Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:07 AM - Re: high temp cable ties (Kyle Boatright)
2. 04:09 AM - Re: high temp cable ties (Kelly McMullen)
3. 06:18 AM - Re: fly-in (Tim Bryan)
4. 06:18 AM - Re: high temp cable ties (Sam Buchanan)
5. 08:27 AM - Re: high temp cable ties (Brian Kraut)
6. 09:59 AM - Re: high temp cable ties (Michael W Stewart)
7. 01:08 PM - Re: high temp cable ties (wskimike)
8. 02:37 PM - Re: high temp cable ties (Tim Bryan)
9. 04:26 PM - Re: high temp cable ties (John W. Cox)
10. 05:15 PM - Gillespie Field (Louis Willig)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: high temp cable ties |
I used regular zip ties on my airplane and the DAR had no problem with that.
After 6 years and 500 hours, they have not given any trouble.
Kyle Boatright
----- Original Message -----
From: "sarg314" <sarg314@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 2:06 AM
Subject: RV-List: high temp cable ties
>
> It is acceptable/practical to use high temp. nylon cable ties under the
> cowling? Will a DAR accept the use of these to secure wires to the
> engine mount tubes?
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, electrical system.
>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: high temp cable ties |
Regardless of the temps, it is not acceptable to use cable ties on an
engine mount tube. Oil and dirt get under it and start wearing the tube.
You need a pair of Adel clamps.
KM
A&P/IA
>
> It is acceptable/practical to use high temp. nylon cable ties under the
> cowling? Will a DAR accept the use of these to secure wires to the
> engine mount tubes?
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, electrical system.
>
>
Message 3
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Hi Greg,
I am a member of 1219. I will try to make the next one and look for you.
Thanks
Tim
Do Not Archive
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg Young
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 12:09 AM
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: fly-in
>
>
> Tim, try hitting the Lufkin Fajita fly-in on the 2nd Sat each month. I
> usually make it and my gray Navion is easy to spot. Most of the organizers
> can point me out. I fly with a contingent of RV's from Hooks, there's
> normally some more from Conroe and a few local RV's. Find me and join us.
>
> Regards,
> Greg Young
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Bryan
> > Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 1:42 PM
> > To: rv-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: RV-List: fly-in
> >
> >
> > I thought I would have a chance to get into the thick of it
> > when I moved to Texas. Most RVers however seem to live down
> > in the southern or central portion. I live in North East
> > Texas. I have only met maybe one or two other RV owners up
> > here. Truth is you have to be a little more outgoing than I
> > to get to know these folks. We have a very diverse and great
> > bunch of RV owners, but ya do got to make the effort to get
> > to know them. I have yet to do so.
> > Tim
> > Do Not Archive
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: high temp cable ties |
Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> Regardless of the temps, it is not acceptable to use cable ties on an
> engine mount tube. Oil and dirt get under it and start wearing the tube.
> You need a pair of Adel clamps.
True.
However, the regular ol' nylon zip ties in the engine compartment of my
RV-6, some of which are on mount tubes, were not only passed by the DAR,
but have stood up just fine for eight years and 825 hours and have
caused no damage.
Maybe it is because oil and dirt are not allowed in the engine
compartment of my plane. :-)
Sam Buchanan
Message 5
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| Subject: | high temp cable ties |
Me too. I would stay away from using them to hold your exhaust up though.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kyle Boatright
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 7:07 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: high temp cable ties
I used regular zip ties on my airplane and the DAR had no problem with that.
After 6 years and 500 hours, they have not given any trouble.
Kyle Boatright
----- Original Message -----
From: "sarg314" <sarg314@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 2:06 AM
Subject: RV-List: high temp cable ties
>
> It is acceptable/practical to use high temp. nylon cable ties under the
> cowling? Will a DAR accept the use of these to secure wires to the
> engine mount tubes?
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, electrical system.
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | high temp cable ties |
I had tie wraps of unknown substance cut into my engine mount of my rv-
6 in
~800 hours.
It cut through the powder coating and into the steel.
I do not know what the magic formula was for this to happen.
Too tight? Too much movement? Too loose? Sharp edge tie wraps? I dunno.
But
Ill never use them again and they are forbiden on the heavies.
My heavies mechanic buddy tried to worn me about this when he looked ov
er
my fwf before my first flight. I blew him off and said "yeah right.
Whatever. That plastic aint gonna cut into that steel."
I was wrong! It did. And I learned my lesson. Listen to the guy that se
es
this stuff a lot.
Mike
"Brian Kraut"
<brian.kraut@enga
lt.com>
To
Sent by: <rv-list@matronics.com>
owner-rv-list-ser
cc
ver@matronics.com
Subj
ect
RE: RV-List: high temp cable tie
s
09/17/2007 11:25
AM
Please respond to
rv-list@matronics
.com
Me too. I would stay away from using them to hold your exhaust up thou
gh.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kyle Boatright
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 7:07 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: high temp cable ties
t>
I used regular zip ties on my airplane and the DAR had no problem with
that.
After 6 years and 500 hours, they have not given any trouble.
Kyle Boatright
----- Original Message -----
From: "sarg314" <sarg314@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 2:06 AM
Subject: RV-List: high temp cable ties
>
> It is acceptable/practical to use high temp. nylon cable ties under t
he
> cowling? Will a DAR accept the use of these to secure wires to the
> engine mount tubes?
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, electrical system.
>
>
========================
============
========================
============
========================
============
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: high temp cable ties |
You can use tie wraps if you use them properly. You are suppose to use
one to go around both the structure and the cable and don't tighten it
but then use another tie wrap wraped around the first tie wrap in
between the cable and structure to tighten the first tie wrap. If
installed properly, it won't cut into anything.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael W Stewart
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 11:56 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: high temp cable ties
I had tie wraps of unknown substance cut into my engine mount of my
rv-6 in ~800 hours.
It cut through the powder coating and into the steel.
I do not know what the magic formula was for this to happen.
Too tight? Too much movement? Too loose? Sharp edge tie wraps? I
dunno. But Ill never use them again and they are forbiden on the
heavies.
My heavies mechanic buddy tried to worn me about this when he looked
over my fwf before my first flight. I blew him off and said "yeah right.
Whatever. That plastic aint gonna cut into that steel."
I was wrong! It did. And I learned my lesson. Listen to the guy that
sees this stuff a lot.
Mike
"Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
"Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
09/17/2007 11:25 AM Please respond to
rv-list@matronics.com
To
<rv-list@matronics.com>
cc
Subject
RE: RV-List: high temp cable ties
Me too. I would stay away from using them to hold your exhaust up
though.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kyle Boatright
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 7:07 AM
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: high temp cable ties
<kboatright1@comcast.net>
I used regular zip ties on my airplane and the DAR had no problem with
that.
After 6 years and 500 hours, they have not given any trouble.
Kyle Boatright
----- Original Message -----
From: "sarg314" <sarg314@comcast.net>
To: <rv-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 2:06 AM
Subject: RV-List: high temp cable ties
>
> It is acceptable/practical to use high temp. nylon cable ties under
the
> cowling? Will a DAR accept the use of these to secure wires to the
> engine mount tubes?
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, electrical system.
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
tor?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
===========
EB FORUMS -
tp://forums.matronics.com
===========
Message 8
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| Subject: | high temp cable ties |
Or alternatively you put one around the structure loose to start with and
the second around your cable and then through the first tie wrap. Then
tighten them.
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of wskimike
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 3:08 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: high temp cable ties
You can use tie wraps if you use them properly. You are suppose to use one
to go around both the structure and the cable and don't tighten it but then
use another tie wrap wraped around the first tie wrap in between the cable
and structure to tighten the first tie wrap. If installed properly, it won't
cut into anything.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael W <mailto:mike.stewart@us.ibm.com> Stewart
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 11:56 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: high temp cable ties
I had tie wraps of unknown substance cut into my engine mount of my rv-6 in
~800 hours.
It cut through the powder coating and into the steel.
I do not know what the magic formula was for this to happen.
Too tight? Too much movement? Too loose? Sharp edge tie wraps? I dunno. But
Ill never use them again and they are forbiden on the heavies.
My heavies mechanic buddy tried to worn me about this when he looked over my
fwf before my first flight. I blew him off and said "yeah right. Whatever.
That plastic aint gonna cut into that steel."
I was wrong! It did. And I learned my lesson. Listen to the guy that sees
this stuff a lot.
Mike
Inactive hide details for "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>"Brian
Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
"Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
09/17/2007 11:25 AM
Please respond to
rv-list@matronics.com
To
<rv-list@matronics.com>
cc
Subject
RE: RV-List: high temp cable ties
Me too. I would stay away from using them to hold your exhaust up though.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kyle Boatright
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 7:07 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: high temp cable ties
I used regular zip ties on my airplane and the DAR had no problem with that.
After 6 years and 500 hours, they have not given any trouble.
Kyle Boatright
----- Original Message -----
From: "sarg314" <sarg314@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 2:06 AM
Subject: RV-List: high temp cable ties
>
> It is acceptable/practical to use high temp. nylon cable ties under the
> cowling? Will a DAR accept the use of these to secure wires to the
> engine mount tubes?
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, electrical system.
>
>
====================================
tor?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
===========
EB FORUMS -
tp://forums.matronics.com
===========
Message 9
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| Subject: | high temp cable ties |
Kyle - Each builder gets to make these choices personally. It could be
wrong for builders to assign responsibility or assume the DARs role was
to do their final "binding" inspection on your project build. That is
one of the reasons the EAA offers "No Charge" progress inspections to
members to provide an added additional sets of eyes to the build
(Initial, Recurrent, Final) through the EAA Tech Counselor Program.
The DAR role (to my understanding) is primarily the review of
documentation and submission for the all important FAA documents. For
many, they can confirm the DARs walk around was only cursory in scope.
I would love to hear of DARS that accept liability for a final
inspection.
As an A&P working for a regional air carrier, SFAR 88 is real and a
definitive FAA effort to assign an explanation and corrective action to
TWA Flight #800. That is to say "other than those conspiracy theorists
who claim the US Navy brought it down". It remains the most costly,
time consuming FAA accident investigation in US Aviation history.
Compliance is a bitch.
I would propose to builders considering "zip ties" that there are indeed
areas where other attachments are recommended (and more valid) on TCDS
Aircraft and possibility a great starting point for Owner Build and
Maintained Aircraft as well. When ties do give trouble, the prudent
builder has thought it out and chosen wisely.
Glad your specific DAR did more than many and that you are flying
happily after so many hours. I cannot speak for DARs. As a Tech
Advisor, I try to point out other alternatives, enlighten builders on
potential avenues, encourage broad questions and further investigation,
and try to promote safety in the build. Tom's question was "is it
acceptable/practical?" Not much is easier than a zip. The builder
decides. He is the manufacturer and the standard to maintain. I try to
enlighten on the potential consequences. Adel's are most often seen on
Air Carrier fleets due to insurance reasons. They come in various
flavors (color and composition) due to environmental concerns that are
"known".
John Cox
EAA TC #5242
A&P/IA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kyle Boatright
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 4:07 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: high temp cable ties
<kboatright1@comcast.net>
I used regular zip ties on my airplane and the DAR had no problem with
that.
After 6 years and 500 hours, they have not given any trouble.
Kyle Boatright
----- Original Message -----
From: "sarg314" <sarg314@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 2:06 AM
Subject: RV-List: high temp cable ties
>
> It is acceptable/practical to use high temp. nylon cable ties under
the
> cowling? Will a DAR accept the use of these to secure wires to the
> engine mount tubes?
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A, electrical system.
>
>
>
Message 10
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Is anyone on the list based at Gillespie? I am thinking of retiring
to San Diego and need a place to hangar "Miss Viagra". Please respond
off list.
-
Louis I Willig
1640 Oakwood Dr.
Penn Valley, PA 19072
610 668-4964
RV-4, N180PF "MISS VIAGRA"
190HP IO-360, C/S prop
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