Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:00 AM - Re: Fairings, Etc, for Horizontal Stab (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
2. 05:26 AM - Re: Fairings, Etc, for Horizontal Stab (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
3. 06:57 AM - Cowl Flaps (Darrell Reiley)
4. 07:33 AM - Re: [RV7Yahoo] Life Insurance... (Bob Collins)
5. 07:41 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Tim Bryan)
6. 07:58 AM - Re: Re: [RV7Yahoo] Life Insurance... (J.T. Helms)
7. 08:13 AM - Extending a glide (Crosley, Rich)
8. 08:38 AM - Monday's Suck (Stephanie Marshall)
9. 08:50 AM - Altitude Blind Encoder For Sale (Crosley, Rich)
10. 09:11 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Brian Denk)
11. 09:42 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Tim Bryan)
12. 10:04 AM - Float type fuel gauge (AYRES, JIMMY L)
13. 10:06 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Sam Buchanan)
14. 10:14 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Brian Denk)
15. 10:23 AM - Re: Extending a glide (Pat Hatch)
16. 10:36 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Mickey Coggins)
17. 10:55 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Stein Bruch)
18. 10:56 AM - Re: Extending a glide (Scott Bilinski)
19. 11:04 AM - Re: Extending a glide (sportav8r@aol.com)
20. 11:21 AM - Re: Extending a glide (sportav8r@aol.com)
21. 11:39 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Terry Watson)
22. 11:39 AM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Ron Lee)
23. 12:02 PM - Trio update (sportav8r@aol.com)
24. 12:03 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Tim Bryan)
25. 12:31 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Stein Bruch)
26. 12:37 PM - Re: Free to good home: Van's fuel gauges (BRUCE GRAY)
27. 12:46 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
28. 01:19 PM - Re: Extending a glide (Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club)
29. 01:43 PM - Re: Trio update (Sam Buchanan)
30. 01:49 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Charlie England)
31. 02:25 PM - Re: Trio update (Ron Lee)
32. 02:28 PM - N1610P update (Ron Lee)
33. 02:55 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (randall)
34. 03:11 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (GMC)
35. 05:17 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (randall)
36. 06:24 PM - Re: SL30 Nav Antenna (Allen Fulmer)
37. 06:28 PM - Re: Extending a glide (Kevin Horton)
38. 06:48 PM - RPM drop! (Bruce Bell)
39. 07:03 PM - Stupid pilot tricks (charlie heathco)
40. 07:04 PM - Re: RPM drop! (Kyle Boatright)
41. 07:18 PM - Re: Extending a glide (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
42. 07:20 PM - Re: Extending a glide (charlie heathco)
43. 07:24 PM - Re: RPM drop! (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
44. 07:32 PM - Re: Trio update (charlie heathco)
45. 07:54 PM - Re: Extending a glide (Charlie England)
46. 07:54 PM - Re: Stupid pilot tricks (Mark Grieve)
47. 08:03 PM - Re: RPM drop! (Alex Peterson)
48. 08:04 PM - Re: Extending a glide (Doug Rozendaal)
49. 08:14 PM - Re: RPM drop! (charlie heathco)
50. 08:24 PM - Re: Extending a glide (Larry Bowen)
51. 08:25 PM - Re: Extending a glide (charlie heathco)
52. 08:27 PM - Re: Trio update (sportav8r@aol.com)
53. 08:35 PM - Re: Trio update (Vanremog@aol.com)
54. 08:48 PM - Re: Trio update (sportav8r@aol.com)
55. 08:58 PM - Re: Extending a glide (charlie heathco)
56. 09:00 PM - Re: Trio update (charlie heathco)
57. 09:53 PM - Re: Stupid pilot tricks (Chris W)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Fairings, Etc, for Horizontal Stab |
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
>>>>>
http://www.fairings-etc.com/
Mark - do not archive
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Fairings, Etc, for Horizontal Stab |
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
>>>>
Also look at:
http://websites.expercraft.com/n51pw/index.php?q=log_entry&log_id=5086
For a brief description on installation- click "next entry>>" at top of page.
If I'd have known the two major tricks I learned during the process, it
would have been installed and ready for paint in maybe two days- very happy with
the parts & the results. Excellent lower fairings were a big plus too...
No affiliation with Bob other than being a happy customer
Mark do not archive
Message 3
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--> RV-List message posted by: Darrell Reiley <lifeofreiley2003@yahoo.com>
Builders,
Do we have anyone who has installed cowl flaps with either the AFP or Bendix fuel
injection setup?
Darrell
Message 4
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| Subject: | RE: [RV7Yahoo] Life Insurance... |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob Collins" <bcollinsrv7a@comcast.net>
// Just curious, what Life Insurance companies are the "kindest" on their
rates to pilots?
The ones where the agents don't ask if you're a pilot. (g)
Bob
St. Paul
(son of life insurance agent)
Do not archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
my RV-6 is still in my shop at home and with tight quarters, I have been
walking around it for months. It hits me about chest level if I were to
walk into it. Why would this put an eye out. I see no issue other than
someone coming along and cutting it off with a hacksaw. I like it there and
it stays.
my opinion only.
Tim Bryan
-------Original Message-------
From: Brian Denk
Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
There is no reason I can think of to not put a cat whisker nav antenna under
the tail on an RV taildragger. Jeff Ludwig's wonderful (and Air Venture cup
winning) RV-8 had (sold it) this setup and it flew hard IFR for years
without any problems at all. Anyone who puts this kind of antenna on the
top of a taildragger RV vertical stab should be flogged for presenting a
clear and present safety danger to anyone on the ground. For a nosedragger
RV, it's OK, but taildragger, no way. I'd be looking for a hacksaw if I see
one. The vision you save may be your own.
My opinion only. But, show me where I'm wrong. There are no compromises
when it comes to safety.
Oh, the Archer antennas are terrific. I'm using them on my -10 when the
time comes.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
>Paul,
>
>With my SL-30, I used a Commant CI-158C mounted under the belly of
>the horizontal stabilizer.
>
>On the top of the vertical stabilizer, it may an "eye" poker,
>depending on your air frame.
>
>Richard Reynolds, RV-6A
>Norfolk, VA
>
>On Aug 20, 2005, at 9:35 AM, Paul Brown wrote:
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Brown" <nightmare@adelphia.net>
> >
> > Listers,
> >
> > What antenna are you using for the SL30 Nav side. I ordered the
> > Miller "wisker" antenna and the "hocky puck" is to big for the
> > vertical fin. I have a tail dragger and don't want to put it under
> > the tail.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> >
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | RE: [RV7Yahoo] Life Insurance... |
--> RV-List message posted by: "J.T. Helms" <jhelms@i1.net>
www.piclife.com
Bill Fanning is the principle. He uses Allstate affiliated companies. I
knew of him before getting into aircraft insurance myself.
JT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Collins
Subject: RV-List: RE: [RV7Yahoo] Life Insurance...
--> RV-List message posted by: "Bob Collins" <bcollinsrv7a@comcast.net>
// Just curious, what Life Insurance companies are the "kindest" on their
rates to pilots?
The ones where the agents don't ask if you're a pilot. (g)
Bob
St. Paul
(son of life insurance agent)
Do not archive
Message 7
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| Subject: | Extending a glide |
0.14 FROM_NO_LOWER From address has no lower-case characters
--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
Rich Crosley
RV-8 N948RC
Message 8
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Stephanie Marshall" <smarshall@enid.org>
I hope everyone had a good weekend, but I have some RV Widow's Diary bad news.
Somehow my server provider lost all of my guestbook entries, if you left a nice
message (OK even if you left a not so nice one) please leave a new one. :~)
www.rv-8a.4t.com
Cheers,
Stephanie
Message 9
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| Subject: | Altitude Blind Encoder For Sale |
0.14 FROM_NO_LOWER From address has no lower-case characters
--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Altitude Blind Encoder, Trans-Cal, SSD120-30A "NEW"
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=4570134
343&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you never
intend to let the public near your airplane.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>
>my RV-6 is still in my shop at home and with tight quarters, I have been
>walking around it for months. It hits me about chest level if I were to
>walk into it. Why would this put an eye out. I see no issue other than
>someone coming along and cutting it off with a hacksaw. I like it there
>and
>it stays.
>
>my opinion only.
>Tim Bryan
>
>-------Original Message-------
>
>From: Brian Denk
>Date: 08/21/05 16:12:39
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>
>There is no reason I can think of to not put a cat whisker nav antenna
>under
>the tail on an RV taildragger. Jeff Ludwig's wonderful (and Air Venture
>cup
>winning) RV-8 had (sold it) this setup and it flew hard IFR for years
>without any problems at all. Anyone who puts this kind of antenna on the
>top of a taildragger RV vertical stab should be flogged for presenting a
>clear and present safety danger to anyone on the ground. For a nosedragger
>RV, it's OK, but taildragger, no way. I'd be looking for a hacksaw if I
>see
>one. The vision you save may be your own.
>
>My opinion only. But, show me where I'm wrong. There are no compromises
>when it comes to safety.
>
>Oh, the Archer antennas are terrific. I'm using them on my -10 when the
>time comes.
>
>Brian Denk
>RV8 N94BD
>RV10 '51
>
>
> >Paul,
> >
> >With my SL-30, I used a Commant CI-158C mounted under the belly of
> >the horizontal stabilizer.
> >
> >On the top of the vertical stabilizer, it may an "eye" poker,
> >depending on your air frame.
> >
> >Richard Reynolds, RV-6A
> >Norfolk, VA
> >
> >On Aug 20, 2005, at 9:35 AM, Paul Brown wrote:
> >
> > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Brown" <nightmare@adelphia.net>
> > >
> > > Listers,
> > >
> > > What antenna are you using for the SL30 Nav side. I ordered the
> > > Miller "wisker" antenna and the "hocky puck" is to big for the
> > > vertical fin. I have a tail dragger and don't want to put it under
> > > the tail.
> > >
> > > Paul
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
Well, you might have a point - but then so does my prop, wing tips, and the
corner of my kitchen counter. I guess, being less visible I could hang a
remove before flight" flag on there.
Tim
Do not archive
-------Original Message-------
From: Brian Denk
Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you never
intend to let the public near your airplane.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>
>my RV-6 is still in my shop at home and with tight quarters, I have been
>walking around it for months. It hits me about chest level if I were to
>walk into it. Why would this put an eye out. I see no issue other than
>someone coming along and cutting it off with a hacksaw. I like it there
>and
>it stays.
>
>my opinion only.
>Tim Bryan
>
>-------Original Message-------
>
>From: Brian Denk
>Date: 08/21/05 16:12:39
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>
>There is no reason I can think of to not put a cat whisker nav antenna
>under
>the tail on an RV taildragger. Jeff Ludwig's wonderful (and Air Venture
>cup
>winning) RV-8 had (sold it) this setup and it flew hard IFR for years
>without any problems at all. Anyone who puts this kind of antenna on the
>top of a taildragger RV vertical stab should be flogged for presenting a
>clear and present safety danger to anyone on the ground. For a nosedragger
>RV, it's OK, but taildragger, no way. I'd be looking for a hacksaw if I
>see
>one. The vision you save may be your own.
>
>My opinion only. But, show me where I'm wrong. There are no compromises
>when it comes to safety.
>
>Oh, the Archer antennas are terrific. I'm using them on my -10 when the
>time comes.
>
>Brian Denk
>RV8 N94BD
>RV10 '51
>
>
> >Paul,
> >
> >With my SL-30, I used a Commant CI-158C mounted under the belly of
> >the horizontal stabilizer.
> >
> >On the top of the vertical stabilizer, it may an "eye" poker,
> >depending on your air frame.
> >
> >Richard Reynolds, RV-6A
> >Norfolk, VA
> >
> >On Aug 20, 2005, at 9:35 AM, Paul Brown wrote:
> >
> > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Brown" <nightmare@adelphia.net>
> > >
> > > Listers,
> > >
> > > What antenna are you using for the SL30 Nav side. I ordered the
> > > Miller "wisker" antenna and the "hocky puck" is to big for the
> > > vertical fin. I have a tail dragger and don't want to put it under
> > > the tail.
> > >
> > > Paul
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Float type fuel gauge |
--> RV-List message posted by: "AYRES, JIMMY L" <JAYRES@entergy.com>
Hey guys,
I just bought Van's float type fuel gauge & sender assembly for my RV7A. The only
installation instructions are the MFR's which show a top mount configuration.
Has anyone out there installed this type of sender & gauge? If so, can you
share with me how you did it? I'm thinking that I just need to set the wing
on a table in the "mounted on fuse" position and bend the float arm such that
it indicates empty when it is empty (or ideally with a little reserve). I saw
not adjustments for calibrating other than positioning the float. Any feedback
would be appreciated.
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<span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Hey guys,
<span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
<span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>I just bought Van's float type fuel gauge sender
assembly for my RV7A. The only installation instructions are the MFR's
which show a top mount configuration. Has anyone out there installed this
type of sender gauge? If so, can you share with me how you did
it? I'm thinking that I just need to set the wing on a table in the
"mounted on fuse" position and bend the float arm such that it
indicates empty when it is empty (or ideally with a little reserve). I
saw not adjustments for calibrating other than positioning the float. Any
feedback would be appreciated.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan <sbuc@hiwaay.net>
Brian Denk wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>
>
> It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you never
> intend to let the public near your airplane.
Ditto. In my opinion, a cat-whisker antenna above the horizontal stab is
a major no-no on a taildragger RV, primarily for the above stated
reason. Besides, it just looks ugly sticking out of the vertical stab. :-)
The cat-whiskers work very nicely under the horizontal stab and are much
less likely to inflict injury. But the Archer wingtip nav antenna works
splendidly on my RV-6 and is totally out of sight.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 690 hrs)
=====================
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>>
>>my RV-6 is still in my shop at home and with tight quarters, I have been
>>walking around it for months. It hits me about chest level if I were to
>>walk into it. Why would this put an eye out. I see no issue other than
>>someone coming along and cutting it off with a hacksaw. I like it there
>>and
>>it stays.
>>
>>my opinion only.
>>Tim Bryan
>>
>>-------Original Message-------
>>
>>From: Brian Denk
>>Date: 08/21/05 16:12:39
>>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>>
>>There is no reason I can think of to not put a cat whisker nav antenna
>>under
>>the tail on an RV taildragger. Jeff Ludwig's wonderful (and Air Venture
>>cup
>>winning) RV-8 had (sold it) this setup and it flew hard IFR for years
>>without any problems at all. Anyone who puts this kind of antenna on the
>>top of a taildragger RV vertical stab should be flogged for presenting a
>>clear and present safety danger to anyone on the ground. For a nosedragger
>>RV, it's OK, but taildragger, no way. I'd be looking for a hacksaw if I
>>see
>>one. The vision you save may be your own.
>>
>>My opinion only. But, show me where I'm wrong. There are no compromises
>>when it comes to safety.
>>
>>Oh, the Archer antennas are terrific. I'm using them on my -10 when the
>>time comes.
>>
>>Brian Denk
>>RV8 N94BD
>>RV10 '51
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
The "remove before flight" streamer would be a good idea. A chunk of foam
slipped over the pointy eye pokers with the streamers attached would greatly
reduce the hazard. The other pointy bits on the aircraft are larger and
*hopefully* more visible to the younguns so as to avoid damage to themselves
or the airframe. I try to orient my prop in the roughly 2 and 8 o'clock
positions when parked as well.
Sorry to go off on a safety rant on ya but if my son were to lose an eye
from something like this, I would go totally ballistic.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/9656/akroshomepage.htm
>From: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 09:38:18 -0700 (Pacific Standard Time)
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>
>Well, you might have a point - but then so does my prop, wing tips, and the
>corner of my kitchen counter. I guess, being less visible I could hang a
>remove before flight" flag on there.
>
>Tim
>Do not archive
>
>-------Original Message-------
>
>From: Brian Denk
>Date: 08/22/05 09:16:51
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>
>
>It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you never
>intend to let the public near your airplane.
>
>
>Brian Denk
>RV8 N94BD
>RV10 '51
>
>
> >
> >--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
> >
> >my RV-6 is still in my shop at home and with tight quarters, I have been
> >walking around it for months. It hits me about chest level if I were to
> >walk into it. Why would this put an eye out. I see no issue other than
> >someone coming along and cutting it off with a hacksaw. I like it there
> >and
> >it stays.
> >
> >my opinion only.
> >Tim Bryan
> >
> >-------Original Message-------
> >
> >From: Brian Denk
> >Date: 08/21/05 16:12:39
> >To: rv-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
> >
> >--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
> >
> >There is no reason I can think of to not put a cat whisker nav antenna
> >under
> >the tail on an RV taildragger. Jeff Ludwig's wonderful (and Air Venture
> >cup
> >winning) RV-8 had (sold it) this setup and it flew hard IFR for years
> >without any problems at all. Anyone who puts this kind of antenna on the
> >top of a taildragger RV vertical stab should be flogged for presenting a
> >clear and present safety danger to anyone on the ground. For a
>nosedragger
> >RV, it's OK, but taildragger, no way. I'd be looking for a hacksaw if I
> >see
> >one. The vision you save may be your own.
> >
> >My opinion only. But, show me where I'm wrong. There are no compromises
> >when it comes to safety.
> >
> >Oh, the Archer antennas are terrific. I'm using them on my -10 when the
> >time comes.
> >
> >Brian Denk
> >RV8 N94BD
> >RV10 '51
> >
> >
> > >Paul,
> > >
> > >With my SL-30, I used a Commant CI-158C mounted under the belly of
> > >the horizontal stabilizer.
> > >
> > >On the top of the vertical stabilizer, it may an "eye" poker,
> > >depending on your air frame.
> > >
> > >Richard Reynolds, RV-6A
> > >Norfolk, VA
> > >
> > >On Aug 20, 2005, at 9:35 AM, Paul Brown wrote:
> > >
> > > > --> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Brown" <nightmare@adelphia.net>
> > > >
> > > > Listers,
> > > >
> > > > What antenna are you using for the SL30 Nav side. I ordered the
> > > > Miller "wisker" antenna and the "hocky puck" is to big for the
> > > > vertical fin. I have a tail dragger and don't want to put it under
> > > > the tail.
> > > >
> > > > Paul
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch@msn.com>
OK, Rich this ought to be a real barn burner, but here's what I would do:
first go from full flaps to half flaps (first half mostly lift, last half
mostly drag), if you have a c/s prop, go to full coarse setting (all the way
out) in the hope that you have enough windmilling oil pressure to increase
your blade angle. If the prop stops, don't worry about it, just land
straight ahead.
Pat Hatch
RV-6
RV-7
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Crosley, Rich
Subject: RV-List: Extending a glide
--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich"
<RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
Rich Crosley
RV-8 N948RC
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
What I've seen work is a small bit of plastic tubing stuck on
the end of the whisker. Makes it a bit more visible, and not
so dangerous if a child hits it with their eye.
> Well, you might have a point - but then so does my prop, wing tips, and the
> corner of my kitchen counter. I guess, being less visible I could hang a
> remove before flight" flag on there.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
Message 17
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| Subject: | SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Here's the deal....I stayed out of this discussion because I didn't want to
sound biased (and due to the fact that my notes usually come across the
wrong way and get someone upset), but the fact of the matter is there is no
demonstrable reason to put cat whiskers on these RV's at all. It's been my
experience and the overall general concensous of the RV crowd is that the
Wingtip NAV antennas work just fine, as do the wingtip Mkr Beacon Antennas.
The Wingtip antennas are cheaper, drag free, and overall a cleaner
installation. I'm not knocking those who have cat whiskers, but I still
struggle to understand exactly why when there is a better alternative out
there.
I did see one post in this thread where the "wingtip antennas" were
obviously confused between the COMM and NAV installations. The ones that
aren't that great in RV's are the COMM antennas, the bent whips are far
superior in that regard - but the wingtip Nav's work just fine. Vertical
polarization (as required by the COMM antennas) is difficult within the
confines of the RV wingtips, but the horizontal polarization (as required by
the NAV's) fits great in the RV wingtips.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents for now!
Cheers,
Stein.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
--> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan <sbuc@hiwaay.net>
Brian Denk wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>
>
> It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you
never
> intend to let the public near your airplane.
Ditto. In my opinion, a cat-whisker antenna above the horizontal stab is
a major no-no on a taildragger RV, primarily for the above stated
reason. Besides, it just looks ugly sticking out of the vertical stab. :-)
The cat-whiskers work very nicely under the horizontal stab and are much
less likely to inflict injury. But the Archer wingtip nav antenna works
splendidly on my RV-6 and is totally out of sight.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 690 hrs)
=====================
Message 18
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| Subject: | Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
Hmmm, you want distance, which means no flaps........right? I would say no
flaps and point the nose at the edge of the airport property and decide if
you can make it by monitoring the glide/speed. If you can make the airport
property and have enough speed and alt, point the nose to the end of the
runway. Too high, slip it. Get close to the ground (100 ft?), full flaps.
What does everyone think?
At 01:19 PM 8/22/2005 -0400, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch@msn.com>
>
>OK, Rich this ought to be a real barn burner, but here's what I would do:
>first go from full flaps to half flaps (first half mostly lift, last half
>mostly drag), if you have a c/s prop, go to full coarse setting (all the way
>out) in the hope that you have enough windmilling oil pressure to increase
>your blade angle. If the prop stops, don't worry about it, just land
>straight ahead.
>
>Pat Hatch
>RV-6
>RV-7
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Crosley, Rich
>To: 'rv-list@matronics.com'
>Subject: RV-List: Extending a glide
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich"
><RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
>
>Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
>base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
>have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
>Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
>much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
>
>
>Rich Crosley
>RV-8 N948RC
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
Rich;
It's not an 8; it's a 6A, but no matter ;-)
I'd raise flaps all the way and cut the turn inside to get to the threshold by
the shortest route. An RV flies fine without flaps at normal downwind speeds
(80-90 mph) and you can always crank in a sideslip and flaps if the above maneuver
brings you in high and hot. RV's with flaps deployed at 65 mph have nearly
the glide angle of a manhole cover. You don't usually need that in an engine-out
scenario in the pattern.
My 2 cents' worth.
-Stormy
-----Original Message-----
From: Crosley, Rich <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Subject: RV-List: Extending a glide
--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
Rich Crosley
RV-8 N948RC
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
Rich:
not that I don't stand by my earlier post, but here's a more thought-out and concise
reply:
Know thy airplane. Experiment and practice.
>>but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.<<
I don't know of anyone who ever stretched a glide by adding flaps, but maybe your
airframe is different. Unless you've flown the test, you won't know. And
unless you've practiced the maneuver many times, the engine-out landing will be
fraught with unknown perils. Ever since learning how to do overhead approaches
to landing in my RV, they've become my preferred method at the home strip,
so much so that I really suck at conventional rectangular patterns into strips
where I don't remember the field elevation off hand. But I know that if I can
hit the "key spot" at 600-800 feet agl, whether at 200+ mph or at 90, I can
nail an overhead-to-landing without using more than idle power. To me, that's
good "insurance."
Oh, my. Did I say "concise reply"? And you believed me ;-)
-Stormy
bored at work; all the kiddos are back in school today!
-----Original Message-----
From: Crosley, Rich <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Subject: RV-List: Extending a glide
--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
Rich Crosley
RV-8 N948RC
Message 21
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| Subject: | SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
Stein, others
I have tip tanks, or the wingtips modified to have the capacity for about 9
gallons of gas in each of them, built by Jon Johanson and sold by Van's. I
have always assumed that this means than I don't have any space for wingtip
antennas but since I have never actually seen an installation, maybe there
is a way. Does anyone know?
Thanks,
Terry
RV-8A #80729 finishing
Seattle
Here's the deal....I stayed out of this discussion because I didn't want to
sound biased (and due to the fact that my notes usually come across the
wrong way and get someone upset), but the fact of the matter is there is no
demonstrable reason to put cat whiskers on these RV's at all. >> snip
Cheers,
Stein.
Message 22
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| Subject: | SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
>Here's the deal....I stayed out of this discussion because I didn't want to
>sound biased (and due to the fact that my notes usually come across the
>wrong way and get someone upset)
I will be upset so as not to disappoint you. I have some sort of aluminum
strip
VOR antennae in my left wingtip. Not sure what brand. I will take a pic and
post that later but as Stein and others noted, it works just fine and has
all the
advantages he mentioned.
Also be aware that GPS approaches are becoming more common and are mucho
easier to follow.
OK, I am no longer upset.
Ron Lee
do not archive
Message 23
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--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
I flew my new Trio EZ pilot A/P with the new GPS connected for the first time yesterday,
and was that ever sweet! Kinda spooky to see invisible hands flying
your airplane for the first time in 500 hours. I'm easily impressed, but having
two brand new boxes in the cockpit with me on a test flight, I couldn't help
but be.
I'm still exploring the capabilities of the Trio, but it tracks a flight plan,
does the emergency 180, and holds a course well, and is a functional wing-leveler
even without GPS input. Installation was very straightforward and uncomplicated.
The Garmin 296 manual took all day Saturday and half the day Sunday to
pore over, but I think I am now capable of putting that unit through most of
its paces. The UPS man brought me a data cable last week for it, and a Panel
Dock form AirGizmos today, so by tonight it should be in my panel like it belongs
there, instead of dangling from a bunch of wires like yesterday ;-)
I had the EZ-Pilot follow a 90-degree turn at a flight plan waypoint, and the overshoot
to the outside of the turn was about 0.8nm at 150 mph, with a secondary
overshoot to the inside of 0.12nm before it locked onto the new heading outbound.
This is no doubt due to the 15 degree bank limiting default setting, so
I will play with the gain a bit on subsequent flights. Thanks, Sam B., for
your earlier suggestion of gain values. I plan to look them up and use them as
starting points.
-Stormy
very happy Garmin and Trio customer
Message 24
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| Subject: | SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
Hi Stein,
Doesn't strike me wrong at all. I started my -6 15 years ago when I had to
wait for a kit to be developed. I installed the whisker in the VS top prior
to knowing of any options. I have taken sooooo long to build this thing and
now I am ready to get it done and flying. I am not changing anything for
this reason. I may make some changes later after it flys but not at this
point.
My airplane is set up for IFR and I reasoned at the time, I did not want to
sacrifice reception for a knot or two of antenna sticking out. These days
and with my GPS, it really isn't a factor.
Thanks for your input however and the others as well. I may stick a flag on
it for when it is parked.
Tim Bryan
RV-6 received the tail kit in 1990
Flying in about a month - two
N616TB
-------Original Message-------
From: Stein Bruch
Subject: RE: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Here's the deal....I stayed out of this discussion because I didn't want to
sound biased (and due to the fact that my notes usually come across the
wrong way and get someone upset), but the fact of the matter is there is no
demonstrable reason to put cat whiskers on these RV's at all. It's been my
experience and the overall general concensous of the RV crowd is that the
Wingtip NAV antennas work just fine, as do the wingtip Mkr Beacon Antennas.
The Wingtip antennas are cheaper, drag free, and overall a cleaner
installation. I'm not knocking those who have cat whiskers, but I still
struggle to understand exactly why when there is a better alternative out
there.
I did see one post in this thread where the "wingtip antennas" were
obviously confused between the COMM and NAV installations. The ones that
aren't that great in RV's are the COMM antennas, the bent whips are far
superior in that regard - but the wingtip Nav's work just fine. Vertical
polarization (as required by the COMM antennas) is difficult within the
confines of the RV wingtips, but the horizontal polarization (as required by
the NAV's) fits great in the RV wingtips.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents for now!
Cheers,
Stein.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
--> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan <sbuc@hiwaay.net>
Brian Denk wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>
>
> It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you
never
> intend to let the public near your airplane.
Ditto. In my opinion, a cat-whisker antenna above the horizontal stab is
a major no-no on a taildragger RV, primarily for the above stated
reason. Besides, it just looks ugly sticking out of the vertical stab. :-)
The cat-whiskers work very nicely under the horizontal stab and are much
less likely to inflict injury. But the Archer wingtip nav antenna works
splendidly on my RV-6 and is totally out of sight.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 690 hrs)
Message 25
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| Subject: | SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Ah-Ha! That would be what I mean when I say a "demonstrable reason". If
your tip tanks are full of gas, then it's hard to put the antenna inside,
hence your specific reason for doing otherwise. Good point!
Cheers,
Stein.
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Terry Watson
Subject: RE: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
Stein, others
I have tip tanks, or the wingtips modified to have the capacity for about 9
gallons of gas in each of them, built by Jon Johanson and sold by Van's. I
have always assumed that this means than I don't have any space for wingtip
antennas but since I have never actually seen an installation, maybe there
is a way. Does anyone know?
Thanks,
Terry
RV-8A #80729 finishing
Seattle
Here's the deal....I stayed out of this discussion because I didn't want to
sound biased (and due to the fact that my notes usually come across the
wrong way and get someone upset), but the fact of the matter is there is no
demonstrable reason to put cat whiskers on these RV's at all. >> snip
Cheers,
Stein.
Message 26
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| Subject: | Free to good home: Van's fuel gauges |
--> RV-List message posted by: "BRUCE GRAY" <brucerv84us@hotmail.com>
Greg,
Working on an 8 Fuse right now and would like to start collecting cockpit
hardware. I take them if you have no-boby yet.
Contact me - brucerv8@charter.net
Bruce Gray
RV8 Fuse
>From: Greg Grigson <iflyhawaii2@yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Free to good home: Van's fuel gauges
>Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 11:52:45 -0700 (PDT)
>
>--> RV-List message posted by: Greg Grigson <iflyhawaii2@yahoo.com>
>
>
>I've got two Van's type fuel gauges that I don't need.
> Contact me off line if you're interested in springing
>for the postage of about $5-$10.
>
>Greg in Honolulu
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com
Hi Ron, that nav antenna is the Bob Archer model we installed with the 430.
I am doing the same on our 7A & 10.
Take care.
Doug
RV7 N731RV
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
refid=0001.0A090203.430A2F86.0024-B-E41Z/xXvy0umUMl9fvtv7w==,
ip=209.107.238.85,
so=2005-07-14 09:05:58,
dmn=2005-05-20 17:56:59
--> RV-List message posted by: "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson@consolidated.net>
Crosley, Rich wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
>
>Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
>base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
>have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
>Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
>much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
>
>
>Rich Crosley
>RV-8 N948RC
>
>
Wow..... what a question.... This is going to get some good answers I
bet... Read them all and come up with a good procedure for your self.
So far we are all hitting close to the same....
Here's my two cents worth. It is virtually the same as the others. At a
half mile out and turning base, you are probably not too bad off in the
first place if you are still nearly at pattern altitude.. Like one
poster said, turn at that time toward the end of the runway.
I would lift all flaps and drop the nose, you may have to grit your
teeth to do it, but dont try to extend the glide by slowing down. With
the plane now cleaned up, I would aim short of the runway in order to
pick up some extra speed while I still had the altitude to do it. If all
went well, you may have to bleed off some speed and alt with flaps,
slips and/or both.
Good question to keep us all awake...
Phil in Illinois
Message 29
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--> RV-List message posted by: Sam Buchanan <sbuc@hiwaay.net>
Congratulations on the new toys, Stormy! Sounds like your EZ-Pilot and
Garmin are doing their stuff as designed.
Try gain settings of "2" and "1". This works well with my RV-6. If you
want a more aggressive turn-in to a new course, you can set the bank
angle to "standard rate" (I'm assuming the software hasn't changed since
I last set my unit); however, this results in a substantial bank at RV
cruise speeds and was more sporty than I wanted to see if I was using
the unit in clouds. I have mine set where the shallow bank angle
transitions to standard rate below 105 kts. Someone who routinely flies
the unit in IFR opps might want a little higher threshold so ATC will
see the turn rates they expect. The programmability of the EZ-Pilot is
really cool!
Have fun!
Sam Buchanan
http://thervjournal.com
===========================================
sportav8r@aol.com wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
>
> I flew my new Trio EZ pilot A/P with the new GPS connected for the
> first time yesterday, and was that ever sweet! Kinda spooky to see
> invisible hands flying your airplane for the first time in 500 hours.
> I'm easily impressed, but having two brand new boxes in the cockpit
> with me on a test flight, I couldn't help but be.
>
> I'm still exploring the capabilities of the Trio, but it tracks a
> flight plan, does the emergency 180, and holds a course well, and is
> a functional wing-leveler even without GPS input. Installation was
> very straightforward and uncomplicated. The Garmin 296 manual took
> all day Saturday and half the day Sunday to pore over, but I think I
> am now capable of putting that unit through most of its paces. The
> UPS man brought me a data cable last week for it, and a Panel Dock
> form AirGizmos today, so by tonight it should be in my panel like it
> belongs there, instead of dangling from a bunch of wires like
> yesterday ;-)
>
> I had the EZ-Pilot follow a 90-degree turn at a flight plan waypoint,
> and the overshoot to the outside of the turn was about 0.8nm at 150
> mph, with a secondary overshoot to the inside of 0.12nm before it
> locked onto the new heading outbound. This is no doubt due to the 15
> degree bank limiting default setting, so I will play with the gain a
> bit on subsequent flights. Thanks, Sam B., for your earlier
> suggestion of gain values. I plan to look them up and use them as
> starting points.
>
> -Stormy
>
> very happy Garmin and Trio customer
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
No intent to beat up on you, but I'd also consider the fact that there
will be occasions when you (& others) will be near the a/c but not in
normal standing mode. Washing the plane, removing fairings, another
builder looking at what a great job you did fitting the various
fairings, etc.
Murphy is a constant companion around aircraft.
Charlie
Brian Denk wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>
>The "remove before flight" streamer would be a good idea. A chunk of foam
>slipped over the pointy eye pokers with the streamers attached would greatly
>reduce the hazard. The other pointy bits on the aircraft are larger and
>*hopefully* more visible to the younguns so as to avoid damage to themselves
>or the airframe. I try to orient my prop in the roughly 2 and 8 o'clock
>positions when parked as well.
>
>Sorry to go off on a safety rant on ya but if my son were to lose an eye
>from something like this, I would go totally ballistic.
>
>Brian Denk
>RV8 N94BD
>RV10 '51
>
>
>http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/9656/akroshomepage.htm
>
>
>
>
>>From: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>>Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com
>>To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
>>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>>Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 09:38:18 -0700 (Pacific Standard Time)
>>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>>
>>Well, you might have a point - but then so does my prop, wing tips, and the
>>corner of my kitchen counter. I guess, being less visible I could hang a
>>remove before flight" flag on there.
>>
>>Tim
>>Do not archive
>>
>>-------Original Message-------
>>
>>From: Brian Denk
>>Date: 08/22/05 09:16:51
>>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>>
>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>>
>>
>>It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you never
>>intend to let the public near your airplane.
>>
>>
>>Brian Denk
>>RV8 N94BD
>>RV10 '51
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
>>>
>>>my RV-6 is still in my shop at home and with tight quarters, I have been
>>>walking around it for months. It hits me about chest level if I were to
>>>walk into it. Why would this put an eye out. I see no issue other than
>>>someone coming along and cutting it off with a hacksaw. I like it there
>>>and
>>>it stays.
>>>
>>>my opinion only.
>>>Tim Bryan
>>>
>>>-------Original Message-------
>>>
>>>From: Brian Denk
>>>Date: 08/21/05 16:12:39
>>>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>>>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
>>>
>>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
>>>
>>>There is no reason I can think of to not put a cat whisker nav antenna
>>>under
>>>the tail on an RV taildragger. Jeff Ludwig's wonderful (and Air Venture
>>>cup
>>>winning) RV-8 had (sold it) this setup and it flew hard IFR for years
>>>without any problems at all. Anyone who puts this kind of antenna on the
>>>top of a taildragger RV vertical stab should be flogged for presenting a
>>>clear and present safety danger to anyone on the ground. For a
>>>
>>>
>>nosedragger
>>
>>
>>>RV, it's OK, but taildragger, no way. I'd be looking for a hacksaw if I
>>>see
>>>one. The vision you save may be your own.
>>>
>>>My opinion only. But, show me where I'm wrong. There are no compromises
>>>when it comes to safety.
>>>
>>>Oh, the Archer antennas are terrific. I'm using them on my -10 when the
>>>time comes.
>>>
>>>Brian Denk
>>>RV8 N94BD
>>>RV10 '51
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Paul,
>>>>
>>>>With my SL-30, I used a Commant CI-158C mounted under the belly of
>>>>the horizontal stabilizer.
>>>>
>>>>On the top of the vertical stabilizer, it may an "eye" poker,
>>>>depending on your air frame.
>>>>
>>>>Richard Reynolds, RV-6A
>>>>Norfolk, VA
>>>>
>>>>On Aug 20, 2005, at 9:35 AM, Paul Brown wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Brown" <nightmare@adelphia.net>
>>>>>
>>>>>Listers,
>>>>>
>>>>>What antenna are you using for the SL30 Nav side. I ordered the
>>>>>Miller "wisker" antenna and the "hocky puck" is to big for the
>>>>>vertical fin. I have a tail dragger and don't want to put it under
>>>>>the tail.
>>>>>
>>>>>Paul
>>>>>
Message 31
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--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
Stormy,
Does your stick move left/right at a 1 Hertz rate? Both
Rick G and I have that situation. Mine does not have the
GPS input yet so that may be a factor but Rick does have
GPS input.
I did chat with Trio about it and they have a possible solution
so I am not overly concerned yet and until I see if it still does
that once I provide a GPS input.
Ron Lee
Message 32
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--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
Stay tuned for an exciting announcement. Hopefully within a week.
Tee hee
Ron
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "randall" <rv6n6r@comcast.net>
I have to jump in and support Brian on this one... your prop, wingtips and
kitchen counter are not likely to poke some kid's eye out if you forget to
put the remove before flight streamer on them some day. Your cat whiskers
are. If there were no other place to put it that would be one thing but it
just seems nutty to do it that way when a much better solution is available.
Plus you'll never have to hassle with that extra remove before flight
streamer.
Speaking as as someone who's logged numerous ILS approaches in my RV-6
taildragger with cat whisker antenna under the tail.
Randall Henderson
RV-6
> >>Well, you might have a point - but then so does my prop, wing tips, and
the
> >>corner of my kitchen counter. I guess, being less visible I could hang
a
> >>remove before flight" flag on there.
> >>
> >>Tim
> >>Do not archive
> >>
> >>-------Original Message-------
> >>
> >>From: Brian Denk
> >>Date: 08/22/05 09:16:51
> >>To: rv-list@matronics.com
> >>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
> >>
> >>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
> >>
> >>
> >>It hits YOU at chest level. It could hit a CHILD'S face. Unless you
never
> >>intend to let the public near your airplane.
> >>
> >>
> >>Brian Denk
> >>RV8 N94BD
> >>RV10 '51
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com>
> >>>
> >>>my RV-6 is still in my shop at home and with tight quarters, I have
been
> >>>walking around it for months. It hits me about chest level if I were
to
> >>>walk into it. Why would this put an eye out. I see no issue other
than
> >>>someone coming along and cutting it off with a hacksaw. I like it
there
> >>>and
> >>>it stays.
> >>>
> >>>my opinion only.
> >>>Tim Bryan
> >>>
> >>>-------Original Message-------
> >>>
> >>>From: Brian Denk
> >>>Date: 08/21/05 16:12:39
> >>>To: rv-list@matronics.com
> >>>Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
> >>>
> >>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" <akroguy@hotmail.com>
> >>>
> >>>There is no reason I can think of to not put a cat whisker nav antenna
> >>>under
> >>>the tail on an RV taildragger. Jeff Ludwig's wonderful (and Air
Venture
> >>>cup
> >>>winning) RV-8 had (sold it) this setup and it flew hard IFR for years
> >>>without any problems at all. Anyone who puts this kind of antenna on
the
> >>>top of a taildragger RV vertical stab should be flogged for presenting
a
> >>>clear and present safety danger to anyone on the ground. For a
> >>>
> >>>
> >>nosedragger
> >>
> >>
> >>>RV, it's OK, but taildragger, no way. I'd be looking for a hacksaw if
I
> >>>see
> >>>one. The vision you save may be your own.
> >>>
> >>>My opinion only. But, show me where I'm wrong. There are no
compromises
> >>>when it comes to safety.
> >>>
> >>>Oh, the Archer antennas are terrific. I'm using them on my -10 when
the
> >>>time comes.
> >>>
> >>>Brian Denk
> >>>RV8 N94BD
> >>>RV10 '51
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Paul,
> >>>>
> >>>>With my SL-30, I used a Commant CI-158C mounted under the belly of
> >>>>the horizontal stabilizer.
> >>>>
> >>>>On the top of the vertical stabilizer, it may an "eye" poker,
> >>>>depending on your air frame.
> >>>>
> >>>>Richard Reynolds, RV-6A
> >>>>Norfolk, VA
> >>>>
> >>>>On Aug 20, 2005, at 9:35 AM, Paul Brown wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>--> RV-List message posted by: "Paul Brown" <nightmare@adelphia.net>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Listers,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>What antenna are you using for the SL30 Nav side. I ordered the
> >>>>>Miller "wisker" antenna and the "hocky puck" is to big for the
> >>>>>vertical fin. I have a tail dragger and don't want to put it under
> >>>>>the tail.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Paul
> >>>>>
>
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: GMC <gmcnutt@shaw.ca>
No reason that the cats whiskers could not face forward as they do on
some production aircraft.
Do not archive
George in Langley BC
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "randall" <rv6n6r@comcast.net>
Cept on a taildragger they're much more likely to catch grass or thicker
stuff.
Randall
----- Original Message -----
From: "GMC" <gmcnutt@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
> --> RV-List message posted by: GMC <gmcnutt@shaw.ca>
>
>
> No reason that the cats whiskers could not face forward as they do on
> some production aircraft.
>
> Do not archive
>
> George in Langley BC
>
>
Message 36
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| Subject: | SL30 Nav Antenna |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
Here is the same question I asked of Bob Archer and his reply.
I still want to try it and will probably talk to Bob directly when I am
ready to start on my tip tanks.
Bob's reply followed by my question to him:
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Archer [mailto:bobsantennas@earthlink.net]
Subject: Re: Nav Antenna question
----- Original Message -----
From: "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer@charter.net>
Subject: Nav Antenna question
Hi Allen;
There are a couple of problems on doing the type installation you propose.
If you completly embed the antenna in fiber glass the velocity factor of the
fiber glass would make the antenna look much larger ( the fiber glass slows
down the passage of RF by a factor of about 30% ) so it would be detuned but
the amount could only be determined by testing after the installation. If
the feed area were to be embeded I don't know what the effect would be on
the series capacitor either. That is a very sensitive area. If you want to
try it I would suggest measureing on the centerline of the embeded portion
of the antenna strips and reduce the length by 30%. It might work ok but I
sure wouldn't want to ensure it.
Yes the Sa-001 will work with a two set coupler, Glide slope will also.
Also yes on using a single Com antenna with the Sa-010 T/R Switch. On
installing the switch you do have to connect the micophone key lines to the
switch. I have sold quite a few of these switches to Lancair IV builders
that report they get reception of about 200 miles at high altitudes.
I hope your questions got satisfactorily answered.
Regards
Bob
> Hello Bob,
>
> Allen Fulmer here again with another question.
>
> The SA-001 Wing tip VOR antenna. Being passive, do you see any problems
if
> I mount it in the RV7 wing tip and then proceed to convert the wing tip
into
> a fuel tank? The antenna would be sandwiched between fiberglass on the
> bottom of the wing tip with 12 gallons of fuel above it. I don't see any
> problem with connections as there will be a fiberglass baffle about an
inch
> in from the outboard wing rib and the antenna can still be mounted between
> the aluminum skin and wing tip to for grounding purposes. What do you
> think?
>
> Also, will one SA-001 feed two NAV radios? Is it as simple as installing
a
> "splitter" in the coax near the radios?
>
> I am thinking a bent whip mounted on the belly would be best for COM.
Does
> one antenna normally (and satisfactorily) feed two transceivers using one
of
> your T/R switches?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Allen Fulmer
> RV7 Wings (QB Fuse on hand)
> N808AF reserved
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Terry Watson
Subject: RE: RV-List: SL30 Nav Antenna
--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
Stein, others
I have tip tanks, or the wingtips modified to have the capacity for about 9
gallons of gas in each of them, built by Jon Johanson and sold by Van's. I
have always assumed that this means than I don't have any space for wingtip
antennas but since I have never actually seen an installation, maybe there
is a way. Does anyone know?
Thanks,
Terry
RV-8A #80729 finishing
Seattle
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorton01@rogers.com>
On 22 Aug 2005, at 11:02, Crosley, Rich wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich"
> <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
>
> Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps
> turning
> base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure
> that you
> have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as
> possible.
> Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if
> so how
> much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
>
As you know, the glide ratio (i.e the distance travelled for a given
amount of altitude) will be better with the flaps up than with them
extended, assuming that you are at the best glide speed for each
configuration. So, at the moment that the engine failed, if you were
at the best glide speed for flaps up, or faster, there is an
advantage to raising the flaps, no matter what your altitude is.
But, if you are flying slower than the best glide speed for flaps up,
you are going to need to push over to accelerate, and you will lose
some altitude to do this. At the moment where you attain the best
glide speed for flaps up, you will probably be below the flight path
you would have followed if you had just left the flaps down. But the
improved glide performance with flaps up will soon let you get above
the flight path you would have followed if you had left the flaps down.
If you were flying below the stall speed for flaps up when the engine
failed (which is a lot slower than you should be flying on final),
you could still raise the flaps, but you would have to push as you
did so, to keep the angle of attack less than the stalling angle of
attack. This implies that you will be at much less than one g load
factor, and you will be falling from the sky like the proverbial
brick until you get some speed back and can then allow the g to
increase. This would be a bad situation if you were at low altitude,
as you might not get enough speed to allow you to pull g and break
the rate of descent before you hit the ground.
In general, for any given speed, there is an altitude at which it
doesn't matter whether you retract the flaps or leave them down - you
will hit the ground at the same point. If you are above this
altitude, it makes sense to retract the flaps. If you are below this
altitude it makes sense to leave them down.
All of the above assumes you know the speed for best glide ratio with
the flaps up and down, and that you know the stall speed for flaps up
and down. You should have determined all those numbers during your
flight test program. Then you should simulate engine failures
starting from various conditions. Put the flaps down, stabilize at
airspeed X using whatever rpm you normally use on base leg. Then
pull the throttle to idle, push over, retract the flaps, and note how
much altitude you lose before you get to best glide speed for flaps
up. Add a bit of a buffer to this altitude, and it will give you a
reasonable minimum altitude at which you should consider retracting
the flaps. Repeat this at different airspeeds, and note how the
altitude required to achieve best glide speed varies with the speed
at engine failure.
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8
Message 38
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Bruce Bell" <brucebell74@sbcglobal.net>
I have an O-320 with dual Electroair Ignition Systems and Airflow Fuel
injection. What drop should I expect with one system off? My Operator's
Manual for the O-320 with fixed pitch prop call for a RPM of 2000/2100 max
drop of 175 RPM and not more than 50 RPM between magnetos on the before T/O
Check list. What are others getting?
Best regards,
Bruce Bell
Lubbock, Texas
RV4 N23BB #2888
Message 39
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| Subject: | Stupid pilot tricks |
autolearn=unavailable version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Anybody else see the story on AvWeb about the C-210 that struck a tree on takeoff
with 2 mechanics aboard, tearing off 5 ft of wing and a gas tank. They flew
2 hrs befor they ran low on fuel an noticed the problem? Pilot said he thought
he struck a bird! Do not archive
Message 40
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Kyle Boatright" <kboatright1@comcast.net>
I have one mag and one Electroair. I do most of my runups at 1500 RPM.
Higher than that, and holding the brakes gets pretty hard. Anyway, my drops
are both under 50 from my runup RPM.
I did have a brain glitch one day and forgot to turn the mag back on before
beginning my takeoff run. The aircraft accelerated to flying speed in what
seemed to be a normal distance and time, but post-liftoff acceleration was
very weak, and the engine RPM was at least a couple of hundred RPM down. I
almost aborted the takeoff, but I found the problem after a quick scan.
Everything was fine after I turned the Mag back on...
Bottom line, the higher your power setting, the more drop you're likely to
see with one system off.
KB
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Bell" <brucebell74@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: RV-List: RPM drop!
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Bruce Bell" <brucebell74@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I have an O-320 with dual Electroair Ignition Systems and Airflow Fuel
> injection. What drop should I expect with one system off? My Operator's
> Manual for the O-320 with fixed pitch prop call for a RPM of 2000/2100 max
> drop of 175 RPM and not more than 50 RPM between magnetos on the before
> T/O
> Check list. What are others getting?
> Best regards,
> Bruce Bell
> Lubbock, Texas
> RV4 N23BB #2888
>
>
>
Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 08/22/2005 7:30:55 PM Central Standard Time,
khorton01@rogers.com writes:
As you know, the glide ratio (i.e the distance travelled for a given
amount of altitude) will be better with the flaps up than with them
extended, assuming that you are at the best glide speed for each
configuration.
>>>>
I'd like to toss the wind into this discussion, if I may- let's not forget
that runway selected for landing usually has the wind trying to blow you AWAY
from it, which is one reason I always like to make
steeper-than-standard-glide-slope approaches. (lots in archives about high sink
rate of RVs (-9s & -10s
excluded?) with power off vs. some power on final)
Recent post regarding diving toward threshold begs this question: Assuming
no hazardous ground obstructions between threshold and current position, is it
wise to dive closer to the ground to gain airspeed (engine out) to possibly
reduce effects of wind? I know this sounds kinda scary, but if it happened to
me, I'd want every advantage I could get to make the runway if no better
alternatives available...
Just theorizing here & never heard it discussed. What say y'all?
Mark Phillips do not archive
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Very interestion question, I have wondered about that myself. On the one
hand flaps increase lift, but on the other they slow you down, I think I
would vote for going to 1st notch. I plan to experiment next flight. charlie
heathco
----- Original Message -----
From: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Subject: RV-List: Extending a glide
--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich"
<RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
Rich Crosley
RV-8 N948RC
Message 43
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--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 08/22/2005 8:06:31 PM Central Standard Time,
kboatright1@comcast.net writes:
I did have a brain glitch one day and forgot to turn the mag back on before
beginning my takeoff run.
>>>
Thank gawd I ain't the only one! 8-)
Mark - do not archive
Message 44
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version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
I am just a few days ahead of you, flew mine first time last week, and Sat I
set up a 5 point flight plan and it flew it like a charm, exept for the turn
at first waypoint which was about 120 deg, overshot considerably. I need to
also experiment with gain. As wing leveler, I can do much better, it tends
to keep the wings rocking a lot, I need to talk with Jerry about what to
addjust. Charlie Heathco
----- Original Message -----
From: <sportav8r@aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Trio update
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
I flew my new Trio EZ pilot A/P with the new GPS connected for the first
time yesterday, and was that ever sweet! Kinda spooky to see invisible
hands flying your airplane for the first time in 500 hours. I'm easily
impressed, but having two brand new boxes in the cockpit with me on a test
flight, I couldn't help but be.
I'm still exploring the capabilities of the Trio, but it tracks a flight
plan, does the emergency 180, and holds a course well, and is a functional
wing-leveler even without GPS input. Installation was very straightforward
and uncomplicated. The Garmin 296 manual took all day Saturday and half the
day Sunday to pore over, but I think I am now capable of putting that unit
through most of its paces. The UPS man brought me a data cable last week
for it, and a Panel Dock form AirGizmos today, so by tonight it should be in
my panel like it belongs there, instead of dangling from a bunch of wires
like yesterday ;-)
I had the EZ-Pilot follow a 90-degree turn at a flight plan waypoint, and
the overshoot to the outside of the turn was about 0.8nm at 150 mph, with a
secondary overshoot to the inside of 0.12nm before it locked onto the new
heading outbound. This is no doubt due to the 15 degree bank limiting
default setting, so I will play with the gain a bit on subsequent flights.
Thanks, Sam B., for your earlier suggestion of gain values. I plan to look
them up and use them as starting points.
-Stormy
very happy Garmin and Trio customer
Message 45
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
Crosley, Rich wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
>
>Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
>base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
>have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
>Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
>much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
>
>
>Rich Crosley
>RV-8 N948RC
>
My instructor insisted that I have the engine at idle when abeam the
numbers & that I fly the landing pattern so that I'd have the runway
made at any time if the engine quit. The technique continued to work
fine when I went from the Luscombe to a Thorp T-18, then a Swift with
160hp & c/s prop, then the same Swift with 200hp & c/s. It works fine
with f/p RV's & I'm pretty sure it would have worked fine on the one c/s
example I've flown if the owner had been comfortable with the idea.
True confession time:
I had the engine quit once while on long final dragging along with power
following another a/c at a flyin years ago. I was probably not much more
than 1/2 mile out when it quit. I might have frozen up a bit, but I only
had time to tell myself to 'fly the plane', set best glide speed &
notice that the stuff under us looked benign enough to just ruin the
plane & not us. By that time a gear leg had hit one tall stalk of
something & we were stopped on the runway. Switched tanks, hit the boost
pump & starter & the plane ran fine with fuel being delivered. (Problem
started with a controller telling me to do something I considered unsafe
about a half hour earlier just as I was reaching for the fuel selector
to change tanks. It continued when I had to follow others around a
monster sized pattern. I let the distraction & stress of flying in an
uncomfortable fashion distract me from switching tanks.)
At 80-90 mph, 1/2 mile would be maybe 20 seconds. I suppose that with
cooler fluid in your veins you'd be able to evaluate whether the
increased sink rate when the flaps come up is less of a problem than the
drag, but I was proud that I could focus enough to 'fly the plane' &
look for the least lethal path into the weeds.
Charlie
Message 46
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| Subject: | Re: Stupid pilot tricks |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mark Grieve <mark@macomb.com>
The bird could have been roosting in the tree.
Certainly Do not archive
charlie heathco wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
>
>Anybody else see the story on AvWeb about the C-210 that struck a tree on takeoff
with 2 mechanics aboard, tearing off 5 ft of wing and a gas tank. They flew
2 hrs befor they ran low on fuel an noticed the problem? Pilot said he thought
he struck a bird! Do not archive
>
Message 47
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson@earthlink.net>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Bruce Bell"
> <brucebell74@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I have an O-320 with dual Electroair Ignition Systems and
> Airflow Fuel injection. What drop should I expect with one
> system off? My Operator's Manual for the O-320 with fixed
> pitch prop call for a RPM of 2000/2100 max drop of 175 RPM
> and not more than 50 RPM between magnetos on the before T/O
> Check list. What are others getting?
> Best regards,
> Bruce Bell
> Lubbock, Texas
> RV4 N23BB #2888
I suspect that the engine and/or airframe manufacturers set an rpm drop spec
because they don't know how to communicate how to "listen" to the engine.
There have been several mag checks I've done in 650 hours which have shown a
cylinder to be misfiring. I couldn't tell you what a "normal" rpm drop in
my plane is, but I know instantly when a plug is fouled and misfiring. In a
four cylinder, this is very obvious once one has some time in the plane. In
most cases, a fouled plug can be burned off by running the rpm up to max
braking ability and leaning the engine way back until some rpm drop occurs.
Don't forget to keep your eyes outside during this!
Anyway, perhaps others more knowledgable will chime in, but, to address your
question, how the engine is running is more important than the exact rpm
drops. Once you have experience with what is "normal" for your engine/prop,
you will know this. Also, an egt gauge is a very helpful tool in diagnosing
a misfiring cylinder. Interestingly, when I've had a fouled plug, and am
running only on one mag, the egt doesn't go to zero, but something around
700F instead. I suspect it is firing every other time?
Alex Peterson
RV6-A N66AP 654 hours
Maple Grove, MN
Message 48
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr@petroblend.com>
Kevin wrote a excellent description of the technical aspects of engine out
glidepath. I'll take a different approach.
Certainly I can not, and few other pilots that I know, except my Test Pilot
Hero ;-) Kevin Horton, can call up that info and process it, while turning
directly to the airport property and trying to figure out why the engine
quit and whether to pull the prop back, switch tanks, maintain best glide,
find a place to park, check the boost pumps, tighen up your shoulder
harness, hit the starter, all this while soiling your undergarments.
I offer a different question and some answers.
What can we do to improve our safety while flying in the pattern?
Tighten up our patterns. An engine failure in the pattern should never
result in an off airport landing. (maybe off the runway, but on the airport
property.) We should talk to our friends about the bomber patterns we all
see at our airports and set a good example, by flying nice tight patterns.
Never Turn back to the runway on an engine failure after take-off.
Shock cooling be damned, approaches should be made at idle power.
Aim for the 1000 ft markers, not the end of the runway.
Don't get slow!
Every power change in the pattern should be a reduction. Not counting ATC,
adding power in the pattern should be considered poor planning and an error.
Every one should have an engine failure checklist committed to memory. Mine
is an old WWII checklist:
Glide - pull or push to best glide speed
Gear - Up or down, up is default unless you are willing to bet your life
that the ground is hard
Gas - Pump on and Try all Selector all positions including OFF, ( I had
one quit, right after annual, and it ran in OFF )
Ignition - try all positions including OFF
Heat - Carb Heat on
Mixture - Rich or maybe leaned on an injected eng.
Prop - Low RPM or Feather
Canopy - open(or doors unlatched) before impact
Harness - Seat and shoulder harness locked and tight
Finally when the end is near,
Mixture, Master & Mags off for impact
You notice flaps did not even make the list.
To answer the original question, If I was high enough to do everything else
that is more important, then I would raise the flaps. There is more
important work to do than raising the flaps. The most important thing, FLY
the airplane to the ground. Airplanes that arrive at the accident site
under control with the wings level usually have survivors onboard. You will
notice Glide is first on the list, and the only thing on the list that I did
when my engine quit.
Tailwinds,
Doug Rozendaal
Message 49
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version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Well, aint it awfull! just 2 flights agoafter extended checking, I ended up
leaving it set on rt, which is bigest drop, noticed I wasnt making full
takeoff rpm, in my case 2150, a few hundred feet after liftoff, scan
spotted the problem. It scared me a little, altho sometimes forget to turn
on pump, cant ever remember doing this before, Must be the age. Thats why
Ive decieded not to get involved with formation flying altho it interests me
greatly. Charlie Heathco
----- Original Message -----
From: <Fiveonepw@aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RPM drop!
--> RV-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com
In a message dated 08/22/2005 8:06:31 PM Central Standard Time,
kboatright1@comcast.net writes:
I did have a brain glitch one day and forgot to turn the mag back on before
beginning my takeoff run.
>>>
Thank gawd I ain't the only one! 8-)
Mark - do not archive
Message 50
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| Subject: | Extending a glide |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" <Larry@BowenAero.com>
I did power-off approaches a lot during the early hours of my RV-8. But I'd
routinely see 1300 fpm descent rates turning final (solo, half flaps, prop
forward, power off, 80-85 knots). It's good to practice that scenario, I
but now I typically keep 10" MP in for a more benign approach. FWIW.....
-
Larry Bowen, RV-8 120 Hrs
Larry@BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doug
> Rozendaal
> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 10:58 PM
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Extending a glide
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr@petroblend.com>
>
> Kevin wrote a excellent description of the technical aspects
> of engine out glidepath. I'll take a different approach.
......
>
> Shock cooling be damned, approaches should be made at idle power.
>
.....
>
> Tailwinds,
> Doug Rozendaal
Message 51
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| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Charlie I understand the dragging it in behind anothere plane thing.
Instructors must be teaching pilots to do extended downwinds for some stupid
reason these days. I have had to follow piolots doing up to 2 mile or more
downwinds past the threshhold, no way you could get back. Always cute to
note that when a pilot anounced he was doing an engine out practice, they
were cutting in VERY close :-) I got my ratings on a little 2300ft strip
with tall trees each end, I still tend to come in high and close. Charlie
heathco
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charlie England" <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Extending a glide
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
Crosley, Rich wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Crosley, Rich"
><RCROSLEY@HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
>
>Suppose, just suppose that you're in your RV-8 on speed, full flaps turning
>base to 1/2 mile final and the engine quits. You are pretty sure that you
>have the runway made but you want to extend your glide as much as possible.
>Do you leave the flaps where they are or do you raise them and if so how
>much? Thought about this yesterday as I turned final.
>
>
>Rich Crosley
>RV-8 N948RC
>
My instructor insisted that I have the engine at idle when abeam the
numbers & that I fly the landing pattern so that I'd have the runway
made at any time if the engine quit. The technique continued to work
fine when I went from the Luscombe to a Thorp T-18, then a Swift with
160hp & c/s prop, then the same Swift with 200hp & c/s. It works fine
with f/p RV's & I'm pretty sure it would have worked fine on the one c/s
example I've flown if the owner had been comfortable with the idea.
True confession time:
I had the engine quit once while on long final dragging along with power
following another a/c at a flyin years ago. I was probably not much more
than 1/2 mile out when it quit. I might have frozen up a bit, but I only
had time to tell myself to 'fly the plane', set best glide speed &
notice that the stuff under us looked benign enough to just ruin the
plane & not us. By that time a gear leg had hit one tall stalk of
something & we were stopped on the runway. Switched tanks, hit the boost
pump & starter & the plane ran fine with fuel being delivered. (Problem
started with a controller telling me to do something I considered unsafe
about a half hour earlier just as I was reaching for the fuel selector
to change tanks. It continued when I had to follow others around a
monster sized pattern. I let the distraction & stress of flying in an
uncomfortable fashion distract me from switching tanks.)
At 80-90 mph, 1/2 mile would be maybe 20 seconds. I suppose that with
cooler fluid in your veins you'd be able to evaluate whether the
increased sink rate when the flaps come up is less of a problem than the
drag, but I was proud that I could focus enough to 'fly the plane' &
look for the least lethal path into the weeds.
Charlie
Message 52
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--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
I experienced a phenomenon you apparently encountered as well, sitting in the cockpit
with the master on, familiarizing myself with the new gadgets and planning
future test flights (okay, I was making airplane noises, too, for old times'
sake): I turned on the servo and observed the stick begin oscillatiing rapidly
left and right, and decided to watch how long it would take to settle down.
It never did. If I grabbed the stick and held it still, I could hear and
feel the servo fighting me and the clutch slipping. Getting out of the cockpit,
I tried restraining the aileron training edge - shaking continued. I disengaged
and re-engaged the servo several times, even cycled the control head off
and on, but the results were always the same. I guess this is normal behavior?
Trio's automatic-disconnect feature using GPS speed to detect takeoff roll seems
redundant, since mine has a built-in stick shaker when it's engaged while still
on the ground :-)
-Stormy
-----Original Message-----
From: charlie heathco <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Trio update
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
I am just a few days ahead of you, flew mine first time last week, and Sat I
set up a 5 point flight plan and it flew it like a charm, exept for the turn
at first waypoint which was about 120 deg, overshot considerably. I need to
also experiment with gain. As wing leveler, I can do much better, it tends
to keep the wings rocking a lot, I need to talk with Jerry about what to
addjust. Charlie Heathco
----- Original Message -----
From: <sportav8r@aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Trio update
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
I flew my new Trio EZ pilot A/P with the new GPS connected for the first
time yesterday, and was that ever sweet! Kinda spooky to see invisible
hands flying your airplane for the first time in 500 hours. I'm easily
impressed, but having two brand new boxes in the cockpit with me on a test
flight, I couldn't help but be.
I'm still exploring the capabilities of the Trio, but it tracks a flight
plan, does the emergency 180, and holds a course well, and is a functional
wing-leveler even without GPS input. Installation was very straightforward
and uncomplicated. The Garmin 296 manual took all day Saturday and half the
day Sunday to pore over, but I think I am now capable of putting that unit
through most of its paces. The UPS man brought me a data cable last week
for it, and a Panel Dock form AirGizmos today, so by tonight it should be in
my panel like it belongs there, instead of dangling from a bunch of wires
like yesterday ;-)
I had the EZ-Pilot follow a 90-degree turn at a flight plan waypoint, and
the overshoot to the outside of the turn was about 0.8nm at 150 mph, with a
secondary overshoot to the inside of 0.12nm before it locked onto the new
heading outbound. This is no doubt due to the 15 degree bank limiting
default setting, so I will play with the gain a bit on subsequent flights.
Thanks, Sam B., for your earlier suggestion of gain values. I plan to look
them up and use them as starting points.
-Stormy
very happy Garmin and Trio customer
Message 53
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--> RV-List message posted by: Vanremog@aol.com
In a message dated 8/22/2005 8:29:09 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
sportav8r@aol.com writes:
I turned on the servo and observed the stick begin oscillating rapidly left
and right, and decided to watch how long it would take to settle down. It
never did. If I grabbed the stick and held it still, I could hear and feel the
servo fighting me and the clutch slipping. Getting out of the cockpit, I
tried restraining the aileron training edge - shaking continued. I disengaged
and re-engaged the servo several times, even cycled the control head off and
on, but the results were always the same. I guess this is normal behavior?
===================
IME this is normal ground behavior. In flight the air loads effectively
damp this out.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A, C/S, Flying 755hrs, Silicon Valley, CA)
Message 54
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|
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
In flight it does not seem to hunt much at all. On the ground, without GPS lock,
it shakes at about 2.5 Hz. Don't ask me to explain why I would want to engage
the servo in the hangar - because it's there?
;-)
-Stormy
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Trio update
--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
Stormy,
Does your stick move left/right at a 1 Hertz rate? Both
Rick G and I have that situation. Mine does not have the
GPS input yet so that may be a factor but Rick does have
GPS input.
I did chat with Trio about it and they have a possible solution
so I am not overly concerned yet and until I see if it still does
that once I provide a GPS input.
Ron Lee
Message 55
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|
| Subject: | Re: Extending a glide |
version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Larry, I was trained to pull to Idle at the treshold, which I still do
mostly, but here at Old Boerne Stage, we sometimes have a glider with tow
plane atatched sitting at the treshhold that I have to come in over, makes
me a little edgy, and I usually put in some power as I still like to land
close to the numbers and last Sat, I had a glider in the pattern and one
circling near departure end and towplane on the ground ready to pull and
waiting. Circling glider was instrutor/student. reply to whats your plan, JP
told me to disreguard him and set up normal downwind entrywhich I did, then
he pulls in about 500' in front of me, turns back and passes me head on left
at about 100' away. My coment "that was interesting" his coment "thats a
pretty airplane" Then as Im on final he anounces that he is getting too low,
Ive got to land as short as posible and get off, tow plane must start the
pull as soon as I hit the runway to get out of his way. Oh well, beats
being bored in front of the TV. :-) Charlie h----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry@bowenaero.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Extending a glide
--> RV-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" <Larry@BowenAero.com>
I did power-off approaches a lot during the early hours of my RV-8. But I'd
routinely see 1300 fpm descent rates turning final (solo, half flaps, prop
forward, power off, 80-85 knots). It's good to practice that scenario, I
but now I typically keep 10" MP in for a more benign approach. FWIW.....
-
Larry Bowen, RV-8 120 Hrs
Larry@BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doug
> Rozendaal
> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 10:58 PM
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Extending a glide
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr@petroblend.com>
>
> Kevin wrote a excellent description of the technical aspects
> of engine out glidepath. I'll take a different approach.
......
>
> Shock cooling be damned, approaches should be made at idle power.
>
.....
>
> Tailwinds,
> Doug Rozendaal
Message 56
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version=3.0.2
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
No Stormy, This is not normal, It will usually shake when turned on in the
hanger,due to no aileron resistance, but light touch will stop it, Talk to
Jerry. Charlie h
----- Original Message -----
From: <sportav8r@aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Trio update
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
I experienced a phenomenon you apparently encountered as well, sitting in
the cockpit with the master on, familiarizing myself with the new gadgets
and planning future test flights (okay, I was making airplane noises, too,
for old times' sake): I turned on the servo and observed the stick begin
oscillatiing rapidly left and right, and decided to watch how long it would
take to settle down. It never did. If I grabbed the stick and held it
still, I could hear and feel the servo fighting me and the clutch slipping.
Getting out of the cockpit, I tried restraining the aileron training edge -
shaking continued. I disengaged and re-engaged the servo several times,
even cycled the control head off and on, but the results were always the
same. I guess this is normal behavior?
Trio's automatic-disconnect feature using GPS speed to detect takeoff roll
seems redundant, since mine has a built-in stick shaker when it's engaged
while still on the ground :-)
-Stormy
-----Original Message-----
From: charlie heathco <cheathco@gvtc.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Trio update
--> RV-List message posted by: "charlie heathco" <cheathco@gvtc.com>
I am just a few days ahead of you, flew mine first time last week, and Sat I
set up a 5 point flight plan and it flew it like a charm, exept for the turn
at first waypoint which was about 120 deg, overshot considerably. I need to
also experiment with gain. As wing leveler, I can do much better, it tends
to keep the wings rocking a lot, I need to talk with Jerry about what to
addjust. Charlie Heathco
----- Original Message -----
From: <sportav8r@aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Trio update
--> RV-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
I flew my new Trio EZ pilot A/P with the new GPS connected for the first
time yesterday, and was that ever sweet! Kinda spooky to see invisible
hands flying your airplane for the first time in 500 hours. I'm easily
impressed, but having two brand new boxes in the cockpit with me on a test
flight, I couldn't help but be.
I'm still exploring the capabilities of the Trio, but it tracks a flight
plan, does the emergency 180, and holds a course well, and is a functional
wing-leveler even without GPS input. Installation was very straightforward
and uncomplicated. The Garmin 296 manual took all day Saturday and half the
day Sunday to pore over, but I think I am now capable of putting that unit
through most of its paces. The UPS man brought me a data cable last week
for it, and a Panel Dock form AirGizmos today, so by tonight it should be in
my panel like it belongs there, instead of dangling from a bunch of wires
like yesterday ;-)
I had the EZ-Pilot follow a 90-degree turn at a flight plan waypoint, and
the overshoot to the outside of the turn was about 0.8nm at 150 mph, with a
secondary overshoot to the inside of 0.12nm before it locked onto the new
heading outbound. This is no doubt due to the 15 degree bank limiting
default setting, so I will play with the gain a bit on subsequent flights.
Thanks, Sam B., for your earlier suggestion of gain values. I plan to look
them up and use them as starting points.
-Stormy
very happy Garmin and Trio customer
Message 57
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| Subject: | Re: Stupid pilot tricks |
--> RV-List message posted by: Chris W <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm@cox.net>
charlie heathco wrote:
>Anybody else see the story on AvWeb about the C-210 that struck a tree on takeoff
with 2 mechanics aboard, tearing off 5 ft of wing and a gas tank. They flew
2 hrs befor they ran low on fuel an noticed the problem? Pilot said he thought
he struck a bird! Do not archive
>
>
When I saw that photo I wondered how the pilot could have not known
something was seriously wrong. Wouldn't there be a strong tendency to
bank to the left? However, now that I think about it and the fact that
fuel tank was also gone, maybe all that weight being gone made up for
the reduced lift on that side of the plane. Still though how could you
hit a tree with the wing on a high wing plane and not know it?
do not archive
--
Chris W
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