Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:22 AM - RV-List Digest: 49 Msgs - 09/21/04 -Reply (Jim.Truitt@usdoj.gov)
2. 03:29 AM - Re: Aircraft Wiring (Doug Gray)
3. 03:49 AM - Re: Tuft Testing the RV wing (Kevin Horton)
4. 03:58 AM - Re: PAINTING THE GAS TANK (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
5. 04:37 AM - Re: Aircraft Wiring (Charlie Kuss)
6. 05:41 AM - Re: Aircraft Wiring (linn walters)
7. 06:21 AM - Re: Aircraft Wiring (Sims, Doug)
8. 06:32 AM - paint (Glen Matejcek)
9. 08:14 AM - Re: paint (steve zicree)
10. 08:43 AM - Paint (Jim Duckett)
11. 11:54 AM - Re: Aircraft Wiring (Jim & Bev Cone)
12. 12:26 PM - Hole for canopy latch (Richard Suffoletto)
13. 03:54 PM - Re: Hole for canopy latch (Richard Tasker)
14. 04:19 PM - Re: Aircraft Wiring (Mike Nellis)
15. 04:42 PM - Re: alternators (lancenewman)
16. 09:10 PM - Re: Aircraft Wiring (Vanremog@aol.com)
17. 10:02 PM - IO-360 with a Bernie Warnke prop (Dave)
Message 1
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| Subject: | RV-List Digest: 49 Msgs - 09/21/04 -Reply |
(Receipt Notification Requested)
--> RV-List message posted by: "Jim.Truitt@usdoj.gov" <Jim.Truitt@usdoj.gov>
I have been temporarily assigned to a new task force in Indianapolis effective
September 22, 2004. All of my fugitive cases have been reassigned to other
task force members. If you need to contact the officer assigned to a case,
contact Jim Enea at (317) 226-7116 (office) or (317) 281-7502 (cell). For
contact concerning a new fugitive case, or collateral leads, contact
Supervisor Tom Cassels at (317) 226-6059 or Brian Aldridge at (317) 226-0255.
I will check my email and voice mail periodically during this period, or I can
be contacted at (317) 281-7503.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Wiring |
--> RV-List message posted by: Doug Gray <dgra1233@bigpond.net.au>
Silver or Nickle plated conductors generally have a 200 degree C max temeperature
rating.
Tin plated conductors are limited to 150 C. High temps will cause the tin to melt....
ETFE (Tefzel) is more operator friendly and cheaper than PTFE. Both are generally
extruded but
sometimes wrapped as strips arount the conductors. Both will cold flow.
PTFE is a pain because very sharp tooling is necessary to strip the wire, and it
takes a skilled
operator to avoid cut or nicked strands. It also seems to bond tenaceously to the
wire. (At least it
is my experience)
I do not have the data sheets at hand but IIRC both are equal and remarkable in
their ability to
withstand environmental duress.
Doug Gray
> However, Tin finishes have the unfortunate tendency to spontaneously grow
> whiskers, so I personally would always prefer Silver plating over Tin. Punch
> "Tin Whiskers" into any search engine and find a bunch of info on this subject
> from the military electronics realm.
>
> PTFE (Teflon) is extruded and sintered over the wire at high temperature so
> Silver plating the strands works better here than Tin.
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Tuft Testing the RV wing |
--> RV-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorton01@rogers.com>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "David Carter" <dcarter@datarecall.net>
>
>About the tufts - I'm almost amazed at how the tufts behind the fuel tank
>(and the line just outboard of tank) show totally separated airflow all the
>way to the front, while the others are straight all the way aft.
> - I wonder if there is something tripping the airflow abnormally in the
>inboard half of the wing? Wouldn't think it was prop-wash or landing gear
>down below.
This is characteristic of low aspect ratio non-tapered wings. There
is upflow ahead of the wing (assuming subsonic speeds, so the air
knows we are coming), which increases the local angle of attack. The
amount of upflow is greatest at the wing root, and decreases as you
go outboard. Thus the local angle of attack is greatest at the wing
root, and decreases towards the wing tip. This causes the stall to
start at the wing root, and to progressively move outboard as the
angle of attack increases. This is a good characteristic, as it
means we get a softer stall than if the whole wing stalled at once,
and we maintain good aileron control right up to the stall.
These two movies (URLs corrected) clearly show the stall starting
inboard, and moving outboard as the angle of attack is increased:
http://www.miramarcollege.net/programs/avim/faculty/north/tufttests/tuft%20testing%20RV6%20stalls%20054.mov
http://www.miramarcollege.net/programs/avim/faculty/north/tufttests/tuft%20testing%20RV6%20stalls%20055.mov
Those two URLs will almost certainly be chopped into two lines. Copy
and paste as required to get them working.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
Message 4
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| Subject: | PAINTING THE GAS TANK |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
System does not matter. Drying time + anytime you want. Since the
sacrificial screw is not stuck to the surface (meaning not screwed down
tight but left raised from the surface) when painting, it can be removed
anytime. A hair of overspray gets under the screw head which is say...
1/16th raised from the surface when painting. This makes sure there is
no line showing when a final painted screw is inserted (can be the
scarification screw too) but not enough paint is under the screw to chip
it when putting the screw in, or taking it out later.
I call the sacrificial screw that because it might get buggered up
screwing in and out. But most of mine made it successfully through the
entire process correctly. But after taking the tanks off many times with
them, some did need to be replaced in the end.
Screws can easily be painted by sticking them into a flat piece of
cardboard to be painted. Keeps em from flying around while being shot.
Paint lots of extras, you will need them.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Fiveonepw@aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: PAINTING THE GAS TANK
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 09/20/2004 1:38:22 PM Central Standard Time,
mstewart@iss.net writes:
On my S8 tanks, I have sacrificial screws which are slightly loose,
enough so that paint cant get underneath the head when sprayed, but
loose enough that paint wont stick to the head and skin when removed.
>>>>>>>>
So after painting, how long do you wait before putting in the final
screws
and tightening them? (using PPG Concept w/CC, may vary by system...)
Mark
==
==
==
==
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Wiring |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss <chaztuna@adelphia.net>
Gary,
Thanks for weighing in on this subject. I'm unfamiliar with Spec 44 or
polyalkene insulation. Could you expand on the characteristics of this
insulation?
Charlie Kuss
>--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
>
>
>In a message dated 9/21/2004 9:12:58 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
>retasker@optonline.net writes:
>
>The exposed silver
>tarnishes and makes it hard to solder. Bare copper also does the same.
>Tin plated copper doesn't do that.
>
>
>===============================
>
>However, Tin finishes have the unfortunate tendency to spontaneously grow
>whiskers, so I personally would always prefer Silver plating over
>Tin. Punch
>"Tin Whiskers" into any search engine and find a bunch of info on
>this subject
>from the military electronics realm.
>
>PTFE (Teflon) is extruded and sintered over the wire at high temperature so
>Silver plating the strands works better here than Tin.
>
>Having said that, all of the wiring in the Bradley is Spec44, which is a Tin
>plated polyalkene insulated wire.
>
>GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 719 hrs)
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Wiring |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
Here's the best hints I can give y'all on teflon or tefzel coated wire.
I don't know which is better, silver or tin coated or bare copper. They
all work.
1. Use a good quality 'automatic stripper' and use the correct 'hole'
...... you need to know the wire size. Cheap strippers won't grip the
wire very well and won't pull off the insulation. A razor blade will
work here also, but change often.
2. Do you know those rubber boots over alligator clips??? I mean the
heavy duty ones, not the stuff on Radio Shack clip leads. If your
automatic stripper doesn't pull the insulation all the way off or you
use the razor blade, poke the wire up into the small end of the clip
lead insulator, squeeze tight (your fingers work OK here) and pull the
insulation off. This, so far, is the best insulation remover I've found.
Linn
Doug Gray wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Doug Gray <dgra1233@bigpond.net.au>
>
>Silver or Nickle plated conductors generally have a 200 degree C max temeperature
rating.
>Tin plated conductors are limited to 150 C. High temps will cause the tin to
melt....
>
>ETFE (Tefzel) is more operator friendly and cheaper than PTFE. Both are generally
extruded but
>sometimes wrapped as strips arount the conductors. Both will cold flow.
>
>PTFE is a pain because very sharp tooling is necessary to strip the wire, and
it takes a skilled
>operator to avoid cut or nicked strands. It also seems to bond tenaceously to
the wire. (At least it
>is my experience)
>
>I do not have the data sheets at hand but IIRC both are equal and remarkable
in their ability to
>withstand environmental duress.
>
>Doug Gray
>
>
>
>>However, Tin finishes have the unfortunate tendency to spontaneously grow
>>whiskers, so I personally would always prefer Silver plating over Tin. Punch
>>"Tin Whiskers" into any search engine and find a bunch of info on this subject
>>from the military electronics realm.
>>
>>PTFE (Teflon) is extruded and sintered over the wire at high temperature so
>>Silver plating the strands works better here than Tin.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Sims, Doug" <Doug.Sims@danahermotion.com>
Strobe Grounding question-- I am wiring my strobe power supply in my rv8 and
have it located where the rear battery installation would be located. What
is the best way to ground the system. I have it bonded locally on the
airframe but question whether I should run it back to the common single
point grount location.
Doug
RV8
Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: linn walters [mailto:lwalters2@cfl.rr.com]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Wiring
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
Here's the best hints I can give y'all on teflon or tefzel coated wire.
I don't know which is better, silver or tin coated or bare copper. They
all work.
1. Use a good quality 'automatic stripper' and use the correct 'hole'
..... you need to know the wire size. Cheap strippers won't grip the
wire very well and won't pull off the insulation. A razor blade will
work here also, but change often.
2. Do you know those rubber boots over alligator clips??? I mean the
heavy duty ones, not the stuff on Radio Shack clip leads. If your
automatic stripper doesn't pull the insulation all the way off or you
use the razor blade, poke the wire up into the small end of the clip
lead insulator, squeeze tight (your fingers work OK here) and pull the
insulation off. This, so far, is the best insulation remover I've found.
Linn
Doug Gray wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Doug Gray <dgra1233@bigpond.net.au>
>
>Silver or Nickle plated conductors generally have a 200 degree C max
temeperature rating.
>Tin plated conductors are limited to 150 C. High temps will cause the tin
to melt....
>
>ETFE (Tefzel) is more operator friendly and cheaper than PTFE. Both are
generally extruded but
>sometimes wrapped as strips arount the conductors. Both will cold flow.
>
>PTFE is a pain because very sharp tooling is necessary to strip the wire,
and it takes a skilled
>operator to avoid cut or nicked strands. It also seems to bond tenaceously
to the wire. (At least it
>is my experience)
>
>I do not have the data sheets at hand but IIRC both are equal and
remarkable in their ability to
>withstand environmental duress.
>
>Doug Gray
>
>
>
>>However, Tin finishes have the unfortunate tendency to spontaneously grow
>>whiskers, so I personally would always prefer Silver plating over Tin.
Punch
>>"Tin Whiskers" into any search engine and find a bunch of info on this
subject
>>from the military electronics realm.
>>
>>PTFE (Teflon) is extruded and sintered over the wire at high temperature
so
>>Silver plating the strands works better here than Tin.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
Hi All-
Pardon my stupidity, but just recently there was a post about a new line of
paints that was being adopted by a truck manufacturer, and I wasn't bright
enough to save it or find it in the archives. Could you please repeat that
reference?
Do not archive
gm
Message 9
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--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
I'm pretty sure it was PPG CCU. I remember the post saying they have
something like 900 colors at a cost of about 200 per gallon.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glen Matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: paint
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
>
> Hi All-
>
> Pardon my stupidity, but just recently there was a post about a new line
of
> paints that was being adopted by a truck manufacturer, and I wasn't bright
> enough to save it or find it in the archives. Could you please repeat
that
> reference?
>
> Do not archive
>
> gm
>
>
Message 10
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--> RV-List message posted by: Jim Duckett <perfeng@3rivers.net>
Hi Glen,
That was me. The product line is Urotec (prefix AUE) produced by PPG.
It is their Commercial Coatings line.
It is a single stage acrylic urethane system. They also offer tinted
primer in the same line. The primer looks almost as good as the top coat.
Jim Duckett
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Wiring |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Jim & Bev Cone" <jimnbev@olypen.com>
There is also a very interesting rebuttal of the critique on the Blue Mountain
Discussion Board.
Jim Cone
3-Peat Offender
Message 12
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| Subject: | Hole for canopy latch |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Suffoletto" <rsuffoletto@hotmail.com>
The answer to this question may be obvious but I thought I would ask anyway. The
directions say to drill a 5/8 hole for the canopy latch, however, the canopy
frame handle mount will not fit through a 5/8 hole. I am assuming it has to go
through this hole and does not rest on the inside of the canopy. Perhaps the
thickness of the powder coating needs to be allowed for.
Can someone clarify for me?
Can't be too careful when dealing with the canopy.
Thanks
Richard
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Hole for canopy latch |
--> RV-List message posted by: Richard Tasker <retasker@optonline.net>
It needs to go through. I guess they assume that after you drill the
5/8" hole and then use sandpaper to religiously smooth out the inside of
the hole, it will be big enough - mine was anyway.
Dick Tasker
Richard Suffoletto wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Suffoletto" <rsuffoletto@hotmail.com>
>
>
>The answer to this question may be obvious but I thought I would ask anyway. The
directions say to drill a 5/8 hole for the canopy latch, however, the canopy
frame handle mount will not fit through a 5/8 hole. I am assuming it has to
go through this hole and does not rest on the inside of the canopy. Perhaps the
thickness of the powder coating needs to be allowed for.
>
>Can someone clarify for me?
>
>Can't be too careful when dealing with the canopy.
>
>Thanks
>
>Richard
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Wiring |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mike Nellis <mike@bmnellis.com>
And the link would be?????
Jim & Bev Cone wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Jim & Bev Cone" <jimnbev@olypen.com>
>
>There is also a very interesting rebuttal of the critique on the Blue Mountain
Discussion Board.
>
>Jim Cone
>3-Peat Offender
>
>
>
>
--
Mike Nellis
Austin, TX
CMRA #32 Honda RC51
'97 YZF1000
'47 Stinson 108-2; RV6 (Fuselage)
http://bmnellis.com
Message 15
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--> RV-List message posted by: "lancenewman" <lancenewman@comcast.net>
You can put a blister in the coweling to accomidate the alternator, or get a
shorter belt and or trim the mounting arm. The alternator vans sells is the
1987 Suzuki Samari alternator. 55 amp output internally regulated. Internal
cooling fans and handles the 7000 rpm turn rate without overheating. Also is
small and fits the coweling without a blister. 189.00 at any auto parts
store.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Shirley Harding" <shirleyh@argo.net.au>
Subject: RV-List: alternators
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Shirley Harding" <shirleyh@argo.net.au>
>
> Hi all -- any photos or advice on an alternator set-up for an RV6. I've
got the Vans brackets and a Bosch alternator but it seems to hit the lower
cowl.
>
> Cheers
> Shirley
>
> RV6
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Wiring |
--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
In a message dated 9/22/2004 4:39:02 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
chaztuna@adelphia.net writes:
Thanks for weighing in on this subject. I'm unfamiliar with Spec 44 or
polyalkene insulation. Could you expand on the characteristics of this
insulation?
======================================
Some info at
_http://www.raychem.com/resources/documents/datasheets/Wire_and_Cable/Spec44wc.pdf_
(http://www.raychem.com/resources/documents/datasheets/Wire_and_Cable/Spec44wc.pdf)
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 719 hrs)
Message 17
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| Subject: | IO-360 with a Bernie Warnke prop |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@coltnet.net>
Listers,
Just purchased a firewall forward IO-360 core with Bernie Warnke prop
included. Is Warnke Airproducts still in business? I found their website,
however the phone number list is no longer in service. Is it possible to
find out if it is still air worthy? If it isn't I think I will refinish it
and put it above my fireplace before my wife changes her mind. I didn't find
anything recent in the archives. I plan on putting the engine on an RV-8.
Haven't decided which prop to use.
Thanks
Dave
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