Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:57 AM - Re: Garmin 196 mounting... (Dave Bristol)
2. 08:07 AM - Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) (Skylor Piper)
3. 09:16 AM - Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) (William King)
4. 09:36 AM - Re: Garmin 196 mounting (Jerry2DT@aol.com)
5. 12:36 PM - Nutplate jigs (Mickey Coggins)
6. 01:07 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Richard Lundin)
7. 01:19 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Mike Nellis)
8. 01:30 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Bill VonDane)
9. 01:37 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Gary Zilik)
10. 01:37 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Richard Tasker)
11. 02:04 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (GMC)
12. 02:05 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (steve zicree)
13. 02:25 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (richard dudley)
14. 02:29 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Rick Galati)
15. 03:55 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Stein Bruch)
16. 03:57 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Mike Robertson)
17. 04:34 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Jim Jewell)
18. 04:39 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Chris & Kellie Hand)
19. 04:41 PM - Flying with flaps down (Hopperdhh@aol.com)
20. 04:48 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (steve zicree)
21. 05:11 PM - Re: Flying with flaps down (Alex Peterson)
22. 05:27 PM - >Re :Nutplate Jigs (Oldsfolks@aol.com)
23. 05:57 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (Stein Bruch)
24. 06:07 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (LarryRobertHelming)
25. 07:12 PM - (steve zicree)
26. 07:16 PM - (steve zicree)
27. 07:49 PM - Special N-Number reservation (William King)
28. 08:00 PM - Re: Flying with flaps down (Ed Holyoke)
29. 08:01 PM - Re: Special N-Number reservation (Vanremog@aol.com)
30. 08:04 PM - Re: Special N-Number reservation (Ed Holyoke)
31. 08:10 PM - Re: Hinges (Vanremog@aol.com)
32. 08:29 PM - Re: Flying with flaps down (steve zicree)
33. 08:29 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (R. Craig Chipley)
34. 08:31 PM - Re: Hinges (steve zicree)
35. 08:45 PM - Re: Hinges (Vanremog@aol.com)
36. 08:49 PM - Re: Special N-Number reservation (Brian Kraut)
37. 10:39 PM - Re: Nutplate jigs (HCRV6@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Garmin 196 mounting... |
clamav-milter version 0.80j
on zoot.lafn.org
--> RV-List message posted by: Dave Bristol <bj034@lafn.org>
Tom,
Check out the RAM mounts at: http://www.ram-mount.com/
I have my Garmin 195 mounted in my 6 using one and I love it! The GPS
can be swiveled to almost any position you like.
Spruce carries them.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/avpages/ram196.php
Dave
Tom wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom" <tomrv8@gvtc.com>
>
>I would like to mount my Garmin 196 GPS in my RV-4, and plan to mount it in
>front of the upper right area of the instrument panel at the intersection of
>the side rail. In that postition it won't be blocking any guages, and should
>be out of the way of my knees. (no room to mount it in the panel itself)
>
>My question is, what mounting brackets might be compatible/ adaptable to
>work with the '196 (or use, in conjunction with, the supplied Garmin
>bracket), and would allow me to attach the bracket to the bottom lip of the
>instrument panel, or possibly to the side rail. Any info on the make of
>bracket and supplier would be greatly appreciated.
>
>Do not archive
>
>Thanks!
>Tom
>San Antonio
>N153TK 16 years old and 1100 hours later...
>
>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) |
--> RV-List message posted by: Skylor Piper <skylor4@yahoo.com>
These are typical Hotrodder misnomers...
It is true that alcohol does contain an oxygen atom at
the end of the Carbon-Hydrogen chain...actually an OH.
In fact, the chemical symbol of ethanol is C2H5OH.
Unfortunately, that molecule of Oxygen is the primary
reason that alcohol has LESS energy per unit mass than
gasoline.
It IS true, however, that Nitromethane is and oxygen
bearing fuel. Instead of the Oxygen being combined
with hydrogen, as it is in alcohol, it's combined with
Nitrogen...just like nitrous oxide.
Now, as has already been stated, even though alcohol
has less available energy per pound than gasoling,
alchol will improve the volumetric efficiency of an
engine over gasoline. One of the reasons for this is
the relatively high octane rating of alcohol, but the
other reason is that alcohol has a higher latent heat
of vaporization than gasoline. This results in a
cooler intake charge, thus a denser fuel/air mixture.
So an engine burning alcohol can produce more power
than an equivalent enginer burning gasoline, BUT the
brake specific fuel consumption will also be higher.
Intersting read about alcohol fuels:
http://web.ask.com/redir?bpg=http%3a%2f%2fweb.ask.com%2fweb%3fq%3dAlternative%2bFuel%2bAlcohol%26o%3d0%26page%3d1&q=Alternative+Fuel+Alcohol&u=http%3a%2f%2ftm.wc.ask.com%2fr%3ft%3dan%26s%3da%26uid%3d06A23CEF91BF9B814%26sid%3d14728CEF91BF9B814%26qid%3dD90F5D88A1FC9746AB38283FA5E9E402%26io%3d5%26sv%3dza5cb0d76%26o%3d0%26ask%3dAlternative%2bFuel%2bAlcohol%26uip%3dc02d481b%26en%3dte%26eo%3d-100%26pt%3d5.%2bAlcohol%2band%2bcotton%2boil%2bas%2balternative%2bfuels%2bfor%2binternal%26ac%3d6%26qs%3d69%26pg%3d1%26ep%3d1%26te_par%3d108%26te_id%3d%26u%3dhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.fao.org%2fdocrep%2fT4470E%2ft4470e08.htm&s=a&bu=http%3a%2f%2fwww.fao.org%2fdocrep%2fT4470E%2ft4470e08.htm&qte=0&o=0&abs=...produce+the+alcohol+at+the+minimum+cost.++Each+country+around+the+world+has+found+the+best+compromise+in+the+production+of+an+alternative+fuel...&tit=5.+Alcohol+and+cotton+oil+as+alternative+fuels+for+internal&bin=fe2afa2cc407d9bcaff2a441b87b8afd%26s%3d1256968492&cat=wp&purl=http%3a%2f%2ftm.wc.ask.com
%2fi%2fb
.html%3ft%3dan%26s%3da%26uid%3d06A23CEF91BF9B814%26sid%3d14728CEF91BF9B814%26qid%3dD90F5D88A1FC9746AB38283FA5E9E402%26io%3d%26sv%3dza5cb0d76%26o%3d0%26ask%3dAlternative%2bFuel%2bAlcohol%26uip%3dc02d481b%26en%3dbm%26eo%3d-100%26pt%3d%26ac%3d24%26qs%3d69%26pg%3d1%26u%3dhttp%3a%2f%2fmyjeeves.ask.com%2faction%2fsnip&Complete=1
The link will undoubtedly get split...
--- Scott Jackson <jayeandscott@telus.net> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Scott Jackson"
> <jayeandscott@telus.net>
>
> Yep, 's'true, otherwise, how could a top-fuel
> dragster put out so much
> horsepower on just the amount of air drawn in by the
> 6-71 blowers? They get
> the rest from the fuel, which comes pre-oxygenated,
> so to speak.
> And they drink it at a rate which borders on
> hydraulic lock, too.
> SCott in lVAncouver
> do not archive
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jack Ford" <jackoford@theofficenet.com>
> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel
> Senders...)
>
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: "Jack Ford"
> <jackoford@theofficenet.com>
> >
> > Way I heard it, back in my hotrodding days, was
> that alcohol carries some
> > of
> > its own oxygen, so it acts sort of like it was
> supercharged, BUT, volume
> > comsumption has to increase to make up for it, so
> you'll be running a lot
> > richer at full power, but you'll also be putting
> out a lot more steam.
> > Jack Ford
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cgalley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
> > To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel
> Senders...)
> >
> >
> >> --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley"
> <cgalley@qcbc.org>
> >>
> >> As I remember it, you have to burn more (higher
> fuel flow) to get the
> > higher
> >> power output with alcohol.
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Chris W"
> <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm@cox.net>
> >> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> >> Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel
> Senders...)
> >>
> >>
> >> > --> RV-List message posted by: Chris W
> >> <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm@cox.net>
> >> >
> >> > Scott Bilinski wrote:
> >> >
> >> > >Yes it has lower BTU's but also puts out about
> 10% more power at
> >> > >the same power settings.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > I'm confused. How can it have less BTU's and
> still put out more power?
> >> > BTU is an energy unit and Power is Energy over
> time. So if ethanol
> >> > has
> >> > fewer BTU's per gallon, how could you possibly
> get 10% more power at
> >> > the
> >> > same GPH flow?
> >> >
> >> > This is probably a bad estimate, and probably
> changes a lot with scale.
> >> > In the model airplane world if you have a big
> bird you want to convert
> >> > from a nitro-methane engine to a gas engine,
> the general rule of thumb
> >> > is you only need half as much fuel by volume.
> >> >
> >> > Now diesel seems the way to go, more BTU's per
> lbs and more lbs per
> >> > gallon... it's like getting long range tanks
> for free. Of course there
> >> > is the whole needing a new engine part. I just
> hope by the time I get
> >> > building Deltahawk or some other manufacture
> will have a 180+ hp diesel
> >> > with all the bugs worked out.
> >> >
> >> > Chris W
> >> > Not getting the gifts you want? The Wish Zone
> can help.
> >> > http://thewishzone.com
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> by the
> Admin.
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
www.yahoo.com
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) |
--> RV-List message posted by: "William King" <bill@kane-king.com>
You can use this link to get to the same place
http://www.fao.org/docrep/T4470E/t4470e08.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Skylor Piper" <skylor4@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...)
> --> RV-List message posted by: Skylor Piper <skylor4@yahoo.com>
>
> These are typical Hotrodder misnomers...
>
> It is true that alcohol does contain an oxygen atom at
> the end of the Carbon-Hydrogen chain...actually an OH.
> In fact, the chemical symbol of ethanol is C2H5OH.
> Unfortunately, that molecule of Oxygen is the primary
> reason that alcohol has LESS energy per unit mass than
> gasoline.
>
> It IS true, however, that Nitromethane is and oxygen
> bearing fuel. Instead of the Oxygen being combined
> with hydrogen, as it is in alcohol, it's combined with
> Nitrogen...just like nitrous oxide.
>
> Now, as has already been stated, even though alcohol
> has less available energy per pound than gasoling,
> alchol will improve the volumetric efficiency of an
> engine over gasoline. One of the reasons for this is
> the relatively high octane rating of alcohol, but the
> other reason is that alcohol has a higher latent heat
> of vaporization than gasoline. This results in a
> cooler intake charge, thus a denser fuel/air mixture.
> So an engine burning alcohol can produce more power
> than an equivalent enginer burning gasoline, BUT the
> brake specific fuel consumption will also be higher.
>
> Intersting read about alcohol fuels:
>
> http://web.ask.com/redir?bpg=http%3a%2f%2fweb.ask.com%2fweb%3fq%3dAlternative%2bFuel%2bAlcohol%26o%3d0%26page%3d1&q=Alternative+Fuel+Alcohol&u=http%3a%2f%2ftm.wc.ask.com%2fr%3ft%3dan%26s%3da%26uid%3d06A23CEF91BF9B814%26sid%3d14728CEF91BF9B814%26qid%3dD90F5D88A1FC9746AB38283FA5E9E402%26io%3d5%26sv%3dza5cb0d76%26o%3d0%26ask%3dAlternative%2bFuel%2bAlcohol%26uip%3dc02d481b%26en%3dte%26eo%3d-100%26pt%3d5.%2bAlcohol%2band%2bcotton%2boil%2bas%2balternative%2bfuels%2bfor%2binternal%26ac%3d6%26qs%3d69%26pg%3d1%26ep%3d1%26te_par%3d108%26te_id%3d%26u%3dhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.fao.org%2fdocrep%2fT4470E%2ft4470e08.htm&s=a&bu=http%3a%2f%2fwww.fao.org%2fdocrep%2fT4470E%2ft4470e08.htm&qte=0&o=0&abs=...produce+the+alcohol+at+the+minimum+cost.++Each+country+around+the+world+has+found+the+best+compromise+in+the+production+of+an+alternative+fuel...&tit=5.+Alcohol+and+cotton+oil+as+alternative+fuels+for+internal&bin=fe2afa2cc407d9bcaff2a441b87b8afd%26s%3d1256968492&cat=wp&purl=http%3a%2f%2ftm.wc.ask.c
om
> %2fi%2fb
> .html%3ft%3dan%26s%3da%26uid%3d06A23CEF91BF9B814%26sid%3d14728CEF91BF9B814%26qid%3dD90F5D88A1FC9746AB38283FA5E9E402%26io%3d%26sv%3dza5cb0d76%26o%3d0%26ask%3dAlternative%2bFuel%2bAlcohol%26uip%3dc02d481b%26en%3dbm%26eo%3d-100%26pt%3d%26ac%3d24%26qs%3d69%26pg%3d1%26u%3dhttp%3a%2f%2fmyjeeves.ask.com%2faction%2fsnip&Complete=1
>
> The link will undoubtedly get split...
>
>
> --- Scott Jackson <jayeandscott@telus.net> wrote:
>
>> --> RV-List message posted by: "Scott Jackson"
>> <jayeandscott@telus.net>
>>
>> Yep, 's'true, otherwise, how could a top-fuel
>> dragster put out so much
>> horsepower on just the amount of air drawn in by the
>> 6-71 blowers? They get
>> the rest from the fuel, which comes pre-oxygenated,
>> so to speak.
>> And they drink it at a rate which borders on
>> hydraulic lock, too.
>> SCott in lVAncouver
>> do not archive
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Jack Ford" <jackoford@theofficenet.com>
>> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>> Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel
>> Senders...)
>>
>>
>> > --> RV-List message posted by: "Jack Ford"
>> <jackoford@theofficenet.com>
>> >
>> > Way I heard it, back in my hotrodding days, was
>> that alcohol carries some
>> > of
>> > its own oxygen, so it acts sort of like it was
>> supercharged, BUT, volume
>> > comsumption has to increase to make up for it, so
>> you'll be running a lot
>> > richer at full power, but you'll also be putting
>> out a lot more steam.
>> > Jack Ford
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "cgalley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
>> > To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel
>> Senders...)
>> >
>> >
>> >> --> RV-List message posted by: "cgalley"
>> <cgalley@qcbc.org>
>> >>
>> >> As I remember it, you have to burn more (higher
>> fuel flow) to get the
>> > higher
>> >> power output with alcohol.
>> >>
>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> From: "Chris W"
>> <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm@cox.net>
>> >> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>> >> Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel
>> Senders...)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > --> RV-List message posted by: Chris W
>> >> <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm@cox.net>
>> >> >
>> >> > Scott Bilinski wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > >Yes it has lower BTU's but also puts out about
>> 10% more power at
>> >> > >the same power settings.
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > I'm confused. How can it have less BTU's and
>> still put out more power?
>> >> > BTU is an energy unit and Power is Energy over
>> time. So if ethanol
>> >> > has
>> >> > fewer BTU's per gallon, how could you possibly
>> get 10% more power at
>> >> > the
>> >> > same GPH flow?
>> >> >
>> >> > This is probably a bad estimate, and probably
>> changes a lot with scale.
>> >> > In the model airplane world if you have a big
>> bird you want to convert
>> >> > from a nitro-methane engine to a gas engine,
>> the general rule of thumb
>> >> > is you only need half as much fuel by volume.
>> >> >
>> >> > Now diesel seems the way to go, more BTU's per
>> lbs and more lbs per
>> >> > gallon... it's like getting long range tanks
>> for free. Of course there
>> >> > is the whole needing a new engine part. I just
>> hope by the time I get
>> >> > building Deltahawk or some other manufacture
>> will have a 180+ hp diesel
>> >> > with all the bugs worked out.
>> >> >
>> >> > Chris W
>> >> > Not getting the gifts you want? The Wish Zone
>> can help.
>> >> > http://thewishzone.com
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> Click on the
>> this
>> by the
>> Admin.
>> _->
>> Contributions
>> any other
>> Forums.
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
>> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
>> http://www.matronics.com/archives
>> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
>> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> __________________________________
> www.yahoo.com
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Garmin 196 mounting |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry2DT@aol.com
Tom,
We used Ram Mount pieces to install the GPS 196 in our -6a. Works well, and
can swivel for best view. They are in various catalogs like Chief and Wicks.
Website is _http://www.ram-mount.com/_ (http://www.ram-mount.com/)
Jerry Cochran
From: "Tom" <tomrv8@gvtc.com>
Subject: RV-List: Garmin 196 mounting...
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom" <tomrv8@gvtc.com>
I would like to mount my Garmin 196 GPS in my RV-4, and plan to mount it in
front of the upper right area of the instrument panel at the intersection of
the side rail. In that postition it won't be blocking any guages, and should
be out of the way of my knees. (no room to mount it in the panel itself)
Message 5
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Hi,
I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
Message 6
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|
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Richard Lundin <rlundin46@yahoo.com>
Absolutely!
Rick
--- Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
> <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate
> installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them
> better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line
> up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery
> charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care
> to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> by the
> Admin.
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
www.yahoo.com
Message 7
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|
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mike Nellis <mike@bmnellis.com>
Mickey, I don't know why your screw holes wouldn't line p correctly.
Here is the sequence I use and it works out great.
1. Drill #30 hole where screw is to be place
2. Cleco nut plate in place
3. Position nut plate so tabs are in correct position
4. Drill 1st tab and cleco
5. Drill 2nd tab
6. Before riveting nut plate in place, drill screw hold to final size
Works every time and, no, I don't think the nut plate jigs are worth the
cost.
I seem to recall a web site with some pictures so I went looking. I
found it in the old, tried and true website of Sam Buchanan. He even
shows how to correctly install the nut plates if you screw up the
sequence. :)
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/tanks.html
--
Mike Nellis
Austin, TX
CMRA #32 Honda RC51
'97 YZF1000
'47 Stinson 108-2; RV6 (Fuselage)
http://bmnellis.com
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Bill VonDane <bill@vondane.com>
Mickey... As long as you do your drilling and riveting with a screw in the
nutplate you wont have any trouble.....and you wont need to spend the $38!
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A (FOR SALE)
www.vondane.com/forsale/rv8a
--- Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
> <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate
> installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them
> better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line
> up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery
> charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care
> to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> by the
> Admin.
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
__________________________________
www.yahoo.com
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Gary Zilik <zilik@excelgeo.com>
On my first RV I made my own nutplate jig instead of buying the
expensive one. On the second RV the jig finally wore out and I went back
to using the nutplate for the jig and got pretty good and fast at it.
When I started the 3rd RV I broke down and bought #8 and #6 jigs from
Brown Tool (cheaper than Avery) and would never go back to the time
before jigs. They are worth it. There are literally hundreds of
nutplates in the typical RV.
Gary Zilik
Mickey Coggins wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Richard Tasker <retasker@optonline.net>
I don't know if they are worth it or not. You could make one easily if
you wanted to.
What I do is drill the screw hole first to whatever size cleco will fit
through the nutplate - same as the nutplate screw for standard
nutplates, smaller for countersunk nutplates. Then I cleco the nutplate
to the aluminum through the screw hole and drill the first rivet hole
right through the nutplate hole. The nutplate is held firmly in place
by the first cleco so it is easy to drill properly. Then I put another
cleco in the first rivet hole and drill the second through the second
nutplate hole. Finally, for the countersunk nutplates I redrill the
screw hole to the proper size.
Dick Tasker
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: GMC <gmcnutt@shaw.ca>
Hi Mickey
I am starting on second RV without nutplate jigs and do not intend to get
any.
My method is slower but here is how I go about mounting nutplates.
(1) put screw through hole into nutplate, not tight just one turn & center
in hole, (nutplate upside down on structure or as required).
(2) using finger pressure on one tab to keep things from shifting drill
through other nutplate tab into structure, then drop a rivet into this hole
to keep nutplate from shifting.
(3) drill second rivet hole.
(4) remove screw & rivet from holes.
(5) use deburring tool to countersink structure. Note that I use only the
small headed "UH-OH" NAS 1097AD3 rivets for mounting nutplates, this will
work on material as thin as .025.
George in Langley
-----Original Message-----
--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Hi,
I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
Thanks,
Mickey
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
What I do is use the smallest drill size that will allow the screw to pass
through. I then use a real short screw to hold the nutplate in position
while I drill for the rivets. After deburring and countersinking, I use the
same screw to hold the nutplate in postion while I squeeze the rivets.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey Coggins" <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: richard dudley <rhdudley@att.net>
Mickey,
Nutplate jigs are wonderful. They are very accurate and save lots of
time and aggravation. Drill the hole for the screw body, insert the pin
of the jig. Drill the first hole for a rivet. Then flip the jig over
insert the center pin and the rivet pin and drill the hole for the
second rivet. At least on the 6/A I used them for wing root fairings,
floor nutplates ( I used screws on the floor), panel, tail fairing
,wingtips and many other locations.
Regards,
Richard Dudley
-6A ready to move to the airport
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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|
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Rick Galati <rick6a@yahoo.com>
Mickey,
For installing the odd nutplate here and there, you can get by well enough without
using a nutplate jig. My preferred method is to drill out the center hole
to accept the screw or bolt and using washers as stack spacers, temporarily install
and align the nutplate to the assembly with a temporary screw or bolt tightened
down to discourage any clocking movement. Drill out one rivet hole and
cleco if possible or at least shove a #40 drill bit through it to help prevent
shifting. Drill out the second rivet hole, then disassemble for deburring.
Reassemble using 1097AD3 rivets. There is a thumbscrew available with undersize
threads that is used to hold the nutplate element in place of a temporary
screw, but I have not seen these tools available to the homebuilder. Perhaps
someone out there knows of a source.
If you are going to install nutplates in dozens of places, I consider nutplate
jigs an essential tool. This is based upon my sometimes daily and otherwise long
experience using all manner of nutplate jigs on the factory floor. Nothing
else insures consistent quality and repeatability like this specialized tool
does, and that goes double when drilling out the hole pattern for floating nutplates.
My RV-6A makes extensive use of (mostly) floating nutplates which includes
service holding all manner of accessories to the firewall, every single
one of the fiberglass tips except for the vertical stab and rudder top, fully
removable floors, upper cowl attach, etc. An assortment of nutplate jigs greatly
simplified these varied tasks. I find that most people having once familiarized
themselves with a nutplate jig, are somewhat loathe to go back to the
basic way of drilling out nutplate hole patterns.
Rick Galati RV-6A "finishing"
Message 15
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Hi Mickey,
I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates and
thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real true
to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are worth
their weight in gold.
If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after you
use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
Just my experience.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Hi,
I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
Message 16
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569@hotmail.com>
Mickey,
They are worth every penny if you are doing more than just a couple of
nutplates.
Mike Robertson
>From: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>Date: Fri, 05 Nov 2004 21:35:32 +0100
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Jim Jewell" <jjewell@telus.net>
Hi Mickey,
Try this:
Shorten a screw of the size that matches the nutplate you wish to install.
Insert the shortened screw and tighten as required to hold the nutplate in
place.
Drill the intended screw hole to the final screw size. Put the nut plate
into place on the material side that allows best drilling access.
(If the shortened screw is the right length it will hold the nutplate in
place for the drilling of the first hole without going all the way through
the nutplate. This preserves the nutplate threads.)
Using light pressure carefully drill the first nutplate mounting hole and
cleako it in place. Drill the second mounting hole. Install the nutplate
when and as required.
Another approach: Cut the head off of the screw of a size that matches the
nutplate you wish to install.
Install the cut off threaded section snugly into the nutplate.
Dill the screw hole to the final screw size. Put the nut plate into place on
the material side that allows best drilling access. Clamp one end of the
nutplate in position. drill the first hole then cleako for drilling the
second hole
In both cases a clamp or a small pair of Vice-grip pliers can be used (when
space allows) to hold the nutplate for drilling the first nutplate mounting
hole. "Some Duct tape (the handy man's secret weapon") on the Vise-grip jaws
protects the surfaces.
I suppose that if you really need to build fast or you intend to re offend
( build more than one RV) the cash for the neat tool would be well spent.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey Coggins" <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Chris & Kellie Hand" <ckhand@earthlink.net>
You guys are raising my interest level - I'm one of those that has been
using the nutplates themselves as jigs and have been pretty satisfied doing
it that way (at the end of fuselage kit, start of finishing kit stage).
Anybody out there that has used the jigs and still thinks it's just as easy
either way?
Chris Hand
RV-6A, #23559, sloooow but steady progress.....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Mickey,
>
> I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
and
> thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
true
> to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
worth
> their weight in gold.
>
> If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
you
> use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
>
> Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
>
> Just my experience.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Flying with flaps down |
--> RV-List message posted by: Hopperdhh@aol.com
Fellow RVers,
This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off from an airport
after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full down. I'm sure
he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
destination he looked everything over, and can find no damage. Has anyone else
ever
done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Mickey,
>
> I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
and
> thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
true
> to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
worth
> their weight in gold.
>
> If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
you
> use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
>
> Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
>
> Just my experience.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Flying with flaps down |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson@earthlink.net>
> Fellow RVers,
>
> This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off
> from an airport
> after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full
> down. I'm sure
> he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
> destination he looked everything over, and can find no
> damage. Has anyone else ever
> done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
>
> Dan Hopper
> RV-7A
> N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
Dan, the honest among us will admit we have taken off and begun our flight
with some amount of flap down. I take off with about half flaps, and a
couple times in 550 hours of flying have failed to retract them fully (got
distracted, answered a radio call, etc., left an inch or two of flap in) An
inch of flaps down is quite noticeable, as even an inch is equivalent to
something like 3-4 inches of manifold pressure drop. What is a little hard
to imagine is proceeding with full flaps. I think my trim would have to be
full forward with high power just to keep the plane flying generally level
with full flaps. Go arounds with full flaps and full power can really
surprise one with the forward stick force needed until the trim is rolled
in. I would guess my 180 horse plane could make maybe 120-130 knots with
full flaps down, if that.
These planes will talk to us, we just need to listen. Anything that seems
amiss probably is.
Dan, or I mean Dan's friend, learn from it and move on. My only question is
why did you, er, he, have full flaps on takeoff? Full flaps lengthen the
takeoff roll.
Alex Peterson
RV6-A 548 hours
Maple Grove, MN
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | >Re :Nutplate Jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Oldsfolks@aol.com
If you look at my "Photoshare" posting for Feb. 11 , 2004 there is a picture
of a very simple platenut jig which doesn't wear out. Just put on another
platenut and install the worn one somewhere.
The post is Feb. 11 ,2004 , Bob Olds in the matronics photoshare
archives.
do not archive
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
Message 23
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Nope, but I can't for the life of me figure out why anyone (including me)
would rather goof around with all these long protracted stories about
inserting a screw, drilling, clecoing, ad.nauseum when the neat little tool
takes literally a few seconds to do each nutplate with NO screws, clecos,
screwdrivers, shortened screws, etc..
I'm just as scared of spending wasted money on stupid gadgets as the next
guy, and much of the time I'm just stubborn enough to think those little
things aren't needed and the "old way" is best, but in this case the
opposite is true.
Just to be clear, I've done it both ways, and have the worn out nutplates to
prove it but wouldn't go back.
Cheers,
Stein.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of steve zicree
Subject: Re: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Mickey,
>
> I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
and
> thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
true
> to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
worth
> their weight in gold.
>
> If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
you
> use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
>
> Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
>
> Just my experience.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
>
> Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
> convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
>
Not all of us. I agree with a few that say you don't need them. I have
built an entire slow build RV7 without a nutplate jig. It can be done and
done well. The key, as some others have already stated, is to drill your
screw hole small so you can use a cleco to hold the nutplate in place. Then
drill your rivet holes using the nutplate as your drill guide. Before
riveting them on, expand the original screw hole to full size. Then rivet
the nutplate on. Works like a charm. You don't have to look for or store
that extra tool any place either. More $$ for avgas when you get done. do
not archive
Indiana Larry, RV7 TipUp "SunSeeker"
The sincerest satisfactions in life come in doing and not dodging duty;
in meeting and solving problems, in facing facts;
in flying a virgin plane never flown before.
- Richard L. Evans & Larry R Helming
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> --> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
>
> Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
> convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
>
> Steve Zicree
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
> >
> > Hi Mickey,
> >
> > I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
> and
> > thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> > nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
> true
> > to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
> worth
> > their weight in gold.
> >
> > If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
> you
> > use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
> >
> > Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
> >
> > Just my experience.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Stein Bruch
> > RV6's, Minneapolis.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> > To: rv-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> >
> >
> > --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> > and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> > My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
> >
> > Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> > for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mickey
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mickey Coggins
> > http://www.rv8.ch/
> > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
> >
> >
>
>
Message 25
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1.16 MISSING_SUBJECT Missing Subject: header
--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're very thin
material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only reason I care
is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
Steve Zicree
RV4, wearing pants!
Message 26
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1.16 MISSING_SUBJECT Missing Subject: header
--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're very thin
material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only reason I care
is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
Steve Zicree
RV4, wearing pants!
Message 27
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|
| Subject: | Special N-Number reservation |
--> RV-List message posted by: "William King" <bill@kane-king.com>
Greetings
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
Bill King
www.kane-king.com
Message 28
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| Subject: | Flying with flaps down |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
Dan,
A friend of mine took off in a 6a with the flaps full down and took a
minute to figure out why it wouldn't accelerate and climb as well as it
usually does. Alex is right. The airplane will tell you something's
wrong. I bet you don't forget to raise them next time. I, I mean my
friend didn't forget again. Same guy forgot to latch his oil filler door
once, too.
Check your canopy at least twice before you go too. That one wasn't my
fault, though. The spring that holds the tip-up latch wasn't long enough
and allowed the latch to come loose and the canopy to open in flight.
That was about a week after we bought the plane. Made an impression on
me. I was at OSH buying springs that night. I may forget to turn on my
transponder every now and them, but I never forget to check the canopy.
Ed Holyoke
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Hopperdhh@aol.com
Subject: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
--> RV-List message posted by: Hopperdhh@aol.com
Fellow RVers,
This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off from an
airport
after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full down. I'm
sure
he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
destination he looked everything over, and can find no damage. Has
anyone else ever
done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Special N-Number reservation |
--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:51:08 PM Pacific Standard Time,
bill@kane-king.com writes:
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
===========================================
Be careful, as assignment of the number (as opposed to reserved status) may
have significant tax implications effective on the date of assignment.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Special N-Number reservation |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
Bill,
You can register the aircraft now if you want, I think, but your local
taxman will come knocking. I've renewed my reservation a couple of times
now. A very minor expense.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
N 86ED (reserved)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William King
Subject: RV-List: Special N-Number reservation
--> RV-List message posted by: "William King" <bill@kane-king.com>
Greetings
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It
expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to
my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially
completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
Bill King
www.kane-king.com
Message 31
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
szicree@adelphia.net writes:
Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're very
thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only reason I
care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
==========================================
I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then be
approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size. I believe
you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
Message 32
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|
| Subject: | Re: Flying with flaps down |
--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
This thread has reminded me of the importance of checklists. Is anybody
using an electronic checklist and, if so, how do you like it? I know they
have some that even read the entries in your own voice and would be curious
to hear from anybody who's tried one.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
>
> Dan,
>
> A friend of mine took off in a 6a with the flaps full down and took a
> minute to figure out why it wouldn't accelerate and climb as well as it
> usually does. Alex is right. The airplane will tell you something's
> wrong. I bet you don't forget to raise them next time. I, I mean my
> friend didn't forget again. Same guy forgot to latch his oil filler door
> once, too.
>
> Check your canopy at least twice before you go too. That one wasn't my
> fault, though. The spring that holds the tip-up latch wasn't long enough
> and allowed the latch to come loose and the canopy to open in flight.
> That was about a week after we bought the plane. Made an impression on
> me. I was at OSH buying springs that night. I may forget to turn on my
> transponder every now and them, but I never forget to check the canopy.
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Hopperdhh@aol.com
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Hopperdhh@aol.com
>
> Fellow RVers,
>
> This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off from an
> airport
> after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full down. I'm
> sure
> he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
> destination he looked everything over, and can find no damage. Has
> anyone else ever
> done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
>
> Dan Hopper
> RV-7A
> N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
>
>
Message 33
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: "R. Craig Chipley" <mechtech81@yahoo.com>
Well, There is one more way without jigs that is
fairly simple. In the place where you want a nutplate,
find your center and drill a #30 hole. Place your
nutplate on TOP of the skin and cleco it down. Use a
medium length drill bit drill your first rivet hole
with the #40 drill. Put in a cleco and drill the other
hole. If your worried about movement put in a screw
down cleco. Not that hard works good lasts a long
time.
--- Stein Bruch <stein@steinair.com> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch"
> <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Nope, but I can't for the life of me figure out why
> anyone (including me)
> would rather goof around with all these long
> protracted stories about
> inserting a screw, drilling, clecoing, ad.nauseum
> when the neat little tool
> takes literally a few seconds to do each nutplate
> with NO screws, clecos,
> screwdrivers, shortened screws, etc..
>
> I'm just as scared of spending wasted money on
> stupid gadgets as the next
> guy, and much of the time I'm just stubborn enough
> to think those little
> things aren't needed and the "old way" is best, but
> in this case the
> opposite is true.
>
> Just to be clear, I've done it both ways, and have
> the worn out nutplates to
> prove it but wouldn't go back.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf
> Of steve zicree
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree"
> <szicree@adelphia.net>
>
> Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate
> jig makers? You've
> convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
>
> Steve Zicree
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
> To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch"
> <stein@steinair.com>
> >
> > Hi Mickey,
> >
> > I used to use every old trick in the book there
> was to put in nutplates
> and
> > thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need
> no darned new-fangled
> > nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I
> acquired some "real
> true
> > to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little
> handheld units that are
> worth
> > their weight in gold.
> >
> > If you haven't used them, you'll think you're
> doing fine. But....after
> you
> > use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them
> before.
> >
> > Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these
> "nutplate" intensive RV's.
> >
> > Just my experience.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Stein Bruch
> > RV6's, Minneapolis.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On
> Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> > To: rv-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> >
> >
> > --> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
> <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate
> installations,
> > and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them
> better.
> > My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line
> up right.
> >
> > Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery
> charge
> > for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care
> to pass on?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mickey
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mickey Coggins
> > http://www.rv8.ch/
> > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> by the
> Admin.
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
www.yahoo.com
Message 34
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--> RV-List message posted by: "steve zicree" <szicree@adelphia.net>
They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up til now.
They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any heavier. Is
there some easy way to tell the difference?
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: <Vanremog@aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
> --> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
>
>
> In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> szicree@adelphia.net writes:
>
> Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're
very
> thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only
reason I
> care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
>
>
> ==========================================
>
> I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then be
> approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size. I
believe
> you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
>
> GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
>
>
Message 35
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--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
In a message dated 11/5/2004 8:33:18 PM Pacific Standard Time,
szicree@adelphia.net writes:
They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up til now.
They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any heavier. Is
there some easy way to tell the difference?
How thin? Rolled aluminum hinges would need to be .040" thick to be good
for even a light structural application as they are made of 5052 (soft) alloy
in order to roll the eyelets without cracking the material. Extruded aluminum
alloy hinges would be obvious due to their cross-section. If the hinges you
have are the rolled eyelet type, are thinner than .040" and you can't tear
them apart with your bare hands, I would guess that they are stainless.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
Message 36
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|
| Subject: | Special N-Number reservation |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
You can register the aircraft before it is complete, as a matter of fact,
since they sometimes take a while to mail back the registration you normally
register it before it is done so you have the paperwork back before the
inspection. Until you get the inspection and have an airworthiness
certificate it is a partially completed airplane anyway so they are all
registered before they are complete.
You will trigger the sales tax man in most states by the registration so
that is a consideration if you won't be done for a while.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of William King
Subject: RV-List: Special N-Number reservation
--> RV-List message posted by: "William King" <bill@kane-king.com>
Greetings
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
Bill King
www.kane-king.com
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
--> RV-List message posted by: HCRV6@aol.com
In a message dated 11/5/04 12:39:58 PM Pacific Standard Time,
mick-matronics@rv8.ch writes:
<< Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge for them (38 USD)?
Any other tricks that you care to pass on? >>
I've never been sorry I purchased both #6 and #8 nutplate jigs early on.
They don't work however on the smaller MK nutplates or on the 45 degree ones.
For them I use the nutplate as a jig. Drill the screw hole first, then attach
the nutplate with a short screw and use it as a guide to drill the rivet holes.
Much slower than the jig but it gets the job done.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final details
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