Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:13 AM - (Thomas Lukasczyk)
2. 04:16 AM - Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! (Jerry Springer)
3. 04:42 AM - Re: Mixture cable too short? (Jack Fromm)
4. 05:53 AM - Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! (Gary Zilik)
5. 06:10 AM - (Thomas Lukasczyk)
6. 06:37 AM - (Thomas Lukasczyk)
7. 06:43 AM - Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! (linn walters)
8. 07:00 AM - Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! (Bob Collins)
9. 07:10 AM - Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... (David)
10. 07:10 AM - Re: Turbine Engines for RVs (Kevin Williams)
11. 07:13 AM - Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! (cecilth@juno.com)
12. 07:59 AM - Re: Turbine Engines for RVs (Marty)
13. 08:07 AM - Re: Turbine Engines for RVs (Scott Bilinski)
14. 08:57 AM - Re: Turbine Engines for RVs (Doug Rozendaal)
15. 09:06 AM - Re: Turbine Engines for RVs (Ed Anderson)
16. 09:17 AM - Canopy - Enough Already (John B. Szantho)
17. 09:32 AM - Re: Re: [SoCAL-RVlist] Congrats Walter (Charles Rowbotham)
18. 09:33 AM - Re: Canopy - Enough Already (linn walters)
19. 10:25 AM - Painting Class (Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club)
20. 11:43 AM - Re: Sliding Canopy fitting tip (Ed Holyoke)
21. 11:43 AM - Re: Canopy - Enough Already (Ed Holyoke)
22. 11:58 AM - Re: Re: HS and Wing stands (Rick Leach)
23. 01:04 PM - Re: Sliding Canopy fitting tip ---Eureka! (Marty)
24. 01:08 PM - Re: Canopy-Enough Already (John B. Szantho)
25. 01:25 PM - Re: HS and Wing stands (Larry Rosen)
26. 01:36 PM - Manual Flaps?, RV-7 (Bill Dube)
27. 02:07 PM - Re: Sliding Canopy fitting tip (Ed Holyoke)
28. 02:44 PM - Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 (RAS)
29. 02:49 PM - Re: Canopy - Ed Holyoke's Rant (Skylor Piper)
30. 03:16 PM - Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 (Bill Dube)
31. 03:38 PM - Mixture cable too short? (George Inman)
32. 03:40 PM - Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 (Bob J)
33. 06:02 PM - Re: Ed Holyoke's Rant/QB FOD (Jim Robinette)
34. 06:02 PM - Photo for presentation (Joe Larson)
35. 06:24 PM - Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... (JOHN STARN)
36. 06:29 PM - Re: Photo for presentation (Dan Checkoway)
37. 06:33 PM - Re: Photo for presentation (Sam Buchanan)
38. 06:59 PM - Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
39. 07:08 PM - Re: Photo for presentation (Joe Larson)
40. 07:15 PM - Re: Mixture cable too short? (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
41. 07:23 PM - Re: Photo for presentation (Alex Peterson)
42. 08:01 PM - Re: Photo for presentation (sportav8r@aol.com)
43. 08:04 PM - Cross-Country Route SF to SEA (Piavis)
44. 08:34 PM - Re: Re: Ed Holyoke's Rant/QB FOD (Tim Olson)
45. 09:07 PM - Re: Cross-Country Route SF to SEA (Henry Hochberg)
46. 09:29 PM - EZ-Pilot problem (charlie heathco)
47. 09:36 PM - Re: Cross-Country Route SF to SEA (Dean Van Winkle)
48. 10:49 PM - Re: Aileron pushrod and wing mounting (HCRV6@aol.com)
Message 1
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Thomas Lukasczyk" <Lukasczyk@gmx.net>
Hi Dean
You might want to take a look at what I did.
http://www.rv-4.de/Detaillsungen.htm
I am sorry it is all in german but there are many good english webpages
already out there....
I filed a gap into the head of a stainless-steel-socket-head-bolt. The bent
end of the Cowl-pin rests inside the gap and is secured by a small lock-pin.
The bolt itself screws into a rivnut that is held by piece of 0.040-2024
epoxied to the inside of the cowl. I do only have 65 hours on my RV-4 but
the design has worked great so far.
Good luck finishing your project soon
do not archieve
Thomas, RV-4
D-EXTL
--
5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse fr Mail, Message, More +++
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv@comcast.net>
JTAnon@aol.com wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: JTAnon@aol.com
>
>Wow Jerry.
>
>Give me a break. I've seen your posts before, some informative, some
>helpful, some opinionated, some potentially offensive.....
>
>
>
What is so funny it was not your commentsa that I was refering to it was
Nic. He wants to have Van
increase the price of the kits so he does not have to do any work
figuring out how to build an airplane
Once again this is a educational process. What is to learn if all we do
is snap together an airplane.
>Guess I should have known better and should have read all the responses
>before I fired off a reply to the first post I read. (And probably before Miller
>Time which I am well into at this point after yet another day of wrestling with
>this frame in 97 degree heat.)
>
>
>
Simple solution, build a tip up :-)
>I was just so relieved to find at least one other builder who agrees with me
>that I needed to continue to vent.
>
>Please don't characterize my post as whining. If some want to do the slow
>build; Hell, if some want to smelt their own aluminum, God bless. That's not
>me.
>
>No, I don't want Vans to come build the plane for me.
>
>In my area of expertise I did great in my life. But I wouldn't expect that
>somebody new to my field would understand all the nuance of what I know after
a
>lifetime in the field. In fact, in my area (teacher) my main task is to show
>the new student the joy of what I love, and help them to gain skills. To a
>really great teacher challenge is part of the process, frustration never is.
>
>
>
I admire your occupation as a teacher that is an area that takes a
special type of person and I am sure an area
that I would not do well in, although I never have any of my flight
students complain. :-)
Jerry
do not archive
PS One more pet peeve is people that do not use "do not archive" when it
should be used.
Message 3
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Subject: | RE: Mixture cable too short? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Jack Fromm" <jfromm1@hotmail.com>
Steve,
I posted on this subject about a year and a half ago but I think it might
have been to the old Yahoo RV-8 list and I can't find it now.
Anyway, you did mention that you are talking about the deluxe quadrant and
Van's cable. If you are also talking about the Precision MA4-5 carb, then
the problem is with both the cable and the quadrant.
On my quadrant, the hole in the mixture lever was not drilled as high up on
the lever as the throttle. You need to drill another hole in the lever at
least as high as, and preferably a little higher than the one in the
throttle lever.
The cable is an issue too. The full stroke of the cable is just a little
over 2", if you're lucky, after taking out the backlash. That's barely
enough to move the mixture arm stop to stop. So you've got to make sure you
are getting every bit of that travel out of the cable by adjusting things at
the quadrant. That means drilling that hole higher, moving the cable as far
forward in the anchor bracket as possible, and, in my case, even notching
the lever a little---whatever it takes to make sure that you are hitting
full travel on the cable and not having the lever stopped by the slots in
the top plate of the quadrant.
Hope that helps.
Jack Fromm
RV-8 N138JF
Flying - 95 hours
Time: 08:59:08 AM PST US
From: "Steve Struyk" <rv8striker@hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Mixture cable too short?
--> RV-List message posted by: "Steve Struyk" <rv8striker@hotmail.com>
I started the engine yesterday for the first time. Big event, and it went
pretty
well. I knew before the start that my mixture arm was not quite making it to
the idle cutoff stop but that was a compromise I had to make in order to
reach
the full rich stop. I would say the idle stop was short by about 1/8 inch,
just
enough to cause the engine to continue to run with the mixture lever off.
Prior to the start, and months ago while rigging the control cables I spent
hours
trying to adjust the cable/rod ends to achieve full travel to both stops but
in the end had to compromise. It appears that the cable, or maybe the
quadrant,
does not have enough travel to accomplish both.
I've been in the archives and have seen similar problems but no clues as to
the
fix. My thoughts are to perhaps move the attach point up on the mixture
lever
(Van's deluxe quadrant, and Cable too), thus providing more travel for any
given
lever movement and hopefully attain the little extra needed to hit both
stops.
I realize this fix will only work if the quadrant is the problem. But what
if it's the cable that does not have the necessary travel?
Your thoughts, comments, and suggestions please.
Steve Struyk
RV-8, N842S
St. Charles, MO
90% done....90% to go!
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! |
--> RV-List message posted by: Gary Zilik <zilik@excelgeo.com>
I have to stand with Jerry on this one. I have built both slow and quick
build kits and have enjoyed every minute spent building. There are
builders, and there are flyers and then there are those that enjoy
building and flying. I guess I am the latter.
Gary
> Terry Watson wrote:
>
> >--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com <mailto:terry@tcwatson.com>>
> >
> >C'mon Jerry, take the high road for once in your life.
> >
> >I am in the middle of building my second filtered air box (F.A.B.). The
> >instructions say you have to cut and splice the fiberglass part to take
some
> >of the bend out of it. I look at that and wonder why the subcontract
> >supplier didn't correct his mold in the several years between when my first
> >one was built and the second one I just received a week or so ago. I
> >understand that every custom built kit airplane is going to be a little
> >different, but does this fiberglass F.A.B. fit ANY of them? I don't know.
> >
> >Then I look at the canopy skirt and wonder why such a nicely molded part
> >doesn't even come close to matching the contour of the fuselage. I wonder
if
> >there is a good reason for it that I don't understand or maybe I did
> >something wrong, or if it doesn't fit because nobody has gotten around
to
> >correcting it in the last 7 years.
> >
> >And then there is this new trap door air filter bypass, which is the reason
> >I am building a new filtered air box. I literally finished the first one
the
> >day the problems with the bypass door staying open were documented here
on
> >this list. And if I call Van's and ask them about it, I'll bet you a dollar
> >the answer I get is some variation of "no one else has any problem with
it."
> >
> >Unlike Nic, I think I am more of a builder than a flyer so I don't mind
as
> >much as he does that it takes a long time. But I can understand his
> >frustration.
> >
> >I LIKE Van's as a company and for the kits they produce. I am constantly
> >reminded of what a lucky but good decision it was for me to go with one
of
> >their kits when I made my decision seven years ago, but that doesn't mean
> >they couldn't do some things better, and it doesn't mean that anyone who
> >complains here on the list deserves to get a shovel of crap from you.
> >
> >Be nice.
> >
> >Terry
> >
> >
> >
> >
> You answered your own question, each one is built different. I guess I
> can express my opinion
> same as you or Nic can. That is all I am/was doing is expressing my
> opinion about whinners.
> Did you call Van's and ask them about the problem with the bypass trap
> door or is that just your
> opinion that they have not heard of the problem.? Is that a "shovel of
> crap" I am getting from you? :-)
>
> Jerry
> do not archive
>
>
>
--
Gary Zilik, Sr. Geophysicist zilik@excelgeo.com
Excel Geophysical Services, Inc. phone: 303.694.9629
5690 DTC Blvd, Suite 330W fax: 303.771.1641
Greenwood Village, CO 80411 http://www.excelgeo.com
Message 5
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Thomas Lukasczyk" <Lukasczyk@gmx.net>
Hi Dean
You might want to take a look at what I did.
http://www.rv-4.de/Detaillsungen.htm
I am sorry it is all in german but there are many good english webpages
already out there....
I filed a gap into the head of a stainless-steel-socket-head-bolt. The bent
end of the Cowl-pin rests inside the gap and is secured by a small lock-pin.
The bolt itself screws into a rivnut that is held by piece of 0.040-2024
epoxied to the inside of the cowl. I do only have 65 hours on my RV-4 but
the design has worked great so far.
Good luck finishing your project soon
do not archieve
Thomas, RV-4
D-EXTL
--
5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse fr Mail, Message, More +++
Message 6
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Thomas Lukasczyk" <Lukasczyk@gmx.net>
> --- Ursprngliche Nachricht ---
> Von: "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos@verizon.net>
> An: <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Betreff: RV-List: Cowl Pins (Glenn Gordon)
> Datum: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 02:43:25 -0400
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "DEAN PSIROPOULOS"
> <dean.psiropoulos@verizon.net>
>
> Glenn Gordon you still on this list? I ran across an old post from you.
> In
> that post you mention you "came up with a pretty slick way of securing the
> horizontal cowl pins". You didn't have any description but said to email
> you directly and you would send pics. I would really like to see those
> pics. Could you please send to me at this email address? Thanks.
> If anyone else has good ideas for this let me know.
>
> Dean Psiropoulos
> RV-6A N197DM
> Finally getting to the end!!
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Dean
You might want to take a look at what I did.
http://www.rv-4.de/gallerie/rv4_img/tn_P6061586.jpg
I am sorry it is all in german but there are many good english webpages
already out there....
I filed a gap into the head of a stainless-steel-socket-head-bolt. The bent
end of the Cowl-pin rests inside the gap and is secured by a small lock-pin.
The bolt itself screws into a rivnut that is held by piece of 0.040-2024
epoxied to the inside of the cowl. I do only have 65 hours on my RV-4 but
the design has worked great so far.
Good luck finishing your project soon
do not archieve
Thomas, RV-4
D-EXTL
--
Lust, ein paar Euro nebenbei zu verdienen? Ohne Kosten, ohne Risiko!
Satte Provisionen fr GMX Partner: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/partner
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
It's been a long dry spell from when I built my Pitts (tube and fabric
and wood) and I start on my -10. There was a BD-5 in there somewhere,
never finished, of course. But read on for MY comments.
JTAnon@aol.com wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: JTAnon@aol.com
>
>OK, I started this whole thread as a joke, and trying to relieve my
>frustration, but really ....
>
>... Now I'm on a rant!
>
Confession is good for the soul. Please remember that in this one,
you're not alone. Help is available although it may be remote and not
immediate.
>The reason I picked Vans was because it is the best kit out there in so, so
>many ways.
>
>Where else (certified or not) can you get a plane that will fly like this at
>this cost? Where else can you find such a clear builders manual aided by
>readily available tech support? (Thank you Tom Green et al for your patience
with
>an idiot like me.) BUT!!!...
>
Probably the most common reasons for all builders.
>Right from the outset I realized that I was not one of these guys that builds
>the first one then suffers from "builders withdrawal" and immediately starts
>building another. I DO NOT enjoy the building process. It's a means to an
>end for me. I will never do this again. I just want to fly the thing, and I
>want it to be right when I do,
>
I hate to say this, but my experience is that a lot of those that DO NOT
enjoy (or at least accept) the building process fail to finish. This is
work. If you thought you were busy before you started this project,
you're surely in over your head (work level wise) now. A lot of things
are going to slip ..... you don't mow the yard as often, or wash the
car, or socialize ..... whatever you did after working all week .....
just doesn't get the attention they used to.
>There is a certain satisfaction from following the (usually) clear
>directions, taking the time to understand the (usually) accurate drawings (the
biggest
>aggregate time in my builder's log will be the looking at the drawings, head
>scratching process. OK, my problem, my bad.), lining up the holes, being
>precise, riveting the thing and finally saying, "Wow! I built a rudder, and
it's a
>real quality job, thank you, thank you Vans for your design and the technical
>support you provide to newbies like me." Tedium and patience is part of the
>process to get it right, and you start to think, "OK, I can do this, I can
>build an airframe if I just follow directions."
>
This is true, 99% of the time.
>But then you run into things like this (the canopy) and all good will goes
>out the window. Frustration doesn't need to be a part of the process if it can
>be avoided.
>
Since your particular project has been lost in the shuffle, I don't know
anymore which plane you're building, (just got to the end and found it's
an RV-7) but it doesn't matter. The kits aren't perfect, and will never
be. You're using this list to vent a little (no flame here, just an
observation) and, hopefully, to get some guidance from those that have
been there. I haven't got the 'van's experience' yet, but if you step
back and look at the project, if the canopy is the only bump in the
road, you're lucky. You need to remember that the purpose of the
Experimental class is "for educational purposes" ..... and for some, the
learning process is steeper than others. I truly believe that airplanes
can be built by total morons. And I've seen some of their work. I
wouldn't get in some homebuilts ..... but the builder did, and they
fly. I do notice that builders with 'junk' projects never participated
in the local EAA chapter, never sought advice, and 'did it their way'.
Too bad, because there was a wealth of knowledge out there that may have
helped.
>I'm no engineer, but I'm reasonably intelligent, so can somebody tell me why
>Vans couldn't put the welded canopy frame (and roll bar) in some kind of
>factory jig to make it fit the rest of the airframe? I can visualize such an
>apparatus but I have neither the skill, means, nor would it be practical for me
to
>build such a jig for a "one time" application. If you can match drill skins
>and ribs surely you can match drill this section too. Just tell me what it
>costs and I'll pay it.
>
Because of the 51% rule mostly, I would guess, and Van's points to the
fact that you're supposed to learn to weld ...... I dunno. The real
reason may be entirely different. I read a lot of emails about the
canopies and problems/questions folks have. And I agree that maybe it
should be easier and without angst. However, Van's seems to have
trouble going back to 'existing' kits to fix drawings, fit parts better,
improve parts etc. because they're working on getting their latest and
greatest out the door. This isn't unlike any electronics production
environment that I've been involved in. It's the nature of a a
fast-moving company.
>Right in Section 9 (Fitting the Canopy) page 1 of the manual it says this can
>be "... one of the most disappointing, gumption-robbing experiences a
>homebuilder can have." Got that right!
>
Well, that blows up my opinion. They knew, but for whatever reason
can't or won't make it easier. That's the way it is.
>Just can't wait until I get to (Vans words) "The black art" of fiberglass.
>Why is it that several guys are making a buck with fairings better than what
>Vans supplies?
>
Again, I don't know specifics here, but there's a lot of costs
associated with making/modifying molds ..... which adds costs and
consume time (Van's has to verify that the modification really does
work) and ther's always more info that we don't have ..... that drove
the original part.
> Better yet, what a joy will wiring this sucker be? Why can't
>Vans recommend a typical instrument panel and supply the components for the
>same instead of me putting out $5K for someone to do this part?
>
This one is easy. There's far too many variables in a 'typical' panel
for one wiring harness to fit. Even when a builder is faces with a
typical harness, the first thing he does is make changes .... different
radio ...... different ..... well, you name it. Now you've got a few
(or a lot) of wires that don't go anywhere, and just add weight. And,
depending on how you rout the wires, some may end up too short. Just
think how that would frustrate you!!!
>A while back in the RV ator Van himself questioned why he had sold xx,xxx
>thousand empenage kits when there were only x,xxx thousand flying. He said,
>"What happened to the other x,xxx thousand?" You want my answer to date? The
>canopy! No skill one has acquired thus far in the process prepares you for this
>mess. Is it possible to leave the damn thing off and just fly with goggles?
>
Hmm, now there's a thought. Also, someone pointed out that the canopies
are blown, not molded, for clarity purposes, and that not all canopy
plastics are created equal.
>Hello Vans! Fix it! Let me do my 51% somewhere else! There must
>be other builders like me!
>
You mean frustrated builders??? Yeah, they all are, at some point or
other. I've been there, done that, and feel a special kinship to
everybody that takes on the task of building an experimental airplane.
We're a special breed of cat, and I'm proud to be a member of that group.
>Please don't flame me. It would just add to my frustration at this point.
>
No flames John, just a little perspective. I'm sorry that you've (and
others) have read all through my answer only to find that there isn't
any help, no insight, no construction pearls of wisdon ..... I don't
have answers to fix your canopy. What I hoped to do was offer you a
step back and maybe give you some time to reflect on your special
project with it's own special problems. I've never been prouder of
myself or my project when it flew the first time. Funny, I know that
when I was building my Pitts I had some really tough times ..... but now
I can't remember any of them. Maybe that's just my failing memory!!!.
But I still own that Pitts after 24 years, and it's still my favorite
toy. I hope your experience goes along like mine. I know that pounding
X,XXX,XXX rivets will get old real quick, but it's just what has to be
done. But right now, I'm looking forward to smacking the first one
..... and the last one!
>John McD (RV7A - @#
>%$ Canopy - ARRGGHAAA)
>
>Don't care if you archive or not, but please, somebody at Vans read this!!!
>
I'll add 'do not archive' since there isn't anything here but emotion
.... no facts ...... and I have a thought. Why not call Van's nd get a
straight answer (if it's possible) WHY the canopy is such a pain???
Better than eliciting comments from folks like myself that really don't
have the answers.
>Rant over. Tomorrow is another day. Maybe the elves will finish the canopy
>while I sleep.
>
Oh well, by now you know the elves are on vacation. But you might
impose on another RV-7A builder nearby for help. I hope there is one!!!
BTW, I hope you're still around when I get frustrates with the -10.
I'll need some mental help too!!!
Linn
>
>
>
>
--
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Subject: | Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob Collins" <bcollinsrv7a@comcast.net>
//I have to stand with Jerry on this one. I have built both slow and quick
build kits and have enjoyed every minute spent building. There are
builders, and there are flyers and then there are those that enjoy
building and flying. I guess I am the latter.
C'mon guys. Let's step back from the cliff here. There are MANY flavors of
MANY people. There's aren't just only an I ENJOY everything about building
and I ENJOY nothing about building people. So the only camp that's really
out there, is you. And unless you paid twice as much for the kit everyone
else is building, ain't nobody better than the other... Just different.
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... |
--> RV-List message posted by: "David" <davewendi@comcast.net>
It is important to remember that everything is relative. How many of you,
who believe nothing should be improved, built a quick build instead of a
slow build? How many built a slow build instead
of using plans only? Be honest... How many of you
would be willing to forego the improvements that have already been made over
the years by Van's?
There is always room for improvement.
David Kirby
RV-6AQB
Griffin, Ga.
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Turbine Engines for RVs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Kevin Williams" <kevinsky18@hotmail.com>
Looks very interesting. High HP low Weight. A bit higher fuel burn, but
cheaper fuel. . . Not sure on the actual cost of the engine, though they
claim the price is comparable to a piston engine. . .
http://www.innodyn.com/index.html
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... I agree !! |
--> RV-List message posted by: cecilth@juno.com
Keep in mind Van can only do 49% of the job. FAA Rules.
Cecil
PS I understand you feel you are doing 85%
Do not archive
On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:26:50 +0100 0.37 PLING_QUERY Subject
has exclamation mark and question mark "Nic" <Nic@skyhi.flyer.co.uk>
writes:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Nic" <Nic@skyhi.flyer.co.uk>
>
> Why should anyone have to battle like this to make a simple
> component of the
> Vans kit fit properly ??
>
> My quick build 8, has been anything but quick build, with fairings
> to make
> up, the canopy to cut and scribe, baggage door to bend, rollbar to
> mangle,
> undercarriage to make fit ... the list is endless, and much of it is
> a
> complete waste of time.
>
> I can only assume that Vans customers put up with this based on the
> fact
> that compared with the RV4 and the slow build kits we are much
> better
> placed. The reality is that like many builders, I am a flyer and
> want to get
> in the air and fly - fiddling with canopies and fairings and the
> horrendous
> cowls is dead time in anybody's life.
>
> We all know how John McD' feels. At the moment there seems to be an
> "Emperor's new clothes" syndrome surrounding our kits, with very
> little
> dissent. Wake up Vans please and make life easier for your
> customers - and
> if needs be charge more for a better and more complete product.
>
> Nic
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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Subject: | Turbine Engines for RVs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Marty" <martorious@earthlink.net>
There are two things to keep in mind when considering this company.
1. Caveat Emptor, and
2. Too good to be true.
I was marginally interested when I first heard of them, however I've
read some things that are making me look in other directions for
powerplant choices.
Read this thread on Doug Reeves site, some of the posts will open your
eyes.
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=1335
Keep in mind that I have not independently confirmed any of this, but
I have read similar tales in more than one place.
For Jet-a burning alternatives, I think the Deltahawk compression
combustion engine looks promising.
Marty in Indiana
RV-8A Preview plans in Hand
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
>server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Williams
>Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 9:10 AM
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Turbine Engines for RVs
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Kevin Williams"
><kevinsky18@hotmail.com>
>
>Looks very interesting. High HP low Weight. A bit higher fuel burn,
>but
>cheaper fuel. . . Not sure on the actual cost of the engine, though
>they
>claim the price is comparable to a piston engine. . .
>
>http://www.innodyn.com/index.html
>
>
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Turbine Engines for RVs |
--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
To make a long story short, so far it is vaporware, and they have not
published any real numbers. The RV-4 test bed is a dog.
At 08:10 AM 8/15/2005 -0600, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Kevin Williams" <kevinsky18@hotmail.com>
>
>Looks very interesting. High HP low Weight. A bit higher fuel burn, but
>cheaper fuel. . . Not sure on the actual cost of the engine, though they
>claim the price is comparable to a piston engine. . .
>
>http://www.innodyn.com/index.html
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Turbine Engines for RVs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr@petroblend.com>
What follows is my opinion based on speaking to these guys at OSH and what I
have read, and read between the lines in trade rags.
I long for a time when I can afford to buy and feed an airplane where all
the parts are turning continuiously in one direction. It is a great
concept. This engine is really cool but they have some problems.
#1 If the fuel economy they claim is correct, then Pratt & Whitney, GE,
Williams, and everyother manufacturer would pay these guys MILLIONS if not
BILLIONS of dollars for the technology.
#2 it appears from what I have read that the engine operates in an EXTREMLY
narrow rpm range and the pilot controls prop pitch and the computer controls
the power. This sounds simple enough but based on what I have read, the
RV-4 is pretty challenging to fly with this setup. If you moved the prop
control too quickly you could either cook or kill the engine in a heartbeat.
Again, reading between the lines, it sounded to me like a go-around would
either be hair-raising or impossible.
#3 They have no means to measure torque output to the propellor. This is
critical. There is no other way to determine the health of a turbine engine
without a torque meter. They seemed totally unconcerned about it. It would
compare roughly to flying a C/S airplane without a Manifold pressure gauge.
#4 I questioned them about fuel flow on a dyno and they evaded my question.
Anyone who can build a turbine engine can figure out a simple dyno. A
generator or a water pump for a load, a bathroom scale, and an RPM gauge and
you have a dyno. There is no reason why they cannot determine and publish
some dyno info. My guess is that they have that info and choose not to
share it. If they don't have it, that is even scarier, what other critical
info are they ignoring?
I wish them all the luck in the world and hope they are successful, but it
looks to me like they are a LONG way from being ready to sell engines that
fly.
Tailwinds,
Doug Rozendaal
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: Turbine Engines for RVs |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
I would be very cautious. Their quote of 7 gph/100HP just too wild for me
to believe - especially for a turbine engine. 7gph on a VERY good piston
automobile engine could produce power on the order of 90HP. Small turbines
have thus far not been able to approach that figure.
Ed A
eanderson@carolina.rr.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Williams" <kevinsky18@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Turbine Engines for RVs
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Kevin Williams" <kevinsky18@hotmail.com>
>
> Looks very interesting. High HP low Weight. A bit higher fuel burn, but
> cheaper fuel. . . Not sure on the actual cost of the engine, though they
> claim the price is comparable to a piston engine. . .
>
> http://www.innodyn.com/index.html
>
>
>
Message 16
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Subject: | Canopy - Enough Already |
--> RV-List message posted by: "John B. Szantho" <szantho@usa.com>
John McD, I agree with you 100%. The canopy is like trying to fit Jell-O
over spaghetti, it can be done, but very frustrating. What I cannot
understand is why we can't ask for improvement from the manufacturer of our
kits without being criticized and berated. I thought that's how we improve
everything we deal with in our everyday existence. Maybe even Van's needs
some help from the pool of thousands of builders. On my part I came to the
conclusion that with the canopy I will have to compromise with my
perfectionist nature and do the best I can (one can always use shims in a
few places).
John
RV9-A Canopy
Message 17
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|
Subject: | Re: [SoCAL-RVlist] Congrats Walter |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham@hotmail.com>
Walter,
CONGRATULATIONS and WELL DONE !!
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A
>From: Walter Tondu <walter@tondu.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>To: SoCAL-RVlist@yahoogroups.com, rv-list@matronics.com,
>RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RV-List: Re: [SoCAL-RVlist] Congrats Walter
>Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 00:46:48 -0400
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Walter Tondu <walter@tondu.com>
>
>On 08/13 10:27, Dan Checkoway wrote:
>
> > Just wanted to extend a big congratulations to Walter Tondu, who flew
>his
> > RV-7A for the first time today at Chino, CA. Nicely done!!!
> >
> > )_( Dan
> > RV-7 N714D
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: Canopy - Enough Already |
--> RV-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
John B. Szantho wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "John B. Szantho" <szantho@usa.com>
>
>John McD, I agree with you 100%. The canopy is like trying to fit Jell-O
>over spaghetti, it can be done, but very frustrating. What I cannot
>understand is why we can't ask for improvement from the manufacturer of our
>kits without being criticized and berated.
>
Nobody did ..... to my knowledge. They voiced their frustration to the
list, which has no more pull than anyone else.
I guess you could use the term berated, but what I read was opinions
expressed by others from the list.
> I thought that's how we improve everything we deal with in our everyday existence.
Maybe even Van's needs some help from the pool of thousands of builders.
>
Well, the complaints are misplaced. The list can't do anything.
However, I (read ME, ME, ME) usually don't complain unless I can offer
some constructive criticism (better way, lower cost etc.) towards the
solution.
> On my part I came to the
>conclusion that with the canopy I will have to compromise with my perfectionist
nature and do the best I can (one can always use shims in a few places).
>
And that's one way to get around the problem. Maybe the solution is for
Vans to supply shim material??? If it's true, and the canopy is blown
rather than molded, (and I don't know how they do that!) and the shape
isn't totally fixed ..... then just how, other than shims, could the
problem be aleviated??? I don't have a clue either. I just like
responding with my perspective and my opinions ..... and apologize in
advance because I can't offer real help.
Linn
do not achive
>
>John
>
>RV9-A Canopy
>
>
>
>
--
Message 19
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|
refid=0001.0A090202.4300CD4D.0074-A-,
ip=209.107.238.85,
so=2005-07-14 09:05:58,
dmn=2005-05-20 17:56:59
--> RV-List message posted by: "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson@consolidated.net>
Do not archive
This could be an informative class for those who want to paint their
plane and don't know where to start....
http://www.devilbiss.com/pdf/training/training_2005.pdf
I am looking into buying a paint gun. It is going to be a Devilbiss GFG
670 ot JGA 670. Does anyone on the list have experience with these guns
that use "plus" technology? Which do you like best, the gravity or the
suction version? Please reply direct (off list) with your ideas..
I presently use MBC guns. I guess it is time I come into the 21st
century on paint guns..
Phil in Illinois
Message 20
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|
Subject: | Sliding Canopy fitting tip |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
Having vented in another post, here's something that may actually help
someone.
The way I finally got the front bow of the slider frame to match up to
the roll bar was this:
I took a piece of 1/8" luaun plywood and laid it across the side rails
behind the roll bar and scribed the shape of the roll bar onto it with a
pencil. I tacked the ply to my workbench and set the slider frame onto
it. I could then see exactly which parts of the front tube needed to be
tweaked in which direction and by how much. Every time you bend one
part, something else is affected, but I could see what was happening
with each incremental bend and make the correct adjustments without
fitting it to the airplane time after time. I did it all on the bench
and when it looked good on the template, it looked good on the plane.
Remember to make the bottom part where the rollers fit a little narrow
because the canopy plastic will spring it out and make the rollers drag
in the tracks if you don't.
Happy canopying,
Ed Holyoke
Message 21
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Subject: | Canopy - Enough Already |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
I feel for everyone of us who has suffered through the canopy. It is (as
has been said) the hardest part of any homebuilt project. It tests your
building skills and innovation - sometimes to the breaking point. A good
scream every now and then helps one to go on.
I did my sliding canopy a little while back and was just as frustrated
as a person could be. It got to where I couldn't even look at it and did
other stuff for a year. Mine is the old round tube style going on a
quickbuild. You would think that the quickbuild would be a known
quantity and that a weldment could be made in a jig to fit it reasonably
well, but no. In initial fittings, with the rear pins actually resting
on the longeron decks (I know that's not the correct name for them, but
the plans are not in front of me), the rear curve of the frame was well
above the fuselage skin. The side rails of the canopy frame angled
downwards to the rear. It was all wrong. I tried everything I could
think of, but couldn't get it anywhere near right. Van's suggested
cutting the frame. It wasn't until I committed to cutting the downtubes
at the rear that I was able to get it anywhere close. I removed about 1
1/4" from one side and about 7/8" from the other. After the cuts were
made, I was able to massage it into place and got a pretty good fit. It
still caused a lot of frustration before it was over.
The tandem canopies are blown bubbles. The side by side are stretched
over forms. Mine is not symmetrical. Still, fitting the glass was not
the hardest part once the frame fit the airplane. The rear skirts were a
pain, but not near as bad as it could have been. If I hadn't cut the
frame, it wouldn't have been possible.
Let it be known that I still believe that the Vans aircraft kits are by
far the best bang for the buck and that there's no better flying or
performing airplane available near the same price point. I submit,
however, that one of Van's selling points has always been that the
welding and the tougher alum bending is done for you so you don't have
to. One could reasonably expect that the weldments would fit without
extreme measures. One could also expect that a jig-built quickbuild
would be straight, but that's another rant for another day.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
Do not archive
John B. Szantho wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "John B. Szantho" <szantho@usa.com>
>
>John McD, I agree with you 100%. The canopy is like trying to fit
Jell-O
>over spaghetti, it can be done, but very frustrating. What I cannot
>understand is why we can't ask for improvement from the manufacturer of
our
>kits without being criticized and berated.
Message 22
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|
Subject: | Re: HS and Wing stands |
--> RV-List message posted by: Rick Leach <papadaddyo@verizon.net>
thanks Tim>
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>Date: Sun Aug 14 20:40:53 CDT 2005
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: HS and Wing stands
>--> RV-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
>Hi Rick,
>
>This might not be what you want, since it doesn't take care of
>the HS, but it might work well for the wings for you:
>
>http://www.myrv10.com/tips/wingtips.html
>
>See the bottom tip from Larry Rosen.
>
>Also, your question might be best addressed on the RV10-List
>instead of the generic RV-List... I see you sent this to
>owner-rv10-list-server, but it didn't make it to the
>RV10-List proper. Might want to verifiy your address book.
>Tim
>
>Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
>Current project: Doors/Windows
>DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>Richard Leach wrote:
>> --> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Leach" <papadaddyo@verizon.net>
>>
>> Does anyone have plans or dimensions of stands for holding the
>> horizontal stab and the wings for the -10?
>>
>> Rick Leach
>> 40397
>>
>
>
Message 23
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|
Subject: | Sliding Canopy fitting tip ---Eureka! |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Marty" <martorious@earthlink.net>
I knew if I kept shoveling through the rest of this thread that I
would find a gem!
Thanks Ed!
Marty in Indiana
RV-8A Preview plans in Hand
Do not archive
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
>server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ed Holyoke
>Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 1:42 PM
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: RV-List: Sliding Canopy fitting tip
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
>
>
>Having vented in another post, here's something that may actually
>help
>someone.
>
>The way I finally got the front bow of the slider frame to match up
>to
>the roll bar was this:
>
>I took a piece of 1/8" luaun plywood and laid it across the side
>rails
>behind the roll bar and scribed the shape of the roll bar onto it
>with a
>pencil. I tacked the ply to my workbench and set the slider frame
>onto
>it. I could then see exactly which parts of the front tube needed to
>be
>tweaked in which direction and by how much. Every time you bend one
>part, something else is affected, but I could see what was happening
>with each incremental bend and make the correct adjustments without
>fitting it to the airplane time after time. I did it all on the bench
>and when it looked good on the template, it looked good on the plane.
>
>Remember to make the bottom part where the rollers fit a little
>narrow
>because the canopy plastic will spring it out and make the rollers
>drag
>in the tracks if you don't.
>
>Happy canopying,
>
>Ed Holyoke
>
>
Message 24
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|
Subject: | Re: Canopy-Enough Already |
--> RV-List message posted by: "John B. Szantho" <szantho@usa.com>
Linn, May be I should not have use the word berated, but comments like:
"I guess you must be
flush with money to ask Van to charge more for his kit, actually that
statement really pisses me off, once again
if you can't build it go buy something else. If you had told anyone
you
were a flyer and not a builder then the
advice would have been GO BUY SOMETHING..."
from Jerry on 8/13/05 is not very helpful and I certainly not criticizing
anyone just making
a comment and I hope I am not misinterpreting Jerry. I wish VAN's would be
more involved
in these discussions. I heard they were, but there were too many problems
and they quit.
I don't know what the problems were. Perhaps others on the list do. I am a
first time builder,
love the process and like VAN's products (with the exception of the canopy,
but I almost got
it figured out). I know they will listen and improve the canopy product also
(too late for me).
But now I better get back to my canopy fitting. Sorry if I made anyone angry
with my "berated"
comment. I don't know what I would do without all the great suggestions on
this list. I wish I
was smart enough to help more.
John
RV9-A Canopy
N3294C
Message 25
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|
Subject: | Re: HS and Wing stands |
--> RV-List message posted by: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
Link to my plans are here http://rv10pilot.home.comcast.net/tips.html
Contact me if you have any questions
LarryRosen@comcast.net
RV10 #356
Wings
Rick Leach wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Rick Leach <papadaddyo@verizon.net>
>
>thanks Tim>
>
>From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
>
>>Date: Sun Aug 14 20:40:53 CDT 2005
>>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: RV-List: HS and Wing stands
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>>
>>Hi Rick,
>>
>>This might not be what you want, since it doesn't take care of
>>the HS, but it might work well for the wings for you:
>>
>>http://www.myrv10.com/tips/wingtips.html
>>
>>See the bottom tip from Larry Rosen.
>>
>>Also, your question might be best addressed on the RV10-List
>>instead of the generic RV-List... I see you sent this to
>>owner-rv10-list-server, but it didn't make it to the
>>RV10-List proper. Might want to verifiy your address book.
>>Tim
>>
>>Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
>>Current project: Doors/Windows
>>DO NOT ARCHIVE
>>
>>
>>Richard Leach wrote:
>>
>>
>>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Leach" <papadaddyo@verizon.net>
>>>
>>>Does anyone have plans or dimensions of stands for holding the
>>>horizontal stab and the wings for the -10?
>>>
>>>Rick Leach
>>>40397
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 26
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|
Subject: | Manual Flaps?, RV-7 |
--> RV-List message posted by: Bill Dube <bdube@al.noaa.gov>
Has anyone attempted to put in manual flaps in their RV-7? How
difficult is it to rig up the flaps for manual operation?
I prefer manual flaps for several reasons. The stock electric
motor has a poor track record. I like to be able to "feel" the force on the
flaps. You automatically know how far the flaps are extended.
Bill Dube' (wings)
Message 27
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Subject: | Sliding Canopy fitting tip |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
When I think about it, this will give you a reverse image. I probably
cut it with a jigsaw before I put it on the bench. It's been a while.
Sorry bout that.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ed Holyoke
Subject: RE: RV-List: Sliding Canopy fitting tip
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
Having vented in another post, here's something that may actually help
someone.
The way I finally got the front bow of the slider frame to match up to
the roll bar was this:
I took a piece of 1/8" luaun plywood and laid it across the side rails
behind the roll bar and scribed the shape of the roll bar onto it with a
pencil. I tacked the ply to my workbench and set the slider frame onto
it. I could then see exactly which parts of the front tube needed to be
tweaked in which direction and by how much. Every time you bend one
part, something else is affected, but I could see what was happening
with each incremental bend and make the correct adjustments without
fitting it to the airplane time after time. I did it all on the bench
and when it looked good on the template, it looked good on the plane.
Remember to make the bottom part where the rollers fit a little narrow
because the canopy plastic will spring it out and make the rollers drag
in the tracks if you don't.
Happy canopying,
Ed Holyoke
Message 28
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Subject: | Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 |
--> RV-List message posted by: "RAS" <deruiteraircraftservices@btinternet.com>
Bill,
you would just as well build it without flaps. there not strictly needed
unless you fly into very short strips. The 100MPH limit is one to watch as
the airplane takes a while to slow down, or alternatively accelerates that
fast that it goes straight through the 100MPH.
Marcel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <bdube@al.noaa.gov>
Subject: RV-List: Manual Flaps?, RV-7
> --> RV-List message posted by: Bill Dube <bdube@al.noaa.gov>
>
> Has anyone attempted to put in manual flaps in their RV-7? How
> difficult is it to rig up the flaps for manual operation?
>
> I prefer manual flaps for several reasons. The stock electric
> motor has a poor track record. I like to be able to "feel" the force on
> the
> flaps. You automatically know how far the flaps are extended.
>
> Bill Dube' (wings)
>
>
>
Message 29
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Subject: | Canopy - Ed Holyoke's Rant |
--> RV-List message posted by: Skylor Piper <skylor4@yahoo.com>
--- Ed Holyoke <bicyclop@pacbell.net> wrote:
>>One could also expect that a
> jig-built quickbuild
> would be straight...
Isn't that the truth!
Skylor
RV-8 QB, Under Construction
Do not archive
Message 30
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Subject: | Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 |
--> RV-List message posted by: Bill Dube <bdube@al.noaa.gov>
I do intend to fly into short strips. Also, the flaps act as speed
brakes to help slow the airplane down, allowing a steeper approach. Of
course, the flaps reduce the stall speed too.
Bill Dube'
At 03:42 PM 8/15/2005, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "RAS" <deruiteraircraftservices@btinternet.com>
>
>Bill,
>
> you would just as well build it without flaps. there not strictly needed
>unless you fly into very short strips. The 100MPH limit is one to watch as
>the airplane takes a while to slow down, or alternatively accelerates that
>fast that it goes straight through the 100MPH.
>
>Marcel
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Bill Dube" <bdube@al.noaa.gov>
>To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: Manual Flaps?, RV-7
>
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: Bill Dube <bdube@al.noaa.gov>
> >
> > Has anyone attempted to put in manual flaps in their RV-7? How
> > difficult is it to rig up the flaps for manual operation?
> >
> > I prefer manual flaps for several reasons. The stock electric
> > motor has a poor track record. I like to be able to "feel" the force on
> > the
> > flaps. You automatically know how far the flaps are extended.
> >
> > Bill Dube' (wings)
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 31
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Subject: | Mixture cable too short? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "George Inman" <ghinman@mts.net>
I started the engine yesterday for the first time. Big event, and it went pretty
well. I knew before the start that my mixture arm was not quite making it to
the idle cutoff stop but that was a compromise I had to make in order to reach
the full rich stop. I would say the idle stop was short by about 1/8 inch, just
enough to cause the engine to continue to run with the mixture lever off.
Prior to the start, and months ago while rigging the control cables I spent hours
trying to adjust the cable/rod ends to achieve full travel to both stops but
in the end had to compromise. It appears that the cable, or maybe the quadrant,
does not have enough travel to accomplish both.
I've been in the archives and have seen similar problems but no clues as to the
fix. My thoughts are to perhaps move the attach point up on the mixture lever
(Van's deluxe quadrant, and Cable too), thus providing more travel for any given
lever movement and hopefully attain the little extra needed to hit both stops.
I realize this fix will only work if the quadrant is the problem. But what
if it's the cable that does not have the necessary travel?
Your thoughts, comments, and suggestions please.
Steve Struyk
RV-8, N842S
Steve
I have the same problem with
my RV-8 with bendix fuel inj. In my case it is
the cables I got from Van's.they have only 2"
throw.Not enough for the throttle and just barely
enough for the mixture
The quadrant has a bit more than 2" throw
I think I might move the attach point up a bit
on the throttle arm.
George Inman
Message 32
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Subject: | Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 |
--> RV-List message posted by: Bob J <rocketbob@gmail.com>
Bill, I don't see why the manual flap weldment from the -6 couldn't be
adapted. The floor ribs on the -7 are different than the 6, so the only
thing that will likely be affected is the notched plate that the flap handle
engages with. The flap handle would sit a little higher off the floor. I
don't think this would take much work to accomplish. I have manual flaps in
my -6 and love them, as you can control the flaps instantly. I have many
times conspired on how to put manual flaps in my F1 which would be a bit
more challenging to do since the flap arm behind the pax seat like the RV-8.
If you have access to a tig welder you could fabricate your own flap arm.
Regards,
Bob Japundza
RV-6 flying F1 under const.
On 8/15/05, Bill Dube <bdube@al.noaa.gov> wrote:
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Bill Dube <bdube@al.noaa.gov>
>
> Has anyone attempted to put in manual flaps in their RV-7? How
> difficult is it to rig up the flaps for manual operation?
>
> I prefer manual flaps for several reasons. The stock electric
> motor has a poor track record. I like to be able to "feel" the force on
> the
> flaps. You automatically know how far the flaps are extended.
>
> Bill Dube' (wings)
>
>
Message 33
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Subject: | RE: Ed Holyoke's Rant/QB FOD |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Jim Robinette" <jim@rvator.net>
You would also expect a QB to be free from FOD! I bought my QB fuse and
wings direct from Van's. Put the fuse on Jeff Bordeleon's rotisserie
only find all kinds of items such as rusted clecos, pop rivets, regular
rivets and some scrap aluminum to fall out. Not that significant, until
there was more clanking beneath the floorboards that couldn't be
stopped. Now I have to either deal with FOD under the seats or drill
out the floorboards to remove it.
Most people wouldn't find this FOD unless they flipped their QB fuse
over. Seems there needs to be a little better quality control in the
PI!
Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Skylor Piper
Subject: RE: RV-List: Canopy - Ed Holyoke's Rant
--- Ed Holyoke <bicyclop@pacbell.net> wrote:
>>One could also expect that a
> jig-built quickbuild
> would be straight...
Isn't that the truth!
Skylor
RV-8 QB, Under Construction
Do not archive
Message 34
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Subject: | Photo for presentation |
--> RV-List message posted by: Joe Larson <jpl@showpage.org>
On Wednesday, I'm giving a presentation titled, "Homebuilt Aviation:
Cunning Plan or Proof of Insanity?" I am applying the final touches
and am hoping for a few more photos.
One photo I would like is an RV obviously engaged in some
demonstration of "fun" such as aerobatics. I'm trying to show in a
photo that an RV is more fun to fly than a Cessna, and the audience
is NOT composed of pilots.
If anyone has any photos I could use for this, please let me know.
-Joe
Message 35
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|
Subject: | Re: Canopy - How many more times? ... |
--> RV-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn@verizon.net>
Good thought Dave..... IF Van's had perfected the perfect airplane & spent
all his time, effort, money & profits getting everything perfect and snap
together assembly without ANY problems........
We'd all ONLY be flying the latest version of the RV-3.
I remember when GM reported that $7.00 more for each Corvette would have
made it safer by increasing the flame resistant capabilities of the resin.
Did they do it........NO....but they didn't increase the power from a max of
375 HP to 450 HP in four years (1963 to 1967). I voted for the HP. KABONG
HRII 561FS 8*)
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "David" <davewendi@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Canopy - How many more times? ...
> --> RV-List message posted by: "David" <davewendi@comcast.net>
>
> It is important to remember that everything is relative. How many of you,
> who believe nothing should be improved, built a quick build instead of a
> slow build? How many built a slow build instead
> of using plans only? Be honest... How many of you
> would be willing to forego the improvements that have already been made
> over
> the years by Van's?
> There is always room for improvement.
>
> David Kirby
> RV-6AQB
> Griffin, Ga.
Message 36
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Subject: | Re: Photo for presentation |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
How about one of these?
http://rvproject.com/images/2005/20050723_roll1.jpg
http://rvproject.com/images/2005/20050723_dan_upside_down.jpg
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (592 hours)
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Larson" <jpl@showpage.org>
Subject: RV-List: Photo for presentation
> --> RV-List message posted by: Joe Larson <jpl@showpage.org>
>
> On Wednesday, I'm giving a presentation titled, "Homebuilt Aviation:
> Cunning Plan or Proof of Insanity?" I am applying the final touches
> and am hoping for a few more photos.
>
> One photo I would like is an RV obviously engaged in some
> demonstration of "fun" such as aerobatics. I'm trying to show in a
> photo that an RV is more fun to fly than a Cessna, and the audience
> is NOT composed of pilots.
>
> If anyone has any photos I could use for this, please let me know.
>
> -Joe
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 37
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Subject: | Re: Photo for presentation |
--> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan <sbuc@hiwaay.net>
Joe Larson wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Joe Larson <jpl@showpage.org>
>
> On Wednesday, I'm giving a presentation titled, "Homebuilt Aviation:
> Cunning Plan or Proof of Insanity?" I am applying the final touches
> and am hoping for a few more photos.
>
> One photo I would like is an RV obviously engaged in some
> demonstration of "fun" such as aerobatics. I'm trying to show in a
> photo that an RV is more fun to fly than a Cessna, and the audience
> is NOT composed of pilots.
Your making a presentation to non-pilots and the word "Insanity" is in
your title?!?
Wow.....bet Phil Boyer and the PR guys at AOPA would really get a charge
out of this one....
I wish you the best with your presentation but hope you reconsider the
title.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, trying for years to convince non-flying folks we
aren't insane...)
Message 38
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Subject: | Re: Manual Flaps?, RV-7 |
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 08/15/2005 3:45:15 PM Central Standard Time,
deruiteraircraftservices@btinternet.com writes:
The stock electric
> motor has a poor track record.
>>>
Hi Bill-
Not an attempt to dissuade you from manual, but pretty sure the "bad" motors
was a somewhat limited run from 2000 or 2001 (not sure of dates- archive check
to be sure). Mine was shipped around 2002 and has performed perfectly for
220+ hours, as have many others for far longer than that...
Best wishes & do not archive
Mark Phillips -6A N51PW
Message 39
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Subject: | Re: Photo for presentation |
--> RV-List message posted by: Joe Larson <jpl@showpage.org>
LOL @ Sam!
It's sort of a long story. I belong to Toastmasters. My first
presentation was supposed to just be an introduction to me, so I
titled it "Geek Coolness" and talked about my own personal style.
When I mentioned I was building an airplane, I got a bunch of looks
that could be interpreted as "do you know what you're doing?" or
perhaps more accurately as "are you nuts?"
So for my second talk, I'm going to explain why someone would want an
RV (that's the first half) and why it's not as crazy as it sounds.
One feature of my public speaking is a certain amount of tongue-in-
cheek humor. For instance, I included baby pictures in my last talk
-- Jennifer Grey from "Dirty Dancing" (her character's name was Baby)
and the leopard from "Bringing Up Baby".
In this presentation, when talking about the planes I currently rent
from the airport, my wife found a photo from the Airplane Graveyard.
You get the idea. The title is completely in line with my style of
humor, and the nature of the talk is to attempt to convince people
it's a cunning plan, NOT proof of insanity.
-Joe
do not archive
On Aug 15, 2005, at 8:32 PM, Sam Buchanan wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan <sbuc@hiwaay.net>
>
> Joe Larson wrote:
>
>> --> RV-List message posted by: Joe Larson <jpl@showpage.org>
>>
>> On Wednesday, I'm giving a presentation titled, "Homebuilt Aviation:
>> Cunning Plan or Proof of Insanity?" I am applying the final touches
>> and am hoping for a few more photos.
>>
>> One photo I would like is an RV obviously engaged in some
>> demonstration of "fun" such as aerobatics. I'm trying to show in a
>> photo that an RV is more fun to fly than a Cessna, and the audience
>> is NOT composed of pilots.
>>
>
>
> Your making a presentation to non-pilots and the word "Insanity" is in
> your title?!?
>
> Wow.....bet Phil Boyer and the PR guys at AOPA would really get a
> charge
> out of this one....
>
> I wish you the best with your presentation but hope you reconsider the
> title.
>
> Sam Buchanan (RV-6, trying for years to convince non-flying folks we
> aren't insane...)
>
Message 40
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Subject: | Re: Mixture cable too short? |
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 08/15/2005 4:39:33 PM Central Standard Time,
ghinman@mts.net writes:
. But what
if it's the cable that does not have the necessary travel?
>>>
This may not be relevant to your situation, just something I've noticed on
mine- I also can't seem to get full idle cutoff every time, even though the
mixture arm (O-320, MA-4 carb) appears to go all the way to the carb body when
I'm
looking at it (assuming is does so in flight!). But I've also noticed that I
have to pull the knob out over one inch before mixture begins to lean enough
to affect engine rpm above 3-4000', and EGTs don't start going up until the
knob is pulled almost that far- about 3/4". Wondering if that first inch of
travel is having no (or little) effect on mixture and could be re-rigged for more
positive idle cutoff? In other words, re-rig so at full rich, the carb arm
is not quite to its stop, allowing available travel to pull the mixture lever
more into idle cutoff?
Another suspicion is that some fuel is leaking past a worn mixture valve even
when at full cutoff, or possibly idle mixture a bit too rich?
Mark Phillips
Message 41
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Subject: | Photo for presentation |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson@earthlink.net>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
>
> How about one of these?
>
> http://rvproject.com/images/2005/20050723_roll1.jpg
> http://rvproject.com/images/2005/20050723_dan_upside_down.jpg
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D (592 hours)
> http://www.rvproject.com <http://www.rvproject.com/>
All right, Dan, that ain't being upside down. See:
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/66AP%20inverted%20with%20Tom%203
.jpg
The picture is a little crummy because it was taken from video.
Alex Peterson
RV6A N66AP 654 hours
Message 42
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Subject: | Re: Photo for presentation |
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
Title page of the OVRV Yahoo group shows an RV formation as pretty as you'll ever
see ; I think it's on Doug Reeves' site as well. 5 or 6 vertical stabs all
lined up perfectly...
-Stormy
not in the picture; wish I was that good :-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Larson <jpl@showpage.org>
Subject: RV-List: Photo for presentation
--> RV-List message posted by: Joe Larson <jpl@showpage.org>
On Wednesday, I'm giving a presentation titled, "Homebuilt Aviation:
Cunning Plan or Proof of Insanity?" I am applying the final touches
and am hoping for a few more photos.
One photo I would like is an RV obviously engaged in some
demonstration of "fun" such as aerobatics. I'm trying to show in a
photo that an RV is more fun to fly than a Cessna, and the audience
is NOT composed of pilots.
If anyone has any photos I could use for this, please let me know.
-Joe
Message 43
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|
Subject: | Cross-Country Route SF to SEA |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Piavis" <piavis@pacbell.net>
I'm looking at taking a low & slow biplane from the Bay Area to Seattle area
in two weeks and was thinking of just following I-5 up north. Is it
preferable to stay east of the Cascades until as far north as possible or
just go IFR? Anyone have a good recommendation on an RON in the Portland
Area or just south?
Thanks,
Jim
-7 Fuse
(Progress nil due to re-location)
Message 44
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Subject: | Re: RE: Ed Holyoke's Rant/QB FOD |
--> RV-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Hey, it ain't all bad....they shipped me 3 free clecos, and a
free #30 12" drill bit... One man's junk is another's
treasure. ;) Tools from the Philippines...gotta love it.
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
Current project: Doors/Windows
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Jim Robinette wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Jim Robinette" <jim@rvator.net>
>
> You would also expect a QB to be free from FOD! I bought my QB fuse and
> wings direct from Van's. Put the fuse on Jeff Bordeleon's rotisserie
> only find all kinds of items such as rusted clecos, pop rivets, regular
> rivets and some scrap aluminum to fall out. Not that significant, until
> there was more clanking beneath the floorboards that couldn't be
> stopped. Now I have to either deal with FOD under the seats or drill
> out the floorboards to remove it.
>
> Most people wouldn't find this FOD unless they flipped their QB fuse
> over. Seems there needs to be a little better quality control in the
> PI!
>
> Jim
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Skylor Piper
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Canopy - Ed Holyoke's Rant
>
> --- Ed Holyoke <bicyclop@pacbell.net> wrote:
>
>
>>>One could also expect that a
>>
>>jig-built quickbuild
>>would be straight...
>
>
>
> Isn't that the truth!
>
> Skylor
> RV-8 QB, Under Construction
>
> Do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 45
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|
Subject: | Re: Cross-Country Route SF to SEA |
--> RV-List message posted by: Henry Hochberg <aeroncadoc@comcast.net>
Weather permitting, take the coastal route, generally lower MEA's if you
do have to file IFR and the views are superb. If not, again weather
permitting, go west of the cascades and RON in McMinnville. Get a tour
of the spruce goose museum.
An IFR biplane.......couldn't be a Staggerwing, that would be too fast.
Henry H.
Piavis wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Piavis" <piavis@pacbell.net>
>
>I'm looking at taking a low & slow biplane from the Bay Area to Seattle area
>in two weeks and was thinking of just following I-5 up north. Is it
>preferable to stay east of the Cascades until as far north as possible or
>just go IFR? Anyone have a good recommendation on an RON in the Portland
>Area or just south?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Jim
>-7 Fuse
>(Progress nil due to re-location)
>
>
>
>
Message 46
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|
Subject: | EZ-Pilot problem |
autolearn=no version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Well It wasnt easy, but I finally got it together. had to take the servo back out
and drill out the arm atach hole because somebody forgot to do it. Then on
fire up it pulled the stick almost max left and ocilated like crazy, and corections
were backward, no sweat, reading on I learned all I had to do was reverse
the servo. Ok did that, still on turn on it pulled the stick near max left,
in fact if I put that much control in it would have done a fast aileron roll.
Called for help, Oh all you have to do is disasemble the control arm off the servo
which instructions told you to glue on, then experiment with moveing the
arm around, crawling back in the plane and turning it on, then keep trying till
it might miraculisly center itelf. Wow! What a deal! for only $1800, you can
get an almost working unit! All you have to do is spend couple hundred dollars
worth of time and it might even work!!! What a peice of Shit!!!
Message 47
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|
Subject: | Re: Cross-Country Route SF to SEA |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Dean Van Winkle" <dvanwinkle@royell.net>
Piavis
If you want to RON in the Portland area, You might consider McMinnville, Or,
about 40 miles SW of Portland. The Evergreen Aviation Museum is right across
the road from the airport with the "Spruce Goose" and many other outstanding
aircraft. We were there just last month and would highly recommend it if you
haven't been there before. Have a safe journey!
Dean Van Winkle
RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
----- Original Message -----
From: "Piavis" <piavis@pacbell.net>
Subject: RV-List: Cross-Country Route SF to SEA
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Piavis" <piavis@pacbell.net>
>
> I'm looking at taking a low & slow biplane from the Bay Area to Seattle
> area
> in two weeks and was thinking of just following I-5 up north. Is it
> preferable to stay east of the Cascades until as far north as possible or
> just go IFR? Anyone have a good recommendation on an RON in the Portland
> Area or just south?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
> -7 Fuse
> (Progress nil due to re-location)
>
>
>
Message 48
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|
Subject: | Re: Aileron pushrod and wing mounting |
--> RV-List message posted by: HCRV6@aol.com
In a message dated 8/14/05 8:11:07 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
jorear@new.rr.com writes:
> My plan has been to get the wings mounted and then make up my pushrods and
> fish them through the wing via the lightening holes. I figure that once I
> get them to the bellcrank, I can finish getting them into the fuselage by
> grabbing them at the aileron bellcrank access.
>
That's exactly how I did it and it worked fine for me. Wrap them with
masking tape to
avoid scratching them as you feed them through the lightening holes. Don't
cut the
inboard end until the first trial fit, then you can see just how long they
need to be.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 118 hours
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