Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:55 AM - Re: Newbie Q: Fluting seat ribs (Andrew Douglas)
2. 06:57 AM - Re: Re: Alternator temperature monitor was Apples to (LarryRobertHelming)
3. 07:40 AM - ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
4. 08:31 AM - Re: ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
5. 09:59 AM - Re: Riveting LE To Spar (HCRV6@aol.com)
6. 11:53 AM - Dan's New NTSB program (Tom Gummo)
7. 11:58 AM - sales tax ()
8. 12:29 PM - Re: Dan's New NTSB program (Kathleen (rv7))
9. 12:36 PM - Re: sales tax (Tom Gummo)
10. 12:59 PM - sales tax ()
11. 01:10 PM - Re: sales tax (linn walters)
12. 01:59 PM - Re: ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 (Ken Beene)
13. 02:43 PM - Re: ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 (LarryRobertHelming)
14. 02:58 PM - Re: Dan's New NTSB program (Scott Vanartsdalen)
15. 03:09 PM - Re: Dan's New NTSB program (Derrick Aubuchon)
16. 03:32 PM - teflon hose (sarg314)
17. 05:00 PM - Re: Dan's New NTSB program (Tom Barnes)
18. 05:31 PM - Re: teflon hose (Dan Checkoway)
19. 05:36 PM - Re: teflon hose (Hal Kempthorne)
20. 08:19 PM - Re: Dan's New NTSB program (Gordon or Marge Comfort)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie Q: Fluting seat ribs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Andrew Douglas <adouglas@optonline.net>
Thanks for the prompt replies, guys.
Dan;
> I think you are referring to the cutouts for installing the control
>
> sticks, aren't you? You have to fasten the ribs back together again at the
> top, so you could do that now.
No, I'm talking about the notch in the upper edge of the rib where the angle
changes.
Onward and upward....
-----------------------------------------------------
Andrew Douglas
Do not archive
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Alternator temperature monitor was Apples to |
--> RV-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
Would you mind to give us a reference for purchasing such as a product, name
or part number? Thanks
Indiana Larry, RV7 TipUp "SunSeeker"
----- Original Message -----
Subject: RV-List: Re: Alternator temperature monitor was Apples to
> --> RV-List message posted by: <gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Just a though, some builders may consider temperature sensitive indicating
labels. Although, not as nice as thermo-couple/cockpit monitoring for
detailed info, it could also be useful.
>
> Indicating labels, temp sensitive tape is available many temp ranges and
could be placed in several locations to keep track of temps for flight test.
Placing them in several locations you could monitor temps under the cowl of
accessories like the alternator and any other item you want.You could check
to see how hot you Carb heat is, cowl, oil cooler or Battery.
Message 3
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| Subject: | ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
I am having a helluva time finding a good installation location for this
thing. Initially I planned on putting it to the bottom of the fwd
baggage floor right above the rudder pedals. That was until I saw this
monster data cable that plugs in to stick down a couple of inches right
into the pedals.
So who of you put it where on the 8?
Mike
S8
Bench flew the GRT/MX20/430, 330 and ACS last night in the dard. KWEL
KWEL KWEL stuff.
Do not archive
Message 4
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| Subject: | ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
Ok Im replying to myself.
I spoke with ACS this morning(they read the list) and they are gonna
swap out this monster cable for a ribbon cable that will sit flat and
head away from the heat sink.
This is a perfect solution and it means that the analog module can
really be low profile and install in a much smaller space.
I told em to forget that monster cable on any installation and go
ribbon. The weight alone scared me.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stewart,
Michael (ISS Atlanta)
Subject: RV-List: ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
<mstewart@iss.net>
I am having a helluva time finding a good installation location for this
thing. Initially I planned on putting it to the bottom of the fwd
baggage floor right above the rudder pedals. That was until I saw this
monster data cable that plugs in to stick down a couple of inches right
into the pedals.
So who of you put it where on the 8?
Mike
S8
Bench flew the GRT/MX20/430, 330 and ACS last night in the dark. KWEL
KWEL KWEL stuff.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Riveting LE To Spar |
--> RV-List message posted by: HCRV6@aol.com
Jamie: I switched from a 2X to a 3X rivet gun at about the same stage in
building that you are at and never looked back. The 3X for me was far easier to
control and sets -4 rivets much faster. Just turn the pressure down for the
-3 rivets!
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, flying, 20+ hours
Message 6
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"Rocket List" <rocket-list@matronics.com>,
"RV List" <rv-list@matronics.com>
| Subject: | Dan's New NTSB program |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Dan,
Way to go. Another super tool for RVer to use.
I used it to check on the RV accident. If you remember, I camped beside an RV-4
which crashed on the way home from OSH this year. Anyway, the plane was out
of gas, even though, he stopped and got gas. Below is a part of the NTSB report:
Fuel receipts were obtained from locations along the pilot's route of flight. Based
on these receipts, it was calculated that the newly installed engine burned
approximately 11.5 gallons of fuel per hour. The total fuel capacity of this
airplane was 32 gallons, of which, 26.7 gallons were usable. The pilot purchased
24.6 gallons of fuel in Iola, Kansas, at 1343.
WHERE DID THE NTSB GET THE USABLE FUEL OF 26.7 GALLONS? I seems to me that a half
a gallon per tank is trapped is much closer or maybe 31 gallons usable. What
say you RV-4 drivers?
Is this just a typo or does someone need to question the NTSB as to where they
got their numbers?
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Harmon Rocket-II
do not archive
http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
Message 7
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--> RV-List message posted by: <erichweaver@cox.net>
Howdy. Im a newby considering purchase of either a mostly completed kit or a low
time, flying RV-6 or 7. Will I save any money on sales tax by traveling out-of-state
to buy? Im in California if that makes any difference.
If I have to pay sales tax, when would it be assessed?
thanks
Erich Weaver
Message 8
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| Subject: | Dan's New NTSB program |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Kathleen (rv7)" <kathleen@rv7.us>
My experience with the NTSB indicates that it is well worth the effort to
write a letter challenging their assumptions. If they can't factually
support the assumption, they will have to drop it from the final report. If
you don't write a challenge, they will leave it in and it will become part
of the findings and support for probable cause. I my own case, their
initial report indicated that the airplane was overloaded when it was really
more than 100 pounds under gross. The overloaded airplane was going to be
the probable cause. The truth is that it was an engine failure on takeoff
resulting from a mechanical failure caused the crash.
Let them know you disagree and do it in writing. They don't have the
resolve to engage someone who really stands up to them.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Gummo
Subject: RV-List: Dan's New NTSB program
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Dan,
Way to go. Another super tool for RVer to use.
I used it to check on the RV accident. If you remember, I camped beside an
RV-4 which crashed on the way home from OSH this year. Anyway, the plane
was out of gas, even though, he stopped and got gas. Below is a part of the
NTSB report:
Fuel receipts were obtained from locations along the pilot's route of
flight. Based on these receipts, it was calculated that the newly installed
engine burned approximately 11.5 gallons of fuel per hour. The total fuel
capacity of this airplane was 32 gallons, of which, 26.7 gallons were
usable. The pilot purchased 24.6 gallons of fuel in Iola, Kansas, at 1343.
WHERE DID THE NTSB GET THE USABLE FUEL OF 26.7 GALLONS? I seems to me that
a half a gallon per tank is trapped is much closer or maybe 31 gallons
usable. What say you RV-4 drivers?
Is this just a typo or does someone need to question the NTSB as to where
they got their numbers?
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Harmon Rocket-II
do not archive
http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
Message 9
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Erich,
We had a guy buy a plane lately and he claimed that if he keep it out of
state for three months, he wouldn't have to pay sales tax.
I am not a CPA nor a H&R block type of guy so take this for what it is
worth. :-)
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Harmon Rocket-II
do not archive
http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
----- Original Message -----
From: <erichweaver@cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: sales tax
> --> RV-List message posted by: <erichweaver@cox.net>
>
> Howdy. Im a newby considering purchase of either a mostly completed kit
> or a low time, flying RV-6 or 7. Will I save any money on sales tax by
> traveling out-of-state to buy? Im in California if that makes any
> difference.
>
> If I have to pay sales tax, when would it be assessed?
>
> thanks
>
> Erich Weaver
>
>
>
Message 10
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--> RV-List message posted by: <erichweaver@cox.net>
As often happens, I found the answers to my own questions shortly after asking
them. Looks like the tax man is gonna get me one way or another.
In case anyone else is interested, this web site seems to cover just about everything
on the sales tax/use tax issue for california:
http://www.boe.ca.gov/sutax/faqtrans.htm.
A quick check of Google indicates other similar sites are available for other states.
regards,
Erich
Message 11
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--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
erichweaver@cox.net wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: <erichweaver@cox.net>
>
>Howdy. Im a newby considering purchase of either a mostly completed kit or a
low time, flying RV-6 or 7. Will I save any money on sales tax by traveling out-of-state
to buy? Im in California if that makes any difference.
>
I'm going to say ..... maybe not. What you should do is check the
difference in sales tax where you are (CA) and where the airplane is
sold. If it's cheaper where it's sold, have the seller collect the tax,
and show that on the paperwork.
>If I have to pay sales tax, when would it be assessed?
>
Most states cull the airplane sale from the change in registry of the
FAA. Let's say that you buy the airplane in Oregon, and don't pay sales
tax. When you register the airplane in your name in CA, the CA Dept. of
Revenue picks up on that and sends you a tax bill complete with
penalties. A lot of aircraft sales transactions are 'fudged' a bit,
though, and that can save you some sales tax hit. For me (FL), when I
register my newly built aircraft, the FL dept of revenue will want to
see invoices of how much I paid for the parts. They know roughly what a
flying plane is worth .... from many sources. If they think it's worth
more than what you paid for the parts, then you'll be required to show
the invoices to get the value lowered. Some folks are really surprised
when they start their project and reserve an N#, only to get a tax bill
before it's built .... and just after spending all their hard earned
cash for the kit is the wrong time to get that bill.
Now, there are ways to get the 'reported' sales price down. I've heard
that you can buy the whole kit for say 10K, and a GPS for 25K ..... the
seller gets his 35K asking price and you document the 10K purchase
price. Legal? I'm not sure, nor do I advise you to do that. I'm just
passing on what I've heard.
Linn
do not archive
>
>thanks
>
>Erich Weaver
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Beene" <kbeene@citilink.com>
The flat ribbon cable is smaller but it is probably not shielded and can
generate a lot of RFI. I know of one person with an early ACS that
generated a lot of noise with the round cable.
Ken
>
> Ok Im replying to myself.
> I spoke with ACS this morning(they read the list) and they are gonna
> swap out this monster cable for a ribbon cable that will sit flat and
> head away from the heat sink.
>
> This is a perfect solution and it means that the analog module can
> really be low profile and install in a much smaller space.
>
> I told em to forget that monster cable on any installation and go
> ribbon. The weight alone scared me.
>
> Mike
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: ACS 2002 analog module installation RV-8 |
--> RV-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
What? FACT: The ribbon cable is flat; On the other hand, the heavy, long,
and other cable is round.
I assume you mean this: Whichever cable you use it will be unshielded and
cause lots of problems with RFI.
Indiana Larry, RV7 TipUp "SunSeeker" do not archive
----- Original Message -----
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Beene" <kbeene@citilink.com>
>
> The flat ribbon cable is smaller but it is probably not shielded and can
> generate a lot of RFI. I know of one person with an early ACS that
> generated a lot of noise with the round cable.
>
> Ken
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Dan's New NTSB program |
--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Vanartsdalen <svanarts@yahoo.com>
Over 5 gallons unusable? Excuse me? I'd like to know where they got those numbers
too.
Do not archive.
Tom Gummo <T.gummo@verizon.net> wrote:
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo"
Dan,
Way to go. Another super tool for RVer to use.
I used it to check on the RV accident. If you remember, I camped beside an RV-4
which crashed on the way home from OSH this year. Anyway, the plane was out of
gas, even though, he stopped and got gas. Below is a part of the NTSB report:
Fuel receipts were obtained from locations along the pilot's route of flight. Based
on these receipts, it was calculated that the newly installed engine burned
approximately 11.5 gallons of fuel per hour. The total fuel capacity of this
airplane was 32 gallons, of which, 26.7 gallons were usable. The pilot purchased
24.6 gallons of fuel in Iola, Kansas, at 1343.
WHERE DID THE NTSB GET THE USABLE FUEL OF 26.7 GALLONS? I seems to me that a half
a gallon per tank is trapped is much closer or maybe 31 gallons usable. What
say you RV-4 drivers?
Is this just a typo or does someone need to question the NTSB as to where they
got their numbers?
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Harmon Rocket-II
do not archive
http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
--
Scott VanArtsdalen
RV-4 N311SV, FLYING!!
When a man does all he can
though it succeeds not well,
blame not him that did it."
-- George Washington
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Dan's New NTSB program |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Derrick Aubuchon" <n184da@volcano.net>
I agree, 26.7 seems a tad low for the usable fuel.
In my RV4, I have less than a cup of unusable per tank. Just to make the
calculations easier, and conservative, I figure 1/4 gallon of unusable
which brings my usable quantity to 31.5. (But my "personal fuel reserves"
kick in much earlier than that!)
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
>
> Dan,
>
> Way to go. Another super tool for RVer to use.
>
> I used it to check on the RV accident. If you remember, I camped beside
> an RV-4 which crashed on the way home from OSH this year. Anyway, the
> plane was out of gas, even though, he stopped and got gas. Below is a
> part of the NTSB report:
>
> Fuel receipts were obtained from locations along the pilot's route of
> flight. Based on these receipts, it was calculated that the newly
> installed engine burned approximately 11.5 gallons of fuel per hour. The
> total fuel capacity of this airplane was 32 gallons, of which, 26.7
> gallons were usable. The pilot purchased 24.6 gallons of fuel in Iola,
> Kansas, at 1343.
>
> WHERE DID THE NTSB GET THE USABLE FUEL OF 26.7 GALLONS? I seems to me
> that a half a gallon per tank is trapped is much closer or maybe 31
> gallons usable. What say you RV-4 drivers?
>
> Is this just a typo or does someone need to question the NTSB as to
> where they got their numbers?
>
> Tom Gummo
> Apple Valley, CA
> Harmon Rocket-II
>
> do not archive
>
> http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
>
Derrick L. Aubuchon
n184da@volcano.net
RV4 N184DA, 400hrs
Message 16
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--> RV-List message posted by: sarg314 <sarg314@comcast.net>
I like the idea of using teflon braided steel hose for my oil and fuel
lines. An RV-6A builder I know used Earl's Performance Products
speed-flex hoses. Looks like pretty good stuff and the fittings and
hose are cheaper than the Aeroquip Teflon hoses that Aircraft Spruce
carries.
My problem is the local retail speed shops don't seem to carry Earl's
in a -6 size and a few of the big mail order outfits I contacted rae
back ordered.
Can any one suggest a source for this product, or perhaps suggest
different brand of teflon hose that's good but easier to get?
Thanks,
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A, firewall
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Dan's New NTSB program |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Barnes" <skytop@megsinet.net>
Maybe they consider TAKE-OFF quantity in part of their equasion.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Vanartsdalen" <svanarts@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Dan's New NTSB program
> --> RV-List message posted by: Scott Vanartsdalen <svanarts@yahoo.com>
>
> Over 5 gallons unusable? Excuse me? I'd like to know where they got
those numbers too.
>
> Do not archive.
>
> Tom Gummo <T.gummo@verizon.net> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo"
>
> Dan,
>
> Way to go. Another super tool for RVer to use.
>
> I used it to check on the RV accident. If you remember, I camped beside an
RV-4 which crashed on the way home from OSH this year. Anyway, the plane was
out of gas, even though, he stopped and got gas. Below is a part of the NTSB
report:
>
> Fuel receipts were obtained from locations along the pilot's route of
flight. Based on these receipts, it was calculated that the newly installed
engine burned approximately 11.5 gallons of fuel per hour. The total fuel
capacity of this airplane was 32 gallons, of which, 26.7 gallons were
usable. The pilot purchased 24.6 gallons of fuel in Iola, Kansas, at 1343.
>
> WHERE DID THE NTSB GET THE USABLE FUEL OF 26.7 GALLONS? I seems to me that
a half a gallon per tank is trapped is much closer or maybe 31 gallons
usable. What say you RV-4 drivers?
>
> Is this just a typo or does someone need to question the NTSB as to where
they got their numbers?
>
> Tom Gummo
> Apple Valley, CA
> Harmon Rocket-II
>
> do not archive
>
> http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
>
>
> --
> Scott VanArtsdalen
> RV-4 N311SV, FLYING!!
>
> When a man does all he can
> though it succeeds not well,
> blame not him that did it."
> -- George Washington
>
>
Message 18
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
http://www.aircrafthose.com/ Precision Hose Technology
Give 'em a call. Best prices, knowledgeable, FAA approved, comes with
documentation, yadda yadda. ;-)
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "sarg314" <sarg314@comcast.net>
Subject: RV-List: teflon hose
> --> RV-List message posted by: sarg314 <sarg314@comcast.net>
>
> I like the idea of using teflon braided steel hose for my oil and fuel
> lines. An RV-6A builder I know used Earl's Performance Products
> speed-flex hoses. Looks like pretty good stuff and the fittings and
> hose are cheaper than the Aeroquip Teflon hoses that Aircraft Spruce
> carries.
>
> My problem is the local retail speed shops don't seem to carry Earl's
> in a -6 size and a few of the big mail order outfits I contacted rae
> back ordered.
>
> Can any one suggest a source for this product, or perhaps suggest
> different brand of teflon hose that's good but easier to get?
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, firewall
>
>
Message 19
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--> RV-List message posted by: Hal Kempthorne <hal_kempthorne@sbcglobal.net>
They can afford to sell them cheap when they are out of stock.
Seriously, it is often true that lower priced sellers offer poorer service. Not
always but very often.
hal
sarg314 <sarg314@comcast.net> wrote:
My problem is the local retail speed shops don't seem to carry Earl's
in a -6 size and a few of the big mail order outfits I contacted rae
back ordered.
Message 20
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| Subject: | Dan's New NTSB program |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Gordon or Marge Comfort" <gcomfo@tc3net.com>
Subject: RV-List: Dan's New NTSB program
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo@verizon.net>
Dan,
Fuel receipts were obtained from locations along the pilot's route of
flight. Based on these receipts, it was calculated that the newly
installed engine burned approximately 11.5 gallons of fuel per hour. The
total fuel capacity of this airplane was 32 gallons, of which, 26.7
gallons were usable. The pilot purchased 24.6 gallons of fuel in Iola,
Kansas, at 1343.
WHERE DID THE NTSB GET THE USABLE FUEL OF 26.7 GALLONS? I seems to me
that a half a gallon per tank is trapped is much closer or maybe 31
gallons usable. What say you RV-4 drivers?
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Harmon Rocket-II
Tom: I know of one RV-4 that will draw more than 31 gallons and keep
running. They must have dreamed it up. I would question their fuel
consumption too, although I suppose 11.5 gph is possible. I once did a
cross country in a Cessna 150 that should have burned something over 5
gph but instead burned over 7. The guy I rented it from said "probably
had a warped venturi". Thanks a lot, but I did learn not to trust book
figures until I had checked for myself.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
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