Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:21 AM - Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? (Jerry Springer)
2. 06:32 AM - Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? (Kelly McMullen)
3. 06:32 AM - Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? (linn Walters)
4. 06:41 AM - Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? (linn Walters)
5. 06:55 AM - Sucking Air or Pushing 'Trons (Valovich, Paul)
6. 07:31 AM - Re: RV/Rocket Steering link (Frazier, Vincent A)
7. 09:28 AM - Redundancies (Paul Besing)
8. 11:24 AM - RV-6 / 6a kits for sale (Scott Kuebler)
9. 12:07 PM - Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? (Chuck Weyant)
10. 12:31 PM - Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? (linn Walters)
11. 12:48 PM - Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? ()
12. 02:14 PM - Re: Instrument Panel - Powercoat Thickness? (Chuck Daus)
13. 02:47 PM - Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue (cbrxxdrv@aol.com)
14. 03:39 PM - Re: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue (scott bilinski)
15. 06:50 PM - Re: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue (cbrxxdrv@aol.com)
16. 07:16 PM - Re: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue (Kelly McMullen)
17. 07:46 PM - What we did for panel redundancy (jhnstniii@aol.com)
18. 08:17 PM - Re: What we did for panel redundancy (Paul Besing)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? |
Some of these dumb ass pros have done more damage to aircraft than any
builder would do to his own aircraft.
Have to love the A&P/IA that comes in here thinking they are gods gift
to aircraft and all that is.
do not archive
RICHARD MILLER wrote:
>
>when we have to talk about system failures, the people to ask it those failure
are those that maintain them. When i hear the statements," i have 2000 hours
of time." it reminds me that if he had 4000 more he might be ready to test for
his a+p. and with 6000 more he might be ready to try for an i/a.
>
> while most aircraft owners will psy 90$ an hour to their car mechanic, they
for some resome want to pay 40$ per hour for their airplane.
>
>most on this list have spent in excess of 1000 hr's building their aircraft. YET
they have no experience maintaining those aircraft.
>
>i love working on aircraft that can be maintained from the local napa shop. but
the pros will keep you alive.listen to them. when they tell you stop .DO IT.
>RICK
>
>
>--- On Sun, 12/14/08, linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>>From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
>>Subject: Re: RV-List: Which is a good vacuum pump?
>>To: rv-list@matronics.com
>>Date: Sunday, December 14, 2008, 9:19 PM
>><pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
>>
>>Sorry folks, but I'm starting to enjoy this!
>>Kelly McMullen wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>><kellym@aviating.com>
>>
>>
>>>It doesn't take a total failure. All you need is
>>>
>>>
>>one little component to let out some electrical smoke in the
>>cockpit while you are on the gauges and you will be faced
>>with no electrics without risk of additional fire.
>>Actually, once the magic smoke gets loose, the only thing
>>you lose is that little box.
>>
>>
>>>Argue all you want, or just make your choice. Just
>>>
>>>
>>don't lead others blindly down the same risky path.
>>I've seen too many electrical failures in 30+ years of
>>flying and wrenching on planes to totally rely on electrics.
>>You may be a pretty good wrench, but I'm getting the
>>feeling you don't know squat about
>>"electrics".
>>
>>
>>>A number of Beechcraft are facing an AD right now to
>>>
>>>
>>replace most of their circuit breakers that on rare occasion
>>leak smoke. So there goes your "will not fail"
>>argument.
>>Nobody said 'nothing will fail' ..... what they did
>>say is that they have an 'alternate' to go to if a
>>failure occurs. It's unfortunate, but the one component
>>in the airplane that seems to fail more often than any other
>>...... is the pilot. I think there's more to the Beech
>>AD than meets the eye ..... not knowing for sure, but I have
>>the feeling there's a design problem in the breaker, and
>>that Beech fed all the radios from one breaker. Older
>>airplanes did that. If it was only a rare occasion, I
>>don't think there would be an AD otherwise.
>>Linn
>>pilot & airplane builder
>>do not archive
>>
>>
>>>KM
>>>A&P/IA
>>>Paul Besing wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>In 15 years of flying, over 2000 hours, and flying
>>>>
>>>>
>>20,000 hour freight airplanes with things breaking all the
>>time, I've never once had a total electrical
>>failure..and trust me..the garbage I was flying, if any rats
>>nest like was in the airplanes I flew will work, a properly
>>crafted experimental electrical system will not fail. *
>>
>>
>>>>*
>>>>*======
>>>>*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? |
All of which shows you have no appreciation of what happens when you get
electric smoke in the cockpit. You don't just loose one item, unless you
have a death wish. You kill the master. Period. An MD-11 failed to do
that, the crew couldn't get it on to an airfield quickly enough, and the
aircraft was lost with all persons on board into the Atlantic. You can
gamble with isolating the problem, at your own peril.
You don't have to justify your desired system to anyone but yourself. A
little common sense will tell you to have at least two completely
independent electric systems if you choose to operate IFR. No one is
going to make you do it. Even with dual electrics, you don't solve the
electrical fire scenario. Yes they are relatively rare. Is your life
worth that gamble? Just food for thought.
linn Walters wrote:
>
> Sorry folks, but I'm starting to enjoy this!
>> It doesn't take a total failure. All you need is one little
>> component to let out some electrical smoke in the cockpit while you
>> are on the gauges and you will be faced with no electrics without
>> risk of additional fire.
> Actually, once the magic smoke gets loose, the only thing you lose is
> that little box.
>> Argue all you want, or just make your choice. Just don't lead others
>> blindly down the same risky path. I've seen too many electrical
>> failures in 30+ years of flying and wrenching on planes to totally
>> rely on electrics.
> You may be a pretty good wrench, but I'm getting the feeling you don't
> know squat about "electrics".
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? |
I guess I'd have to put software glitches into the infant failure modes
since almost all software bugs are found early on. Fortunately (as told
by Mike Stewart) he had the presence of mind to act swiftly and properly
.... a less capable pilot may not have the same outcome.
The software glitch syndrome isn't confined to the low cost EFIS systems
.... Just ask Garmin how, with all the testing in certification, their
products have been marketed with 'unannounced features'. Or better yet,
ask Microsoft why the whole world seems to be part of their beta testing
program.
Linn
do not archive
Bruce Gray wrote:
>
> While the electrical system might have some issues, the real issue with low
> cost EFIS systems are software bugs. Redunancy can save your life.
>
> As told by,
>
> --> <mike.stewart@us.ibm.com>
>
> As a survivor of a dual efis (GRT & BMA), single lockup, IMC, 2000'agl
> vectors to final approach, it was the a/p that broke the tie for me. One
> said left turn, one said right. My GRT locked up frozen on the efis screen
> in a turn. I was fortunate to have noticed the discrepancy. Disorientation
> set in in about 1 second as soon as it was noticed. You cant imagine the
> immediate brain confusion when the 2 EFIS's are not agreeing in a big way.
> Turn on the a/p and sort it out. A/p says BMA wins, and thats what I flew to
> the runway. It resulted in an emergency firmware update the following day by
> GRT. Turns out the EFIS did not like a GPS approach with no assigned runway
> in the database. Was a software bug. Would have been easier if the screen
> had just gone blank, but your don't get to choose your fail modes.
>
> Also as a side note, had I of had 2 GRT's, they both would have locked up
> and I'd of been on A/P alone. That would not have been fun, but doable.
>
> It can happen. I was happy that day I chose 2 different EFIS's. Probably
> saved my butt.
>
> Also, as was asked earlier on this thread, I have tested my Trio A/P in many
> unusual attitudes, and it will right me from the most ridicules attitudes
> every time.
> Mike
> -
>
> Bruce
> www.Glasair.org
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? |
Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> All of which shows you have no appreciation of what happens when you
> get electric smoke in the cockpit.
You could be right ... I've never had smoke in the cockpit.
> You don't just loose one item, unless you have a death wish. You kill
> the master. Period.
I disagree .... properly designed, an electrical system will contain the
'smoke' problem inside the 'black box. If you have smoke emanating
outside the boxes, then there's a design problem. The failure modes for
the wiring is usually unintentional grounding of a hot wire due to
chafing of the insulation or improper protection (ckt breaker) for the
wiring. Remember that ckt breakers protect the wiring, not the device
connected to it, and that proper sizing of the breaker is paramount.
> An MD-11 failed to do that, the crew couldn't get it on to an
> airfield quickly enough, and the aircraft was lost with all persons on
> board into the Atlantic.
Not familiar with it.
> You can gamble with isolating the problem, at your own peril.
> You don't have to justify your desired system to anyone but yourself.
> A little common sense will tell you to have at least two completely
> independent electric systems if you choose to operate IFR. No one is
> going to make you do it. Even with dual electrics, you don't solve the
> electrical fire scenario. Yes they are relatively rare. Is your life
> worth that gamble? Just food for thought.
Thanks, I like food!!!
Linn
do not archive
>
> linn Walters wrote:
>>
>> Sorry folks, but I'm starting to enjoy this!
>>> It doesn't take a total failure. All you need is one little
>>> component to let out some electrical smoke in the cockpit while you
>>> are on the gauges and you will be faced with no electrics without
>>> risk of additional fire.
>> Actually, once the magic smoke gets loose, the only thing you lose is
>> that little box.
>>> Argue all you want, or just make your choice. Just don't lead others
>>> blindly down the same risky path. I've seen too many electrical
>>> failures in 30+ years of flying and wrenching on planes to totally
>>> rely on electrics.
>> You may be a pretty good wrench, but I'm getting the feeling you
>> don't know squat about "electrics".
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Sucking Air or Pushing 'Trons |
This is one of those subjects where personal preferences determine the outc
ome. I spent many hours researching the instrumentation options for my -8A.
The real issue was not lack of options, but too many available choices. In
order to get a logical handle on the subject, I went through a formal deci
sion process that relied both on data and gut feel. In the end, I am comfor
table with my choices - they may, in many folks minds, not be optimum, but
they were my conscious choices.
1. No vacuum pump. Not so much a fear of reliability as much as a des
ire to exploit new technology.
2. Redundant electrical sources. Main alternator, SD-8, and battery b
ackup(s).
3. IFR capability - including ILS.
4. Redundant attitude displays.
5. Back up altimeter, VSI and airspeed.
6. GPS and VOR nav capability.
7. Backup comms.
Ended up with AFS 3500, SL30, ICOM backup, panel-mounted 496, PMA7000B, Tru
Trac ADI II and Vans AS, VSI and Alt.
Works for me.
Paul Valovich
N192NM - Canopy and Cowling
Will fly Saturday - just don't know which Saturday that will be.
Message 6
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| Subject: | RE: RV/Rocket Steering link |
You can get the steering link from my web store (in the U.S.) or from
Wayne Hadath (in Canada). Shipping is a bit easier if you get it in
your country, but not a big deal.
Wayne can be reached at whadath@rogers.com
I know of no problems with the steering link use. The entire tailwheel
assembly requires periodic inspection and lubrication, but if you do
that, you should have no problems.
Thx,
Vince Frazier
Flyboy Accessories
3965 Caborn Road
Mount Vernon, IN 47620
812-464-1839
www.flyboyaccessories.com
Message 7
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Good point, Linn. "will not fail" was the wrong choice of words while writing
in haste (and being tired didn't help). I meant my point to be understood that
the pilot and the builder/designer are the weak links most of the time. If
one were to subscribe to Bob Knuckolls school of thought, a little redundancy
goes a long way. But to over design a system with two electrical systems, vacuum,
electric, and backups for the backups are getting a little crazy in some
builder's airplanes. IMHO, that introduces more failure points and complexities
than it does any good. Regarding the Beech AD, feeding all radios or multiple
components are definitely NOT a good idea...single points of failures should
be minimized.
Paul Besing
________________________________
From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 10:19:36 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Which is a good vacuum pump?
Sorry folks, but I'm starting to enjoy this!
Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> It doesn't take a total failure. All you need is one little component to let
out some electrical smoke in the cockpit while you are on the gauges and you
will be faced with no electrics without risk of additional fire.
Actually, once the magic smoke gets loose, the only thing you lose is that little
box.
> Argue all you want, or just make your choice. Just don't lead others blindly
down the same risky path. I've seen too many electrical failures in 30+ years
of flying and wrenching on planes to totally rely on electrics.
You may be a pretty good wrench, but I'm getting the feeling you don't know squat
about "electrics".
> A number of Beechcraft are facing an AD right now to replace most of their circuit
breakers that on rare occasion leak smoke. So there goes your "will not
fail" argument.
Nobody said 'nothing will fail' ..... what they did say is that they have an 'alternate'
to go to if a failure occurs. It's unfortunate, but the one component
in the airplane that seems to fail more often than any other ...... is the
pilot. I think there's more to the Beech AD than meets the eye ..... not knowing
for sure, but I have the feeling there's a design problem in the breaker,
and that Beech fed all the radios from one breaker. Older airplanes did that.
If it was only a rare occasion, I don't think there would be an AD otherwise.
Linn
pilot & airplane builder
do not archive
> KM
> A&P/IA
> Paul Besing wrote:
>> In 15 years of flying, over 2000 hours, and flying 20,000 hour freight airplanes
with things breaking all the time, I've never once had a total electrical
failure..and trust me..the garbage I was flying, if any rats nest like was in
the airplanes I flew will work, a properly crafted experimental electrical system
will not fail. *
>> *
>> *======
>> *
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | RV-6 / 6a kits for sale |
RV-6 / 6a kits for sale.
Empennage: Complete except for fiberglass tips. Includes electric elevator
trim kit. All parts are alodined and primed with Marhyde primer.
Wings & Phlogiston Spar: Both skeletons fully assembled. Top skins
riveted. Both tanks are complete and sealed. Flaps and ailerons complete,
but not fitted. Includes electric aileron trim kit. All parts are alodined
and primed with Deft epoxy primer (Mil-P-23377G).
Both kits are the pre-punched versions purchased in 1997 & 1998 by myself.
Construction is excellent. Preview plans and Orndorff videos are included
for both kits.
Detailed photos are available upon request.
Must sell. The first $3750 takes it all. Buyer arranges transportation.
If all items were purchased separately the price would be more than $6500
for the unassembled kits.
Regards,
Scott Kuebler
Buffalo, NY
716-510-0318- cell
scottam65@gmail.com
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? |
I got to chime in here. I'm a retired air traffic controller. I've
experienced lots of emergencies in the tower cab throughout my career.
Worked a C97 with two engine fires to a successful landing, had a Western
Boeing720 trainer roll inverted, crash and explode near the base of the
tower, a Hughes Airwest and military F4 midair just north of the airfield,
and a Starduster Too auger in between the parallels at Oakland, CA right in
front of me. I even saved a drowning victim at the lake one weekend when no
one else would go in after the poor sob. I felt I was one pretty cool dude
and could handle just about any emergency.
Then one day as my wife and I were heading for Laughlin, NV, I looked down
and there it was, a wisp of smoke from under the panel! I was smack dab in
the middle of a coastal mountain range with little or no options but to slam
off the master, declare an emergency and head back to the airport ten
minutes away. Smoke and smell went away. Turned out to be an inverter (or
converter, can't keep 'em straight) that blew. No fire, just smoked and
melted.
I don't know about others that have had smoke in the cockpit, but I wasn't
interested in "isolating the problem." I just wanted on the ground --- now!
I think there's a whole bunch of pilots that would react just like I did.
Granted, some of you Chuck Yeagers would analyze and attempt to isolate the
problem while being annoyed with the smoke, but I'm here to tell you that
when/if smoke ever happens to you, no matter how macho you think you are,
it's gonna get your attention! I didn't panic --- but I sure felt panic. I
was scared, really, really scared.
Anyhow, I smile when I hear the uninitiated attempt to convince others that
electricity can be made failsafe.
Chuck Weyant
RV10 two months to first flight
> Kelly McMullen wrote:
>>
>> All of which shows you have no appreciation of what happens when you get
>> electric smoke in the cockpit.
> You could be right ... I've never had smoke in the cockpit.
>> You don't just loose one item, unless you have a death wish. You kill the
>> master. Period.
> I disagree .... properly designed, an electrical system will contain the
> 'smoke' problem inside the 'black box. If you have smoke emanating
> outside the boxes, then there's a design problem. The failure modes for
> the wiring is usually unintentional grounding of a hot wire due to chafing
> of the insulation or improper protection (ckt breaker) for the wiring.
> Remember that ckt breakers protect the wiring, not the device connected to
> it, and that proper sizing of the breaker is paramount.
>> An MD-11 failed to do that, the crew couldn't get it on to an airfield
>> quickly enough, and the aircraft was lost with all persons on board into
>> the Atlantic.
> Not familiar with it.
>> You can gamble with isolating the problem, at your own peril.
>> You don't have to justify your desired system to anyone but yourself. A
>> little common sense will tell you to have at least two completely
>> independent electric systems if you choose to operate IFR. No one is
>> going to make you do it. Even with dual electrics, you don't solve the
>> electrical fire scenario. Yes they are relatively rare. Is your life
>> worth that gamble? Just food for thought.
> Thanks, I like food!!!
> Linn
> do not archive
>
>>
>> linn Walters wrote:
>>>
>>> Sorry folks, but I'm starting to enjoy this!
>>>> It doesn't take a total failure. All you need is one little component
>>>> to let out some electrical smoke in the cockpit while you are on the
>>>> gauges and you will be faced with no electrics without risk of
>>>> additional fire.
>>> Actually, once the magic smoke gets loose, the only thing you lose is
>>> that little box.
>>>> Argue all you want, or just make your choice. Just don't lead others
>>>> blindly down the same risky path. I've seen too many electrical
>>>> failures in 30+ years of flying and wrenching on planes to totally rely
>>>> on electrics.
>>> You may be a pretty good wrench, but I'm getting the feeling you don't
>>> know squat about "electrics".
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? |
Hi Chuck! Can't say I envy your experiences! I know you're not
referring to me ( uninitiated .... electricity can be made failsafe),
since in my career I've let a fair amount of the magic smoke escape, and
I've said that almost nothing in the modern world is failsafe. However,
it's been my experience that by the time you smell the magic smoke
(really unique smell, isn't it!) the problem is over, the offending unit
is dead or heavily impaired ..... and if properly wired .... the ckt
breaker or fuse is intact. And I agree with your assessment of 'until
it happens to you, you don't know how you'll really react'. On a couple
of occasions, I've reacted fairly well, thank you very much, but there
have been those times that I've walloped the hell out of that 'panic
button'. I call them educational experiences. I've learned from every one.
Linn
do not archive
PS .... converters change the voltage (12V down to 6V etc) and inverters
change the type (DC to AC).
Chuck Weyant wrote:
>
> I got to chime in here. I'm a retired air traffic controller. I've
> experienced lots of emergencies in the tower cab throughout my career.
> Worked a C97 with two engine fires to a successful landing, had a
> Western Boeing720 trainer roll inverted, crash and explode near the
> base of the tower, a Hughes Airwest and military F4 midair just north
> of the airfield, and a Starduster Too auger in between the parallels
> at Oakland, CA right in front of me. I even saved a drowning victim
> at the lake one weekend when no one else would go in after the poor
> sob. I felt I was one pretty cool dude and could handle just about
> any emergency.
>
> Then one day as my wife and I were heading for Laughlin, NV, I looked
> down and there it was, a wisp of smoke from under the panel! I was
> smack dab in the middle of a coastal mountain range with little or no
> options but to slam off the master, declare an emergency and head back
> to the airport ten minutes away. Smoke and smell went away. Turned
> out to be an inverter (or converter, can't keep 'em straight) that
> blew. No fire, just smoked and melted.
>
> I don't know about others that have had smoke in the cockpit, but I
> wasn't interested in "isolating the problem." I just wanted on the
> ground --- now! I think there's a whole bunch of pilots that would
> react just like I did. Granted, some of you Chuck Yeagers would
> analyze and attempt to isolate the problem while being annoyed with
> the smoke, but I'm here to tell you that when/if smoke ever happens to
> you, no matter how macho you think you are, it's gonna get your
> attention! I didn't panic --- but I sure felt panic. I was scared,
> really, really scared.
>
> Anyhow, I smile when I hear the uninitiated attempt to convince others
> that electricity can be made failsafe.
> Chuck Weyant
> RV10 two months to first flight
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Which is a good vacuum pump? |
I'm late to the discussion but WET is the best IMHO. Of course you need air-oil
sep. It will weigh more over all. Some claim oil migration can get to gyros
and cause a problem. I have not seen that but I guess it could happen. There are
ways to prevent that. The point is WET will last and not fail unexpectedly
like DRY pumps.
New Dry pump designs look better than the traditional black can design? Just
get a spruce AC catalog. I have not used a Vac pump in years with the EFIS. It's
about money. Check the warranty.
If reliability is critical to you than plan preventative replacement. Dry pump
works fine, but those vane's wear and get unstable when they get short, causing
catastrophic failure. Do preventative maintence/inspections. The dry pumps
are delicate and need to be handled carefully. Cooling is critical as is the
overall installation. Restrictive fittings, hoses and improper or missing filters
and regulators are sure fire ways to mess your pump up.
Educate your self on all the DO's and DON'T of installation and operation of
any Vac pump. A lot of premature failures are due to abuse, installation error
or operation issues.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Instrument Panel - Powercoat Thickness? |
Matt,
Powdercoat guy here, recommended thickness is .0015" to .003" per side. We
usually get .002" to .003" when we spray. Just ask the powdercoater to run
his finger or something that will "brush off" the powder around the inside
of the holes before he cures the powder. Doing this will brush off the
powder and will take most if not all of the thickness away.
Chuck
RV6A FWF
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 1:07 PM
Subject: RV-List: Instrument Panel - Powercoat Thickness?
Dear Listers,
I laid out the RV-8 panel in a CAD program and had experimentalair.com cut a
clear Lexan mockup for fitting. I highly recommend using a Lexan mockup
first as its a lot cheaper and it really helps to be able to see through the
panel to locate brackets, etc. Also, Nick Burns over at ExperimpntalAir has
be *super* to work with on this project. I've been emailing him DXF
versions of the panel and he made a number of suggestions that I
incorporated into the CAD drawing. I sent him the final CAD version
Wednesday and he cut the Lexan panel on a FloJet and I received it Friday.
It's a work of art!
So here's my question. On the hole cutouts, I used a micrometer to measure
each instrument, then used these exact measurements in the CAD drawing. I
added .005" to both X and Y to allow for easier sliding in and out of the
instrument which has turned out to be exactly the right amount. BUT,
there's no powercoating on the panel yet. I'm planning on a simi-flat black
coating. What is the thickness of the powercoating? How much should I
increase the cutout size to account for the coating and still have the nice,
tight, fit that I have now?
Here's a link to my Builder's Log for anyone that is interested in checking
out more on the project:
http://www.mykitlog.com/users/category.php?user=dralle&project=619&category
0
Thanks for the feedback,
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV (res)
Message 13
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| Subject: | Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue |
I am posting this for a friend.....He can not send, only receive e-mails.
" I'm having a problem with Whelen strobe interference on my E.I.
UGB-16 engine analyzer showing up on number?two cylinder. The display
and bar graph jump between 190 and -300 deg F. When I turn off the
strobes the problem disappears. The 2?power packs are mounted on the
wingtips and are on a separate breakers for the E.I. and strobes. The
interference causes the E.I. to trip its 5 amp breaker taking along the
engine instruments and flap circuit with it.
If after checking all the T/C connections from number 2 I still have problems can
anyone suggest any ideas ?
Thanks,
Doug Gardner? RV-8A??? N456DG?? 101 hrs
Palm Harbor/Lakeland Fl
Douglas P. Gardner
Fireye Regional Sales Manager/Southeast
Palm Harbor, Florida ?34683
(727) 784-2600 Fax (727) 785-4767
Email : seabearfl@netzero.com
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue |
Off the top of my head..........=0A=0ADo not run any-wires that supply po
wer near a wire used for an instrument reading. =0A=0AFor example-on my f
irewall I have power wires going through in one area and-wires used for s
ensors in another area seperated by about 2 feet.=0A=0AI am guesing that so
mewhere along the way the strobe wires are to close to other non-power wire
s.......?=0A=0AScott RV-8a=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_______________________________
_=0AFrom: "cbrxxdrv@aol.com" <cbrxxdrv@aol.com>=0ATo: rv-list@matronics.com
=0ASent: Monday, December 15, 2008 2:45:08 PM=0ASubject: RV-List: Strobe an
d E.I. UGB-16 Issue=0A=0A=0AI am posting this for a friend.....He can not s
end, only receive e-mails.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A" I'm having a problem with Whelen
strobe interference on my E.I. UGB-16 engine analyzer showing up on number
-two cylinder. The display and bar graph jump between 190 and -300 deg F.
When I turn off the strobes the problem disappears. The 2-power packs ar
e mounted on the wingtips and are on a separate breakers for the E.I. and s
trobes. The interference causes the E.I. to trip its 5 amp breaker taking a
long the engine instruments and flap circuit with it.=0AIf after checking a
ll the T/C connections from number 2 I still have problems can anyone sugge
st any ideas ?=0AThanks,=0ADoug Gardner- RV-8A--- N456DG-- 101
hrs=0APalm Harbor/Lakeland Fl=0A=0ADouglas P. Gardner=0AFireye Regional Sal
es Manager/Southeast=0APalm Harbor, Florida -34683=0A(727) 784-2600 Fax (
727) 785-4767=0AEmail : seabearfl@netzero.com=0A=0A=0A_____________________
___________=0AListen to 350+ music, sports, & news radio stations ' inclu
ding songs for the holidays ' FREE while you browse. Start Listening Now!
=0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue |
I will say this for him.......it was fine for the first 100 hours ??
I am gonna take a look at it this weekend with him but will take all suggest
ions=C2- :)
Sal
-----Original Message-----
From: scott bilinski <rv8a2001@yahoo.com>
Sent: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 6:38 pm
Subject: Re: RV-List: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue
Off the top of my head..........
=C2-
Do not run any=C2-wires that supply power near a wire used for an instrume
nt reading.
=C2-
For example=C2-on my firewall I have power wires going through in one area
and=C2-wires used for sensors in another area seperated by about 2 feet.
=C2-
I am guesing that somewhere along the way the strobe wires are to close to o
ther non-power wires.......?
=C2-
=C2-
Scott RV-8a
From: "cbrxxdrv@aol.com" <cbrxxdrv@aol.com>
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 2:45:08 PM
Subject: RV-List: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue
I am posting this for a friend.....He can not send, only receive e-mails.
" I'm having a problem with Whelen strobe interference on my E.I. UGB-16 eng
ine analyzer showing up on number=C2-two cylinder. The display and bar gra
ph jump between 190 and -300 deg F. When I turn off the strobes the problem
disappears. The 2=C2-power packs are mounted on the wingtips and are on a
separate breakers for the E.I. and strobes. The interference causes the20E.I
. to trip its 5 amp breaker taking along the engine instruments and flap cir
cuit with it.
If after checking all the T/C connections from number 2 I still have problem
s can anyone suggest any ideas ?
Thanks,
Doug Gardner=C2- RV-8A=C2-=C2-=C2- N456DG=C2-=C2- 101 hrs
Palm Harbor/Lakeland Fl
Douglas P. Gardner
Fireye Regional Sales Manager/Southeast
Palm Harbor, Florida =C2-34683
(727) 784-2600 Fax (727) 785-4767
Email : seabearfl@netzero.com
Listen to 350+ music, sports, & news radio stations =93 including song
s for the holidays =93 FREE while you browse. Start Listening Now!
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue |
Interesting. I have a similar issue with #2 EGT only on same system.
Sometimes it is fine, othertimes it jumps around, occasionally drops off
line. Strobe switch is next to UBG-16 power switch. However this only
developed after 150 hours. Next time it happens will try turning strobes
off.
cbrxxdrv@aol.com wrote:
> I will say this for him.......it was fine for the first 100 hours ??
>
> I am gonna take a look at it this weekend with him but will take all
> suggestions :)
>
> Sal
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: scott bilinski <rv8a2001@yahoo.com>
> To: rv-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 6:38 pm
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue
>
> Off the top of my head..........
>
> Do not run any wires that supply power near a wire used for an
> instrument reading.
>
> For example on my firewall I have power wires going through in one
> area and wires used for sensors in another area seperated by about 2 feet.
>
> I am guesing that somewhere along the way the strobe wires are to
> close to other non-power wires.......?
>
>
> Scott RV-8a
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* "cbrxxdrv@aol.com <mailto:cbrxxdrv@aol.com>" <cbrxxdrv@aol.com
> <mailto:cbrxxdrv@aol.com>>
> *To:* rv-list@matronics.com <mailto:rv-list@matronics.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, December 15, 2008 2:45:08 PM
> *Subject:* RV-List: Strobe and E.I. UGB-16 Issue
>
> I am posting this for a friend.....He can not send, only receive e-mails.
>
>
> " I'm having a problem with Whelen strobe interference on my E.I.
> UGB-16 engine analyzer showing up on number two cylinder. The display
> and bar graph jump between 190 and -300 deg F. When I turn off the
> strobes the problem disappears. The 2 power packs are mounted on the
> wingtips and are on a separate breakers for the E.I. and strobes. The
> interference causes the E.I. to trip its 5 amp breaker taking along
> the engine instruments and flap circuit with it.
> If after checking all the T/C connections from number 2 I still have
> problems can anyone suggest any ideas ?
> Thanks,
> Doug Gardner RV-8A N456DG 101 hrs
> Palm Harbor/Lakeland Fl
>
> Douglas P. Gardner
> Fireye Reg ional Sales Manager/Southeast
> Palm Harbor, Florida 34683
> (727) 784-2600 Fax (727) 785-4767
> Email : seabearfl@netzero.com <mailto:seabearfl@netzero.com>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Listen to 350+ music, sports, & news radio stations including songs
> for the holidays FREE while you browse. Start Listening Now
> <http://toolbar.aol.com/aolradio/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown00000013>!
> < /font>
>
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List>
> *
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>
> ==========
>
> ,courier" size="2">* <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List>*http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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>
> or?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
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>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Listen to 350+ music, sports, & news radio stations including songs
> for the holidays FREE while you browse. Start Listening Now
> <http://toolbar.aol.com/aolradio/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown00000013>!
> *
>
> *
Message 17
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| Subject: | What we did for panel redundancy |
Listers--I'm not going to get into the argument, just share with you?what we did
and the logic we followed.
We set up our RV-6A for IFR as follows:
Vacuum attitude indicator and DG.
Electric turn coordinator/S-Tec 30 2-axis autopilot (ship's power only).
Electric back up attitude indicator?on right side of panel (ship's power only).
Replace vacuum pump (SigmaTek dry pump) every 500 hours.
Replace 60 amp alternator from Vans every 500 hours.
Garmin 430 panel mounted.
Garmin 496 on swing out mount near left side roll?bar with XM weather (ship's power
constantly charges battery with automatic battery back-up if power fails).??
The panel page on this unit is our final back-up, which Aviation Consumer
has demonstrated can keep you right side up?if you don't get too far out of whack.
Our theory: redundancy/multiple power sources plus periodic replacement of potential
failure items.
We haven't flown IFR yet so no real world data to share.
LeRoy Johnston/David White (Ohio)?RV-6A Esperanza 116.2 hours.
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: What we did for panel redundancy |
Great combination of redundancy and planning, as well as a good mx plan. N
ice work. I've tested the 396 in IMC and it would function well as a last
resort, although a vacuum failure and an electrical failure on the same fl
ight is, well...=0A=0APaul Besing=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A___________________________
_____=0AFrom: "jhnstniii@aol.com" <jhnstniii@aol.com>=0ATo: rv-list@matroni
cs.com=0ASent: Monday, December 15, 2008 8:44:30 PM=0ASubject: RV-List: Wha
t we did for panel redundancy=0A=0AListers--I'm not going to get into the a
rgument, just share with you what we did and the logic we followed.=0A=0AWe
set up our RV-6A for IFR as follows:=0A=0AVacuum attitude indicator and DG
.=0A=0AElectric turn coordinator/S-Tec 30 2-axis autopilot (ship's power on
ly).=0A=0AElectric back up attitude indicator on right side of panel (ship'
s power only).=0A=0AReplace vacuum pump (SigmaTek dry pump) every 500 hours
.=0A=0AReplace 60 amp alternator from Vans every 500 hours.=0A=0AGarmin 430
panel mounted.=0A=0AGarmin 496 on swing out mount near left side roll bar
with XM weather (ship's power constantly charges battery with automatic bat
tery back-up if power fails). The panel page on this unit is our final ba
ck-up, which Aviation Consumer has demonstrated can keep you right side up
if you don't get too far out of whack. =0A=0AOur theory: redundancy/multipl
e power sources plus periodic replacement of potential failure items.=0A=0A
We haven't flown IFR yet so no real world data to share. =0A=0ALeRoy Johnst
on/David White (Ohio) RV-6A Esperanza 116.2 hours.=0A=0A=0A________________
________________=0AListen to 350+ music, sports, & news radio stations '
including songs for the holidays ' FREE while you browse. Start Listening
====0A=0A=0A=0A
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