Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:10 AM - Re: Fuel flow pulsation dampener (Jeff Point)
2. 02:02 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (RAS)
3. 02:28 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Jim Sears)
4. 04:13 AM - Re: Fuel flow pulsation dampener (FLYaDIVE@aol.com)
5. 05:24 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Rick Galati)
6. 05:45 AM - RV Area at COPPERSTATE Regional EAA Fly-In (JAMES MCCHESNEY)
7. 06:21 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Chuck Jensen)
8. 06:32 AM - Re: Relocating plane prior to phase one complete (Tim Bryan)
9. 07:12 AM - Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Ron Lee)
10. 07:12 AM - Re: Relocating plane prior to phase one complete (Mike Robertson)
11. 07:37 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (linn Walters)
12. 07:57 AM - Re: XM Antenna through Fiberglass? (Dane Sheahen)
13. 10:04 AM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Tedd McHenry)
14. 10:08 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Paul Besing)
15. 10:54 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Paul Besing)
16. 11:04 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Richard McBride)
17. 11:07 AM - Baggage Compartment Temperatures (James H Nelson)
18. 11:19 AM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Tim Bryan)
19. 11:27 AM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Terry Watson)
20. 12:03 PM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Rob Prior (rv7))
21. 12:45 PM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Tim Bryan)
22. 03:13 PM - Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (Roger Crandell)
23. 04:33 PM - Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? (JOHN STARN)
24. 05:22 PM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (DOUGPFLYRV@aol.com)
25. 06:07 PM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Charlie England)
26. 06:12 PM - Re: 10 Vane Oil Cooler (Dale Walter)
27. 06:49 PM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Ron Lee)
28. 07:25 PM - Re: Baggage Compartment Temperatures (dick martin)
29. 08:19 PM - Re: 10 Vane Oil Cooler (Konrad L. Werner)
30. 09:12 PM - Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison (Paul Besing)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel flow pulsation dampener |
--> RV-List message posted by: Jeff Point <jpoint@mindspring.com>
I had a similar, but not quite so high, oscilation on my flow readings.
I installed the dampener and it smoothed things out considerably. It's
not much $ or much work to install, and I recommend it.
Jeff Point
RV-6 flying
RV-8 preview plans
Milwaukee
>*
>*
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
I disagree very strongly, placed oredr with Wicks and recived only half
items ordered. Even some items which were supposed to be part of a
wheelkit (not for RV) were missing, or short. No apologies, no contact
beforehand.
Aircraft Spruce is far better and keeps in touch and let you make a
choice if items are on backorder.
In addition if you order online it indicates if parts are in stock.
MR
----- Original Message -----
From: passpat@aol.com
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 11:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
BUY FROM WICKS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE
PAT
-----Original Message-----
From: bertrv6@highstream.net
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 2:30 PM
Subject: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
--> RV-List message posted by: bertrv6@highstream.net
Hi:
I have tried for the past two weeks, to call Spruce, to place a small
order.
This is not exageration, I have made at least eight calls, Starting
at 12:00 my time, East Coast...to 4:30 PM..
No one ever answers, I have hold at one time for 3 minutes...
I cannot understand, why sucessfull companies, ingnore this...
I wrote a letter to Jim Irwin,, maybe I get a respond...
If they want that one fax, or e-mail, they should say so....but then
are they going to list correct prices??
I will not buy from them unless is absolutely necessary for me to do
so..
Any one has had this problem ?
Would like to hear suggestions..
Bert
rv6a
do not archive
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
I guess we can get bad service from anyone we deal with. I had a
similar situation with ACS. It took over two months to get in an order
that should have come in the first pass. The parts I really needed just
dribbled in. I've not encountered that with Wicks. Around here, I
talked with several others who had the same kinds of problems with ACS;
so, I figured it was a company to not do business with. Later on, I
helped another build a RV-9A. I had warned him of my problems with ACS;
but, he tried them anyway. By the time he got his oil and fuel hoses,
he was totally fed up with them. We can probably find poor service from
any source we talk about; but, it's been my experience, and that of
others, that Wicks has done a better job. Unfortunately, they don't
have the same level of offerings as ACS. Like I said, I gave the
company a second chance, as suggested. I was not satisfied.
Jim in KY
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: RAS
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 5:01 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
I disagree very strongly, placed oredr with Wicks and recived only
half items ordered. Even some items which were supposed to be part of a
wheelkit (not for RV) were missing, or short. No apologies, no contact
beforehand.
Aircraft Spruce is far better and keeps in touch and let you make a
choice if items are on backorder.
In addition if you order online it indicates if parts are in stock.
MR
----- Original Message -----
From: passpat@aol.com
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 11:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
BUY FROM WICKS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE
PAT
-----Original Message-----
From: bertrv6@highstream.net
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 2:30 PM
Subject: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
--> RV-List message posted by: bertrv6@highstream.net
Hi:
I have tried for the past two weeks, to call Spruce, to place a small
order.
This is not exageration, I have made at least eight calls, Starting
at 12:00 my time, East Coast...to 4:30 PM..
No one ever answers, I have hold at one time for 3 minutes...
I cannot understand, why sucessfull companies, ingnore this...
I wrote a letter to Jim Irwin,, maybe I get a respond...
If they want that one fax, or e-mail, they should say so....but then
are they going to list correct prices??
I will not buy from them unless is absolutely necessary for me to do
so..
Any one has had this problem ?
Would like to hear suggestions..
Bert
rv6a
do not archive
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
com/Navigator?RV-List
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel flow pulsation dampener |
--> RV-List message posted by: FLYaDIVE@aol.com
In a message dated 9/6/06 2:44:29 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
l_klingmuller6@earthlink.net writes:
> I have a J P fuel flow/fuel totalizer but are somewhat disappointed in the
> fuel flow readings. These fluctuate constantly within a +/- up to 1 gl/hr
> rate. Now my installation is not accordingly to the manufactures
> recommendation which calls for 6 inches of straight line on the inlet and
> outlet sides. I attached the sensor right to the gascolator out side since
> this seems to be a much sounder installation scheme.
>
> Questions for those who have been there: Is it worthwhile (time, $) to
> install the Dralle dampener??
> I do not recall seeing too many post on this subject on the list. Could
not
> find anything in the achieves.
>
> Lothar, 6A, 650 hrs
=========================================
Lothar:
I have installed 5 fuel flow totalizes, that extra length of straight run
depends on how you hooked up the fittings. Especially if you did a 90 Deg turn
in fuel flow before entering or leaving the transducer.
I have never used the Dralle Dampener, ONLY a smooth flow of fuel is
required. In one case where a 90 Deg turn was needed I had to fabricate a fitting
with oversized bores and a cut away internal turn. This either reduced or
eliminated internal restriction or caviation.
Questions:
The variance you are seeing, I guess you are seeing it during S&L flight?
How is the accuracy of the instrument on Gallons Remaining?
By playing with the 'k' factor you might take the gage from a borderline
reading into a more stabilized reading without affecting the Gallons Remaining
reading.
Barry
"Chop'd Liver"
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Rick Galati" <rick6a@yahoo.com>
Over the past 6 years I have dealt with both companies frequently, literally spending
thousands of dollars to support my addiction. As far as I am concerned,
both Wicks and Spruce are national treasures. Both companies offer excellent
service......generally. In my experience, Spruce's Jim Irwin will personally
contact you relative to customer satisfaction issues or catalog suggestions.
If you would like to see Spruce carry a particular item, by all means.....ask
him....not necessarily the person who answers the phone. The fact that Spruce's
catalog grows ever thicker by the year with a growing inventory of choices
does not happen by accident. Nothing however, is perfect. On occasion, I have
found Spruce's on-line ordering process to be flawed. It can sometimes be difficult
to locate items you know they carry and at times prices are at variance
with those posted in the print catalog. Just yesterday I placed a rather eclectic
order and the on-line check-out cart indicated all the items were in stock.
When the routine order confirmation arrrived via e-mail, it noted one item
on backorder. I consider these to be a very minor frustrations and part of
the price we sometimes pay for the convenience of e-commerce.
As a people, we can be inclined towards instant gratification, the fast food expectation
by another name. Well, homebuilt aircraft construction will puts the
halts to that inclination very quickly. Instant gratification has no place
in our hobby. I have become "almost" comfortable dealing with the frustration
and deferred satisfactions that are an inevitable part of this hobby. Is it
all worth it? Oh Yea....and then some.
Rick Galati RV-6A "Darla" 165 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=59900#59900
Message 6
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| Subject: | RV Area at COPPERSTATE Regional EAA Fly-In |
Hello RV Listers-
My Name is Jim McChesney. In addition to working full time and building
an RV-7A I am in charge of Aircraft Parking at Copperstate Regional EAA
Fly-In. This year's fly-in will be held at the Casa Grande, Arizona
municipal airport (CGZ) from October 26-29, 2006.
http://www.copperstate.org/<http://www.copperstate.org/>
The reason for this post is to see if there is any interest in having an
RV-specific area on the main showplane ramp this year? And, if so, is
there anyone available and willing to staff such an area?
We always have a really good showing from the RV guys but unfortunately
I just don't have the volunteer manpower to staff an RV parking area.
One person would NOT be able to do this alone so we'd need to assemble a
crew of 3-4 people (minimum) to man this area. If anyone is interested
in taking charge of this area or working there, please contact me off
list. The usual perks apply: free admission, free food, plenty of sun.
Jim McChesney
RV-7A
Message 7
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| Subject: | Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Chuck Jensen" <cjensen@dts9000.com>
I'm amused by the concern about 'spotty' service. The complainers have
obvious never run a small business selling in small lots to small buyers
that obsess over the cost of a Tinnerman washer. I'm sure Wicks and ACS
both work their tails off to do the best they can. I have no knowledge
of their particlarly circumstances but they undoubtably have to rely on
a low paid workforce that is not always reliable. Why hire cheap,
unreliable help...because their customer's demand 'cheap'. It all falls
under the 'you get what you pay for', so a little forebearance is in
order. If it'll help you cope, just be pleased and surprised with
something is shipped on time and correctly. Lowered expectations is a
good anti-dote for disappointment.
Personal opinion: Given the low margins they work with, both Wicks and
ACS give good to exemplary service.
Chuck Jensen
Do Not Archive
Message 8
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| Subject: | Relocating plane prior to phase one complete |
Hi Mike,
Thank You. I am expecting to get my inspection for AW in about two weeks
=2E
I want to fly enough hours to be sure I am comfortable with the plane and
eliminate any squaks. How long do I need to allow to obtain the ferry
permit?
Thanks
Tim
-------Original Message-------
From: Mike Robertson
Subject: RE: RV-List: Relocating plane prior to phase one complete
Tim,
Call me at (503) 615-3237 and I will give you a hand to get a Ferry permi
t
to Texas.
Mike Robertson
From: flyrv6@bryantechnology.com
Subject: RV-List: Relocating plane prior to phase one complete
Hi Listers,
I am planning to move to Texas from Oregon in mid to late October. My pl
ane
will have been inspected and maybe 15 hours flown off by then. I asked m
y
DAR if I could get a ferry permit to move it to Texas. Since it crosses
several teritorries, he was not certain. Has anybody ever done this?
I definately want to have enough time on the plane to be comfortable and
have any issues worked out. But will need to establish a new phase one a
rea
once it is relocated.
Tim
RV-6
N616TB
t=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
p://forums.matronics.com
//wiki.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Use Messenger to talk to your IM friends, even those on Yahoo! Talk now!
==========
==========
==========
==========
==========
Message 9
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| Subject: | Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
--> RV-List message posted by: Ron Lee <ronlee@pcisys.net>
>Yesterday I had the chance to compare my Lightspeed (LS) Twenty 3G
headsets against a pair of Bose. This is a quick, non-scientific review.
I could detect an improvement in noise reduction with the Bose but
suspect that the difference would be minimal or non-existent with
a pair of LS Thirty 3G headsets (6 db better active noise reduction
than Twenty 3G).
The ear clamping force on the Bose was less which I thought would
make them less effective in reducing noise. I was wrong.
The Bose weighs about 120 grams (4 ounces) less.
The earcup assemblies are about an inch thinner on the Bose.
I did not wear the Bose for the entire flight so I can't make any comments
about it being more comfortable but it is nice. It looks sleeker because of
the smaller earcup assemblies.
Bottom line is that I don't know that it would be worth $400 more than a pair
of LS 30-3Gs.
Ron Lee
Message 10
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| Subject: | Relocating plane prior to phase one complete |
If you get 25 hours on your phase one test flight period then you will need
a minimum of 10 hours and have no mechanical discrepancies. If you have a
40 hours test period then you will need at least 15 hours and have no outs
tanding discrepancies. You will also have to plot a route including all fu
el stops. Needless to say the route must be over sparsely populated areas.
Going from Bend to anywhere in Texas, that shouldn't be a problem.
Mike
list@matronics.comSubject: RE: RV-List: Relocating plane prior to phase one
complete
Hi Mike,
Thank You. I am expecting to get my inspection for AW in about two weeks.
I want to fly enough hours to be sure I am comfortable with the plane and
eliminate any squaks. How long do I need to allow to obtain the ferry perm
it?
Thanks
Tim
-------Original Message-------
From: Mike Robertson
Subject: RE: RV-List: Relocating plane prior to phase one complete
Tim, Call me at (503) 615-3237 and I will give you a hand to get a Ferry p
ermit to Texas. Mike Robertson
list@matronics.comSubject: RV-List: Relocating plane prior to phase one com
plete
Hi Listers,
I am planning to move to Texas from Oregon in mid to late October. My plan
e will have been inspected and maybe 15 hours flown off by then. I asked m
y DAR if I could get a ferry permit to move it to Texas. Since it crosses
several teritorries, he was not certain. Has anybody ever done this?
I definately want to have enough time on the plane to be comfortable and ha
ve any issues worked out. But will need to establish a new phase one area
once it is relocated.
Tim
RV-6
N616TB
t=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
p://forums.matronics.com
//wiki.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Use Messenger to talk to your IM friends, even those on Yahoo! Talk now!
p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
onics.com
s.com
ww.matronics.com/contribution
_________________________________________________________________
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685ee3e858fe
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
It's been a long time since I was in the parts ordering phase, but from
the muttering, threats, and proposed dire consequences of those watching
their bank account slowly dry up ..... there ain't nobody out there
perfect. If you have a bad experience, maybe it's just your turn! In
this age of instant gratification, picture this scenario .........
Vendor X (pick your favorite one) finds a really neat widget, and stocks
20 of them, and puts them in the online catalog and database. Joe 'big
time' builder sees the widget, and has to have it. He installs the
widget, loves it and then rants on the X list (again, pick your favorite
one or many!) about how it reallyb works and saves ya big buck down the
road. 700 listers read the email, and only 200 go online to the link
provided and see there are still 19 widgets left. Hit the purchase
button, enter your credit card info and sit back with much anticipation.
Gotta have that widget!!!! Now pan to stage right where Vendor X
starts filling that mountain of orders, and in one hour, the stock goes
from 19 to zippo. There are now 181 backorders and purchasing is
notified. Well, the backorder ed part goes into the que along with the
other 264,789 items that are on 'bin low' status (remember that Vendor X
has a 3" thick catalog of stuff ..... it's the reason you do business
with them) ...... and they slog through the paperwork to order new
stock. Your widget takes two weeks to make it to the top of the queue
..... and purchasing can't get hold of the MFGR because they're shut
down for summer vacation and all four people are enjoying their time
off. Meanwhile, Joe 'big time' builder has been calling everyday, along
with the other 180 builders on the widget backorder list (by some stroke
of luck, all the other orders have been filled ;-) ) and customer
service is trying hard to answer the phone while listening to 180
different reasons why their project is most important and should bubble
to the top of the backorder list immediately ........ and the phone
keeps ringing, and the phone queue keeps getting longer ......
Well, so much for the scenario ..... one really neat widget has managed
to p..s off 181 builders who rant on the list about the poor service of
Vendor X .... which creates an exponential amount of emails extolling
the virtues or failures of Vendor X.
Solly Cholly! Crap happens in the real world. Me??? I'm just damn
thankful I have two companies (mainly Wicks and ACS&S) that I can go to
and get parts. Oh yeah, the order for 200 widgets made enough profit
for the widget makers that they decided to retire and bail out of the
ratrace ...... nad now Vendor X is looking for another supplier!
Sorry for the creativity and loss of bandwidth, but I was on a roll!!!
Linn
do not archive
Soapbox available now!
Jim Sears wrote:
> I guess we can get bad service from anyone we deal with. I had a
> similar situation with ACS. It took over two months to get in an
> order that should have come in the first pass. The parts I really
> needed just dribbled in. I've not encountered that with Wicks.
> Around here, I talked with several others who had the same kinds of
> problems with ACS; so, I figured it was a company to not do
> business with. Later on, I helped another build a RV-9A. I had
> warned him of my problems with ACS; but, he tried them anyway. By the
> time he got his oil and fuel hoses, he was totally fed up with
> them. We can probably find poor service from any source we talk
> about; but, it's been my experience, and that of others, that Wicks
> has done a better job. Unfortunately, they don't have the same level
> of offerings as ACS. Like I said, I gave the company a second chance,
> as suggested. I was not satisfied.
>
> Jim in KY
> do not archive
Message 12
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| Subject: | XM Antenna through Fiberglass? |
Mike
Do you have metal flake paint on the fiberglass? Dick Martin informed me it
did affect his antennas in his wing tips. I assume it would do the same in
receiving the XM signal
Dane Sheahen
N838RV RV8a
Subject: RV-List: XM Antenna through Fiberglass?
I have had success mounting the GPS antenna under the fiberglass cowl, so I
thought I'd try it with my XM antenna. It seems to work, but not as well.
The weather seems to take longer to download and the music is spotty at
times. I don't know if it is because I have it close to the baffles and it
may be blocking reception during climbs in certain directions, or if it is
because of the fiberglass.
Has anyone had success mounting theirs under fiberglass?? Does anyone know
if it should work?
Thanks
-Mike Kraus
RV-4 flying
RV-10 building
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
--> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry <tedd@vansairforce.org>
I have two pairs of Lightspeed headsets that I'm happy with the performance of.
But earlier this year I had a problem with one and called Lightspeed for help.
I was told that my model is no longer supported and they don't stock parts for
it, but they invited me to upgrade to a newer model.
I really don't think it's too much to ask that a company support and stock
parts for a headset that's less than ten years old, so I wasn't very impressed
with that. Fortunately, the problem turned out to be only a broken wire. But
when an actual Lightspeed part eventually fails the headset will be scrap. I
doubt that would happen with a David Clark, at the same age.
---
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC, Canada
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
There's a rumor going around that if you live on the west coast, your service with
ACS is better than if you live on the east coast. I have never had a problem
with them when the parts came from their california location...I have had
one or two issues from what I recall if they came from the east coast location...too
strange..I do remember talking with someone who has heard the same thing.
Live close to CA, get fine service and delivery..east coast, maybe not. Central?
Well, like rolling the dice I guess.
Paul Besing
Jim Sears <jmsears@adelphia.net> wrote:
I guess we can get bad service from anyone we deal with. I had a similar
situation with ACS. It took over two months to get in an order that should have
come in the first pass. The parts I really needed just dribbled in. I've
not encountered that with Wicks. Around here, I talked with several others who
had the same kinds of problems with ACS; so, I figured it was a company to
not do business with. Later on, I helped another build a RV-9A. I had warned
him of my problems with ACS; but, he tried them anyway. By the time he got his
oil and fuel hoses, he was totally fed up with them. We can probably find
poor service from any source we talk about; but, it's been my experience, and
that of others, that Wicks has done a better job. Unfortunately, they don't have
the same level of offerings as ACS. Like I said, I gave the company a second
chance, as suggested. I was not satisfied.
Jim in KY
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: RAS
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 5:01 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
I disagree very strongly, placed oredr with Wicks and recived only half items
ordered. Even some items which were supposed to be part of a wheelkit (not for
RV) were missing, or short. No apologies, no contact beforehand.
Aircraft Spruce is far better and keeps in touch and let you make a choice if
items are on backorder.
In addition if you order online it indicates if parts are in stock.
MR
----- Original Message -----
From: passpat@aol.com
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 11:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
BUY FROM WICKS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE
PAT
-----Original Message-----
From: bertrv6@highstream.net
Sent: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 2:30 PM
Subject: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
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--> RV-List message posted by: bertrv6@highstream.net Hi: I have tried
for the past two weeks, to call Spruce, to place a small order. This is not
exageration, I have made at least eight calls, Starting at 12:00 my time,
East Coast...to 4:30 PM.. No one ever answers, I have hold at one time
for 3 minutes... I cannot understand, why sucessfull companies, ingnore
this... I wrote a letter to Jim Irwin,, maybe I get a respond... If they
want that one fax, or e-mail, they should say so....but then are they going
to list correct prices?? I will not buy from them unless is absolutely necessary
for me to do so.. Any one has had this problem ? Would like to
hear suggestions.. Bert rv6a do not archive
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Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
Good points, Linn...basic supply chain issues here, and the scenario about all
four people taking off for the summer is so true...lots of small businesses sell
to ACS (including myself). Fortunately, making CD's for shipment isn't a big
deal for me.
Paul Besing
linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net> wrote:
It's been a long time since I was in the parts ordering phase, but from the muttering,
threats, and proposed dire consequences of those watching their bank
account slowly dry up ..... there ain't nobody out there perfect. If you have
a bad experience, maybe it's just your turn! In this age of instant gratification,
picture this scenario ......... Vendor X (pick your favorite one) finds
a really neat widget, and stocks 20 of them, and puts them in the online catalog
and database. Joe 'big time' builder sees the widget, and has to have it.
He installs the widget, loves it and then rants on the X list (again, pick
your favorite one or many!) about how it reallyb works and saves ya big buck
down the road. 700 listers read the email, and only 200 go online to the link
provided and see there are still 19 widgets left. Hit the purchase button, enter
your credit card info and sit back with much anticipation. Gotta have that
widget!!!! Now pan to stage right where Vendor
X starts filling that mountain of orders, and in one hour, the stock goes from
19 to zippo. There are now 181 backorders and purchasing is notified. Well,
the backorder ed part goes into the que along with the other 264,789 items that
are on 'bin low' status (remember that Vendor X has a 3" thick catalog of stuff
..... it's the reason you do business with them) ...... and they slog through
the paperwork to order new stock. Your widget takes two weeks to make it
to the top of the queue ..... and purchasing can't get hold of the MFGR because
they're shut down for summer vacation and all four people are enjoying their
time off. Meanwhile, Joe 'big time' builder has been calling everyday, along
with the other 180 builders on the widget backorder list (by some stroke of
luck, all the other orders have been filled ;-) ) and customer service is trying
hard to answer the phone while listening to 180 different reasons why their
project is most important and should bubble to the
top of the backorder list immediately ........ and the phone keeps ringing, and
the phone queue keeps getting longer ......
Well, so much for the scenario ..... one really neat widget has managed to p..s
off 181 builders who rant on the list about the poor service of Vendor X ....
which creates an exponential amount of emails extolling the virtues or failures
of Vendor X.
Solly Cholly! Crap happens in the real world. Me??? I'm just damn thankful I
have two companies (mainly Wicks and ACS&S) that I can go to and get parts.
Oh yeah, the order for 200 widgets made enough profit for the widget makers that
they decided to retire and bail out of the ratrace ...... nad now Vendor X
is looking for another supplier!
Sorry for the creativity and loss of bandwidth, but I was on a roll!!!
Linn
do not archive
Soapbox available now!
Jim Sears wrote:
I guess we can get bad service from anyone we deal with. I had a similar
situation with ACS. It took over two months to get in an order that should have
come in the first pass. The parts I really needed just dribbled in. I've
not encountered that with Wicks. Around here, I talked with several others who
had the same kinds of problems with ACS; so, I figured it was a company to
not do business with. Later on, I helped another build a RV-9A. I had warned
him of my problems with ACS; but, he tried them anyway. By the time he got his
oil and fuel hoses, he was totally fed up with them. We can probably find
poor service from any source we talk about; but, it's been my experience, and
that of others, that Wicks has done a better job. Unfortunately, they don't have
the same level of offerings as ACS. Like I said, I gave the company a second
chance, as suggested. I was not satisfied.
Jim in KY
do not archive
---------------------------------
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
Well I can address that one. I've done more than my fair share of
business with ACS (and Wicks and others) since 1986 for the refurb of a
'53 PA-22, the construction of an RV-6 and an RV-8 and now a Rans S-7S.
During that time, due to my vagabond existence thanks to Uncle Sam, I've
been stationed in North Carolina, San Antonio, TX, Rochester, NY,
Chicago, IL, Atlanta, GA and now Washington DC. During that time and at
all of those locations I have never had a timeliness issue with order
delivery from ACS. In fact, since they opened (bought) the GA operation
I usually get my orders within two to three working days (standard
delivery) here in Virginia. My most recent experiences with Wicks is
slightly longer and with Van's well over a week to ten days; but they
have a further distance to travel. Both ACS and Wicks have always
delivered as expected. We're fortunate that we have both suppliers to
service our needs, it could be a lot worse.
Rick McBride
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Besing<mailto:pbesing@yahoo.com>
To: rv-list@matronics.com<mailto:rv-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 1:07 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
There's a rumor going around that if you live on the west coast, your
service with ACS is better than if you live on the east coast. I have
never had a problem with them when the parts came from their california
location...I have had one or two issues from what I recall if they came
from the east coast location...too strange..I do remember talking with
someone who has heard the same thing. Live close to CA, get fine
service and delivery..east coast, maybe not. Central? Well, like
rolling the dice I guess.
Paul Besing
Jim Sears <jmsears@adelphia.net> wrote:
I guess we can get bad service from anyone we deal with. I had a
similar situation with ACS. It took over two months to get in an order
that should have come in the first pass. The parts I really needed just
dribbled in. I've not encountered that with Wicks. Around here, I
talked with several others who had the same kinds of problems with ACS;
so, I figured it was a company to not do business with. Later on, I
helped another build a RV-9A. I had warned him of my problems with ACS;
but, he tried them anyway. By the time he got his oil and fuel hoses,
he was totally fed up with them. We can probably find poor service from
any source we talk about; but, it's been my experience, and that of
others, that Wicks has done a better job. Unfortunately, they don't
have the same level of offerings as ACS. Like I said, I gave the
company a second chance, as suggested. I was not satisfied.
Jim in KY
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: RAS<mailto:deruiteraircraftservices@btinternet.com>
To: rv-list@matronics.com<mailto:rv-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 5:01 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
I disagree very strongly, placed oredr with Wicks and recived only
half items ordered. Even some items which were supposed to be part of a
wheelkit (not for RV) were missing, or short. No apologies, no contact
beforehand.
Aircraft Spruce is far better and keeps in touch and let you make
a choice if items are on backorder.
In addition if you order online it indicates if parts are in
stock.
MR
----- Original Message -----
From: passpat@aol.com<mailto:passpat@aol.com>
To: rv-list@matronics.com<mailto:rv-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 11:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
BUY FROM WICKS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE
PAT
-----Original Message-----
From: bertrv6@highstream.net<mailto:bertrv6@highstream.net>
To: rv-list@matronics.com<mailto:rv-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 2:30 PM
Subject: RV-List: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service?
--> RV-List message posted by:
bertrv6@highstream.net<mailto:bertrv6@highstream.net> Hi: I
have tried for the past two weeks, to call Spruce, to place a small
order. This is not exageration, I have made at least eight calls,
Starting at 12:00 my time, East Coast...to 4:30 PM.. No one ever
answers, I have hold at one time for 3 minutes... I cannot
understand, why sucessfull companies, ingnore this... I wrote a
letter to Jim Irwin,, maybe I get a respond... If they want that one
fax, or e-mail, they should say so....but then are they going to list
correct prices?? I will not buy from them unless is absolutely
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Message 17
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| Subject: | Baggage Compartment Temperatures |
--> RV-List message posted by: James H Nelson <rv9jim@juno.com>
Hi Dick,
What was that 3M tape you were talking about. I'd like to
explore using it on my fire wall.
Jim Nelson
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
At ten years this could very well be the case with your 50K car. After t
en
years the parts start to dry up. Unless the aftermarket picks up the mol
ds
or it is a component that is available through the local auto zone.
Tim
Do Not Archive.
-------Original Message-------
From: Tedd McHenry
Subject: Re: RV-List: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison
--> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry <tedd@vansairforce.org>
I have two pairs of Lightspeed headsets that I'm happy with the performan
ce
of.
But earlier this year I had a problem with one and called Lightspeed for
help.
I was told that my model is no longer supported and they don't stock part
s
for
it, but they invited me to upgrade to a newer model.
I really don't think it's too much to ask that a company support and stoc
k
parts for a headset that's less than ten years old, so I wasn't very
impressed
with that. Fortunately, the problem turned out to be only a broken wire.
But
when an actual Lightspeed part eventually fails the headset will be scrap
=2E
I
doubt that would happen with a David Clark, at the same age.
---
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC, Canada
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Message 19
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| Subject: | Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
I have been quite pleased with Aircraft Spruce over the last couple of
years. A few months ago I screwed up an on-line order and within a few
minutes had an email from them telling me that I had provided an invalid
credit card number. A few minutes later I received a call from them to
straighten it out.
I also see that they now provide virtually instant email quotes on avionics
that they don't show prices for in their catalog.
I get the impression that they have worked hard and successfully to correct
previous inadequacies in their service. Unlike a few years ago, I now like
to buy from them.
Terry
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Rob Prior (rv7)" <rv7@b4.ca>
On 11:18:51 2006-09-06 "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com> wrote:
> At ten years this could very well be the case with your 50K car.
> After ten years the parts start to dry up. Unless the aftermarket
> picks up the molds or it is a component that is available through the
> local auto zone. Tim
Maybe if it's american-made... But i've never had problems obtaining parts
for 15-20 year old japanese cars or motorcycles. Honda always seems to
have parts. You'll just have to pay exorbitant amounts of money for them...
-Rob
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
Good point Rob.
Tim
Do Not Archive
-------Original Message-------
From: Rob Prior (rv7)
Subject: Re: RV-List: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison
--> RV-List message posted by: "Rob Prior (rv7)" <rv7@b4.ca>
On 11:18:51 2006-09-06 "Tim Bryan" <flyrv6@bryantechnology.com> wrote:
> At ten years this could very well be the case with your 50K car.
> After ten years the parts start to dry up. Unless the aftermarket
> picks up the molds or it is a component that is available through the
> local auto zone. Tim
Maybe if it's american-made... But i've never had problems obtaining part
s
for 15-20 year old japanese cars or motorcycles. Honda always seems to
have parts. You'll just have to pay exorbitant amounts of money for them
=2E..
-Rob
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Message 22
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| Subject: | RE: Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "Roger Crandell" <rwc000@hotmail.com>
I have ordered from ACS for about 6 years and must state they have always
provided me with outstanding service and pricing. Because of my remote
location, I order many items using the internet. ACS is one of, if not the
best I have ever dealt with. How many internet businesses will ship instock
items immediately and later ship the backordered items free of charge?
Roger Crandell
_________________________________________________________________
Got something to buy, sell or swap? Try Windows Live Expo
ttp://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwex0010000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://expo.live.com/
Message 23
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| Subject: | Aircraft Spruce terrible Service? |
--> RV-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn@verizon.net>
I don't need to defend Jim or ACS but I'll been purchasing from them for
more years than I care to remember. When I started buying there was only one
store in an old vacated wooden warehouse right next to the RR tracks
(complete with loading docks for RR cars) in Fullerton. I had my Plumbing &
A/C business about a block away on Harbor Blvd. I was the guy that took
orders from pilot friends & did the will call. I tried to not be at ACS
between 2 and 4 pm because that's when the long trains came by & the
building shook & there was dust (think the building may have been used for
grain storage) everywhere. I was impressed by the staff that did a quick
clean up & got back to business. Phone calls as the trains went by, forget
it.
My impression of the new store(s) and the service has not changed. If they
have it, you get it. They are upfront if they don't have it & when they
"might" be able to have it to you. I place my orders via phone & on-line and
have some split orders...some items shipped from CA & the rest from GA.
Their return/replacement has never been a problem for me, their mistake or
mine.
KABONG Do Not Archive. (GBA & GWB)
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
I agree with Ron. I bought the Bose & Lightspeed at the same time.....tried
them both and sent the Bose back. Not worth the additional cost in my opinion.
Doug Preston
RV-7 N731RV (For Sale)
RV-7A N196VA ( 26 hours)
RV-10 (Getting close)
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
Tedd McHenry wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry <tedd@vansairforce.org>
>
>I have two pairs of Lightspeed headsets that I'm happy with the performance of.
>But earlier this year I had a problem with one and called Lightspeed for help.
>I was told that my model is no longer supported and they don't stock parts for
>it, but they invited me to upgrade to a newer model.
>
>I really don't think it's too much to ask that a company support and stock
>parts for a headset that's less than ten years old, so I wasn't very impressed
>with that. Fortunately, the problem turned out to be only a broken wire. But
>when an actual Lightspeed part eventually fails the headset will be scrap. I
>doubt that would happen with a David Clark, at the same age.
>
>---
>
>Tedd McHenry
>Surrey, BC, Canada
>
Hi Tedd,
Since I'm the originator of the recent 'rant' controversy, I thought I
might play 'devil's advocate' for a change.
I feel your frustration, since I just went through the exact same issue
with a pair of 20K's (which I bought used, from an individual) and a
pair of 15XL's that I bought new. My experience was that the tech guy
said that they *might* not be able to fix the 20K's; I could trade them
up if I wanted; but send them anyway & they'd take a look. I just got
both sets back today, repaired, no charge, including wear items like the
pads (2nd time, free, on the 15XL's). I was planning to write the list
tonight to praise LS for their excellent service when I read your post.
Here's my 'devil's advocate' position:
When I ran a consumer electronics repair company in a previous life (no
sales; just repair) & we had to tell a customer that their
stereo/tv/vcr/etc wasn't worth fixing, most got really frustrated with
us, even though we didn't sell the product to them. My explanation
usually ran something like, "I know it's only x years old, but you only
paid y dollars for it. If you had paid 3 times y dollars for it, it
would be worth fixing. I think you came out ahead, even though it's hard
to adjust to 'disposable' products." Manufacturers of almost all
products are pushing us into disposable products by jacking up the
replacement parts prices so high they can stay legal (automotive, for
example) by keeping just a couple of parts on a shelf somewhere priced
at half the value of the product. The upside is that most mass produced
products have gotten incredibly inexpensive relative to what they do.
The LS headsets are (mostly) constructed of very inexpensive, often
flimsy, parts. The purchase price, compared to the high end stuff,
reflects it. One of the ways to keep costs down is not restocking custom
parts after changing models (common practice; there's a particular
relatively high dollar GPS brand that quit supplying even database
updates after just 3 or 4 years, a while back). The impressive thing
about LS is that I've never heard of anyone that paid for a repair on
them, no matter what the age. Not so for some of the high end brands.
The $1k brands can probably be fixed 'forever' but it's likely to cost
almost as much as a new pair of LS for each repair.
I can't stop without griping about something; they wouldn't let me trade
in the 20K's on a pair of the new in-the-ear models.
:-)
Charlie
Message 26
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| Subject: | 10 Vane Oil Cooler |
Barry,
Our oil cooler came from Vans, 4/11/2001, part number 4215, per Vans
invoice; "EA OIL COOLER 4215, OIL COOLER FOR IO-360". I had forgotten our
cooler was for the IO and not the "O" model, but I would recommend it.
We have the O-360, 180 hp. I will try to find the mfg info next time I take
the bottom cowl off. Maybe Vans can tell you who makes the #4215.
Pic attached.
Dale
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of FLYaDIVE@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 11:09 AM
Subject: RV-List: 10 Vane Oil Cooler
--> RV-List message posted by: FLYaDIVE@aol.com
Hey Flight:
Who is the manufacture and what is the part number for the 10 Vane Oil
Cooler
used on the RV-6 with an O-360?
Thanks for the feedback,
Barry
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
At 06:21 PM 9/6/2006, you wrote:
>I agree with Ron. I bought the Bose & Lightspeed at the same
>time.....tried them both and sent the Bose back. Not worth the additional
>cost in my opinion.
Doug was it the Lightspeed 20-3G or 30-3G?
Ron Lee
Do not archive
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Baggage Compartment Temperatures |
--> RV-List message posted by: "dick martin" <martin@gbonline.com>
Jim,
It is called 3M VIBRATION DAMPING TAPE.
It is used by commercial medium and large twin engine type repair and
refurbishing companys. It is also used by none aviation users. Suggest you
try 3M website for vendors in your area.
Dick Martin
RV8 N233M
the fast one
----- Original Message -----
From: "James H Nelson" <rv9jim@juno.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 1:05 PM
Subject: RV-List: Baggage Compartment Temperatures
> --> RV-List message posted by: James H Nelson <rv9jim@juno.com>
>
> Hi Dick,
> What was that 3M tape you were talking about. I'd like to
> explore using it on my fire wall.
>
> Jim Nelson
>
>
>
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: 10 Vane Oil Cooler |
Dale,
Yours looks like a PosiTech Cooler to me...
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Dale Walter
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 7:11 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: 10 Vane Oil Cooler
Barry,
Our oil cooler came from Vans, 4/11/2001, part number 4215, per Vans
invoice; "EA OIL COOLER 4215, OIL COOLER FOR IO-360". I had forgotten
our
cooler was for the IO and not the "O" model, but I would recommend it.
We have the O-360, 180 hp. I will try to find the mfg info next time I
take
the bottom cowl off. Maybe Vans can tell you who makes the #4215.
Pic attached.
Dale
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
FLYaDIVE@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 11:09 AM
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: 10 Vane Oil Cooler
--> RV-List message posted by: FLYaDIVE@aol.com
Hey Flight:
Who is the manufacture and what is the part number for the 10 Vane Oil
Cooler
used on the RV-6 with an O-360?
Thanks for the feedback,
Barry
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
9/6/2006
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Bose versus Lightspeed headset comparison |
I still can't believe this continues to be a recurring thread. My opinion only,
(not sure why it is not more common, though!) is that to ME it's worth the $1K
for the quality, comfort, and most of all, piece of mind that I won't ever
have to send them back....I don't care if LS sends me a new pair every time or
repairs them...the bottom line is you have to send them back and be without headsets,
pay shipping charges to LS, and frankly, is a pain in the rear.
I'll reiterate from my previous posts...I've had the Bose X for 6 years now,
and have about 1000 hours on a pair. The most of those hours were in and out
of Cessnas while I was a flight instructor, in all kinds of heat, cold, rain,
etc, and not one blip out of them in all that time. To ME, it's worth not every
buying another pair, or having to send one back. Not to mention, I feel that
they are far more comfortable, even if the ANR quality is close enough between
the two.
I now have two pairs of Bose X headsets for the above reasons and don't have
the slightest regret for spending the money...especially when they have no interest
over 12 months. We are airplane builders, flyers, etc..nobody said it was
a cheap hobby!
Again, my opinion only!
Paul Besing
Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net> wrote:
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England
Tedd McHenry wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry
>
>I have two pairs of Lightspeed headsets that I'm happy with the performance of.
>But earlier this year I had a problem with one and called Lightspeed for help.
>I was told that my model is no longer supported and they don't stock parts for
>it, but they invited me to upgrade to a newer model.
>
>I really don't think it's too much to ask that a company support and stock
>parts for a headset that's less than ten years old, so I wasn't very impressed
>with that. Fortunately, the problem turned out to be only a broken wire. But
>when an actual Lightspeed part eventually fails the headset will be scrap. I
>doubt that would happen with a David Clark, at the same age.
>
>---
>
>Tedd McHenry
>Surrey, BC, Canada
>
Hi Tedd,
Since I'm the originator of the recent 'rant' controversy, I thought I
might play 'devil's advocate' for a change.
I feel your frustration, since I just went through the exact same issue
with a pair of 20K's (which I bought used, from an individual) and a
pair of 15XL's that I bought new. My experience was that the tech guy
said that they *might* not be able to fix the 20K's; I could trade them
up if I wanted; but send them anyway & they'd take a look. I just got
both sets back today, repaired, no charge, including wear items like the
pads (2nd time, free, on the 15XL's). I was planning to write the list
tonight to praise LS for their excellent service when I read your post.
Here's my 'devil's advocate' position:
When I ran a consumer electronics repair company in a previous life (no
sales; just repair) & we had to tell a customer that their
stereo/tv/vcr/etc wasn't worth fixing, most got really frustrated with
us, even though we didn't sell the product to them. My explanation
usually ran something like, "I know it's only x years old, but you only
paid y dollars for it. If you had paid 3 times y dollars for it, it
would be worth fixing. I think you came out ahead, even though it's hard
to adjust to 'disposable' products." Manufacturers of almost all
products are pushing us into disposable products by jacking up the
replacement parts prices so high they can stay legal (automotive, for
example) by keeping just a couple of parts on a shelf somewhere priced
at half the value of the product. The upside is that most mass produced
products have gotten incredibly inexpensive relative to what they do.
The LS headsets are (mostly) constructed of very inexpensive, often
flimsy, parts. The purchase price, compared to the high end stuff,
reflects it. One of the ways to keep costs down is not restocking custom
parts after changing models (common practice; there's a particular
relatively high dollar GPS brand that quit supplying even database
updates after just 3 or 4 years, a while back). The impressive thing
about LS is that I've never heard of anyone that paid for a repair on
them, no matter what the age. Not so for some of the high end brands.
The $1k brands can probably be fixed 'forever' but it's likely to cost
almost as much as a new pair of LS for each repair.
I can't stop without griping about something; they wouldn't let me trade
in the 20K's on a pair of the new in-the-ear models.
:-)
Charlie
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