Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:03 AM - Re: Carb heat connector P/N DL-07 (Fred Stucklen)
2. 08:15 AM - Re: Where's the best place to purchase PPG? (Randy Lervold)
3. 08:29 AM - Re: Car gas in Ellisons (Boyd Braem)
4. 08:30 AM - Re: RV6-A Constant Speed Upgrade (Eustace Bowhay)
5. 09:08 AM - Re: How many RV's to change a light bulb (Ed Bundy)
6. 09:08 AM - Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... (Boyd Braem)
7. 11:18 AM - Re: Car gas in Ellisons (Terry Watson)
8. 12:28 PM - Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... (linn walters)
9. 03:24 PM - Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... (Kevin Horton)
10. 04:08 PM - Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... (Elsa & Henry)
11. 04:28 PM - RV List Skytech starter (smoothweasel@juno.com)
12. 04:28 PM - Re: Car gas in Ellisons (Charlie & Tupper England)
13. 04:51 PM - Re: RV List Skytech starter (Boyd Braem)
14. 06:19 PM - Lyle Hefel (Lenleg@aol.com)
15. 06:27 PM - Re: Car gas in Ellisons (Charlie Kuss)
16. 07:02 PM - Re: Lyle Hefel (Cy Galley)
17. 08:10 PM - Re: Pitot tubes (Kevin Horton)
18. 08:24 PM - WW 200RV test results in (Randy Lervold)
Message 1
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| Subject: | RE: Carb heat connector P/N DL-07 |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Fred Stucklen" <wstucklen1@cox.net>
Hal,
On both RV-6a's I've built I've always closed in those gaps. I too
found that there was not enough hot air getting into the air box, and
found that by modifying the Carb heat connector from Van's, by adding
additional metal in the gap areas, more heat was available to the air
box.
The FAR's (part 23 I think) state that the alternate air source should
be capable of increasing the carb inlet air temp by 20*C (20* C above
ambient.. It doesn't state under what conditions, so I assumed at cruise
RPM...). So I've added a heat muff on one of the exhaust crossover pipes
that is solely dedicated to heating alternate air. Inside the muff,
wrapped around the exhaust pipe, is a stainless 1/4" spring (constructed
by winding .032" safety wire on a 1/4" dowel). The muff is the same size
as the cabin heat muff, so a lot of hot air is generated.
I've found that the best way to quantify the muff's performance is to
insert a temperature probe into the top lid of the air box (outside the
filter). This probe could be a simple as a Radio Shack outside air probe
(dual channel, so you could see ambient and carb inlet temps). I have
extra channels on the Electronics International Ultimate temp scanner,
so that's what I used.
I've been in light icing, and medium level snow showers, and have not
had any issues with carb heat. With the temp probe always indicating
actual inlet air temps that a well above freezing, I'm confident that I
shouldn't have any alternate air issues.....
Fred Stucklen
RV-6A N926RV
108 Hrs since Aug 03 !
Time: 09:42:01 PM PST US
From: kempthornes <kempthornes@earthlink.net>
Subject: Carb heat connector P/N DL-07
--> RV-List message posted by: kempthornes
<kempthornes@earthlink.net>
Hi,
I have cowling off my RV6a and one thing I wanted to check on was
why carb
heat seems to have so little effect. Door operates properly,
horizontal
muff (Robbins I think) is okay. I look at another RV and see it
does not
have the part P/N DL-07 that mine has. This part creates two gaps
about
1/2 by 2 1/2 each. Van's catalog says:
"Stand-off design allows hot air to escape when carb heat is not
selected
and allows full operation of lever opening alternate air door."
Makes some sense but ... how does yours work?
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Where's the best place to purchase PPG? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Just look in your local phone book in the Auto Body Supply section, there
should be a number of places that sell paint & supplies to local auto body
shops.
Randy Lervold
RV-8 primed with DX1791 and painted with Concept DCC
> I've decided to try PPG DP48 two part Epoxy Primer (white) if it's readily
available. Otherwise, DX 1791 - Self-Etching Wash Primer.
>
> The PPG website is not easy to navigate. I'd appreciate a URL or advice on
where to purchase.
>
> Thanks,
> John
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Car gas in Ellisons |
--> RV-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
The Ellison doesn't care about the gas, but your engine
(pistons--compression) might.
Boyd
do not archive
On Sunday, December 7, 2003, at 12:20 AM, Gary Crowder wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Gary Crowder" <rv9@3rivers.net>
>
> I would like to hear from anyone who has experience running car gas
> with an Ellison TBI.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gary RV-9A 55 hrs
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: RV6-A Constant Speed Upgrade |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay@jetstream.net>
Hi Pete:
For me it is not so much about performance as it is about engine handling.
The constant speed will give you the ability to accurately set what ever
power you want to pull from the engine.
With a manifold gauge installed and the constant speed you can now set the
most suitable rpm in relation to the throttle setting.
Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C.
----- Original Message -----
From: "pjoslin" <pjoslin@bellsouth.net>
Subject: RV-List: RV6-A Constant Speed Upgrade
> --> RV-List message posted by: "pjoslin" <pjoslin@bellsouth.net>
>
> I have recently purchased a low time RV6-A with 0-320 160HP fixed pitch.
With emphasis on cruise speed and cost which constant speed propeller
combination would fellow listers recommend. I went into the archives but
still not sure. Thanks for any suggestions or tips.
> Pete Joslin
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | How many RV's to change a light bulb |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Bundy" <ebundy@velocitus.net>
That was one of the funniest (and most on the mark) posts I've read here in
a long time.
Don't forget the (113) posts that remind everyone to do not archive.
Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID
RV6a 600+ hours
>Actually found on the Acro list
>(12) claim that they are leaving the forum forever
>because they can't stand the thread.
---
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... |
--> RV-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
Harry--
This memory thing gets harder and harder--unlike the part that my wife
liked--but I believe that the "grommets" ACS sells are bigger (9 or 11
mm) than the standard sparkplug cables (7 mm)--I have no idea why or if
this is still the case, but I would ask (axe) before I spent money.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Car gas in Ellisons |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
Ellison doesn't want you to use auto gas with their throttle body. This is
right off their website:
Use with Auto Fuel
The Ellison Throttle Body Injector has been designed specifically for
aircraft use and has been thoroughly tested with aviation fuels. We do not
recommend the use of auto fuel with the TBI. Several of our customers who
have used auto fuel have had substantial damage to the rubber and metal
parts of the TBI. When operated only on aviation fuel, we have never
observed any deterioration of metal or rubber parts in the unit.
The EPA has required the oil companies to add oxygenates to auto fuel in in
many parts of the country to reduce pollution in the winter months. In most
areas this additive is alcohol which will damage aircraft fuel systems. In
addition to possible chemical incompatibility, the high vapor pressure of
auto fuel can be a problem when used in aircraft, as it is much more likely
to boil that aviation fuel. Unlike aviation fuel, the formula of auto fuel
is altered as the seasons change, so winter grade fuel is even more likely
to form vapor.
Many of our customers have stated that they believe there is no chemical
difference between aviation fuel and auto fuel. A dramatic difference can
be demonstrated by pouring a sample of each into Styrofoam coffee cups. The
aviation fuel will remain contained in the cup, but auto fuel will dissolve
the cup and flow right through the bottom.
Terry
--> RV-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
The Ellison doesn't care about the gas, but your engine
(pistons--compression) might.
Boyd
do not archive
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
Bill VonDane wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Bill VonDane" <bill@vondane.com>
>
>http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/engbaffleseals.php
>
>-Bill
>
>
Now those prices scare me!!!
Linn
do not archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... |
--> RV-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorton01@rogers.com>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
>
>Harry--
>
>This memory thing gets harder and harder--unlike the part that my wife
>liked--but I believe that the "grommets" ACS sells are bigger (9 or 11
>mm) than the standard sparkplug cables (7 mm)--I have no idea why or if
>this is still the case, but I would ask (axe) before I spent money.
I can confirm the ACS ones were about 2 mm bigger than my plug wires. I'm
on the road right now so I can't measure the actual diameters. A kind
lister sent me some ones that fit my wires much better.
Kevin Horton
RV-8 (Finishing Kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Ignition Gromet for Rear Baffling...... |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Elsa & Henry" <elsa-henry@darlor-watch.com>
When I saw the prices for these feed-thrus, paying in CAN$ plus taxes, that
was enough for me to design an fabricate my own out of a block of 3/4" thick
UHMW which I had on hand and found most useful for making other insulators
such as battery box, main-spar feed-thrus, etc. I have a dimensional drawing
of the spark plug lead insulator on file which I could forward to anybody
interested.
Cheers!! ----Henry Hore
Message 11
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| Subject: | RV List Skytech starter |
--> RV-List message posted by: smoothweasel@juno.com
Does anyone know the actual AMP. that a Skytech starter uses starting a
O-320 160 HP?
I will be mounting my Batt. directly behind the baggage comp. and was
trying to calculate the voltage loss with this long of a cable to the
starter so that I can use the correct size cable.
Thanx in advance
do not archive
Weasel
-4
still sanding a few fairings..........THEN COMES THE PAINT!!!!!!
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Car gas in Ellisons |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England <cengland@netdoor.com>
Terry Watson wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
>
>Ellison doesn't want you to use auto gas with their throttle body. This is
>right off their website:
>
>Use with Auto Fuel
>The Ellison Throttle Body Injector has been designed specifically for
>aircraft use and has been thoroughly tested with aviation fuels. We do not
>recommend the use of auto fuel with the TBI. Several of our customers who
>have used auto fuel have had substantial damage to the rubber and metal
>parts of the TBI. When operated only on aviation fuel, we have never
>observed any deterioration of metal or rubber parts in the unit.
>The EPA has required the oil companies to add oxygenates to auto fuel in in
>many parts of the country to reduce pollution in the winter months. In most
>areas this additive is alcohol which will damage aircraft fuel systems. In
>addition to possible chemical incompatibility, the high vapor pressure of
>auto fuel can be a problem when used in aircraft, as it is much more likely
>to boil that aviation fuel. Unlike aviation fuel, the formula of auto fuel
>is altered as the seasons change, so winter grade fuel is even more likely
>to form vapor.
>Many of our customers have stated that they believe there is no chemical
>difference between aviation fuel and auto fuel. A dramatic difference can
>be demonstrated by pouring a sample of each into Styrofoam coffee cups. The
>aviation fuel will remain contained in the cup, but auto fuel will dissolve
>the cup and flow right through the bottom.
>
>Terry
>
Bummer...Forced to settle for aircraft quality again.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: RV List Skytech starter |
--> RV-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
If you have any doubt, get 00 or a welding cable--much easier to
handle/route and no worries about resitance/ft.
Boyd.
Check the Archives on the Matronic's AeroElectric Connection (Bob
Knuckolls).
do not archive
On Sunday, December 7, 2003, at 07:16 PM, smoothweasel@juno.com wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: smoothweasel@juno.com
>
> Does anyone know the actual AMP. that a Skytech starter uses starting a
> O-320 160 HP?
> I will be mounting my Batt. directly behind the baggage comp. and was
> trying to calculate the voltage loss with this long of a cable to the
> starter so that I can use the correct size cable.
>
> Thanx in advance
> do not archive
>
> Weasel
> -4
> still sanding a few fairings..........THEN COMES THE PAINT!!!!!!
>
Message 14
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--> RV-List message posted by: Lenleg@aol.com
I have checked the archives, etc. ...... does anyone know how to contact Lyle
Hefel?
Len Leggette, RV-8A
Greensboro, NC N910LL
175 hrs
Message 15
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| Subject: | Car gas in Ellisons |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss <chaskuss@bellsouth.net>
In 1975 (1st year of mandated no lead fuel) I was working for a large Dodge dealership.
Chrysler had a huge problem with the unleaded fuel reacting with the
rubber accelerator pump seals. We had to change all of the seals in ALL of the
cars. The replacement units were made of Viton rubber. Viton is impervious to
all types of gasoline.
If you really want to run auto fuel with an Ellison, I suggest that you replace
all the rubber seals with one made of Viton. These are readily available from
vendors like MSC and McMaster-Carr. Anyone using a Flow Ezy fuel filter (standard
equipment with Airflow Performance Fuel Injection systems) should also substitute
Viton seals for these units when used with auto fuel. You can order
these filters WITH Viton seals when you order them direct from Flow Ezy. Chris
Heitman of Pegasus Auto Racing Supplies had recently become a distributor for
these fuel filters. Check him out. You can't beat his prices on this item.
http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/index.htm
I can supply additional info on these fuel filters for those interested
Charlie Kuss
I can sill dismantle any Carter carburetor blindfolded! :-(
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
>
>Ellison doesn't want you to use auto gas with their throttle body. This is
>right off their website:
>
>Use with Auto Fuel
>The Ellison Throttle Body Injector has been designed specifically for
>aircraft use and has been thoroughly tested with aviation fuels. We do not
>recommend the use of auto fuel with the TBI. Several of our customers who
>have used auto fuel have had substantial damage to the rubber and metal
>parts of the TBI. When operated only on aviation fuel, we have never
>observed any deterioration of metal or rubber parts in the unit.
>The EPA has required the oil companies to add oxygenates to auto fuel in in
>many parts of the country to reduce pollution in the winter months. In most
>areas this additive is alcohol which will damage aircraft fuel systems. In
>addition to possible chemical incompatibility, the high vapor pressure of
>auto fuel can be a problem when used in aircraft, as it is much more likely
>to boil that aviation fuel. Unlike aviation fuel, the formula of auto fuel
>is altered as the seasons change, so winter grade fuel is even more likely
>to form vapor.
>Many of our customers have stated that they believe there is no chemical
>difference between aviation fuel and auto fuel. A dramatic difference can
>be demonstrated by pouring a sample of each into Styrofoam coffee cups. The
>aviation fuel will remain contained in the cup, but auto fuel will dissolve
>the cup and flow right through the bottom.
>
>Terry
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
>
>The Ellison doesn't care about the gas, but your engine
>(pistons--compression) might.
>
>Boyd
>
>do not archive
>
>
Message 16
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
Lyle Hefel, 2821 Elm Street, Dubuque, Iowa 52001 563-583-4657
He is a member of Chapter 75 and just finished another RV-8
rvbuilder@dubuque.net
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley@qcbc.org or experimenter@eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: <Lenleg@aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Lyle Hefel
> --> RV-List message posted by: Lenleg@aol.com
>
> I have checked the archives, etc. ...... does anyone know how to contact
Lyle
> Hefel?
>
> Len Leggette, RV-8A
> Greensboro, NC N910LL
> 175 hrs
>
>
Message 17
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--> RV-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorton01@rogers.com>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Jim Nolan" <jamespnolan@earthlink.net>
>
>Listers,
> Does anyone know if a Heated Pitot/static blade from a PA-28 161 have
>the same mounting holes as a PA-28 140C. I had to order the 161 blade
>because Piper didn't have the blade for the 140C. They couldn't tell me if
>they were the same, all they could say was they had different part no's and
>the blade length was the same.
> By the way, there's no information about what I'm asking in the
>archives and our local aircraft maintenance shop doesn't have that
>information and this is RV related.
>Jim Nolan
>N444JN
I don't know if all Piper pitot/static blades have the same mounting holes
or not, but I know that many of them do. I know that there are several
different Piper pitot/static blades with the same mounting holes, but
different angles on the bottom face - this may be why you are seeing
different part numbers. The different angle on the bottom face changes the
sensed static pressure, so that the accuracy of the static source position
error can be tuned to best work with the airframe it is designed to be
installed on.
So, if you are using the static source on the blade, and you are happy with
the accuracy now, you need to replace it with the same part number. If you
are only using the pitot part then it doesn't matter what the angle on the
bottom face is.
Diamond had a real tough time when they went from the DA-20A1 to the
DA-20C1. The heavier engine on the DA-20C1 led them to sweep the wings
forward ever so slightly, and that led to a slight change in spar location
which meant they had to move the Piper pitot/static blade. The one they
used on the DA-20A1 worked fine there, but it gave large static source
errors when installed on the DA-20C1. They tried all the available Piper
part numbers, and couldn't find one that gave acceptable accuracy. There
was one in particular that gave a very low indicated stall speed, and an
indicated speed in cruise that was way too high. We joked that they should
offer that pitot/static blade as a high performance option :). In the end
they ended up modifying a Piper pitot/static blade to have a custom angle
on the bottom to get acceptable accuracy.
Kevin Horton
RV-8 (Finishing Kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
Message 18
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<rv-list@matronics.com>
| Subject: | WW 200RV test results in |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Guys,
This weekend I finally had a chance to test the new Whirl Wind 200RV. The
results are posted on my prop page at...
www.rv-8.com/Prop.htm
Suffice it to say that the 200RV bested all other props in every category --
this is one sweet prop!
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 364 hrs
www.rv-8.com
EAA Technical Counselor
Home Wing VAF
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