Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:26 AM - Re: Slow Starter (Arnold de Brie)
2. 05:08 AM - Re: F-794A lower horizontal stabilizer/fuselage fairing (Rick Galati)
3. 05:09 AM - Re: Slow Starter (Bob U.)
4. 05:44 AM - Seager pattern and engine failure with CS hartzell prop (lucky macy)
5. 06:27 AM - Slow starter redux (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
6. 06:28 AM - Instrument panel cutting (Glen Matejcek)
7. 06:36 AM - Re: RV-List Digest: 41 Msgs - 01/02/04 (Glen Matejcek)
8. 07:03 AM - Re: Slow starter redux (Bob U.)
9. 07:05 AM - manual engine pre-oiler (thomas a. sargent)
10. 07:22 AM - Re: Wire and cable source? (Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club)
11. 07:33 AM - Re: Slow Starter (Alan McKeen)
12. 08:41 AM - Re: Wire and cable source? (Brian Denk)
13. 08:54 AM - Re: manual engine pre-oiler (Ed Holyoke)
14. 09:02 AM - RV-7/8 wing rear spar question (Charlie & Tupper England)
15. 09:22 AM - Re: Slow starter redux (Oldsfolks@aol.com)
16. 09:22 AM - Re: Electric seat heat (Kosta Lewis)
17. 11:24 AM - Re: RV-7/8 wing rear spar question (Dana Overall)
18. 01:01 PM - [ Ken Brooks ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
19. 01:59 PM - CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... (czechsix@juno.com)
20. 02:15 PM - Re: seat fabric amount (Ernest Kells)
21. 02:24 PM - Re: Slow starter redux (smoothweasel@juno.com)
22. 02:25 PM - Re: Whirlwind 151-series Propeller Installation (Larry Bowen)
23. 02:39 PM - Re: Seager pattern and engine failure with CS hartzell prop (Doug Rozendaal)
24. 03:12 PM - Re: Seager pattern and engine failure with CS hartzell (rmickey@ix.netcom.com)
25. 03:38 PM - Re: Exiting an RV in Flight - Ideas (Rob Prior)
26. 03:41 PM - Re: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... (Dan Checkoway)
27. 04:00 PM - Re: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... (van Bladeren, Ron)
28. 05:29 PM - Re: manual engine pre-oiler ()
29. 05:42 PM - >Re:Slow starter redux (Oldsfolks@aol.com)
30. 05:46 PM - Re: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... (Vanremog@aol.com)
31. 05:55 PM - Flap motor failure (Jerry2DT@aol.com)
32. 06:20 PM - travel to central america (tom coggin)
33. 06:28 PM - trip to honduras (tom coggin)
34. 06:29 PM - Re: Flap motor failure (Vanremog@aol.com)
35. 06:47 PM - Re: Wire and cable source? (flmike)
36. 09:20 PM - Re: propeller indexing and engine smoothness (Richard Sipp)
37. 10:01 PM - Re: trip to honduras (PittsS1@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Slow Starter |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Arnold de Brie" <ajdbrie@interestate.nl>
I struggled almost a year with this slow start problem too and it finally
turned out that I forgot the flexible ground cable between firewall and
engine.
Stupid or what??
Now I can almost taxi on cranking
Arnold de Brie
RV 8
The Netherlands
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: F-794A lower horizontal stabilizer/fuselage fairing |
--> RV-List message posted by: Rick Galati <rick6a@yahoo.com>
--> RV-List message posted by: RAMTHAXTON@aol.comAre there other ways to attach
this fairing to the fuselage. The plans call for countersinking the longeron
for # 6 screws and dimpling the fairing. Lookslike the countersink will go almost
all the way thru longeron which would leave little room for the 6/32 threads.Bob
Thaxton, RV-7QB, Indiana
I thought there had to be a better way and my solution was to simply bond the fairings
in place with good ol proseal. This provides the slickest means possible
of attaching the fairings, but good surface preparation (scuffing and cleaning)
before the bonding operation was emphasized. I masked the relevant areas
off, buttered the surfaces with a generous coating of proseal, the idea being
to deny any voids, then applied and clamped the fairings in place using small
c-clamps through the rear access holes and used clear packing tape to hold them
in place everywhere else. Looked for generous squeeze out around the entire
fairing(s), then let the proseal set up for a few days. Then I scraped off the
now hardened excess squeeze out with a nylon scraper and wiped away the remaining
residue with MEK. I've had more than one person scratch their head wondering
how I got those fairings attached.
Rick Galati RV-6A "finishing"
---------------------------------
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Slow Starter |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob U." <rv3@comcast.net>
Kyle Boatright wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright@adelphia.net>
>
>Bob,
>
>Do you have the weights of the two starters? I'm lookin' at some weight
>reducing upgrades to offset some weight adding upgrades I'm considering...
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>KB
>
The Prestolite was appx 16.4 pounds.
The automotive starter purchased from Air-Tec back in 2000 was a 1980
rebuilt Toyota truck, not the current Lexus version. From memory, it was
around 12 pounds. Not sure. A trip to the Lexus store with your scale in
hand would yield a more accurate picture.. or call Air-Tec. They can
give you accurate info. 1-800-366-4746.
Bob U.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Seager pattern and engine failure with CS hartzell prop |
--> RV-List message posted by: "lucky macy" <luckymacy@hotmail.com>
In a real engine out scenario, are you stuck with whatever the prop governor
is set at at time of engine failure?
When do you stop being able to control the pitch on a hydraulically operated
system during and engine failure? As long as the prop is windmilling do you
still have some control over pitch?
Also, I'm told that for pattern work Mike Seager teaches that with his FP 6,
you basically pull back power to idle abeam the touchdown point, more or
less immediately start your descending turn to base (what's his method for
establishing air speed/descent rate control), start to dial in half flaps,
clear final approach, turn again for final yourself, add remainder flaps on
final and all the while not to touch throttle unless you're going to land
short.
Is that right and with a CS prop do you fly the pattern differently?
thanks,
lucky
do not archive
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Message 5
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| Subject: | Slow starter redux |
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
Thanks to all for the input- Some more data: Battery is about 1.5 years old,
most of time on a shelf, but used for system checkout and occasionally
charged with smart charger. Contactors are on firewall with shortest possible
(mere
inches) of #4 welding cable connecting batt & contactors. Approx. 3' of #2
weld cable to direct-drive (no gearing) Delco-Remy boat anchor. Ground is #2
weld cable bolted to crankcase at base of dipstick tube, then to Bob's ground
lug on firewall next to battery. All fat lugs are crimped and soldered.
Most have mentioned high resistance connections but all check OK. Might just
"borrow" the Biddle meter from work and ring it out anyway. (Biddle meter is
an instrument used to accurately measure resistance in micro-ohms- we use it
to measure resistance spotweld gun secondaries- neat tool!)
Others cite that a healthy battery and motor work well, so plan is to
purchase fresh battery from DigiKey and go from there. Bob has warned us to get
a
fresh one for flying anyway!
Also talked to Dick Waters (Air-Tec) about his Lexus starter, but he is
unsure if it will fit the cowling on a -6 (his earlier models would not he says).
He is investigating and may send one anyway for a trial-fit.
Thanks again to all and especially to Bob- many of you know what a thrill it
is to start bringing your project to life and everything (mostly!) actually
WORKS!!
From The PossumWorks in TN
Mark - getting close............
Message 6
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| Subject: | Instrument panel cutting |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
> ________________________________ Message 13
____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:54:26 AM PST US
> From: "Wayne R. Couture" <commando@cox-internet.com>
> Subject: RV-List: Instrument panel cutting
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Wayne R. Couture"
<commando@cox-internet.com>
>
> Well, I just ruined my first instrument panel on my 8A and I have to
wonder
> if there's a better way! I searched the archives and found some options
but
> I can't see spending hundreds of dollars for a panel design program I'm
only going
> to use once, or spend months learning how to use it. I have no CAD
experience.
>
> There seems to be plenty of guy's that can cut it out, but how can I
get it
> designed without spending a fortune?
>
> Wayne
> RV-8A
> wiring
>
>
>Hi Wayne-
I did my panel layout with http://www.epanelbuilder.com/index.htm. I
liked the flexibility of the system, plus if you want a system or device
not currently listed on the website, they'll get it for you.
GM
Message 7
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| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 41 Msgs - 01/02/04 |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
>
>
> Time: 10:58:51 PM PST US
> From: "jgburns" <jgburns@comcast.net>
> Subject: RV-List: Wire and cable source?
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "jgburns" <jgburns@comcast.net>
>
> I spent a few hours today searching for a convenient Tefzell wire and
cable source.
> No joy.
> I'm not looking to for advice to use PVC low smoke plenum cable or other
products
> - I understand the trade-offs and may compromise.
>
> In summary:
> - Van's and Aircraft Spruce offers single Tefzell wire, not cable.
> - Local Albuquerque sources have to special order and they require huge
quantities.
> - On-line sources, such as WireMasters, Inc. may require large orders as
well and
> there's the wholesale hurdle.
>
> My immediate need is for 20 AWG, 7 conductor, unshielded cable.
>
> Can anyone point me to a reasonably priced source for low quantity orders?
>
> Thanks,
> John, 7A QB on the slow track
>
>
>Hi John-
The best deals I've gotten were from Airparts Inc, 800-800-3229
www.airpartsinc.com and Skycraft Parts and Surplus, Inc 407-628-5634
www.skycraftsurplus.com.
GM
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Slow starter redux |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob U." <rv3@comcast.net>
>Also talked to Dick Waters (Air-Tec) about his Lexus starter, but he is
>unsure if it will fit the cowling on a -6 (his earlier models would not he says).
>He is investigating and may send one anyway for a trial-fit.
>
>>From The PossumWorks in TN
>Mark - getting close..
>
IMO, the geared automotive starter is worth whatever you gotta do to
install it. In the case of my RV-3, the cowling didn't fit, either.
So... it was a matter of carving away what was needed to get clearance.
One of these days, I should cover the offending small 'cutout' with a
bubble to finish the job. However, it can wait until other mods are
completed. No need to repaint until then. YMMV.
Bob U.
do not archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | manual engine pre-oiler |
--> RV-List message posted by: "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314@earthlink.net>
In my old (2000/2001) Aircraft Spruce catalog I came across a manual
lever operated engine pre-oiler for $165. The Oilamatic product now
costs about $1200, so this is interesting. However, the Aircraft Spruce
on-line catalog doesn't show the product, so I guess they have dropped it.
Does any one know who makes this product or if it is still being made?
Does any body on the list have one or ever used on ?
Thanks,
--
Tom Sargent
RV-6A - drilling plexi.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Wire and cable source? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson@consolidated.net>
try this RV guy and see what he has....................
stein@steinair.com
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Slow Starter |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Alan McKeen" <amckeen@twcny.rr.com>
I recommend that you verify the slow starter problem cause first, before you invest
any money. Low battery would be the first thing to check. Wire/connectors
should be the next thing to check.
If the battery and wiring are in good shape, then a replacement starter may be
justified. I highly recommend the Air-Tec starter. It weighs a little more (~10
lbs. total weight) than the Sky-Tec but lacks the timing reference mark, has
provided me excellent service, and costs much less than any Sky-Tec or B&C
starters. It is a Nipppondenso from the Toyota/Lexus V6 engine with an adapter
bracket. This starter spins my O-320 over very briskly.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Wire and cable source? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>I spent a few hours today searching for a convenient Tefzel wire and cable
>source. No joy.
>I'm not looking to for advice to use PVC low smoke plenum cable or other
>products - I understand the trade-offs and may compromise.
>
>In summary:
>- Van's and Aircraft Spruce offers single Tefzel wire, not cable.
>- Local Albuquerque sources have to special order and they require huge
>quantities.
>- On-line sources, such as WireMasters, Inc. may require large orders as
>well and there's the wholesale hurdle.
>
>My immediate need is for 20 AWG, 7 conductor, unshielded cable.
>
>Can anyone point me to a reasonably priced source for low quantity orders?
>
>Thanks,
>John, 7A QB on the slow track
>
John,
Howdy neighbor. I found a very large spool of AWG16 Milspec wire at...of
all places....Jone's Surplus on Central. Ya just never know what you might
find there. They often buy up lots of wiring from Sandia Labs, and some of
it is aircraft grade stuff, that they don't even know that it is! I got a
helluva deal on it, to say the least. I still had to buy some smaller gauge
stuff for wiring radio and transponder and did so from Chief Aircraft. I've
had excellent dealings with them.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 51 VS underway
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Message 13
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| Subject: | manual engine pre-oiler |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
I wonder if anyone has used one of these: (from the infinity stick grip
guy) - http://www.infinityaerospace.com/
All-in-one electric Pre-Oiler and Back-Up Engine Oil Pump (a MUST have
for *ALL* engines, not just aircraft engines).
How this works: when you turn your Master Switch ON, the pump turns ON
and pressurizes your Engine Oil Pressure to about 60 PSI *before* engine
start -- remember, 87% of engine wear for ANY engine is from just
starting the engine. After you see about 60 PSI on your Oil Pressure
Gage, THEN start your engine. When the Engine Driven Mechanical Oil Pump
catches up, the Pre-Oiler pump automatically shuts off. If the Engine
Driven Mechanical Oil Pump were to ever fail (which does happen all too
often), the Pre-Oiler comes ON as a Back-Up Oil Pump. You're flying with
2 spark plugs, 2 ignition systems and 2 fuel pumps. Why are you flying
with just 1 oil pump?!?
Wondering which to choose?
The 3 lb. GP-301 Intermitent Duty model could probably be considered
Continuous Duty for aircraft for it should work just fine running for
several hours as a Back-Up Oil Pump. And it will eventually pump very
cold oil at start-up in very cold climates.
But, if you're operating over mountains a lot, and/or operating in
extremely cold weather a lot, and/or flying over water a LOT, I would
consider the GP-302 model [it's just 3 more lbs., and this is the model
I use -- take the extra 3 lbs. of weight out of you :-) ] :
GP301-12 -- 12 VDC / 60 PSI / 3 GPM - 11.4 LPM / 10 AMP CB / weight 3
lbs. Gear Pump for use as a Intermitent Duty Pre-Oiler and Back-Up Oil
Pump, or for the transfer of Lube Oil, Diesel Fuel, Antifreeze and
Water; bronze gears/stainless shafts, brass pump body with lip seal; -6
fittings -- $199.00 ($206.96 credit card price) plus S & H, and CA Sales
Tax (if you live in CA);
GP301-24 -- 24 VDC / 60 PSI / 3 GPM - 11.4 LPM / 10 AMP CB / weight 3
lbs. Gear Pump for use as a Intermitent Duty Pre-Oiler and Back-Up Oil
Pump, or for the transfer of Lube Oil, Diesel Fuel, Antifreeze and
Water; bronze gears/stainless shafts, brass pump body with lip seal; -6
fittings -- $199.00 ($206.96 credit card price) plus S & H, and CA Sales
Tax (if you live in CA);
GP302-12 -- 12 VDC / 60 PSI / 3 GPM - 23.1 LPM / 15 AMP CB / weight 6
lbs. Gear Pump for use as a Continuous Duty Pre-Oiler and Back-Up Oil
Pump, or for the transfer of Lube Oil, Diesel Fuel, Antifreeze and
Water; bronze gears/stainless shafts, brass pump body with lip seal; -6
fittings -- $360 ($374.40 credit card price) plus S & H, and CA Sales
Tax (if you live in CA);
GP302-24 -- 24 VDC / 60 PSI / 3 GPM - 23.1 LPM / 15 AMP CB / weight 6
lbs. Gear Pump for use as a Continuous Duty Pre-Oiler and Back-Up Oil
Pump, or for the transfer of Lube Oil, Diesel Fuel, Antifreeze and
Water; bronze gears/stainless shafts, brass pump body with lip seal; -6
fittings -- $360 ($374.40 credit card price) plus S & H, and CA Sales
Tax (if you live in CA);
Ed Holyoke
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of thomas a.
sargent
Subject: RV-List: manual engine pre-oiler
--> RV-List message posted by: "thomas a. sargent"
<sarg314@earthlink.net>
In my old (2000/2001) Aircraft Spruce catalog I came across a manual
lever operated engine pre-oiler for $165. The Oilamatic product now
costs about $1200, so this is interesting. However, the Aircraft Spruce
on-line catalog doesn't show the product, so I guess they have dropped
it.
Does any one know who makes this product or if it is still being made?
Does any body on the list have one or ever used on ?
Thanks,
--
Tom Sargent
RV-6A - drilling plexi.
==
==
==
==
Message 14
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"rv7-list@matronics.com" <rv7-list@matronics.com>
| Subject: | RV-7/8 wing rear spar question |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England <cengland@netdoor.com>
The instructions say to pre-dimple the top flange holes in the w707a
rear spar at the inboard doubler fork because of later limited access
but make no mention of whether to pre-dimple the top flanges of w707E &
F doublers & the matching top flange holes of the spar.
Did ya'll pre-dimple the flanges of w707E/F & their mating points on the
spar before riveting the doublers onto the spar?
Thanks,
Charlie
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Slow starter redux |
--> RV-List message posted by: Oldsfolks@aol.com
If you're getting a new battery,go with the Odyssey. I could'nt start my
O-320 on my 150 HP Lyc. most times when it was cold or if it didn't start right
off on a hot start.
I took out the $90 gel-cel and put it my antique Farmall runway mower. It
gave up there too!
Most RV'ers seem to use the Odyssey 680 but I went for lots of reserve and
put a 925 in our RV-4.
You won't want to go back to the old batteries I promise you.
Try
> http://batteriesamerica.com. < and look in aviation for the Odyssey.
Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
Charleston, Arkansas
"Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
Message 16
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| Subject: | Electric seat heat |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Kosta Lewis" <mikel@dimensional.com>
This came up several years ago and there were several vendors listed.
Yahoo lists 181,000 sites for "seat heaters". There are quite a few
companies that have heaters you can custom cut to your seats. If you
don't find any I will search in the "old" computer downstairs. Not all
the info transferred to this computer. Motorcycle heated vests and pants
are also an option. All are 12 volt plug-in or built in type.
Michael
Message 17
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| Subject: | RV-7/8 wing rear spar question |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dana Overall" <bo124rs@hotmail.com>
Charlie,
As I recall, the middle hinge bracket and the outboard hinge bracket get
riveted to the aft spar after the top skins are riveted on. The reason for
this is a couple skin rivets are positioned on top of those two brackets and
makes them almost impossible to buck. In this case, there is no reason to
pre-dimple those two area unless you just want to. You could also just
dimple the spar around the E & F and countersink the E & F. The inboard aft
spar, two holes outboard of the fifth rib, must be done before you rivet the
rear spar reinforcing fork and doubler plate as you would be unable to get a
dimple die into that area.
If this doesn't answer your question, give me a shout off list.
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY
RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic"
Finish kit
Buying Instruments. Hangar flying my Dynon.
http://rvflying.tripod.com
do not archive
>From: Charlie & Tupper England <cengland@netdoor.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>To: RV list <rv-list@matronics.com>, "rv7-list@matronics.com"
><rv7-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: RV-7/8 wing rear spar question
>Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2004 11:04:40 -0600
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie & Tupper England
><cengland@netdoor.com>
>
>The instructions say to pre-dimple the top flange holes in the w707a
>rear spar at the inboard doubler fork because of later limited access
>but make no mention of whether to pre-dimple the top flanges of w707E &
>F doublers & the matching top flange holes of the spar.
>
>Did ya'll pre-dimple the flanges of w707E/F & their mating points on the
>spar before riveting the doublers onto the spar?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Charlie
>
>
Expand your wine savvy and get some great new recipes at MSN Wine.
http://wine.msn.com
Message 18
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| Subject: | [ Ken Brooks ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> RV-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Ken Brooks <kenbrooks@charter.net>
Subject: Whirlwind 151-series Propeller Installation
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/kenbrooks@charter.net.01.03.2004/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
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Message 19
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| Subject: | CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... |
--> RV-List message posted by: czechsix@juno.com
Guys,
For those of you flying, do you find that the CHT on #4 (left aft
cylinder) tends to be the hottest? I've got an -8A with O-360-A1A if
that makes a difference, but I'd assume it's the same trend for any
Lycoming installation....
My reason for asking is that I'm pondering the placement of my oil
cooler. I plan to hang it on the firewall or engine mount and feed it
via a SCAT off the back baffle. In looking at the "normal" location of
mounting the cooler on the left side just behind cylinder #4, it seems to
me that it would exacerbate any cooling problems here because it would
allow some air to escape through the cooler that would otherwise go down
behind #4 and cool the critical exhaust port area.
I know the cooler won't fit on the RH side aft baffle, but since I'm not
mounting it on the baffle I could take the air off the RH side if it made
any difference in keeping the #4 CHT's more in line with the other jugs.
Thanks as always,
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A N2D FWF stuff....
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: seat fabric amount |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells@sympatico.ca>
> I have ordered the Vans foam seat cores and wondering how much fabric I
> need. I guess I could take my ruler and measure every inch of the drawings
> but if someone has prior experience I would appreciate it. Wayne RV7a
> S.Alberta
I ordered the same foam seat cores for my RV-9A. Very impressed with the
quality/price.
The fabric required for a seat core depends on the width of the fabric bolt
that you select. My fabric is 54" wide. I required three yards of
material. This includes seat bottom and back, seat booster and stick boot.
I will have enough fabric left over for a couple of side panels.
This is how I reached my requirements. I fitted the complete seat cores
(without the booster core) in the plane. You may have to trim the bottom
wedge depending on how you installed the back frame piano hinges. Then I
transferred the drawing to white bristle board with a ball point pen -
adjust for anything you trimmed off. Highlight the outlines in ink, then
cut them out. I used some string and weights to outline a 3 yard X 54"
frame on my living room floor. Then I positioned the shapes in the frame to
minimize waste. They fit within the frame, easily. Calculate your total
yardage based upon two seats, considering how much extra you want for other
panels. This all assumes ONE colour.
Your upholstery firm will appreciate the bristle board shapes as a template.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
90% Complete - Instruments/wiring
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Slow starter redux |
--> RV-List message posted by: smoothweasel@juno.com
DUDE!!!! MY 160 HP Lyc. doesn't have a O-320 to start on it....must
have something to do with the 150 HP model.
Peace Weasel
do not archive
If you're getting a new battery,go with the Odyssey. I couldn't start my
O-320 on my 150 HP Lyc.
Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
Charleston, Arkansas
"Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
=
=
=
=
Message 22
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| Subject: | RE: Whirlwind 151-series Propeller Installation |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" <Larry@BowenAero.com>
Very handsome. How much did that beauty cost?
-
Larry Bowen
Larry@BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Email List Photo Shares [mailto:pictures@matronics.com]
> Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2004 4:00 PM
> To: Email List Photo Shares
> Subject: RV-List: [ Ken Brooks ] : New Email List Photo Share
> Available!
>
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares
> --> <pictures@matronics.com>
>
>
> A new Email List Photo Share is available:
>
> Poster: Ken Brooks <kenbrooks@charter.net>
>
>
> Subject: Whirlwind 151-series Propeller Installation
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/kenbrooks@charter.net.01.0
> 3.2004/index.html
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Seager pattern and engine failure with CS hartzell prop |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr@petroblend.com>
Lucky,
I will answer some of your questions and then some comentary on engine out
with C/S props.
> --> RV-List message posted by: "lucky macy" <luckymacy@hotmail.com>
>
> In a real engine out scenario, are you stuck with whatever the prop
governor
> is set at at time of engine failure?
False, if the engine is windmilling and the oil pump and prop governor are
still working, you will still have control of the propellor even though the
engine is not producing power.
>
> When do you stop being able to control the pitch on a hydraulically
operated
> system during and engine failure? As long as the prop is windmilling do
you
> still have some control over pitch?
As stated above, True. If you lose oil pressure or the governor fails, a
standard Single engine C/S prop will go to low pitch/hi RPM. Some aerobatic
propellors fail to hi-pitch and low RPM so if the oil pump loses oil in a
gyroscopic manuver the engine won't over rev.
> Also, I'm told that for pattern work Mike Seager teaches that with his FP
6,
> you basically pull back power to idle abeam the touchdown point, more or
> less immediately start your descending turn to base (what's his method for
> establishing air speed/descent rate control), start to dial in half flaps,
> clear final approach, turn again for final yourself, add remainder flaps
on
> final and all the while not to touch throttle unless you're going to land
> short.
I agree with this method, it teaches you to sense the energy in the airplane
and adjust pattern size, flaps and speed. If you do this every time, when
you have a real engine failure, your chances of landing where you want to at
the desired airspeed are much better.
> Is that right and with a CS prop do you fly the pattern differently?
You can fly a much tighter pattern with a C/S prop because it has a
tremendous amount of drag in flat pitch/ High RPM.
With this information, then you could surmise that if the engine quits and
you still have oil pressure, you should pull the propellor back to hi
pitch/low rpm. This will dramatically increase your gliding distance and
reduce your rate of decent in an RV. When you have your selected field
"made" you could then push the prop ahead to get on the ground, but beware,
it will fall out of the sky like a load of brick when you do that.
I have taken my airplane up high over the airport and pulled the mixture to
find the rate of decent between prop forward and back. If you are not
comfortable with a deadstick landing, you may want to have an instructor
along in case for some reason it did not light up when you push the mixture
in. I don't know any reason why that would happen, but you never know.
Tailwinds,
Doug Rozendaal
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Seager pattern and engine failure with CS hartzell |
prop
--> RV-List message posted by: rmickey@ix.netcom.com
Lucky,
I spent a couple of days recently with Mike in his 6A, 160hp, CS. He taught me
differently than you stated in your email. Here is how he taught me.
- enter the patten at 17" mp and 2300 rpm
- abeam the number, pull throttle all the way back, push prop all the way forward,
hold alttitude
- at 100 mph, put in 20 degrees of flaps
- slow to 80 mph, push throttle to 1700 rpm, turn base
- put in 40 degres of flaps
- turn final
- when you are over the threshold, cut power
- at 3 foot above runway, level off
- hold altitude
- stall as your wheels touch
The pattern is very close in as the sink rate is high with a CS prop.
In my 180 hp, CS, 6A, I have to get slower and use less power to get the same close
pattern.
Ross Mickey
N9PT
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Exiting an RV in Flight - Ideas |
--> RV-List message posted by: Rob Prior <rv7@b4.ca>
Jeff Peltier wrote:
>>>--> RV-List message posted by: "RV_8 Pilot" <rv_8pilot@hotmail.com>
>>>Now this is one of the most important reasons I read The List. here's
>>>an example of something fairly easy to accomplish adding value. whether
>>>you use a cable reel, or length of nylon cord (carefully!) bound with a
>>>rubber band and velcro'd to your chute harness, it may still save your skin
>>>and cost little to nothing.
> Is the skin of your passengers really worth "little to nothing"? They may
> disagree.
>
> Jeff Peltier
In the computer industry, this is called spreading FUD about a product.
That's Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt. You're just casting a doubt on the
safety of body-worn parachutes over the supposed increased safety of a BRS
(which hasn't been proven).
It's the same marketing ploy that Cirrus uses to sell their airplanes to the
spouses of pilots. "This one has it's own parachute to save you from
accidents." Never mind the fact that it *presumes* an accident will occur,
and that the pilot *will not* be capable of dealing with it. It takes
advantage of people who don't understand flying, and who may happen to hold
some of the pursestrings when choosing to buy an aircraft.
-Rob
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
Mark,
Just playing devil's advocate here, but where would you derive the SCAT air
source for the oil cooler if you "remote" mount it? I figure the air's
gotta come from someplace, regardless of where the cooler itself is located,
and it'll always be stealing some measure of cooling from the cylinders.
Basically I'm theorizing that it won't make a difference to the cylinders
where the oil cooler is mounted. And if anything, if you mount it on the
baffle you can always build an air dam if you find your oil runs too
cool...which would in effect return some of that "stolen" air to the
cylinders.
Anyway, this is all theory...so let the experts chime in with the real
answers. 8-)
do not archive
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <czechsix@juno.com>
Subject: RV-List: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement...
> --> RV-List message posted by: czechsix@juno.com
>
> Guys,
>
> For those of you flying, do you find that the CHT on #4 (left aft
> cylinder) tends to be the hottest? I've got an -8A with O-360-A1A if
> that makes a difference, but I'd assume it's the same trend for any
> Lycoming installation....
>
> My reason for asking is that I'm pondering the placement of my oil
> cooler. I plan to hang it on the firewall or engine mount and feed it
> via a SCAT off the back baffle. In looking at the "normal" location of
> mounting the cooler on the left side just behind cylinder #4, it seems to
> me that it would exacerbate any cooling problems here because it would
> allow some air to escape through the cooler that would otherwise go down
> behind #4 and cool the critical exhaust port area.
>
> I know the cooler won't fit on the RH side aft baffle, but since I'm not
> mounting it on the baffle I could take the air off the RH side if it made
> any difference in keeping the #4 CHT's more in line with the other jugs.
>
> Thanks as always,
>
> --Mark Navratil
> Cedar Rapids, Iowa
> RV-8A N2D FWF stuff....
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... |
You may be on to something here Mark. I have a firewall mounted oilcooler
fed by a 3" scat tube off the right rear baffle on my 8A, O-360-A1A and my
hottest cylinder is always no. 3!
Ron
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld
--> RV-List message posted by: "van Bladeren, Ron" <rwv@nwnatural.com>
-----Original Message-----
From: czechsix@juno.com <czechsix@juno.com>
Subject: RV-List: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement...
--> RV-List message posted by: czechsix@juno.com
Guys,
For those of you flying, do you find that the CHT on #4 (left aft
cylinder) tends to be the hottest? I've got an -8A with O-360-A1A if
that makes a difference, but I'd assume it's the same trend for any
Lycoming installation....
My reason for asking is that I'm pondering the placement of my oil
cooler. I plan to hang it on the firewall or engine mount and feed it
via a SCAT off the back baffle. In looking at the "normal" location of
mounting the cooler on the left side just behind cylinder #4, it seems to
me that it would exacerbate any cooling problems here because it would
allow some air to escape through the cooler that would otherwise go down
behind #4 and cool the critical exhaust port area.
I know the cooler won't fit on the RH side aft baffle, but since I'm not
mounting it on the baffle I could take the air off the RH side if it made
any difference in keeping the #4 CHT's more in line with the other jugs.
Thanks as always,
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A N2D FWF stuff....
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: manual engine pre-oiler |
--> RV-List message posted by: <klwerner@comcast.net>
Dear Tom,
The 2003/2004 Aircraft Spruce shows a product called "PROLUBER ENGINE PRE-OILER"
on page 270 (P/N 08-00197) for $465.00
Good Luck,
Konrad
----- Original Message -----
From: thomas a. sargent
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2004 8:05 AM
Subject: RV-List: manual engine pre-oiler
--> RV-List message posted by: "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314@earthlink.net>
In my old (2000/2001) Aircraft Spruce catalog I came across a manual
lever operated engine pre-oiler for $165. The Oilamatic product now
costs about $1200, so this is interesting. However, the Aircraft Spruce
on-line catalog doesn't show the product, so I guess they have dropped it.
Does any one know who makes this product or if it is still being made?
Does any body on the list have one or ever used on ?
Thanks,
--
Tom Sargent
RV-6A - drilling plexi.
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: >Re:Slow starter redux |
--> RV-List message posted by: Oldsfolks@aol.com
Mark;
You should go for the Odysset battery to get one which will give you the very
best service and longest life.
I took the gel-cel out of our RV-4 and put it in the runway mower(Antique
Farmall tractor). I put in an Odyssey 925 and I haven't been able to weaken it
in
cold or hot starts. It just keeps going & going. Most RV'ers are using the
680,a little smaller.
Yuo can find lots on this in ths archives,too.
I promise you'll like the Odyssey battery.
NO, I don't have an interest in Odyssey,just a happy user.
Try: > http://batteriesamerica.com < & look under aircraft.
Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
Charleston, Arkansas
"Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: CHT #4 and oil cooler placement... |
--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
In a message dated 1/3/2004 2:00:03 PM Pacific Standard Time,
czechsix@juno.com writes:
For those of you flying, do you find that the CHT on #4 (left aft
cylinder) tends to be the hottest? I've got an -8A with O-360-A1A if
that makes a difference, but I'd assume it's the same trend for any
Lycoming installation.
No. #3 is usually by far the hottest. #4 runs very cool. Oil Cooler on
baffle behind #4 is what I would advise. Just make sure you reinforce this area
as the cooler is quite massive when full of oil.
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 675 hrs)
Message 31
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| Subject: | Flap motor failure |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry2DT@aol.com
Listers...
Recently we've repaired the electric flap motor in our RV6a twice in 30
hours. Upon searching the archives I see others have had the problem, consisting
of
goop accumulating on the brushes. I've asked the manufacturer of the motor
about it and they are "unaware of any problem", and suggested I just "continue
what you're doing to fix it". I guess this means disassembly every 30 hours or
so. Both times it has failed the flaps were in the up position, and we were
close to home, luckily. The first time, it did give a bit of warning with
intermittent flap operation, the second time it just plain quit.
I would like to ask others who have experience with this problem to weigh
in, either on this board or by email, so I can give them a better idea of the
scope of the problem. Thanks to all.
Jerry Cochran
-6a flying
-6a building
Message 32
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| Subject: | travel to central america |
--> RV-List message posted by: "tom coggin" <motniggo@localnet.com>
I am hoping to fly to the Bay Islands of Honduras by way of Key West, Florida then
to Cancun, Mexico for fuel only and then to Roatan, Honduras.Does Honduras
require prior written notice? Does Guatemala require prior written notice to
overfly along the coast? Will Mexico require customs, insurance and fees just
for a fuel stop? If so, I might have the range to make it to Belize City. I know
I can get this info by joining (paying $39.00) Baja Bush Pilots. Thanks for
the free info.
Message 33
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| Subject: | trip to honduras |
--> RV-List message posted by: "tom coggin" <motniggo@localnet.com>
I am hoping to fly to the Bay Islands of Honduras by way of Key West, Florida then
to Cancun, Mexico for fuel only and then to Roatan, Honduras.Does Honduras
require prior written notice? Does Guatemala require prior written notice to
overfly along the coast? Will Mexico require customs, insurance and fees just
for a fuel stop? If so, I might have the range to make it to Belize City. I know
I can get this info by joining (paying $39.00) Baja Bush Pilots. Thanks for
the free info.
Tom Coggin
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Flap motor failure |
--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
In a message dated 1/3/2004 5:55:42 PM Pacific Standard Time,
Jerry2DT@aol.com writes:
Recently we've repaired the electric flap motor in our RV6a twice in 30
hours. Upon searching the archives I see others have had the problem,
consisting of
goop accumulating on the brushes. I've asked the manufacturer of the motor
about it and they are "unaware of any problem", and suggested I just
"continue
what you're doing to fix it". I guess this means disassembly every 30 hours
or
so. Both times it has failed the flaps were in the up position, and we were
close to home, luckily. The first time, it did give a bit of warning with
intermittent flap operation, the second time it just plain quit.
This is surprising. I've got 600+ hrs on my Motion Industries (at least was
what Van's was using when I bought in the early 90's) flap actuator without a
hint of a problem. Is yours the same brand? IIRC the Motion unit has a
Pittman brand motor on it. Pittman is one of the top names in electric motors,
so
what's really going on here? Where is the goop coming from?
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 675 hrs)
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Wire and cable source? |
--> RV-List message posted by: flmike <flmike2001@yahoo.com>
Skycraft lists some 7 conductor 20 gauge (shielded
though) as "aircraft" about halfway down the page at:
http://skycraftsurplus.com/Table6.htm
You might give then a call and see if they can tell
you exactly what it is.
Mike
__________________________________
http://photos.yahoo.com/
Message 36
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|
| Subject: | Re: propeller indexing and engine smoothness |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Sipp" <rsipp@earthlink.net>
I can second Bill's suggestion in the following post. We re-indexed a fixed
pitch Sensinich on a low compression O-360 powered RV8A today. The owner,
who had been complaining of vibration, said the change made a very
significant improvement. This after trying everything else we could think
of. The prop had been dynamically balanced previously and required only
required a few grams to balance to .04 IPS. We removed this small weight
along with the re-indexing and still saw the significant improvement.
Dick Sipp
RV4 250DS RV10 110DV
SportAV8R@aol.com
>
> Over the weekend I had to pull the cowl and prop to make repairs on a
broken aluminum alternator tension arm, and thought while I had the prop off
anyway I would try a suggestion I had read about in the Sky Ranch
Engineering Manual. It says that a flat four engine will run more smoothly
if the prop is indexed to be in the same plane as the crank pins, meaning it
is horizontal when the pistons are at top or bottom dead center. This
orientation is 60 degrees away from the indexing that is traditional for
Lycomings, which is a concession to ease of hand-propping.
>
> Well, I tried it and it works. The difference in smoothness was noticable
from very first startup, and the engine is (subjectively) smoother at all
rpm ranges. The prop now stops at about 1 o'clock position viewed from the
front, as opposed to the traditional 10 o'clock position. The compression
stroke is felt much lower down in the swing, making it indeed very awkward
and dangerous to hand prop as you have to bend way over to pull it through.
But since I never hand prop my plane, I consider it worth the trade off. I'm
going to take a wild guess and say the vibration level is about half what it
was before. I find myself now wondering if the dynamic balance I was
considering before would even be worth the cost and effort. Now, if only we
could solve the exhaust pulse floor vibration as easily ;-)
>
> -Bill Boyd
>
>
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: trip to honduras |
--> RV-List message posted by: PittsS1@aol.com
honduras..tegus..i've been there. 1st time in a PBY, the following year my
ride home was in a.....in a F4U-4 Corsair.... the trip of a lifetime.
semper fi,
mike
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