Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:45 PM - flap motor Failure?. (thomas sargent)
2. 02:04 PM - Re: flap motor Failure?. (Randy Hooper)
3. 02:05 PM - Re: flap motor Failure?. (Dale Ensing)
4. 02:47 PM - Re: flap motor Failure?. (Ralph E. Capen)
5. 02:56 PM - Re: flap motor Failure?. (thomas sargent)
6. 03:37 PM - Re: flap motor Failure?. (Gene Lee)
7. 04:59 PM - Re: flap motor Failure?. (vanremog@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | flap motor Failure?. |
Thursday morning when doing touch and goes in my 6A my flap motor stopped
working. I landed and raced off to work and got back to it this morning.
It will work for a while and then fail. I removed the switch (a high
quality, sealed mil-spec switch) and tested it a lot on the bench - it
never failed, I put it back in and the motor was intermittent. I removed
the panel to access the motor and tried shaking the wiring and
disconnecting and reconnecting the connector I have installed there, all to
no effect. Failures didn't seem to correlate with anything Then I made a
mating connector with 2 bare leads so the next time it failed I could
disconnect the motor, connect the test connector and measure the voltage to
see if voltage was getting to the motor. Of course, after that I couldn't
get it to fail again. The connectors are good quality automotive ones with
gold plated pins. I haven't had any failures of these connectors and I
used a lot of them.
So my question is about Van's flap motor typical failure modes. My
suspicion is that the wiring and switch are OK - I suspect the motor.
Can/does the motor itself often fail this way? I vaguely recall people say
these motors aren't very reliable.
--
Tom Sargent
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: flap motor Failure?. |
It is most likely inhibited by grease and brush dust caked in the motor. Dis
assembly and cleaning will most likely solve the problem.
This failure and remedy has been widely discussed over on vansairforce.net.
Randy Hooper
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 10, 2012, at 4:44 PM, thomas sargent <sarg314@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thursday morning when doing touch and goes in my 6A my flap motor stopped w
orking. I landed and raced off to work and got back to it this morning. It
will work for a while and then fail. I removed the switch (a high quality,
sealed mil-spec switch) and tested it a lot on the bench - it never failed,
I put it back in and the motor was intermittent. I removed the panel to ac
cess the motor and tried shaking the wiring and disconnecting and reconnecti
ng the connector I have installed there, all to no effect. Failures didn't s
eem to correlate with anything Then I made a mating connector with 2 bare l
eads so the next time it failed I could disconnect the motor, connect the te
st connector and measure the voltage to see if voltage was getting to the mo
tor. Of course, after that I couldn't get it to fail again. The connectors a
re good quality automotive ones with gold plated pins. I haven't had any fa
ilures of these connectors and I used a lot of them.
>
> So my question is about Van's flap motor typical failure modes. My susp
icion is that the wiring and switch are OK - I suspect the motor. Can/does t
he motor itself often fail this way? I vaguely recall people say these moto
rs aren't very reliable.
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
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>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: flap motor Failure?. |
Tom, check the brushes in the motor. There is a history of grease from the g
ear
getting into the brush area and causing the type of failure.
Dale Ensing
RV-6A
Sent from my iPhone
On Mar 10, 2012, at 15:44, thomas sargent <sarg314@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thursday morning when doing touch and goes in my 6A my flap motor stopped w
orking. I landed and raced off to work and got back to it this morning. It
will work for a while and then fail. I removed the switch (a high quality,
sealed mil-spec switch) and tested it a lot on the bench - it never failed,
I put it back in and the motor was intermittent. I removed the panel to ac
cess the motor and tried shaking the wiring and disconnecting and reconnecti
ng the connector I have installed there, all to no effect. Failures didn't s
eem to correlate with anything Then I made a mating connector with 2 bare l
eads so the next time it failed I could disconnect the motor, connect the te
st connector and measure the voltage to see if voltage was getting to the mo
tor. Of course, after that I couldn't get it to fail again. The connectors a
re good quality automotive ones with gold plated pins. I haven't had any fa
ilures of these connectors and I used a lot of them.
>
> So my question is about Van's flap motor typical failure modes. My susp
icion is that the wiring and switch are OK - I suspect the motor. Can/does t
he motor itself often fail this way? I vaguely recall people say these moto
rs aren't very reliable.
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | flap motor Failure?. |
I had the same failure mode on about my third flight. I had to take my
motor apart and clean the contacts. There was too much grease on them
=93 which cooked and caused an open! No problems since.
IIRC Van=99s has a document on how to do this on their website
=93 especially the part about putting the motor back
together..
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of thomas sargent
Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2012 4:44 PM
Subject: RV-List: flap motor Failure?.
Thursday morning when doing touch and goes in my 6A my flap motor
stopped working. I landed and raced off to work and got back to it this
morning. It will work for a while and then fail. I removed the switch
(a high quality, sealed mil-spec switch) and tested it a lot on the
bench - it never failed, I put it back in and the motor was
intermittent. I removed the panel to access the motor and tried shaking
the wiring and disconnecting and reconnecting the connector I have
installed there, all to no effect. Failures didn't seem to correlate
with anything Then I made a mating connector with 2 bare leads so the
next time it failed I could disconnect the motor, connect the test
connector and measure the voltage to see if voltage was getting to the
motor. Of course, after that I couldn't get it to fail again. The
connectors are good quality automotive ones with gold plated pins. I
haven't had any failures of these connectors and I used a lot of them.
So my question is about Van's flap motor typical failure modes. My
suspicion is that the wiring and switch are OK - I suspect the motor.
Can/does the motor itself often fail this way? I vaguely recall people
say these motors aren't very reliable.
--
Tom Sargent
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: flap motor Failure?. |
Thanks, that sounds very likely to be the problem. I now remember reading
about this years ago, but I wasn't flying then and had forgotten about it.
I'll work on it tomorrow.
--
Tom Sargent
Message 6
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| Subject: | flap motor Failure?. |
I had a failure of my flap motor last year. The problem was the
original specification for packing it with grease at the worm gear was
found to be problematic over time. Grease was working its way up into
the motor and binding it up. My symptom was that the breaker kept
popping at random intervals.
I learned that you can buy just a replacement motor from Usher Precision
(503.992.0015) for much less than buying the whole flap motor assembly
from Vans. So if your time to rebuild the motor isn=99t worth the
$110.00 that you can buy a brand new one for, Usher is the place to
call.
Gene
RV-7a
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph E. Capen
Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2012 4:54 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: flap motor Failure?.
I had the same failure mode on about my third flight. I had to take my
motor apart and clean the contacts. There was too much grease on them
=93 which cooked and caused an open! No problems since.
IIRC Van=99s has a document on how to do this on their website
=93 especially the part about putting the motor back
together..
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of thomas sargent
Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2012 4:44 PM
Subject: RV-List: flap motor Failure?.
Thursday morning when doing touch and goes in my 6A my flap motor
stopped working. I landed and raced off to work and got back to it this
morning. It will work for a while and then fail. I removed the switch
(a high quality, sealed mil-spec switch) and tested it a lot on the
bench - it never failed, I put it back in and the motor was
intermittent. I removed the panel to access the motor and tried shaking
the wiring and disconnecting and reconnecting the connector I have
installed there, all to no effect. Failures didn't seem to correlate
with anything Then I made a mating connector with 2 bare leads so the
next time it failed I could disconnect the motor, connect the test
connector and measure the voltage to see if voltage was getting to the
motor. Of course, after that I couldn't get it to fail again. The
connectors are good quality automotive ones with gold plated pins. I
haven't had any failures of these connectors and I used a lot of them.
So my question is about Van's flap motor typical failure modes. My
suspicion is that the wiring and switch are OK - I suspect the motor.
Can/does the motor itself often fail this way? I vaguely recall people
say these motors aren't very reliable.
--
Tom Sargent
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: flap motor Failure?. |
I think the motor proper is probably quite reliable. Pittman makes good mo
tors. On the other hand, I have heard that the way these linear actuators
get greased during assembly can be a problem. The gear grease ends up migr
ating into the commutator/brush area of the motor hosing up the operation.
You may ultimately be able to correct it thru disassembly and a cleaning o
f this area with IPA.
-GV
-----Original Message-----
From: thomas sargent <sarg314@gmail.com>
Sent: Sat, Mar 10, 2012 1:45 pm
Subject: RV-List: flap motor Failure?.
Thursday morning when doing touch and goes in my 6A my flap motor stopped w
orking. I landed and raced off to work and got back to it this morning. I
t will work for a while and then fail. I removed the switch (a high qualit
y, sealed mil-spec switch) and tested it a lot on the bench - it never fail
ed, I put it back in and the motor was intermittent. I removed the panel t
o access the motor and tried shaking the wiring and disconnecting and recon
necting the connector I have installed there, all to no effect. Failures d
idn't seem to correlate with anything Then I made a mating connector with
2 bare leads so the next time it failed I could disconnect the motor, conne
ct the test connector and measure the voltage to see if voltage was getting
to the motor. Of course, after that I couldn't get it to fail again. The
connectors are good quality automotive ones with gold plated pins. I haven
't had any failures of these connectors and I used a lot of them.
So my question is about Van's flap motor typical failure modes. My suspi
cion is that the wiring and switch are OK - I suspect the motor. Can/does t
he motor itself often fail this way? I vaguely recall people say these mot
ors aren't very reliable.
--
Tom Sargent
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