RV-List Digest Archive

Tue 09/22/09


Total Messages Posted: 17



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 06:31 AM - Painting Baffles (Valovich, Paul)
     2. 06:34 AM - RV Newsletter was Gear leg fairing scribe lines (Chris Stone)
     3. 07:20 AM - Re: Re: Front Mounted Governor vs. Rear Mounted Governor... (wgill10@comcast.net)
     4. 07:22 AM - Inspection Plate (David Schaefer)
     5. 08:39 AM - Re: Inspection Plate (Ollie Washburn)
     6. 08:56 AM - Re: Painting Baffles (peter laurence)
     7. 10:41 AM - Re: RV Newsletter was Gear leg fairing scribe lines (Bob Collins)
     8. 04:15 PM - Re: Inspection Plate ()
     9. 04:57 PM - IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? (Mike De Lange)
    10. 05:02 PM - Re: Inspection Plate (Tim Bryan)
    11. 05:09 PM - Re: Inspection Plate (Bret Smith)
    12. 06:27 PM - Re: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? (Mike Robertson)
    13. 06:51 PM - Re: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? (Kelly McMullen)
    14. 06:54 PM - Re: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? (Darrell Reiley)
    15. 07:58 PM - Re: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? (Tim Olson)
    16. 08:43 PM - Re: Inspection Plate (Terry Watson)
    17. 10:43 PM - Re: Inspection Plate (Vanremog@aol.com)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 06:31:39 AM PST US
    From: "Valovich, Paul" <pvalovich@dcscorp.com>
    Subject: Painting Baffles
    I am finishing my baffles and have put a primer coat (SEMS Self Etching Gre y) on the metal and decided to leave it at that and not paint. Has anyone d one this? If so, how did it hold up? Paul Valovich RV-8A N192NM


    Message 2


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    Time: 06:34:51 AM PST US
    From: Chris Stone <rv8iator@earthlink.net>
    Subject: RV Newsletter was Gear leg fairing scribe lines
    Bob... If you are working on the fairings you must be nearing the final stage of completion! Is the RV Newsletter dead and burried? Curious in Oregon... C. Stone RV-8 eventually -----Original Message----- >From: Bob Collins <bcollinsrv7a@comcast.net> >Sent: Sep 21, 2009 3:08 PM >To: rv-list@matronics.com >Subject: RV-List: Re: Gear leg fairing scribe lines > > >The answer on the scribe lines on gear leg fairings comes from Ken Scott at Van's: > >Some fairings have them, some don't. I think it depends on the condition of the mold when they are laid up. It really doesn't make much difference, as it turns out. Trim the fairing to fit between the fuse and the wheel pant. As long as it's symmetrical between sides, it will work. >The inter. fairings can cover whatever space you leave. > > >-------- >Bob Collins >St. Paul, Minn. >Letters from Flyover Country >http://rvnewsletter.blogspot.com/ > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264184#264184 > >


    Message 3


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    Time: 07:20:52 AM PST US
    From: wgill10@comcast.net
    Subject: Re: Front Mounted Governor vs. Rear Mounted Governor...
    Hello Matt, I purchased a 72" cable from Spruce (special order, 3.5" stroke). A 68" cab le would have been perfect, but more special order fees were required. Sinc e I have a -7 without side controls, your application will likely be differ ent. Best regards, Bill RV-7 N151WP Lee's Summit, MO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle@matronics.com> Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 5:00:40 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: RV-List: Re: Front Mounted Governor vs. Rear Mounted Governor... Great pictures, Bill; thank you! I just ordered a PCU5000 with the extension arm and the clockwise rotation (clockwise to increase pitch). What length control cable did you use? If you had made your bracket stick out a little farther, could you have got ten away with not using the extra bushing on the control arm? Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV http://www.mattsrv8.com Engine Baffling & Governor Installation... -------- Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264215#264215 =========== =========== MS - =========== e - =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2--Matt Dralle, List Admin. ===========


    Message 4


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    Time: 07:22:00 AM PST US
    From: David Schaefer <n142ds@gmail.com>
    Subject: Inspection Plate
    Has anyone in the 6 or 7 community cut 'inspection' plates into the forward coweling just ahead of the windshield for access to that area? If so I'd love to see pictures, how you did it, does it leak etc? Please contact me off-line. Thanks.... for the help. David W. Schaefer RV-6A N142DS "Nerdgasm" TMX-IO360 Dual-LightSpeed Plasma IIIs, Hartzell Blended Airfoil, GRT EFIS www.n142ds.com


    Message 5


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    Time: 08:39:37 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Inspection Plate
    From: Ollie Washburn <ollies7s@gmail.com>
    Many RVs have the cut-outs. Some with 2 and some with 4 like mine. Ollie On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 10:21 AM, David Schaefer <n142ds@gmail.com> wrote: > Has anyone in the 6 or 7 community cut 'inspection' plates into the forward > coweling just ahead of the windshield for access to that area? If so I'd > love to see pictures, how you did it, does it leak etc? Please contact me > off-line. > > Thanks.... for the help. > > > David W. Schaefer > RV-6A N142DS "Nerdgasm" > TMX-IO360 Dual-LightSpeed Plasma IIIs, Hartzell Blended Airfoil, GRT EFIS > www.n142ds.com > > * > > * > >


    Message 6


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    Time: 08:56:58 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Painting Baffles
    From: peter laurence <peterlaurence6@gmail.com>
    There are Rvs at my field that with bare metal baffles. A couple of them are over ten years old and the baffles look fine. BTW, I retrieved a scrap piece of flap that was in my back yard exposed to the elements(Miami Beach).Buffed it up a bit and and was good as new. Now, Had that flap been primed and painted without ectching and chromic converting, filliform corrosion would have been the menu for the day! Peter Laurence On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 9:30 AM, Valovich, Paul <pvalovich@dcscorp.com>wrote: > I am finishing my baffles and have put a primer coat (SEMS Self Etching > Grey) on the metal and decided to leave it at that and not paint. Has anyone > done this? If so, how did it hold up? > > Paul Valovich > > RV-8A N192NM > > * > > * > >


    Message 7


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    Time: 10:41:05 AM PST US
    From: "Bob Collins" <bcollinsrv7a@comcast.net>
    Subject: RV Newsletter was Gear leg fairing scribe lines
    Yes, I am working on the "final stage of completion," Chris. Of course, I've been working on the stage for several years, now. (g) Seriously, if I had a bunch of money and a lot more time, I'd be flying by next year some time. But I'm thinking 2011 is probably more realistic. Somewhere along the 8-year build in which I started out as a cut-corners kind of guy, I became a bit of a perfectionist. Yes, the RV Builder's Hotline is -- basically -- dead and buried (although the archives and all the articles will stay up). Once Yahoo started bouncing back because of sp*m, it just created a nightmare of work trying to get each mailing out to 2,000 people. But the real problem is that a lot of content that was spread all over the universe, has migrated to VAF so the reason for its existence disappeared. I still write an occasional article but I just put it on the blog (http://rvnewsletter.blogspot.com). Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Stone Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:34 AM Subject: RV-List: RV Newsletter was Gear leg fairing scribe lines Bob... If you are working on the fairings you must be nearing the final stage of completion! Is the RV Newsletter dead and burried? Curious in Oregon... C. Stone RV-8 eventually


    Message 8


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    Time: 04:15:08 PM PST US
    From: <av8er2fly@peoplepc.com>
    Subject: Re: Inspection Plate
    Dan Checkoway did this but all his pictures and website are gone. Mark Rose 8A 137MR To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 7:21 AM Subject: RV-List: Inspection Plate Has anyone in the 6 or 7 community cut 'inspection' plates into the forward coweling just ahead of the windshield for access to that area? If so I'd love to see pictures, how you did it, does it leak etc? Please contact me off-line. Thanks.... for the help. David W. Schaefer RV-6A N142DS "Nerdgasm" TMX-IO360 Dual-LightSpeed Plasma IIIs, Hartzell Blended Airfoil, GRT EFIS www.n142ds.com


    Message 9


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    Time: 04:57:51 PM PST US
    From: Mike De Lange <squishyoleo@yahoo.ca>
    Subject: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram??
    Hi All! I'm building an RV-9A and I've decided that I want to go with an IO-320 (vertical induction) engine which will probably be purchased from Aerosport in BC (I'm located in Canada). This engine uses the Precision AirmotiveSilver HawkEX fuel injection system which, from what I'm told, has no fuel vapor return lines. This seems like a nice feature as that means that I wouldn't have to poke another set of holes in my tanks. Unfortunetly in all the time I've spent researching and gathering information on how to hook it all up, I've been finding that there is an amazing lack of information on how one would go about installing it. I asked Aerosport if they had any information on how the system would be plumbed in and they said I should go talk to Precision. I went and spoke with Precision and they told me that that would be dictated by the engine manufacturer and I should go talk to them. I'm stuck. Van's has apparently never installed a vertical induction fuel injected engine on any of their planes so they won't even begin to speculate. The Van's Airforce site was no help (which was surprising) as well as a couple of dozen builder websites which didn't help either. Is anyone here using a setup like that? Would anyone here have a diagram as to how this system would be put together? Thanks! __________________________________________________________________ Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet Explorer 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! at http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/


    Message 10


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    Time: 05:02:00 PM PST US
    From: "Tim Bryan" <n616tb@btsapps.com>
    Subject: Inspection Plate
    David, Why offline? This would be of particular interest to me and probably others. Anyone responding to this, please post online. Thanks a bunch. I just hate crawling under the panel to get to stuff. Not sure how bad the access panels would look, but maybe not bad. Tim Bryan RV-6 Flying N616TB over 120 hours now From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David Schaefer Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:21 AM Subject: RV-List: Inspection Plate Has anyone in the 6 or 7 community cut 'inspection' plates into the forward coweling just ahead of the windshield for access to that area? If so I'd love to see pictures, how you did it, does it leak etc? Please contact me off-line. Thanks.... for the help. David W. Schaefer RV-6A N142DS "Nerdgasm" TMX-IO360 Dual-LightSpeed Plasma IIIs, Hartzell Blended Airfoil, GRT EFIS www.n142ds.com


    Message 11


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    Time: 05:09:51 PM PST US
    From: "Bret Smith" <smithhb@tds.net>
    Subject: Inspection Plate
    Just a note, Vans strongly discourages this mod as it weakens the entire structure. This is part of the "crumple zone" in the event of a crash and weakening the area could compromise pilot and passenger safety. Bret Smith EAA Technical Advisor RV-9A N16BL Blue Ridge, GA From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of av8er2fly@peoplepc.com Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:17 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Inspection Plate Dan Checkoway did this but all his pictures and website are gone. Mark Rose 8A 137MR Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 7:21 AM Subject: RV-List: Inspection Plate Has anyone in the 6 or 7 community cut 'inspection' plates into the forward coweling just ahead of the windshield for access to that area? If so I'd love to see pictures, how you did it, does it leak etc? Please contact me off-line. Thanks.... for the help. David W. Schaefer RV-6A N142DS "Nerdgasm" TMX-IO360 Dual-LightSpeed Plasma IIIs, Hartzell Blended Airfoil, GRT EFIS www.n142ds.com href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/N avigator?RV-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c


    Message 12


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    Time: 06:27:59 PM PST US
    From: Mike Robertson <mrobert569@hotmail.com>
    Subject: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram??
    While we did not use the precision fuel injection system we did install an IO-320 in our RV-9A using the airflow performance FI system. Sorry I don't have any pictures but I can tell you that we basically used the Van's RV-7 A fuel injection system drawing. The exception was the fuel return line co ming from the purge valve mounted to the flow divider. We had to install a return line from the flow purge valve to the left tank fuel line just prior to the selector valve. Easy to do and the only special consideration is t hat we purge and start on the right tank. Any questions drop me a line. Mike Robertson Das Fed > Date: Tue=2C 22 Sep 2009 16:49:27 -0700 > From: squishyoleo@yahoo.ca > Subject: RV-List: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? > To: rv-list@matronics.com > > > Hi All! > > I'm building an RV-9A and I've decided that I want to go with an IO-320 ( vertical induction) engine which will probably be purchased from Aerosport in BC (I'm located in Canada). This engine uses the Precision Airmotive Si lver Hawk EX fuel injection system which=2C from what I'm told=2C has no fu el vapor return lines. This seems like a nice feature as that means that I wouldn't have to poke another set of holes in my tanks. > > Unfortunetly in all the time I've spent researching and gathering informa tion on how to hook it all up=2C I've been finding that there is an amazing lack of information on how one would go about installing it. I asked Aero sport if they had any information on how the system would be plumbed in and they said I should go talk to Precision. I went and spoke with Precision and they told me that that would be dictated by the engine manufacturer and I should go talk to them. I'm stuck. Van's has apparently never installe d a vertical induction fuel injected engine on any of their planes so they won't even begin to speculate. The Van's Airforce site was no help (which was surprising) as well as a couple of dozen builder websites which didn't help either. > > Is anyone here using a setup like that? Would anyone here have a diagram as to how this system would be put together? > > Thanks! > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > Make your browsing faster=2C safer=2C and easier with the new Internet Ex plorer=AE 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! at http://downloads. yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/ > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > _________________________________________________________________ Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.


    Message 13


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    Time: 06:51:01 PM PST US
    From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
    Subject: Re: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram??
    Not sure what a vertical induction would look like, as the injected type certificated versions of Lycoming I am familiar with all had Precision horizontal induction, and have no provisions for any return line. Any reason you couldn't specify a horizontal induction sump for your engine? I would look to what the Twin Comanche used with the IO-320. Mike Robertson wrote: > While we did not use the precision fuel injection system we did install > an IO-320 in our RV-9A using the airflow performance FI system. Sorry I > don't have any pictures but I can tell you that we basically used the > Van's RV-7A fuel injection system drawing. The exception was the fuel > return line coming from the purge valve mounted to the flow divider. We > had to install a return line from the flow purge valve to the left tank > fuel line just prior to the selector valve. Easy to do and the only > special consideration is that we purge and start on the right tank. Any > questions drop me a line. > > Mike Robertson > Das Fed > > > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 16:49:27 -0700 > > From: squishyoleo@yahoo.ca > > Subject: RV-List: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? > > To: rv-list@matronics.com > > > > > > Hi All! > > > > I'm building an RV-9A and I've decided that I want to go with an > IO-320 (vertical induction) engine which will probably be purchased from > Aerosport in BC (I'm located in Canada). This engine uses the Precision > Airmotive Silver Hawk EX fuel injection system which, from what I'm > told, has no fuel vapor return lines. This seems like a nice feature as > that means that I wouldn't have to poke another set of holes in my tanks. > > > > Unfortunetly in all the time I've spent researching and gathering > information on how to hook it all up, I've been finding that there is an > amazing lack of information on how one would go about installing it. I > asked Aerosport if they had any information on how the system would be > plumbed in and they said I should go talk to Precision. I went and > spoke with Precision and they told me that that would be dictated by the > engine manufacturer and I should go talk to them. I'm stuck. Van's has > apparently never installed a vertical induction fuel injected engine on > any of their planes so they won't even begin to speculate. The Van's > Airforce site was no help (which was surprising) as well as a couple of > dozen builder websites which didn't help either. > > > > Is anyone here using a setup like that? Would anyone here have a > diagram as to how this system would be put together? > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > > Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet > Explorer 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! at > http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplor====================== > &g============== > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmai='_new'>Sign up now. > > * > > > *


    Message 14


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    Time: 06:54:04 PM PST US
    From: Darrell Reiley <lifeofreiley2003@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram??
    Mark Olson in Canada is getting a new power plant 320 for his RV4 which is fuel injected. He had a Precision set-up he removed from his old 320... he was also wanting to sell the system as his new 320 comes with a new FI system. You may tray and track him down. Darrell --- On Tue, 9/22/09, Mike De Lange <squishyoleo@yahoo.ca> wrote: > From: Mike De Lange <squishyoleo@yahoo.ca> > Subject: RV-List: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram?? > To: rv-list@matronics.com > Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 6:49 PM > Mike De Lange <squishyoleo@yahoo.ca> > > Hi All! > > I'm building an RV-9A and I've decided that I want to go > with an IO-320 (vertical induction) engine which will > probably be purchased from Aerosport in BC (I'm located in > Canada). This engine uses the Precision AirmotiveSilver > HawkEX fuel injection system which, from what I'm told, > has no fuel vapor return lines. This seems like a nice > feature as that means that I wouldn't have to poke another > set of holes in my tanks. > > Unfortunetly in all the time I've spent researching and > gathering information on how to hook it all up, I've been > finding that there is an amazing lack of information on how > one would go about installing it. I asked Aerosport if > they had any information on how the system would be plumbed > in and they said I should go talk to Precision. I went and > spoke with Precision and they told me that that would be > dictated by the engine manufacturer and I should go talk to > them. I'm stuck. Van's has apparently never installed a > vertical induction fuel injected engine on any of their > planes so they won't even begin to speculate. The Van's > Airforce site was no help (which was surprising) as well as > a couple of dozen builder websites which didn't help > either. > > Is anyone here using a setup like that? Would anyone here > have a diagram as to how this system would be put together? > > Thanks! > > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new > Internet Explorer 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for > Free! at http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/ > > > Forum - > FAQ, > - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > List Contribution Web Site - > -Matt > Dralle, List Admin. > > > >


    Message 15


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    Time: 07:58:55 PM PST US
    From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
    Subject: Re: IO-320 Fuel System Diagram??
    I think you're overthinking it a little as to how hard it will be to plumb the engine. On the -10, a vertical induction precision is really common. Bart delivers the engine all set up, and the FI stuff that's left just bolts right up and is real straight forward. I can show you some -10 install photos if you need. It is nice not to have to worry about return lines and purge valves, and it makes the install really simple. I can't tell you how the airbox on a 9A is going to go, and how it mates with the cowl. All I call say is that on the -10 it just isn't much to worry about. So if you can get anyone with a vertical system on a 9A to just take a picture for you, you'll have no problem getting it all set up. All of the people you referred to will probably answer the questions with good answers, but just be careful to ask the right questions to the right people, as you're asking them. Don't bother Bart with questions about how it fits with the 9A cowl. Don't ask Precision about the electric boost pump and all the stuff that comes before their system. Just focus the questions from each person on the thing that they know best. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD do not archive Mike De Lange wrote: > > Hi All! > > I'm building an RV-9A and I've decided that I want to go with an > IO-320 (vertical induction) engine which will probably be purchased > from Aerosport in BC (I'm located in Canada). This engine uses the > Precision Airmotive Silver Hawk EX fuel injection system which, from > what I'm told, has no fuel vapor return lines. This seems like a > nice feature as that means that I wouldn't have to poke another set > of holes in my tanks. > > Unfortunetly in all the time I've spent researching and gathering > information on how to hook it all up, I've been finding that there is > an amazing lack of information on how one would go about installing > it. I asked Aerosport if they had any information on how the system > would be plumbed in and they said I should go talk to Precision. I > went and spoke with Precision and they told me that that would be > dictated by the engine manufacturer and I should go talk to them. > I'm stuck. Van's has apparently never installed a vertical induction > fuel injected engine on any of their planes so they won't even begin > to speculate. The Van's Airforce site was no help (which was > surprising) as well as a couple of dozen builder websites which > didn't help either. > > Is anyone here using a setup like that? Would anyone here have a > diagram as to how this system would be put together? > > Thanks! >


    Message 16


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    Time: 08:43:40 PM PST US
    From: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
    Subject: Inspection Plate
    An inspection plate done right should not weaken the structure at all. It could stiffen the structure in a way that was detrimental to the crumple zone mentioned, but it should not make it weaker. And of course it makes the plane slightly heavier. I did it on my stalled 8A project and could come up with some photos if no one else has any available. Terry RV-8A #80729 Seattle From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bret Smith Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 4:39 PM Subject: RE: RV-List: Inspection Plate Just a note, Vans strongly discourages this mod as it weakens the entire structure. This is part of the "crumple zone" in the event of a crash and weakening the area could compromise pilot and passenger safety. Bret Smith EAA Technical Advisor RV-9A N16BL Blue Ridge, GA From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of av8er2fly@peoplepc.com Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:17 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Inspection Plate Dan Checkoway did this but all his pictures and website are gone. Mark Rose 8A 137MR Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 7:21 AM Subject: RV-List: Inspection Plate Has anyone in the 6 or 7 community cut 'inspection' plates into the forward coweling just ahead of the windshield for access to that area? If so I'd love to see pictures, how you did it, does it leak etc? Please contact me off-line. Thanks.... for the help. David W. Schaefer RV-6A N142DS "Nerdgasm" TMX-IO360 Dual-LightSpeed Plasma IIIs, Hartzell Blended Airfoil, GRT EFIS www.n142ds.com href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/N avigator?RV-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution


    Message 17


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    Time: 10:43:39 PM PST US
    From: Vanremog@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Inspection Plate
    This is just nonsense. The installation of access panels merely needs to be done in such a way as to not appreciably weaken OR strengthen the structure in that region, as it needs to deform in a predictable way. Th is assumes that the original monocoque structure was in fact designed exactl y as Van's claims and that adequate testing has proven that the crumple zones collectively behave well in compression at a given crash speed. That the y performed this testing and optimized it in the design seem a stretch to me. I personally would err on the side of making the mod slightly more robust rather than slightly weaker than the original area. I think that after many years Van's people have grown weary of answering the zillion questions about the myriad modifications possible and so "jus t make it work", "if you really needed it, we would have designed it in" an d "we discourage making any modifications" yada yada become the most effective way to end further legitimate discussion. I would follow prudent access panel suggestions presented in the Tony Bingelis books and I believe that as long as the area looks approximately as robust as the original, it would be acceptable. This is not a wing spar repair. Keep in mind that there are similar access panels in the undersi de of the wing skins at mid-span and these are in a much more critical failure area. N1GV (RV-6A Flying 930TTAE Silicon Valley, CA) In a message dated 9/22/2009 5:11:52 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, smithhb@tds.net writes: Just a note, Vans strongly discourages this mod as it weakens the entire structure. This is part of the =9Ccrumple zone=9D in the even t of a crash and weakening the area could compromise pilot and passenger safety.




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