Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:38 AM - Re: N161RL Flies (Charles Rowbotham)
2. 06:54 AM - Re: XM WX (Paul Besing)
3. 08:49 AM - Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long (Ken Howell)
4. 10:44 AM - Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long (Terry Watson)
5. 12:06 PM - Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long (Mickey Coggins)
6. 12:39 PM - Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long (Olen Goodwin)
7. 03:02 PM - WTB - RV-6A or RV-7A (Ron Lee)
8. 06:42 PM - Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long (Brian Kraut)
9. 06:52 PM - Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long (Tracy Crook)
10. 07:04 PM - test (Mannan J. Thomason)
11. 07:19 PM - Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long (Don Hall)
Message 1
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham@hotmail.com>
Mannan,
CONGRATULATIONS and WELL DONE !!
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A
>From: "Mannan J. Thomason" <mannanj@alltel.net>
>Subject: RV-List: N161RL Flies
>Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2006 10:13:29 -0400
>
>
>After 4 1/2 years and after being asked "when is it going to fly?" and my
>saying Thursday, about half a million times, N161RL flew Thurs.29 June.
>She's an RV-8 slow build, IO-360-A3B6D, McCauley (ugh.) Prop, Sam James
>Cowl.
>
Message 2
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--> RV-List message posted by: Paul Besing <pbesing@yahoo.com>
I just flew in Texas yesterday and noticed that the wx
info is a little slow to update. It was nice to see
the cell on the screen about 50 miles before I could
even see it, though. Made the diversion much more
gradual. I would caution not to completely rely on it
in IMC to determine where the cells are, but it is
great for the VFR pilot to make some turn around
decisions, or diversions for alternate routes.
Sometimes the information can be a little old, like
10-20 mins it might seem sometimes.
Paul Besing
--- Larry Pardue <n5lp@warpdriveonline.com> wrote:
> --> RV-List message posted by: Larry Pardue
> <n5lp@warpdriveonline.com>
>
>
> On Jul 20, 2006, at 4:58 PM, Paul Besing wrote:
>
> > --> RV-List message posted by: Paul Besing
> <pbesing@yahoo.com>
> >
> > I have the $30 subscription for XM weather right
> now.
> > It's fine, but the $50 one would be nice mainly
> for
> > the winds aloft information. It is available on
> the
> > 396, it's not just a 496 new item.
> >
> I think the $50 subscription is also real nice for
> the lightning
> data. I have seen times, like over the Guadalupe
> Mountains, that no
> echos at all showed up on my 396, but I could see a
> thunderstorm
> visually and by the lightning data. Makes me wonder
> about the source
> of the radar data because I know precip shows up
> here on NOAA sites.
> It is a difficult area for radar coverage though.
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP Flying
> http://n5lp.net
>
>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
> Admin.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________________________
Message 3
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| Subject: | Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Howell" <cfi1513840@comcast.net>
I have to drag out the soap box for this one. I apologize for the length...
I completely agree that reasonable and lawful behavior and consideration for
others is the responsibly of every citizen. The finer point to be made is on
what we call our "rights", and how assertive we should be in demanding them.
It has nothing to do with invoking "constitutional rights". It has to do
with common sense. We are not 8th graders. Most of us realize that our
so-called rights are really privileges. Today, in many countries around the
world, if you can manage to get through life without being tortured or
brutalized in some way, you are privileged indeed. Historically, the concept
of rights has always been restricted. What rights did people have in the
Middle Ages, or under Slavery? It is only in the relatively recent past that
rights for average citizens has become accepted practice, and only in a few
places, our own country being thankfully one of them. Today, in many
societies around the world, average people still have very little in the way
of rights or privileges.
Today in this country, we are "privileged" to live in a time and place that
affords us the technology and allows us to build and fly small airplanes.
There are not too many places in the world where this is the case. If we
were not lucky enough to live where we do, we would be looking up at
contrails and dreaming of personal flight as the majority of the Earth's
population has to do. However it is also true that as members of a minority
of a minority (homebuilders and aviators), we are easy targets, and if we do
not assert our "rights", they will be gradually eroded and eventually taken
away from us, as sure as the sun rises and sets. In my opinion, it is a
natural tendency of those who govern to enforce bureaucracy in a way that
restricts the rights of their citizens, especially in areas that are
somewhat esoteric, or practiced by what is considered to be an elite
minority. General Aviation and aircraft homebuilding in particular fall into
this category. In that respect, I believe the EAA and AOPA are essential to
our "right" to fly airplanes, and to build them if we so choose, because
they represent and give voice to us in the thousands and not simply as
individuals. However, regardless of EAA or AOPA advocacy, we cannot neglect
the responsibility of standing up for ourselves when the need arises.
I think we all agree that the JAX ordinance is onerous to homebuilders and
should be rescinded. Regardless of the degree of EAA or AOPA advocacy in
this matter, I believe that it is a time where our voices should be heard as
individuals, in an assertive and respectful manner. Just like the 20,000
comments that poured in opposing the permanent DC ADIZ, this ill-conceived
ordinance should invoke a similar response, because if left unchallenged, it
will set a precedent that will eventually affect all of us. It may be
overkill, but my fervent hope would be that thousands of homebuilders would
respond in opposition.
Ken Howell
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Jensen
Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2006 10:52 AM
--> RV-List message posted by: "Chuck Jensen" <cjensen@dts9000.com>
I have no opinion on the merits of Mr. Kraut situation and
circumstances. Certainly, his postings seem reasonable and reasoned.
If one is to draw a conclusion from this 'managed' information, it would
certainly seem that the ordinance is 'mosquito hunting with an elephant
gun.'
What concerns me the most is the near instantaneous laying claim to
'constitutional rights' (not necessarily by Mr. Kraut, but certainly
many others). First of all, most that make such claims 1) have never
read the constitution, and 2) wouldn't know how to apply it to define
one's rights anyhow. This whole process of asserting constitutional
rights culminates in 8th graders running around and telling their
teachers and Principals to shove-it because 'they know their rights'.
What I hear far less frequently, but interests me a great more, is what
are our 'responsibilities' as citizens, not just our rights. Societal
needs may not trump 'rights' but the exercise of innumerable personal
rights (real and imagined) is often corrosive to our social fabric and
quality of life. To mute exercise of our rights and our personal
behavior is sometimes referred to as the go-along, get-along philosophy.
In Kraut's immediate case, multiple parties are not going-along and
certainly not getting-along; the result of which is a nasty,
over-reaching ordinance and consternation on the part of many
(potentially) affected parties---all because somebody probably decided
to assert their 'rights' instead of their responsibilities.
So, let's go forward a bit more gently--we will all find life more
comfortable and pleasant by doing so. Oh, by the way; do as I say, not
as I do.
Chuck
Do Not Archive
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England
> <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
>
> I'm on your side; my point is that when the city decided to pass a
> discriminatory ordinance, it became much more than a 'case'.
> We are all
> affected.
>
> Even if you were the world's worst jerk, riveting at 3:00 AM
> & spraying
> dangerous chemicals into your neighbor's windows, it still would not
> justify passing the law they passed.
>
> Charlie
>
> Brian Kraut wrote:
>
> >--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
> >
> >It is very much a "case" and will have its day in court. I
> could move
> >the plane to the airport or a mini storage and not go to court, but
> >this needs to be fought. I will not run with my tail
> between my legs.
> >
> >I really appreciate everyone's support and suggestions. I
> wish I could
> >respond to the hundreds of emails I get, but that would be a
> full time
> >job.
> >
> >I have been keeping a little quiet on all the little details, the
> >information I have been gathering on the ordinance and how
> it passed,
> >and the legal strategy for getting this ordinance changed.
> This will
> >go to court and I can't spill all the beans now.
> >
> >Brian Kraut
> >www.jaxairplane.com
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> Charlie England
> >Sent: Saturday, July 22, 2006 11:31 PM
> >Solution?
> >
> >
> >--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England
> >--> <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
> >
> >Pete Cowper wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >>--> RV-List message posted by: pcowper@webtv.net (Pete Cowper)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>"I also believe that two judges orders confirm that I was not doing
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>anything wrong,"
> >>
> >>Brian's posts show that he appears to be a rather calm and
> >>level-headed person, and some third parties who have met
> him confirm
> >>this.
> >>
> >>For the city council to legislate in favor of the sole whining
> >>neighbor seems suspect, the whole story may show that Brian
> has been
> >>caught up in a citywide problem.
> >>
> >>I trust the list understands that my comment about the pole tent
> >>workshop was tongue-in-cheek and intended to illustrate the need to
> >>listen to both sides of the issue before jumping to conclusions.
> >>Having been a lawyer in California for almost 20 years in both
> >>criminal prosecution and defense as well as a civil litigation
> >>practice the past 15 years . . . I am always hesitant to
> determine the
> >>merits of a case based on hearing only one side of the
> story. Whether
> >>it is from the
> >>
> >>
> >>
> > >snipped
> >
> >
> >
> >>Pete Cowper
> >>RV-8 #81139
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >It seems to me that discussing this as a 'case' misses the point
> >entirely.
> >
> >If this was a 'case', it would have been dealt with as a
> 'case' (Brian
> >has apparently already dealt with the 'case').
> >
> >This city (which happens to be an entire county) has legislated that
> >*all* its citizens cannot exercise their constitutional
> rights in two
> >areas. No restrictions were placed on hobbies like antique tractor
> >restoration, which in every way could be just as dangerous and/or
> >irritating to neighbors.
> >
> >Strategy & tactics used to respond can be debated, but there is no
> >doubt in my mind that this blatantly unconstitutional, like
> most of the
> >laws restricting conduct in the last 30-40 years. (Why do
> we allow the
> >FAA to call our right to fly a 'privilege'? Is my right to vote a
> >'privilege' just because I can lose it if I'm convicted of a felony?)
> >
> >Charlie
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
To say that our rights are actually privileges is to say that someone,
presumably some level of government, has the power and the right to grant or
deny those privileges. That premise is completely backwards. In the U.S. at
least, government exists expressly by the consent of the governed, and our
federal and individual state constitutions are expressly written to limit
the power of the government, not the citizens. It is the nature of
government to constantly try to push the limits of its power, as sure as it
is the nature of fish to swim or dogs to bark, which is exactly why it is in
all of our interests to push back.
Regulations are written by people who for whatever reason believe they have
the power and the right to tell other people how they should live their
lives. Often this is to force inconsiderate people to respect the rights and
autonomy of their neighbors, but it would seem to me that just as often it
is by inconsiderate and dominating people to try to force others to live
their lives according to the regulator's ideas of what is good for them. A
third reason, often behind onerous zoning laws, is blatant self-interest at
the expense of those without the political power to resist.
I would encourage those who value their freedom to make their own decisions
about their life to push back, never accepting the false premise that they
live by the permission of any other individual or group or government.
Terry
RV-8A finishing
Seattle
-----Original Message-----From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ken Howell
Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 8:46 AM
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Howell" <cfi1513840@comcast.net>
<snip> We are not 8th graders. Most of us realize that our
so-called rights are really privileges.<snip>
I think we all agree that the JAX ordinance is onerous to homebuilders and
should be rescinded. Regardless of the degree of EAA or AOPA advocacy in
this matter, I believe that it is a time where our voices should be heard as
individuals, in an assertive and respectful manner. Just like the 20,000
comments that poured in opposing the permanent DC ADIZ, this ill-conceived
ordinance should invoke a similar response, because if left unchallenged, it
will set a precedent that will eventually affect all of us. It may be
overkill, but my fervent hope would be that thousands of homebuilders would
respond in opposition.
Ken Howell
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long |
--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Terry Watson wrote:
> ...
> I would encourage those who value their freedom to make their own decisions
> about their life to push back, never accepting the false premise that they
> live by the permission of any other individual or group or government.
I couldn't have written it better. Brave men and women have given the
ultimate sacrifice defending our freedom, and it would be shameful
for us to just forgo them out of ignorance, laziness and indifference.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
do not archive
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Olen Goodwin" <ogoodwin@comcast.net>
Terry, right on all counts. Fortunately, there are still people that
understand that to keep rights, you must know they are rights that transcend
anything this or any government says or does. Some Europeans seem to have
forgotten that. At some point, a portion of the population says, "ENOUGH!"
and takes whatever action is necessary. Fortunately also that so far we've
been able to fend off the nannys and power freaks by simply "throwing the
bums out" of office. The time may come that that isn't enough, and when
that happens, we'll find out once more what the character of the American
people is.
Olen Goodwin
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 11:39 AM
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
>
>
> To say that our rights are actually privileges is to say that someone,
> presumably some level of government, has the power and the right to grant
> or
> deny those privileges. That premise is completely backwards. In the U.S.
> at
> least, government exists expressly by the consent of the governed, and our
> federal and individual state constitutions are expressly written to limit
> the power of the government, not the citizens. It is the nature of
> government to constantly try to push the limits of its power, as sure as
> it
> is the nature of fish to swim or dogs to bark, which is exactly why it is
> in
> all of our interests to push back.
>
> Regulations are written by people who for whatever reason believe they
> have
> the power and the right to tell other people how they should live their
> lives. Often this is to force inconsiderate people to respect the rights
> and
> autonomy of their neighbors, but it would seem to me that just as often it
> is by inconsiderate and dominating people to try to force others to live
> their lives according to the regulator's ideas of what is good for them. A
> third reason, often behind onerous zoning laws, is blatant self-interest
> at
> the expense of those without the political power to resist.
>
> I would encourage those who value their freedom to make their own
> decisions
> about their life to push back, never accepting the false premise that they
> live by the permission of any other individual or group or government.
>
> Terry
> RV-8A finishing
> Seattle
>
>
> -----Original Message-----From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ken Howell
> Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 8:46 AM
>
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Howell" <cfi1513840@comcast.net>
>
>
> <snip> We are not 8th graders. Most of us realize that our
> so-called rights are really privileges.<snip>
>
> I think we all agree that the JAX ordinance is onerous to homebuilders and
> should be rescinded. Regardless of the degree of EAA or AOPA advocacy in
> this matter, I believe that it is a time where our voices should be heard
> as
> individuals, in an assertive and respectful manner. Just like the 20,000
> comments that poured in opposing the permanent DC ADIZ, this ill-conceived
> ordinance should invoke a similar response, because if left unchallenged,
> it
> will set a precedent that will eventually affect all of us. It may be
> overkill, but my fervent hope would be that thousands of homebuilders
> would
> respond in opposition.
>
> Ken Howell
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | WTB - RV-6A or RV-7A |
--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
This is for another individual. We have looked at Trade-A-Plane.
If there are other good web sources please email the link.
Preferences as best known at this time
1) IO-360 preferred [O-360 may be ok]. Engine must be low time new
2) CS prop preferred
3) Blue Mountain type avionics preferred
4) Slider preferred
Ron Lee
ronlee@pcisys.net
Message 8
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| Subject: | Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
Very well written. You have nailed a big part of the reason why I have not
just given into the 10 day warnings and avoided the citations. Some people
think I am crazy for that.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Terry Watson
Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 1:39 PM
--> RV-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
To say that our rights are actually privileges is to say that someone,
presumably some level of government, has the power and the right to grant or
deny those privileges. That premise is completely backwards. In the U.S. at
least, government exists expressly by the consent of the governed, and our
federal and individual state constitutions are expressly written to limit
the power of the government, not the citizens. It is the nature of
government to constantly try to push the limits of its power, as sure as it
is the nature of fish to swim or dogs to bark, which is exactly why it is in
all of our interests to push back.
Regulations are written by people who for whatever reason believe they have
the power and the right to tell other people how they should live their
lives. Often this is to force inconsiderate people to respect the rights and
autonomy of their neighbors, but it would seem to me that just as often it
is by inconsiderate and dominating people to try to force others to live
their lives according to the regulator's ideas of what is good for them. A
third reason, often behind onerous zoning laws, is blatant self-interest at
the expense of those without the political power to resist.
I would encourage those who value their freedom to make their own decisions
about their life to push back, never accepting the false premise that they
live by the permission of any other individual or group or government.
Terry
RV-8A finishing
Seattle
-----Original Message-----From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ken Howell
Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 8:46 AM
--> RV-List message posted by: "Ken Howell" <cfi1513840@comcast.net>
<snip> We are not 8th graders. Most of us realize that our
so-called rights are really privileges.<snip>
I think we all agree that the JAX ordinance is onerous to homebuilders and
should be rescinded. Regardless of the degree of EAA or AOPA advocacy in
this matter, I believe that it is a time where our voices should be heard as
individuals, in an assertive and respectful manner. Just like the 20,000
comments that poured in opposing the permanent DC ADIZ, this ill-conceived
ordinance should invoke a similar response, because if left unchallenged, it
will set a precedent that will eventually affect all of us. It may be
overkill, but my fervent hope would be that thousands of homebuilders would
respond in opposition.
Ken Howell
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long |
I still start leak'n around the eyeballs every time I read that second
paragraph of the Declaration of Independence:
"We hold these Truths to be self evident......."
The idea that one has to be a Constitutional expert to understand what
our rights are is simply wrong. If you are serious enough to
contemplate these self evident rights, you can't help but accept the
responsibility that goes with them.
As a practical matter, I have found it amazingly effective to simply
ignore every attempt to negate self evident rights. Most of the time
when these rights are denied, it requires the consent of the victim.
Don't ever give it.
Tracy Crook
--> RV-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
<mick-matronics@rv8.ch<mailto:mick-matronics@rv8.ch>>
Terry Watson wrote:
> ...
> I would encourage those who value their freedom to make their own
decisions
> about their life to push back, never accepting the false premise
that they
> live by the permission of any other individual or group or
government.
I couldn't have written it better. Brave men and women have given the
ultimate sacrifice defending our freedom, and it would be shameful
for us to just forgo them out of ignorance, laziness and indifference.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/<http://www.rv8.ch/>
#82007 finishing
do not archive
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List<http://www.matronics.com/Navig
ator?RV-List>
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http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contributi
on>
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Message 10
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--> RV-List message posted by: "Mannan J. Thomason" <mannanj@alltel.net>
Checking to see if this works
Do Not Archive
Mannan Thomason
Message 11
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| Subject: | Anti-Aviation bill in Florida - Long |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Don Hall" <dhall@donka.net>
[alone and crickets chirping]
Eh, er, well, I don't think I'd want a neighbor like Brian. As far as the
legal aspect, I sympathize with him. I generally don't like more and more
laws for all aspects of life. Aside from that, Brian seems to perpetually
have two planes under construction somewhere on his property. That's
doesn't seem like a typical homebuilder unless he's trying to build his own
personal invasion fleet for a war against Amelia Island. I'd hate it if
the guy next to me always had two cars under restoration in his yard and
garage. Whether legal or not, it's not neighborhood friendly, and it sounds
like Brian met his Bizarro with that neighbor.
Brian,
I have some suggestions for you. Remove the planes to offsite storage and
invest your money in becoming the ultimate bad neighbor:
1) Erect a 50 foot ham radio tower in the back yard.
2) Start to build a new front porch and quit part way through the project.
3) Plant weeds in your yard.
4) Christmas lights all year long.
5) Use some old tires somewhere in your landscaping plans.
6) Make a weathervane out of a vert stab!
7) Find out the political persuasion of your neighbor and post support signs
for the other party politicians. The guy sounds smart and crabby, so
probably a republican (like me 'cept for the smart part).
8) A flock of rusty pink flamingos sounds about right for a true Floridian.
Good luck!
******************************************
Don Hall
N517DG (registered)
rv7 fuselage
http://rv7.donka.net
******************************************
> Brian Kraut wrote:
>
> >--> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
> >
> >It is very much a "case" and will have its day in court. I
> could move
> >the plane to the airport or a mini storage and not go to court, but
> >this needs to be fought. I will not run with my tail
> between my legs.
> >
> >I really appreciate everyone's support and suggestions. I
> wish I could
> >respond to the hundreds of emails I get, but that would be a
> full time
> >job.
> >
> >I have been keeping a little quiet on all the little details, the
> >information I have been gathering on the ordinance and how
> it passed,
> >and the legal strategy for getting this ordinance changed.
> This will
> >go to court and I can't spill all the beans now.
> >
> >Brian Kraut
> >www.jaxairplane.com
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> Charlie England
> >Sent: Saturday, July 22, 2006 11:31 PM Solution?
> >
> >
> >--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England
> >--> <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
> >
> >Pete Cowper wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >>--> RV-List message posted by: pcowper@webtv.net (Pete Cowper)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>"I also believe that two judges orders confirm that I was not doing
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>anything wrong,"
> >>
> >>Brian's posts show that he appears to be a rather calm and
> >>level-headed person, and some third parties who have met
> him confirm
> >>this.
> >>
> >>For the city council to legislate in favor of the sole whining
> >>neighbor seems suspect, the whole story may show that Brian
> has been
> >>caught up in a citywide problem.
> >>
> >>I trust the list understands that my comment about the pole tent
> >>workshop was tongue-in-cheek and intended to illustrate the need to
> >>listen to both sides of the issue before jumping to conclusions.
> >>Having been a lawyer in California for almost 20 years in both
> >>criminal prosecution and defense as well as a civil litigation
> >>practice the past 15 years . . . I am always hesitant to
> determine the
> >>merits of a case based on hearing only one side of the
> story. Whether
> >>it is from the
> >>
> >>
> >>
> > >snipped
> >
> >
> >
> >>Pete Cowper
> >>RV-8 #81139
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >It seems to me that discussing this as a 'case' misses the point
> >entirely.
> >
> >If this was a 'case', it would have been dealt with as a
> 'case' (Brian
> >has apparently already dealt with the 'case').
> >
> >This city (which happens to be an entire county) has legislated that
> >*all* its citizens cannot exercise their constitutional
> rights in two
> >areas. No restrictions were placed on hobbies like antique tractor
> >restoration, which in every way could be just as dangerous and/or
> >irritating to neighbors.
> >
> >Strategy & tactics used to respond can be debated, but there is no
> >doubt in my mind that this blatantly unconstitutional, like
> most of the
> >laws restricting conduct in the last 30-40 years. (Why do
> we allow the
> >FAA to call our right to fly a 'privilege'? Is my right to vote a
> >'privilege' just because I can lose it if I'm convicted of a felony?)
> >
> >Charlie
> >
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