Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:00 AM - Official Usage Guideline [Please Read] [Monthly Posting] (Matt Dralle)
2. 06:27 AM - Body filler? (Shemp)
3. 06:34 AM - Re: Body filler? (Bruce Gray)
4. 06:42 AM - FW: 48 States report (Wheeler North)
5. 07:22 AM - Re: Body filler? (Scott Bilinski)
6. 07:43 AM - Pre-purchase inspection (C P)
7. 08:29 AM - Re: ignition problem (Lwfeatherston@aol.com)
8. 09:37 AM - RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly (Pete Howell)
9. 10:48 AM - Re: ignition problem (Bob 1)
10. 10:52 AM - garmin 296 (ray sheffield)
11. 11:01 AM - Re: ignition problem (Scott Bilinski)
12. 11:24 AM - Re: garmin 296 (Scott Bilinski)
13. 12:33 PM - Re: garmin 296 (David Burton)
14. 01:42 PM - Roll servo install (TruTrak) (BGCrook@aol.com)
15. 01:58 PM - Re: Roll servo install (TruTrak) (Pat Hatch)
16. 02:11 PM - Re: marketing practices (was garmin 296). (Stein Bruch)
17. 02:18 PM - Re: Roll servo install (TruTrak) (Ross Mickey)
18. 02:41 PM - Re: Roll servo install (TruTrak) (Laird Owens)
19. 03:17 PM - Re: RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly (Ben Cunningham)
20. 03:30 PM - Re: ignition problem (Jerry Springer)
21. 03:46 PM - Re: ignition problem (Konrad Werner)
22. 03:58 PM - KOLZ ???? (Tom Gummo)
23. 04:32 PM - Re: ignition problem (Dan Checkoway)
24. 05:33 PM - Re: RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly (Mike Nellis)
25. 05:41 PM - Re: KOLZ ???? (RV6 Flyer)
26. 05:48 PM - Re: ignition problem (RV6 Flyer)
27. 06:19 PM - Re: ignition problem (Stein Bruch)
28. 06:31 PM - Re: ignition problem (Alex Peterson)
29. 06:37 PM - Re: KOLZ ???? (Tom Gummo)
30. 08:30 PM - Re: ignition problem (Charlie Kuss)
31. 09:09 PM - Hot start (was: Ignition problem) (Dan Checkoway)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Official Usage Guideline [Please Read] [Monthly Posting] |
DNA: do not archive
--> RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Lister,
Please read over the RV-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
RV-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/RV-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
RV-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the RV-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the RV-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
RV-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the RV-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
Message 2
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" <shempdowling@earthlink.net>
A few months ago I spoke with someone about filling gaps between fairings and the
plane. I cant remember what type of filler was recommended. I know evercoat
has been highly recommended but there are many different types of evercoat.
I bought some metal glaze but was told by the auto guy that it would crack at
anything more that the minimum thickness.
Any suggestions would be appreciated. (Well at least most of them)
Thanks
Jeff Dowling
RV-6a
Chicago/ Louisville
Message 3
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Bruce Gray" <Bruce@glasair.org>
Most of the Glasair guys use Evercoat Rage.
Bruce
www.glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Shemp
Subject: RV-List: Body filler?
--> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" <shempdowling@earthlink.net>
A few months ago I spoke with someone about filling gaps between
fairings and the plane. I cant remember what type of filler was
recommended. I know evercoat has been highly recommended but there are
many different types of evercoat. I bought some metal glaze but was
told by the auto guy that it would crack at anything more that the
minimum thickness.
Any suggestions would be appreciated. (Well at least most of them)
Thanks
Jeff Dowling
RV-6a
Chicago/ Louisville
==
==
==
==
Message 4
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| Subject: | FW: 48 States report |
--> RV-List message posted by: Wheeler North <wnorth@sdccd.cc.ca.us>
T-minus 8 hours...
I just got word that our email server is being moved into a new building
this weekend so I will be offline for the first few days of the trip.
I'll try daily anyways as our guru's are usually pretty good about keeping
the juice flowing.
Not much to say about the last few prep items. The plane is topped off, and
about as full of ca ca as I usually am. For those of you who know me well
I'm sure that you will be amazed if it gets off the ground.
First stop is Minden Lake Tahoe. This is just east of the lake on the east
side of the ridge that forms the eastern edge of the lake. There are
currently two wild fire air attack TFRs on either side of it so I will be
using Trukee and Reno as alternates in case of smoke.
Next stop after that will be Scappoose Oregon, which is north west of
Portland by about 20 miles. It usually has great fuel prices.
>From there I will shoot for Arlington Washington if it is not too late and
the WX is good. The last three days it has seemed to be cruddy and scuddy in
the mornings up there but nice and clear in the afternoons and evenings so
it would be nice to get there in one day and arrive in the evening.
If not I'll overnight in Vernonia, which is a nice little grass strip
halfway to the coast west of Portland. The approach is down a short valley,
yank back on the stick, turn left as you stop and start camping about ten
feet away from the runway. Not sure what happens if another plane comes in a
little off course, but there's a few stout trees I can pitch my tent behind.
Last few times I camped there no other planes appeared.
Those of you alums of the Mike Seger school of scaring your flight
instructor half to death will remember this airport as the one where he gets
to show you how a real pilot does it flawlessly.
The up side of staying here is its a really pretty place to spend the night,
and Mike usually drops out for a visit if he's in town. The dwonside is that
I may not be able to get onward up coast until the afternoon. If this
happens I'll plan on popping over to Auaora, or Independance for lunch, then
head on North.
For the rest of the weekend I am working on setup at the flyin, or doing
whatever lowly tasks the chiefs would ask of me to do. I may head down on
Monday to Umaqua Oregon to meet a friend who is bringing his flawless newly
restored Stearman Biplane up to the flyin. I can't wait to fly alongside
that one over the pudget sound and take a few shots with the islands as a
backdrop.
Well,
off to bed, early to rise,
Keep the blue side up on landings...
W
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Body filler? |
--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
There is a filler that I really like it's called All Metal (Evercoat?) it
is a polyester filler with high aluminium powder fill. I would guess its
about 75% aluminium powder. It will expand and contract the same as the
plane, I would think it would old up better than any other type fill on
aluminium. I will let you know in a few years if its holding up... You can
find it at the local auto body shop/paint store.
If your still not sure what to use always consult the experts, call
Evercoat. I have talked to guys in their lab about how well things hold up.
Its great talking to people who know everything about the product.
At 08:25 AM 7/2/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" <shempdowling@earthlink.net>
>
>A few months ago I spoke with someone about filling gaps between fairings
>and the plane. I cant remember what type of filler was recommended. I
>know evercoat has been highly recommended but there are many different
>types of evercoat. I bought some metal glaze but was told by the auto guy
>that it would crack at anything more that the minimum thickness.
>
>Any suggestions would be appreciated. (Well at least most of them)
>
>Thanks
>Jeff Dowling
>RV-6a
>Chicago/ Louisville
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
Message 6
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| Subject: | Pre-purchase inspection |
--> RV-List message posted by: C P <yankeerv10@yahoo.com>
Hi,
I have a friend who is choosing between two RV-6s. He needs help
finding A&Ps, DARs, or even experienced builders capable of
helping with pre-purchase inspections. One is in Bangor, ME, the
other is in Ft. Myers, FL. Any help would be appreciated! Mike
can be reached at MnwPeeps@aol.com.
cheers,
Chuck
__________________________________
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
In your most recent e-mail which I unfortunately erased, you stated that "if
it is not the mag, no one here knows what to do next." I am not trying to
be cute but can "anyone there" spell _klaus@lightspeedengineering_
(mailto:klaus@lightspeedengineering) . I have both of my semi-inoperative mags which
were recently overhauled by a very reputable shop in a cabinet in the hangar,
and two of LightSpeeds wonderful electronic ignitions on my engine. I have no
scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was absolutely
correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per hour, and never
have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at about
$350 per. (You'll need a backup battery and wiring for $25 to $75 depending.)
My Lycoming hot starts on the second blade everytime. Dang! Life is good.
You can pay me now, or pay me later. Thanks Klaus! Les Featherston
N206KT Harmon Rocket II "Airgasm" with 70 hrs.
Message 8
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| Subject: | RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Pete Howell" <pete.howell@gecko-group.com>
Hello,
I am ready to begin work on my RV-9 QB fuse and will require a
stand/cradle/dolly that will enable me to move it about the garage on
wheels. Has anyone built something like this that they can
recommend?
Is it wise to tie into the wing spar wood blocks?
TIA
Pete
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob 1" <rv3a@comcast.net>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
> I have no
> scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was absolutely
> correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per hour,
and never
> have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at about
> $350 per.
When you have SCIENTIFIC PROOF
to back up sincere opinion.....
please post.
Bob - from the Show Me state
Message 10
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--> RV-List message posted by: "ray sheffield" <rv8a@csranet.com>
Looking for the best price on a new garmin 296 hand held gps
ray
rv8a@csranet.com
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
I flew with a friend, him, a stock O-360. Me an IO-360 with dual EI and
injectors matched. Him and RV-8 me an RV-8a. I use 1.5 gallons less per hour.
At 12:47 PM 7/2/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob 1" <rv3a@comcast.net>
>
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
>
> > I have no
> > scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was absolutely
> > correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per hour,
>and never
> > have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at about
> > $350 per.
>
>
>When you have SCIENTIFIC PROOF
>to back up sincere opinion.....
>please post.
>
>
>Bob - from the Show Me state
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
Message 12
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--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
Spinners Pilot Shop $1680.00.
Everyone else looks to be $1695.00
At 01:52 PM 7/2/2004 -0400, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "ray sheffield" <rv8a@csranet.com>
>
>Looking for the best price on a new garmin 296 hand held gps
>
>ray
>
>rv8a@csranet.com
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
Message 13
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--> RV-List message posted by: "David Burton" <dburton@nwlink.com>
Garmin has told their dealers that if they discount this they will be cut
off. They are not even supposed to offer free shipping to lower the price.
I thought that the days of price fixing were long gone, but there apparently
is legislation in place allowing manufacturers to do this. I tried to look
it up but did could not find it. As I recall it was the Colgate act ?
I'm sorry to see Garmin do this... I was looking at the 296 too. I don't
plan to purchase anything from them except the updates for my 195 and 430
until they change this policy. I'm going to talk to their rep at Arlington
on Wenesday to see what he knows about this.
Message 14
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| Subject: | Roll servo install (TruTrak) |
--> RV-List message posted by: BGCrook@aol.com
Hello,
I searched the archives and didn't find what I was looking for so here
is my question. I'm getting close to finishing the left wing (RV-7) and I
would like to install the TruTrak AP. I haven't yet purchased the unit so I'm not
sure if I should close up the left wing or not. My question is which wing does
it mount in. On the TT website shows a left wing install, but I have heard
from another builder that his actually mounted in the right wing. I know it
could be installed later, but I'd rather just mount the servo and run the wiring
while I have better access.
I have sent a couple e-mails to TT and have gotten no reply.
Thanks,
Bryon Crook
-7 wings
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Roll servo install (TruTrak) |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch@msn.com>
Bryon,
You can put it in either wing...just let them know which wing you chose when
you ask for the install kit, which includes all the brackets, hardware and
connectors you will need. Ask for the drawing for the wing you select,
otherwise you might have to look at it in a mirror :-). Definitely do the
install kit now, though.
Let me know off line if you need any pictures or any other help. I have the
Digiflight II VS in the RV-7, but I think they all use the same servos.
Pat Hatch
RV-4
RV-6
RV-7 All Flying
Vero Beach, FL
----- Original Message -----
From: <BGCrook@aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Roll servo install (TruTrak)
> --> RV-List message posted by: BGCrook@aol.com
>
> Hello,
>
> I searched the archives and didn't find what I was looking for so
here
> is my question. I'm getting close to finishing the left wing (RV-7) and I
> would like to install the TruTrak AP. I haven't yet purchased the unit so
I'm not
> sure if I should close up the left wing or not. My question is which wing
does
> it mount in. On the TT website shows a left wing install, but I have heard
> from another builder that his actually mounted in the right wing. I know
it
> could be installed later, but I'd rather just mount the servo and run the
wiring
> while I have better access.
>
> I have sent a couple e-mails to TT and have gotten no reply.
>
> Thanks,
> Bryon Crook
> -7 wings
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | marketing practices (was garmin 296). |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Actually, this is still VERY common practice among lots of retailed items,
both aviation and non-aviation alike. It may seem stupid, but in our
little aviation world it actually make sense. I woudn't hold this against
Garmin, because guess what?? Bendix/King, Chelton, David Clark, Lycoming,
Continental, etc.. all still have this type of policy. Sometimes it's
disguised as a "MAP" or minimum adverstised price, but in the end it's the
same thing. In fact, if you really did some fact finding, I think you'd
find that a large majority of items are like that. I think you'd be
surprised to find out how many aviation products are actually similar. Are
you going to shut off your Lycoming, hand in your headset, give back all
your flight instruments, strip the paint off your plane, let the air out of
the tires, etc.. until those companies quit that?? Because guess what, they
are all in the same boat. Oh, remember that Whopper/Big Mac you had
earlier.....same story.
Here's the reason for it. From the persective of someone who manufactures
something and sells it through various outlets (avionics products for
example), which I do.
If I have product "x" which I sell for price "y" to the customer, I expect
to make a certain profit from it. When I sell it to dealer, I naturally
give them a good discount so they can make a profit also. In that profit
margin, they need to cover their own costs, such as marketing, overhead,
airshows, etc.. As soon as dealers start a price war and trying to undercut
each other by a buck or two, everyone does the same thing until NO-ONE is
making any money at all. People like the "online super pilot stores" of
which many are just virtual businesses with no office, people, etc..
discount their stuff until the margin is literall razor thin. They just
drop ship the stuff anyway, and provide no real customer service. It's kind
of why the "group buy" thing will never really take off. The mfgrs &
dealers hate it. Some guy with no intention whatsoever of running a real
business, and doing the things required to run a business, like R&D,
marketing, advertising, etc.. tries to get a mfgr to sell a lump of things
directly to a group of people and do an end run around all the people who
spent the money to make the product viable in the marketplace.
This is basic marketing 101. You can't let your dealers dictate your
pricing, or you'll all end up broke. There is always one guy who is stupid
enough to sell things for $.01 of profit on a product, when the normal
margin might be many times higher than that. He initially thinks that he
can make up for margins by increasing quantity. In the end, that guy who is
making 1% on all his sales goes tits up, meanwhile he's taken a significant
chunk of business away from people who actually know how to run a business
and are in it for the long run. This is especially difficult for those of
us who have small businesses and also sell products directly. You have to
realize that many of the products that we use in our airplanes go through at
least 4 or more levels before they reach the consumer. Each one of those
levels makes a profit. I know it sucks, and in an ideal works we'd all buy
directly from the mfgrs, but the reality is not that way. Many newer small
companies I've dealt with like Dynon, BMA, GRT, etc.. have all been finding
out about this lesson the hard way over the past year. At first it seems
attractive to sign up a heap of dealerships to "let people sell things for
you", then you find out the dealers are fighting amongst themselves for
marketshare, meanwhile your product pricing power is degraded to a point
where someone is selling the thing for cost, making everyone look like
bank-robbers, and no-one turns a profit.
Don't get me wrong, I'm an airplane builder and consumer aw well, and like
the next guy I always try to save a buck. That being said, I'm not one of
those people who spends an hour driving to save $4.00 on my gas tank fill
up.
Very few people in the aviation world are getting rich from their
businesses, and I just wanted to give a little perspective from us "little
guys" into why those things work like that. I think you'll see more and
more of the "virtual" dealer type companies dissapear for the very same
reasons. Sorry for the rant.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
http://www.steinair.com
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of David Burton
Subject: Re: RV-List: garmin 296
--> RV-List message posted by: "David Burton" <dburton@nwlink.com>
Garmin has told their dealers that if they discount this they will be cut
off. They are not even supposed to offer free shipping to lower the price.
I thought that the days of price fixing were long gone, but there apparently
is legislation in place allowing manufacturers to do this. I tried to look
it up but did could not find it. As I recall it was the Colgate act ?
I'm sorry to see Garmin do this... I was looking at the 296 too. I don't
plan to purchase anything from them except the updates for my 195 and 430
until they change this policy. I'm going to talk to their rep at Arlington
on Wenesday to see what he knows about this.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Roll servo install (TruTrak) |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey@ix.netcom.com>
I installed mine in the right wing. I don't see any reason why it
couldn't be mounted in either wing. I think they have installation
hardware for both. While you may be able to install it after you close
the wing, it would be A LOT easier to do it before. I even made a
separate inspection plate under mine for easy access.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of BGCrook@aol.com
Subject: RV-List: Roll servo install (TruTrak)
--> RV-List message posted by: BGCrook@aol.com
Hello,
I searched the archives and didn't find what I was looking for so
here
is my question. I'm getting close to finishing the left wing (RV-7) and
I
would like to install the TruTrak AP. I haven't yet purchased the unit
so I'm not
sure if I should close up the left wing or not. My question is which
wing does
it mount in. On the TT website shows a left wing install, but I have
heard
from another builder that his actually mounted in the right wing. I know
it
could be installed later, but I'd rather just mount the servo and run
the wiring
while I have better access.
I have sent a couple e-mails to TT and have gotten no reply.
Thanks,
Bryon Crook
-7 wings
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Roll servo install (TruTrak) |
--> RV-List message posted by: Laird Owens <owens@aerovironment.com>
Byron,
I found that mounting it the wing was a little tighter than I liked
(RV-6), so I mounted the servo out on the wing tip and used a pushrod
to the bellcrank. My buddy mounted his in the seat pan, which I like
better because it's easier to wire, and you don't need the servo until
your working on the finish kit.
Pictures of both installs are at:
http://www.rvproject.com/trutrak.html
Good luck
Laird RV-6 (950hrs )
SoCal
On Jul 2, 2004, at 1:41 PM, BGCrook@aol.com wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: BGCrook@aol.com
>
> Hello,
>
> I searched the archives and didn't find what I was looking for
> so here
> is my question. I'm getting close to finishing the left wing (RV-7)
> and I
> would like to install the TruTrak AP. I haven't yet purchased the unit
> so I'm not
> sure if I should close up the left wing or not. My question is which
> wing does
> it mount in. On the TT website shows a left wing install, but I have
> heard
> from another builder that his actually mounted in the right wing. I
> know it
> could be installed later, but I'd rather just mount the servo and run
> the wiring
> while I have better access.
>
> I have sent a couple e-mails to TT and have gotten no reply.
>
> Thanks,
> Bryon Crook
> -7 wings
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Re: RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ben Cunningham" <benandginny@insightbb.com>
Hi Pete,
fwiw, I used a padded saw horse right under the spar and an old office chair
with vertical adjustment under the tail. Put the saw horse on wheels if you
want. Works great. Simple. You will need to remove those wood blocks soon
enough to work in the area forward of the spar.
Ben Cunningham 71313
RV7 Finish Kit
Crossflow Subaru
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pete Howell" <pete.howell@gecko-group.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Pete Howell" <pete.howell@gecko-group.com>
>
>
> Hello,
>
> I am ready to begin work on my RV-9 QB fuse and will require a
> stand/cradle/dolly that will enable me to move it about the garage on
> wheels. Has anyone built something like this that they can
> recommend?
>
> Is it wise to tie into the wing spar wood blocks?
>
> TIA
>
> Pete
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv@earthlink.net>
Yes, and I can burn the same or less than a friend with a O-320 and me
with a O-360, with mags,depends on many things, such as how well
an airplane is built, power settings, props, altitude etc. You are not
saving 1.5 gallons an hour with EI. I also have friends with
them and they say no fuel saving at all.
Jerry
Scott Bilinski wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>
>I flew with a friend, him, a stock O-360. Me an IO-360 with dual EI and
>injectors matched. Him and RV-8 me an RV-8a. I use 1.5 gallons less per hour.
>
>
>At 12:47 PM 7/2/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>
>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob 1" <rv3a@comcast.net>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>--> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
>>>
>>>
>>>I have no
>>>scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was absolutely
>>>correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per hour,
>>>
>>>
>>and never
>>
>>
>>>have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at about
>>>$350 per.
>>>
>>>
>>When you have SCIENTIFIC PROOF
>>to back up sincere opinion.....
>>please post.
>>
>>
>>Bob - from the Show Me state
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>Scott Bilinski
>Eng dept 305
>Phone (858) 657-2536
>Pager (858) 502-5190
>
>
>
>
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Re: ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Konrad Werner" <klwerner@comcast.net>
Jerry,
Exactly which E.I.-System do your friends run?
Lightspeed? Jeff Rose? Lasar? or are there any other one's out there?
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Jerry Springer
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, July 02, 2004 4:25 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: ignition problem
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv@earthlink.net>
Yes, and I can burn the same or less than a friend with a O-320 and me
with a O-360, with mags,depends on many things, such as how well
an airplane is built, power settings, props, altitude etc. You are not
saving 1.5 gallons an hour with EI. I also have friends with
them and they say no fuel saving at all.
Jerry
Scott Bilinski wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>
>I flew with a friend, him, a stock O-360. Me an IO-360 with dual EI and
>injectors matched. Him and RV-8 me an RV-8a. I use 1.5 gallons less per hour.
>
>
>At 12:47 PM 7/2/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>
>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob 1" <rv3a@comcast.net>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>--> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
>>>
>>>
>>>I have no
>>>scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was absolutely
>>>correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per hour,
>>>
>>>
>>and never
>>
>>
>>>have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at about
>>>$350 per.
>>>
>>>
>>When you have SCIENTIFIC PROOF
>>to back up sincere opinion.....
>>please post.
>>
>>
>>Bob - from the Show Me state
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>Scott Bilinski
>Eng dept 305
>Phone (858) 657-2536
>Pager (858) 502-5190
>
>
>
>
Message 22
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Looking at the airports to use on the way to OSH, I found KOLZ, Oelwein Municipal
in Oelwein, Iowa.
Any of you local guys know if there is anything wrong with this airport?
It looks like there is no food within 4 miles. :-(
I was planning on staying there overnight (camping) and then have a short hop to
OSH the next morning. It has gas and camping on field.
Thanks,
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Harmon Rocket-II
do not archive
http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
The "IO" factor plays a big part in the equation, especially with the AFP
injection and matched injectors like Scott's talking about.
You can pull that puppy LOP and it'll run smooth and cool...burning a heck
of a lot less fuel than any "O" engine will at the same MP/RPM setting,
since the carb'd setup is pretty much forced to run ROP.
do not archive
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Springer" <jsflyrv@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: ignition problem
> --> RV-List message posted by: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv@earthlink.net>
>
> Yes, and I can burn the same or less than a friend with a O-320 and me
> with a O-360, with mags,depends on many things, such as how well
> an airplane is built, power settings, props, altitude etc. You are not
> saving 1.5 gallons an hour with EI. I also have friends with
> them and they say no fuel saving at all.
>
> Jerry
>
> Scott Bilinski wrote:
>
> >--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski
<bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
> >
> >I flew with a friend, him, a stock O-360. Me an IO-360 with dual EI and
> >injectors matched. Him and RV-8 me an RV-8a. I use 1.5 gallons less per
hour.
> >
> >
> >At 12:47 PM 7/2/2004 -0500, you wrote:
> >
> >
> >>--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob 1" <rv3a@comcast.net>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>--> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I have no
> >>>scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was
absolutely
> >>>correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per
hour,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>and never
> >>
> >>
> >>>have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at
about
> >>>$350 per.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>When you have SCIENTIFIC PROOF
> >>to back up sincere opinion.....
> >>please post.
> >>
> >>
> >>Bob - from the Show Me state
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >Scott Bilinski
> >Eng dept 305
> >Phone (858) 657-2536
> >Pager (858) 502-5190
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Mike Nellis" <mike@bmnellis.com>
One of the guys in our chapter is making and selling just what you're
looking for. (it's not me)
http://bmnellis.com/eaa187/admin/index.php?sid=c3463d087f724c7ee311ab7ea702f
831
Mike Nellis
RV-6 Fuselage N699BM
1947 Stinson 108-2 NC9666K
http://bmnellis.com
*** -----Original Message-----
*** From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
*** [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pete Howell
*** Sent: Friday, July 02, 2004 11:40 AM
*** To: rv-list@matronics.com
*** Subject: RV-List: RV-9 Fuse stand/dolly
***
***
*** --> RV-List message posted by: "Pete Howell"
*** --> <pete.howell@gecko-group.com>
***
***
*** Hello,
***
*** I am ready to begin work on my RV-9 QB fuse and will
*** require a stand/cradle/dolly that will enable me to move it
*** about the garage on wheels. Has anyone built something
*** like this that they can recommend?
***
*** Is it wise to tie into the wing spar wood blocks?
***
*** TIA
***
*** Pete
***
***
*** ==============
*** Matronics Forums.
*** ==============
*** ==============
*** ==============
***
***
***
***
***
***
***
Message 25
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer@hotmail.com>
Tom:
I recommend OVS Boscobel as my last stop before Oshkosh and also as a RON.
They have lots of courtesy cars and cheap hotels near by. A couple of guys
on one trip even slept in the FBO office pilots lounge. Fuel is a little
more money but my airplane has spent the night in a free hangar every night
that I stayed there. A restaurant is a short hop in the free courtesy car
and Paul that runs the FBO is the nicest person you would ever want to meet.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,521 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Subject: RV-List: KOLZ ????
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Looking at the airports to use on the way to OSH, I found KOLZ, Oelwein
Municipal in Oelwein, Iowa.
Any of you local guys know if there is anything wrong with this airport?
It looks like there is no food within 4 miles. :-(
I was planning on staying there overnight (camping) and then have a short
hop to OSH the next morning. It has gas and camping on field.
Thanks,
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Harmon Rocket-II
do not archive
http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
Get tips for maintaining your PC, notebook accessories and reviews in
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Re: ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer@hotmail.com>
I have Bendix mags on my 1961 O-320 engine. They have never let me down
since I overhauled both of them for less than $320 (price if for both mags)
over 1,521 hours ago. No where that I know of is there a requirement or
need for a 250 hour overhaul. There is a 500 hour inspection and that has
cost me only time and no material.
I have spent more time troubleshooting other peoples LightSpeed EI that I
have working on my mags.
Look at other posts to prove that you will NOT save any fuel with the EI.
Last time I looked at the price, I could buy a NEW set of 2 Slick mags
cheaper than I could 2 LightSpeed EI systems. The mags will also work with a
complete electrical failure.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,521 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
> >>>--> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I have no
> >>>scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was
absolutely
> >>>correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per
hour,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>and never
> >>
> >>
> >>>have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at
about
> >>>$350 per.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>When you have SCIENTIFIC PROOF
> >>to back up sincere opinion.....
> >>please post.
> >>
> >>
> >>Bob - from the Show Me state
http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
Message 27
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|
| Subject: | ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
True....but....
Here's my story. I'm going to replace on of my mags with an E.I. this
summer because my IO-360 sucks to start when it's hot soaked - Plain and
simple. I could care less about the claimed fuel savings, hp increase
etc..., the one thing that seems to have been proven no matter which EI is
used, is that the IO's all start better with EI than without. Oh, and
before someone pipes in with the "holy grail" of heat soaked injected
Lycoming starting, please don't.
Just my opinion, we'll see how it does here after OSH.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
(1 Injected-360 & 1 Carburated-320.....guess which one is more fun to start
when hot)!
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of RV6 Flyer
Subject: Re: RV-List: ignition problem
--> RV-List message posted by: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer@hotmail.com>
I have Bendix mags on my 1961 O-320 engine. They have never let me down
since I overhauled both of them for less than $320 (price if for both mags)
over 1,521 hours ago. No where that I know of is there a requirement or
need for a 250 hour overhaul. There is a 500 hour inspection and that has
cost me only time and no material.
I have spent more time troubleshooting other peoples LightSpeed EI that I
have working on my mags.
Look at other posts to prove that you will NOT save any fuel with the EI.
Last time I looked at the price, I could buy a NEW set of 2 Slick mags
cheaper than I could 2 LightSpeed EI systems. The mags will also work with a
complete electrical failure.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,521 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
> >>>--> RV-List message posted by: Lwfeatherston@aol.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I have no
> >>>scientific proof, but it is my sincere opinion that Klaus was
absolutely
> >>>correct when he said I would save at least one gallon of fuel per
hour,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>and never
> >>
> >>
> >>>have to worry about a mag going bad before it's 250 hr overhaul at
about
> >>>$350 per.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>When you have SCIENTIFIC PROOF
> >>to back up sincere opinion.....
> >>please post.
> >>
> >>
> >>Bob - from the Show Me state
http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson@earthlink.net>
> Look at other posts to prove that you will NOT save any fuel
> with the EI.
>
Gary, I have done careful measurements on this very topic. What I have
found is that without the electronic spark advance (I happen to have
Lasar), it is possible to run smoothly more lean of peak than without,
at least at power settings around 55 - 60%. I have AFP injection, but
I'm not sure how much of a factor that is. What I have found, during
direct comparisons on the same flight, is about 0.4 gph less fuel burn
(at 55-60% power) with EI as compared to 25 degree advance mags. Lasar
is the only system which allows this direct comparison, as it can be
disabled in flight, reverting to straight magneto ignition. There is an
additional fuel economy benefit of simply being able to run leaner with
the EI. For the data simply comparing with and without EI, see:
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/fuelflow.htm
Additionally, there is an RV7A here with a carb'd O360 with dual EI's.
When we fly side by side, and run lean of peak, we have essentially the
same fuel burn.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 493 hours
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
Message 29
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Darn, now everybody will want to stay there. :-)
Thanks, Gary
GummiBear
----- Original Message -----
From: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: KOLZ ????
> --> RV-List message posted by: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer@hotmail.com>
>
> Tom:
>
> I recommend OVS Boscobel as my last stop before Oshkosh and also as a RON.
> They have lots of courtesy cars and cheap hotels near by. A couple of
guys
> on one trip even slept in the FBO office pilots lounge. Fuel is a little
> more money but my airplane has spent the night in a free hangar every
night
> that I stayed there. A restaurant is a short hop in the free courtesy car
> and Paul that runs the FBO is the nicest person you would ever want to
meet.
>
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 1,521 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
>
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
> To: "RV List" <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RV-List: KOLZ ????
> Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2004 15:57:33 -0700
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
>
> Looking at the airports to use on the way to OSH, I found KOLZ, Oelwein
> Municipal in Oelwein, Iowa.
> Any of you local guys know if there is anything wrong with this airport?
> It looks like there is no food within 4 miles. :-(
> I was planning on staying there overnight (camping) and then have a short
> hop to OSH the next morning. It has gas and camping on field.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tom Gummo
> Apple Valley, CA
> Harmon Rocket-II
>
> do not archive
>
> http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
>
>
> Get tips for maintaining your PC, notebook accessories and reviews in
>
>
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | ignition problem |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss <chaztuna@adelphia.net>
Alex,
Your statement below is not quite true. Jeff Rose's ElectroAir Electronic
ignition has the ability to allow the pilot to both monitor the amount of
spark advance (an optional extra) and "defeat" the additional advance
(return to a steady 25 degrees of advance) with the addition of 1 wire and
a toggle switch. This feature is standard on his units.
Charlie Kuss
>snipped
>Gary, I have done careful measurements on this very topic. What I have
>found is that without the electronic spark advance (I happen to have
>Lasar), it is possible to run smoothly more lean of peak than without,
>at least at power settings around 55 - 60%. I have AFP injection, but
>I'm not sure how much of a factor that is. What I have found, during
>direct comparisons on the same flight, is about 0.4 gph less fuel burn
>(at 55-60% power) with EI as compared to 25 degree advance mags. Lasar
>is the only system which allows this direct comparison, as it can be
>disabled in flight, reverting to straight magneto ignition. There is an
>additional fuel economy benefit of simply being able to run leaner with
>the EI. For the data simply comparing with and without EI, see:
snipped
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Hot start (was: Ignition problem) |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
> before someone pipes in with the "holy grail" of heat soaked injected
> Lycoming starting, please don't.
Can't....resist....commenting.....must.....type.....response..... 8-)
I have the Airflow Performance injection and purge valve system on my
IO-360-A1B6. I thought the purge valve would be the coolest thing sinced
sliced bread. Never use it.
Well...until today. In Vegas, it was over 90F on the ground, and for the
very first time in 150 hours, my engine got heat soaked badly enough to
inhibit starting right up. It would kick and then die. Repeat x3,
regardless of various attempts. I actually went ahead and used the purge
valve as it's intended -- purge valve open, throttle & mixture firewalled,
boost pump on for 20-30 sec, purge valve closed, mixture cutoff, crank --
started right up. It really did help.
Up until this point, hot starts have required very little effort, and I went
from using the purge valve occasionally to not bothering and essentially
never needing it. But I do see that in certain conditions it really does
pay off.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
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