Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:53 AM - Re: Unleaded 100 Octane (linn walters)
2. 10:50 AM - test (bertrv6@highstream.net)
3. 11:19 AM - eis question (bertrv6@highstream.net)
4. 11:44 AM - New builder.... (copperhead)
5. 12:08 PM - Re: eis question (Brian Alley)
6. 12:14 PM - Re: eis question (linn walters)
7. 12:23 PM - Re: eis question (Brian Denk)
8. 02:08 PM - Re: New builder.... (Ross Schlotthauer)
9. 02:23 PM - Re: New builder.... ()
10. 04:10 PM - "Frozen" Screws (John)
11. 04:35 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (Alex Peterson)
12. 05:57 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (Doug Weiler)
13. 06:16 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (linn walters)
14. 06:31 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (Richard E. Tasker)
15. 06:36 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (Ned Thomas)
16. 07:52 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (Jim Jewell)
17. 08:55 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (bryan hooks)
18. 09:21 PM - Torx screws 100 degree-historical info - was Re: "Frozen" Screws (David Carter)
19. 09:55 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (Mickey Coggins)
20. 10:47 PM - Re: "Frozen" Screws (Ed Holyoke)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Unleaded 100 Octane |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
thomas a. sargent wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314@earthlink.net>
>
>I think 100-NoLead probably is possible, but I don't think the metal
>additives are the reason for the real threat to 100LL. The problem, as
>I understand it, is that 100LL is, by comparison a very small part of
>the gasoline market and the oil refiners just don't want to bother with
>it. Very few refineries (8 as of a year or 2 ago) still make the stuff.
>
>If some one can correct me on this, please do. I have an IO360-B2B which
>will get hung on my plane next month. I'd sure like to know that I'll
>have a source of 100 oct. fuel for it well into the future.
>--
>Tom Sargent - RV-6A, Landing Gear.
>
>Donald Mei wrote:
>
Your IO360 will run quite well on mogas. Mine's an A4A in my Pitts
...... and I abuse the heck out of it running hi-test (92). I do not
have lead fouling problems which used to occur every 10 hrs or so. I,
for one, won't miss 100LL. However, if you're really hung up on 100LL,
be assured that the environmentalists will take issue with the lead and
whatever replacement the Feds agree on will work just fine ....... but
'works fine' is a subjectie term. Right now we have one fuel that
replaced 80 and 100/130 and 'works fine' includes digging lead rocks out
of the plugs periodically. Maybe we'll get a car-gas derrivative with a
'vapor pressure modifier' as an additive!!!
Linn
>
>
>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Donald Mei" <don_mei@hotmail.com>
>>
>>Dear All,
>>
>>There is continuous discussion of "the demise of 100ll". I was recently
>>refered to this info by a mutual car nut. If Sunoco can get 100 Oct without
>>any "metal additives", whats to prevent the same thing from replacing 100
>>LL.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 2
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--> RV-List message posted by: bertrv6@highstream.net
test hi
Message 3
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--> RV-List message posted by: bertrv6@highstream.net
Hi:
Recently Started my engine, first time, everything showed OK for
about 30 seconds, and then my EIS (GRAND RIPIDS TECHNOLOGIES)UNIT WENT
BLANK..
I stoped the engine then. With engine off, I turned master switch
on, and unit came to live, normally..
I have not started engine second time, as I have been doing other things
Does any one have any ideas or suggestions, as to why this happened?
I have not called Company as yet...
thanks for any comments..
Bert
rv6a
Getting close...
Do Not archive
Message 4
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--> RV-List message posted by: "copperhead" <copperhead@tcmax.net>
Well after much lurking, visiting different projects, and encouragement from other
RV builders (such as Rick in Nevada), I have stepped off into the deep water.
It took several visits out to the college to participate in numerous experiments
and selling vast quantities of various body fluids, but I finally got
the money and I am now the proud owner of an -9 empennage and complete tool kit.
After looking over the plans, I must say I am excitedly scared at the prospect
of building this machine. This is gonna be GREAT!
I anticipate ordering the wing kit by the end of the summer as I have a few other
projects to complete first (including a wedding), plus my back just wouldn't
hold up to the late night dancing at the club which threw my finances a little
off. The paper route is going well though, plus the whole lottery thing each
week, so hopefully I should be back on top by then.
I am located in Southeast Missouri and looking to hook up with a tech counselor
as I want it done the best I can possibly make it. I have received a contact
list from EAA which I plan on utilizing, unless someone wants to step forward
or has a better idea. I would also like to co-mingle with other builders in
the area.
One of the final decisions on this particular project was the RV family. Each
person seems genuinely concerned about every aspect of this hobby and goes out
of their way to show it. I have been greatly impressed with the overall attitude
of RVer's which made me want to be a part. Thanks for the opportunity to
participate with such a distinquished group.
BTW, I have an extra set of preview plans for sale (its a long, sad story). I
would consider a trade for a wing kit or maybe a set of those nomex shorts.
Chuck in Missouri #90662
99.9% to go (still trying to get the box opened)
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: eis question |
--> RV-List message posted by: Brian Alley <n320wt@yahoo.com>
Bert, I have an EIS in my 0320 W-10 Tailwind. It has
on rare occasion done exactly as you describe. It has
never happened in flight and has always been remedied
by a power cycle. Still, I would contact Grand Rapids
and have a note placed in your customer file or insist
on a repair or replacement if you have not begun
flying with it yet!!!
=====
BRIAN ALLEY (N320WT)
CARBON FIBER COMPOSITES
304-872-7938 shop
304-562-6800 home
How are you going to win by a nose if you don't stick out your neck?
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: eis question |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
bertrv6@highstream.net wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: bertrv6@highstream.net
>
>
> Hi:
>
> Recently Started my engine, first time, everything showed OK for
>about 30 seconds, and then my EIS (GRAND RIPIDS TECHNOLOGIES)UNIT WENT
>BLANK..
>
> I stoped the engine then. With engine off, I turned master switch
>on, and unit came to live, normally..
>
> I have not started engine second time, as I have been doing other things
> Does any one have any ideas or suggestions, as to why this happened?
>
Well, I'd suspect a loose connection to either power or ground. I
wouldn't be surprised in a new installation
Linn
>
>
> I have not called Company as yet...
>
>
> thanks for any comments..
>
>
> Bert
>
>
> rv6a
>
> Getting close...
>
>
>Do Not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
> Hi:
>
> Recently Started my engine, first time, everything showed OK for
>about 30 seconds, and then my EIS (GRAND RIPIDS TECHNOLOGIES)UNIT WENT
>BLANK..
>
> I stoped the engine then. With engine off, I turned master switch
>on, and unit came to live, normally..
>
> I have not started engine second time, as I have been doing other
>things
> Does any one have any ideas or suggestions, as to why this happened?
>
>
> I have not called Company as yet...
>
>
> thanks for any comments..
>
>
> Bert
>
>
> rv6a
>
Check bus voltage with alternator (engine) running. I suspect an over or
undervoltage condition might be present due to failed regulator or
overvoltage protection.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
Check out the coupons and bargains on MSN Offers! http://youroffers.msn.com
Message 8
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Ross Schlotthauer" <rv7maker@hotmail.com>
Chuck,
Congratulations. I will trade you a set of RV-7A Tip up canopy and gear
installation drawing for your 9 preview plans. I will also throw in a
scrapped out elevator skin that contains one extra hole.
Welcome to the party,
Ross
Ross Schlotthauer
RV-7 Slider, wiring
www.experimentalair.com
>From: "copperhead" <copperhead@tcmax.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: New builder....
>Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 13:44:57 -0500
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "copperhead" <copperhead@tcmax.net>
>
>Well after much lurking, visiting different projects, and encouragement
>from other RV builders (such as Rick in Nevada), I have stepped off into
>the deep water. It took several visits out to the college to participate
>in numerous experiments and selling vast quantities of various body fluids,
>but I finally got the money and I am now the proud owner of an -9 empennage
>and complete tool kit. After looking over the plans, I must say I am
>excitedly scared at the prospect of building this machine. This is gonna
>be GREAT!
>
>I anticipate ordering the wing kit by the end of the summer as I have a few
>other projects to complete first (including a wedding), plus my back just
>wouldn't hold up to the late night dancing at the club which threw my
>finances a little off. The paper route is going well though, plus the
>whole lottery thing each week, so hopefully I should be back on top by
>then.
>
>I am located in Southeast Missouri and looking to hook up with a tech
>counselor as I want it done the best I can possibly make it. I have
>received a contact list from EAA which I plan on utilizing, unless someone
>wants to step forward or has a better idea. I would also like to co-mingle
>with other builders in the area.
>
>One of the final decisions on this particular project was the RV family.
>Each person seems genuinely concerned about every aspect of this hobby and
>goes out of their way to show it. I have been greatly impressed with the
>overall attitude of RVer's which made me want to be a part. Thanks for the
>opportunity to participate with such a distinquished group.
>
>BTW, I have an extra set of preview plans for sale (its a long, sad story).
> I would consider a trade for a wing kit or maybe a set of those nomex
>shorts.
>
>Chuck in Missouri #90662
>99.9% to go (still trying to get the box opened)
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: New builder.... |
--> RV-List message posted by: <groves@epix.net>
Congrats Chuck!!
You are going to love it..Have fun
Kirk RV-8 wings
>
> From: "copperhead" <copperhead@tcmax.net>
> Date: 2004/05/11 Tue PM 02:44:57 EDT
> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RV-List: New builder....
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "copperhead" <copperhead@tcmax.net>
>
> Well after much lurking, visiting different projects, and encouragement from
other RV builders (such as Rick in Nevada), I have stepped off into the deep water.
It took several visits out to the college to participate in numerous experiments
and selling vast quantities of various body fluids, but I finally got
the money and I am now the proud owner of an -9 empennage and complete tool
kit. After looking over the plans, I must say I am excitedly scared at the prospect
of building this machine. This is gonna be GREAT!
>
> I anticipate ordering the wing kit by the end of the summer as I have a few other
projects to complete first (including a wedding), plus my back just wouldn't
hold up to the late night dancing at the club which threw my finances a little
off. The paper route is going well though, plus the whole lottery thing
each week, so hopefully I should be back on top by then.
>
> I am located in Southeast Missouri and looking to hook up with a tech counselor
as I want it done the best I can possibly make it. I have received a contact
list from EAA which I plan on utilizing, unless someone wants to step forward
or has a better idea. I would also like to co-mingle with other builders in
the area.
>
> One of the final decisions on this particular project was the RV family. Each
person seems genuinely concerned about every aspect of this hobby and goes out
of their way to show it. I have been greatly impressed with the overall attitude
of RVer's which made me want to be a part. Thanks for the opportunity
to participate with such a distinquished group.
>
> BTW, I have an extra set of preview plans for sale (its a long, sad story).
I would consider a trade for a wing kit or maybe a set of those nomex shorts.
>
> Chuck in Missouri #90662
> 99.9% to go (still trying to get the box opened)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 10
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0.3 FROM_HAS_MIXED_NUMS From: contains numbers mixed in with letters
--> RV-List message posted by: "John" <n1cxo320@salidaco.com>
On occassion I find screws (#8 particularly) that stick and refuse to the
removed...some so bad they have to be drilled out.
I just finished my annual condition inspection and found three of the frozen
screws...I replaced them (and others that were removed to open inspection
plates, fairings, etc) with new stainless screws and put a dab of grease on
the threads, hoping it will prevent screws from freeziing in their nut
plates.
I wondered: Would Torx-head screws be a better bet? The Phillips heads seem
to simply 'ream out' too readily.
What has worked for you?
John
Message 11
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson@earthlink.net>
> On occassion I find screws (#8 particularly) that stick and
> refuse to the removed...some so bad they have to be drilled out.
Use a little wax on the threads. For a buck, you can buy a toilet wax
ring, should last through about 100 747's. Don't use grease, it will
streak and generally not work anyway.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 463 hours
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: "Frozen" Screws |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Weiler" <dougweil@pressenter.com>
>
> > On occassion I find screws (#8 particularly) that stick and
> > refuse to the removed...some so bad they have to be drilled out.
>
> Use a little wax on the threads. For a buck, you can buy a toilet wax
> ring, should last through about 100 747's. Don't use grease, it will
> streak and generally not work anyway.
>
> Alex Peterson
> Maple Grove, MN
> RV6-A N66AP 463 hours
I also used the toilet wax ring techniques especially the first time I
inserted new screws into new nutplates.
Works great!!
Doug Weiler
RV-4 in the paint shop in Tuscaloosa, AL
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: "Frozen" Screws |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
John wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "John" <n1cxo320@salidaco.com>
>
>On occassion I find screws (#8 particularly) that stick and refuse to the
>removed...some so bad they have to be drilled out.
>
>I just finished my annual condition inspection and found three of the frozen
>screws...I replaced them (and others that were removed to open inspection
>plates, fairings, etc) with new stainless screws and put a dab of grease on
>the threads, hoping it will prevent screws from freeziing in their nut
>plates.
>
>I wondered: Would Torx-head screws be a better bet? The Phillips heads seem
>to simply 'ream out' too readily.
>
>What has worked for you?
>
Buy a can of 'anti-sieze' at your local auto parts place. It's messy,
but you won't have to drill them out again!
Linn
But to answer your question ..... yes, Torx would be better than Phillips.
>
>John
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: "Frozen" Screws |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker@optonline.net>
If you decide on torx, this is where to get them.
http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
I am going to use them.
Dick Tasker, RV9A # 90573
John wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "John" <n1cxo320@salidaco.com>
>
>On occassion I find screws (#8 particularly) that stick and refuse to the
>removed...some so bad they have to be drilled out.
>
>I just finished my annual condition inspection and found three of the frozen
>screws...I replaced them (and others that were removed to open inspection
>plates, fairings, etc) with new stainless screws and put a dab of grease on
>the threads, hoping it will prevent screws from freeziing in their nut
>plates.
>
>I wondered: Would Torx-head screws be a better bet? The Phillips heads seem
>to simply 'ream out' too readily.
>
>What has worked for you?
>
>John
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: "Frozen" Screws |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ned Thomas" <923te@cox.net>
Be careful about the torx or even the square hole screws as they are
generally not as strong as phillips head screws. One company makes the
square head #8 screws with a smaller hole than standard in order to give
greater strength to the screw. If interested I'll have to do a little
searching to find out who it is.
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: "Frozen" Screws |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Jim Jewell" <jjewell@telus.net>
The "square hole" screws are actually called Robertson screws.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ned Thomas" <923te@cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: "Frozen" Screws
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Ned Thomas" <923te@cox.net>
>
> Be careful about the torx or even the square hole screws as they are
> generally not as strong as phillips head screws. One company makes the
> square head #8 screws with a smaller hole than standard in order to give
> greater strength to the screw. If interested I'll have to do a little
> searching to find out who it is.
>
>
Message 17
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--> RV-List message posted by: "bryan hooks" <hook3607@bellsouth.net>
I'm interested. Are the torx screws that microfastener sells weaker
than normal Phillips heads? I'd planned on using these in a few places
and wasn't aware that they weren't as strong.
Bryan Hooks
RV-7A, Slow...very slow
Knoxville, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ned Thomas
Subject: Re: RV-List: "Frozen" Screws
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ned Thomas" <923te@cox.net>
Be careful about the torx or even the square hole screws as they are
generally not as strong as phillips head screws. One company makes the
square head #8 screws with a smaller hole than standard in order to
give
greater strength to the screw. If interested I'll have to do a little
searching to find out who it is.
==
==
==
==
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: "Frozen" Screws |
--> RV-List message posted by: "David Carter" <dcarter@datarecall.net>
I've pasted 2 or 3 e-mails at the bottom of this that give the last/latest
info I saw & filed in "My Documents".
Summary: The Torx ("6 lobe") -8 screws were originally made for -20 Torx
driver bit. Some torque testing was done and the original batch of screws
was replaced with screws for the -15 (smaller) driver bit - at no charge.
So, see the e-mails down at the bottom of this for more details, prices, web
site/source.
David Carter
----- Original Message -----
From: "bryan hooks" <hook3607@bellsouth.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: "Frozen" Screws
> --> RV-List message posted by: "bryan hooks" <hook3607@bellsouth.net>
>
> I'm interested. Are the torx screws that microfastener sells weaker
> than normal Phillips heads? I'd planned on using these in a few places
> and wasn't aware that they weren't as strong.
>
> Bryan Hooks
> RV-7A, Slow...very slow
> Knoxville, TN
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ned Thomas
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: "Frozen" Screws
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Ned Thomas" <923te@cox.net>
>
> Be careful about the torx or even the square hole screws as they are
> generally not as strong as phillips head screws. One company makes the
> square head #8 screws with a smaller hole than standard in order to
> give
> greater strength to the screw. If interested I'll have to do a little
> searching to find out who it is.
>
- - - - - - - - - - - -
Historical e-mails pasted here:
1st E-mail:
AeroElectric-List message posted by: BAKEROCB@aol.com
10/18/2002
Hello Fellow Builders, Stainless steel, flat head, 100 degree countersink,
six lobe recess drive*, screws are now available in the following sizes with
Micro Fastener catalog numbers in ( ).
4-40X1/2 (FCMXS0408) T8 recess
6-32X ? (not quite available yet, but soon. Check with John at Micro
Fasteners)
8X32-5/8 (FCMXS0810) T15 recess**
10X32-3/4 (FCMXS1112) T20 recess
**You may recall that a previous batch of the 8X32 screws had T20 recess
drives. These screw heads did not have adequate strength and Micro Fastener
is shipping replacement T15 drive 8X32 screws to all who purchased the
earlier batch.
I'd like to emphasize that these are special configuration screws that are
not available elsewhere. Also these screws are intended for use in amateur
built experimental aircraft. While these screws were not manufactured to
NASM
/ MS 24694 standards I have personally installation tested the 8X32 size
screws and have received a report of strength testing that gives me
confidence in using these screws in my aircraft for structural purposes such
as fastening aluminum hinges to composite control and flight surfaces.
The decision to use these screws and the manner of their use rests with the
individual builder.
You may contact Micro Fasteners at: 800-892-6917 or email
<<info@microfasteners.com>> web site is <<http://microfasteners.com>>
I request that you relay this posting to any group that you may be part of
that has members that could be interested in this information. Thank you.
'OC' Baker, Builder of KIS TR-1 #116 4/14/97 - ?/?/?
*PS: While there is no longer a patent in force for Torx drive screws the
name Torx is still a registered trademark. So manufacturers are making
screws
and drive tools entirely compatible with the Torx configuration and various
T
sizes, but not using the Torx name.
- - - - - - - - -
2nd e-mail:
Hi Don;
You can go direct to them and buy at;
http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
FCMXS0408 100 4-40 x 1/2 $ 8.50
FCMXS0810 100 8-32 x 5/8 $ 14.50
FCMXS1112 100 10-32 x 3/4 $ 15.80
S. Todd Bartrim
Turbo 13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (FWF)
C-FSTB
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
3rd e-mail (torque test results - test which prompted change from T20 to T15
drive on -8 screws)
9/4/2002
Hello Fellow Builders, I have some bad news and some good news. The bad news
is that I don't think the current supply of subject screws from Micro
Fasteners is of adequate strength for structural purposes such as installing
control surface hinges on composite aircraft. The good news is that John
Fleisher hasn't given up on us.
Let me explain. I bought a supply of the subject screws from MF and gave
them
a rudimentary comparative installation strength test. The test consisted of
putting four separate AN 365 alloy steel nuts in a vise then screwing in one
of four different 8 X 32 screws into each nut using a torque wrench until
something failed. I will give the results for the four different screws
below:
A) Alloy steel MS24694 structual machine screw (minimum tensile strength of
125,000 PSI). Drive: Phillips. Failure torque: 32 in lbs. Remarks: Phillips
bit cammed out of head, unable to tighten any further.
B) 4037 high molybdenum steel alloy through hardened to surface Rockwell C
38-44 and having a tensile strength of 137-150 ksi. These screws were made
per the reqts of ANSI/ASME B18.3 of 1986. Drive: 3/32 inch hex socket
(Allen). Failure torque: 50 in lbs. Remarks: Screw socket stripped. (These
screws were obtained from MF some time ago as a special order and were very
expensive).
C) 302 stainless steel, unhardened, with tensile strength of 85 ksi min.
Made
per the reqts of ANSI/ASME B18.3 of 1986. Drive: 3/32 inch hex socket
(Allen). Failure torque: 30 in lbs. Remarks: Screw socket stripped. (These
screws were obtained from MF some time ago as a special order and were very
expensive).
D) 302 stainless steel. Drive: Torx 20. Failure torque: 50 in lbs. Remarks:
Screw head sheared off. Just obtained recently from MF. See further remarks
below.
Let me try to add some perspective / caveats to the above home grown tests.
These are what I called "installation failure tests". The screws failed as I
deliberately overstressed them with a torque wrench while simulating their
installation. This does not mean that they would suffer installation failure
as a person would install (or remove) them in a normal prudent manner.
An "installation failure" is not the same as an "in service failure" in my
terminology. For example if you installed non defective examples of either
screw A) or screw B) satisfactorily in your structure and then that
structure, while in service, placed a stress upon those screws they would
obviously withstand a greater load than satisfactorily installed
nondefective
screws C) or D) simply by virtue of the material that they were made of
aside
from any design considerations.
But I feel that screw D) does have a too high "in service failure" potential
caused by its design.. I say this based on my examination of the sheared off
screw head and shank. There just does not apprear to be enough material
left
between the screw shank and the screw head because of the size of the Torx
20
cavity. I do not plan to use them.
Where do we go from here? I'm not sure. I've already alerted John Fleisher
to
my concerns and he has responded with an email that I have copied below. I
have two recommendations:
1) Please pass this entire posting on to any group that you are a part of
that may be interested in this subject and who will not see it through just
this posting.
2) Let's let John work the problem for a while -- please be patient.
Manufacturing and stocking issues are also very significant financial issues
for small businessmen and they require some time to resolve.
As a final point of this posting I would point out that there are standard
specification structural fasteners (such as MS 24694 machine screws
--Phillips drive) and non structural fasteners (such as MS 24693 machine
screws -- Phillips drive) of various tensile strengths available to us as
builders of amateur built experimental aircraft.
What fasteners we choose to use and why we choose them are, within some
bounds of reason and common sense, the choice of the individual builder.
Please respect your fellow builder's prerogative to make that choice --
after
all, he is an experimenter.
Below my signature line follows the email that I received from John
Fleisher.
'OC' Baker, Builder of KIS TR-1 #116 4/14/97 - ?/?/?
Subj: Re: 8-32x5/8 100 degree flat head torx screws
From: microfasteners@hotmail.com (John Fleisher)
OC, I've been concerned about them since I got Camcar's technical book
onTorx
+ and saw that they recommend a T15 for 8-32 flat heads and we used aT20. I
had tried to twist them off here before then, and couldn't, so Irelaxed.
I had asked our manufacturer before ordering them about the size, and he
being less than the most communicative guy in the world said T20 was
the largest he could put on that head. When I spoke with him again today he
said T15 would be a lot easier. He's making up a new lot with the T15 heads
and we'll send you some in a week or two. Also of course we will replace any
we have shipped, to you and to others.
We continue to think that our guy is a competent mfr; this time around we'll
get some verification of the quality before shipping them.
Thanks for the headsup. John Micro Fasteners
Message 19
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--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
I guess a related question might be are there places
on the plans that show the use of phillips screws for
structural fastening? I'm not aware of any, but...
Mickey
>I'm interested. Are the torx screws that microfastener sells weaker
>than normal Phillips heads? I'd planned on using these in a few places
>and wasn't aware that they weren't as strong.
>>Be careful about the torx or even the square hole screws as they are
>>generally not as strong as phillips head screws. ...
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
Message 20
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
The torx screws in question are stainless and are not as strong as the
cad plated steel ones. I asked Van's if there would be a problem using
those screws in the place of the Phillips screws supplied with the kit.
Their reply was that there was no structural reason not to, but that
they haven't had any problems with the Phillips screws and, that since
you'd probably never have to pull the fuel tanks off anyway, you
wouldn't ever strip the heads on them and if you did, they'd be cheap
enough to replace. Stainless screws would also be harder to stick paint
to. I'm undecided still.
Ed Holyoke
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
Subject: RE: RV-List: "Frozen" Screws
--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
I guess a related question might be are there places
on the plans that show the use of phillips screws for
structural fastening? I'm not aware of any, but...
Mickey
>I'm interested. Are the torx screws that microfastener sells weaker
>than normal Phillips heads? I'd planned on using these in a few places
>and wasn't aware that they weren't as strong.
>>Be careful about the torx or even the square hole screws as they are
>>generally not as strong as phillips head screws. ...
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
==
==
==
==
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