Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:44 AM - Diamondhead VS Danville Flyin (eregensburg)
2. 05:15 AM - Re: 9A manual trim cable in a 6A? (Dana Overall)
3. 06:29 AM - Re: Diamondhead Flyin? (Don't even try it) (Charlie & Tupper England)
4. 09:31 AM - Horiz vs. Vert induction (Geoff Evans)
5. 11:36 AM - SERFI? (Paul Besing)
6. 12:31 PM - [ Ken Brooks ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
7. 02:14 PM - Re: SERFI? (Ed Anderson)
8. 03:24 PM - F-810C LENGTH RV-8 QUICKBUILD (GEORGE INMAN)
9. 07:07 PM - Re: Re: RiteAngle AOA owners (Larygagnon@aol.com)
10. 08:08 PM - Re: Horiz vs. Vert induction (Dick Jordan)
11. 08:21 PM - Re: Matco master cylinder rebuild, etc. (Brian Denk)
12. 08:41 PM - Subject: Re: [SoCAL-RVlist] Carb Ice over the Santa Monicas? Redux (Blake Harral)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Diamondhead VS Danville Flyin |
--> RV-List message posted by: eregensburg <eregensburg@triad.rr.com>
Im going to Danville VA for the young Eagles fly in that Len Leggette helped
organize. Anyone else willing to help would be appreciated. (DAN) Starting
around 9AM (briefing) 10 AM we fly. Anyone, anytime welcome !!
Ed "Ditch"
N925RV - RV6A
Message 2
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| Subject: | 9A manual trim cable in a 6A? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dana Overall" <bo124rs@hotmail.com>
Jeff, on the 9 & 7 the manual trim knob comes up through the fuel selector
valve cover. The cover has a triangular flange bent into the front of it.
If you would like a picture, I'll post you one, just let me know. The plans
still have it coming through the tunnel then doing almost a 180 up to the
fuel selector valve cover.
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY
RV-7 slider/fuselage, Imron black, "Black Magic"
Finish kit ordered!! Buying Instruments. Hangar flying my Dynon.
http://rvflying.tripod.com
do not archive
>From: "GMC" <gmcnutt@intergate.ca>
>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RE: RV-List: 9A manual trim cable in a 6A?
>Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 23:54:02 -0700
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "GMC" <gmcnutt@intergate.ca>
>
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Jeff Orear" <jorear@new.rr.com>
>
>Listers:
>
>I am trying to get everything squared away in the aft fuselage before I
>rivet my aft top fuselage skin on, and I have a question, mostly for the 9A
>builders out there, regarding routing the manual elevator trim cable.
>
>On the 6A, the plans call out for it to be routed under the seat and
>baggage
>floors, with the trim knob mounted on a center console that runs from the
>bottom of the panel to the fuel valve mount. This requires the cable to
>form a vertical loop from where it exits the wing spar up to where the trim
>knob is mounted on the center console.
>
>I would very much like to eliminate this loop, as well as the center
>console,
>
>---------------------------big snip
>
>Regards,
>
>Jeff Orear
>RV6A
>
>-----------------------------------------
>
>Hi Jeff
>
>I have electric trim on my 6A because I did not like the looks of the trim
>cable setup either.
>
>However if I was trying to put in manual trim on a 6A I would investigate
>trying a shorter cable running along left side under left arm-rest, then
>connecting to a lever that runs up through a slot at forward end of
>arm-rest. There must be off the shelf outboard motor throttle cables or
>something similar that could be made to work.
>
>This is only food for thought and worth what you paid for it.
>
>Have flown both manual & electric trim, both work fine. Only drawback with
>the vernerier cable setup is that on the aircraft I flew there was no trim
>indicator and it is hard to tell when trim is neutral during before takeoff
>check. With a left side lever there would be a visual reference for trim
>tab
>position.
>
>George McNutt
>Langley, BC
>6A - 210 hrs
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Diamondhead Flyin? (Don't even try it) |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England <cengland@netdoor.com>
Charlie & Tupper England wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England <cengland@netdoor.com>
>
>Anyone in the Southeast going to the Diamondhead Mississippi flyin tomorrow?
>
>Charlie
>RV-4 N914RV
>
Just discovered that they expect arrivals on Friday & departures on
Sunday afternoon. The field is closed for the fly-in. (???)
I hope I haven't caused anyone any problems.
Charlie
do not archive
Message 4
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| Subject: | Horiz vs. Vert induction |
--> RV-List message posted by: Geoff Evans <hellothaimassage@yahoo.com>
Aero Sport Power now lists two types of IO-360 (the 180HP non-counterweighted
version) engines on their pricing page.
The IO-360-B series has a vertical draft sump (like the O-360) and the
IO-360-M series has a horizontal setup (like the IO-360-A1B6).
Other than the extra hole in the front of the cowl, what are the advantages
and disadvantages of a horizontal vs. vertical induction setup?
Why is the M-series (horizontal) almost $2000 more?
Thanks.
-Geoff
RV-8 QB fuselage
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
Message 5
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Besing" <azpilot@extremezone.com>
Anyone been to SERFI before? I was thinking of going and setting up a
booth. How's the turn out each year?
do not archive
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold
RV-10 Soon
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
Message 6
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| Subject: | [ Ken Brooks ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> RV-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Ken Brooks <kenbrooks@charter.com>
Subject: Remote Magnetometer Shelf and CPU Mount for Blue Mountain Avionics
EFIS-One in RV-8
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/kenbrooks@charter.com.09.20.2003/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
Message 7
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot@extremezone.com>
Subject: RV-List: SERFI?
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Besing" <azpilot@extremezone.com>
>
> Anyone been to SERFI before? I was thinking of going and setting up a
> booth. How's the turn out each year?
>
> do not archive
>
> Paul Besing
I went for the first time last year, Paul. I thoroughly enjoyed it. I was
a little dismayed that the FBO had no sectional maps for their part of
Alabama (New Orleans Sectional). My sectionals stretched within 50 miles or
so I felt no sweat getting rest of way on GPS, but I like having a map of
what I fly over. The sense of time seems a bit slower, I was trying to get
fueled up on my departure date early in the morning to beat the
thunderbumpers home. So around 6 am I noticed the FBO office open, I was
parked right next to the 100LL - could have almost dragged the hose to my
aircraft. I asked to be refueled and was told to wait for sunrise. Wellll,
ok, I guess that was reasonable. I waited for another half hour and
accosted the same individual who then suggested I see him after they served
breakfast in the hanger. Well, my digestion was beginning to turn a bit
sour. Finally got fueled (by a different individual) and stuck the bill in
my hat - well, that appeared to get his attention (after his breakfast).
Sooo that was my experience with the FBO. I was told that they don't have a
terrible lot of activity there outside of SERFI - don't know if that trues
or not. I may perhaps get a bit impatient, when I am trying to beat
thunderbumbers home, but not having local sectionals and then what I
perceived as "drag your feet" service was enough to turn me off a bit.
However, that said, I truly thought the local EAA chapter put on a great fly
in. Enjoyed every minute of it. Met lots of new folks, I had not seen at
other flyins such as Sun & Fun, great variety of aircraft, friendly folks
and just a fine all around time. I am definitely returning this October,
but, this time I will bring a sectional of the area and ensure I do not need
refueling in the wee hours of the AM.
Hope to see you there
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
eanderson@carolina.rr.com
Message 8
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| Subject: | F-810C LENGTH RV-8 QUICKBUILD |
--> RV-List message posted by: "GEORGE INMAN" <ghinman@attcanada.ca>
When mounting my horiz.stab to the
fuselage I noticed that the F-810C angle
was not quite long enough.
It does not butt tight against the
vert. flange of the F-887 longeron
As a result it will be difficult to
maintain edge clearance for the bolt
that goes through both the f-810C
and the F-887 .
Has anyone had this problem
on the RV-8 QB .
GEORGE H. INMAN
ghinman@attcanada.ca
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: RE: RiteAngle AOA owners |
--> RV-List message posted by: Larygagnon@aol.com
My RV6 has 27 hours now and the AOA is still not programed. I wanted to wait
until I could take a passenger with me to be able to program the unit. I'm
intimidated by the instructions and want someone in the plane to help with the
programing. I'll let you know when I get the system up and running.
Larry Gagnon
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Horiz vs. Vert induction |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dick Jordan" <mkejrj@erols.com>
Geoff,
I ordered the horizontal induction Superior engine and have not received
same at this writing. It should be ready for delivery in about 60 days since
they are doing engineering work on the manifold before releasing it to the
public.My answers are based on conversations with Superior and are not first
hand knowledge but I believe them to be accurate.
The new manifold is made from a composite material which is about 8 Lbs.
lighter than it's standard aluminum counterpart. It routes the induction
charge to the cylinders so that the gas air mixture does not pick up as much
heat as the conventional unit( which routes through the crank case filled
with hot oil). The cooler induction method results in a denser mixture and
more power.. Superior advises about 1/2 " more manifold pressure.
The above summarizes the main advantages. Other than that I understand the
RV 8 is designed for the forward induction system and this should save time
and money in not having to modify the cowl for vertical induction.
If my memory serves me the horizontal system sells for a $1,000. more than
the standard system. This may be distorted in that I purchased my engine at
an OSH sales price.
Good Luck,
Dick Jordan
RV 8A, Finishing
----- Original Message -----
From: "Geoff Evans" <hellothaimassage@yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: Horiz vs. Vert induction
> --> RV-List message posted by: Geoff Evans <hellothaimassage@yahoo.com>
>
> Aero Sport Power now lists two types of IO-360 (the 180HP
non-counterweighted
> version) engines on their pricing page.
>
> The IO-360-B series has a vertical draft sump (like the O-360) and the
> IO-360-M series has a horizontal setup (like the IO-360-A1B6).
>
> Other than the extra hole in the front of the cowl, what are the
advantages
> and disadvantages of a horizontal vs. vertical induction setup?
>
> Why is the M-series (horizontal) almost $2000 more?
>
> Thanks.
>
> -Geoff
> RV-8 QB fuselage
>
> __________________________________
> http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Matco master cylinder rebuild, etc. |
LIMITED_TIME_ONLY
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>In a message dated 9/19/2003 3:34:15 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
>akroguy@hotmail.com writes:
>I have a leaking master cylinder on my RV8. I ordered rebuild kits (two of
>them). For those with a few years of RV operation behind them, have you
>found it's best to just rebuild both master cylinders every few years or
>do
>they typically work for a long time, thus requiring rebuild only as needed?
>I'd rather just do both while I'm at it if it's the best plan of action.
>Brian-
>
>This depends on why it developed a leak. I'm assuming in my response that
>your master cylinder is leaking fluid out of the rod seal rather than
>leaking by
>the piston seal.
Yeah, it's around the rod seal.
>
>If you have a rough rod (ouch!), the seals will just get torn up again in
>short order. If the rod is good and mirror smooth, it's possible that the
>seal
>was damaged during initial installation or was defective in some other way.
>Pay particular attention to the quality of the surfaces in contact with the
>seal. If I were doing this I would probably use it as an opportunity to
>replace
>the nitrile (buna-n) O-rings with Viton but the nitrile ones work fine in
>the
>master. Viton is really much better than nitrile for the caliper piston
>seal.
I'll thoroughly check the rod surface finish and O-rings for flaws. I have
access to all kinds of O-rings at work, including viton. I'll cross
reference the rings when the kits arrive and keep them handy for the future.
I'm thinking the most likely reason for the leakage is dirt getting on the
rod and wearing the O ring by sawing into it. It's pretty dusty here,
especially during the spring and it just doesn't rain enough! I have to
sweep mounds of dust out of my hangar a few times every year. Time to
invent a master cylinder rod condom. :)
>
>See you at Copperstate.
I hope! I started the annual today and found *gasp*...another bad engine
cylinder. That makes three cracked jugs in four years. I could just
scream.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
Message 12
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| Subject: | RE: [SoCAL-RVlist] Carb Ice over the Santa Monicas? |
Redux
--> RV-List message posted by: "Blake Harral" <bharral@cox.net>
Ed,
I have a C-172 with a 0-300 (same engine as an O-200 used in C-150). While
at full throttle, it would occasionally start running rough, but reducing
the throttle and increasing it slowly would restore smooth operation for a
bit, at which point the whole process would repeat.
I sent the carb out for overhaul, but it did not fix the problem. Finally,
I got a suggestion to try new valve springs. I did install new springs, and
the problem disappeared. I now know of three cases where worn-out valve
springs caused a rough-running engine. I got a set of new surplus springs
from Fresno Airmotive - pretty reasonable cost. With the old springs
installed, I could with quite a bit of effort, open a valve by pressing down
on the springs with my thumbs. The new springs were stiffer, and after
installation, I could no longer move the valve by pressing down on the
spring with my thumbs.
The first instance of your problem certainly sounds like carb ice, or a
fuel-realated problem - particularly as the engine quit entirely and then
restarted at low altitude.
As for the second instance, after you thoroughly checked out the fuel/air
system, perhaps it is time to look elsewhere (ignition, valve train). A
fuel flow instrument and 4 cyl CHT/EGT monitoring would be a big help in
diagnosing the problem - I do realize these options are not cheap. It would
be very helpful to know whether the carb is actually getting fuel to the
cylinders and whether the problem is with all cylinders or just one. Also,
you should try operation on a single mag, as a malfunctioning mag might fire
early, causing rough operation.
I have heard of cases where a *broken* crankshaft will ride in the case
bore, but due to the break, will not maintain alignment between the
front/rear parts of the crankshaft. Because of the way shafts fail in
torsion, the shape of the break does not allow the two parts to rotate
completely independently, but perfect alignment is compromised. This causes
the valve timing to change, and the engine to run rough. This is a rare but
pretty depressing (costwise) scenario.
Having said all that, I'm not really sure what the problem is - just trying
to give you some ideas. Good luck.
Blake
Time: 07:54:55 PM PST US
From: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
Subject: RV-List: RE: [SoCAL-RVlist] Carb Ice over the Santa Monicas? Redux
(very
long)
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
On June 30 I posted to the SoCal RV-list list about a problem my C-150
had with suspected carb ice. I've reposted it below for reference. Sorry
about the long post. I'm still having problems with it and am looking
for ideas.
First what we did after the other incident:
1. Pulled carb airbox and inspected it. Showed it to a couple of
AI's. decided it was serviceable.
2. Pulled carburetor and sent it to airmotive. They reported that
the float would slowly rise indicating a problem with needle and seat.
Observed "witness mark" on seat but could not locate any debris. Screen
was clear. Installed new needle and seat and flow tested. Returned with
yellow tag.
3. Drained fuel tanks through carb feed hose. Fuel flowed just fine
with no hiccups until tanks were empty (about 17 gals).
4. Removed fuel on/off valve. Replaced o-ring and lubed valve with
fuel lube and reinstalled.
5. Removed engine primer valve. Cleaned and replaced o-rings.
Checked that it pumps fuel by removing line to intake manifold and
operating primer.
6. Replaced fuel cap gaskets and checked that underwing fuel vent
was unblocked by blowing through it until the tank creaked and listening
to the air coming back out the vent tube.
7. Installed "iceman" carb ice detector. It has an led and
photocell on a probe in the carb throat and lights a light on the panel
and an audible alarm when the photocell picks up less light.
8. Had it blessed and returned to service by an AI.
Two test flights totaling about an hour and a half showed nothing wrong
and if anything, running better than before.
Today I loaded it up and headed out to Oceano. Stopped for 80 octane at
SZP and continued. Over Lake Cachuma and at 6500 ft I noticed some
roughness and about 50 rpm drop. The carb ice detector was not sounding
(and it's not shy- it's gone off several times during runup and power
reductions). I pulled carb heat anyway and went full throttle. The rpm
degraded some more and then seemed to recover slightly then dropped to
1500 and immediately came back up to about 2500. It them proceeded to
cycle back and forth between 2500 and 1500 continuously. I experimented
with throttle, carb heat and mixture and was unable to find a sweet spot
where it would run normally. The mixture control did have an effect on
rpm as did the carb heat. If I pulled the throttle back to about 1600,
it seemed to run OK, but more throttle put it back in cycling mode. By
this time I was over Santa Ynez at about 4000' and, low and behold it
seemed to run fine at any throttle setting. I landed.
Unable to locate and A&P and after some more unsuccessful attempts to
diagnose the problem, including blowing compressed air through the
underwing vent tube with one fuel cap off at a time, I decided to run it
up and try it out over the airport. I climbed to 7500' in the vicinity
of the airport and then turned east still climbing at minimum speed to
11,500' and flew it back to WHP while talking to SoCal. It flew just
fine the whole way. I did get a carb ice alarm twice while descending,
but it cleared up instantly with carb heat.
I'm at a loss. Does anybody have any ideas about what to do next? The
plan is to sell the Cessna when the RV's about ready and my nephew, Mark
intends to buy a tail kit at that point with his half of the proceeds.
We can't, in good conscience, sell it without solving this problem
though.
Ed Holyoke
6 QB (very slow)
I've finished my wings and now it's back to the canopy. I've promised
myself an engine when I finish that.
Do not archive
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