RV-List Digest Archive

Wed 10/13/10


Total Messages Posted: 14



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 07:02 AM - Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (rveighta@comcast.net)
     2. 07:14 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Bruce Gray)
     3. 07:44 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Jerry Grimmonpre)
     4. 08:15 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Kelly McMullen)
     5. 08:23 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Bruce Gray)
     6. 09:08 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Panama Red)
     7. 09:26 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Bruce Gray)
     8. 09:28 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Glenn Bell)
     9. 09:33 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (John J)
    10. 09:49 AM - Fw: O360-A1A engine for sale (Ed Anderson)
    11. 11:47 AM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Glenn Bell)
    12. 01:12 PM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Kelly McMullen)
    13. 01:35 PM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Bruce Gray)
    14. 01:48 PM - Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem (Glenn Bell)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 07:02:27 AM PST US
    From: rveighta@comcast.net
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    Guys, my neighbor in the airpark who is building an RV-9A, just began runni ng his engine and it really runs rough - backfires, black smoke, won't idle. He says he has set the timing properly.=C2- Any input will be appreciated as to the cause. Thanks, Walt Shipley=C2-


    Message 2


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    Time: 07:14:50 AM PST US
    From: "Bruce Gray" <bgray@glasair.org>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    Sounds like it's running to rich a mixture. Bruce www.Glasair.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rveighta@comcast.net Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:58 AM Subject: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem Guys, my neighbor in the airpark who is building an RV-9A, just began running his engine and it really runs rough - backfires, black smoke, won't idle. He says he has set the timing properly. Any input will be appreciated as to the cause. Thanks, Walt Shipley


    Message 3


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    Time: 07:44:47 AM PST US
    From: "Jerry Grimmonpre" <jerry@mc.net>
    Subject: Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    Walt ... Black smoke is indicating too rich. Try turning off the boost pump if it's on, lean deeply as well. Jerry Grimmonpre Just bought a lot at Hensley AP ... over on Kitty Hawk St ----- Original Message ----- From: rveighta@comcast.net To: RV List Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 8:58 AM Subject: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem Guys, my neighbor in the airpark who is building an RV-9A, just began running his engine and it really runs rough - backfires, black smoke, won't idle. He says he has set the timing properly. Any input will be appreciated as to the cause. Thanks, Walt Shipley


    Message 4


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    Time: 08:15:52 AM PST US
    From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
    Subject: Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    There are all kinds of possibilities. Depends on who built the engine, whether all accessory gears/cam are timed correctly, dry tappet clearance correct, etc. Black smoke may or may not say anything about mixture. Boost pump does not affect mixture on a Lycoming, only on a Continental injected engine. No leaning should be necessary for startup, only after it is running smoothly. Also, whether mags have correct internal timing as well as the external timing. On 10/13/2010 7:41 AM, Jerry Grimmonpre wrote: > Walt ... > Black smoke is indicating too rich. Try turning off the boost pump if > it's on, lean deeply as well. > Jerry Grimmonpre Just bought a lot at Hensley AP ... over on Kitty > Hawk St > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* rveighta@comcast.net <mailto:rveighta@comcast.net> > *To:* RV List <mailto:rv-list@matronics.com> > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 13, 2010 8:58 AM > *Subject:* RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem > > Guys, my neighbor in the airpark who is building an RV-9A, just > began running his engine and it really runs rough - backfires, > > black smoke, won't idle. He says he has set the timing properly. > Any input will be appreciated as to the cause. > > Thanks, > > Walt Shipley > > * > > > *


    Message 5


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    Time: 08:23:51 AM PST US
    From: "Bruce Gray" <bgray@glasair.org>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the down and locked position. Bruce www.Glasair.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Grimmonpre Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:41 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem Walt ... Black smoke is indicating too rich. Try turning off the boost pump if it's on, lean deeply as well. Jerry Grimmonpre Just bought a lot at Hensley AP ... over on Kitty Hawk St ----- Original Message ----- From: rveighta@comcast.net Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 8:58 AM Subject: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem Guys, my neighbor in the airpark who is building an RV-9A, just began running his engine and it really runs rough - backfires, black smoke, won't idle. He says he has set the timing properly. Any input will be appreciated as to the cause. Thanks, Walt Shipley


    Message 6


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    Time: 09:08:43 AM PST US
    From: "Panama Red" <panamared505@brier.net>
    Subject: Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    I don't understand? Is there some special primer control that I should be using to control how I prime the engine? If so what is the part number in ACS. Bob You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the down and locked position. Bruce www.Glasair.org


    Message 7


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    Time: 09:26:19 AM PST US
    From: "Bruce Gray" <bgray@glasair.org>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    Sorry, injected engines don't have primers. Bruce www.Glasair.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Panama Red Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 12:06 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem I don't understand? Is there some special primer control that I should be using to control how I prime the engine? If so what is the part number in ACS. Bob You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the down and locked position. Bruce www.Glasair.org


    Message 8


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    Time: 09:28:44 AM PST US
    From: "Glenn Bell" <glennbell@cablelynx.com>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    First thing I would check is for an open primer solenoid if it had a carb..but since it doesnt. do the usual checks on the injection system.Is it really backfiring, which would be an ignition/preignition problem or is the racket due to unburned fuel igniting in the exhaust system? Since it is also running rough, as simple as it sounds, spark plug wires to the wrong cylinders could cause all these symptoms. The cylinders that aren't firing would be dumping fuel into the exhaust.its fun to listen to but it is really rough on exhaust components..just my two c ents worth.. From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Gray Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:12 AM Subject: RE: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem Sounds like it's running to rich a mixture. Bruce www.Glasair.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rveighta@comcast.net Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:58 AM Subject: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem Guys, my neighbor in the airpark who is building an RV-9A, just began running his engine and it really runs rough - backfires, black smoke, won't idle. He says he has set the timing properly. Any input will be appreciated as to the cause. Thanks, Walt Shipley Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 01:34:00


    Message 9


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    Time: 09:33:57 AM PST US
    From: "John J" <n212pj@gmail.com>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    Not sure the fuel injected engines come with a primer. But, what Bruce says is correct. If you do have a primer pump mounted on the panel and it's left unlocked, it'll leak directly into the heads, saturate the air intake tube seals, whereby gas will run down the outside of the tubes, especially if left overnight, and so on. Doubt that you'd have this with a fuel injection engine, which typically uses the electric fuel pump to prime. John J Oh, and ask me how I know. I even have pictures. From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Panama Red Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:06 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem I don't understand? Is there some special primer control that I should be using to control how I prime the engine? If so what is the part number in ACS. Bob You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the down and locked position. Bruce www.Glasair.org


    Message 10


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    Time: 09:49:24 AM PST US
    From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
    Subject: Fw: O360-A1A engine for sale
    A friend of mine has an 0360-A1A for sale. If you are interested contact Marv marv@lancair.net - all information I have is listed below Ed Edward L. Anderson Anderson Electronic Enterprises LLC 305 Reefton Road Weddington, NC 28104 http://www.andersonee.com http://www.eicommander.com From: marv@lancair.net Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 12:03 PM Subject: engine for sale HI Ed, I was wondering if you could post something to the RV forum for me... I have a Lycoming O360-A1A with 821.3 hours SMOH available that I'd like to sell. I'm asking $6,000 for it. Crating and shipping from Deland, FL will be at the buyer's expense. Have anyone who might be interested contact me at marv@lancair.net for further information. I appreciate the help. <Marv> PS... the engine comes out of an LA4 (Lake Bucanneer) that I purchased as a wing donor for another LA4. I'll be selling off a number of other parts from that installation as well... JIC you know someone who might be interested. Thanks again.......


    Message 11


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    Time: 11:47:28 AM PST US
    From: "Glenn Bell" <glennbell@cablelynx.com>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    One more thing to check.if the timing was set without tripping the impulse couplings, the engine will start but the timing will advance to approx 50 deg advanced when the couplings disengage.this mistake is real easy to make if you haven't timed many engines.. it can also happen to experienced mechanics if they are distracted.rotate the prop in the direction of rotation and listen for the mags to snap.this should occur at approx tdc.if one or both snap at the timing mark..it/they are improperly timed .to time them you should rotate the prop until the mags fire then rotate back to just past the timing mark...then forward.don't go too far or the impulse couplings will reengage.. From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John J Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:27 AM Subject: RE: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem Not sure the fuel injected engines come with a primer. But, what Bruce says is correct. If you do have a primer pump mounted on the panel and it's left unlocked, it'll leak directly into the heads, saturate the air intake tube seals, whereby gas will run down the outside of the tubes, especially if left overnight, and so on. Doubt that you'd have this with a fuel injection engine, which typically uses the electric fuel pump to prime. John J Oh, and ask me how I know. I even have pictures. From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Panama Red Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:06 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem I don't understand? Is there some special primer control that I should be using to control how I prime the engine? If so what is the part number in ACS. Bob You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the down and locked position. Bruce www.Glasair.org http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 01:34:00


    Message 12


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    Time: 01:12:32 PM PST US
    From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
    Subject: Re: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    If mags are in use, rather than electronic, they are not set at more than 25 degrees on a Lycoming, never anywhere close to 50 degrees. Even the electronic don't advance beyond 40 degrees at low power in flight. On 10/13/2010 11:38 AM, Glenn Bell wrote: > > One more thing to checkif the timing was set without tripping the > impulse couplings, the engine will start but the timing will advance > to approx 50 deg advanced when the couplings disengagethis mistake is > real easy to make if you havent timed many engines.. it can also > happen to experienced mechanics if they are distractedrotate the prop > in the direction of rotation and listen for the mags to snapthis > should occur at approx tdcif one or both snap at the timing > mark..it/they are improperly timed to time them you should rotate the > prop until the mags fire then rotate back to just past the timing > mark..then forwarddont go too far or the impulse couplings will > reengage.. > > *From:* owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John J > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:27 AM > *To:* rv-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* RE: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem > > Not sure the fuel injected engines come with a primer. But, what Bruce > says is correct. If you do have a primer pump mounted on the panel and > its left unlocked, itll leak directly into the heads, saturate the > air intake tube seals, whereby gas will run down the outside of the > tubes, especially if left overnight, and so on. Doubt that youd have > this with a fuel injection engine, which typically uses the electric > fuel pump to prime. > > John J > > Oh, and ask me how I know. I even have pictures > > *From:* owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Panama Red > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:06 AM > *To:* rv-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem > > I don't understand? Is there some special primer control that I should > be using to control how I prime the engine? If so what is the part > number in ACS. > > Bob > > *You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the > down and locked position.* > > * * > > Bruce > www.Glasair.org <http://www.Glasair.org> > > * * > * * > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List* > * * > *http://forums.matronics.com* > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > * * > * * > * * > * * > ** > ** > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List* > ** > ** > ** > *http://forums.matronics.com* > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > ** > * * > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > 01:34:00 > > * > > > *


    Message 13


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    Time: 01:35:07 PM PST US
    From: "Bruce Gray" <bgray@glasair.org>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    That's not what he said. IF the mags were timed with the impulse coupler still engaged they could be WAY off. Bruce www.Glasair.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 4:09 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem If mags are in use, rather than electronic, they are not set at more than 25 degrees on a Lycoming, never anywhere close to 50 degrees. Even the electronic don't advance beyond 40 degrees at low power in flight. On 10/13/2010 11:38 AM, Glenn Bell wrote: > > One more thing to check.if the timing was set without tripping the > impulse couplings, the engine will start but the timing will advance > to approx 50 deg advanced when the couplings disengage.this mistake is > real easy to make if you haven't timed many engines.. it can also > happen to experienced mechanics if they are distracted.rotate the prop > in the direction of rotation and listen for the mags to snap.this > should occur at approx tdc.if one or both snap at the timing > mark..it/they are improperly timed .to time them you should rotate the > prop until the mags fire then rotate back to just past the timing > mark...then forward.don't go too far or the impulse couplings will > reengage.. > > *From:* owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John J > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:27 AM > *To:* rv-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* RE: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem > > Not sure the fuel injected engines come with a primer. But, what Bruce > says is correct. If you do have a primer pump mounted on the panel and > it's left unlocked, it'll leak directly into the heads, saturate the > air intake tube seals, whereby gas will run down the outside of the > tubes, especially if left overnight, and so on. Doubt that you'd have > this with a fuel injection engine, which typically uses the electric > fuel pump to prime. > > John J > > Oh, and ask me how I know. I even have pictures. > > *From:* owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Panama Red > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:06 AM > *To:* rv-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem > > I don't understand? Is there some special primer control that I should > be using to control how I prime the engine? If so what is the part > number in ACS. > > Bob > > *You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the > down and locked position.* > > * * > > Bruce > www.Glasair.org <http://www.Glasair.org> > > * * > * * > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List* > * * > *http://forums.matronics.com* > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > * * > * * > * * > * * > ** > ** > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List* > ** > ** > ** > *http://forums.matronics.com* > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > ** > * * > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > 01:34:00 > > * > > > *


    Message 14


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    Time: 01:48:11 PM PST US
    From: "Glenn Bell" <glennbell@cablelynx.com>
    Subject: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem
    That is correct...provided that the installer tripped the impulse coupling before timing them to the engine...if he/she didn't, the engine will be timed approx 50 deg advanced -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 3:09 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem If mags are in use, rather than electronic, they are not set at more than 25 degrees on a Lycoming, never anywhere close to 50 degrees. Even the electronic don't advance beyond 40 degrees at low power in flight. On 10/13/2010 11:38 AM, Glenn Bell wrote: > > One more thing to check.if the timing was set without tripping the > impulse couplings, the engine will start but the timing will advance > to approx 50 deg advanced when the couplings disengage.this mistake is > real easy to make if you haven't timed many engines.. it can also > happen to experienced mechanics if they are distracted.rotate the prop > in the direction of rotation and listen for the mags to snap.this > should occur at approx tdc.if one or both snap at the timing > mark..it/they are improperly timed .to time them you should rotate the > prop until the mags fire then rotate back to just past the timing > mark...then forward.don't go too far or the impulse couplings will > reengage.. > > *From:* owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John J > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:27 AM > *To:* rv-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* RE: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem > > Not sure the fuel injected engines come with a primer. But, what Bruce > says is correct. If you do have a primer pump mounted on the panel and > it's left unlocked, it'll leak directly into the heads, saturate the > air intake tube seals, whereby gas will run down the outside of the > tubes, especially if left overnight, and so on. Doubt that you'd have > this with a fuel injection engine, which typically uses the electric > fuel pump to prime. > > John J > > Oh, and ask me how I know. I even have pictures. > > *From:* owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Panama Red > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:06 AM > *To:* rv-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: RV-List: Lycoming IO-320 DIA Engine Problem > > I don't understand? Is there some special primer control that I should > be using to control how I prime the engine? If so what is the part > number in ACS. > > Bob > > *You might also verify that the primer, if so equipped, is in the > down and locked position.* > > * * > > Bruce > www.Glasair.org <http://www.Glasair.org> > > * * > * * > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List* > * * > *http://forums.matronics.com* > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > * * > * * > * * > * * > ** > ** > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List* > ** > ** > ** > *http://forums.matronics.com* > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > ** > * * > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > 01:34:00 > > * > > > * Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 01:34:00




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