RV-List Digest Archive

Fri 04/02/10


Total Messages Posted: 8



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 03:39 AM - Re: Something I didn't want to see (Thilo Kind)
     2. 04:00 AM - Re: Something I didn't want to see (Kevin Horton)
     3. 06:30 AM - Re: Something I didn't want to see (David Burton)
     4. 07:22 AM - Re: Something I didn't want to see (glen matejcek)
     5. 07:27 AM - Re: Something I didn't want to see (scott bilinski)
     6. 07:10 PM - Cracked canopy (Bruno)
     7. 07:25 PM - Re: Cracked canopy (Linn Walters)
     8. 07:46 PM - Re: Cracked canopy (Linn Walters)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 03:39:51 AM PST US
    From: "Thilo Kind" <thilo.kind@gmx.net>
    Subject: Something I didn't want to see
    Hi Bruno, Very sorry to hear about that. Sounds like a stress cracking caused by inherent stress in the canopy in conjunction with temperature changes, exposure to sunlight, and / or (most likely) use of detergents or solvents on the canopy. You can glue the crack using special glue for PMMA (acrylic sheet), but the crack will remain visible. Thilo _____ From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruno Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 04:19 Subject: RV-List: Something I didn't want to see Hello Gents Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time ) How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down fairly quickly in the last few days / week... That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it last? Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4 rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far ) the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few days?? Thanks in advance Bruno Dionne rv4@videotron.ca C-GDBH RV-4 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 08:32:00


    Message 2


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    Time: 04:00:09 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Something I didn't want to see
    From: Kevin Horton <khorton01@rogers.com>
    Bruno, Ouch. That really sucks, especially just at the start of the flying season. You can probably fix the crack, as described below in a message that was originally posted by RV builder Noel Drew from South Africa. Good luck, Kevin > I can share your feelings on a canopy crack. My RV6 windscreen decided to > start a crack from the roll bar down some 6 inches that probably started > from somebody else resting too hard on the edge. This is an early 1/4 inch > windscreen that Van offered when the slider was first introduced and to the > best of my knowledge is no longer obtainable. > > I was considering my options when a glider pilot looked at it and said > "weld" it like the glider owners do. I suppose there is always a first time > for everything so I started seeking advice. > > I first located some liquid methyl methacrylate monomer that is the raw > material used in the manufacture of sheet plexiglas. It is not the glue > that is sometimes supplied nor is it solvent. It is called stabilised > monomer. Having stop drilled the crack, I cut a V shaped groove on the line > of the crack leaving a narrow gap at the bottom and about 3/16" wide at the > top. I located a thick needle for a hypodermic syringe and was able to lay > the viscous liquid monomer in the gap with tip of the needle submerged to > avoid bubbles. After somewhat of a learning curve I was able to generate a > reasonable weld. > > The problems you will encounter will be bubbles trapped in the liquid, a > flow of liquid down the slope of the windscreen, the monomer going solid in > the syringe, needle, and on the surface of the jar it is supplied in. I > should mention that the monomer will evaporate and shrink in the groove if > you do not get it to set quickly by exposing it to ultraviolet radiation. > At different times I used the sun (very quick) and a crack testing lamp from > the nearby engine shop. Less than a minute in Durban's sun will have it too > stiff to go anywhere while it will remain liquid for hours in the > ultraviolet free workshop. After a few false starts that were rectified by > starting over with the Dremel, the result looked like a metal weld with a > ridge of plexiglas on both sides. Careful shaving and sanding gave me a > surface that polished up very well after it had set properly. > > The end result is a line in my canopy that is smooth and transparent but it > deflects the light as is does not entirely match the colour or refractive > index of the original material. I am satisfied with the strength of the > join and now regard the repair as an honourable scar on my companion and a > satisfactory compromise to the huge task of replacing the windscreen. On 2010-04-01, at 22:19 , Bruno wrote: > Hello Gents > Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time ) > How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down fairly quickly in the last few days / week... > > That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it last? > > Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4 rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far ) the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few days?? > > Thanks in advance > > Bruno Dionne > rv4@videotron.ca > C-GDBH RV-4 > > >


    Message 3


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    Time: 06:30:19 AM PST US
    From: "David Burton" <d-burton@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Something I didn't want to see
    Hi Bruno, Take a look at this: http://www.tapplastics.com/info/adhesives.php? Get some acrylic and do some practicing. We produce flawless near invisible joints using this process. Once you figure out the technique you can do a repair like this quickly. The liquid will melt the surface of the canopy if you allow it to dribble and run. Practice first. If the crack has drawn apart I would use the technique that Kevin suggested. Methyl Chloride is a dangerous carcinogen that people are far to careless with. Protect yourself while using it... DavidB From: Bruno Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2010 7:19 PM Subject: RV-List: Something I didn't want to see Hello Gents Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time ) How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down fairly quickly in the last few days / week... That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it last? Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4 rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far ) the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few days?? Thanks in advance Bruno Dionne rv4@videotron.ca C-GDBH RV-4


    Message 4


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    Time: 07:22:24 AM PST US
    From: "glen matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
    Subject: RE: Something I didn't want to see
    Hi Bruno- I'd suggest checking into Todd's canopies down in Ft. Lauderdale. Last I saw, his canopies were thicker, stronger, available in several tints, customizable, cheaper, and came with a guarantee. You can (used to be able to?) find an article on the RV wiki about gluing canopies. glen matejcek aerobubba@earthlink.net


    Message 5


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    Time: 07:27:08 AM PST US
    From: scott bilinski <rv8a2001@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Something I didn't want to see
    Something to remember the canopy expands and contracts you must give it room to do so. I put my canopy on with screws. The screw was, lets say .150 diameter the hole in the canopy is ~.187. Somebody once said an RV-8 canopy lengthens 3/16 of an inch between 32F and 100F. Thats a bunch of stress if the canopy is not allowed to move......... Scott RV-8a ________________________________ From: Bruno <rv4@videotron.ca> Sent: Thu, April 1, 2010 7:19:05 PM Subject: RV-List: Something I didn't want to see Hello Gents Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time ) How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down fairly quickly in the last few days / week... That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it last? Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4 rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far ) the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few days?? Thanks in advance Bruno Dionne rv4@videotron.ca C-GDBH RV-4


    Message 6


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    Time: 07:10:06 PM PST US
    From: Bruno <rv4@videotron.ca>
    Subject: Cracked canopy
    Hello again Gents First : Time: 07:59:57 PM PST US From: Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net> : Something I didn't want to see -------------------------------- Thanks for the info Linn, greatly appreciated.. Today I talked with Jeff at Aero Plastics ( Van's supplier ) and he told me first to stop the crack by stop drilling it up to 3/16 of an inch otherwise the crack will keep on cracking ( seem like a big hole to me but he 's the pro ) Second: he told me to use a Solvent type called '' Well Done 3 '' which comes with a needle type applicator to help in putting the glue right in the crack. Third:: He told me to put a doubler on the bottom 3 inches of the crack and to bond it with Gorilla Super Glue so it could be kept closed... Is the above procedure something familiar to some of you and does it sounds like something you have done or will do ?? Thank you for your imputs.. Bruno Dionne rv4@videotron.ca


    Message 7


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    Time: 07:25:30 PM PST US
    From: Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: Cracked canopy
    Bruno wrote: > Hello again Gents > > */ First :/* Time: 07:59:57 PM PST US > From: Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net > <wlmailhtml:%7B607964B9-EA69-4D98-AAC1-72F1BAB281EE%7Dmid://00000129/%21x-usc:mailto:pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>> > : Something I didn't want to see > -------------------------------- > Thanks for the info Linn, greatly appreciated.. > > Today I talked with Jeff at Aero Plastics ( Van's supplier ) and he > told me first to stop the crack by stop drilling it up to 3/16 of an > inch otherwise the crack will keep on cracking ( seem like a big hole > to me but he 's the pro ) Well, as you said, he's the pro. I think you might have mis-understood about the 3/16" drill. You're right ...... that would be a big hole. Use a #40 (or smaller) drill ahead of the crack .... so that the crack points to the hole .... (not more than 3/16" away from the crack???) ..... so that the crack can propagate to the hole. Drilling at the end of the crack might cause the crack to propagate across the hole. > > */Second/*: he told me to use a Solvent type called '' Well Done 3 '' > which comes with a needle type applicator to help in putting the glue > right in the crack. Well, I can understand how you got there .... but its Weldon 3. > > */Third::/* He told me to put a doubler on the bottom 3 inches of the > crack and to bond it with Gorilla Super Glue so it could be kept closed... On my Pitts canopy I glued a thin piece of acrylic across the crack at the canopy edge using ..... either Weldon 3 or it's equivalent. My glue (actually just a solvent) didn't come with a needle-type applicator, so I used a insulin syringe. Pays to have diabetic friends. > > Is the above procedure something familiar to some of you and does it > sounds like something you have done or will do ?? Except for the 3/16" drill, it sounds like what I did ... or would do. Good luck, and let us know how you made out. Linn > > Thank you for your imputs.. > > Bruno Dionne > rv4@videotron.ca <mailto:rv4@videotron.ca> > > > >


    Message 8


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    Time: 07:46:02 PM PST US
    From: Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: Cracked canopy
    One thing I forgot to mention ..... buy a drill bit made for plastic. If you can't find a small plastic drill bit grind the cutting edge on a standard drill flat so it can't grab the plastic as it goes through ...... get rid of the chisel tip. Grind the point so it scrapes the plastic rather than cutting into it, and go slow with little pressure on the bit. Linn Bruno wrote: > Hello again Gents > > */ First :/* Time: 07:59:57 PM PST US > From: Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net > <wlmailhtml:%7B607964B9-EA69-4D98-AAC1-72F1BAB281EE%7Dmid://00000129/%21x-usc:mailto:pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>> > : Something I didn't want to see > -------------------------------- > Thanks for the info Linn, greatly appreciated.. > > Today I talked with Jeff at Aero Plastics ( Van's supplier ) and he > told me first to stop the crack by stop drilling it up to 3/16 of an > inch otherwise the crack will keep on cracking ( seem like a big hole > to me but he 's the pro ) > > */Second/*: he told me to use a Solvent type called '' Well Done 3 '' > which comes with a needle type applicator to help in putting the glue > right in the crack. > > */Third::/* He told me to put a doubler on the bottom 3 inches of the > crack and to bond it with Gorilla Super Glue so it could be kept closed... > > Is the above procedure something familiar to some of you and does it > sounds like something you have done or will do ?? > > Thank you for your imputs.. > > Bruno Dionne > rv4@videotron.ca <mailto:rv4@videotron.ca> > > > >




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