Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:33 AM - Tracy Saylor E-Mail Address (RICKRV6@aol.com)
2. 09:05 AM - Re: Tracy Saylor E-Mail Address (Ed Holyoke)
3. 10:01 AM - Vortex Generators (Jerry2DT@aol.com)
4. 12:11 PM - K1100-06 nutplate installation on e-616 (Mike Draper)
5. 12:59 PM - Re: how to feed the battery cable through the firewall?? (bertrv6@highstream.net)
6. 01:01 PM - Re: Vortex Generators (Chuck)
7. 03:39 PM - Vans Homecoming (Wheeler North)
8. 05:27 PM - Dynon D-10 errors (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
9. 06:51 PM - Re: Dynon D-10 errors (Doug Rozendaal)
10. 07:23 PM - Re: Need help trimming out airplane (linn walters)
11. 07:53 PM - Re: Smoke Systems (linn walters)
12. 08:29 PM - Re: Vortex Generators (SportAV8R@aol.com)
13. 10:19 PM - Nose wheel tire mounting (thomas a. sargent)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Tracy Saylor E-Mail Address |
--> RV-List message posted by: RICKRV6@aol.com
Can someone provide me Tracy Saylor's current e-mail address? The one in the yeller
pages comes back undeliverable. I need a replacement lens for the wing
tip light kit I purchased from him.
Thanks
Rick McBride
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Tracy Saylor E-Mail Address |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
I think you'll have to use snail mail with Tracy. He gave up on computers
several years back. Did you try the phone number?
Maybe someone can kick out his address. I believe it's his daughter and son
in law who are doing his products now.
Ed Holyoke
----- Original Message -----
From: <RICKRV6@aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Tracy Saylor E-Mail Address
> --> RV-List message posted by: RICKRV6@aol.com
>
> Can someone provide me Tracy Saylor's current e-mail address? The one in
the yeller pages comes back undeliverable. I need a replacement lens for
the wing tip light kit I purchased from him.
>
> Thanks
> Rick McBride
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Vortex Generators |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry2DT@aol.com
Hi Joa...
Your product looks intriguing and the price seems right for sure. It would
be good if we had some reliable test data from an RV. Any installed so far?
Thanx
Jerry Cochran
--> RV-List message posted by: Land Shorter <landshorter2@yahoo.com>
Hey folks,
I double checked and Matt Dralle's earlier post says it's OK to post about
new
aviation products as long as the message doesn't come off as having a
"flavor"
of "traditional spam". Don't worry I'm not going to try to sell you anything
that supposedly makes any of your body parts larger (or smaller) and this
product
is directly aviation related :) I'm just an airplane builder, owner, pilot,
and aviation nut who wants to tell you where you can find more information
about
a great new product.
I've been selling kits of vortex generators (VG's) for only $95 and my
customers are telling me they really like the performance gains they're seeing.
VG's are great for reducing stall speeds and allow you to land slower, shorter,
and safer. I invite you to check out my site at www.landshorter.com and see
what you think. My VG's can be quickly installed for testing using removable
double-stick tape and come with a 100% money-back guarantee so why not try
them out on your plane? You'll be really glad you did :)
Thanks and let's keep 'em flying!
Joa Harrison
The VG Guy
www.landshorter.com
Message 4
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| Subject: | K1100-06 nutplate installation on e-616 |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mike Draper <mdraper@nww.com>
I am currently finishing up my elevator and am at the point on installing
the trim tab reinforcement plate and correcsponding platenuts.
I searched the archives and got some good tips on using oops rivets to
install the platenuts.
My question. Once the platenut is installed, do you countersink the
reinforcement plate to accept the dimple from the cover plate?
The only other option would be to dimple the reinforcement plate and
countersink the screw hole inthe nutplate.
Which would be the best approach? Does it matter?
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: how to feed the battery cable through the firewall?? |
--> RV-List message posted by: bertrv6@highstream.net
Quoting Gert <gert@execpc.com>:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Gert <gert@execpc.com>
>
>
> Hi folks
>
> For those of you with the battery not in the engine compartment.
> How have you brought the wire from the battery to the starter contactor
> through the firewall??
>
> what kind of penetration/insulation/chafing prevention have you used.
> pro's/con's??
>
> thanks Gert: plans for rv6a, is to be installed inside fire wall, that
is the starter and Battery contactor...you must have different model,no?
Bert
Do not archive
>
> Gert
> --
> is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Vortex Generators |
--> RV-List message posted by: Chuck <chuck515tigger@yahoo.com>
Well I'll chime in here... I bought some VG's from Greg H. (the Larry Vetterman
brand, 1999 model, RV-4, ones). The adhesive had gone south, so I epoxyed them
on. The results I'm listing at this moment are from memory and are in MPH
not Nuts (knots). I have an RV-4 IO-320 inverted fuel & oil, 160 hp, fixed
pitch prop (I bought from Rob R., waiting for my new prop to get final finishing
done) with 80% span ailerons and 18 inches of "Airbrakes" on each wing (aerobatic
reasons, or so I like to think) and no wheel pants or gear leg fairings
on. Testing was done at 3500' on two 85 degree (zip for humidity) mornings
each time. Turning stall testing not completed yet; but roll authority has a
noticable improvement/responsiveness.
*Prior to installation: >Power-off Clean stall - 54/55 >Power-on (2300 rpm)
Clean stall - 50/50 >Power-off Airbrakes - 53/53 >Power-on Airbrakes - 51/50
*After installation: >Power-off Clean stall - 49/49 >Power-on (2300 rpm) Clean
stall - 43/44 >Power-off Airbrakes - 49/49 >Power-on Airbrakes - 43/43
***note the Power-on Airbrakes stall "Helicoptering" at 43 mph ? Just kinda hanging
there on the prop.
My opinion so far, with no side-by-side RV-4 testing yet (maybe if/when Scott V.
comes by again), ...but I wouldn't spend the money again, HOWEVER... I
ain't gonna take them off now neither!
Chuck
Jerry2DT@aol.com wrote:
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry2DT@aol.com
Hi Joa...
Your product looks intriguing and the price seems right for sure. It would
be good if we had some reliable test data from an RV. Any installed so far?
Thanx
Jerry Cochran
--> RV-List message posted by: Land Shorter
Hey folks,
I double checked and Matt Dralle's earlier post says it's OK to post about
new
aviation products as long as the message doesn't come off as having a
"flavor"
of "traditional spam". Don't worry I'm not going to try to sell you anything
that supposedly makes any of your body parts larger (or smaller) and this
product
is directly aviation related :) I'm just an airplane builder, owner, pilot,
and aviation nut who wants to tell you where you can find more information
about
a great new product.
I've been selling kits of vortex generators (VG's) for only $95 and my
customers are telling me they really like the performance gains they're seeing.
VG's are great for reducing stall speeds and allow you to land slower, shorter,
and safer. I invite you to check out my site at www.landshorter.com and see
what you think. My VG's can be quickly installed for testing using removable
double-stick tape and come with a 100% money-back guarantee so why not try
them out on your plane? You'll be really glad you did :)
Thanks and let's keep 'em flying!
Joa Harrison
The VG Guy
www.landshorter.com
---------------------------------
Message 7
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--> RV-List message posted by: Wheeler North <wnorth@sdccd.cc.ca.us>
Well,
it may seem obscure to fly from San Diego to Aurora for a few hours and a
new VAF tee shirt, but with the RVs and a couple of really nice days it was
worth it. For those of you who live out in the flat lands, the bumps out
west are really a lot of fun on a pretty white and blue day.
Day one after work was from San Diego to Agua Dulce for their Friday night
steak dinner, burp, then on to Columbia Airport for a early night quick
camp. The next morning I popped from there to Aurora direct, hung out for
half the day then decided the clouds looked like they wouldn't be fun to
camp under over at Vernonia, so headed back south to Shellville in the Bay
Area to visit some friends. Had a great time there, met some folks who are
major old timers in aviation. This airport is where the OSH show stopper
Curtiss Jenny lives.
From there I followed the coast back down to Santa Paula, then over to Auga
Dulce for a soda and more low cost fuel, and then on home. For those of you
in the SoCal area this airport has recently come under citizen attack, and
they are looking for a few good signatures. So stop on in every chance you
get.
I don't have much to report on the home coming event other than there were a
lot of aircraft showing up as I was leaving. I got a few pics and will try
to post them via Matt's photoshare as soon as I catch up on a few other
projects.
W
PS Hi Mikey, how's the flying out there in the middle these days?
Message 8
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| Subject: | Dynon D-10 errors |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
I want to thank those who have inquired as to the errors I have been
getting on the Dynon based on some Findings From Dan Checkoway's post on
his website here:
http://www.rvproject.com/20040901.html Dan has done an excellent good
job summarizing the issue there. I suggest you read that first.
To summarize, myself and others, have been getting errors on the horizon
function of the Dynon EFIS. In one case it really scared me and as a
result I have grounded me 6A from any IFR work. Most of the errors are a
lean in the roll axis by as much as 7-10 degrees. Pitch errors in my
case have been as much as 20 degrees. Here is a brief synopsis of what
and how it is happening based on some e-mail to Dynon:
I flew 6 hours today and worked the Dynon hard. I can now easily
reproduce the lean.
I started after departure at 2500rm and went to 1900rmp 10rpm at a time
with 1 minute intervals, and back to 2700rpm
At 2560, the leaning happens, it slowly oscillates from right to left,
and back again. I can come off it by 15rmp on either side and it resumes
accurate operation.
I can give you further details but I now can quickly reproduce it, and I
took some shots of how bad it is out on the lean. You will notice that
on one shot, the bank indicator on the right shows wings completely
level, autopilot on, and it was silky smooth air.
Also I have seen it at other RPMs today. I saw it in formation at 2480
but could not troubleshoot as we were practicing.
I was able to see the pitch out during this activity, but not by much. 2
degrees maybe, but it was out and I could watch it happen with the
leaning at the same rpm, although the pitch was not as reproducible as
the roll problem.
took off from home base, early turn out, climb in smooth morning air to
3500'agl level off and the d10 compass heading was swinging a d10 being
erratic on the screen. That caught my eye. At the same time, d10 showed
me in a 20 degree climb and I was level. In about 6 seconds the compass
stabilized, and in about 20 seconds the pitch stabilized to level.
Next on a different day, I saw another example of the leans in roll
information by about 4 degrees. A very pronounced lean showing a right
hand turn 4 degrees or so, autopilot flying the plane straight and
level, compass on the d10 holding steady. It would eventually, after 1
minute or so get level, then lean again. This went on for about 6
minutes. Then fine. I have seen this behavior in the unit a dozen times
over the 700 hours of flight with it.
In another case, the one that really scared me, I came out of 15,000' on
a long hard decent to 1000'AGL and leveled off in MVFR vis 2, mist, and
the dynon showed I was in a steady climb of 20 degrees. I was clearly
level cross checking other instruments and was low. After a min or so it
cleared up and resumed normal operation. This is the largest deviation
in pitch I have seen. I took a big deep breath and thanked god I was not
IMC. If I were, I may not have caught the pitch error and might have put
the nose into the ground. Needless to say, no more IFR till it is
resolved.
So the above e-mail excerpts will give you and idea of the issue. Like
Dan stated on his webpage, I have been in contact with Dynon and they
are taking this very seriously. I have been impressed with their
responsiveness and professionalism. Clearly this is serious and Dynon
says "this is the most important item on their plate." Now, we have not
found a fix yet. I seem to be the only guy who can easily reproduce the
problem, but I would bet, as I did with the EMI item, that this is a
fleet wide problem. Dynon says I have the most hours on their unit in
the field. Perhaps that explains some of why I have been able to get to
a reproducible stage. They are working hard and I am confident they will
get to the bottom of it. They have offered to refund my money. I haven't
taken it yet as I want to help them work out the problem. This is a
terrific unit and I am confident they will nail it down. Until then,
remember this is an experimental device and should be treated as such.
If you have one of these in your plane, keep this in mind as you fly.
Picture of a lean here: Notice bottom right Trio Autopilot shows wings
level, as they were.
http://www.mstewart.net/deletesoon/dynonlean.jpg
Regards,
Mike Stewart
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Dynon D-10 errors |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr@petroblend.com>
Mike,
I have occasionally seen the roll error from the get go on my D-10.
I never dreamed it was RPM related.
Mine has been really good lately and I was not so concerned about it any
more, but now it all makes sense. The only times I have problems lately is
early in the flight (read climb power) I used to run higher RPMs and I had
more problems. I have been using 2300 much more than 2400 or 2500
I would go test this right now, except, I was showing my Dynon to a vistor
and I did not get it shut down, it ran the Battery down on the airplane and
When I charged the battery back up, it would not fire up so mine is back at
the factory getting looked at.
I have NEVER had a pitch problem with mine, just the ~ 5 deg roll issue you
describe.
I have a very early D-10 and I have about 235 hours on flight time with it.
Tailwinds,
Doug Rozendaal
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Need help trimming out airplane |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
Scott Vanartsdalen wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Vanartsdalen <svanarts@yahoo.com>
>
>Okay, let's say I have this "friend" who has an RV-4 that he's been flying for
almost two years now. Let's say this "friend" is pulling his hair out because
I - uh, *he* cannot trim his plane out to straight and level flight without
some control input. With the wings held level by the stick in straight and level
flight the plane wants to go into a skidding left turn. To keep the plane
on a straight course the stick either has to be deflected to the right or right
rudder/left stick must be held. There is already a trim tab on the rudder.
Should I just keep enlarging it?
>
Nah, big tabs are draggy and look bad (IMHO)
> Any other ideas?
>
Well, yes. I'm not familiar with the RV rudder setup so I'll offer some
things: If you don't have rudder springs between the pedals and the
firewall (springs to put tension on the cables) then this addition would
be a start. What you can do (if you have the springs) is to
twist/untwist the cables to change their effective length, which will
set the position of the rudder to one side (to counteract a skidding
tendency). I do not like trim tabs ..... so I spend a lot of time on
rigging and tweaking stuff instead of bending tabs that add drag. Good
luck!
Linn ....... someday my -10 will come
>
>Thanks.
>
>
>--
>Scott VanArtsdalen
>RV-4 N311SV, FLYING!!
>
> When a man does all he can
> though it succeeds not well,
> blame not him that did it."
> -- George Washington
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Smoke Systems |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
Lenleg@aol.com wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Lenleg@aol.com
>
>List:
>
>I have been through the archives on smoke systems and have seen some messages
>regarding the "negatives" of a smoke system. Mostly concerned about belly
>mess, etc.
>
>One post said aerobatic people hate them ... always problems.
>
>I am seriously considering installing one .... but I do not want persistent
>problems ???
>
>Comments ??? Especially from people who have them on !!
>
Well, my smoke system is on a Pitts .... if that matters. If you're
getting oil on the belly you just need to cut down on the oil flow. If
it isn't vaporizing ..... it ain't making smoke. So, I like smoke, and
will put it on the -10 if I can make it work easily. Let's face it ....
smoke is cool ..... so I think ya auta do it!!!
Linn
do not archive
>
>Len Leggette, RV-8A
>Greensboro, NC N910LL
>272 hrs
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Vortex Generators |
--> RV-List message posted by: SportAV8R@aol.com
Hi Joa...
Your product looks intriguing and the price seems right for sure. It would
be good if we had some reliable test data from an RV. Any installed so far?
Thanx
Jerry Cochran
<<
I'll second that. I'm interested, but want to hear an RV testimonial even at that
price :-)
-BB
Message 13
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| Subject: | Nose wheel tire mounting |
--> RV-List message posted by: "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314@earthlink.net>
I just mounted the tube & tire on the nose wheel of my RV-6A for the
first time. After reading all the emails, it was easier than I expected
and turned out very well. Maybe I was just lucky, but here's what I did:
1- I used a lot of talcum powder on everything including the the wheel
rim and tire bead. I put one wheel half on the tire (with the deflated
tube) and used a wooden slat and a plastic mallet to push/pound the bead
further onto the wheel. It helps to have two people to hold all this
down while wacking it. The second wheel half is not in place yet so you
can easily reach the bead from the inside of the tire.
2- With the tire bead most of the way onto the first wheel half, it was
easy to get the second one close enough get the nuts started on the
bolts. Just screw them on part way, though. The two wheel halves are
now separated by a gap of about a 1/16". You can see the gap all the
way around using a dental mirror in the center of the wheel. Look into
it past a trouble light held against your face. A flashlight might work
too. You can see if the tube is in between the two wheel halves at any
point. In my case it appeared to be pinched at one place.
3- Next, I put about 5-10 pounds of air in the tube. My theory was this
partial inflation makes it harder for the tube to get caught in the gap
between the two wheel halves. It "rounds out" the tube and that makes
it harder to pinch. At least visual inspection indicated it was not
caught in the gap after I did this.
4- Tighten down the bolts by turning each nut 1 turn in succession.
5- Inflate the tube and deflate it several times just as they say in the
manual. Since there's no weight on the tire, I think it can be over
inflated safely to the 50 - 55 pound area, which is what I did. This
made the tire beads slide nicely out to the rims of the wheel. It
appears to be mounted perfectly.
Maybe I just had a fortuitous fit here, but I think it was the talc on
the wheel and the tire bead that made it slide into place.
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A, Landing gear
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