---------------------------------------------------------- RV-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 08/11/04: 78 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:01 AM - Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (Todd Bartrim) 2. 12:34 AM - Re: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (linn walters) 3. 12:55 AM - Re: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (Todd Bartrim) 4. 05:26 AM - Re: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (cgalley) 5. 05:32 AM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (cgalley) 6. 06:30 AM - Re: insurance (Shemp) 7. 06:40 AM - Re: TruTrak Servo Hardware (Shemp) 8. 06:46 AM - Re: CS vs FP props (Doug Rozendaal) 9. 06:48 AM - Fuel Servo problem (Glen Matejcek) 10. 06:52 AM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Shemp) 11. 06:58 AM - Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 (sjhdcl@kingston.net) 12. 07:01 AM - facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (SportAV8R@aol.com) 13. 07:06 AM - Re: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 (Shemp) 14. 07:19 AM - Re: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 (Scott Bilinski) 15. 07:30 AM - RV6-A Plenum Question (Tom & Cathy Ervin) 16. 07:43 AM - Re: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 (Richard Bibb) 17. 07:57 AM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Monty Barrett) 18. 07:59 AM - Re: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (Jaye and Scott Jackson) 19. 08:04 AM - Re: TruTrak Servo Hardware (Steve&Anita Nyman) 20. 08:06 AM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Greg Young) 21. 08:14 AM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Jaye and Scott Jackson) 22. 08:17 AM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (Tim Bryan) 23. 08:20 AM - Re: RV6-A Plenum Question (Ross Mickey) 24. 08:27 AM - Re: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 (Phil Birkelbach) 25. 08:28 AM - Fw: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (Jaye and Scott Jackson) 26. 08:31 AM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (Sam Buchanan) 27. 08:31 AM - Re: RV6-A Plenum Question (Jaye and Scott Jackson) 28. 08:32 AM - Re: CS vs FP props (Tim Bryan) 29. 08:39 AM - Re: RV6-A Plenum Question (Jeff Point) 30. 08:48 AM - Re: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 (Dan Checkoway) 31. 08:55 AM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (cgalley) 32. 09:26 AM - Re: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 (Scott Bilinski) 33. 09:27 AM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (George Neal E Capt AU/PC) 34. 09:36 AM - RV-7A newbie questions () 35. 09:48 AM - Rudder issues (Charles E. Brame) 36. 09:49 AM - Re: Can someone bring me up to speed - RV-6A nose wheel pro (czechsix@juno.com) 37. 09:51 AM - Re: CS vs FP props (czechsix@juno.com) 38. 09:53 AM - Re: Fuel Boost Pump Location RV-6 (czechsix@juno.com) 39. 10:31 AM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (Randy Lervold) 40. 10:46 AM - Re: Rudder issues (Trainnut01@aol.com) 41. 10:46 AM - Re: RV-7A newbie questions (Phil Birkelbach) 42. 10:58 AM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (Gary Zilik) 43. 11:09 AM - Re: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (Neil McLeod) 44. 11:24 AM - Talking about LED position lights and Strobes... (Amit Dagan) 45. 11:24 AM - Reassembly at the airport (Mickey Coggins) 46. 11:41 AM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (JOHN STARN) 47. 11:48 AM - Re: CS vs FP props (Doug Rozendaal) 48. 12:07 PM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (SportAV8R@aol.com) 49. 12:23 PM - Re: CS vs FP props (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)) 50. 01:15 PM - Re: Can someone bring me up to speed - RV-6A nose wheel (Terry Mortimore) 51. 01:24 PM - Re: Labeling wiring (Terry Mortimore) 52. 01:30 PM - Re: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (Jaye and Scott Jackson) 53. 01:42 PM - Re: RV6-A Plenum Question (LarryRobertHelming) 54. 02:12 PM - Re: Reassembly at the airport (Ed Anderson) 55. 02:14 PM - Re: Reassembly at the airport (Kyle Boatright) 56. 02:30 PM - Re: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? (Neil McLeod) 57. 02:38 PM - Re: Reassembly at the airport (Scott Bilinski) 58. 03:09 PM - Re: Fuel Boost Pump Location RV-6 (Scott.Fink@microchip.com) 59. 03:36 PM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Greg Young) 60. 03:48 PM - Starter Interruption (David Schaefer) 61. 04:28 PM - Re: Starter Interruption (Richard Bibb) 62. 04:30 PM - Re: Starter Interruption (James E. Clark) 63. 05:05 PM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Alex Peterson) 64. 05:15 PM - Re: Starter Interruption (Gert) 65. 05:23 PM - Re: RV6-A Plenum Question (Tom & Cathy Ervin) 66. 05:50 PM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Larry Bowen) 67. 06:08 PM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (James Ashford) 68. 06:15 PM - New RV-7A Construction log site... (Matt Johnson) 69. 06:17 PM - Rudder issues. (Emrath) 70. 06:22 PM - Re: Reassembly at the airport (Dean Pichon) 71. 07:15 PM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (Harvey Sigmon) 72. 07:15 PM - Re: New RV-7A Construction log site... (not processed: message from valid local sender) (Kathleen (rv7)) 73. 07:23 PM - Re: Fuel Servo problem (linn walters) 74. 08:18 PM - Metal Polish/Cleaner? (Larry Bowen) 75. 09:00 PM - Re: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction (Charlie Kuss) 76. 09:39 PM - Thanks. (Dean Psiropoulos) 77. 10:14 PM - RV traveling to PNW (Kenneth Cantrell) 78. 10:38 PM - Cherry Max rivet question (Karie Daniel) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:01:32 AM PST US From: "Todd Bartrim" Subject: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" Hi All; I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a real problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for parking I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds very well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost always leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have ensured that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the brake to release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops of fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last year, but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd forgotten about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must say it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the last time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? Todd Bartrim RV9Endurance 13B Turbo Rotary C-FSTB http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard work and determination to the things they do." ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:34:11 AM PST US From: linn walters Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: linn walters Todd Bartrim wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" > >Hi All; > I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a real >problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for parking >I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds very >well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost always >leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have ensured >that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the brake to >release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops of >fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake >operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last year, >but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd forgotten >about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must say >it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the last >time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! > Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? > I haven't a clue as to how the valve is plumbed in your bird, so this is a real SWAG! The next time it locks up, try and pull the brake pedal back. The valve in the brake cylinder may be closed off preventing fluid from flowing back through the cylinder. Best of luck, Linn > >Todd Bartrim > >RV9Endurance >13B Turbo Rotary >C-FSTB >http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard >work and determination to the things they do." > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:55:55 AM PST US From: "Todd Bartrim" Subject: RE: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" I haven't a clue as to how the valve is plumbed in your bird, so this is a real SWAG! Pretty much the same as everybody else. The next time it locks up, try and pull the brake pedal back. The valve in the brake cylinder may be closed off preventing fluid from flowing back through the cylinder. Best of luck, Linn Tried that... no luck Todd Bartrim RV9Endurance 13B Turbo Rotary C-FSTB http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard work and determination to the things they do." ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:26:55 AM PST US From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" Have a couple of friends that were flying to Alaska in a 125 hour old Maule this summer. Used the parking brake. Took off OK but one brake was still locked on landing. Wiped out the gear, one wing, 3 bladed prop. Fortunately the $45,000 repair is covered by insurance as they are now looking at more things. Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot ----- Original Message ----- From: "Todd Bartrim" Subject: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" > > Hi All; > I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a real > problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for parking > I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds very > well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost always > leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have ensured > that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the brake to > release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops of > fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake > operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last year, > but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd forgotten > about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must say > it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the last > time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! > Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? > > Todd Bartrim > > RV9Endurance > 13B Turbo Rotary > C-FSTB > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard > work and determination to the things they do." > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:32:32 AM PST US From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" I believe these are your words.. > For 30 minutes I had a glorious flight and was the happiest man in the air. > Returning to Hooks, when I turned on the boost pump the engine went rough. > After trying various combinations of boost on/off and leaning I thought the > engine was running smooth and planned for a high speed approach Am I wrong? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gregory Young" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > --> RV-List message posted by: "Gregory Young" > > Cy, your recollection of my accident is incorrect. In fact, my boost pump > was OFF on landing precisely because of symptoms similar to those Andre > described. The engine ran fine until I pulled the power on base. Airflow > Performance recommends the boost be ON for takeoff and landing as does > Lycoming for their Bendix injected engines. I turned it off because my > mixture went over-rich when I turned the boost on for approach. I still > don't have a definitive cause of the engine failure but my working theory is > that the boost being off was a contributing event in a chain leading to > vapor lock. > > Andre, your symptoms sound like what I experienced in flight and I implore > you not to fly until you resolve the problem. Have you tried leaning it when > the boost is on? That would confirm an over-rich condition like I > experienced. I can't offer any suggestions other than to resolve it on the > ground. I would be very interested in anything you find, it may answer some > questions for me. Even if you have a Bendix system, the AFP was based on the > Bendix design so any findings would probably apply. > > Regards, > Greg Young - Houston (DWH) > RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix > Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > Don't turn on the pump. We lost a plane that turned the pump > > on during the first flight, killed the engine and could not > > restart because it was flooded. Ask Greg Young. Pump is a > > standby for when the engine pump fails. > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs > > Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Berthet, Andre G" > > To: > > Subject: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Berthet, Andre G" > > > > > > > > I have an IO-360-A1A and have a strange problem. When the > > engine is hot, > > > turning the booster pump ON will results in a substantial > > drop of RPM. > > > Let say if I set my engine speed to 1300 RPM and then turn > > the booster > > > ON, the engine speed will decrease by about 500 RPM. Of > > course if I do > > > that at a normal idling of 700 RPM, the engine just quit. > > My servo has > > > been overhauled in January, re-inspected in June and I'm > > sending it back > > > again. The flow divider and the fuel nozzles have been > > overhauled last > > > June too. Also the idling speed is changing depending if > > the engine is > > > hot or cold. My mixture is adjusted for a 25 RPM rise at ICO. > > > > > > My engine driven pump alone produces 23 PSI of fuel > > pressure, and when > > > the booster pump is turned ON it increases the pressure to 28 PSI. > > > > > > Could anyone have suggestions how to fix this problem? > > > > > > Andre > > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:30:20 AM PST US From: "Shemp" Subject: Re: RV-List: insurance --> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" Nationair ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Weyant" Subject: RV-List: insurance > --> RV-List message posted by: "Chuck Weyant" > > Who you guys using for insurance? Best quote I can get is $1,700 a year. > Chuck > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:40:40 AM PST US From: "Shemp" Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak Servo Hardware --> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" That's a good idea. I ended up using a little loctite per my conversation with the factory rep but should have done what you did. Dont need anything coming loose back there!!!! shemp ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak Servo Hardware > --> RV-List message posted by: N67BT@aol.com > > > On my Altrak servo (same as the roll servo) I drilled out the threads and > put AN bolts clear through with washers and lock nuts. This will also safety > the small socket head screws nearby. I plan to do the same with the roll > servo. > > Bob Trumpfheller > > > In a message dated 8/10/2004 5:50:24 PM Mountain Daylight Time, > nyman@bellsouth.net writes: > > I'm installing the roll servo in the right wing of my 7 and was curious what > others used for hardware to mount the servo to the bracket that replaces the > lower bellcrank bracket. The attach holes in the servo are threaded for an > AN3 bolt or an AN509-10 screw. I was thinking one of those with a lock > washer and Loctite, or maybe a long enough screw to go all the way through the > servo housing and put a lock nut on it. > > Thanks > Steve > 7QB > MEM > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:46:21 AM PST US From: "Doug Rozendaal" Subject: Re: RV-List: CS vs FP props --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" I had a wood FP on my first RV-4 and I wanted a C/S for the following reasons. 1. Rain, I needed a metal prop of some sort for IFR. 2. Acro, with a metal FP, rpm overspeed is really critical and I did not want to live in fear of the propeller coming apart. 3. Formation, The C/S has both, better power response, and better braking for formation flying. 4. T/O climb performance. The C/S wins big here, much longer vertical lines. 5.Lower cruise RPM, The C/S allows me to cruise at a much lower rpm which is quieter and saves fuel. At 12,000 ft, 2300 and 2400 rpm yields the same speed and 2500 rpm is slower, but the fuel flow changes dramatically with decreasing rpms. 2100 rpms up high and I can get some amazing miles per gallon numbers. 6. Weight, The only time weight is a good thing in an airplane, but I wanted to be able to put a fat guy in the back seat of my -4. My wood prop airplane was pretty spooky with a heavy guy in back. That was the thought process I used, and I am really happy. I would hate to go back to a F/P of any sort. Your results may differ...... Tailwinds Doug Rozendaal ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:48:31 AM PST US From: "Glen Matejcek" Subject: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek" Hi All- What great timing- another forum I sat in on at OSH was about the RSA injection systems and was put on by Precision (Bendix). They stated point blank that the RSA fuel servo has its own regulator built in and that pump output pressure has no effect on fuel flow, as long as the servo inlet pressure is within the specified limits. Therefore, if the application in question has a Bendix / Precision RSA injector and engine stumbles / fails when the boost pump is activated, it would seem that either the pump output is way too high or there is a problem with the injection system, most likely the fuel pressure regulator. I'd sure get it checked... Glen Time: 10:15:34 AM PST US From: "Shemp" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" I have a Bendix injector and when I turn on the b.p., the engine rpm drops for a half second, then comes back up to normal. I see a surge on my fuel pressure gauge but then it returns to normal. I dont feel any change at above idle settings. Shemp ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:52:34 AM PST US From: "Shemp" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" Speaking of Bendix injectors, I was speaking with one of the factory reps at Oshkosh concerning the cd they gave me for maintaing the RSA fuel injection system. One of the topics on the cd is what to do if you get run on during shut down. The cd says this is due to a servo problem. I just had my servo and distributor rebuilt 100 hours ago. It only runs on when the engine and oat are hot. Im having a hard time accepting the fact that the servo isnt working properly. Has anyone else had this situation? Thanks Shemp (Jeff Dowling) RV-6a/ 100 hours Chicago/ Louisville ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gregory Young" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > --> RV-List message posted by: "Gregory Young" > > Cy, your recollection of my accident is incorrect. In fact, my boost pump > was OFF on landing precisely because of symptoms similar to those Andre > described. The engine ran fine until I pulled the power on base. Airflow > Performance recommends the boost be ON for takeoff and landing as does > Lycoming for their Bendix injected engines. I turned it off because my > mixture went over-rich when I turned the boost on for approach. I still > don't have a definitive cause of the engine failure but my working theory is > that the boost being off was a contributing event in a chain leading to > vapor lock. > > Andre, your symptoms sound like what I experienced in flight and I implore > you not to fly until you resolve the problem. Have you tried leaning it when > the boost is on? That would confirm an over-rich condition like I > experienced. I can't offer any suggestions other than to resolve it on the > ground. I would be very interested in anything you find, it may answer some > questions for me. Even if you have a Bendix system, the AFP was based on the > Bendix design so any findings would probably apply. > > Regards, > Greg Young - Houston (DWH) > RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix > Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > Don't turn on the pump. We lost a plane that turned the pump > > on during the first flight, killed the engine and could not > > restart because it was flooded. Ask Greg Young. Pump is a > > standby for when the engine pump fails. > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs > > Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Berthet, Andre G" > > To: > > Subject: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Berthet, Andre G" > > > > > > > > I have an IO-360-A1A and have a strange problem. When the > > engine is hot, > > > turning the booster pump ON will results in a substantial > > drop of RPM. > > > Let say if I set my engine speed to 1300 RPM and then turn > > the booster > > > ON, the engine speed will decrease by about 500 RPM. Of > > course if I do > > > that at a normal idling of 700 RPM, the engine just quit. > > My servo has > > > been overhauled in January, re-inspected in June and I'm > > sending it back > > > again. The flow divider and the fuel nozzles have been > > overhauled last > > > June too. Also the idling speed is changing depending if > > the engine is > > > hot or cold. My mixture is adjusted for a 25 RPM rise at ICO. > > > > > > My engine driven pump alone produces 23 PSI of fuel > > pressure, and when > > > the booster pump is turned ON it increases the pressure to 28 PSI. > > > > > > Could anyone have suggestions how to fix this problem? > > > > > > Andre > > > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:58:34 AM PST US Subject: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 From: sjhdcl@kingston.net --> RV-List message posted by: sjhdcl@kingston.net Anybody know where to find AN470AD3-3.5. I've tried B&B Aircraft Supply (they carry several 1/2 size rivets) but no luck. Steve RV7A #2 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:01:38 AM PST US From: SportAV8R@aol.com Subject: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com Question for you fellows: Last weekend, my Facet didn't sound right on start-up (carbureted O-320 with electric solenoid primer) and the engine behaved as if it had received no primer shot, though I gave it the usual "4-count" on the primer button. The usual loud clacking of the fuel boost pump was not present; instead there was a muted clicking... a few light taps on the body of the pump with a mallet restored the familiar noise, along with a rise in fuel pressure from 1 to 2 psig (normal reading is 4 or 5 psig). The engine then started normally and fuel pressure was 4 psi with or without the boost pump (normal readings, BTW). The round trip flight to Cleveland was completed without incident, and the pump sounded and behaved normally on this and a subsequent flight (to Dean Meylor's beautiful home airstrip, 9NC9). I'm wondering if I should be concerned by this recent "hiccup" in pump operation... is it the beginning of the end for my electric pump? Could it foreshadow a dangerous fuel line stoppage condition? Just curious how "pre-emptive" I need to be in this situation. -Bill B / "Stormy" RV-6A - 410 hrs ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:06:40 AM PST US From: "Shemp" Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 --> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" Did u try Vans? shemp do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 > --> RV-List message posted by: sjhdcl@kingston.net > > Anybody know where to find AN470AD3-3.5. > > I've tried B&B Aircraft Supply (they carry several 1/2 size rivets) but no > luck. > > Steve > RV7A #2 > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:19:42 AM PST US From: Scott Bilinski Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 --> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski You dont have the rivet cut tool in your tool kit? It basically shears off the unwanted length. At 09:58 AM 8/11/2004 -0400, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: sjhdcl@kingston.net > >Anybody know where to find AN470AD3-3.5. > >I've tried B&B Aircraft Supply (they carry several 1/2 size rivets) but no >luck. > >Steve >RV7A #2 > > Scott Bilinski Eng dept 305 Phone (858) 657-2536 Pager (858) 502-5190 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:30:08 AM PST US From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" Subject: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" List, For the builders who have installed a plenum to cool their engines have you needed to install Van's upper cowl cooling ramps? I can't see why they would be of any value with the Plenum Conversion and might just be in the way? Thanks for any help, Tom in Ohio ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 07:43:42 AM PST US From: "Richard Bibb" Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 --> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Bibb" They are a standard size in the RV-4 kit so I know Van's has them.... ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 > --> RV-List message posted by: sjhdcl@kingston.net > > Anybody know where to find AN470AD3-3.5. > > I've tried B&B Aircraft Supply (they carry several 1/2 size rivets) but no > luck. > > Steve > RV7A #2 > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:57:15 AM PST US From: "Monty Barrett" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Monty Barrett" The usual cause of " Run on " or after firing is a small leakage past the idle valve when in idle cutoff. The smallest grain of grit will scar the 2 Plates that rotate to close off an orfice when in ICO and this will allow enough fuel to after fire. I suggest: 1. check your mixture cable rigging to make sure you are at ICO 2. make sure the boost pump is OFF at shutdown. 3. If after firing is a nuisance to you, after the mixture is in ICO, open the throttle and it should quit. Make sure the brakes work stick full back if you open the throttle. 4. Normal procedure at servo overhaul is to lap the 2 plates so that they are perfectly smooth with no scratches. I saw a thread about boost pump on changing the speed momentarily. I would consider this to be normal. Monty Barrett Barrett Performance Aircraft, Inc. FAA-CRS XBTR929K -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Shemp Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Shemp" Speaking of Bendix injectors, I was speaking with one of the factory reps at Oshkosh concerning the cd they gave me for maintaing the RSA fuel injection system. One of the topics on the cd is what to do if you get run on during shut down. The cd says this is due to a servo problem. I just had my servo and distributor rebuilt 100 hours ago. It only runs on when the engine and oat are hot. Im having a hard time accepting the fact that the servo isnt working properly. Has anyone else had this situation? Thanks Shemp (Jeff Dowling) RV-6a/ 100 hours Chicago/ Louisville ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gregory Young" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > --> RV-List message posted by: "Gregory Young" > > Cy, your recollection of my accident is incorrect. In fact, my boost pump > was OFF on landing precisely because of symptoms similar to those Andre > described. The engine ran fine until I pulled the power on base. Airflow > Performance recommends the boost be ON for takeoff and landing as does > Lycoming for their Bendix injected engines. I turned it off because my > mixture went over-rich when I turned the boost on for approach. I still > don't have a definitive cause of the engine failure but my working theory is > that the boost being off was a contributing event in a chain leading to > vapor lock. > > Andre, your symptoms sound like what I experienced in flight and I implore > you not to fly until you resolve the problem. Have you tried leaning it when > the boost is on? That would confirm an over-rich condition like I > experienced. I can't offer any suggestions other than to resolve it on the > ground. I would be very interested in anything you find, it may answer some > questions for me. Even if you have a Bendix system, the AFP was based on the > Bendix design so any findings would probably apply. > > Regards, > Greg Young - Houston (DWH) > RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix > Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > Don't turn on the pump. We lost a plane that turned the pump > > on during the first flight, killed the engine and could not > > restart because it was flooded. Ask Greg Young. Pump is a > > standby for when the engine pump fails. > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs > > Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Berthet, Andre G" > > To: > > Subject: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Berthet, Andre G" > > > > > > > > I have an IO-360-A1A and have a strange problem. When the > > engine is hot, > > > turning the booster pump ON will results in a substantial > > drop of RPM. > > > Let say if I set my engine speed to 1300 RPM and then turn > > the booster > > > ON, the engine speed will decrease by about 500 RPM. Of > > course if I do > > > that at a normal idling of 700 RPM, the engine just quit. > > My servo has > > > been overhauled in January, re-inspected in June and I'm > > sending it back > > > again. The flow divider and the fuel nozzles have been > > overhauled last > > > June too. Also the idling speed is changing depending if > > the engine is > > > hot or cold. My mixture is adjusted for a 25 RPM rise at ICO. > > > > > > My engine driven pump alone produces 23 PSI of fuel > > pressure, and when > > > the booster pump is turned ON it increases the pressure to 28 PSI. > > > > > > Could anyone have suggestions how to fix this problem? > > > > > > Andre > > > > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:59:28 AM PST US From: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Todd: I also equipped my 6 with the same valve, thinking it would stop calf cramps in my three teenage daughters holding the brakes during runups. My valve behaves just like yours, which is annoying. I suspect that two things are at play here, and there is a way to get it to release without the need to shutdown or egress. I think that either the internal design of the valve, or the mechanical advantage of the valve lever, or even the rigidity of the Bowden cable that actuates the lever, can't overcome the pressure trapped in the lines once the parking brakes are set. With this in mind, the way to reduce the load on the valve is to apply and hold pressure with the toe brakes, then move the valve to the off position. It takes a few tries to get it to work, usually only one wheel releases first, before it will roll with only idle power. My daughter says that it works best if the pressure applied to the toe brakes is the same and the pressure originally applied, and trapped in, the brakes lines by the valve being closed. This makes sense, in effect balancing the pressure on both sides of the valve, making it easier to move internally. I did find it so annoying-from the outside, it appears that one is so stupid they're attempting to taxi with the brakes on and can't figure out why it won't go anywhere-that I don't use it anymore, but the girls find it worth the hassle. I've started to wonder what to do if the valve should accidentally get closed in flight, though..... Scott in Vancouver ----- Original Message ----- From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > Have a couple of friends that were flying to Alaska in a 125 hour old Maule > this summer. Used the parking brake. Took off OK but one brake was still > locked on landing. Wiped out the gear, one wing, 3 bladed prop. Fortunately > the $45,000 repair is covered by insurance as they are now looking at more > things. > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair > Safety Programs Editor - TC > EAA Sport Pilot > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Todd Bartrim" > To: "RV List (E-mail)" > Subject: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" > > > > Hi All; > > I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a > real > > problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for > parking > > I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds very > > well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost > always > > leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have > ensured > > that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the brake > to > > release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops of > > fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake > > operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last > year, > > but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd forgotten > > about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must > say > > it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the > last > > time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! > > Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? > > > > Todd Bartrim > > > > RV9Endurance > > 13B Turbo Rotary > > C-FSTB > > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > > > "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard > > work and determination to the things they do." > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 08:04:04 AM PST US From: "Steve&Anita Nyman" Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak Servo Hardware --> RV-List message posted by: "Steve&Anita Nyman" TruTrak does indeed have a hardware list for there installation. Paul at TruTrak emailed it to me this morning. Most of it I have, but will have to order replacements. Thanks Steve 7QB MEM ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:06:35 AM PST US From: "Greg Young" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Greg Young" Those are my words but your inference that the boost stayed on is incorrect. I wrote that two days after the accident and although I've recounted it numerous time in the last 3 years, I guess back then I wasn't specific in the configuration. I fell back to what had been working flawlessly for the 30 minutes prior, i.e. full rich and boost OFF. That followed the theory that if the last action you took made things worse, then undo it. Greg > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > I believe these are your words.. > > For 30 minutes I had a glorious flight and was the happiest > man in the > air. > > Returning to Hooks, when I turned on the boost pump the > engine went rough. > > After trying various combinations of boost on/off and leaning I > > thought > the > > engine was running smooth and planned for a high speed approach > > Am I wrong? > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Gregory Young" > > > > Cy, your recollection of my accident is incorrect. In fact, > my boost pump > > was OFF on landing precisely because of symptoms similar to > those Andre > > described. The engine ran fine until I pulled the power on > base. Airflow > > Performance recommends the boost be ON for takeoff and > landing as does > > Lycoming for their Bendix injected engines. I turned it off > because my > > mixture went over-rich when I turned the boost on for > approach. I still > > don't have a definitive cause of the engine failure but my > working theory > is > > that the boost being off was a contributing event in a > chain leading to > > vapor lock. > > > > Andre, your symptoms sound like what I experienced in > flight and I implore > > you not to fly until you resolve the problem. Have you > tried leaning it > when > > the boost is on? That would confirm an over-rich condition like I > > experienced. I can't offer any suggestions other than to > resolve it on the > > ground. I would be very interested in anything you find, it > may answer > some > > questions for me. Even if you have a Bendix system, the AFP > was based on > the > > Bendix design so any findings would probably apply. > > > > Regards, > > Greg Young - Houston (DWH) > > RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix > > Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A > > > > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > > > Don't turn on the pump. We lost a plane that turned the pump > > > on during the first flight, killed the engine and could not > > > restart because it was flooded. Ask Greg Young. Pump is a > > > standby for when the engine pump fails. > > > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs > > > Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Berthet, Andre G" > > > To: > > > Subject: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > > > > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Berthet, Andre G" > > > > > > > > > > > I have an IO-360-A1A and have a strange problem. When the > > > engine is hot, > > > > turning the booster pump ON will results in a substantial > > > drop of RPM. > > > > Let say if I set my engine speed to 1300 RPM and then turn > > > the booster > > > > ON, the engine speed will decrease by about 500 RPM. Of > > > course if I do > > > > that at a normal idling of 700 RPM, the engine just quit. > > > My servo has > > > > been overhauled in January, re-inspected in June and I'm > > > sending it back > > > > again. The flow divider and the fuel nozzles have been > > > overhauled last > > > > June too. Also the idling speed is changing depending if > > > the engine is > > > > hot or cold. My mixture is adjusted for a 25 RPM rise at ICO. > > > > > > > > My engine driven pump alone produces 23 PSI of fuel > > > pressure, and when > > > > the booster pump is turned ON it increases the pressure > to 28 PSI. > > > > > > > > Could anyone have suggestions how to fix this problem? > > > > > > > > Andre ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 08:14:11 AM PST US From: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" My two cents: somewhere in the archives should be a previous post describing how larger aircraft overcome fuel "boiling", caused by warm fuel lifted quickly to a high altitude before it has time to cool. The result is bubbles in the fuel line, minimized by having a pump at the supply source, in the tank. Large airliners sometimes have a gravity-feeding max altitude table, to use in case of massive electrical problems that depower the tank pumps. The table is divided into two depending on how long the aircraft has been at altitude, if not for very long, an immediate descent into the mid-teens is necessary. Scott in Vancouver----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Rozendaal" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" > > > > > Dan, why the pump when switching tanks? > > > > > Alex, > > Many low wing aircraft flight manuals call for boost pumps on while > switching tanks. This is especially important in higher altitude airplanes. > Between the vapor pressure of the fuel and the low ambient air pressure, > switching tanks can get interesting. > > At sea level, you have 14.7 psi available to replace the fuel consumed by > the engine, but at 18,000 it is less than half of that. Throw in the vapor > pressure of the fuel and getting fuel to the pump can be a big deal. Many > high altitude airplanes have the electric boost pump built in the tank. > Some have small boost pumps in the tank that run all the time to feed the > engine driven or primary electric boost pumps. > > Many turbine airplanes have jet (or venturi) pumps that are powered by the > return fuel that feeds fuel to the engine driven fuel pump much like a two > pipe well pump system on a farm. > > In the B-25 the fuel pressure will start to jump around above 10,000 feet in > the summertime. We have a low setting on the electric pumps that we use to > smooth it out. > > Tailwinds, > Doug Rozendaal > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 08:17:15 AM PST US From: "Tim Bryan" Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" Stormy, If you had to tap the pump to get it going, You are not getting a rise in pressure with it running over the engine pump, and not seeing your normal pressure on the guage... Then you need to address this NOW! My feeling is that you are now test flying your airplane as it is not in the same condition as previously tested and flown. Don't rule out a problem with the engine pump or the wiring but sounds like a boost pump problem Just my .02 worth. Tim Bryan RV-6 N616TB -------Original Message------- From: rv-list@matronics.com Subject: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com Question for you fellows: Last weekend, my Facet didn't sound right on start-up (carbureted O-320 with electric solenoid primer) and the engine behaved as if it had received no primer shot, though I gave it the usual "4-count" on the primer button. The usual loud clacking of the fuel boost pump was not present; instead there was a muted clicking... a few light taps on the body of the pump with a mallet restored the familiar noise, along with a rise in fuel pressure from 1 to 2 psig (normal reading is 4 or 5 psig). The engine then started normally and fuel pressure was 4 psi with or without the boost pump (normal readings, BTW). The round trip flight to Cleveland was completed without incident, and the pump sounded and behaved normally on this and a subsequent flight (to Dean Meylor's beautiful home airstrip, 9NC9). I'm wondering if I should be concerned by this recent "hiccup" in pump operation... is it the beginning of the end for my electric pump? Could it foreshadow a dangerous fuel line stoppage condition? Just curious how "pre-emptive" I need to be in this situation. -Bill B / "Stormy" RV-6A - 410 hrs ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 08:20:24 AM PST US From: "Ross Mickey" Subject: RE: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question --> RV-List message posted by: "Ross Mickey" -----Original Message----- From: Tom & Cathy Ervin List, For the builders who have installed a plenum to cool their engines have you needed to install Van's upper cowl cooling ramps? I can't see why they would be of any value with the Plenum Conversion and might just be in the way? Thanks for any help, Tom in Ohio Tom, This depends on your plenum. I built my own. All I did was cover the baffles with a custom cut/bent piece of aluminum sheet that is held in place with hinge pins and a few screws in front. I am using the standard air intake ducts. I made my plenum to fit the standard cowl and baffle setup. Ross Mickey RV6A N9PT ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 08:27:04 AM PST US From: Phil Birkelbach Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 --> RV-List message posted by: Phil Birkelbach Here is a link to Wicks. They are listed as MS20470 instead of AN470 but they should be the same thing. http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_cat.php/subid=2182/index.html Just curious, where you are using such a small universal head rivet in your RV-7A? There were a few times when I wanted to just use a small UH rivet but it always seemed easier to just go ahead and dimple the thing than to worry about ordering and waiting. Godspeed, Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Panel http://www.myrv7.com sjhdcl@kingston.net wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: sjhdcl@kingston.net > >Anybody know where to find AN470AD3-3.5. > >I've tried B&B Aircraft Supply (they carry several 1/2 size rivets) but no >luck. > >Steve >RV7A #2 > > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 08:28:00 AM PST US From: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Subject: Fw: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > Todd: > I also equipped my 6 with the same valve, thinking it would stop calf > cramps in my three teenage daughters holding the brakes during runups. > My valve behaves just like yours, which is annoying. I suspect that two > things are at play here, and there is a way to get it to release without > the need to shutdown or egress. > I think that either the internal design of the valve, or the mechanical > advantage of the valve lever, or even the rigidity of the Bowden cable that > actuates the lever, can't overcome the pressure trapped in the lines once > the parking brakes are set. > With this in mind, the way to reduce the load on the valve is to apply and > hold pressure with the toe brakes, then move the valve to the off position. > It takes a few tries to get it to work, usually only one wheel releases > first, before it will roll with only idle power. > My daughter says that it works best if the pressure applied to the toe > brakes is the same and the pressure originally applied, and trapped in, the > brakes lines by the valve being closed. > This makes sense, in effect balancing the pressure on both sides of the > valve, making it easier to move internally. > I did find it so annoying-from the outside, it appears that one is so > stupid they're attempting to taxi with the brakes on and can't figure out > why it won't go anywhere-that I don't use it anymore, but the girls find it > worth the hassle. > I've started to wonder what to do if the valve should accidentally get > closed in flight, though..... > > Scott in Vancouver > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "cgalley" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 5:26 AM > Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > Have a couple of friends that were flying to Alaska in a 125 hour old > Maule > > this summer. Used the parking brake. Took off OK but one brake was still > > locked on landing. Wiped out the gear, one wing, 3 bladed prop. > Fortunately > > the $45,000 repair is covered by insurance as they are now looking at more > > things. > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair > > Safety Programs Editor - TC > > EAA Sport Pilot > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Todd Bartrim" > > To: "RV List (E-mail)" > > Subject: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" > > > > > > Hi All; > > > I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a > > real > > > problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for > > parking > > > I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds > very > > > well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost > > always > > > leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have > > ensured > > > that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the > brake > > to > > > release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops > of > > > fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake > > > operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last > > year, > > > but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd > forgotten > > > about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must > > say > > > it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the > > last > > > time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! > > > Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? > > > > > > Todd Bartrim > > > > > > RV9Endurance > > > 13B Turbo Rotary > > > C-FSTB > > > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > > > > > "The world will always have a place for those that bring > hard > > > work and determination to the things they do." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:31:04 AM PST US From: Sam Buchanan Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan SportAV8R@aol.com wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com > > Question for you fellows: > > Last weekend, my Facet didn't sound right on start-up (carbureted > O-320 with electric solenoid primer) and the engine behaved as if it > had received no primer shot, though I gave it the usual "4-count" on > the primer button. The usual loud clacking of the fuel boost pump > was not present; instead there was a muted clicking... a few light > taps on the body of the pump with a mallet restored the familiar > noise, along with a rise in fuel pressure from 1 to 2 psig (normal > reading is 4 or 5 psig). The engine then started normally and fuel > pressure was 4 psi with or without the boost pump (normal readings, > BTW). The round trip flight to Cleveland was completed without > incident, and the pump sounded and behaved normally on this and a > subsequent flight (to Dean Meylor's beautiful home airstrip, 9NC9). > > I'm wondering if I should be concerned by this recent "hiccup" in > pump operation... is it the beginning of the end for my electric > pump? Could it foreshadow a dangerous fuel line stoppage condition? > > Just curious how "pre-emptive" I need to be in this situation. > > -Bill B / "Stormy" RV-6A - 410 hrs Less than $40.00 will put this question to bed: http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin/catalog.cgi?ident=1092238105-152-264&browse=engines&product=pump-carb Just replace the pump instead of worrying about it. :-) Sam Buchanan ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 08:31:35 AM PST US From: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" My plenum top is just a large sheet of .032. At the front, it has ears of baffle sealing material at the vertical sides, and about a six-inch-wide "finger" of .032 extending forward across the top of the cowl inlets, which spring up against the inlet ramps, protected against chafing with UHMW tape left over from the flaps. SCott in VAncouver ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ross Mickey" Subject: RE: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question > --> RV-List message posted by: "Ross Mickey" > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom & Cathy Ervin > > List, > For the builders who have installed a plenum to cool their > engines have you needed to install Van's upper cowl cooling ramps? > I can't see why they would be of any value with the Plenum > Conversion and might just be in the way? > > Thanks for any help, Tom in Ohio > > Tom, > > This depends on your plenum. I built my own. All I did was cover the > baffles with a custom cut/bent piece of aluminum sheet that is held in > place with hinge pins and a few screws in front. I am using the > standard air intake ducts. I made my plenum to fit the standard cowl > and baffle setup. > > Ross Mickey > RV6A > N9PT > > ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 08:32:28 AM PST US From: "Tim Bryan" Subject: Re: RV-List: CS vs FP props --> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" Great post Doug, I am not flying mine yet but another plus I thought of was descent speed. I had a C-170 with 0360 Lyc and constant speed equipped. With the constant speed prop I could just trim down and keep my speeds up for the last miles of the trip. With the FP I had to begin to slow down also to keep from over RPM. It kind of made up for the slower climb out speeds to get it back at the other end. Not sure if this is a factor in the RV but I would think so. Tim Bryan RV-6 0-360 and CS prop Will fly this year -------Original Message------- From: rv-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: CS vs FP props --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" I had a wood FP on my first RV-4 and I wanted a C/S for the following reasons. 1. Rain, I needed a metal prop of some sort for IFR. 2. Acro, with a metal FP, rpm overspeed is really critical and I did not want to live in fear of the propeller coming apart. 3. Formation, The C/S has both, better power response, and better braking for formation flying. 4. T/O climb performance. The C/S wins big here, much longer vertical lines. 5.Lower cruise RPM, The C/S allows me to cruise at a much lower rpm which is quieter and saves fuel. At 12,000 ft, 2300 and 2400 rpm yields the same speed and 2500 rpm is slower, but the fuel flow changes dramatically with decreasing rpms. 2100 rpms up high and I can get some amazing miles per gallon numbers. 6. Weight, The only time weight is a good thing in an airplane, but I wanted to be able to put a fat guy in the back seat of my -4. My wood prop airplane was pretty spooky with a heavy guy in back. That was the thought process I used, and I am really happy. I would hate to go back to a F/P of any sort. Your results may differ...... Tailwinds Doug Rozendaal ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 08:39:21 AM PST US From: Jeff Point Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question --> RV-List message posted by: Jeff Point On my plenum, I designed the inlets to follow the approximate shape of the cooling ramps. No need to glass the ramps into the cowl, and they would be in the way if installed. Pics at : http://home.mindspring.com/~rv6/rv6plenumpics/ Jeff Point RV-6 Milwaukee WI > > ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 08:48:26 AM PST US From: "Dan Checkoway" Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 --> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" Rivet cutter... do not archive )_( Dan RV-7 N714D http://www.rvproject.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 > --> RV-List message posted by: sjhdcl@kingston.net > > Anybody know where to find AN470AD3-3.5. > > I've tried B&B Aircraft Supply (they carry several 1/2 size rivets) but no > luck. > > Steve > RV7A #2 > > ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 08:55:49 AM PST US From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" The inference that the boost stayed on is incorrect. My source which I consulted claims that the "over boost" creates turbulence and cavitation in the engine pump. It takes a little time for everything to come back to normal. But the chain of events was started by the over boost even though you removed it, the cavitation (air bubble) stopped the engine. At least that is what my Mechanic with over 40 years of experience said. He also said that this was a well known phenomenon. Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Young" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > --> RV-List message posted by: "Greg Young" > > Those are my words but your inference that the boost stayed on is incorrect. > I wrote that two days after the accident and although I've recounted it > numerous time in the last 3 years, I guess back then I wasn't specific in > the configuration. I fell back to what had been working flawlessly > for the 30 minutes prior, i.e. full rich and boost OFF. That followed the > theory that if the last action you took made things worse, then undo it. > > Greg > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > I believe these are your words.. > > > For 30 minutes I had a glorious flight and was the happiest > > man in the > > air. > > > Returning to Hooks, when I turned on the boost pump the > > engine went rough. > > > After trying various combinations of boost on/off and leaning I > > > thought > > the > > > engine was running smooth and planned for a high speed approach > > > > Am I wrong? > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Gregory Young" > > > > > > Cy, your recollection of my accident is incorrect. In fact, > > my boost pump > > > was OFF on landing precisely because of symptoms similar to > > those Andre > > > described. The engine ran fine until I pulled the power on > > base. Airflow > > > Performance recommends the boost be ON for takeoff and > > landing as does > > > Lycoming for their Bendix injected engines. I turned it off > > because my > > > mixture went over-rich when I turned the boost on for > > approach. I still > > > don't have a definitive cause of the engine failure but my > > working theory > > is > > > that the boost being off was a contributing event in a > > chain leading to > > > vapor lock. > > > > > > Andre, your symptoms sound like what I experienced in > > flight and I implore > > > you not to fly until you resolve the problem. Have you > > tried leaning it > > when > > > the boost is on? That would confirm an over-rich condition like I > > > experienced. I can't offer any suggestions other than to > > resolve it on the > > > ground. I would be very interested in anything you find, it > > may answer > > some > > > questions for me. Even if you have a Bendix system, the AFP > > was based on > > the > > > Bendix design so any findings would probably apply. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Greg Young - Houston (DWH) > > > RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix > > > Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > > > > > Don't turn on the pump. We lost a plane that turned the pump > > > > on during the first flight, killed the engine and could not > > > > restart because it was flooded. Ask Greg Young. Pump is a > > > > standby for when the engine pump fails. > > > > > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs > > > > Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Berthet, Andre G" > > > > To: > > > > Subject: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Berthet, Andre G" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have an IO-360-A1A and have a strange problem. When the > > > > engine is hot, > > > > > turning the booster pump ON will results in a substantial > > > > drop of RPM. > > > > > Let say if I set my engine speed to 1300 RPM and then turn > > > > the booster > > > > > ON, the engine speed will decrease by about 500 RPM. Of > > > > course if I do > > > > > that at a normal idling of 700 RPM, the engine just quit. > > > > My servo has > > > > > been overhauled in January, re-inspected in June and I'm > > > > sending it back > > > > > again. The flow divider and the fuel nozzles have been > > > > overhauled last > > > > > June too. Also the idling speed is changing depending if > > > > the engine is > > > > > hot or cold. My mixture is adjusted for a 25 RPM rise at ICO. > > > > > > > > > > My engine driven pump alone produces 23 PSI of fuel > > > > pressure, and when > > > > > the booster pump is turned ON it increases the pressure > > to 28 PSI. > > > > > > > > > > Could anyone have suggestions how to fix this problem? > > > > > > > > > > Andre > > ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 09:26:33 AM PST US From: Scott Bilinski Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 --> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski You did not get one in your tool kit? I did. Drop the rivet in and adjust it to the length you need squeeze the handle and there you go, the exact length you need. At 08:50 AM 8/11/2004 -0700, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" > >Rivet cutter... > >do not archive >)_( Dan >RV-7 N714D >http://www.rvproject.com > >----- Original Message ----- >From: >To: >Subject: RV-List: Rivet search AN470AD3-3.5 > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: sjhdcl@kingston.net > > > > Anybody know where to find AN470AD3-3.5. > > > > I've tried B&B Aircraft Supply (they carry several 1/2 size rivets) but no > > luck. > > > > Steve > > RV7A #2 > > > > > > Scott Bilinski Eng dept 305 Phone (858) 657-2536 Pager (858) 502-5190 ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 09:27:13 AM PST US From: George Neal E Capt AU/PC Subject: RE: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: George Neal E Capt AU/PC Dernit, Sam, if he just replaces the pump we won't get to argue about it for the next few weeks. 73... neal >Less than $40.00 will put this question to bed: >Sam Buchanan ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 09:36:55 AM PST US Subject: RV-List: RV-7A newbie questions From: --> RV-List message posted by: After reviewing the archives on priming/primers I have determined that the following is probably the most logical approach to priming/primers for the RV-7A. I would just like some confirmation that I have understood the posts correctly: 1. As a minimum need to prime the joined parts (riveted rib flanges etc) 2. As a minimum non-alclad parts need to be primed 3. 2 part epoxy primer seems to be the primer of choice (way back when I recall we used zinc chromate on everything but I guess this is old hat) 4. Self etch Marhyde spray can is ok for spot priming (csk holes etc) but is not good enough for general priming/corrosion protection 5. Breathing apparatus is essential when spraying the epoxy primer (can this stuff be brushed on for small areas?) The above is a reasonable compromise between corrosion protection and weight. Is this a correct interpretation of the archives?? Additionally when referring to scotchbrite wheels do most people use them in bench grinders or handheld drills or both, I assume the deburring/polishing version is the one that is used. Thanks Dave RV-7A (just starting the empennage kit) Do not archive Dave ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 09:48:13 AM PST US From: "Charles E. Brame" Dean Psiropoulos Subject: RV-List: Rudder issues --> RV-List message posted by: "Charles E. Brame" Dean, Here are my solutions. I trimmed the aft fuselage skin so that it just clears the rudder at full deflection. The resulting trailing edge of the fuselage skin is not a straight line, but it doesn't detract from the appearance at all. I figured as much fairing as I could get was the best idea. Seems to work okay. I gave up on Van's standard 6A tie down bracket. I ordered a -7A tie down bracket, which is an extruded fixture which mounts on the forward side of the aft bulkhead. The tie down ring screws into the fixture similar to the wing tie down rings. I intend for the aft tie down ring to be permanently installed as it also acts as a skid bar to protect the rudder bottom in the -6A. I too, have the nav light/strobe package in the rudder bottom. I ran the fat wire and the nav light wires laced together up the inside of the rudder to above the hinge. I made an adel clamp to hold the wires clear of the hinge. I cut a 5/8" tall, three inch wide slot in the forward edge of the rudder for the wires to exit the rudder and to allow for wire movement with rudder deflection. The slot is about three inches above the hinge. I made a single 1/2" hole in the centerline of the aft bulkhead/vertical fin spar to match up with the slot. I used staggerd handshake connectors for all the wires which will connect just inside of the aft bulkhead - that will allow for easy rudder removal if necessary and the stagger makes the wires easier to fit though the hole. I'll try to take a picture of my set up and send it to you off line. Charlie RV-6A N11CB San Antonio ------------------------------------ > Time: 10:03:31 PM PST US > From: "Dean Psiropoulos" > Subject: RV-List: Rudder issues. > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Dean Psiropoulos" > > I have a few rudder installation issues on my RV-6A. First there is the aft > fuselage skin overlap, I left it fairly long and made some smooth cutouts > where the rudder bottom leading edge would touch it when the rudder is > deflected. From other RVs I've seen most people cut it straight down pretty > close to the aft bulkhead leaving quite a gap there. Any reason for this or > is everyone just cutting it close as a painless exercise? > > > Also, on the RV-6A there is the tie down bracket mounted on the aft bulkhead > right in front of the fiberglass rudder bottom leading edge. With the rudder > adjusted out from the vertical stab as specified on Van's plans and the tie > down bracket ground down close to the weld, the rudder bottom won't allow > the rudder to inserted far enough in to get the hinge bolts in. What's the > fix for this? Is everyone just adjusting the hiem bearings out from the > rudder to increase the gap? Or are you cutting the leading edge off the > bottom fairing and making it shorter? Or something else? > > > One last thing, I will be installing a combination aft position light strobe > light in the rudder bottom. I need a hole for the fat strobe wire and a > smaller hole for small power and ground wires to the light. Where is the > best place to put these holes, above the bottom hinge bracket, below the > bottom hinge bracket, some other place? Should I use one large hole or a > large hole and a small hole? I need to make a slot in the rudder bottom to > allow for rudder deflection I assume?! Any suggestions? Thanks for > entertaining this anal slow builder. > > > Dean Psiropoulos > > RV-6A N197DM ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 09:49:49 AM PST US From: "czechsix@juno.com" Subject: RE: RV-List: Can someone bring me up to speed - RV-6A nose wheel pro blems. --> RV-List message posted by: "czechsix@juno.com" As far as greater building "challenge" of the NW, remember also the addition of a step (or two for some folks). With respect to weight, for the -8 series, the -8A is actually a bit lighter because the -8 has those big honkin' gear tower structures. But for the -6/7/9 series the TD model will be a few pounds lighter... --Mark Navratil Cedar Rapids, Iowa RV-8A N2D painting... Subject: RE: RV-List: Can someone bring me up to speed - RV-6A nose wheel problems. From: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" --> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" Another wheel pant, another gear fairing, transition fairing to cowl, more hardware, more alignments, more weight, another tire hub assembly, another potential shimmy hassle. Mike Stewart 6A Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of CBRxxDRV@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Can someone bring me up to speed - RV-6A nose wheel problems. --> RV-List message posted by: CBRxxDRV@aol.com In a message dated 8/10/04 8:11:05 AM Eastern Daylight Time, lhelming@sigecom.net writes: > The NW is a bit > more challenging to build. > ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 09:51:27 AM PST US From: "czechsix@juno.com" Subject: RV-List: Re: CS vs FP props --> RV-List message posted by: "czechsix@juno.com" Sal, I recently got a new Hartzell for my -8A, not flying quite yet. I've flown with several friends in RV's of various types, some with FP and some with CS props. The CS props are definitely a bigger kick in the pants for takeoff and climb as you've already noted. The FP are sure nice for their low cost and simplicity (and lighter weight when compared to Hartzell), but there are some more operational limitations other than just takeoff. If you're always going to cruise at the same altitude and power setting, get a FP setup for this one condition and you'll be happy. If you want the flexibility of optimizing cruise at different altitudes and power settings, go with CS. The typical pitch setting on a Sensenich for an RV will overspeed the engine at lower altitudes and higher power settings. So you have to reduce power, and even then you may end up running 26-2700 rpm when you'd prefer to reduce noise and increase efficiency by pulling the prop back to 2400. Also if you do a cro I'm sure you're aware of the CS advantages (more power on the upside, braking on the downside, etc). FWIW....this is all a repeat of what's been rehashed in the archives over and over... --Mark Navratil Cedar Rapids, Iowa RV-8A N2D painting... Time: 09:36:39 PM PST US From: CBRxxDRV@aol.com Subject: RV-List: CS vs FP props --> RV-List message posted by: CBRxxDRV@aol.com Has anyone made an upgrade? Built the plane then made the switch from Fixed pitch to constant speed? That would be a great way to compare. I have a RV-4 with a Hartsell. It has plenty of wow on takeoff. I find that at 500 feet agl I pull the power back and set the prop to the rpm I want. Set it and forget it. The -6 I trained in had a fixed pitch and it had enough wow at take off. Am I missing something here? With 190 hp 0-360 I figure I should have all the wow that is needed and cruise should not be an issue on a -8. Anyone have any views or thoughts?? I am trying to decide if I want to spend the extra $$ for a new hartsell for my -8. I promissed myself I would not cut corners but an Extra $4500 for the first 500 feet AGL seems a bit much. TIA RV-4 RV-8 tail Sal Capra Lakeland, FL My Home Page http://hometown.aol.com/cbrxxdrv/index.html ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 09:53:44 AM PST US From: "czechsix@juno.com" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Boost Pump Location RV-6 --> RV-List message posted by: "czechsix@juno.com" There's also a bazillion Piper Cherokee-series (Warriors and Archers and etc) out there with the round "beer can" Facet pump happily thumping away on the engine side of the firewall... --Mark Navratil Cedar Rapids, Iowa RV-8A N2D with "beer can" pump in my wingroot...(as well as a gascolator, but that's another discussion, in itself :-) From: Jim Sears Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Boost Pump Location RV-6 --> RV-List message posted by: Jim Sears > Wherever you put the Boost pump, it should be on the " cold side " of the > firewall, NOT in the engine compartment. Boost pumps do not survive the > high temps present in the engine bay. They are much happier and live longer > If kept away from the heat as much as practical. I beg to differ. I had a round Facet boost pump on my '77 Cheetah that did quite well on the engine side of the firewall. With that, I put the same kind on my -6A on the engine side of the firewall. Works like a charm. Maybe the little square ones that Van's sells don't last in the heat; but, I didn't care too much for those, anyway. I personally don't care for having the boost pump in the cabin with me. Because I put mine on the engine side, it was easy to T off that for the primer valve, as well. Oh, yeah. I don't have a gascolator, either. That's another discussion, in itself. :-) Jim Sears in KY RV-6A N198JS (Scooter) RV-7A #70317 (Finishing the tail) EAA Technical Counselor ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 10:31:49 AM PST US From: "Randy Lervold" Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: "Randy Lervold" > Last weekend, my Facet didn't sound right on start-up (carbureted O-320 with electric solenoid primer) and the engine behaved as if it had received no primer shot, though I gave it the usual "4-count" on the primer button. The usual loud clacking of the fuel boost pump was not present; instead there was a muted clicking... a few light taps on the body of the pump with a mallet restored the familiar noise, along with a rise in fuel pressure from 1 to 2 psig (normal reading is 4 or 5 psig). The engine then started normally and fuel pressure was 4 psi with or without the boost pump (normal readings, BTW). The round trip flight to Cleveland was completed without incident, and the pump sounded and behaved normally on this and a subsequent flight (to Dean Meylor's beautiful home airstrip, 9NC9). > > I'm wondering if I should be concerned by this recent "hiccup" in pump operation... is it the beginning of the end for my electric pump? Could it foreshadow a dangerous fuel line stoppage condition? > > Just curious how "pre-emptive" I need to be in this situation. > > -Bill B / "Stormy" > RV-6A - 410 hrs Bill, those pumps are only $36 from Van's. Personally, I'd replace it at the next opportunity as a preventative measure. Randy Lervold www.rv-3.com www.rv-8.com EAA Technical Counselor ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 10:46:27 AM PST US From: Trainnut01@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Rudder issues --> RV-List message posted by: Trainnut01@aol.com Charlie Any chance I could get a copy of that picture also. Carroll Jernigan 7A Fuselage ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 10:46:47 AM PST US From: Phil Birkelbach Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-7A newbie questions --> RV-List message posted by: Phil Birkelbach I all different kinds of primer on my plane in one place or another. Basically because I could never make up my mind. Here is a synopsis of what I think of each... Mar Hyde Pros - Easy (self-etching), durable, quick drying (can work with the part in an hour) Con - rattle cans are expensive and the finger get's tired. Note - You can buy it by the quart and spray it with a gun Epoxy Pros - Bulletproof and is a moisture barrier without top coat. Looks (fairly) nice. Cons - Pain in the posterior, toxic, not self etching, fairly expensive, heavy, takes a day to cure before working, mixing Vinyl Wash (PG60G2) Pros - Easy (self-etching), lightweight, quick drying (about the same as Mar Hyde), fairly inexpensive Cons - No moisture barrier without topcoat, Ugly as sin, mixing Zinc Chromate (Don't know have no experience) Basically I don't know that Epoxy is the primer of choice (I chose not to use it after the emp kit) but I can tell you that if you put it on correctly you'll need a file to scratch it. The question is, what do you need? and sometimes you don't need the best there is. You can kill a fly with a sledgehammer but do you really want to? The next airplane I build will probably be Mar Hyde all the way. I's use the quart stuff to spray large parts and big jobs and the rattle can for the little stuff. You could probably brush on the Epoxy but you'll still need at least a good repirator to open the can and mix the parts. Probably should use a good respirator for all the above, and a breathing system is always better. I know this will probably start a war but this is just what works for me. Cessna has built a bunch of airplanes with no primer, and few if any of the WWII warbirds were primed and many of them have survived the years. I live in Houston and that is why I am priming. If I lived in Phoenix I probably wouldn't have bothered. Godspeed, Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Panel http://www.myrv7.com dfiggins@es.com wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: > >After reviewing the archives on priming/primers I have determined that >the following is probably the most logical approach to priming/primers >for the RV-7A. I would just like some confirmation that I have >understood the posts correctly: >1. As a minimum need to prime the joined parts (riveted rib flanges etc) >2. As a minimum non-alclad parts need to be primed >3. 2 part epoxy primer seems to be the primer of choice (way back when I >recall we used zinc chromate on everything but I guess this is old hat) >4. Self etch Marhyde spray can is ok for spot priming (csk holes etc) >but is not good enough for general priming/corrosion protection >5. Breathing apparatus is essential when spraying the epoxy primer (can >this stuff be brushed on for small areas?) > >The above is a reasonable compromise between corrosion protection and >weight. > >Is this a correct interpretation of the archives?? > >Additionally when referring to scotchbrite wheels do most people use >them in bench grinders or handheld drills or both, I assume the >deburring/polishing version is the one that is used. > >Thanks > >Dave RV-7A (just starting the empennage kit) >Do not archive > >Dave > > > > ________________________________ Message 42 ____________________________________ Time: 10:58:12 AM PST US From: Gary Zilik Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: Gary Zilik Wait just one dag-burn minute. He's gotta replace the pump and polish the spinner. Then we won't know what fixed it. The pump or the spinner? George Neal E Capt AU/PC wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: George Neal E Capt AU/PC > > Dernit, Sam, if he just replaces the pump we won't get to argue about it for > the next few weeks. > > 73... neal > > >>Less than $40.00 will put this question to bed: >>Sam Buchanan > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 43 ____________________________________ Time: 11:09:56 AM PST US From: "Neil McLeod" Subject: RE: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Neil McLeod" Three teenage daughters!!!??? As the parent of one teenage and one 3 year old daughter I commend you on the ability to keep your medical, I think I would have too much stress induced hypertension if I had 3 teens. Way to go Dad! Neil McLeod 7QB FWF and Finishing -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jaye and Scott Jackson Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Todd: I also equipped my 6 with the same valve, thinking it would stop calf cramps in my three teenage daughters holding the brakes during runups. My valve behaves just like yours, which is annoying. I suspect that two things are at play here, and there is a way to get it to release without the need to shutdown or egress. I think that either the internal design of the valve, or the mechanical advantage of the valve lever, or even the rigidity of the Bowden cable that actuates the lever, can't overcome the pressure trapped in the lines once the parking brakes are set. With this in mind, the way to reduce the load on the valve is to apply and hold pressure with the toe brakes, then move the valve to the off position. It takes a few tries to get it to work, usually only one wheel releases first, before it will roll with only idle power. My daughter says that it works best if the pressure applied to the toe brakes is the same and the pressure originally applied, and trapped in, the brakes lines by the valve being closed. This makes sense, in effect balancing the pressure on both sides of the valve, making it easier to move internally. I did find it so annoying-from the outside, it appears that one is so stupid they're attempting to taxi with the brakes on and can't figure out why it won't go anywhere-that I don't use it anymore, but the girls find it worth the hassle. I've started to wonder what to do if the valve should accidentally get closed in flight, though..... Scott in Vancouver ----- Original Message ----- From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > Have a couple of friends that were flying to Alaska in a 125 hour old Maule > this summer. Used the parking brake. Took off OK but one brake was still > locked on landing. Wiped out the gear, one wing, 3 bladed prop. Fortunately > the $45,000 repair is covered by insurance as they are now looking at more > things. > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair > Safety Programs Editor - TC > EAA Sport Pilot > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Todd Bartrim" > To: "RV List (E-mail)" > Subject: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" > > > > Hi All; > > I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a > real > > problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for > parking > > I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds very > > well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost > always > > leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have > ensured > > that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the brake > to > > release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops of > > fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake > > operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last > year, > > but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd forgotten > > about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must > say > > it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the > last > > time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! > > Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? > > > > Todd Bartrim > > > > RV9Endurance > > 13B Turbo Rotary > > C-FSTB > > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > > > "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard > > work and determination to the things they do." > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 44 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:37 AM PST US From: "Amit Dagan" Subject: RV-List: Talking about LED position lights and Strobes... --> RV-List message posted by: "Amit Dagan" You guys gotta check this one out: http://www.silence-aircraft.de/index-e.html go to "construction" and then on to "Strobe lights". There is even a short video of the strobe/position lights in action. THAT is what they should be like IMHO! AD. ________________________________ Message 45 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:37 AM PST US From: Mickey Coggins Subject: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins Hi, Still several months away, but where I live we have to plan quite a bit in advance. I'm trying to get an idea of how long it will take to reassemble my RV8 after transporting it to an airport. I plan to have the plane 100% assembled and ready to fly in the workshop before taking it apart to transport it. Many thanks for any words of wisdom and experience! Mickey -- Mickey Coggins http://www.rv8.ch/ #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage ________________________________ Message 46 ____________________________________ Time: 11:41:21 AM PST US From: "JOHN STARN" Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" Besides that, he'll have to redo both takeoff and landing check lists by removing the "whack the fuel pump" part. 8*) KABONG Do Not Archive > Wait just one dag-burn minute. He's gotta replace the pump and polish > the spinner. Then we won't know what fixed it. The pump or the spinner? > > Dernit, Sam, if he just replaces the pump we won't get to argue about it for > > the next few weeks. ________________________________ Message 47 ____________________________________ Time: 11:48:04 AM PST US From: "Doug Rozendaal" Subject: Re: RV-List: CS vs FP props --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" That is a factor, but it is easily compensated for by starting decent earlier. It would be a long ways down on my list of reasons for C/S Tailwinds, Doug Rozendaal > --> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" > > Great post Doug, > > I am not flying mine yet but another plus I thought of was descent speed. I > had a C-170 with 0360 Lyc and constant speed equipped. With the constant > speed prop I could just trim down and keep my speeds up for the last miles > of the trip. With the FP I had to begin to slow down also to keep from over > RPM. It kind of made up for the slower climb out speeds to get it back at > the other end. > > Not sure if this is a factor in the RV but I would think so. > > Tim Bryan RV-6 > 0-360 and CS prop > Will fly this year ________________________________ Message 48 ____________________________________ Time: 12:07:50 PM PST US From: SportAV8R@aol.com Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com Less than $40.00 will put this question to bed: >>Sam Buchanan > Where's the fun in that? You guys don't live very close to the edge, do you? ;-) Okay, okay, I'll pay Van $40 for the pump + 19.95 S&H + small-order fee and we'll never know what the real story was. Are you happy now? Actually, the advice is so sensible I'm embarassed I asked the question. At 40 bucks, it really is a throw-away part (like my nosewheel tire tubes and all those wheel bearings over the years; don't question why they fail, just replace them every few hours and be glad they're relatively cheap)- but I was hoping to save some small change in the kitty for all those electro-whizzies from Perihelion Design... shucks. -Stormy ________________________________ Message 49 ____________________________________ Time: 12:23:29 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV-List: CS vs FP props From: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" --> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" Rick Gray did last week. Multi award winning 6. rgray67968@aol.com His comments to me were. Awesome, 6+kts, climb rocks, it was more work than he thought. Mike Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of CBRxxDRV@aol.com Subject: RV-List: CS vs FP props --> RV-List message posted by: CBRxxDRV@aol.com Has anyone made an upgrade? Built the plane then made the switch from Fixed pitch to constant speed? That would be a great way to compare. I have a RV-4 with a Hartsell. It has plenty of wow on takeoff. I find that at 500 feet agl I pull the power back and set the prop to the rpm I want. Set it and forget it. The -6 I trained in had a fixed pitch and it had enough wow at take off. Am I missing something here? With 190 hp 0-360 I figure I should have all the wow that is needed and cruise should not be an issue on a -8. Anyone have any views or thoughts?? I am trying to decide if I want to spend the extra $$ for a new hartsell for my -8. I promissed myself I would not cut corners but an Extra $4500 for the first 500 feet AGL seems a bit much. TIA RV-4 RV-8 tail Sal Capra Lakeland, FL My Home Page http://hometown.aol.com/cbrxxdrv/index.html == == == == ________________________________ Message 50 ____________________________________ Time: 01:15:04 PM PST US From: Terry Mortimore problems. Subject: Re: RV-List: Can someone bring me up to speed - RV-6A nose wheel problems. --> RV-List message posted by: Terry Mortimore problems. Hi gang, thanks for the replies. Looks like I'll go for the 6A version, I'm more comfortable with that idea. I'll order the newer nose gear for peace of mind. tailwinds, terry. Terry Mortimore, 426 McNabb Street Apt #4, Sault Ste Marie, Ontario Canada P6B-1Z3 ________________________________ Message 51 ____________________________________ Time: 01:24:19 PM PST US From: Terry Mortimore Subject: Re: RV-List: Labeling wiring --> RV-List message posted by: Terry Mortimore Hopperdhh@aol.com wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: Hopperdhh@aol.com > >I found that I could write by hand on white heat shrink tubing before putting >it on the wire. Use a Sharpie Twin-tip pen (they come in colors, too). When >the heat shrink shrinks, so does the writing. Easy, cheap and works real >well. > >Dan Hopper >RV-7A (About 35 hours now) > > > Hi Dan: Another variation on the theme is to make labels on paper in small font. Roll it around the wire and use clear heat shrink tubing. Makes for a nice job. tailwinds, terry. Terry Mortimore, 426 McNabb Street Apt #4, Sault Ste Marie, Ontario Canada P6B-1Z3 ________________________________ Message 52 ____________________________________ Time: 01:30:07 PM PST US From: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" It's actually worse than that! I have four teenagers, it's just that one isn't interested... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neil McLeod" Subject: RE: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > --> RV-List message posted by: "Neil McLeod" > > Three teenage daughters!!!??? As the parent of one teenage and one 3 year > old daughter I commend you on the ability to keep your medical, I think I > would have too much stress induced hypertension if I had 3 teens. Way to go > Dad! > > Neil McLeod > 7QB FWF and Finishing > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jaye and Scott > Jackson > To: rv-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" > > > Todd: > I also equipped my 6 with the same valve, thinking it would stop calf > cramps in my three teenage daughters holding the brakes during runups. > My valve behaves just like yours, which is annoying. I suspect that two > things are at play here, and there is a way to get it to release without > the need to shutdown or egress. > I think that either the internal design of the valve, or the mechanical > advantage of the valve lever, or even the rigidity of the Bowden cable that > actuates the lever, can't overcome the pressure trapped in the lines once > the parking brakes are set. > With this in mind, the way to reduce the load on the valve is to apply and > hold pressure with the toe brakes, then move the valve to the off position. > It takes a few tries to get it to work, usually only one wheel releases > first, before it will roll with only idle power. > My daughter says that it works best if the pressure applied to the toe > brakes is the same and the pressure originally applied, and trapped in, the > brakes lines by the valve being closed. > This makes sense, in effect balancing the pressure on both sides of the > valve, making it easier to move internally. > I did find it so annoying-from the outside, it appears that one is so > stupid they're attempting to taxi with the brakes on and can't figure out > why it won't go anywhere-that I don't use it anymore, but the girls find it > worth the hassle. > I've started to wonder what to do if the valve should accidentally get > closed in flight, though..... > > Scott in Vancouver > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "cgalley" > To: > Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > Have a couple of friends that were flying to Alaska in a 125 hour old > Maule > > this summer. Used the parking brake. Took off OK but one brake was still > > locked on landing. Wiped out the gear, one wing, 3 bladed prop. > Fortunately > > the $45,000 repair is covered by insurance as they are now looking at more > > things. > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair > > Safety Programs Editor - TC > > EAA Sport Pilot > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Todd Bartrim" > > To: "RV List (E-mail)" > > Subject: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" > > > > > > Hi All; > > > I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a > > real > > > problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for > > parking > > > I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds > very > > > well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost > > always > > > leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have > > ensured > > > that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the > brake > > to > > > release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops > of > > > fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake > > > operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last > > year, > > > but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd > forgotten > > > about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must > > say > > > it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the > > last > > > time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! > > > Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? > > > > > > Todd Bartrim > > > > > > RV9Endurance > > > 13B Turbo Rotary > > > C-FSTB > > > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > > > > > "The world will always have a place for those that bring > hard > > > work and determination to the things they do." > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 53 ____________________________________ Time: 01:42:53 PM PST US From: "LarryRobertHelming" Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question --> RV-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" Subject: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question > --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" > > List, > For the builders who have installed a plenum to cool their engines have you needed to install Van's upper cowl cooling ramps? > I can't see why they would be of any value with the Plenum Conversion and might just be in the way? > Thanks for any help, Tom in Ohio > You can throw the upper cowl cooling ramps away. You will need something however to guide the incoming air into/within your plenum. > Indiana Larry, RV7 TipUp "SunSeeker" The sincerest satisfactions in life come in doing and not dodging duty; in meeting and solving problems, in facing facts, in being a dependable person. - Richard L. Evans > > ________________________________ Message 54 ____________________________________ Time: 02:12:13 PM PST US From: "Ed Anderson" Subject: Re: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport --> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Anderson" Well, Micky its hard to say. I took my RV-6A out to the airport Sept 23 1997 planning to have it flying by Thanksgiving as it was 100% complete {:>). I actually did fly it before Thanksgiving - of 1998 that is. So many things that you think are completed you find are not. But, perhaps you will be much closer to that 100% point than I. Good Luck Ed Ed Anderson RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered Matthews, NC ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mickey Coggins" Subject: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport > --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins > > Hi, > > Still several months away, but where I live we have to > plan quite a bit in advance. I'm trying to get an > idea of how long it will take to reassemble my RV8 > after transporting it to an airport. I plan to > have the plane 100% assembled and ready to fly > in the workshop before taking it apart to > transport it. > > Many thanks for any words of wisdom and experience! > > Mickey > > -- > Mickey Coggins > http://www.rv8.ch/ > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage > > ________________________________ Message 55 ____________________________________ Time: 02:14:03 PM PST US From: "Kyle Boatright" Subject: Re: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport --> RV-List message posted by: "Kyle Boatright" Mickey, The answer to your question is It depends. If you can borrow a spare set of hands (or two) when you need 'em, don't have any cold weather issues to deal with, and are able to spend several hours a day on the airplane, you might get the job done in a week or two depending on how much disassembly you did prior to transportation. In my case, I had a few minor items to complete once I got to the airfield. They would have taken 5-10 hours in my shop. It probably took a couple of weeks once I got to the airport. Part of the delay was due to "wrong tools at the airport". For instance, I didn't expect to need the close tolerance 90 degree angle drill, so that meant a trip home to get it. Another delay I suffered was due to cold and dark weather. I put the airplane together at the airport beginning at the start of November, and made my first flight on March 1. There were quite a few evenings where I had to quit work after a half hour or so, simply because it was too cold to continue working, despite various space heaters I was running. I don't believe I was ever able to work more than a couple of hours on any evening, again because of the cold. Finally, there are un-knowables, like when you have to troubleshoot something. In my case, I spent a couple of evenings troubleshooting an intermittant starter problem. Turned out that the fuse on the starter switch was getting intermittant contact in the fuse holder. Also, my carb float had failed, which was another week waiting on getting a new carb float installed. KB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mickey Coggins" Subject: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport > --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins > > Hi, > > Still several months away, but where I live we have to > plan quite a bit in advance. I'm trying to get an > idea of how long it will take to reassemble my RV8 > after transporting it to an airport. I plan to > have the plane 100% assembled and ready to fly > in the workshop before taking it apart to > transport it. > > Many thanks for any words of wisdom and experience! > > Mickey > > -- > Mickey Coggins > http://www.rv8.ch/ > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage > > ________________________________ Message 56 ____________________________________ Time: 02:30:33 PM PST US From: "Neil McLeod" Subject: RE: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Neil McLeod" Double wow! do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jaye and Scott Jackson Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" It's actually worse than that! I have four teenagers, it's just that one isn't interested... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neil McLeod" Subject: RE: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > --> RV-List message posted by: "Neil McLeod" > > Three teenage daughters!!!??? As the parent of one teenage and one 3 year > old daughter I commend you on the ability to keep your medical, I think I > would have too much stress induced hypertension if I had 3 teens. Way to go > Dad! > > Neil McLeod > 7QB FWF and Finishing > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jaye and Scott > Jackson > To: rv-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" > > > Todd: > I also equipped my 6 with the same valve, thinking it would stop calf > cramps in my three teenage daughters holding the brakes during runups. > My valve behaves just like yours, which is annoying. I suspect that two > things are at play here, and there is a way to get it to release without > the need to shutdown or egress. > I think that either the internal design of the valve, or the mechanical > advantage of the valve lever, or even the rigidity of the Bowden cable that > actuates the lever, can't overcome the pressure trapped in the lines once > the parking brakes are set. > With this in mind, the way to reduce the load on the valve is to apply and > hold pressure with the toe brakes, then move the valve to the off position. > It takes a few tries to get it to work, usually only one wheel releases > first, before it will roll with only idle power. > My daughter says that it works best if the pressure applied to the toe > brakes is the same and the pressure originally applied, and trapped in, the > brakes lines by the valve being closed. > This makes sense, in effect balancing the pressure on both sides of the > valve, making it easier to move internally. > I did find it so annoying-from the outside, it appears that one is so > stupid they're attempting to taxi with the brakes on and can't figure out > why it won't go anywhere-that I don't use it anymore, but the girls find it > worth the hassle. > I've started to wonder what to do if the valve should accidentally get > closed in flight, though..... > > Scott in Vancouver > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "cgalley" > To: > Subject: Re: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > Have a couple of friends that were flying to Alaska in a 125 hour old > Maule > > this summer. Used the parking brake. Took off OK but one brake was still > > locked on landing. Wiped out the gear, one wing, 3 bladed prop. > Fortunately > > the $45,000 repair is covered by insurance as they are now looking at more > > things. > > > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair > > Safety Programs Editor - TC > > EAA Sport Pilot > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Todd Bartrim" > > To: "RV List (E-mail)" > > Subject: RV-List: Matco Parking brake Lock-up? > > > > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Todd Bartrim" > > > > > > Hi All; > > > I have the Matco parking brake sold by Van's on my RV-9a and have a > > real > > > problem with it that I can't find in the archives. When I use it for > > parking > > > I apply full brake pressure then close the parking valve and it holds > very > > > well. However when I open the valve to release the brakes, it almost > > always > > > leaves me with at least one locked brake and sometimes both. I have > > ensured > > > that the valve is in the open position, but the only way to get the > brake > > to > > > release is to remove the wheel pant and crack the bleed valve. 2 drops > of > > > fluid is enough to bleed and it will free the brake completely and brake > > > operation will be normal. I had this problem right from first use last > > year, > > > but I really haven't needed it at all in the months since so I'd > forgotten > > > about it, but lately I've had occasion to use it a few times and I must > > say > > > it is very annoying to pull the wheel pant to fix it... especially the > > last > > > time as I was foolishly only equipped with a Leatherman! > > > Anybody else experience this? Any suggestions? > > > > > > Todd Bartrim > > > > > > RV9Endurance > > > 13B Turbo Rotary > > > C-FSTB > > > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > > > > > "The world will always have a place for those that bring > hard > > > work and determination to the things they do." > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 57 ____________________________________ Time: 02:38:15 PM PST US From: Scott Bilinski Subject: Re: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport --> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski Also dont forget the airport factor, it takes twice as long to get half as much done as it did at home, in the garage. At 05:11 PM 8/11/2004 -0400, you wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Anderson" > >Well, Micky its hard to say. I took my RV-6A out to the airport Sept 23 >1997 planning to have it flying by Thanksgiving as it was 100% complete >{:>). I actually did fly it before Thanksgiving - of 1998 that is. So many >things that you think are completed you find are not. But, perhaps you will >be much closer to that 100% point than I. > >Good Luck > >Ed > >Ed Anderson >RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered >Matthews, NC >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Mickey Coggins" >To: >Subject: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins > > > > Hi, > > > > Still several months away, but where I live we have to > > plan quite a bit in advance. I'm trying to get an > > idea of how long it will take to reassemble my RV8 > > after transporting it to an airport. I plan to > > have the plane 100% assembled and ready to fly > > in the workshop before taking it apart to > > transport it. > > > > Many thanks for any words of wisdom and experience! > > > > Mickey > > > > -- > > Mickey Coggins > > http://www.rv8.ch/ > > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage > > > > > > Scott Bilinski Eng dept 305 Phone (858) 657-2536 Pager (858) 502-5190 ________________________________ Message 58 ____________________________________ Time: 03:09:36 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Boost Pump Location RV-6 From: Scott.Fink@microchip.com 08/11/2004 03:11:10 PM, Serialize complete at 08/11/2004 03:11:10 PM --> RV-List message posted by: Scott.Fink@Microchip.com ...Isolated from the rest of the engine compartment in a box with the gascolator, and with a blast tube from the back of the baffling. Scott "czechsix@juno.com" RV-List message posted by: "czechsix@juno.com" There's also a bazillion Piper Cherokee-series (Warriors and Archers and etc) out there with the round "beer can" Facet pump happily thumping away on the engine side of the firewall... ________________________________ Message 59 ____________________________________ Time: 03:36:54 PM PST US From: "Greg Young" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Greg Young" Cy, I find it incredulous that you can diagnose my engine failure and present the cause as fact when you've never seen the aircraft, have no idea of the conditions of the flight, the sequence or timing of events and no knowledge of the system configuration of the aircraft. And further, to do it based on the speculation of a third party, who has even less specific knowledge, just blows me away. I'd dearly love to definitively know the cause but this is the first I've heard of this "well known phenomenon." If this occurred every time a boost pump was cycled, airplanes would be falling out of the sky. I'm an engineer. Show me some data on how, when and under what conditions this phenomenon occurs, even anecdotal evidence, and I'll throw it in the mix of possible causes to consider. But for you to state it as THE cause, at this point, is BS. Regards, Greg Young - Houston (DWH) RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A > > --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > The inference that the boost stayed on is incorrect. My > source which I consulted claims that the "over boost" > creates turbulence and cavitation in the engine pump. It > takes a little time for everything to come back to normal. > But the chain of events was started by the over boost even > though you removed it, the cavitation (air bubble) stopped the engine. > > At least that is what my Mechanic with over 40 years of > experience said. He also said that this was a well known phenomenon. > > Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs > Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg Young" > To: > Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Greg Young" > > > > Those are my words but your inference that the boost stayed on is > incorrect. > > I wrote that two days after the accident and although I've > recounted it > > numerous time in the last 3 years, I guess back then I > wasn't specific in > > the configuration. I fell back to what had been > working flawlessly > > for the 30 minutes prior, i.e. full rich and boost OFF. > That followed the > > theory that if the last action you took made things worse, > then undo it. > > > > Greg ________________________________ Message 60 ____________________________________ Time: 03:48:19 PM PST US From: "David Schaefer" Subject: RV-List: Starter Interruption --> RV-List message posted by: "David Schaefer" I've wired my RV6 straight down the lines of Aeroelectric's Z-14 with the exception that I don't use both busses to start the aircraft ( but I do have a cross connect if I loose a single side). That said, I have two Grand Rapids displays each with two separate power wires each wired to the two different busses so that they will operate if I turn off either buss. Why does the alternate buss 'die' when I start the aircraft, killing the display? I can understand the primary bus kicking off during start .. but why the alternate? I've got to go through the 'reboot' sequence again each time I hit the starter! Thanks... David Schaefer Finishing RV6-A ________________________________ Message 61 ____________________________________ Time: 04:28:12 PM PST US From: "Richard Bibb" Subject: Re: RV-List: Starter Interruption --> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Bibb" hard to say exactly why but your alternate bus voltage has to be getting pulled down below the minimal level for the Great Plains when you hit that starter. If the volatege gets below some level the Great Plains is going to reboot. I don't have to diagram in front of me to figure out why the isolation isn't working. ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Schaefer" Subject: RV-List: Starter Interruption > --> RV-List message posted by: "David Schaefer" > > I've wired my RV6 straight down the lines of Aeroelectric's Z-14 with the > exception that I don't use both busses to start the aircraft ( but I do have > a cross connect if I loose a single side). That said, I have two Grand > Rapids displays each with two separate power wires each wired to the two > different busses so that they will operate if I turn off either buss. Why > does the alternate buss 'die' when I start the aircraft, killing the > display? I can understand the primary bus kicking off during start .. but > why the alternate? I've got to go through the 'reboot' sequence again each > time I hit the starter! > > > Thanks... > > > David Schaefer > > Finishing RV6-A > > ________________________________ Message 62 ____________________________________ Time: 04:30:14 PM PST US From: "James E. Clark" Subject: RE: RV-List: Starter Interruption --> RV-List message posted by: "James E. Clark" David, I am planning the same system you describe and am in the process of wiring per Z-14. Since I am not working yet all I say below is SPECULATION and "thinking out loud". Is is fair to assume that you have you "left" PWR1 supplied by the "left" contactor and the "right" PWR1 supplied by the "right" contactor with a crisscross on for the PWR2? If so ... No offense in the question, but is the "alternate" contactor turned on? The GRT boxes are supposed to sense voltage on the multiple sources and switch to the higher (spent some time with Greg talking about this and "backups" last year). I noticed on my friend's RV that the voltage at cranking can get quite low for a little while and cause certain electronic ignitions and certain engine monitors to "lose it" temporarily. There was lots of discussion on the Aeroelectric list about how thing **should** perform. But back to the GRT units, my thinking was that if there were THREE power inputs on the system, you ALWAYS have power to the dual units from the dual power busses *and potentially* from an optional "9V" battery in case both batteries and both alternators fell out of the airplane! :-) OK, I know this is a bit over the top so no cries of overkill, please. :-) Just a little humor for us belt and suspenders types. Now in your case, I would think that the second battery should be sitting there happily supplying PLENTY of juice to keep the displays happy. I was thinking that if I could crank on one battery, I would be guaranteed to have good clean power for the electronics during cranking. How is the AHRS/ADC powered? Have you tried cranking with the crossfeed switch thrown??? Just some thoughts and if you are way past this, I apologize. James > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of David Schaefer > Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 6:48 PM > To: rv-list@matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Starter Interruption > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "David Schaefer" > > I've wired my RV6 straight down the lines of Aeroelectric's Z-14 with the > exception that I don't use both busses to start the aircraft ( > but I do have > a cross connect if I loose a single side). That said, I have two Grand > Rapids displays each with two separate power wires each wired to the two > different busses so that they will operate if I turn off either buss. Why > does the alternate buss 'die' when I start the aircraft, killing the > display? I can understand the primary bus kicking off during start .. but > why the alternate? I've got to go through the 'reboot' sequence > again each > time I hit the starter! > > > Thanks... > > > David Schaefer > > Finishing RV6-A > > ________________________________ Message 63 ____________________________________ Time: 05:05:11 PM PST US From: "Alex Peterson" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" > --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" > > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" > > > > > Dan, why the pump when switching tanks? > > > > > Alex, > > Many low wing aircraft flight manuals call for boost pumps on > while switching tanks. This is especially important in > higher altitude airplanes. Between the vapor pressure of the > fuel and the low ambient air pressure, switching tanks can > get interesting. > > At sea level, you have 14.7 psi available to replace the fuel > consumed by the engine, but at 18,000 it is less than half of > that. Throw in the vapor pressure of the fuel and getting > fuel to the pump can be a big deal. Many high altitude > airplanes have the electric boost pump built in the tank. > Some have small boost pumps in the tank that run all the time > to feed the engine driven or primary electric boost pumps. > > Many turbine airplanes have jet (or venturi) pumps that are > powered by the return fuel that feeds fuel to the engine > driven fuel pump much like a two pipe well pump system on a farm. > > In the B-25 the fuel pressure will start to jump around above > 10,000 feet in the summertime. We have a low setting on the > electric pumps that we use to smooth it out. > > Tailwinds, > Doug Rozendaal OK, got it, Doug. For a minute I thought we were talking about RV's :>) My original question remains, although I'll be more specific this time: Why would one need to use the boost pump when switching tanks on an RV, assuming Van's standard fuel line routing arrangement? Unless one is at extreme altitudes, there should be no -additional- tendency for vapor lock during the switching procedure than during normal feed from the tank. There could be a hot section of stagnant fuel in the cockpit fuel lines during winter operations which might vaporize during the initial draw when switching tanks, but the engine driven fuel pump should have no problem keeping a draw on that (i.e., they should be self priming). Cooler fuel would be right behind it. I would suggest that if someone experiences trouble, which is fixed by using the boost pump, during the tank switching operations that there is a design or mechanical problem in the fuel system. Alex Peterson Maple Grove, MN RV6-A N66AP 510 hours http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/ ________________________________ Message 64 ____________________________________ Time: 05:15:51 PM PST US From: Gert Subject: Re: RV-List: Starter Interruption --> RV-List message posted by: Gert Do you need diodes in each of the lines to the displays?? to prevent 'crossfeed' through the displays?? David Schaefer wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: "David Schaefer" > > I've wired my RV6 straight down the lines of Aeroelectric's Z-14 with the > exception that I don't use both busses to start the aircraft ( but I do have > a cross connect if I loose a single side). That said, I have two Grand > Rapids displays each with two separate power wires each wired to the two > different busses so that they will operate if I turn off either buss. Why > does the alternate buss 'die' when I start the aircraft, killing the > display? I can understand the primary bus kicking off during start .. but > why the alternate? I've got to go through the 'reboot' sequence again each > time I hit the starter! > > > Thanks... > > > David Schaefer > > Finishing RV6-A > > > > > > > -- is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 ________________________________ Message 65 ____________________________________ Time: 05:23:21 PM PST US From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" Thanks everybody! Back to Fiberglass pinholes and primer!! Do Not Archive Tom in Ohio ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ross Mickey" Subject: RE: RV-List: RV6-A Plenum Question > --> RV-List message posted by: "Ross Mickey" > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom & Cathy Ervin > > List, > For the builders who have installed a plenum to cool their > engines have you needed to install Van's upper cowl cooling ramps? > I can't see why they would be of any value with the Plenum > Conversion and might just be in the way? > > Thanks for any help, Tom in Ohio > > Tom, > > This depends on your plenum. I built my own. All I did was cover the > baffles with a custom cut/bent piece of aluminum sheet that is held in > place with hinge pins and a few screws in front. I am using the > standard air intake ducts. I made my plenum to fit the standard cowl > and baffle setup. > > Ross Mickey > RV6A > N9PT > > ________________________________ Message 66 ____________________________________ Time: 05:50:01 PM PST US From: "Larry Bowen" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" I was also taught from day one to use the boost while switching tanks. Probably just one of those "good habit" type things. - Larry Bowen Larry@BowenAero.com http://BowenAero.com Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: Alex Peterson [mailto:alexpeterson@earthlink.net] > > OK, got it, Doug. For a minute I thought we were talking > about RV's :>) > > My original question remains, although I'll be more specific > this time: Why would one need to use the boost pump when > switching tanks on an RV, assuming Van's standard fuel line > routing arrangement? Unless one is at extreme altitudes, > there should be no -additional- tendency for vapor lock > during the switching procedure than during normal feed from > the tank. There could be a hot section of stagnant fuel in > the cockpit fuel lines during winter operations which might > vaporize during the initial draw when switching tanks, but > the engine driven fuel pump should have no problem keeping a > draw on that (i.e., they should be self priming). Cooler fuel > would be right behind it. > > I would suggest that if someone experiences trouble, which is > fixed by using the boost pump, during the tank switching > operations that there is a design or mechanical problem in > the fuel system. > > Alex Peterson > Maple Grove, MN > RV6-A N66AP 510 hours http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/ ________________________________ Message 67 ____________________________________ Time: 06:08:30 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction From: James Ashford --> RV-List message posted by: James Ashford Bill, Replace it! The Facet pumps are relatively cheap considering the important role they would play in the event of engine driven pump failure. On my last homebuilt (not an RV), my facet failed after 150 hours of flight time. Jim Ashford RV7 70% done, 80% to go On Wednesday, August 11, 2004, at 07:01 AM, SportAV8R@aol.com wrote: > --> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com > > Question for you fellows: > > Last weekend, my Facet didn't sound right on start-up (carbureted > O-320 with electric solenoid primer) and the engine behaved as if it > had received no primer shot, though I gave it the usual "4-count" on > the primer button. The usual loud clacking of the fuel boost pump was > not present; instead there was a muted clicking... a few light taps on > the body of the pump with a mallet restored the familiar noise, along > with a rise in fuel pressure from 1 to 2 psig (normal reading is 4 or > 5 psig). The engine then started normally and fuel pressure was 4 psi > with or without the boost pump (normal readings, BTW). The round trip > flight to Cleveland was completed without incident, and the pump > sounded and behaved normally on this and a subsequent flight (to Dean > Meylor's beautiful home airstrip, 9NC9). > > I'm wondering if I should be concerned by this recent "hiccup" in pump > operation... is it the beginning of the end for my electric pump? > Could it foreshadow a dangerous fuel line stoppage condition? > > Just curious how "pre-emptive" I need to be in this situation. > > -Bill B / "Stormy" > RV-6A - 410 hrs > > > _- > ======================================================================= > _- > ======================================================================= > _- > ======================================================================= > _- > ======================================================================= > > > > ________________________________ Message 68 ____________________________________ Time: 06:15:09 PM PST US From: "Matt Johnson" Subject: RV-List: New RV-7A Construction log site... (not processed: message from valid local sender) --> RV-List message posted by: "Matt Johnson" I just got done building my builders log software and set up a front end website to access the data. The URL is: http://www.rv7a.com I am about a month into the project... - Matt Johnson ________________________________ Message 69 ____________________________________ Time: 06:17:12 PM PST US From: "Emrath" Subject: RV-List: Rudder issues. --> RV-List message posted by: "Emrath" Dean, I use the -9A tie down. It mounts inside the rear bulkhead. There are four bolts holding this on through the VS. Thus the tie down is removable like in the wings. Seemed to work great when I fit my VS, but I'm not flying.....yet. AS for the wiring, I've heard one should run the wire in the bottom fairing, but angle up and into the VS and rear Bulkhead somewhat higher so the wire will twist and not bend as the rudder is deflected. Can't help with the number of holes issue, perhaps this is a personal preference item. I doubt if I'm any slower builder than you, but I try not to be anal. Marty in Brentwood TN, RV-6A fairings, waiting for CS Hartzell to finish cowling mounting. Time: 10:03:31 PM PST US From: "Dean Psiropoulos" Subject: RV-List: Rudder issues. --> RV-List message posted by: "Dean Psiropoulos" --> I have a few rudder installation issues on my RV-6A. First there is the aft fuselage skin overlap, I left it fairly long and made some smooth cutouts where the rudder bottom leading edge would touch it when the rudder is deflected. From other RVs I've seen most people cut it straight down pretty close to the aft bulkhead leaving quite a gap there. Any reason for this or is everyone just cutting it close as a painless exercise? Also, on the RV-6A there is the tie down bracket mounted on the aft bulkhead right in front of the fiberglass rudder bottom leading edge. With the rudder adjusted out from the vertical stab as specified on Van's plans and the tie down bracket ground down close to the weld, the rudder bottom won't allow the rudder to inserted far enough in to get the hinge bolts in. What's the fix for this? Is everyone just adjusting the hiem bearings out from the rudder to increase the gap? Or are you cutting the leading edge off the bottom fairing and making it shorter? Or something else? One last thing, I will be installing a combination aft position light strobe light in the rudder bottom. I need a hole for the fat strobe wire and a smaller hole for small power and ground wires to the light. Where is the best place to put these holes, above the bottom hinge bracket, below the bottom hinge bracket, some other place? Should I use one large hole or a large hole and a small hole? I need to make a slot in the rudder bottom to allow for rudder deflection I assume?! Any suggestions? Thanks for entertaining this anal slow builder. Dean Psiropoulos RV-6A N197DM TMX-360 waiting for install ________________________________ Message 70 ____________________________________ Time: 06:22:42 PM PST US From: "Dean Pichon" Subject: RE: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport --> RV-List message posted by: "Dean Pichon" I took my aircraft (RV-4) out of the basement in April of 2001 and made the first flight on August 8th, 2001. In June of the same year, I spent two weeks in Europe on my honeymoon. Before moving the aircraft to the airport, the wings had never been fit to the aircraft, nor had any of the control linkages been connected to the tail. I had installed the engine and propeller while in the basement, but had to remove both to get it out of the house. If you do all you can in the comfort of your home shop, and I mean everything, and you try your best to choreograph all the remaining activities, four months is plenty. If you don't have to work for a living, probably half that is sufficient. I was by no means a fast builder, as I spent 3 weeks short of 10 years to go from receipt of tail kit to first flight. I did find, however, that once I was at the airport, I was highly motivated to get the thing flying. Finally, I've been flying for just over 3 years, and I still wouldn't consider it completely done - they never are... Good luck, Dean Pichon Bolton, MA RV-4, 220hrs -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins Subject: RV-List: Reassembly at the airport --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins Hi, Still several months away, but where I live we have to plan quite a bit in advance. I'm trying to get an idea of how long it will take to reassemble my RV8 after transporting it to an airport. I plan to have the plane 100% assembled and ready to fly in the workshop before taking it apart to transport it. Many thanks for any words of wisdom and experience! Mickey -- Mickey Coggins http://www.rv8.ch/ #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage == direct advertising on the Matronics Forums. == == == ________________________________ Message 71 ____________________________________ Time: 07:15:54 PM PST US From: "Harvey Sigmon" Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: "Harvey Sigmon" Larry: Thanks for bringing some common sense to this discussion, I have personally experienced as a professional flight engineer for about 20 years on all kinds of airplanes Piston airplanes up through B-747. The boost pump is always turned on before a tank is selected. By watching the fuel pressure rise as the tank pump is turned on and watch the slight drop when the pump is turned off. On my last RV-6 had a I0-320 fuel injected engine, the pump was used like all engines are used for take off, landing and switching tanks. I would suspect the engine driven pump bypass valve is not working if the pump causes the engine to flood out. Normally all you would see at idle was a slight drop in RPM. Michael Stewart can tell you what is the outcome if the engine driven fuel pump fail and the electric pump is not available. I had one experience when I had a ruptured diaphragm in the fuel servo and the engine did not like to run without the pump on. When flying DC-8's in Vietnam with the high temperature on the ground 30 degrees C. if the boost pumps were not used, when the power is retarded at altitudes above 33,000ft the fuel pressure would fluctuate and the engines would begin to flame out. The procedure had to be changed to leave the pumps on all the time. Sorry for the long reply Harvey Sigmon RV-6A Do not arcive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Bowen" Subject: RE: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem > --> RV-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" > > I was also taught from day one to use the boost while switching tanks. > Probably just one of those "good habit" type things. > > - > Larry Bowen > Larry@BowenAero.com > http://BowenAero.com > Do not archive > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Alex Peterson [mailto:alexpeterson@earthlink.net] > > > > OK, got it, Doug. For a minute I thought we were talking > > about RV's :>) > > > > My original question remains, although I'll be more specific > > this time: Why would one need to use the boost pump when > > switching tanks on an RV, assuming Van's standard fuel line > > routing arrangement? Unless one is at extreme altitudes, > > there should be no -additional- tendency for vapor lock > > during the switching procedure than during normal feed from > > the tank. There could be a hot section of stagnant fuel in > > the cockpit fuel lines during winter operations which might > > vaporize during the initial draw when switching tanks, but > > the engine driven fuel pump should have no problem keeping a > > draw on that (i.e., they should be self priming). Cooler fuel > > would be right behind it. > > > > I would suggest that if someone experiences trouble, which is > > fixed by using the boost pump, during the tank switching > > operations that there is a design or mechanical problem in > > the fuel system. > > > > Alex Peterson > > Maple Grove, MN > > RV6-A N66AP 510 hours http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/ > > ________________________________ Message 72 ____________________________________ Time: 07:15:54 PM PST US From: "Kathleen (rv7)" Subject: RE: RV-List: New RV-7A Construction log site... (not processed: message from valid local sender) --> RV-List message posted by: "Kathleen (rv7)" Matt, the site is very nice, but frankly, your shop is way too clean. You should be embarrassed :-) I spent a week cleaning mine and it's still a mess. How do you do that? (do not archive) Kathleen Evans Folsom, CA www.rv7.us -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Johnson Subject: RV-List: New RV-7A Construction log site... (not processed: message from valid local sender) --> RV-List message posted by: "Matt Johnson" I just got done building my builders log software and set up a front end website to access the data. The URL is: http://www.rv7a.com I am about a month into the project... - Matt Johnson advertising on the Matronics Forums. ________________________________ Message 73 ____________________________________ Time: 07:23:19 PM PST US From: linn walters Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel Servo problem --> RV-List message posted by: linn walters Larry Bowen wrote: >--> RV-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" > >I was also taught from day one to use the boost while switching tanks. >Probably just one of those "good habit" type things. > As, I think, we all were. It's just a way to lower the chance of things going wrong. The boost pump would push any air that may be trapped in the fuel tank of the 'switching to' tank ..... say from becoming unported during unusual attitudes ..... which may become a problem for the engine driven pump .... and then a problem for the engine. True or not??? Hell, I don't know .... just throwing out ideas to see what sticks. Linn do not archive > >- >Larry Bowen >Larry@BowenAero.com >http://BowenAero.com >Do not archive > > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Alex Peterson [mailto:alexpeterson@earthlink.net] >> >>OK, got it, Doug. For a minute I thought we were talking >>about RV's :>) >> >>My original question remains, although I'll be more specific >>this time: Why would one need to use the boost pump when >>switching tanks on an RV, assuming Van's standard fuel line >>routing arrangement? Unless one is at extreme altitudes, >>there should be no -additional- tendency for vapor lock >>during the switching procedure than during normal feed from >>the tank. There could be a hot section of stagnant fuel in >>the cockpit fuel lines during winter operations which might >>vaporize during the initial draw when switching tanks, but >>the engine driven fuel pump should have no problem keeping a >>draw on that (i.e., they should be self priming). Cooler fuel >>would be right behind it. >> >>I would suggest that if someone experiences trouble, which is >>fixed by using the boost pump, during the tank switching >>operations that there is a design or mechanical problem in >>the fuel system. >> >>Alex Peterson >>Maple Grove, MN >>RV6-A N66AP 510 hours http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/ >> >> > > > > ________________________________ Message 74 ____________________________________ Time: 08:18:06 PM PST US From: "Larry Bowen" Subject: RV-List: Metal Polish/Cleaner? --> RV-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" After recently removing the plastic from the rest of the plane skins, it's real obvious where the plastic was removed years earlier, along the rivet lines. I have stripes where the exposed AL has tarnished. Anyone know of a good cleaner/polish I can used to even things up? I'm not trying to have a polished plane, per say, but it would be nice if the whole thing was equally shiney everywhere, as it might be many months before I have it painted. Thx, - Larry Bowen Larry@BowenAero.com http://BowenAero.com ________________________________ Message 75 ____________________________________ Time: 09:00:38 PM PST US From: Charlie Kuss Subject: Re: RV-List: facet electric fuel (boost) pump ? malfunction --> RV-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss Bill You may have simply passed a piece of debris through the pump. I'd monitor it for a while. Charlie Kuss >--> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com > >Question for you fellows: > >Last weekend, my Facet didn't sound right on start-up (carbureted O-320 >with electric solenoid primer) and the engine behaved as if it had >received no primer shot, though I gave it the usual "4-count" on the >primer button. The usual loud clacking of the fuel boost pump was not >present; instead there was a muted clicking... a few light taps on the >body of the pump with a mallet restored the familiar noise, along with a >rise in fuel pressure from 1 to 2 psig (normal reading is 4 or 5 >psig). The engine then started normally and fuel pressure was 4 psi with >or without the boost pump (normal readings, BTW). The round trip flight >to Cleveland was completed without incident, and the pump sounded and >behaved normally on this and a subsequent flight (to Dean Meylor's >beautiful home airstrip, 9NC9). > >I'm wondering if I should be concerned by this recent "hiccup" in pump >operation... is it the beginning of the end for my electric pump? Could >it foreshadow a dangerous fuel line stoppage condition? > >Just curious how "pre-emptive" I need to be in this situation. > >-Bill B / "Stormy" >RV-6A - 410 hrs > > ________________________________ Message 76 ____________________________________ Time: 09:39:38 PM PST US From: "Dean Psiropoulos" Subject: RV-List: Thanks. --> RV-List message posted by: "Dean Psiropoulos" Thanks for all the input on the rudder fairing, tie-down and wiring guys. Hopefully Hurricane Charlie won't make me the proud owner of mangled mess of aluminum that I've spent the last seven years trying to turn into an RV-6A. Cross your fingers for me and the rest of the Florida RV builders (you wouldn't believe how many there are). Thanks again. Dean Psiropoulos N197DM ________________________________ Message 77 ____________________________________ Time: 10:14:11 PM PST US From: "Kenneth Cantrell" Subject: RV-List: RV traveling to PNW --> RV-List message posted by: "Kenneth Cantrell" Hello listers, My wife and I are planning to fly our RV-6 from home in central Ca to the greater Seattle area including possibly Friday Harbor and Victoria BC in a couple weeks. I'd like some advice on where to stay and sights to see. Advice on customs procedures for travel into Canada appreciated as well. We'll likely be staying 3 or 4 days. Thanks in advance for any & all suggestions. Ken Cantrell RV-6, 299 hours ________________________________ Message 78 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:09 PM PST US From: "Karie Daniel" Subject: RV-List: Cherry Max rivet question --> RV-List message posted by: "Karie Daniel" I would like to install some Cherry Max rivets in place of MSP-42 rivets. It's for the Flap Brace on my 7-A. On the quick build wings you have to use the MSP-42 rivets since there isn't any access to place the AN rivets. I think it's supposed to be a CR3213-4-6 but that's just a guess? And yes I know....the MSP-42's will work just fine. I'll just sleep better using the Max rivets for the flap brace since that's about all that's holding it on. Thanks! Karie Daniel Sammamish RV-7A QB (feels like a Slow Build)