---------------------------------------------------------- RV-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 10/18/03: 19 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:30 AM - Fw: flying humor Not RV related (Ken Stribling) 2. 01:10 PM - Re: Fw: flying humor Not RV related () 3. 01:15 PM - Re: 2004 FAR/AIMs are in (Doug Shenk) 4. 02:50 PM - Center arm rest length (Dana Overall) 5. 03:04 PM - Re: Fw: flying humor Not RV related (Canyon) 6. 03:12 PM - Re: fire retardant (Michael McGee) 7. 03:37 PM - Re: Re: Fire resistant seats (Pete Waters) 8. 03:56 PM - Re: Re: Display readability in sunlight (George P. Tyler) 9. 04:50 PM - Re: Fw: flying humor Not RV related (rv6tc) 10. 04:55 PM - Avionics Price (bruno) 11. 05:13 PM - Re: Center arm rest length (Alex Peterson) 12. 05:31 PM - Re: Fw: flying humor Not RV related (Canyon) 13. 05:59 PM - Re: Center arm rest length (RGray67968@aol.com) 14. 06:19 PM - Re: Re: Fire resistant seats (Cy Galley) 15. 06:37 PM - Re: Avionics Price (Dan Checkoway) 16. 08:03 PM - dipstick & tube--help (Dave Ford) 17. 08:52 PM - LOE#3 / RV Fly-In () 18. 08:52 PM - Re: dipstick & tube--help (Jim Jewell) 19. 09:34 PM - Re: dipstick & tube--help (Charlie Kuss) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:30:25 AM PST US From: "Ken Stribling" "Tim Bryan" , Subject: RV-List: Fw: flying humor Not RV related --> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Stribling" Message ----- Original Message ----- : flying humor do not archive After every flight, pilots fill out a form called a gripe sheet, which conveys to the mechanics problems encountered with the aircraft during the flight that need repair or correction. The mechanics read and correct the problem, and then respond in writing on the lower half of the form what remedial action was taken, and the pilot reviews the gripe sheets before the next flight. Never let it be said that ground crews and engineers lack a sense of humor. Here are some actual logged maintenance complaints and problems as submitted by Qantas pilots and the solution recorded by maintenance engineers. By the way, Qantas is the only major airline that has never had an accident. P Problem logged by the pilot. S Solution and action taken by the mechanics. P: Left inside main tire almost needs replacement. S: Almost replaced left inside main tire. P: Test flight OK, except auto-land very rough. S: Auto-land not installed on this aircraft. P: Something loose in cockpit. S: Something tightened in cockpit. P: Dead bugs on windshield. S: Live bugs on back-order. P: Autopilot in altitude-hold mode produces a 200 feet per minute descent. S: Cannot reproduce problem on ground. P: Evidence of leak on right main landing gear. S: Evidence removed. P: DME volume unbelievably loud. S: DME volume set to more believable level. P: Friction locks cause throttle levers to stick. S: That's what they're there for. P: IFF inoperative. S: IFF always inoperative in OFF mode. P: Suspected crack in windshield. S: Suspect you're right. P: Number 3 engine missing. S: Engine found on right wing after brief search. P: Aircraft handles funny. S: Aircraft warned to straighten up, fly right, and be serious. P: Target radar hums. S: Reprogrammed target radar with lyrics. P: Mouse in cockpit. S: Cat installed. P: Noise coming from under instrument panel. Sounds like a midget pounding on something with a hammer. S: Took hammer away from midget. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:10:07 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV-List: Fw: flying humor Not RV related From: --> RV-List message posted by: > --> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Stribling" > do not archive > > By the way, Qantas is the only major airline that has never > had an accident. Only if you don't call wrecking a 747 an accident . Rob Acker (RV-6 flying) ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 01:15:04 PM PST US From: Doug Shenk Subject: Re: RV-List: 2004 FAR/AIMs are in --> RV-List message posted by: Doug Shenk if you have one of the Jep books left, i'd appreciate it. I will be ordering a FAR/AIM on the website this afternoon. thanks doug shenk Aircraft Technical Book Company wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Aircraft Technical Book Company" > >2004 FAR/AIMs are now in. Get yours by return e-mail, or through either of >our web sites, or by phone at 800 780-4115 > >There are also 3-4 left of the Jeppesen Instrument/Commercial Textbooks for >FREE (with any other order) This book just had some minor revisions. The >new edition is $82. But I've got 3-4 copies left of the old ones, with cut >off covers, available FREE for the asking. > >Andy >www.buildersbooks.com >www.pilotsbooks.com > > >do not archive > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:50:14 PM PST US From: "Dana Overall" Subject: RV-List: Center arm rest length --> RV-List message posted by: "Dana Overall" For Mike, or anyone else who has made a center arm rest..........how far forward did you extend the arm rest. Since I don't have my seat foam I am at a little loss as to where my elbow will rest in relation to the panel. The only reference point I have is the forward edge of the fabricated tunnel cover, forward of the flap actuator channel. If this is not clear enough, I can take a pic and post it for reference. I would like to fabricate this tomorrow, if possible, and am looking at attaching angle, with nutplates, to the top of the tunnel cover and having the rest extend to the forward most point of the tunnel cover panel. Will this be far enough forward?? Dana Overall Richmond, KY RV-7 slider/fuselage, Imron black, "Black Magic" Finish kit ordered!! Buying Instruments. Hangar flying my Dynon. http://rvflying.tripod.com do not archive ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:04:28 PM PST US From: Canyon Subject: Re: RV-List: Fw: flying humor Not RV related --> RV-List message posted by: Canyon racker@rmci.net wrote: > > By the way, Qantas is the only major airline that has never > > had an accident. > >Only if you don't call wrecking a 747 an accident . --- Uhh... and Southwest Airlines? Steve ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:12:53 PM PST US From: Michael McGee Subject: Re: RV-List: fire retardant --> RV-List message posted by: Michael McGee At 21:31 2003-10-15, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: " bert murillo" > >Hello: > Where can one get seats for our rv's, which >meet the FAA specs. for fire retardant material? > I was surprise to find out, the people we know > such as Laurentis...that their seats, are not fire >retardant,,,,I am sure that there is not such a thing >as Fire proof, on seats.? I know, the material I have > on fire wall, as proctection is defenitely fire proof > did not burn, even with a solder torch... > Would like to hear comments...does any one feel >it is really important, to obtain the fabric for the >seats,, FAA approved? so where do you get this?? >bert >rv6a > almost ready for wings.... >Do Not archive In aircraft as small as ours I don't believe that flame retardant/resistant material in the seats is an important consideration due to: 1) If the seat is catching on fire I'm not in it or 2) It doesn't matter any more and I will save the expense of a pine box. In an airliner or large cabin aircraft it makes a difference. Mike McGee, RV-4 N996RV, O320-E2G, Hillsboro, OR 13B in gestation mode ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 03:37:53 PM PST US From: Pete Waters Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Fire resistant seats --> RV-List message posted by: Pete Waters Not trying to be sarcastic here, but if one really worried about this then one needs to consider what clothes to wear while flying. Having fireproof seats won't help you in the event of a cockpit fire if you're clothes catch on fire. In the military we fly in fireproof nomex flight suits. Theoretically we're supposed to have the sleeves rolled down and nomex gloves on, with ankle-high boots, a helmet, and an O2 mask. I.e. almost no skin exposed. Now, some of this is overkill in a GA airplane, but if you want to be fireproof, buy a nomex flight suit from military surplus. Flightsuits.com is one supplier, although not the cheapest. They're available in other colors besides standard military olive green and desert tan. If you don't go this far, all pilots and passengers should at least give a thought to what they wear in the plane. Polyester and most synthetics (like GoreTex or polypropylene or most of the other high-tech camping / hiking stuff) will melt and fuse right onto your skin during a fire. They'll have to anesthetize you heavily to get it off. Your best bet by far (short of nomex) is to wear cotton clothing or some other natural fiber. Pedro (military jet navigator, trying to pass the knowledge along) Christopher J Fortin wrote: --> RV-List message posted by: Christopher J Fortin A quick search on the net produced this: Use of Decoration Materials In University Residence Halls The following is a flame-resistant formula: Borax: 7oz. Boric Acid: 3 oz. Hot Water: 2 quarts These materials can be purchased from a drug store. The material to be treated should be dipped in or sprayed with the solution. After treatment, check several small pieces of the material to assure flame-resistance. Re-apply if sample burns after initial test. Chris Fortin N813CJ reserved Time: 06:33:07 AM PST US From: Gkb5577@aol.com Subject: RV-List: Re: Fire resistant seats --> RV-List message posted by: Gkb5577@aol.com There are foams that meet your criteria: ask Oregon Aero for their catalog (I've no financial ties to them)- I just got mine and it is full of a lot of interesting photos and info as well as difficult to find items. Prices are a little on the high side but they do have the research done. Does anyone know what the chemical is that you can spray on things that makes it fire resistant? It was discovered during the WWII .AO? Geoff On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 23:57:23 -0700 RV-List Digest Server writes: --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 03:56:06 PM PST US From: "George P. Tyler" Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Display readability in sunlight --> RV-List message posted by: "George P. Tyler" I know this is off the original thread but, I have had nothing but trouble down loading and then transferring up dates into my ipac, in every instance that I have tried to do it I have had to call for help. Is this just me or have others had problems loading up dates too? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sam Buchanan" Subject: RV-List: Re: Display readability in sunlight > --> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan > > Tracy Crook wrote: > > > I use AnywhereMap with an iPAQ but never tried the window tint on it. > > Probably would not work since it is an LCD display. I'm surprised your > > friend found the iPAQ not acceptable though. > > > An important component of an iPAQ installation is a mount that allows > the iPAQ to be adjusted for various reflections and lighting conditions. > I have found that a slight adjustment of the RAM ball mount on my iPAQ > is enough to eliminate sun glare or a reflection from the passenger's > light-colored shirt. > > As with many reflective screens, polarized sunglasses will inhibit the > apparent brightness of the iPAQ screen. But I find the iPAQ to be easy > to read under all daylight conditions, and the AnywhereMap software is a > supremely capable nav tool. > > Sam Buchanan > http://thervjournal.com > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 04:50:40 PM PST US From: "rv6tc" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fw: flying humor Not RV related --> RV-List message posted by: "rv6tc" They ran a 737 thru a blast fence and into a Chevron station in Burbank (Crossing the threshold at 210 KIAS at Flaps 10 will do that for you). Two weeks later, they ran a 737 off the end of the runway (8/26) in Phoenix and into a construction area. The hull loss would have been that same spring when they taxied onto an active runway in 1,800 RVR in Ontario... right into the path of a UAL 737 on takeoff roll. UAL rejected using RTO brakes (3,000 psi) and both swerved. Less than 300 feet separation. No hull loss, but "accident"... you decide. Keith Hughes Denver Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Canyon" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fw: flying humor Not RV related > --> RV-List message posted by: Canyon > > > > >Only if you don't call wrecking a 747 an accident . > --- > Uhh... and Southwest Airlines? > > Steve > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 04:55:07 PM PST US From: bruno Subject: RV-List: Avionics Price --> RV-List message posted by: bruno Hello listers I will be on the market for a new transponder as I've decided to replace my actual transponder while it still has a bit of a trading value. So I would like to know where is the best place to buy a new one ( Planning on the Garmin GTX 327 OR 320A )preferably in Canada but if I can get a good price in the States I will go that way. Thanks for your imputs Bruno Dionne RV-4 C-GDBH rv4@videotron.ca Do not archive ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:13:56 PM PST US From: "Alex Peterson" Subject: RE: RV-List: Center arm rest length --> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" > For Mike, or anyone else who has made a center arm > rest..........how far > forward did you extend the arm rest. > tomorrow, if possible, and am looking at attaching angle, > with nutplates, to > the top of the tunnel cover and having the rest extend to the > forward most > point of the tunnel cover panel. > > Will this be far enough forward?? The aileron trim in my 6A is generally what limited the forward end of the center armrest box. The armrest is more than far enough forward with regards to its function as an armrest. I believe the forward point of the tunnel cover is a good landmark. Alex Peterson Maple Grove, MN RV6-A N66AP 388 hours www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 05:31:08 PM PST US From: Canyon Subject: Re: RV-List: Fw: flying humor Not RV related --> RV-List message posted by: Canyon rv6tc wrote: >They ran a 737 thru a blast fence and into a Chevron station in Burbank >(Crossing the threshold at 210 KIAS at Flaps 10 will do that for >you). Two >weeks later, they ran a 737 off the end of the runway (8/26) in >Phoenix and >into a construction area. The hull loss would have been that same spring >when they taxied onto an active runway in 1,800 RVR in Ontario... right >into the path of a UAL 737 on takeoff roll. UAL rejected using RTO >brakes >(3,000 psi) and both swerved. Less than 300 feet separation. No hull >loss, >but "accident"... you decide. --- I was reminded of the Burbank incident but never heard of the others, I guess. However, I stand corrected. :-) I think I heard recently they are the only US carrier to have never had a fatal accident though. Probably what prompted my post. Oh well... Thanks, Steve ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 05:59:21 PM PST US From: RGray67968@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Center arm rest length at.a.big.ISP@matronics.com --> RV-List message posted by: RGray67968@aol.com Dana, I put a center console in my flying RV after seeing Mike's. I don't know how I ever flew without it and, it would surely be missed if I removed it tomorrow. Mine is all aluminum angle construction with .020 side skins and .032 hinged top - padded and covered to match the interior. Great for storing items and in flight snacks, laying your seat belts across so they don't get mixed up, pilot/pass divider, and a good elbow support for throttle management during formation. Make yours as long OR short as YOU want to suit YOUR needs (heard that before huh : ). I just sent you a couple pics of mine to give you something to go by. Rick Gray RV6 in Ohio at the Buffalo Farm For Mike, or anyone else who has made a center arm rest..........how far forward did you extend the arm rest. Since I don't have my seat foam I am at a little loss as to where my elbow will rest in relation to the panel. The only reference point I have is the forward edge of the fabricated tunnel cover, forward of the flap actuator channel. If this is not clear enough, I can take a pic and post it for reference. I would like to fabricate this tomorrow, if possible, and am looking at attaching angle, with nutplates, to the top of the tunnel cover and having the rest extend to the forward most point of the tunnel cover panel. Will this be far enough forward?? Dana Overall Richmond, KY RV-7 slider/fuselage, Imron black, "Black Magic" Finish kit ordered!! Buying Instruments. Hangar flying my Dynon. http://rvflying.tripod ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:19:13 PM PST US From: "Cy Galley" Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Fire resistant seats --> RV-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" Regardless of what clothes you wear, one should wear nomex gloves. Then you can handle hot objects, beat out flames, etc. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Waters" Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Fire resistant seats > --> RV-List message posted by: Pete Waters > > Not trying to be sarcastic here, but if one really worried about this then one needs to consider what clothes to wear while flying. Having fireproof seats won't help you in the event of a cockpit fire if you're clothes catch on fire. > In the military we fly in fireproof nomex flight suits. Theoretically we're supposed to have the sleeves rolled down and nomex gloves on, with ankle-high boots, a helmet, and an O2 mask. I.e. almost no skin exposed. Now, some of this is overkill in a GA airplane, but if you want to be fireproof, buy a nomex flight suit from military surplus. Flightsuits.com is one supplier, although not the cheapest. They're available in other colors besides standard military olive green and desert tan. > If you don't go this far, all pilots and passengers should at least give a thought to what they wear in the plane. Polyester and most synthetics (like GoreTex or polypropylene or most of the other high-tech camping / hiking stuff) will melt and fuse right onto your skin during a fire. They'll have to anesthetize you heavily to get it off. Your best bet by far (short of nomex) is to wear cotton clothing or some other natural fiber. > > Pedro > (military jet navigator, trying to pass the knowledge along) > > Christopher J Fortin wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: Christopher J Fortin > > A quick search on the net produced this: > > > Use of Decoration Materials In University Residence Halls > > > The following is a flame-resistant formula: > Borax: 7oz. > Boric Acid: 3 oz. > Hot Water: 2 quarts > > These materials can be purchased from a drug store. The material to be > treated should be dipped in or sprayed with the solution. After > treatment, check several small pieces of the material to assure > flame-resistance. Re-apply if sample burns after initial test. > > > Chris Fortin > N813CJ reserved > > Time: 06:33:07 AM PST US > From: Gkb5577@aol.com > Subject: RV-List: Re: Fire resistant seats > > --> RV-List message posted by: Gkb5577@aol.com > > There are foams that meet your criteria: ask Oregon Aero for their > catalog > (I've no financial ties to them)- I just got mine and it is full of a lot > of > interesting photos and info as well as difficult to find items. Prices > are a > little on the high side but they do have the research done. Does > anyone know > > what the chemical is that you can spray on things that makes it fire > resistant? > > It was discovered during the WWII .AO? Geoff > On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 23:57:23 -0700 RV-List Digest Server > writes: > > > --------------------------------- > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:37:13 PM PST US From: "Dan Checkoway" Subject: Re: RV-List: Avionics Price --> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" Give John Stark a call. He tends to have the best prices around (as far as I've seen). http://www.starkavionics.com For what it's worth, I chose the GTX-320A over the -327. It was a full pound lighter and a bit shallower. On the flip side, the digital -327 would only have been a hundred bucks more (from Stark). He tried to talk me into it, but I wanted to stay light and simple (knobs). Anyway, just my 2 cents. do not archive )_( Dan RV-7 N714D http://www.rvproject.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "bruno" Subject: RV-List: Avionics Price > --> RV-List message posted by: bruno > > Hello listers > I will be on the market for a new transponder as I've decided > to replace my actual transponder while it still has a bit of a trading > value. > So I would like to know where is the best place to buy a new > one ( Planning on the Garmin GTX 327 OR 320A )preferably in Canada but if I > can get a good price in the States I will go that way. > > Thanks for your imputs > > Bruno Dionne > RV-4 C-GDBH > rv4@videotron.ca > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:03:18 PM PST US From: "Dave Ford" Subject: RV-List: dipstick & tube--help --> RV-List message posted by: "Dave Ford" I have an overhauled O360A1A that I just put its first 6 quarts of oil in. The dipstick shows that it has 5 quarts in it. No oil has yet circulated through the oil lines or filter. This core when received did not have a dipstick or tube, I ordered a new tube #75767 from an engine shop. It is approx. 11 1/2" from tip of tube to engine base. The dipstick was a used one from (supposedly) an O360A1A 8 quart system (it is imprinted "8" on top). I don't know if I have the wrong dipstick or tube, any suggestions? Dave Ford ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:52:38 PM PST US From: Subject: RV-List: LOE#3 / RV Fly-In --> RV-List message posted by: Dear RV-Ators, Just a quick PIREP on LOE #3: I spent the sunny day today looking over all the RV's (& Rockets) that made it to the 3rd. RV Land of Enchantment Fly-In in Las Cruces, New Mexico, USA. The last count I heard (based on A/C registrations) was in excess of 180+ A/C's. FINAL numbers are yet to be seen. That was truly a sight to be seen !!! Konrad / ABQ, NM ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 08:52:38 PM PST US From: "Jim Jewell" Subject: Re: RV-List: dipstick & tube--help --> RV-List message posted by: "Jim Jewell" Hi Dave, You can search for the right stick of course as the first choice. The next choice is to run it up briefly with the 6 quarts in it, let it stand a bit and remark the stick add another quart remark again etc. There are ways to pre-oil the system but a brief run will not hurt and it is sure to fill the filter etc. If the engine was on a tail dragger before and you have a tri gear the end result should be quite accurate enough. Any thing below 5 quarts is not too critical for marks on the stick if you plan to check the oil before and after every flight. That is your plan isin't it.(;-) Happy Flying Jim in Kelowna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Ford" Subject: RV-List: dipstick & tube--help > --> RV-List message posted by: "Dave Ford" > > I have an overhauled O360A1A that I just put its first 6 quarts of oil in. The dipstick shows that it has 5 quarts in it. No oil has yet circulated through the oil lines or filter. This core when received did not have a dipstick or tube, I ordered a new tube #75767 from an engine shop. It is approx. 11 1/2" from tip of tube to engine base. The dipstick was a used one from (supposedly) an O360A1A 8 quart system (it is imprinted "8" on top). I don't know if I have the wrong dipstick or tube, any suggestions? > > Dave Ford > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 09:34:41 PM PST US From: Charlie Kuss Subject: Re: RV-List: dipstick & tube--help --> RV-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss Dave It is common for an engine to require 1 to 2 extra quarts of oil on initial fill up. There is a certain amount of oil which doesn't drain out of an engine when you drain it for oil change. Leave the oil in it for now. Once you start it up and run it, drain the oil and filter again. Refill with 6 quarts again, and check the level. This will give you an accurate indication. Charlie Kuss >--> RV-List message posted by: "Dave Ford" > >I have an overhauled O360A1A that I just put its first 6 quarts of oil in. The dipstick shows that it has 5 quarts in it. No oil has yet circulated through the oil lines or filter. This core when received did not have a dipstick or tube, I ordered a new tube #75767 from an engine shop. It is approx. 11 1/2" from tip of tube to engine base. The dipstick was a used one from (supposedly) an O360A1A 8 quart system (it is imprinted "8" on top). I don't know if I have the wrong dipstick or tube, any suggestions? > >Dave Ford > >