Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:11 AM - Re: Supplier Problem (Chuck Jensen)
2. 05:49 AM - Re: Supplier Problem (Bob Leffler)
3. 06:40 AM - Re: Supplier Problem (Joseph Larson)
4. 06:50 AM - Re: Supplier Problem (Ron Lee)
5. 08:54 AM - Re: Supplier Problem (John Fasching)
6. 08:54 AM - Re: Supplier Problem (Darrell Reiley)
7. 10:00 AM - Re: Supplier Problem (Ron Lee)
8. 10:12 AM - Supplier Problem (John Fasching)
9. 03:37 PM - Re: Breather run into exhaust (nuff said) ()
10. 04:39 PM - Re: Re: Breather run into exhaust (nuff said) (Ron Lee)
11. 05:27 PM - LP4-3 Rivets (H.Ivan Haecker)
12. 06:33 PM - Re: LP4-3 Rivets (Todd & Kristen Neidinger)
13. 06:38 PM - Re: Supplier Problem (evmeg@snowcrest.net)
14. 06:38 PM - Re: LP4-3 Rivets (Charlie England)
15. 07:16 PM - Re: Supplier Problem (Joseph Larson)
16. 07:20 PM - Re: Re: Breather run into exhaust (nuff said) (Kyle Boatright)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Supplier Problem |
Take a number and get in line.
Chuck
What would you do?
The first week of February, 2007, I deposited $1,000 with a well known
RV-related supplier for a sub-assembly for an RV. After three months and
no word I contacted the supplier only to learn that parts necessary for
the product were not even ordered yet.
How would you handle a situation like this?
Message 2
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| Subject: | Supplier Problem |
Share your experiences in a factual, non-bashing manner so that others don't
end up in a similar situation with this vendor.
I have no problems with vendors that experience delays and communicate
regularly with their customers, but I have very little sympathy for vendors
that don't keep their customer's informed of the issues and delays.
-----Original Message-----
What would you do?
The first week of February, 2007, I deposited $1,000 with a well known
RV-related supplier for a sub-assembly for an RV. After three months and
no word I contacted the supplier only to learn that parts necessary for
the product were not even ordered yet.
How would you handle a situation like this?
__________ NOD32 2338 (20070619) Information __________
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Supplier Problem |
It's now 4 months since you placed your order. Did the company tell
you initially you should expect a multi-month delivery schedule?
I would call them back and ask for the following:
-Expected ship date
-Reason for the lengthy delay
-Reason to believe the delay has been resolved
If I wasn't satisfied with the answers provided, I would politely ask
for a refund. If the person you're talking to can't offer one, then
talk to someone who can.
So far, I'd keep it all polite and businesslike. If they refused the
refund, it's basically war. I would then do the following:
-Send them a certified letter telling them of the actions you're
about to undergo. Include a history of your attempts to resolve the
problem.
-If you paid your deposit via credit card, contact the credit card
company and request reversal of charges
-If you mailed a check, it might qualify as mail fraud. Contact the
post office or the attorney general in your state or the state where
the supplier resides.
-In the letter sent, I'd also tell them if you are forced to hire an
attorney to resolve this issue, you will be demanding legal fees in
addition to a refund.
And as Bob said, I'd also post about your experiences complete with
the name of the company involved so the rest of us know.
-J
On Jun 19, 2007, at 7:48 AM, Bob Leffler wrote:
>
> Share your experiences in a factual, non-bashing manner so that
> others don't
> end up in a similar situation with this vendor.
>
> I have no problems with vendors that experience delays and communicate
> regularly with their customers, but I have very little sympathy for
> vendors
> that don't keep their customer's informed of the issues and delays.
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> What would you do?
>
> The first week of February, 2007, I deposited $1,000 with a well known
> RV-related supplier for a sub-assembly for an RV. After three
> months and
>
> no word I contacted the supplier only to learn that parts necessary
> for
> the product were not even ordered yet.
>
> How would you handle a situation like this?
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Supplier Problem |
There is very little info to go on. Are you flying now? What part
that is not in would ground you?
Ron Lee
do not archive
>
> What would you do?
>
> The first week of February, 2007, I deposited $1,000 with a well known
> RV-related supplier for a sub-assembly for an RV. After three months and
>
> no word I contacted the supplier only to learn that parts necessary for
> the product were not even ordered yet.
>
> How would you handle a situation like this?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________ NOD32 2338 (20070619) Information __________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Supplier Problem |
Ron,
After 12 years the slosh in my fuel tanks began to come loose. Rather
than try to clean them out I asked Evan Johnson to build two new tanks
for me. I cannot fly with the tanks, its just too dangerous. I have an
aux tank that takes the place of the passenger so I can fly. The real
problem is that my BFR is due no later than the 30th of this month or I
won't be legal to fly and more importantly, my insurance won't be
valid. No BFR on time, no coverage.
Also flying to OSH looks remote right now too.
some folks just don't deserve the business they get it appears.
John
Ron Lee wrote:
>
> There is very little info to go on. Are you flying now? What part
> that is not in would ground you?
>
> Ron Lee
>
> do not archive
>
>
>>
>> What would you do?
>>
>> The first week of February, 2007, I deposited $1,000 with a well
>> known RV-related supplier for a sub-assembly for an RV. After three
>> months and
>>
>> no word I contacted the supplier only to learn that parts necessary
>> for the product were not even ordered yet.
>>
>> How would you handle a situation like this?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> __________ NOD32 2338 (20070619) Information __________
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Supplier Problem |
Sounds to me like you order a pre-built panel and they
do take some time and there is usually a waiting list
or waiting time.
Call around to another vendor if this is the case.
Darrell
--- Joseph Larson <jpl@showpage.org> wrote:
> <jpl@showpage.org>
>
> It's now 4 months since you placed your order. Did
> the company tell
> you initially you should expect a multi-month
> delivery schedule?
>
> I would call them back and ask for the following:
>
> -Expected ship date
> -Reason for the lengthy delay
> -Reason to believe the delay has been resolved
>
> If I wasn't satisfied with the answers provided, I
> would politely ask
> for a refund. If the person you're talking to can't
> offer one, then
> talk to someone who can.
>
> So far, I'd keep it all polite and businesslike. If
> they refused the
> refund, it's basically war. I would then do the
> following:
>
> -Send them a certified letter telling them of the
> actions you're
> about to undergo. Include a history of your
> attempts to resolve the
> problem.
> -If you paid your deposit via credit card, contact
> the credit card
> company and request reversal of charges
> -If you mailed a check, it might qualify as mail
> fraud. Contact the
> post office or the attorney general in your state or
> the state where
> the supplier resides.
> -In the letter sent, I'd also tell them if you are
> forced to hire an
> attorney to resolve this issue, you will be
> demanding legal fees in
> addition to a refund.
>
> And as Bob said, I'd also post about your
> experiences complete with
> the name of the company involved so the rest of us
> know.
>
> -J
>
> On Jun 19, 2007, at 7:48 AM, Bob Leffler wrote:
>
> <rvmail@thelefflers.com>
> >
> > Share your experiences in a factual, non-bashing
> manner so that
> > others don't
> > end up in a similar situation with this vendor.
> >
> > I have no problems with vendors that experience
> delays and communicate
> > regularly with their customers, but I have very
> little sympathy for
> > vendors
> > that don't keep their customer's informed of the
> issues and delays.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> <n1cxo320@salidaco.com>
> >
> > What would you do?
> >
> > The first week of February, 2007, I deposited
> $1,000 with a well known
> > RV-related supplier for a sub-assembly for an RV.
> After three
> > months and
> >
> > no word I contacted the supplier only to learn
> that parts necessary
> > for
> > the product were not even ordered yet.
> >
> > How would you handle a situation like this?
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
> Web Forums!
>
>
>
>
>
Never miss an email again!
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Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Supplier Problem |
Why can't you do a BFR in another plane? Not ideal but at least you
would not be grounded for that reason.
Ron Lee
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Fasching" <n1cxo320@salidaco.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2007 9:53 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Supplier Problem
>
> Ron,
>
> After 12 years the slosh in my fuel tanks began to come loose. Rather
> than try to clean them out I asked Evan Johnson to build two new tanks
> for me. I cannot fly with the tanks, its just too dangerous. I have an
> aux tank that takes the place of the passenger so I can fly. The real
> problem is that my BFR is due no later than the 30th of this month or I
> won't be legal to fly and more importantly, my insurance won't be
> valid. No BFR on time, no coverage.
> Also flying to OSH looks remote right now too.
>
> some folks just don't deserve the business they get it appears.
> John
>
> Ron Lee wrote:
>>
>> There is very little info to go on. Are you flying now? What part
>> that is not in would ground you?
>>
>> Ron Lee
>>
>> do not archive
>>
>>
>>>
>>> What would you do?
>>>
>>> The first week of February, 2007, I deposited $1,000 with a well
>>> known RV-related supplier for a sub-assembly for an RV. After three
>>> months and
>>>
>>> no word I contacted the supplier only to learn that parts necessary
>>> for the product were not even ordered yet.
>>>
>>> How would you handle a situation like this?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________ NOD32 2338 (20070619) Information __________
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Supplier Problem |
Well, perhaps my problem is about over...I just talked to Evan Johnson
regarding my fuel tanks ordered early February, and he said he expects
to ship them this coming Monday. I may make Oshkosh after all. Seems he
has been out of the country for a bit which slows/stops things in a
one-man operation.
Maybe all will be well...thanks to several of you folks who offered
assistance/advise.
John
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Breather run into exhaust (nuff said) |
And in the end what did we learn?
Nothing,
because not one of our heroes has dared showed us how they
did their super secret crankcase evacuation system with the
exhaust or wet vacuum pump. May be its gerbils next?
They say IT'S GREAT! but then can tell us why or show us how.
Hummmm? Did they even try it?
All I heard was sarcastic "straw-man" arguments and points
made by saying, "Reno Racer" & "turbo-charger". What?
The rest of the comments where about me or attacking me for
various reasons? I guess I offended people because I went to
engineering school and fly planes? Why would that be
relevant? Sorry I went to school and fly planes for a living. Oh
yea I don't think PCV is necessary or value added, and that
really set the tribe off into a Tizzy. I dared disagree; how could I.
Attn: Guys who just want to build your RV, the quickest way
to finish and fly a nice RV, that is safe, reliable, light and fun is
to follow the plans in my opinion. You can quote me. Leave off
the exhaust sucker or wet vacuum pump for now. If you want
to use it later, research it, call Lyc, Van and yes call a "Reno
Racer" and ask them directly. BTW: super-charged or turbo-
charged engines have more blow-by into the crank case than a
normally aspirated engines like ours. (facts again darn it)
Part of the fun is learning, and I am truly sorry that may be all
you learned is there's a "gang" on the list who makes personal
attacks to "put people into their place", so you might be
intimidated from asking a question. That's a shame. If you need
help email me direct; I'll help if I can and won't make fun of you
even if you are a pilot or went to school.
I am happy however if you learned to be careful and check it
out for your self, not to unilaterally believe me or the experts.
It is a good lesson, check it out and learn, your life or your wife
or kids life may depend on it. Be careful with engine mods.
Building is learning and is fun; ignore the dolts.
Asbestos underwear on so flame away. Nuff said
---------------------------------
Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Breather run into exhaust (nuff said) |
And in the end what did we learn?
Nothing,
Actually I may have learned something about the end of the
breather hose. Although I am still a bit confuzzled how the end
is cut apparently is important so that you don't pressurize it.
Also having a whistle slot near the engine is good IF the end
becomes obstructed.
Ron Lee
Message 11
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Does anyone know if Aircraft Spruce sells a rivet that is equivalent to
the LP4-3 that Van's supplies? I'm assembling an order for ACS but don't
see the same rivet that Van's sells. I'm hoping to avoid an extra
shipping and handling charge just for a few rivets.
Ivan Haecker -4 1370 hrs. S.Cen.TX
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: LP4-3 Rivets |
I tracked this down when I first needed to order more:
AVEX RIVETS (LP4-3) http://www.airpartsinc.com/catalog_gif/page18.htm
Non-structural blind rivet.
Aluminum rivet on steel stem. 1/8" diameter has 165 lbs. shear, 230 lbs. tensile.
5/32" diameter has 255 lbs. shear and 375 lbs. tensile.
1661 ( Low Profile ) Dome
View this page
Dia grip range Part # Price Each/100
1/8 .031 - .187 1661-0410 $7.95
5/32 .046 - .250 1661-0512i $7.95
Aircraft Spurce Cherry Rivets
MINIMUM RIVET SHEAR AND TENSILE STRENGTH (Ibs.)
RIVET
DIA.
BS SERIES ALUM RIVET / STEEL MAND. GRADE 19
MS SERIES MONEL RIVET / STEEL MAND.GRADE 40
CC SERIES STAINLESS RIVET / STAINLESS MAND. GRADE 51
Shear Tens Shear Tens Shear Tens
3/32 125 175 200 300 230 280
1/8 200 325 350 525 450 600
5/32 325 450 600 900 750 1000
3/16 430 650 750 1100 1000 1300
1/4 750 1050 1450 2150 1700 2250
When I asked Vans about using these:
Could you please provide me with the shear and tensile strength
> numbers for the lp4-3 and lp4-4 rivets?
They're around 170 shear, 220 tensile, a little less than the BSP type.
Who makes these rivets?
Gesipa Mfg, NC
> > Would the Cherry BSPS-43(44) or the AD41BS be _*fully*_ equivalent to
> > the LP series?
>
They'd be an acceptable substitute, but they're more expensive.
Vans
Todd Neidinger
9A - fuse.
Waunakee, Wi
H.Ivan Haecker wrote:
> Does anyone know if Aircraft Spruce sells a rivet that is equivalent
> to the LP4-3 that Van's supplies? I'm assembling an order for ACS but
> don't see the same rivet that Van's sells. I'm hoping to avoid an
> extra shipping and handling charge just for a few rivets.
>
> Ivan Haecker -4 1370 hrs. S.Cen.TX
> *
>
>
> *
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Supplier Problem |
>Geez John, I just got home and started reading this thread. You seem to
have left out the most important bit about the fact that when you
orderded your tanks.....way back in February.....you told me you would
not need them untill OSH.....Pretty important from a scheduling
standpoint. Not too sure I appreciate this bit of attention. I think your
good karma just went south.
Evan
.....Still working on your tanks but a bit miffed....
>
> Well, perhaps my problem is about over...I just talked to Evan Johnson
> regarding my fuel tanks ordered early February, and he said he expects
> to ship them this coming Monday. I may make Oshkosh after all. Seems he
> has been out of the country for a bit which slows/stops things in a
> one-man operation.
>
> Maybe all will be well...thanks to several of you folks who offered
> assistance/advise.
>
> John
>
>
---------------------------------------------
This message was sent using SnowCrest WebMail.
http://www.snowcrest.net
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: LP4-3 Rivets |
H.Ivan Haecker wrote:
> Does anyone know if Aircraft Spruce sells a rivet that is equivalent to
> the LP4-3 that Van's supplies? I'm assembling an order for ACS but don't
> see the same rivet that Van's sells. I'm hoping to avoid an extra
> shipping and handling charge just for a few rivets.
>
> Ivan Haecker -4 1370 hrs. S.Cen.TX
>
> *
http://www.hansonrivet.com/
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Supplier Problem |
I think what Evan *really* meant to write was:
"John, when you ordered your tanks, you indicated you wouldn't need
them until shortly before OSH, so I added them to the schedule. I'm
really sorry if I misunderstood you. I promise I'll have your tanks
shipped by the end of next week. Please let me know if there's
anything I can do to make sure they are easy to install in a prompt
fashion."
I'm sure that's what Evan really meant to say.
-J
On Jun 19, 2007, at 8:37 PM, evmeg@snowcrest.net wrote:
>
>> Geez John, I just got home and started reading this thread. You
>> seem to
> have left out the most important bit about the fact that when you
> orderded your tanks.....way back in February.....you told me you would
> not need them untill OSH.....Pretty important from a scheduling
> standpoint. Not too sure I appreciate this bit of attention. I
> think your
> good karma just went south.
> Evan
> .....Still working on your tanks but a bit miffed....
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Breather run into exhaust (nuff said) |
You do want to have a minor amount of air pressure going into the
breather hose. To accomplish this, you cut a bevel at 45 degrees or so
with the opening facing into the airstream (and down) - similar to the
fuel vents. If the opening faces the other way and you are careless
enough (I was - once) to leave the oil dipstick loose, you can find a
huge amount of oil on the airplane's belly even after a short flight.
The combination of a loose dipstick and a backwards facing breather can
create a lot of airflow *through* the engine, which will pull a
surprising amount of oil with it...
I wrote my incident up for the RVator about 5 years ago. I blew a quart
and a half of oil out of the engine in about 15 minutes. Quite the
surprise when I landed to have oil running down the belly of the
airplane and dripping on the ramp.
KB
----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Lee
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2007 7:37 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Breather run into exhaust (nuff said)
And in the end what did we learn?
Nothing,
Actually I may have learned something about the end of the
breather hose. Although I am still a bit confuzzled how the end
is cut apparently is important so that you don't pressurize it.
Also having a whistle slot near the engine is good IF the end
becomes obstructed.
Ron Lee
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