Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:16 AM - Re: Jack's Final Flight (Mark Grieve)
2. 02:07 PM - Re: Leaking Tank How To (Joe & Jan Connell)
3. 03:15 PM - Re: Jack's Final Flight (Jim Fogarty, Lakes & Leisure Realty, Inc.)
4. 03:15 PM - Re: Leaking Tank How To (RV6160hp@aol.com)
5. 03:55 PM - Re: Leaking Tank How To (Charlie England)
6. 04:30 PM - Re: Leaking Tank How To (RV6160hp@aol.com)
7. 04:36 PM - Re: Leaking Tank How To (Ian)
8. 05:53 PM - Re: Leaking Tank How To (Charlie England)
9. 10:22 PM - drilling hole in nose gear for cotter pin (thomas sargent)
10. 11:17 PM - Re: drilling hole in nose gear for cotter pin (Bruce Gray)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Jack's Final Flight |
I remember posts from KABONG. I hope that someone reads High Flight at his
service.
Mark
> My friend Jack Starn, many of you knew him as KABONG, has passed away. He
> has been sick for a long time and his heart just gave up. He hasn't added
> his witty comments to the lists for the last several years but the old
> timers will remember his emails.
>
> For the new guys/gals on the list, Jack moved next door to me right after
> I got the tail kit for the RV-4. It quickly turned into a Harmon Rocket
> II, and Jack held the bucking bar for all 16,000 rivets (plus or minus a
> few). During the five years of building Jack got cancer and had to have
> his vocal cords removed and talked with a buzzer held against his neck.
>
> We had a few good years but he got sick again. They couldn't find out why
> he lost 85 pounds and just got weaker and weaker.
>
> Anyway, the email I sent to my EAA chapter is below.
>
> For you all who might remember Jack-KABONG, please sent a short note, you
> know just a line or two with a personal comment, and I will copy them to a
> letter I will give the family.
>
> The memorial sevice will be May 30th at 10:00 AM. Some RV guys/gals are
> attempting to set up a missing man fly-by to start the service. After the
> service, we will take him for his last plane ride.
>
> Tom "GummiBear" Gummo
> Harmon Rocket II N-561FS 350 hours
> Major USAF Retired, F-4G Instuctor Pilot
> http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
>
> ******************************************************************************
> Everybody,
>
> Jack took his final flight this morning, May 19, 2009
>
> Last night, my wife cooked and we took the food up to the Starn's and had
> a nice evening with them. Jack was up walking around and we had a long
> talk about the Chino Air Show. He looked a lot better than his current
> normal.
>
> This morning I got a call and was told I had to come right away. When I
> arrived, he was with three football coaches from the school where he was
> "The Voice of the Ravens." He was unable to talk or raise his head and
> his breathing was labored. The hospice nurse said that he could hear us.
> The coaches prayed with him, sang a couple of songs and ended with a Raven
> cheer.
>
> I walked outside to call my folks who knew Jack and to cancel my trip to
> visit them this weekend. When his nephew came out and said it was all
> over. He was surround by family and friends.
>
> A couple hours later, the folks came to pick him up and we gathered on the
> front lawn to say Good-bye as they loaded him into the truck.
> The Air Force decided to say "Thank you for your service" and a plane from
> Edwards AFB broke the sound barrier overhead. So Jack was loaded with a
> sonic boom.
>
> As I get the details for his memorial service, I will send them to you.
>
> Please keep your thoughts and prayers for his family,
>
> Tom,
> Proud to say he was my friend.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Leaking Tank How To |
Loctite 290 is the same as Permatex 29000 and NAPA BK 7651148.
(Drove a few miles to figure this out...)
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Jack's Final Flight |
I remember reading his post, God Bless him and the men and women who
will give him a great send off. It's great to have a group of wonderful
friends to help his family in this time of sadness and sorrow.
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: halbenjamin@optonline.net
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 10:17 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Jack's Final Flight
Hi Tom,
I am truly sorry to hear about KABONG. I always got a big kick out of
his posts & have wondered what became of him in the last few years.
Please send may deepest condolences to his family. Thank you.
Sincerely,
Hal Benjamin
Long Island, New York
RV-4
----- Original Message -----
From: Tom Gummo
Date: Thursday, May 21, 2009 7:51 pm
Subject: RV-List: Jack's Final Flight
To: Rocket List , RV List
> My friend Jack Starn, many of you knew him as KABONG, has passed
> away. He has been sick for a long time and his heart just gave
> up. He hasn't added his witty comments to the lists for the
> last several years but the old timers will remember his emails.
>
> For the new guys/gals on the list, Jack moved next door to me
> right after I got the tail kit for the RV-4. It quickly turned
> into a Harmon Rocket II, and Jack held the bucking bar for all
> 16,000 rivets (plus or minus a few). During the five years of
> building Jack got cancer and had to have his vocal cords removed
> and talked with a buzzer held against his neck.
>
> We had a few good years but he got sick again. They couldn't
> find out why he lost 85 pounds and just got weaker and weaker.
>
> Anyway, the email I sent to my EAA chapter is below.
>
> For you all who might remember Jack-KABONG, please sent a short
> note, you know just a line or two with a personal comment, and I
> will copy them to a letter I will give the family.
>
> The memorial sevice will be May 30th at 10:00 AM. Some RV
> guys/gals are attempting to set up a missing man fly-by to start
> the service. After the service, we will take him for his last
> plane ride.
>
> Tom "GummiBear" Gummo
> Harmon Rocket II N-561FS 350 hours
> Major USAF Retired, F-4G Instuctor Pilot
> http://mysite.verizon.net/t.gummo/index.html
>
>
*************************************************************************
*****
> Everybody,
>
> Jack took his final flight this morning, May 19, 2009
>
> Last night, my wife cooked and we took the food up to the
> Starn's and had a nice evening with them. Jack was up walking
> around and we had a long talk about the Chino Air Show. He
> looked a lot better than his current normal.
>
> This morning I got a call and was told I had to come right away.
> When I arrived, he was with three football coaches from the
> school where he was "The Voice of the Ravens." He was unable to
> talk or raise his head and his breathing was labored. The
> hospice nurse said that he could hear us. The coaches prayed
> with him, sang a couple of songs and ended with a Raven cheer.
>
> I walked outside to call my folks who knew Jack and to cancel my
> trip to visit them this weekend. When his nephew came out and
> said it was all over. He was surround by family and friends.
>
> A couple hours later, the folks came to pick him up and we
> gathered on the front lawn to say Good-bye as they loaded him
> into the truck.
> The Air Force decided to say "Thank you for your service" and a
> plane from Edwards AFB broke the sound barrier overhead. So
> Jack was loaded with a sonic boom.
>
> As I get the details for his memorial service, I will send them
> to you.
>
> Please keep your thoughts and prayers for his family,
>
> Tom,
> Proud to say he was my friend.
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Leaking Tank How To |
For vacuum ....I have one of these older models for HVAC work ...and while
I have not done this on the RV fuel tanks.... I am aware of the technique
& done on home heating oil tank (less volatile??) repairs with vacuum
cleaner...this probably will not collapse your tank as fast either...
Thus for my $.02 FWIW ...if you have an air compressor and long hoses you
can make vacuum from one of these without electric motors near by &
present...
Yup good old Harbor Freight.... Internet prices matched at our local store
too... go see item 96677-7VGA, Air Vacuum Pump $14.99 and with R134A and
R12 Connectors to boot....heck someday you may want to put AC in a RV and
vacuum out the system prior to charge???
RV6 350 + TT Builder, Pilot.
FJ2
**************Stay connected and tighten your budget with a great mobile
device for under $50. Take a Peek!
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Leaking Tank How To |
RV6160hp@aol.com wrote:
> *For vacuum ....I have one of these older models for HVAC work ...and
> while I have not done this on the RV fuel tanks.... I am aware of the
> technique & done on home heating oil tank (less volatile??) repairs
> with vacuum cleaner...this probably will not collapse your tank as
> fast either...*
> **
> *Thus for my $.02 FWIW ...if you have an air compressor and long hoses
> you can make vacuum from one of these without electric motors near by
> & present...*
> **
> *Yup good old Harbor Freight.... Internet prices matched at our local
> store too... go see item 96677-7VGA, **Air Vacuum Pump $14.99 and
> with R134A and R12 Connectors to boot....heck someday you may want to
> put AC in a RV and vacuum out the system prior to charge???*
> **
> *RV6 350 + TT Builder, Pilot.*
> *FJ2*
You might want to ignore anything I say after I posted the wrong loctite
#, but here goes:
All you're looking for is a pressure differential & you don't really
need it for that long. With a large syringe (no needle) & a sheet of
soft rubber with a hole in the middle, you can put a drop of thread lock
on the rivet, use the rubber sheet as a gasket, and pressurize the area
using the syringe. Once the thread lock is forced into the gap, no
pressure is needed. In fact, continued pressure/vacuum can actually
re-open the gap.
Does the description make sense?
Charlie
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Leaking Tank How To |
Yup whole heatedly agreed...the vacuum I applied in the past on big "earl"
tanks was to replace filters, fittings & lines without flow out from the
tanks for a duration of repairs...I can understand fully your mention of we
may just reopen the gap with constant vacuum applied...
I easily can agree with your force a little via pressure (not vacuum now)
into the leak area there from the outside, localized as you outlined below,
it would be a better 1st attempt for leak repair.......
In a message dated 5/22/2009 6:56:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
ceengland@bellsouth.net writes:
--> RV-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
RV6160hp@aol.com wrote:
> *For vacuum ....I have one of these older models for HVAC work ...and
> while I have not done this on the RV fuel tanks.... I am aware of the
> technique & done on home heating oil tank (less volatile??) repairs
> with vacuum cleaner...this probably will not collapse your tank as
> fast either...*
> **
> *Thus for my $.02 FWIW ...if you have an air compressor and long hoses
> you can make vacuum from one of these without electric motors near by
> & present...*
> **
> *Yup good old Harbor Freight.... Internet prices matched at our local
> store too... go see item 96677-7VGA, **Air Vacuum Pump $14.99 and
> with R134A and R12 Connectors to boot....heck someday you may want to
> put AC in a RV and vacuum out the system prior to charge???*
> **
> *RV6 350 + TT Builder, Pilot.*
> *FJ2*
You might want to ignore anything I say after I posted the wrong loctite
#, but here goes:
All you're looking for is a pressure differential & you don't really
need it for that long. With a large syringe (no needle) & a sheet of
soft rubber with a hole in the middle, you can put a drop of thread lock
on the rivet, use the rubber sheet as a gasket, and pressurize the area
using the syringe. Once the thread lock is forced into the gap, no
pressure is needed. In fact, continued pressure/vacuum can actually
re-open the gap.
Does the description make sense?
Charlie
**************Stay connected and tighten your budget with a great mobile
device for under $50. Take a Peek!
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Leaking Tank How To |
Evan Johnson gave me some great advice, and I was able to fix a fairly
large leak (despite the air pressure testing) by diluting Proseal with
lacquer thinner, which contains MEK and some other ingredients. It did
a great job, but it has to be run along the seams, on the inside of the
tank, involving removing the tank. I did some comparison between using
acetone and lacquer thinner and the latter did a much better job of
making the Proseal adequately runny, but it dried to a nice firm
consistency.
Unfortunately, if you're trying to fix a baffle seal leak, rather than a
rivet, you'll have to remove the tank to do this. The good news is that
you can pour in the diluted Proseal via the filler and just patiently
let it flow along to the other end and back a few times. You should not
need to cut new holes if it's leaking along the baffle seam.
As others suggested, the best way to test the tank is with Avgas since
the staining helps localize the leaks, and on my data point of two
tanks, the air test failed to localize a leak in one of them.
Ian Brown
RV-9A
Bromont
Quebec
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Leaking Tank How To |
Ian wrote:
>
> Evan Johnson gave me some great advice, and I was able to fix a fairly
> large leak (despite the air pressure testing) by diluting Proseal with
> lacquer thinner, which contains MEK and some other ingredients. It did
> a great job, but it has to be run along the seams, on the inside of the
> tank, involving removing the tank. I did some comparison between using
> acetone and lacquer thinner and the latter did a much better job of
> making the Proseal adequately runny, but it dried to a nice firm
> consistency.
>
> Unfortunately, if you're trying to fix a baffle seal leak, rather than a
> rivet, you'll have to remove the tank to do this. The good news is that
> you can pour in the diluted Proseal via the filler and just patiently
> let it flow along to the other end and back a few times. You should not
> need to cut new holes if it's leaking along the baffle seam.
>
> As others suggested, the best way to test the tank is with Avgas since
> the staining helps localize the leaks, and on my data point of two
> tanks, the air test failed to localize a leak in one of them.
>
> Ian Brown
> RV-9A
> Bromont
> Quebec
>
I had a similar issue with an aux tank I added to the wing leading edge
(laid the bead too far from the back baffle). I called Flamemaster (the
brand of 'proseal' Van was supplying at the time) & asked for a pour
able sealant that was compatible with the original sealant. IIRC, the
product they recommended was CS3600; you can find the spec sheet here:
http://www.flamemaster.com/sealants.html
I've also (mis?)used it on the access cover as a gasket sealant for the
cork gasket, & then painted it over the edges& over the screw heads
after installing the cover.
If anyone needs to order some, drop me a line & I'll go look at the can
to be sure of the # before you order. :-)
Lots of other interesting stuff on the page, including the CS3300 products.
Charlie
Message 9
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| Subject: | drilling hole in nose gear for cotter pin |
I got my nose gear back from Langair last week and remounted it and just set
the nose wheel breakout force tonight. I then tried to drill the 1/8" holes
for the large cotter pin that secures the big castle nut that holds the fork
on. After an hour I am perhaps 1/3 of the way thru the wall of the nose
gear. I'm using new drill bits and "tap magic" cutting fluid. I put a
piece of tape on the chuck of the hand drill so I could see how fast it is
turning. I think it is no more than 500 RPM. I'm using a #30 and a #40
(Langair says to make a dimple with the #30 then drill a pilot hole with the
#40). The #40 seems to make no progress at all. The #30 at least produces
some filings, but it's REALLY slow going.
Is there a better type of drill bit to use? I'm using drill bits I bought
from Avery which work fine on aluminum and soft steel. Or perhaps a
different type of cutting fluid?
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
Message 10
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| Subject: | drilling hole in nose gear for cotter pin |
All work and a dull drill make Jack a bored buy.
Have you sharpened your bits?
Bruce
www.Glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of thomas sargent
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2009 1:20 AM
Subject: RV-List: drilling hole in nose gear for cotter pin
I got my nose gear back from Langair last week and remounted it and just
set the nose wheel breakout force tonight. I then tried to drill the
1/8" holes for the large cotter pin that secures the big castle nut that
holds the fork on. After an hour I am perhaps 1/3 of the way thru the
wall of the nose gear. I'm using new drill bits and "tap magic" cutting
fluid. I put a piece of tape on the chuck of the hand drill so I could
see how fast it is turning. I think it is no more than 500 RPM. I'm
using a #30 and a #40 (Langair says to make a dimple with the #30 then
drill a pilot hole with the #40). The #40 seems to make no progress at
all. The #30 at least produces some filings, but it's REALLY slow going.
Is there a better type of drill bit to use? I'm using drill bits I
bought from Avery which work fine on aluminum and soft steel. Or
perhaps a different type of cutting fluid?
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
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