RV-List Digest Archive

Sat 12/29/12


Total Messages Posted: 11



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 08:59 AM - Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (Garey Wittich)
     2. 11:49 AM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (Jeff Luckey)
     3. 12:09 PM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (vanremog@aol.com)
     4. 12:11 PM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (Larry Bowen)
     5. 12:25 PM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (Jeff Luckey)
     6. 04:45 PM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (Warren Brecheisen)
     7. 04:57 PM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (sheldon barrett)
     8. 05:05 PM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (sheldon barrett)
     9. 05:33 PM - Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw (Robert Savage)
    10. 06:33 PM - Matt's RV-8 Rebuild... (Matt Dralle)
    11. 06:42 PM - Auto-response (Viorel Nichols)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 08:59:43 AM PST US
    From: Garey Wittich <gareywittich2000@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    Happy Holidays:=0A=0ALooking for Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw that fits i n a Microstop. -The Pilot Bit (Guide Pin) has to be 0.089" Dia so the fin ished screw hole after countersinking can be TAPPED for the 4-40 screw thre ads !!!! -Where can I buy a 4-40 Countersink Bit with a guide pin of 0.08 9" Dia -or any suggestions as how to do this -?=0A=0AI took a normal -3 Rivet Countersink Bit and had a friend turn the Guide Pin down from 0.098" Dia to 0.089" Dia. -I tried this and it did NOT work as the cutting flut es of the Countersink Bit did NOT extend all the way to the reduced diamete r Guide Pin which is now 0.089" Dia. -Also tried a normal Debarring Tool Bit, but it "chattered" because of no Guide Pin to keep it centered on the 0.089" Dia hole - result very poor.=0A=0AAppreciate any suggestions !!!! -=0A=0AMANY THANKS,=0A=0AGarey Wittich - -RV-8A Builder


    Message 2


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    Time: 11:49:07 AM PST US
    From: "Jeff Luckey" <JLuckey@pacbell.net>
    Subject: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    Garey, I'm working from memory here, but I think that the countersink geometry between a rivet and a standard flat-head screw is different. The countersinks that I have for my microstop have the rivet geometry, so even if your mod to the countersink worked, the screw head probably would not seat properly in that countersink hole. (I think the difference in geometry is about 15 degrees, so it may not matter in your application.) You should be able to use a 'standard' non-aviation-geometry countersink. I regularly use one in a drill press to countersink thick aluminum. Cutter RPM is important to prevent chatter. -Jeff _____ From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Garey Wittich Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 08:59 Subject: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw Happy Holidays: Looking for Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw that fits in a Microstop. The Pilot Bit (Guide Pin) has to be 0.089" Dia so the finished screw hole after countersinking can be TAPPED for the 4-40 screw threads !!!! Where can I buy a 4-40 Countersink Bit with a guide pin of 0.089" Dia or any suggestions as how to do this ? I took a normal -3 Rivet Countersink Bit and had a friend turn the Guide Pin down from 0.098" Dia to 0.089" Dia. I tried this and it did NOT work as the cutting flutes of the Countersink Bit did NOT extend all the way to the reduced diameter Guide Pin which is now 0.089" Dia. Also tried a normal Debarring Tool Bit, but it "chattered" because of no Guide Pin to keep it centered on the 0.089" Dia hole - result very poor. Appreciate any suggestions !!!! MANY THANKS, Garey Wittich RV-8A Builder No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com


    Message 3


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    Time: 12:09:20 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    From: vanremog@aol.com
    Just to confuse things further, countersinks for AN solid rivets are 100deg , for pop rivets they are 120deg and for screws they can be 82deg, 90deg or 100deg depending on whether they are either of the two types of SAE or met ric. -GV -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Luckey <JLuckey@pacbell.net> Sent: Sat, Dec 29, 2012 11:49 am Subject: RE: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw Garey, I=99m working from memory here, but Ithink that the countersink geome try between a rivet and a standard flat-headscrew is different. The counte rsinks that I have for my microstop havethe rivet geometry, so even if your mod to the countersink worked, the screwhead probably would not seat prope rly in that countersink hole. (I thinkthe difference in geometry is about 15 degrees, so it may not matter in yourapplication.) You should be able to use a =98standard=99non-aviation-geometry countersink. I regularly use one in a drill pressto countersink thick alu minum. Cutter RPM is important to preventchatter. -Jeff From:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matron ics.com] On Behalf Of Garey Wittich Sent: Saturday, December 29, 201208:59 Subject: RV-List: Countersink Bitfor 4-40 Screw HappyHolidays: Looking for Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screwthat fits in a Microstop. The Pi lot Bit(Guide Pin) has to be 0.089" Dia so the finished screw hole aftercou ntersinking can be TAPPED for the 4-40 screw threads !!!! Wherecan I buy a 4-40 Countersink Bit with a guide pin of 0.089" Dia orany suggestions as how to do this ? I took a normal -3 Rivet Countersink Bitand had a friend turn the Guide Pin down from 0.098" Dia to 0.089"Dia. I tried this and it did NOT work as th e cutting flutes of theCountersink Bit did NOT extend all the way to the re duced diameter Guide Pinwhich is now 0.089" Dia. Also tried a normal Debar ring Tool Bit, butit "chattered" because of no Guide Pin to keep it centere d on the0.089" Dia hole - result very poor. Appreciate any suggestions !!!! MANY THANKS, Garey Wittich RV-8A Builder www.aeroelectric.com www.buildersbooks.com www.homebuilthelp.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List http://forums.matronics.com No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 12/28/12


    Message 4


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    Time: 12:11:57 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    From: Larry Bowen <larry@bowenaero.com>
    Maybe you can shorten the pilot on the #40 countersink so it's almost not there -- just enough to do the job. Then after countersinking drill additional depth at 0.089 and tap for the screw. Or, use #6 screw instead. 4's aren't very durable. -- Larry Bowen Larry@BowenAero.com http://BowenAero.com On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 11:59 AM, Garey Wittich <gareywittich2000@yahoo.com>wrote: > Happy Holidays: > > Looking for Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw that fits in a Microstop. *The > Pilot Bit (Guide Pin) has to be 0.089" Dia so the finished screw hole after > countersinking can be TAPPED for the 4-40 screw threads !!!! *Where can > I buy a 4-40 Countersink Bit with a guide pin of 0.089" Dia or any > suggestions as how to do this ? > > I took a normal -3 Rivet Countersink Bit and had a friend turn the Guide > Pin down from 0.098" Dia to 0.089" Dia. I tried this and it did NOT work > as the cutting flutes of the Countersink Bit did NOT extend all the way to > the reduced diameter Guide Pin which is now 0.089" Dia. Also tried a > normal Debarring Tool Bit, but it "chattered" because of no Guide Pin to > keep it centered on the 0.089" Dia hole - result very poor. > > Appreciate any suggestions !!!! > > MANY THANKS, > > Garey Wittich RV-8A Builder > > * > > * > >


    Message 5


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    Time: 12:25:22 PM PST US
    From: "Jeff Luckey" <JLuckey@pacbell.net>
    Subject: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    GV - thanks for filling-in the numbers. -Jeff _____ From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of vanremog@aol.com Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 12:08 Subject: Re: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw Just to confuse things further, countersinks for AN solid rivets are 100deg, for pop rivets they are 120deg and for screws they can be 82deg, 90deg or 100deg depending on whether they are either of the two types of SAE or metric. -GV -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Luckey <JLuckey@pacbell.net> Sent: Sat, Dec 29, 2012 11:49 am Subject: RE: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw Garey, I'm working from memory here, but I think that the countersink geometry between a rivet and a standard flat-head screw is different. The countersinks that I have for my microstop have the rivet geometry, so even if your mod to the countersink worked, the screw head probably would not seat properly in that countersink hole. (I think the difference in geometry is about 15 degrees, so it may not matter in your application.) You should be able to use a 'standard' non-aviation-geometry countersink. I regularly use one in a drill press to countersink thick aluminum. Cutter RPM is important to prevent chatter. -Jeff _____ From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com?> ] On Behalf Of Garey Wittich Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 08:59 Subject: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw Happy Holidays: Looking for Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw that fits in a Microstop. The Pilot Bit (Guide Pin) has to be 0.089" Dia so the finished screw hole after countersinking can be TAPPED for the 4-40 screw threads !!!! Where can I buy a 4-40 Countersink Bit with a guide pin of 0.089" Dia or any suggestions as how to do this ? I took a normal -3 Rivet Countersink Bit and had a friend turn the Guide Pin down from 0.098" Dia to 0.089" Dia. I tried this and it did NOT work as the cutting flutes of the Countersink Bit did NOT extend all the way to the reduced diameter Guide Pin which is now 0.089" Dia. Also tried a normal Debarring Tool Bit, but it "chattered" because of no Guide Pin to keep it centered on the 0.089" Dia hole - result very poor. Appreciate any suggestions !!!! MANY THANKS, Garey Wittich RV-8A Builder www.aeroelectric.com www.buildersbooks.com www.homebuilthelp.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List http://forums.matronics.com No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 12/28/12 _blank">www.aeroelectric.com " target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com ="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List tp://forums.matronics.com No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com


    Message 6


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    Time: 04:45:32 PM PST US
    From: "Warren Brecheisen" <n146wb@cfu.net>
    Subject: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    I ran into this a couple of times on my -6. I simply used a pilotless countersink with the correct angle. I used a hand hole deburring tool that accepts tools with the =BC-20 thread (same as microstops). I went slowly and carefully, checking the result often and making corrections as I went. I did not use any 4-40 screws on structural components. If you are using them on your wings tips, my method is probably too labor intensive to complete in a reasonable amount of time. I used 6-32=92s on the tips. Warren


    Message 7


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    Time: 04:57:58 PM PST US
    From: "sheldon barrett" <sheldonb@frontiernet.net>
    Subject: Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    I used 4-40s' on the tips (the kit came with the countersink) but I forgot who supplied the kit... But it was for wingtip install... However, I agree, use 6-32's instead... Sheldon ----- Original Message ----- From: Warren Brecheisen To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 5:44 PM Subject: RE: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw I ran into this a couple of times on my -6. I simply used a pilotless countersink with the correct angle. I used a hand hole deburring tool that accepts tools with the =BC-20 thread (same as microstops). I went slowly and carefully, checking the result often and making corrections as I went. I did not use any 4-40 screws on structural components. If you are using them on your wings tips, my method is probably too labor intensive to complete in a reasonable amount of time. I used 6-32's on the tips. Warren


    Message 8


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    Time: 05:05:19 PM PST US
    From: "sheldon barrett" <sheldonb@frontiernet.net>
    Subject: Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    I used 4-40s' on the tips (the kit came with the countersink) but I forgot who supplied the kit... But it was for wingtip install... However, I agree, use 6-32's instead... Sheldon ----- Original Message ----- From: Warren Brecheisen To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 5:44 PM Subject: RE: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw I ran into this a couple of times on my -6. I simply used a pilotless countersink with the correct angle. I used a hand hole deburring tool that accepts tools with the =BC-20 thread (same as microstops). I went slowly and carefully, checking the result often and making corrections as I went. I did not use any 4-40 screws on structural components. If you are using them on your wings tips, my method is probably too labor intensive to complete in a reasonable amount of time. I used 6-32's on the tips. Warren


    Message 9


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    Time: 05:33:29 PM PST US
    From: Robert Savage <bsavage22@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw
    Here's a link to Cleveland Tool and their kit for wing tip attachment. I used this kit and their dimple die for the wing aluminum. I used a hand tool for countersinking the fiberglass. It is pricey though and time consuming but the result was very nice. I also used their #4 nutplate jig. http://www.cleavelandtool.com/prodinfo.asp?number=WHS220#.UN-WVKywXTo Bob From: sheldonb@frontiernet.net Subject: Re: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw I used 4-40s' on the tips (the kit came with the countersink) but I forgot who supplied the kit... But it was for wingtip install... However=2C I agree=2C use 6-32's instead... Sheldon ----- Original Message ----- From: Warren Brecheisen To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday=2C December 29=2C 2012 5:44 PM Subject: RE: RV-List: Countersink Bit for 4-40 Screw I ran into this a couple of times on my -6. I simply used a pilotless countersink with the correct angle. I used a hand hole deburring tool that accepts tools with the =BC-20 thre ad (same as microstops). I went slowly and carefully=2C checking the result often and making corrections as I went. I did not use any 4-40 screws on structural components. If you are using them on your wings tips=2C my method is probably too labor intensive to complete in a reasonable amount of time. I used 6-32=92s on the tips. Warren href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chr ef="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/ Navigator?RV-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com


    Message 10


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    Time: 06:33:07 PM PST US
    From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
    Subject: Matt's RV-8 Rebuild...
    Dear fellow RV Builders and Flyers, I've been working hard on the RV-8 rebuild over the holidays and thought I'd share. Here the current status as of December 28 2012 on the new RV-8 2.0. This quick video highlights the new instrument panel including the recently finished cockpit audio output for the video camera. Line level output from the airplane's intercom is routed out through the RCA outputs in the rear of the cabin through some matching circuitry in the gold RCA connectors up to the camera's Mic input. The matching seems to be working pretty well. The audio in the video is coming right from the intercom and includes a mix of the intercom voice, the music or DVD output from the Kenwood stereo, and the audio output from the Garmin SL-30 Com unit (aircraft communications radio). Yet to be wired in is the audio outputs from the EFIS's, the VP-200, and the ADS600B. Note also that the video output from the camera is also routed in though the new A/V panel and then out through the headrest LCD display for the passenger. The video is also available on the pilot's Kenwood display. Everything is working pretty nicely. I'm particularly pleased with the new A/V panel I/O. Matt's HD YouTube Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xrTKAuDEyI&feature=share&list=PLB2F39639392A90DE - Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen" http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap... RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer" http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log Status: 120+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode


    Message 11


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    Time: 06:42:58 PM PST US
    From: Viorel Nichols <viorel.nichols@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Auto-response
    Away on holiday from the 22 December 2012 till 29 January 2013 Wishing you a happy festive season . Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year from Viorel ...




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