Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:35 AM - Piece of Grass 2010 refunds (Bob Collins)
2. 08:40 AM - Re: Piece of Grass 2010 refunds (H. Ivan Haecker)
3. 10:38 AM - Chainsaw Propeller Carving (Helsper)
4. 01:24 PM - Re: some approx V speeds (HCRV6@comcast.net)
5. 02:13 PM - Re: Fw: List Introduction & Main spar falls off workbench (Charlie England)
6. 03:51 PM - Re: some approx V speeds (Ed Anderson)
7. 06:45 PM - KCDC (don wentz)
8. 09:29 PM - engine serial number? (thomas sargent)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Piece of Grass 2010 refunds |
You've probably heard by now that the spot on which we have had the RV
get-together at Oshkosh ("Piece of Grass") for (most of) the last 6
years
is not likely to be available to us because EAA is moving the 24-hour
generator area out to the middle of the field at Camp Scholler (I don't
really want to camp in a truck stop), which is where people have always
been
able to find us (because we told them exactly where we'll be).
But EAA has still not made maps available for the new Camp Scholler
design
and because it's unclear what the net effect of displacing tenters (like
me)
from that area, I'm in no position to say where my camp area will end up
at.
A couple of alternative locations have fallen apart (it would appear the
Van's dinner is the most likely spot for those who wish to socialize).
A lot of people donated a lot of money to secure 6 camping sites for the
event, and we won't be needing them, so a week or so ago -- because of
the
uncertainty -- I returned it via PayPayl (for those of you who submitted
it
via PayPal). For those of you who sent checks, I've simply shredded the
checks and you should "void" them in your register.
If you HAVEN'T received a refund, please contact me ASAP.
Thanks.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Piece of Grass 2010 refunds |
MessageAh, thats what's meant by the term "EAA in Action"!
Ivan Haecker
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Collins
To: rv-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, June 06, 2010 9:24 AM
Subject: RV-List: Piece of Grass 2010 refunds
You've probably heard by now that the spot on which we have had the RV
get-together at Oshkosh ("Piece of Grass") for (most of) the last 6
years is not likely to be available to us because EAA is moving the
24-hour generator area out to the middle of the field at Camp Scholler
(I don't really want to camp in a truck stop), which is where people
have always been able to find us (because we told them exactly where
we'll be).
But EAA has still not made maps available for the new Camp Scholler
design and because it's unclear what the net effect of displacing
tenters (like me) from that area, I'm in no position to say where my
camp area will end up at. A couple of alternative locations have fallen
apart (it would appear the Van's dinner is the most likely spot for
those who wish to socialize).
A lot of people donated a lot of money to secure 6 camping sites for
the event, and we won't be needing them, so a week or so ago -- because
of the uncertainty -- I returned it via PayPayl (for those of you who
submitted it via PayPal). For those of you who sent checks, I've simply
shredded the checks and you should "void" them in your register.
If you HAVEN'T received a refund, please contact me ASAP.
Thanks.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Chainsaw Propeller Carving |
There is a propeller carving demo given at Oshkosh every year that shows how
to carve a wooden propeller using all power tools (chainsaws and power
sanders). Here are some pictures of the process, on my blog, if anyone is
interested.
http://nickhelsper.blogspot.com/p/propeller-carving-all-power-tool-method.html
~Nick Helsper
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: some approx V speeds |
Ed,
Thanks for that. Without giving it much thought (make that any thought) my
reaction was, what does it matter what kind of prop? Obviously it does as s
oon as one recognizes the effect of airspeed/RPM on HP with the fixed pitch
props.
My experience is consistent with your observation, at 120 MPH my Catto prop
allows me to climb with any of my buddies with CS props. They always get a
bit of a jump on me at takeoff but as soon as I accelerate to 120 to 130 I
can catch up.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 695 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
Sent: Friday, June 4, 2010 4:41:21 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
Subject: RE: RV-List: some approx V speeds
Harry,
When I first did my airspeed checks with my fixed pitch prop RV-6A, I could
n=99t get anywhere near the performance/airspeed figures that Van quo
ted. It turns out his figures are for engines with a constant speed prop.
My best climb speed Vy turns out to be 120 MPH IAS, considerably higher tha
n the Van=99s figure.
I=99m sure there is someone out there that can give you a more unders
tandable explanation =93 but it goes something like this.
Here is how I see it =93 with a constant speed prop, you can get more
HP at slow airspeeds by making the pitch finer producing less load on the
engine, which results in more RPM which results in more HP. When you are di
scussing climb it=99s the EXTRA HP above that required to maintain le
vel flight than causes you to climb. If you can increase your HP above that
necessary for level flight, you can increase your climb rate at any airspe
ed (well, just about)..
With a fixed pitch prop, you have the maximum load on the prop and therefor
e the engine at slower airspeeds during climb-out, that keeps the rpm lower
and therefore HP down compared to a constant speed prop. Therefore, in ord
er to get more climb you need to produce more HP, with a fixed pitch prop y
ou do that by flying a higher airspeed unloading the prop and engine a bit
thereby permitting more rpm and HP and higher climb rate.
Ed
Ed Anderson
Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
eanderson@carolina.rr.com
http://www.andersonee.com
http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html
http://www.flyrotary.com/
http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW
http://www.rotaryaviation.com/Rotorhead%20Truth.htm
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matro
nics.com] On Behalf Of HCRV6@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, June 04, 2010 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: some approx V speeds
Please explain:
Whether you have fixed pitch or constant speed prop makes a difference.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 693 hours
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List http://forums.matronics.com http
=====================
==
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Fwd: List Introduction & Main spar falls off workbench |
Obviously, Van should have the final word. But I'll bet they tell you to clean
up the edges of the crack & build on. It's hard to imagine that one rivet doing
a lot to keep the plane in the air. Take a look at edge distances & see if you
can add a rivet outboard (toward the corner), & one between the original outboard
pair.
Adding a doubler there looks like it would be difficult, with the gear weldment
in that space.
Charlie
________________________________
From: James S Clark IV <james.s.clark@comcast.net>
Sent: Sat, June 5, 2010 3:56:56 PM
Subject: RV-List: Fwd: List Introduction & Main spar falls off workbench
Hello RV'ers,
I've been lurking, reading, and building an RV7A slow build since
2007. I thought I'd introduce myself to the list prior to my first
request for help!
Well it took till getting the fuselage kit for the first major problem
to strike: a comedy of errors, on which I would truly appreciate some
advice:
Assembling the main spar center section, I had just constructed and
temp bolted the wood spacer blocks between the fore and aft main spars
to check for fit.
Things looked good and I left the center spar on the workbench for the
night. Unfortunately, I left it on a piece of foam which gradually
compressed and the spar fell off the table 3 feet to the concrete and
linoleum floor!
The first floor strike appeared to bend a corner of the spar web down
90 degrees on a 45 degree bias. This is on the forward left lower side
of the front spar web (where the 7A gear leg will go through later)
I just knew it was stressed and would crack bending it back and it did
when bent about half way back. I stop drilled the crack #30 and bent
it the rest of the way back flat. I then sanded and scotchbrited a
smooth slot.
My question is (and I will ask Vans):
This is a small crack, but it is in a BAD place (1 inch to main spar bolts).
Is my fix OK? Is there a better solution? This piece is matched to my
left and right main wing spars and wings are 90% done. Is it
impossible to get a new center section front spar?
Looking at the drawings, I note:
Both the forward bottom skin and the aft bottom skin overlap this
lower spar web flange at the front spar (lots of skin thickness here).
Are there no stresses on the corner of this web at this location?
The landing gear leg on the 7A will require scalloping a bit of this
flange away anyway, but that scallop area (approximated by red pen in
picture) is closer to the second rivet hole than the first. I got
excited when I saw this as I thought I might cut my error away anyway,
but it looks like the scallop will miss the damaged area.
Well so much for you all thinking highly of me on my first intro. I've
been pretty careful so far and not many mistakes or drilled fingers,
but boy is this a bummer. Could it have happened on a worse piece?
Thoughts, comments, fixes, and good natured laughter are appreciated.
Best regards,
Jim Clark (Gainesville, VA)
BTW, for some additional comedy: the bucking bar followed the spar off
the table (in the same event) an put a nice dent in the center of the
web to add insult to injury. This is not a show stopper though.
Message 6
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| Subject: | some approx V speeds |
Welcome, Harry.
Yeah, I really thought I had a dog at first, because I couldn't match
Van's performance numbers - just the wrong comparison in my case {:>).
There are certainly benefits to having a C/S on take off - however, for cost
and simplicity reasons, I have not regretted staying fixed pitch.
I swing a 74x 88 Performance Wood Prop which takes all the right rudder I
have in my 6A to keep it on our 35' wide runway, in fact until I hit around
40 mph,
there is not sufficient rudder authority. Take off performance is great,
but I still need to hit 120 MPH to get best rate of climb.
Now if I had to fly up a mountain side after take off - I might sing a
different tune {:>)
ed
Ed Anderson
Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
eanderson@carolina.rr.com
<http://www.andersonee.com> http://www.andersonee.com
<http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html>
http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html
http://www.flyrotary.com/
<http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm>
http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW
http://www.rotaryaviation.com/Rotorhead%20Truth.htm
<http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html>
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of HCRV6@comcast.net
Sent: Sunday, June 06, 2010 4:24 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: some approx V speeds
Ed,
Thanks for that. Without giving it much thought (make that any thought) my
reaction was, what does it matter what kind of prop? Obviously it does as
soon as one recognizes the effect of airspeed/RPM on HP with the fixed pitch
props.
My experience is consistent with your observation, at 120 MPH my Catto prop
allows me to climb with any of my buddies with CS props. They always get a
bit of a jump on me at takeoff but as soon as I accelerate to 120 to 130 I
can catch up.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 695 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
Sent: Friday, June 4, 2010 4:41:21 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
Subject: RE: RV-List: some approx V speeds
Harry,
When I first did my airspeed checks with my fixed pitch prop RV-6A, I
couldn't get anywhere near the performance/airspeed figures that Van quoted.
It turns out his figures are for engines with a constant speed prop.
My best climb speed Vy turns out to be 120 MPH IAS, considerably higher than
the Van's figure.
I'm sure there is someone out there that can give you a more understandable
explanation - but it goes something like this.
Here is how I see it - with a constant speed prop, you can get more HP at
slow airspeeds by making the pitch finer producing less load on the engine,
which results in more RPM which results in more HP. When you are discussing
climb it's the EXTRA HP above that required to maintain level flight than
causes you to climb. If you can increase your HP above that necessary for
level flight, you can increase your climb rate at any airspeed (well, just
about)..
With a fixed pitch prop, you have the maximum load on the prop and therefore
the engine at slower airspeeds during climb-out, that keeps the rpm lower
and therefore HP down compared to a constant speed prop. Therefore, in
order to get more climb you need to produce more HP, with a fixed pitch prop
you do that by flying a higher airspeed unloading the prop and engine a bit
thereby permitting more rpm and HP and higher climb rate.
Ed
Ed Anderson
Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
eanderson@carolina.rr.com
<http://www.andersonee.com> http://www.andersonee.com
<http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html>
http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html
http://www.flyrotary.com/
<http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm>
http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW
http://www.rotaryaviation.com/Rotorhead%20Truth.htm
<http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html>
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of HCRV6@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, June 04, 2010 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: some approx V speeds
Please explain:
Whether you have fixed pitch or constant speed prop makes a difference.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 693 hours
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 7
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Hey RVers,
anyone in the vicinity of Cedar City UT?
Have an RV-6 stranded there with electrical/battery issues.
pls call 503-703 1724
thanks!
Message 8
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| Subject: | engine serial number? |
I am filling out the forms to request an airworthiness inspection. Form
8130-12 asks for the engine model and serial number. Mine is an Aerosport
Power rebuild. The Aerosport power data plate on the engine shows the
serial number as 0240, which in retrospect (after I got back home) seems way
too small to be a Lycoming serial number.
Is that what they are asking for? Who is deemed to be the engine maker,
Lycoming or Aerosport? I'm not aware of a Lycoming serial number anywhere
on the engine, though I easily could have missed it. I didn't think to
check the engine log book which is at the hangar.
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A, doing the paper work.
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