
drilled perpendicular to the rollbar flange. They must be drilled
perpendicular to the longeron. He did mention that these weren't close
tolerance bolts, and that it didn't really matter if the holes were slightly
oversized or elongated because the two surfaces weren't parellel with each
other.
Then we got into a discussion about the rollbar's purpose and the shims. In a
nutshell, he said that the rollbar served no structural purpose except to
protect your head if the plane flips over on the ground. Given that, these
bolts really aren't responsible for holding anything together on a regular
basis -- they just have to keep the rollbar attached to the airplane if you
flip it over.
He further said that the shims were mostly for cosmetic reasons, even though
this area gets covered up by the top skin anyway. At 20-25 inch-pounds of
torque, you're not going to distort the longeron or the steel rollbar, even
if there is a gap between the rollbar flange and the longeron. The rollbar is
sitting flush on the cockpit rail and it's flush with the longeron at the aft
end, so it's not going anywhere.
He didn't specifically say this, but I'm under the impression he implied that
the shims weren't even really necessary as long as you didn't overtorque the
bolts.
Taking all of this into consideration, I drilled the rest of the holes
perpendicular to the longeron and there is plenty of room for the bolt heads
on the back side. I'm planning to make some shims, but I'm certainly not
going to spend a week getting them "just right" since this area gets covered
up by the top skin anyway. Grinding the washers like you suggest sounds like
a good idea as well.
After drilling the holes, I removed the rollbar and looked at it more
closely. The flanges with the five bolt holes on each side have twists in
them! I didn't measure them, but it's enough to see with the naked eye. This
explains why I have a much bigger gap (7/32" on one side) at the foward end
of the flange than the aft end. The edges of the flanges are straight in that
they line up perfectly with the edges of the longerons, but they are
definitely twisted about the longitudinal axis.
It beats me how you can bend a 5" long piece of steel in a brake to form a
flange and have it come out bent more at one end than at the other. Perhaps
it's a quality control problem, and perhaps if more of us complained about it
and demanded new parts it would get fixed. I suspect, however, that the
majority of builders just make double-tapered shims like you suggested and go
on about their business. That's certainly the easier route, but it doesn't
solve the fundamental problem.
Thanks for your info, Dave, and I hope this discussion will help some others
in the future. I also hope I haven't misconstrued or misunderstood anything
Scott said in our telephone conversation.
-Geoff
RV-8 QB fuselage
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