Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:35 AM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! (Allen Fulmer)
2. 05:30 AM - Re: Re: Sources for electrical system design (LarryRobertHelming)
3. 05:45 AM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
4. 06:13 AM - Re: Noisy Airplanes (was Rude RV'ers) (James E. Clark)
5. 06:28 AM - Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern (James E. Clark)
6. 06:45 AM - New pitot/ static offerings (Evan and Megan Johnson)
7. 06:54 AM - Mason City 3rd annual RV Formation Clinic (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
8. 07:30 AM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! (Tim Olson)
9. 07:41 AM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! (David E. Nelson)
10. 07:58 AM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! 15, 2004) at 05/11/2005 09:39:05 A... (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
11. 08:33 AM - Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern (Doug Rozendaal)
12. 09:29 AM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! (Peter Mather)
13. 09:32 AM - Noisy Airplanes and Altitude (Chris W)
14. 09:35 AM - Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern (Hull, Don)
15. 10:29 AM - Joy Riding in the Pattern ()
16. 10:49 AM - PC680hd (Battery hold down) (George Inman)
17. 10:57 AM - Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
18. 10:58 AM - Re: Re: Sources for electrical system design (Paul Folbrecht)
19. 11:05 AM - Lycoming O-360 A1A for Sale ()
20. 12:09 PM - Re: Mufflers on Rv's (Bob Hodgson)
21. 12:29 PM - Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern (Tedd McHenry)
22. 01:09 PM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! 15, 2004) at 05/11/2005 (David E. Nelson)
23. 02:31 PM - plane flew into restricted airspace (son hoang)
24. 03:32 PM - Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern (Ron Lee)
25. 03:40 PM - Heavy Wing (Darrell Reiley)
26. 04:01 PM - Re: New pitot/ static offerings (Tim Olson)
27. 04:24 PM - Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
28. 05:22 PM - Re: Rude RVers (rv6n6r@comcast.net)
29. 05:37 PM - Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern (Tedd McHenry)
30. 06:16 PM - Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI (Bill Schlatterer)
31. 06:40 PM - Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to (Ron Lee)
32. 06:51 PM - Re: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI (Tim Bryan)
33. 07:12 PM - Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
34. 07:25 PM - Re: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI (Paul Folbrecht)
35. 07:51 PM - Re: [RV7Yahoo] Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI (Darwin N. Barrie)
36. 07:58 PM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! (Albert Gardner)
37. 08:09 PM - Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? (RV6 Flyer)
38. 08:47 PM - Re: New pitot/ static offerings (Jeff Dowling)
39. 09:02 PM - Re: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI (Richard E. Tasker)
40. 09:05 PM - Re: Just trashing my first flap!! (Richard E. Tasker)
41. 09:06 PM - Re: Noisy Airplanes and Altitude (Finn Lassen)
42. 09:42 PM - Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? (Konrad L. Werner)
43. 10:11 PM - Mufflers for RVs (Was Re: Noisy Airplanes) (Mark Schrimmer)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Just trashing my first flap!! |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
Swivel flush set was in use. I DID try a little boost in air pressure as it
"seemed" I was having to rat-a-tat-tat too long on the bottom side. And I
WAS getting some "bounce" on the bottom side, but reasoned it was acceptable
since it was the bottom. I don't have a pressure gage on the gun but one of
those little regulators with a numbered knob you can adjust. Setting has
stayed the same for wings and ailerons. By the time I reduced the
"regulator" on the gun back to where it had been the damage had been done
and I was too frustrated to be able to think straight anyway.
I still don't know how I will get my fat hand on a bucking bar over those
bottom rib/top skin rivets? And I think I will get my wife to help hold the
flap steady in the v-blocks.
I know others have probably had to work through similar disappointments and
I will too.
Thanks for the help.
Allen
DO NOT ARCHIVE
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of David Carter
Subject: Re: RV-List: Just trashing my first flap!!
--> RV-List message posted by: "David Carter" <dcarter@datarecall.net>
Are you using a "swivel flush rivet set"? And what air pressure are you
using? Should be down around 35psi? (been along time, but definitely not up
at 60 or 80 psi). Straight, unswiveled rivet sets ought to be banned from
RV shops.
David
----- Original Message -----
From: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
Subject: RV-List: Just trashing my first flap!!
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
>
> I haven't had this much trouble since I took 3 attempts to get a good trim
> tab!!
>
> Wing top skins went beautiful, leading edges, ailerons, but I have trashed
> my first flap! Bad thing is I don't know what to do different?? The 3x
> rivet gun is bouncing all around making smileys galore! I can't really
get
> my hand down inside to get a good hold on the bucking bar! First 3 rivets
> on an inside rib and 2 are sticking out halfway and the other has a big
> smiley looking at me! And things seemed to be going so good and I was so
> proud of my work! Maybe that was the problem?
>
> Time to go to bed I guess. Maybe I can learn what I am doing on this
> trashed flap and if the other one turns out good I can just order another
> set of parts.
>
> Frustrating! Can't quit! Got to go on! Tomorrow will be a better day!
>
> Allen Fulmer
> RV7 Wings, QB Fuse on hand
> N707AF reserved
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Sources for electrical system design |
--> RV-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
----- Original Message -----
> Turns out, that removing the alt field voltage won't shut down an
> internally regulated alternator, and disconnecting >from the battery can
> cause a load dump. Haven't yet flown the plane, but it looks like I'm
> taking out the O.V. (over voltage) setup.
((((((((()))))))))
Good point. IR (internally regulated) alternators are so plentiful and
reasonably priced. Everyone can easily accept the thought of having a
problem in podunk, podunk where there is an Autozone close that has a
freshly overhauled alternator replacement. No hold over, reasonable prices.
BUT there is a problem, we might also like the idea of OV protection, LV
warning, and perhaps the ability to adjust the voltage up or down a tenth or
two. That is where the IR alt does not work. SO,,,,,,decide whether you
can live with IR and its risks --or-- NR (non regulated) with OV/LV
regulator. Vans sells a NR alternator but you can't be running your
electric copier while flying =:-)
Bob of Aeroelectric advocates the NR alternator. Whichever way you go with,
you have some risks, which you should understand, and their costs. Yearly
out of pocket cost appears to be lower by not using a fresh battery every
year as Bob advocates. However the risk is lowered with Bob's admonition.
Risk vs. cost. You understand them and make and fly your decision within
the design and needs of your flying. I found that I revised some of my
flying goals to make the components in my electrical system more acceptable
risk-cost wise. I recommend, if you haven't already done so, to get a copy
of Aeroelectric Bob's manual and read it at least twice. A few nights well
spent. No, I am not on Bob's payroll, I am just happen my RV7 is flying
using one of his wiring designs and appears to not have any electrical
problems. And I more fully understand what
Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip Up FLYING - Phase 1 Flight Testing
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Just trashing my first flap!! |
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 5/11/05 6:37:28 AM Central Daylight Time,
afulmer@charter.net writes:
> I still don't know how I will get my fat hand on a bucking bar over those
> bottom rib/top skin rivets? And I think I will get my wife to help hold the
> flap steady in the v-blocks.
>>>
I had good luck using a modified splitting wedge for a bucking bar- seems it
came in real handy on the flap ribs and also for all the rear control surface
rivets. There's enough mass in it to help control it when banging on the
skinny end.
Mark Phillips
Message 4
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| Subject: | Noisy Airplanes (was Rude RV'ers) |
--> RV-List message posted by: "James E. Clark" <james@nextupventures.com>
Are you sure that what you are referencing is not the "cabin heat muff" or
"carb heat muff"?
The widely used Vetterman cross-over exhausts that I suspect most of us use
is non-mufflered as far as I know.
James
| -----Original Message-----
| From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
| server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Folbrecht
| Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 4:17 PM
| To: rv-list@matronics.com
| Subject: Re: RV-List: Noisy Airplanes (was Rude RV'ers)
|
| --> RV-List message posted by: Paul Folbrecht <paulfolbrecht@yahoo.com>
|
| I'm still a tad confused on this. Van's FWF kits include what they call
| a
| "muffler". What I think you're saying is that this "muffler" is so
| ineffective
| that it barely qualifies as one. Correct? If not, you're saying that
| most
| RVers do not use Van's FWF kits with their Lycs or do not use the Van's
| exhaust
| stack.
|
| > Most RV's have no mufflers at all... not a Van's norm...
| >
|
|
|
|
|
Message 5
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| Subject: | Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: "James E. Clark" <james@nextupventures.com>
Thanks Mike for posting this. I was about to look up the pages and diagrams
to post with my notes below.
For those who might not have experienced this from inside a plane, it is not
only legal but is understood at the "big airports with picky controllers
that will remind you if you are doing anything wrong :-) ". If you ask
properly they will not only oblige, they will vector you into position
(mindful of other traffic) and sometimes call the point for lead to make the
first turn.
Of course at some (non-towered) airports when it is first introduced, there
may be people in the pattern that are wondering what is going on (they
might not be familiar with the AIM reference below), but a courteous (and
quick) explanation works wonders. This I have experienced.
Finally, upon returning to the home base airport in IFR conditions (riding
with the FBO owner, Aeronautics Commission member, bazillion hour pilot)
this maneuver was performed after we broken out in the clear on the
localizer approach. He pointed out to me how it was a MUCH safer approach as
even though the ceilings were a bit low, it was still LEGAL for VFR traffic
to be in the pattern.
James
| -----Original Message-----
| From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
| server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)
| Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 5:18 PM
| To: rv-list@matronics.com
| Subject: RE: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
|
| --> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
| <mstewart@iss.net>
|
| OK here we go again on the overheads.
| They are very standard and are defined in the AIM chapter 5. Quote
| below. Searchable here:
| http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/AIM/Chap5/aim0504.html
|
{SNIP}
Message 6
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|
| Subject: | New pitot/ static offerings |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg@snowcrest.net>
A few months ago there was a thread about the poor choices available for pitot tubes and static port kits. We have just received our first batch of CNC machined pitot tubes and they look beautiful! Please have a look http://www.evansaviationproducts.com/Other%20Products.htm
The pitot kit comes complete with the mast and all of the hardware you need for
a super clean installation. I believe this is the only kit available right now
as a complete package....most others require you to go searching for the components
from different sources. You will find a significant cost savings with
the kit as well as really nice hardware. We are currently prototyping a heated
version, but it is still a bit down the road.
Cheers,
Evan Johnson
www.evansaviationproducts.com
(530)247-0375
(530)351-1776 cell
Message 7
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|
| Subject: | Mason City 3rd annual RV Formation Clinic |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
Its that time of year for the Mason City Iowa 3 day formation clinic.
Its held the weekend before Oshkosh so you can gear up and head in for
the show. This is one of several clinics held around the country. The
training program is provided by Team RV with support from other talented
folks to include the SoCal group, Falcon Flight, Buckeye flight and
others. These RV'ers have lots of formation experience and freely give
of their time and money to provide this training free of charge.
Obviously they are not in it for the money, but the love of the game.
You will not receive a better training in your RV than what these teams
provide. The training is intense and carefully checked by experienced
pilots and instructors. Im sure participants from past years will chime
in and provide you some feedback on the value and activities. Its more
fun than should be allowed. Great planes, great flying, and as
always..... great people.
Details can be found at the website below. Doug Rozendaal is our host.
You all should know him from his excellent posts on the RV-list. Last
year our training culminated in a 13 ship on a P-51D Mustang, Mustang
flown by Doug. Fun had by all.
http://www.mstewart.net/teamrv/formationclinic/masoncity05
Hope to see you there.
Kahuna
Aka Mike Stewart
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Just trashing my first flap!! |
--> RV-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Can you post a photo to make it easier to see where you're talking
about?
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #170
Current project: Fuselage
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Allen Fulmer wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
>
> I haven't had this much trouble since I took 3 attempts to get a good trim
> tab!!
>
> Wing top skins went beautiful, leading edges, ailerons, but I have trashed
> my first flap! Bad thing is I don't know what to do different?? The 3x
> rivet gun is bouncing all around making smileys galore! I can't really get
> my hand down inside to get a good hold on the bucking bar! First 3 rivets
> on an inside rib and 2 are sticking out halfway and the other has a big
> smiley looking at me! And things seemed to be going so good and I was so
> proud of my work! Maybe that was the problem?
>
> Time to go to bed I guess. Maybe I can learn what I am doing on this
> trashed flap and if the other one turns out good I can just order another
> set of parts.
>
> Frustrating! Can't quit! Got to go on! Tomorrow will be a better day!
>
> Allen Fulmer
> RV7 Wings, QB Fuse on hand
> N707AF reserved
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Just trashing my first flap!! |
15, 2004) at 05/11/2005 09:39:05 AM,
Serialize by Router on MailServ59-US/AUS/H/NIC(Release 6.5.3FP1|December
15, 2004) at
05/11/2005 09:39:07 AM,
Serialize complete at 05/11/2005 09:39:07 AM
--> RV-List message posted by: "David E. Nelson" <david.nelson@pobox.com>
Hi Mark,
As I'm getting to do this...
Are you talking about a wedge for splitting wood? And what type of
modifications? Got a picture?
Thanks,
/\/elson
RV-7A - Feveristly finishing the wings before the fus shows up
Austin, TX
On Wed, 11 May 2005 Fiveonepw@aol.com wrote:
> I had good luck using a modified splitting wedge for a bucking bar- seems it
> came in real handy on the flap ribs and also for all the rear control surface
> rivets. There's enough mass in it to help control it when banging on the
> skinny end.
>
> Mark Phillips
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Just trashing my first flap!! 15, 2004) at 05/11/2005 09:39:05 |
A...
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 5/11/05 9:43:42 AM Central Daylight Time,
david.nelson@pobox.com writes:
> Are you talking about a wedge for splitting wood? And what type of
> modifications? Got a picture?
>>>
Yep- maybe $10-12 down at the local hardware store, WallyWorld or Lowes
Depot. These come kind of rough- you'll need one good surface on both sides down
near the pointy end. As purchased, mine had too much radius along the side
near the point, so I ground it flatter (on the side) until I could get a fairly
square edge, then polished both sides and dulled the original cutting edge to
avoid scratching any metal it might contact. What you're shooting for is a
good bucking surface close to the very end of the wedge on both sides so you can
flip it over to get 'em from both directions. Sorry, but don't think I ever
took a foto of it...
And if it don't work, it still makes a nice doorstop, or you can even split
farwood with it!
Mark
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr@petroblend.com>
----- Original Message -----
From: "James E. Clark" <james@nextupventures.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
> --> RV-List message posted by: "James E. Clark" <james@nextupventures.com>
>
> Thanks Mike for posting this. I was about to look up the pages and
> diagrams
> to post with my notes below.
>
> For those who might not have experienced this from inside a plane, it is
> not
> only legal but is understood at the "big airports with picky controllers
> that will remind you if you are doing anything wrong :-) ". If you ask
> properly they will not only oblige, they will vector you into position
> (mindful of other traffic) and sometimes call the point for lead to make
> the
> first turn.
>
> Of course at some (non-towered) airports when it is first introduced,
> there
> may be people in the pattern that are wondering what is going on (they
> might not be familiar with the AIM reference below), but a courteous (and
> quick) explanation works wonders. This I have experienced.
>
> Finally, upon returning to the home base airport in IFR conditions (riding
> with the FBO owner, Aeronautics Commission member, bazillion hour pilot)
> this maneuver was performed after we broken out in the clear on the
> localizer approach. He pointed out to me how it was a MUCH safer approach
> as
> even though the ceilings were a bit low, it was still LEGAL for VFR
> traffic
> to be in the pattern.
>
> James
>
>
> {SNIP}
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Just trashing my first flap!! |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Peter Mather" <peter@mather.com>
Allen
What weight bar are you using? I've found that my riveting has been transformed
since I got an aerospace surplus 3lb bar off ebay. Previously I was having problems
when using some of the recommended lighter bars. This new one will buck
3/32" rivets without any pressure other than its own weight.
I've only got a cheap manual squeezer so am bucking nearly everything (including
all 1/8" rivets). As long as I can get the heavy bar in it is no problem. Also,
I don't subscribe to the swivel flush set argument. I use a 1.5" solid flush
set with a neoprene ring round the edge. I've had no problems with smilies
as the set is big enough to guarantee its aligned.
Best regards
Peter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Just trashing my first flap!!
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
>
> Swivel flush set was in use. I DID try a little boost in air pressure as it
> "seemed" I was having to rat-a-tat-tat too long on the bottom side. And I
> WAS getting some "bounce" on the bottom side, but reasoned it was acceptable
> since it was the bottom. I don't have a pressure gage on the gun but one of
> those little regulators with a numbered knob you can adjust. Setting has
> stayed the same for wings and ailerons. By the time I reduced the
> "regulator" on the gun back to where it had been the damage had been done
> and I was too frustrated to be able to think straight anyway.
>
> I still don't know how I will get my fat hand on a bucking bar over those
> bottom rib/top skin rivets? And I think I will get my wife to help hold the
> flap steady in the v-blocks.
>
> I know others have probably had to work through similar disappointments and
> I will too.
>
> Thanks for the help.
>
> Allen
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Noisy Airplanes and Altitude |
--> RV-List message posted by: Chris W <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm@cox.net>
I was just curious how high you would have to be for the sound level on
the ground to be low enough that it probably wouldn't be hard in
someones house. Maybe there is a formula of x DB drop per 1000 feet of
altitude. Does anyone know?
--
Chris W
Gift Giving Made Easy
Get the gifts you want &
give the gifts they want
http://thewishzone.com
Message 14
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| Subject: | Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Hull, Don" <Donald.C.Hull@nasa.gov>
Mike, so you are telling us that everytime you do an overhead break to a
landing you have been on an IFR flight plan? I seriously doubt it,
especially when you are in formation flight. According to the source you
quote, that is the only time it is allowed.
Don
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stewart, Michael
(ISS Atlanta)
Subject: RE: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
--> <mstewart@iss.net>
OK here we go again on the overheads.
They are very standard and are defined in the AIM chapter 5. Quote below.
Searchable here: http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/AIM/Chap5/aim0504.html
5-4-25. Overhead Approach Maneuver
a. Pilots operating in accordance with an IFR flight plan in Visual
Meteorological Conditions (VMC) may request ATC authorization for an
overhead maneuver. An overhead maneuver is not an instrument approach
procedure. Overhead maneuver patterns are developed at airports where
aircraft have an operational need to conduct the maneuver. An aircraft
conducting an overhead maneuver is considered to be VFR and the IFR flight
plan is cancelled when the aircraft reaches the initial point on the initial
approach portion of the maneuver. (See FIG 5-4-22.) The existence of a
standard overhead maneuver pattern does not eliminate the possible
requirement for an aircraft to conform to conventional rectangular patterns
if an overhead maneuver cannot be approved. Aircraft operating to an airport
without a functioning control tower must initiate cancellation of an IFR
flight plan prior to executing the overhead maneuver. Cancellation of the
IFR flight plan must be accomplished after crossing the landing threshold on
the initial portion of the maneuver or after landing. Controllers may
authorize an overhead maneuver and issue the following to arriving aircraft:
Enjoy,
Mike
Do not archive this again
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob
Subject: Re: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
--> RV-List message posted by: Bob <panamared3@brier.net>
> The 180 overhead landing is not standard. I do formation flying,
> takeoff, approach and landing, including 180 overheads, however you
have
> to be aware that you will startle other pilots and folks on the ground
> with mass arrivals and military patterns. Some bystanders love it, and
my
> RV buddies think everyone should love the show. They don't all love
it.
> May be it is jealousy, but just be sensitive to that. Also this could
be
> actionable by the FAA. Patterns are not specified by the FARs except
"all
> turns must be made to the left unless noted otherwise." However US
> Government Vs. Joe Pilot, in appeals court, has shown the AIM, which
is
> not regulations, does show a standard pattern and has been upheld as
> de-facto law. Meaning pilots not flying the pattern per the AIM can
get
> the FAA shaft.
Now for the other side of the story. Flying a standard pattern behind a
Piper Cub flying at 35 knots and doing a Bomber Pattern, (that is 5 miles
downwind, 2 miles crosswind and another 5 miles on final with a 5 minute
taxi on the runway before turn off on a taxiway) is sheer frustration for
even a Citabria Pilot.
My philosophy is if you are going to land, then land. Do not joy ride in
the pattern.
Bob
RV6 NightFighter
Message 15
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| Subject: | Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: <gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com>
Bob and Mike:
Bob, I agree 100%, and Mike, I agree a 180 OH can be done safely. Patterns do get
stretched out to ridiculous lengths, but are a function of number of planes
in pattern and student activity. I was a full time CFI (I) and MEI. I taught
my students to do short, normal approaches and to adapt to the eventual cross-country
down wind patterns of other pilots. It is a fact of flying, especially
at busy airports. We all need to consider all pilots and the airport community,
some of which might be student pilots or new RV pilots getting use to faster
speeds, giving themselves longer finals to sort it out.
>"OK here we go again on the overheads. They are very standard and are defined
in the AIM chapter 5.
Mike, you sound frustrated, but sorry your AIM reference is not relevant and can't
I agree with you. Your AIR reference for the 180 overhead is clearly for an
IFR pilot, a single airplane, ONE airplane to do a circling type maneuver during
a contact approach. If you are suggesting this is approval to do yank-and-bank
in a pattern, VFR, solo or with a formation flight of several planes, I
respectively disagree.
>Pilots operating in accordance with an IFR flight plan in Visual
>Meteorological Conditions (VMC) may request ATC authorization for an
>overhead maneuver.
FIRST: Again there is NO REG on patterns except make all turn to the left unless
noted otherwise, as I said. 360, 270, 180, 90 straight-in is not prohibited,
but..... If something happens it is your responsibility to operate in a safe
manner. Also, to avoid doing aerobatics in the pattern by definition (far 91.307),
bank angles must be limited to 60 degree bank. Many RV 180 breaks are done
at high initial speeds and large (up to 90 degree) initial bank angles. There
is nothing making this cool to the FAA. Again some think it looks great but
it tends to get people excited in a bad way when they see a 90 degree bank in
the pattern.
SECOND: The purpose of this AIM par. 5-4-25, "overhead approach", involves canceling
an IFR flight plan if you see the runway for a "contact approach", saving
you from flying outbound to do the full instrument procedure or vectors to
the full approach. You can fly any pattern you want once approved, published circling
approach, straight in, entry on the base or 180 overhead. I never said
the 180 overheads are not a recognized maneuver, cannot be done safely or do
not have a use. Read your ref. The words, IFR flight plan an ATC APPROVAL. When
I was a freight pilot, breaking off my IFR clearance and diving thru a visual
opening to the end of the runway to abbreviate a full approach was always
an option if the airport was clear. If it were marginal, I would do the whole
approach. Flying for a big airline, it is not an option as company policy does
not allow contact or circling approaches. In a court of law, if you pull this
out to justify your gaggle of 6 RV's doing a for
mation
180 overhead landing, which might have almost caused an accident, par 5-4-25 will
mean nothing. Again the AIM is not regulatory, but the standard rectangle
pattern, 45, base, final, landing is a de-facto requirement, shown over and over
in court. Do what you want in your own judgment, but don't expect par 5-4-25
to save your legal tail.
If it is a towered airport they can approve your Flight of 6 RVs and 180 Break.
Than you are golden. At a non-towered airport and a formation of RVs cuts someone
off flying downwind/base/final, that is rude and possibly dangerous. If you
are in radio contact with other traffic they often will give way, and tell
you go for it. The point is a 180 overhead approach is an option, not a right.
My point is as a group we cant seem arrogant about flying the pattern we want.
We DO NOT have extra privilege or rights to fly formation around an airport
(unless tower gives it to you). Regardless what AIM you quote that angry Cessna
driver on the ramp, your formation of RVs just cut off, he is not going to care
and the FAA might. If anyone is in the pattern before you, they have the right
to fly a full pattern, and you have an obligation to follow them if they
where there first, even if it means an extended downwind at 80 mph.
When I am flying the jet at work and the plane in front of me decides to slow way
down, 10 miles from the outer marker, for no reason, after ATC told them to
keep their speed up, aggravates me, but what are you going to do, pass them on
the left?
There is plenty case law and rulings against pilots not flying basic rectangular
pattern. My only point is safety. The FEDs can use the reckless operation card
at anytime. It is rare, but I have seen a few formation groups get a little
arrogant attitude, they dont know how to fly and this is how we did it in the
Air Force. They felt they have some kind of extra privilege or right away because
they are in formation. Keep in mind I love flying formation and the above
attitude was only observed once in 15 years of flying RVs. Unless the you are
a blimp or a glider you never have the right away over another powered plane,
unless you where there first. Regardless of the FAA, FARs or AIM, other pilots
may not like your formation flight in the traffic pattern.
Regards George
Time: 02:18:14 PM PST US
Subject: RE: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
From: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
<mstewart@iss.net>
OK here we go again on the overheads.
They are very standard and are defined in the AIM chapter 5. Quote
below. Searchable here:
http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/AIM/Chap5/aim0504.html
5-4-25. Overhead Approach Maneuver
a. Pilots operating in accordance with an IFR flight plan in Visual
Meteorological Conditions (VMC) may request ATC authorization for an
overhead maneuver. An overhead maneuver is not an instrument approach
procedure. Overhead maneuver patterns are developed at airports where
aircraft have an operational need to conduct the maneuver. An aircraft
conducting an overhead maneuver is considered to be VFR and the IFR
flight plan is canceled when the aircraft reaches the initial point on
the initial approach portion of the maneuver. (See FIG 5-4-22.) The
existence of a standard overhead maneuver pattern does not eliminate
the possible requirement for an aircraft to conform to conventional
rectangular patterns if an overhead maneuver cannot be approved.
Aircraft operating to an airport without a functioning control tower
must initiate cancellation of an IFR flight plan prior to executing the
overhead maneuver. Cancellation of the IFR flight plan must be
accomplished after crossing the landing threshold on the initial
portion of the maneuver or after landing. Controllers may authorize
an overhead maneuver and issue the following to arriving aircraft:
Enjoy,
Mike
Do not archive this again
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob
Subject: Re: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
--> RV-List message posted by: Bob <panamared3@brier.net>
> The 180 overhead landing is not standard. I do formation flying,
> takeoff, approach and landing, including 180 overheads, however you
> have to be aware that you will startle other pilots and folks on the
> ground with mass arrivals and military patterns. Some bystanders love it,
>and my RV buddies think everyone should love the show. They don't all love
>it. May be it is jealousy, but just be sensitive to that. Also this could
> be actionable by the FAA. Patterns are not specified by the FARs except
> "all turns must be made to the left unless noted otherwise." However US
> Government Vs. Joe Pilot, in appeals court, has shown the AIM, which
> is not regulations, does show a standard pattern and has been upheld as
> de-facto law. Meaning pilots not flying the pattern per the AIM can
> get the FAA shaft.
Now for the other side of the story. Flying a standard pattern behind
a Piper Cub flying at 35 knots and doing a Bomber Pattern, (that is 5
miles downwind, 2 miles crosswind and another 5 miles on final with a 5
minute
taxi on the runway before turn off on a taxiway) is sheer frustration
for even a Citabria Pilot.
My philosophy is if you are going to land, then land. Do not joy ride
in the pattern.
Bob
RV6 NightFighter
---------------------------------
Message 16
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| Subject: | PC680hd (Battery hold down) |
--> RV-List message posted by: "George Inman" <ghinman@mts.net>
I was going to use the PC680 hold down
to mount a PC680 battery in my RV-8.
I decided against it,because the battery
cannot be removed without removing the hold down.
There is a lip on the hold down,and then the engine
mount is in the way
Has anyone else used the hold down on
the firewall?
GEORGE H. INMAN
ghinman@mts.net
CELL 204 799 7062
HOME 204 287 8334
Message 17
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| Subject: | RE: Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
Points addressed below:
-----Original Message-----
From: gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com [mailto:gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com]
Subject: Joy Riding in the Pattern
<snip>
FIRST: Again there is NO REG on patterns except make all turn to the
left unless noted otherwise, as I said. 360, 270, 180, 90 straight-in is
not prohibited, but..... If something happens it is your responsibility
to operate in a safe manner.<snip
This is true regardless of any entry.
<snip>
Also, to avoid doing aerobatics in the pattern by definition (far
91.307), bank angles must be limited to 60 degree bank. Many RV 180
breaks are done at high initial speeds and large (up to 90 degree)
initial bank angles. There is nothing making this cool to the FAA. Again
some think it looks great but it tends to get people excited in a bad
way when they see a 90 degree bank in the pattern.
<snip> I did not recommend any aerobatic maneuvers or even suggest how
to execute the maneuver.
<snip>
In a court of law, if you pull this out to justify your gaggle of 6 RV's
doing a formation 180 overhead landing, which might have almost caused
an accident, par 5-4-25 will mean nothing. <snip> Everything means
nothing if done to almost cause an accident.
<snip>
Again the AIM is not regulatory<snip> Your right. But it can provide
guidance.
<snip>
. At a non-towered airport and a formation of RVs cuts someone off
flying downwind/base/final, that is rude and possibly dangerous. <snip>
True. Again regardless of what is being done.
<snip>. We DO NOT have extra privilege or rights to fly formation around
an airport (unless tower gives it to you). <snip> We have neither less
nor more.
<snip>
If anyone is in the pattern before you, they have the right to fly a
full pattern, and you have an obligation to follow the! m if they where
there first, even if it means an extended downwind at 80 mph.<snip>
True, again regardless of what maneuver is being preformed
<snip> but I have seen a few formation groups get a little arrogant
attitude, "they don't know how to fly and this is how we did it in the
Air Force." <snip> that's a different problem and has nothing to do with
whether or not it can be preformed legally
<snip>
Regardless of the FAA, FARs or AIM, other pilots may not like your
formation flight in the traffic pattern.<snip> Agreed and we have an
obligation to play friendly, talk nice, give way, advertise through
communication, and... perform the maneuver, whether they like the
formation in the pattern or not. There are a lot of things I don't like
in the pattern to include long down winds, but... I talk nice nice to em
anyway.
Best Regards,
Mike
Time: 02:18:14 PM PST US
Subject: RE: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
From: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net
<http://us.f300.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?Tomstewart@iss.net&YY32661&o
rderdown&sortdate&pos0> >
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
<mstewart@iss.net
<http://us.f300.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?Tomstewart@iss.net&YY32661&o
rderdown&sortdate&pos0> >
OK here we go again on the overheads.
They are very standard and are defined in the AIM chapter 5. Quote
below. Searchable here:
http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/AIM/Chap5/aim0504.html
<http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/AIM/Chap5/aim0504.html>
5-4-25. Overhead Approach Maneuver
a. Pilots operating in accordance with an IFR flight plan in Visual
Meteorologi! cal Conditions (VMC) may request ATC authorization for an
overhead maneuver. An overhead maneuver is not an instrument approach
procedure. Overhead maneuver patterns are developed at airports where
aircraft have an operational need to conduct the maneuver. An aircraft
conducting an overhead maneuver is considered to be VFR and the IFR
flight plan is canceled when the aircraft reaches the initial point on
the initial approach portion of the maneuver. (See FIG 5-4-22.) The
existence of a standard overhead maneuver pattern does not eliminate
the possible requirement for an aircraft to conform to conventional
rectangular patterns if an overhead maneuver cannot be approved.
Aircraft operating to an airport without a functioning control tower
must initiate cancellation of an IFR flight plan prior to executing the
overhead maneuver. Cancellation of the IFR flight plan must be
accomplished after crossing the landing threshold on the initial
p! ortion of the maneuver or after landing. Controllers may authorize
an overhead maneuver and issue the following to arriving aircraft:
Enjoy,
Mike
Do not archive this again
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
<http://us.f300.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?Toowner-rv-list-server@matron
ics.com&YY32661&orderdown&sortdate&pos0>
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
<http://us.f300.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?Toowner-rv-list-server@matron
ics.com&YY32661&orderdown&sortdate&pos0> ] On Behalf Of Bob
Subject: Re: RV-List: Joy Riding in the Pattern
--> RV-List message posted by: Bob <panamared3@brier.net
<http://us.f300.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?Topanamared3@brier.net&YY326
61&orderdown&sortdate&pos0> >
> The 180 overhead landing is not standard. I do formation flying, >
takeoff, approach and landing, including 180 overheads, however you
> have to be aware that you will startle other pilots and folks on the
> ground with mass arrivals and military patterns. Some bystanders love
it,
>and my RV buddies think everyone should love the show. They don't all
love
>it. May be it is jealousy, but just be sensitive to that. Also this
could
> be actionable by the FAA. Patterns are not specified by the FARs
except
> "all turns must be made to the left unless noted otherwise." However
US
> Government Vs. Joe Pilot, in appeals court, has shown the AIM, which
> is not regulations, does show a standard pattern and has been upheld
as
> de-facto law. Meaning pilots not flying the pattern per the AIM can
> get the FAA shaft.
Now for the other side of the story. Flying a standard pattern behind
a Piper Cub flying at 35 knots and doing a Bomber Pattern! , (that is 5
miles downwind, 2 miles crosswind and another 5 miles on final with a 5
minute
taxi on the runway before turn off on a taxiway) is sheer frustration
for even a Citabria Pilot.
My philosophy is if you are going to land, then land. Do not joy ride
in the pattern.
Bob
RV6 NightFighter
_____
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt31637/*http:/smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resourc
es/>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Sources for electrical system design |
--> RV-List message posted by: Paul Folbrecht <paulfolbrecht@yahoo.com>
I did some reading. I think I will go with the B&C alternator. I think I will
need the 60A too which is $600 - ouch!!
--- LARRY ADAMSON <rvhi03@msn.com> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "LARRY ADAMSON" <rvhi03@msn.com>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Paul Folbrecht
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Sources for electrical system design
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Paul Folbrecht paulfolbrecht@yahoo.com
>
>
> This alternator debate has been a tough one. I have a 60 internally regulated
> alt. from Van's. A few years ago, I installed the O.V, protection that opened
> the main cable from the alt. to battery. Turns out, that removing the alt
> field voltage won't shut down an internally regulated alternator, and
> disconnecting from the battery can cause a load dump. Haven't yet flown the
> plane, but it looks like I'm taking out the O.V. (over voltage) setup. There
> is a good discussion of this on the Matronics Aeroelectric list during the
> last month.
>
>
> Seriously? I thought all the hard decisions had been made. Damn!
>
> Is it that big a deal? I admit I'm not expert, but I've never had an
> alternator failure (Ok, in my measly 300 hours) or heard of one firsthand
> even
> on airplanes with very old alternators. Which I think are all externally
> regulated.. I guess it's another point to research.. and I guess there is
> probably a reason why a B&C alternator costs 2x what the one Mattituck
> supplies
> does.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Lycoming O-360 A1A for Sale |
--> RV-List message posted by: <tomvelvick@cox.net>
I have a Lycoming 0-360 A1A for sale. $8500 1700 TTSN 1000 since TOH. Has carburator
and starter, no other accessories. Set up for constant speed with a govenor
pad and line from govenor to prop. Wide Deck. This engine came out of a piper
navajo that had the O-360 conversion done. I bought both engines. One
for my rv-6a project and one for my wifes rv-4. She had decided that she wants
a new XP-360 instead so I am selling her engine. Buyer has to pay shipping and
crating costs or come and pick it up.
Contact Tom Velvick in Peoria, AZ at 623-261-2906 cell, 623-979-2519 home phone.
My email is tomvelvick@cox.net
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Mufflers on Rv's |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob Hodgson" <bob@hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk>
"Prop noise is loudest" - not necessarily, and it's very 'peaky' in line
with the plane of the prop. Keep helical tip speed below around 800 fps and
you avoid the annoying T6 blare. Not a problem on fixed pitch props unless
they're very fine, and on a CS prop that allows 2700 rpm on take-off, just
get back to 25/25 as soon as safely possible after take-off.
Exhaust noise remains the dominant factor for most of the time an aeroplane
is overflying, and as for mufflers, the Swiss type in Tony Bingelis' books
works well for damping out the high frequencies. However the Lycoming sound
spectrum shows highest powers under 800Hz. An expansion chamber muffler of
adequate volume (say over 270 cu in) should work better for these low
frequencies. Even treating the ends of the exhaust pipes as per the Wicks
'piccolo' takes some of the 'bite' out of the sound. Some German companies
have done successful work on certificated mufflers and will be happy to sell
you a couple (for enormous piles of euros!) They are much smaller / lighter
than the Swiss muffler in Tony's book. Have a Google for Gomolzig and Liese
for starters.
Our Popular Flying Association takes noise reduction seriously, and some
info can be found on their website:
http://www.pfa.org.uk/engineering_services/silencing_papers.asp
Performance loss may be less than feared using these new free-breathing
mufflers. If the length of pipe is tuned to say 2500rpm, it may not even
happen, according to some reports.
My RV is not yet flying, so I can't quote actual figures yet. I do however
intend to take before and after readings when playing around with mufflers.
You can still legally fly an 'experimental' without any muffler over here in
the UK, but for how long?? We've lost a lot of airfields to noise
complaints, so have to disarm the critics before they shut us down
completely.
Just my 2c /pence worth, YMMV etc
Bob
(RV3B - still starting 'finishing')
Message 21
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| Subject: | Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry <tedd@vansairforce.org>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Hull, Don" <Donald.C.Hull@nasa.gov>
>
> Mike, so you are telling us that everytime you do an overhead break to a
> landing you have been on an IFR flight plan? I seriously doubt it,
> especially when you are in formation flight. According to the source you
> quote, that is the only time it is allowed.
> Don
Don:
How do you get that interpretation? The source says, "Pilots operating in
accordance with an IFR flight plan in Visual Meteorological Conditions (VMC)
may request ATC authorization for an overhead maneuver." It says nothing
whatsoever about when an overhead may not be used.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC, Canada
Message 22
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|
09":39:05.A...@roxy.matronics.com
| Subject: | Re: Just trashing my first flap!! 15, 2004) at 05/11/2005 |
09:39:05 A...
15, 2004) at 05/11/2005 03:08:39 PM,
Serialize by Router on MailServ58-US/AUS/H/NIC(Release 6.5.3FP1|December
15, 2004) at
05/11/2005 03:08:41 PM,
Serialize complete at 05/11/2005 03:08:41 PM
--> RV-List message posted by: "David E. Nelson" <david.nelson@pobox.com>
Thanks Mark,
I've got an better idea/vision of what you are talking about.
Thanks,
/\/elson
On Wed, 11 May 2005 Fiveonepw@aol.com wrote:
> Yep- maybe $10-12 down at the local hardware store, WallyWorld or Lowes
> Depot. These come kind of rough- you'll need one good surface on both sides
down
> near the pointy end. As purchased, mine had too much radius along the side
> near the point, so I ground it flatter (on the side) until I could get a fairly
> square edge, then polished both sides and dulled the original cutting edge to
> avoid scratching any metal it might contact. What you're shooting for is a
> good bucking surface close to the very end of the wedge on both sides so you
can
> flip it over to get 'em from both directions. Sorry, but don't think I ever
> took a foto of it...
>
> And if it don't work, it still makes a nice doorstop, or you can even split
> farwood with it!
>
> Mark
Message 23
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| Subject: | plane flew into restricted airspace |
--> RV-List message posted by: "son hoang" <son@hoangs.com>
C 152 w/ 2 men on board violated no fly zone
White House and Congress evacuated
red level alert
stock market dived because of the security scare
this incident made me angry, frustrated and very sad
I just shook my head in disbelief
there was much over reaction to the real threat
but if we GA pilots keep doing this we will lose any freedom we have to fly
who do we have to blame but ourselves ( or a few rotten ones among us)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Hodgson" <bob@hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Mufflers on Rv's
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Bob Hodgson"
<bob@hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk>
>
> "Prop noise is loudest" - not necessarily, and it's very 'peaky' in line
> with the plane of the prop. Keep helical tip speed below around 800 fps
and
> you avoid the annoying T6 blare. Not a problem on fixed pitch props unless
> they're very fine, and on a CS prop that allows 2700 rpm on take-off, just
> get back to 25/25 as soon as safely possible after take-off.
>
> Exhaust noise remains the dominant factor for most of the time an
aeroplane
> is overflying, and as for mufflers, the Swiss type in Tony Bingelis' books
> works well for damping out the high frequencies. However the Lycoming
sound
> spectrum shows highest powers under 800Hz. An expansion chamber muffler of
> adequate volume (say over 270 cu in) should work better for these low
> frequencies. Even treating the ends of the exhaust pipes as per the Wicks
> 'piccolo' takes some of the 'bite' out of the sound. Some German companies
> have done successful work on certificated mufflers and will be happy to
sell
> you a couple (for enormous piles of euros!) They are much smaller /
lighter
> than the Swiss muffler in Tony's book. Have a Google for Gomolzig and
Liese
> for starters.
>
> Our Popular Flying Association takes noise reduction seriously, and some
> info can be found on their website:
> http://www.pfa.org.uk/engineering_services/silencing_papers.asp
>
> Performance loss may be less than feared using these new free-breathing
> mufflers. If the length of pipe is tuned to say 2500rpm, it may not even
> happen, according to some reports.
>
> My RV is not yet flying, so I can't quote actual figures yet. I do however
> intend to take before and after readings when playing around with
mufflers.
> You can still legally fly an 'experimental' without any muffler over here
in
> the UK, but for how long?? We've lost a lot of airfields to noise
> complaints, so have to disarm the critics before they shut us down
> completely.
>
> Just my 2c /pence worth, YMMV etc
>
> Bob
>
> (RV3B - still starting 'finishing')
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
I believe that the original post used an IFR scenario to justify all uses
of this approach.
Ron Lee
> > Mike, so you are telling us that everytime you do an overhead break to a
> > landing you have been on an IFR flight plan? I seriously doubt it,
> > especially when you are in formation flight. According to the source you
> > quote, that is the only time it is allowed.
> > Don
>
>Don:
>
>How do you get that interpretation? The source says, "Pilots operating in
>accordance with an IFR flight plan in Visual Meteorological Conditions (VMC)
>may request ATC authorization for an overhead maneuver." It says nothing
>whatsoever about when an overhead may not be used.
>
>Tedd McHenry
>Surrey, BC, Canada
>
>
Message 25
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--> RV-List message posted by: Darrell Reiley <lifeofreiley2003@yahoo.com>
Read this for starters www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/Wing_Heavy.pdf
Darrell Reiley
Round Rock, Texas
RV 7A #70125
N622DR (reserved)
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: New pitot/ static offerings |
--> RV-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Those really ARE beautiful. Now if you only offered a Heated
version...... I've been waiting for the Gretz GA-1000, but
unfortunately it's getting closer to the time I'm just going to
have to buy what's currently available.
--
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #170
Current project: Fuselage
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Evan and Megan Johnson wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Evan and Megan Johnson"
> <evmeg@snowcrest.net>
>
> A few months ago there was a thread about the poor choices available
> for pitot tubes and static port kits. We have just received our first
> batch of CNC machined pitot tubes and they look beautiful! Please
> have a look http://www.evansaviationproducts.com/Other%20Products.htm
> The pitot kit comes complete with the mast and all of the hardware
> you need for a super clean installation. I believe this is the only
> kit available right now as a complete package....most others require
> you to go searching for the components from different sources. You
> will find a significant cost savings with the kit as well as really
> nice hardware. We are currently prototyping a heated version, but it
> is still a bit down the road. Cheers, Evan Johnson
> www.evansaviationproducts.com (530)247-0375 (530)351-1776 cell
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? |
--> RV-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Hi Ron. How is the EASTER EGG doing? Wish we had kept it. Flying a 7 right
now and hope to come to LOE 5. Are u suggesting a change of dates for LOE to
coincide with the balloon activities?
Regards,
Doug
Message 28
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--> RV-List message posted by: rv6n6r@comcast.net
Well I know some of those guys too and I think they're RUDE. Imagine taking off
for the Caribbean and leaving me behind! I don't care that it's my fault I didn't
go. They should have stayed rather than leave me behind. Rude b@$#ards!
;-)
Randall Henderson
RV-6
do not archive
Message 29
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| Subject: | Joy Riding in the Pattern |
--> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry <tedd@vansairforce.org>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
>
> I believe that the original post used an IFR scenario to justify all uses
> of this approach.
If I'm reading the posts in the right order, that's true. But, unless I missed
the post, there so far hasn't been any reference presented that suggests
overhead breaks are for IFR flights only. Can someone provide such a
reference?
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC, Canada
Message 30
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| Subject: | Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bill Schlatterer" <billschlatterer@sbcglobal.net>
Decided to cheat and ordered a custom interior from Abby at Flightline
Interiors for my 7a. Having a golf club compartment and lower baggage
access panels complicated that area immensely. Also wanted something a
little different on the seats. All the stuff came today, some 30 separate
pieces and I am totally amazed at the workman(woman)ship and detail. Won't
have it installed for a while but simply had to put in a plug for Abby after
having the finished product in my hand!
Now that she is not working on mine, I would highly recommend her operation!
You will not be disappointed.
Thanks Bill S
7a Ark fuse/panel
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to |
Albuquerque, NM?
--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net> Albuquerque, NM?
> Are u suggesting a change of dates for LOE to coincide with the
> balloon activities?
>Regards,
>Doug
Absolutely not. This has nada to do with LOE. This is a possible new
fly-in opportunity that offers different things to see and do than LOE
Ron
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
I have to second this. Abby did my interior and I am verrrrrry happy with
it.
Tim
RV6 - N616TB
DNA
-------Original Message-------
From: Bill Schlatterer
Subject: RV-List: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bill Schlatterer" <billschlatterer@sbcglobal
net>
Decided to cheat and ordered a custom interior from Abby at Flightline
Interiors for my 7a. Having a golf club compartment and lower baggage
access panels complicated that area immensely. Also wanted something a
little different on the seats. All the stuff came today, some 30 separate
pieces and I am totally amazed at the workman(woman)ship and detail. Won't
have it installed for a while but simply had to put in a plug for Abby after
having the finished product in my hand!
Now that she is not working on mine, I would highly recommend her operation!
You will not be disappointed.
Thanks Bill S
7a Ark fuse/panel
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? |
--> RV-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
OK. I wish the timing was such that I could make both in one trip.
dp
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI |
--> RV-List message posted by: Paul Folbrecht <paulfolbrecht@yahoo.com>
I'm lucky enough to live just a few miles from Abby and lucky enough to have
flown in one of the 7s she did (and also flew in herself I undertand) and it is
indeed impeccable. Interior's a no-brainer for me when I get to that stage!
--- Tim Bryan <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>
> I have to second this. Abby did my interior and I am verrrrrry happy with
> it.
> Tim
> RV6 - N616TB
> DNA
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Bill Schlatterer
> Date: 05/11/05 18:19:03
> To: rv-list@matronics.com; RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RV-List: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Bill Schlatterer" <billschlatterer@sbcglobal
> net>
>
> Decided to cheat and ordered a custom interior from Abby at Flightline
> Interiors for my 7a. Having a golf club compartment and lower baggage
> access panels complicated that area immensely. Also wanted something a
> little different on the seats. All the stuff came today, some 30 separate
> pieces and I am totally amazed at the workman(woman)ship and detail. Won't
> have it installed for a while but simply had to put in a plug for Abby after
> having the finished product in my hand!
>
> Now that she is not working on mine, I would highly recommend her operation!
> You will not be disappointed.
>
>
> Thanks Bill S
> 7a Ark fuse/panel
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: [RV7Yahoo] Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn@cox.net>
I echo your sentiments. I had already chosen a material and wanted someone
familiar with RV seats to use my stuff. She gladly accepted. I received my
seats and everything fits great.
FYI, I asked her how she liked the material. (White leather like material
and blue microfiber for the center pieces.) She said it was refreshing from
the usual tans and grays most people pick:)
Darwin N. Barrie
P19
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Schlatterer" <billschlatterer@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [RV7Yahoo] Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI
> Decided to cheat and ordered a custom interior from Abby at Flightline
> Interiors for my 7a. Having a golf club compartment and lower baggage
> access panels complicated that area immensely. Also wanted something a
> little different on the seats. All the stuff came today, some 30 separate
> pieces and I am totally amazed at the workman(woman)ship and detail.
Won't
> have it installed for a while but simply had to put in a plug for Abby
after
> having the finished product in my hand!
>
> Now that she is not working on mine, I would highly recommend her
operation!
> You will not be disappointed.
>
>
> Thanks Bill S
> 7a Ark fuse/panel
>
>
> Help save the life of a child. Support St. Jude Children's Research
Hospital's
> 'Thanks & Giving.'
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/6iY7fA/5WnJAA/Y3ZIAA/1yWplB/TM
>
>
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
>
>
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
>
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Message 36
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|
| Subject: | Re: Just trashing my first flap!! |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud@adelphia.net>
Since those devices restrict flow but don't drop the pressure, my theory is
that the first hit from the rivet gun is at whatever the line pressure is
and then the restricted flow keeps the pressure from building up on
subsequent hits. As soon as you stop riveting, the line pressure will build
up again ready for the next smile. I'd say throw those devices away and get
a pressure regulator or better yet a combination regulator/oiler/water
trap. You need to oil your tool from time to time.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
I don't have a pressure gage on the gun but one of
> those little regulators with a numbered knob you can adjust. Setting has
> stayed the same for wings and ailerons. By the time I reduced the
> "regulator" on the gun back to where it had been the damage had been done
> and I was too frustrated to be able to think straight anyway.
Message 37
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|
| Subject: | Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer@hotmail.com>
Those of us that have jobs and have to work are not able to make two trips
to New Mexico in the same month.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,666 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
do not archive
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: New pitot/ static offerings |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling2@earthlink.net>
Save some cash and get a used one from the boneyard. I saved about 75%.
Works just fine
Shemp/Jeff Dowling
RV-6A, N915JD
190 hours
Chicago/Louisville
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Olson" <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: New pitot/ static offerings
> --> RV-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Those really ARE beautiful. Now if you only offered a Heated
> version...... I've been waiting for the Gretz GA-1000, but
> unfortunately it's getting closer to the time I'm just going to
> have to buy what's currently available.
>
> --
> Tim Olson -- RV-10 #170
> Current project: Fuselage
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
> Evan and Megan Johnson wrote:
>> --> RV-List message posted by: "Evan and Megan Johnson"
>> <evmeg@snowcrest.net>
>>
>> A few months ago there was a thread about the poor choices available
>> for pitot tubes and static port kits. We have just received our first
>> batch of CNC machined pitot tubes and they look beautiful! Please
>> have a look http://www.evansaviationproducts.com/Other%20Products.htm
>> The pitot kit comes complete with the mast and all of the hardware
>> you need for a super clean installation. I believe this is the only
>> kit available right now as a complete package....most others require
>> you to go searching for the components from different sources. You
>> will find a significant cost savings with the kit as well as really
>> nice hardware. We are currently prototyping a heated version, but it
>> is still a bit down the road. Cheers, Evan Johnson
>> www.evansaviationproducts.com (530)247-0375 (530)351-1776 cell
>>
>
>
>
Message 39
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|
| Subject: | Re: Flightline Interiors - Comments FYI |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker@optonline.net>
I will second this endorsement. I recently received my RV9A interior
and was amazed by the number of pieces included. She provides precut
pieces for just about every exposed surface in the cockpit area -
including under the panel and the sidewalls under the instrument area.
She covered Oregon Aero seats for my installation and they look great!
The quality is top notch! She also provides pictorial directions for
where each and every piece goes and in what order to install them.
As Bill says, now that she is finished with mine I would highly
recommend her work.
Dick Tasker
Bill Schlatterer wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Bill Schlatterer" <billschlatterer@sbcglobal.net>
>
>Decided to cheat and ordered a custom interior from Abby at Flightline
>Interiors for my 7a. Having a golf club compartment and lower baggage
>access panels complicated that area immensely. Also wanted something a
>little different on the seats. All the stuff came today, some 30 separate
>pieces and I am totally amazed at the workman(woman)ship and detail. Won't
>have it installed for a while but simply had to put in a plug for Abby after
>having the finished product in my hand!
>
>Now that she is not working on mine, I would highly recommend her operation!
>You will not be disappointed.
>
>
>Thanks Bill S
>7a Ark fuse/panel
>
>
>
>
--
----
Please Note:
No trees were destroyed in the sending of this message. We do concede, however,
that a significant number of electrons may have been temporarily inconvenienced.
----
Message 40
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|
| Subject: | Re: Just trashing my first flap!! |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker@optonline.net>
I agree. I started with one and almost immediately removed it and used
a real regulator. Much better control.
Dick Tasker
Albert Gardner wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud@adelphia.net>
>
>Since those devices restrict flow but don't drop the pressure, my theory is
>that the first hit from the rivet gun is at whatever the line pressure is
>and then the restricted flow keeps the pressure from building up on
>subsequent hits. As soon as you stop riveting, the line pressure will build
>up again ready for the next smile. I'd say throw those devices away and get
>a pressure regulator or better yet a combination regulator/oiler/water
>trap. You need to oil your tool from time to time.
>Albert Gardner
>RV-9A 872RV
>Yuma, AZ
>
>
>
>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
>>
>>
>I don't have a pressure gage on the gun but one of
>
>
>>those little regulators with a numbered knob you can adjust. Setting has
>>stayed the same for wings and ailerons. By the time I reduced the
>>"regulator" on the gun back to where it had been the damage had been done
>>and I was too frustrated to be able to think straight anyway.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
--
----
Please Note:
No trees were destroyed in the sending of this message. We do concede, however,
that a significant number of electrons may have been temporarily inconvenienced.
----
Message 41
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|
| Subject: | Re: Noisy Airplanes and Altitude |
--> RV-List message posted by: Finn Lassen <finn.lassen@verizon.net>
Something about diminishing by the square of the distance...
Finn
Chris W wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Chris W <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm@cox.net>
>
>I was just curious how high you would have to be for the sound level on
>the ground to be low enough that it probably wouldn't be hard in
>someones house. Maybe there is a formula of x DB drop per 1000 feet of
>altitude. Does anyone know?
>
>
>
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Konrad L. Werner" <klwerner@comcast.net>
Dear Ron,
How well are you acquainted with the Albuquerque & Santa Fe areas and their respective
airport activities?
Just curious.
Konrad / ABQ, NM
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Lee Albuquerque ; NM?@roxy.matronics.com
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 7:17 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Is there interest in an Oct fly-in to Albuquerque, NM?
--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net> Albuquerque, NM?
> Are u suggesting a change of dates for LOE to coincide with the
> balloon activities?
>Regards,
>Doug
Absolutely not. This has nada to do with LOE. This is a possible new
fly-in opportunity that offers different things to see and do than LOE
Ron
Message 43
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|
| Subject: | Re: Mufflers for RVs (Was Re: Noisy Airplanes) |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer@pacbell.net>
Has anybody used the exhaust system from Aircraft
Exhaust Technologies http://www.aircraftexhaust.net?
According to their web site, they have a stainless
steel crossover system that includes two mufflers that
are small enough to fit inside the cowl of an RV-6,
RV-6A, RV-7, RV-7A, RV-8, RV-8A, RV-9, or RV-9A.
Besides reducing sound, they are supposed to increase
cabin heat, too.
Mark
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