Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:52 PM - spark plugs and cooling baffles (thomas sargent)
2. 04:12 PM - Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles (Steve Hamer)
3. 05:05 PM - Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles (William Gill)
4. 05:09 PM - Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles (HCRV6@comcast.net)
5. 06:10 PM - Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles (Kyle Boatright)
6. 06:44 PM - Autogas STC (Charles Ennis)
7. 07:11 PM - Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles (Charles Kuss)
8. 07:14 PM - Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles (Denis Walsh)
9. 07:22 PM - Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles (Bobby Hester)
Message 1
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| Subject: | spark plugs and cooling baffles |
I just tried to put plugs in my engine (IO-360-B2B) today and found that the
cooling baffles make it impossible to get a deep socket on the aft, top
plugs (on 3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on OK, there just isn't
room between the socket and the cooling baffle to get the ratchet wrench or
even just a simple breaker bar on the socket. Now, I don't have a real
aircraft spark plug socket, just a 7/8" Home Depot socket, so maybe the real
thing is a bit shorter? I should mention that since I made a cooling plenum
for my engine, my baffles are 1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be
without the plenum. So, there's no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
Every one must run into this same problem. Will I have to hack an access
hole in the baffles to get a socket extension in there? Or will ordering a
spark plug socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be easy.
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles |
I had the same problem with the Autolite plugs that came with my engine.
The Champion plugs are a bit shorter and will allow a socket and
ratchet to fit in there. That's what worked for me.
Steve Hamer
RV-6 flying
Apple Valley, Ca
----- Original Message -----
From: thomas sargent
To: rv-list
Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 2:51 PM
Subject: RV-List: spark plugs and cooling baffles
I just tried to put plugs in my engine (IO-360-B2B) today and found
that the cooling baffles make it impossible to get a deep socket on the
aft, top plugs (on 3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on OK,
there just isn't room between the socket and the cooling baffle to get
the ratchet wrench or even just a simple breaker bar on the socket.
Now, I don't have a real aircraft spark plug socket, just a 7/8" Home
Depot socket, so maybe the real thing is a bit shorter? I should
mention that since I made a cooling plenum for my engine, my baffles are
1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be without the plenum. So,
there's no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
Every one must run into this same problem. Will I have to hack an
access hole in the baffles to get a socket extension in there? Or will
ordering a spark plug socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be easy.
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles |
Tom,
This is very common problem with RV's as well as certified ships. The
top of an aircraft plug socket is a 7/8 inch hex and well suited for a
wrench or socket. Simply use a crow-feet wrench on the socket hex and
you should be fine.
Bill
RV-7 N151WP
Lee's Summit, MO
----- Original Message -----
From: thomas sargent
To: rv-list
Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 4:51 PM
Subject: RV-List: spark plugs and cooling baffles
I just tried to put plugs in my engine (IO-360-B2B) today and found
that the cooling baffles make it impossible to get a deep socket on the
aft, top plugs (on 3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on OK,
there just isn't room between the socket and the cooling baffle to get
the ratchet wrench or even just a simple breaker bar on the socket.
Now, I don't have a real aircraft spark plug socket, just a 7/8" Home
Depot socket, so maybe the real thing is a bit shorter? I should
mention that since I made a cooling plenum for my engine, my baffles are
1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be without the plenum. So,
there's no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
Every one must run into this same problem. Will I have to hack an
access hole in the baffles to get a socket extension in there? Or will
ordering a spark plug socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be easy.
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles |
Or do as I did and buy an offset box wrench, Craftsman makes a good one, and use
that on those aft two plugs. I rotate plugs every fifty hours and never have
a problem using this wrench. Oh yes, I did have to do a little grinding so that
that the wrench fits deeper into the cylinder fins because the hex on my Champion
plugs is lower than the hex on the Autolites.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 650 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "thomas sargent" <sarg314@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 2, 2010 2:51:45 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
Subject: RV-List: spark plugs and cooling baffles
I just tried to put plugs in my engine (IO-360-B2B) today and found that the cooling
baffles make it impossible to get a deep socket on the aft, top plugs (on
3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on OK, there just isn't room between
the socket and the cooling baffle to get the ratchet wrench or even just a simple
breaker bar on the socket. Now, I don't have a real aircraft spark plug
socket, just a 7/8" Home Depot socket, so maybe the real thing is a bit shorter?
I should mention that since I made a cooling plenum for my engine, my baffles
are 1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be without the plenum. So, there's
no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
Every one must run into this same problem. Will I have to hack an access hole in
the baffles to get a socket extension in there? Or will ordering a spark plug
socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be easy.
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles |
The newer (OK, newer than my circa 1999 baffles) come with punched
openings in the baffle sides which provide a pass through for a socket
extension. You could do something similar and use snap-in plugs to
provide access.
Kyle Boatright
----- Original Message -----
From: thomas sargent
To: rv-list
Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 5:51 PM
Subject: RV-List: spark plugs and cooling baffles
I just tried to put plugs in my engine (IO-360-B2B) today and found
that the cooling baffles make it impossible to get a deep socket on the
aft, top plugs (on 3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on OK,
there just isn't room between the socket and the cooling baffle to get
the ratchet wrench or even just a simple breaker bar on the socket.
Now, I don't have a real aircraft spark plug socket, just a 7/8" Home
Depot socket, so maybe the real thing is a bit shorter? I should
mention that since I made a cooling plenum for my engine, my baffles are
1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be without the plenum. So,
there's no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
Every one must run into this same problem. Will I have to hack an
access hole in the baffles to get a socket extension in there? Or will
ordering a spark plug socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be easy.
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
Message 6
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Several months ago there was a discussion on the list concerning
certified engines and the application of AD's issued for them..The
following came from the FlyBaby forum and was written by Harry Fenton.
Its subject is "Autogas STC" but it addresses a few issues which could
be helpful to builders and those already flying. At any rate the year is
young and we might as wall start it off with a "hot" topic.
Charlie Ennis RV-6A flying in northern Ky.
Actually, there is a legal aspect to running auto fuel, even in an
homebuilt
aircraft. The auto fuel STC's have two components- engine and airframe.
Obviously, if the airframe is experimental and the STC for the airframe
does
not apply. However, if you intend to keep the C-85-12 operating as an
FAA
approved engine, then the FAA would require that an STC be applied to
the
engine to keep it legal.
There are rules for Experimental aircraft operation which are often
misunderstood (or ignored). A primary misconception is that anything
attached to an experimental airframe is FREE of any rules or compliance
to
FAA regulations- WRONG! While liberties can be taken, the aircraft
always
has to be operated in a safe manner consistent with FAA airworthiness
regulations. In particular, most amateur built aircraft use FAA approved
components of some sort- primarily engines. If the engine is to be
continued in operation as a certified component, then AD compliance and
STC
compliance is required, despite the installation of the component in an
experimental airframe.
The FAA requires compliance to TC specs because parts which migrate from
certificated aircraft to amateur built aircraft often migrate back into
the
certified world. Case in point, the Fly Baby is often worth more dead
than
alive. The engine, brakes, and instruments can often be parted out for
more
than the value of the aircraft in a complete, flying condition. So, the
FAA
wants TC'd components to be maintained accordingly to ensure some
reasonable
chance that parts are airworthy when re-installed on a certified
aircraft.
A certified engine can be converted to an uncertified status. The engine
data plate is removed, an entry made in the logbook stating that the
data
plate was removed and that the engine has been maintained from that
point
forward to amateur or experimental standards. This action would legally
allow you to burn anything you want in the engine, including auto fuel.
If
the engine is sold at some point, then the buyer can inspect the engine
and
re-attach the data plate. So, if you don't want to buy the the STC, then
this action keeps the paperwork legal.
There are a couple of advantages to keeping the engine conforming to
Type
Certificated regulations. The value of the engine is more if sold at a
later date and the flight restrictions during initial test flights are
less
when using a Type Certificated engine. If the data plate is removed,
even
if the engine is a Continental, then it is treated just like a converted
lawnmower engine in the eyes of the FAA, and flight test hours are
increased.
Granted, this is really splitting some fine hairs. The only time the FAA
will discover that auto fuel has been run in an engine with no STC is
during
the investigation after the crash. In reality, paperwork or no
paperwork,
the engine will generally run fine on auto fuel. Just be aware that
there
are some legal fish hooks, and you can get snagged under the right set
of
circumstances.
Harry
Back to top
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles |
Tom,
If you have the room, use a universal and an extension. If the universal won't
fit, use a "wobble" extension. Wobble extensions act as a sort of mini universal.
The extension can be tipped up to 15 degrees to clear obstructions.
Snap On [high end], Harbor Freight [low end] and everyone in between offers these
extensions. They really are a "must have" for anyone's tool box. See the links
below.
http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=all&item_ID=67459&group_ID=241&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=31203
Charlie Kuss
--- On Sat, 1/2/10, thomas sargent <sarg314@gmail.com> wrote:
> From: thomas sargent <sarg314@gmail.com>
> Subject: RV-List: spark plugs and cooling baffles
> To: "rv-list" <rv-list@matronics.com>
> Date: Saturday, January 2, 2010, 5:51 PM
> I just tried to put plugs in my engine
> (IO-360-B2B) today and found that the cooling baffles make
> it impossible to get a deep socket on the aft, top plugs (on
> 3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on OK, there just
> isn't room between the socket and the cooling baffle to
> get the ratchet wrench or even just a simple breaker bar on
> the socket. Now, I don't have a real aircraft spark
> plug socket, just a 7/8" Home Depot socket, so maybe
> the real thing is a bit shorter? I should mention that
> since I made a cooling plenum for my engine, my baffles are
> 1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be without the
> plenum. So, there's no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
>
> Every one must run into this same problem.
> Will I have to hack an access hole in the baffles to get a
> socket extension in there? Or will ordering a spark plug
> socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
>
> Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be
> easy.
>
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles |
I have also used a box wrench for the rear top plugs. After a couple
of years I switched to REM 37BY which are an authorized sub for the O
360. they are are a little shorter on the outside and will just barely
allow the plug wrench on my standard baffles circa 1996.
On Jan 2, 2010, at 7:07 PM, Kyle Boatright wrote:
> The newer (OK, newer than my circa 1999 baffles) come with punched
openings in the baffle sides which provide a pass through for a socket
extension. You could do something similar and use snap-in plugs to
provide access.
>
> Kyle Boatright
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: thomas sargent
> To: rv-list
> Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 5:51 PM
> Subject: RV-List: spark plugs and cooling baffles
>
> I just tried to put plugs in my engine (IO-360-B2B) today and found
that the cooling baffles make it impossible to get a deep socket on the
aft, top plugs (on 3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on OK,
there just isn't room between the socket and the cooling baffle to get
the ratchet wrench or even just a simple breaker bar on the socket.
Now, I don't have a real aircraft spark plug socket, just a 7/8" Home
Depot socket, so maybe the real thing is a bit shorter? I should
mention that since I made a cooling plenum for my engine, my baffles are
1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be without the plenum. So,
there's no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
>
> Every one must run into this same problem. Will I have to hack an
access hole in the baffles to get a socket extension in there? Or will
ordering a spark plug socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
>
> Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be easy.
>
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
>
>
>
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.c
om/Navigator?RV-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: spark plugs and cooling baffles |
When I pulled the plugs on buddies RV9A I used an aircraft spark plug
socket which was a 3/8" drive and a 6" wobble extension with a ratchet.
That combo worked fine!
I have auto plugs up my uppers so things are different on mine, easier.
----
Surfing the web from Hopkinsville, KY
Visit my web site:
http://home.newwavecomm.net/bobbyhester/RVSite.htm
thomas sargent wrote:
> I just tried to put plugs in my engine (IO-360-B2B) today and found
> that the cooling baffles make it impossible to get a deep socket on
> the aft, top plugs (on 3 and 4). Actually, I can get the socket on
> OK, there just isn't room between the socket and the cooling baffle to
> get the ratchet wrench or even just a simple breaker bar on the
> socket. Now, I don't have a real aircraft spark plug socket, just a
> 7/8" Home Depot socket, so maybe the real thing is a bit shorter? I
> should mention that since I made a cooling plenum for my engine, my
> baffles are 1 or 1.5 inches shorter than they would be without the
> plenum. So, there's no problem on cyl. 1 and 2.
>
> Every one must run into this same problem. Will I have to hack an
> access hole in the baffles to get a socket extension in there? Or
> will ordering a spark plug socket from Aircraft Spruce solve my problem?
>
> Gee, I thought putting in the plugs would be easy.
>
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A final assembly.
> *
>
>
> *
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