---------------------------------------------------------- RV-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 02/25/08: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:44 AM - Re: Gas tank repair (Doug Gray) 2. 03:05 AM - Re: Gas tank repair (Dale Ensing) 3. 05:41 AM - Re: gas tank repair (Glen Matejcek) 4. 06:01 AM - Firewall foreward cooling air needs (Ralph E. Capen) 5. 08:37 AM - Re: Gas tank repair (Terry Watson) 6. 12:44 PM - Firewall foreward cooling air needs (James H Nelson) 7. 02:06 PM - Canopy Slide block (Charles Brame) 8. 03:10 PM - Comment period on FAA ADS-B Out NPRM ends in one week (Ron Lee) 9. 03:14 PM - Re: Gas tank repair (Louis Willig) 10. 05:19 PM - Re: Gas tank repair (Kevin Horton) 11. 05:21 PM - Re: Gas tank repair (rv6n@optonline.net) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:44:48 AM PST US Subject: Re: RV-List: Gas tank repair From: Doug Gray Get at it with plastic steak knives. Cheap and effective and doesn't marr the alclad. Doug Gray On Sun, 2008-02-24 at 18:05 -0500, Louis Willig wrote: > > > Hi gang, > > A few months ago, many of you gave me a lot of help/instruction to > remove my leaky tank. I finally removed it today, with a lot less > problems than I anticipated. BUT, I am finding that the large (6") > access plate is not so obedient. I carefully removed all 12 screws. > Now what? The plate is prosealed in place, and has lots of > additional sealant from previous repairs. I removed most of the added > repair sealant while trying not to gauge away at the plate and rib. > Since I am not the builder, I am not sure what I am now looking at. > Looking at the edge of the access plate, it appears to be two layers > of aluminum resting on the rib material. Is there a reinforcement > ring between the access plate and the rib material? (I am calling the > ends of the tank "ribs" since they in fact are acting as such). > Whatever is there, the access plate is firmly attached with proseal > to the rib or ring below. > > Anyway, I do not want to destroy this tank. How do I lift the access > plate away? Do I need to soften up the proseal? Can this be done? > Help!! I love you guys. Help! :-) > > Thanks in advance. > > > > - > Louis I Willig > 1640 Oakwood Dr. > Penn Valley, PA 19072 > 610 668-4964 > RV-4, N180PF > 190HP IO-360, C/S prop > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:05:09 AM PST US From: "Dale Ensing" Subject: Re: RV-List: Gas tank repair A method we have used successfully. when doing the SB fix on the pick up line, is to use a very flexible putty knife sharpened a bit on the end edge. Work it in between the plate and the ring. It helps if you can warm the Proseal.(heat lamp or sun) After you have one side loose you can apply some pressure to the plate by pulling/lifting on the loose side which will help get the knife in around the remaining edge. A little bending of the plate is OK when you are pulling on it as it will straighten when you release the pressure. Dale Ensing EAA TC & FA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Louis Willig" Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2008 6:05 PM Subject: RV-List: Gas tank repair > > > Hi gang, > > A few months ago, many of you gave me a lot of help/instruction to remove > my leaky tank. I finally removed it today, with a lot less problems than I > anticipated. BUT, I am finding that the large (6") access plate is not so > obedient. I carefully removed all 12 screws. Now what? The plate is > prosealed in place, and has lots of additional sealant from previous > repairs. I removed most of the added repair sealant while trying not to > gauge away at the plate and rib. Since I am not the builder, I am not sure > what I am now looking at. Looking at the edge of the access plate, it > appears to be two layers of aluminum resting on the rib material. Is there > a reinforcement ring between the access plate and the rib material? (I am > calling the ends of the tank "ribs" since they in fact are acting as > such). Whatever is there, the access plate is firmly attached with proseal > to the rib or ring below. > > Anyway, I do not want to destroy this tank. How do I lift the access plate > away? Do I need to soften up the proseal? Can this be done? Help!! I love > you guys. Help! :-) > > Thanks in advance. > > > - > Louis I Willig > 1640 Oakwood Dr. > Penn Valley, PA 19072 > 610 668-4964 > RV-4, N180PF > 190HP IO-360, C/S prop > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:41:11 AM PST US From: Glen Matejcek Subject: RV-List: Re: gas tank repair Hey Guys- RE: >Louis: I used a heat gun to warn and soften the Proseal. I understand the >fuel tank is full of vapors and I kept the heat gun away from the tank >access plate as possible but still heat the plate sufficiently to soften the >Proseal and used a razor knife under the plate, MEK to clean. Hope this >helps, Dan. If MEK will soften the proseal, how about standing the tank on it's outboard end with MEK on the inbd end. Put some sort of cover over the butt rib to limit evaporation. If you let the tank sit a day ot two, would the access panel come free easily, or would you just cause other problems? Glen Matejcek ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:01:50 AM PST US From: "Ralph E. Capen" Subject: RV-List: Firewall foreward cooling air needs Here's the setup: IO360B1F6 with CS MT prop, AFP injection, LASAR ignition, Vetterman crossover heater/mufflers in a SamJames cowled/plenum'd RV6A. I'm planning on putting the oil cooler behind the #4 cylinder with its cutout for airflow feeding the oil cooler. My heater/mufflers require cooling air over them even when they're not heating the cockpit according to Larry. I'm thinking that taking the cooling air for both heater/mufflers from the back plate behind the #2 cylinder should be OK - since I'm taking a chunk from each side. Is this a valid thought? - or does it not matter since I have a plenum. For the cabin heat air, would it be better to take the air from the vertical plate or the 40 degree angled plate below it? Thanks, Ralph ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:37:53 AM PST US From: "Terry Watson" Subject: RE: RV-List: Gas tank repair You might try a plastic putty knife. I have a set of three that were very cheap but seem to be just the right hardness and stiffness to scrape gunk off of aluminum without damaging the aluminum. Terry -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dale Ensing Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 3:02 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Gas tank repair A method we have used successfully. when doing the SB fix on the pick up line, is to use a very flexible putty knife sharpened a bit on the end edge. Work it in between the plate and the ring. It helps if you can warm the Proseal.(heat lamp or sun) After you have one side loose you can apply some pressure to the plate by pulling/lifting on the loose side which will help get the knife in around the remaining edge. A little bending of the plate is OK when you are pulling on it as it will straighten when you release the pressure. Dale Ensing EAA TC & FA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Louis Willig" Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2008 6:05 PM Subject: RV-List: Gas tank repair > > > Hi gang, > > A few months ago, many of you gave me a lot of help/instruction to remove > my leaky tank. I finally removed it today, with a lot less problems than I > anticipated. BUT, I am finding that the large (6") access plate is not so > obedient. I carefully removed all 12 screws. Now what? The plate is > prosealed in place, and has lots of additional sealant from previous > repairs. I removed most of the added repair sealant while trying not to > gauge away at the plate and rib. Since I am not the builder, I am not sure > what I am now looking at. Looking at the edge of the access plate, it > appears to be two layers of aluminum resting on the rib material. Is there > a reinforcement ring between the access plate and the rib material? (I am > calling the ends of the tank "ribs" since they in fact are acting as > such). Whatever is there, the access plate is firmly attached with proseal > to the rib or ring below. > > Anyway, I do not want to destroy this tank. How do I lift the access plate > away? Do I need to soften up the proseal? Can this be done? Help!! I love > you guys. Help! :-) > > Thanks in advance. > > > - > Louis I Willig > 1640 Oakwood Dr. > Penn Valley, PA 19072 > 610 668-4964 > RV-4, N180PF > 190HP IO-360, C/S prop > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:44:18 PM PST US Subject: RV-List: Firewall foreward cooling air needs From: James H Nelson Ralph, I have the same situation. I put in a air source on the ramp for the #2 cyl for the left muffler. I put in a source for the port side on the angled baffle behind #3 cyl. This seems to be my best way. I am not flying yet but the bird is at the painters right now. Hopefully I'll be flying by the end of March. Jim N15JN ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 02:06:24 PM PST US From: Charles Brame Subject: RV-List: Canopy Slide block I made an aluminum "dog house" that covers the slide rail at the back of the canopy on my 6A slider. It fits quite tight when the canopy is closed and doesn't leave enough room vertically for the slider. I omitted the slider and there is not enough gap to worry about. The slider was an "after thought" anyway and was not on my original plans. Charlie Brame RV-6A N11CB San Antonio ----------------------------- > > > Time: 11:44:05 AM PST US > Subject: RV-List: Canopy slide block > From: James H Nelson > > > For those of you who built the slider canopy, I am about to put the > canopy on for the final time (at the painters). How did you fasten > the > slider block to the canopy to drag it back and forth. There is not > much > room to fasten anything to it. I'm guessing that a fishing line of > nylon > would work but how to fasten it to the block? I molded the skirt with > fiberglass so the block fits snugly when the canopy is closed. I need > some suggestions from those who have done it successfully. > > Jim > N15JN > RV9-A > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 03:10:34 PM PST US From: "Ron Lee" Subject: RV-List: Comment period on FAA ADS-B Out NPRM ends in one week There is one week left to comment on this onerous and fatally flawed FAA proposal that may cost as much as $17,000 per aircraft with little to no benefit to the GA community. My website at StopADS-B.org/ADS.htm gives details. You can also read about it at aopa.org. Ron Lee StopADS-B.org/ADS.htm ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:14:22 PM PST US From: Louis Willig Subject: Re: RV-List: Gas tank repair At 06:02 AM 2/25/2008, you wrote: > >A method we have used successfully. when doing the SB fix on the >pick up line, is to use a very flexible putty knife sharpened a bit >on the end edge. Work it in between the plate and the ring. It helps >if you can warm the Proseal.(heat lamp or sun) After you have one >side loose you can apply some pressure to the plate by >pulling/lifting on the loose side which will help get the knife in >around the remaining edge. A little bending of the plate is OK when >you are pulling on it as it will straighten when you release the pressure. >Dale Ensing >EAA TC & FA Dale, you are the first person to use the word " ring". Is there a ring ( like a reinforcing) between the access plate and the tank wall? I see what looks like two layers of metal attached to the rib. Is this an illusion? (or is there actually a ring between the access plate and the tank wall? I have been unable to decide where to attack with my sharpened knife. Several people have suggested heating the area. This is a great idea. And there are zero fumes left in the tank. Thanks to all so far. I've been on the "list" for over ten years, and this is why. - Louis I Willig 1640 Oakwood Dr. Penn Valley, PA 19072 610 668-4964 RV-4, N180PF 190HP IO-360, C/S prop ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:19:36 PM PST US From: Kevin Horton Subject: Re: RV-List: Gas tank repair > > At 06:02 AM 2/25/2008, you wrote: >> >> >> A method we have used successfully. when doing the SB fix on the >> pick up line, is to use a very flexible putty knife sharpened a >> bit on the end edge. Work it in between the plate and the ring. It >> helps if you can warm the Proseal.(heat lamp or sun) After you >> have one side loose you can apply some pressure to the plate by >> pulling/lifting on the loose side which will help get the knife in >> around the remaining edge. A little bending of the plate is OK >> when you are pulling on it as it will straighten when you release >> the pressure. >> Dale Ensing >> EAA TC & FA > > you are the first person to use the word " ring". Is there a ring > ( like a reinforcing) between the access plate and the tank wall? > I see what looks like two layers of metal attached to the rib. Is > this an illusion? (or is there actually a ring between the access > plate and the tank wall? I have been unable to decide where to > attack with my sharpened knife. > There is a reinforcing ring, but it should have been installed on the inside of the tank. But, perhaps the builder put it on the outside. If there truly are two layers of metal outboard of the tank rib, then the putty knife would need to go between the access cover and the next layer. The reinforcing ring should be riveted to the tank rib, so you won't be prying it loose with a putty knife. Good luck, -- Kevin Horton RV-8 (Finishing Kit) Ottawa, Canada http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:21:22 PM PST US From: rv6n@optonline.net Subject: Re: RV-List: Gas tank repair Louis=2C It has been years since I closed up my RV6 tanks but from what I remembe r we had the option of using a cork gasket and or using the pro-seal to prevent leaks=2E I chose to just use the pro-seal but I think you are l ooking at your tank and seeing the outer plate and the cork and the pro- seal =2E The ribs were stamped to have raised reinforcing areas and I b elieve that is what the last lister was referring to as the ring but I t hink you took it as a separate backer plate and I don=27t think that is the case=2E If I am wrong maybe Dale will chime in to clarify what he i s calling the ring=2E You have some good advice already and I will most likely use some of it myself since I have not done this SB either=2E W hat I read that I like is using the flexible puddy knife sharpened and t he heat lamp to warm the pro seal since it can be some tough stuff=2E I t is not a job I look forward to either but you can do it=2C just go at it=2E It sounds like you removed your tanks and that should make it eas ier=2C I will attack mine through the wing root fairing area=2E I also remember using some Allen head screws to attach the cover plate to make it easier to unscrew=2C we=27ll see if it actually works=2E You may wan t to consider them when reinstalling yours=2E Good luck with yours=2C y ou could have it back together by the weekend=2E I am in the middle of the second condition inspection=2E do not archive Bob Bales RV6 71 hours FOK ----- Original Message ----- From=3A Louis Willig Date=3A Monday=2C February 25=2C 2008 6=3A31 pm Subject=3A Re=3A RV-List=3A Gas tank repair To=3A rv-list=40matronics=2Ecom =3E --=3E RV-List message posted by=3A Louis Willig =3E =3E At 06=3A02 AM 2/25/2008=2C you wrote=3A =3E =3E--=3E RV-List message posted by=3A =22Dale Ensing=22 =3E =3E =3E =3EA method we have used successfully=2E when doing the SB fix on =3E the =3E =3Epick up line=2C is to use a very flexible putty knife sharpened a =3E bit =3E =3Eon the end edge=2E Work it in between the plate and the ring=2E I t =3E helps =3E =3Eif you can warm the Proseal=2E(heat lamp or sun) After you have =3E one =3E =3Eside loose you can apply some pressure to the plate by =3E =3Epulling/lifting on the loose side which will help get the knife =3E in =3E =3Earound the remaining edge=2E A little bending of the plate is OK =3E when =3E =3Eyou are pulling on it as it will straighten when you release =3E the pressure=2E =3E =3EDale Ensing =3E =3EEAA TC =26 FA =3E =3E Dale=2C =3E =3E you are the first person to use the word =22 ring=22=2E Is there a =3E ring ( =3E like a reinforcing) between the access plate and the tank wall=3F =3E I =3E see what looks like two layers of metal attached to the rib=2E =3E Is =3E this an illusion=3F (or is there actually a ring between the =3E access =3E plate and the tank wall=3F I have been unable to decide where to =3E attack =3E with my sharpened knife=2E =3E =3E Several people have suggested heating the area=2E This is a great =3E idea=2E =3E And there are zero fumes left in the tank=2E =3E =3E Thanks to all so far=2E I=27ve been on the =22list=22 for over ten =3E years=2C and =3E this is why=2E =3E =3E =3E =3E - =3E Louis I Willig =3E 1640 Oakwood Dr=2E =3E Penn Valley=2C PA 19072 =3E 610 668-4964 =3E RV-4=2C N180PF =3E 190HP IO-360=2C C/S prop =3E =3E =3E =3E =5F-====================== ======================== ============= =3E =5F-= - The RV-List Email Forum - =3E =5F-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse =3E =5F-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription=2C =3E =5F-= Archive Search =26 Download=2C 7-Day Browse=2C Chat=2C FAQ=2C =3E =5F-= Photoshare=2C and much much more=3A =3E =5F-= --=3E http=3A//www=2Ematronics=2Ecom/Navigator=3FRV-List =3E =5F-====================== ======================== ============= =3E =5F-= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - =3E =5F-= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! 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