Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:07 AM - Re: Color after Alodine (RAS)
2. 02:10 AM - Re: Color after Alodine (RAS)
3. 06:15 AM - Re: Color after Alodine (linn walters)
4. 09:57 AM - Re: Re: Trim Cable Brackets (Mike Kraus)
5. 10:21 AM - Re: Re: Trim Cable Brackets (Mike Kraus)
6. 11:56 AM - Re: Rudder Trailing Edge (John Jessen)
7. 01:13 PM - Re: Rudder Trailing Edge ()
8. 02:16 PM - Exterior lighting choices (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
9. 06:30 PM - Re: For Tim Olson (GenGrumpy@aol.com)
10. 06:30 PM - Re: Exterior lighting choices (Tim Olson)
11. 06:41 PM - Re: Exterior lighting choices (brian bollaert)
12. 07:13 PM - IO540 experimental engine (Robert)
13. 10:36 PM - Re: For Tim Olson (Tim Olson)
14. 10:39 PM - Re: IO540 experimental engine (Tim Olson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Color after Alodine |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "RAS" <deruiteraircraftservices@btinternet.com>
Hi Larry,
You probabaly left the alodine on for too long. I'm not familiar with the
brand you're using, but the trimite alodine in powder form only needs five
minutes at 28C.
Marcel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Rosen" <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Color after Alodine
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>
> I just finished alodining my first batch of parts. I expected them to be
> a golden color, but they came out a coffee brown. I am using PPG Chemfil
> DX503. Did I not rinse the parts enough?
>
> Larry
> #356
> http://rv10pilot.home.comcast.net/
>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Color after Alodine |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "RAS" <deruiteraircraftservices@btinternet.com>
Hi,
Letting alodine dry in without rinse and then alodine again will guaranteed
get you a coffee brown color. Once is enough. Alodine is a chemical
conversion coating, when the chemical conversion has taken place, it will
not do it again. A better way of doing this is to get a tank of either
plastic or stainless steel, and dip all your parts for 5 minutes, lift them
out and then rinse with clean water, then air dry.
I hope this helps,
Marcel
RV7 testing
RV10 building
both in alodine
--- Original Message -----
From: "linn walters" <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Color after Alodine
> --> RV10-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
>
> Larry, depending on where you got your alodine ..... that may be all
> you're going to get. Years ago you could buy liquid alodine that was
> potent .... and you got the golden color. Along comes the EPA and said
> chromium was harmful (isn't everything but pure air???) so the
> concentration was cut drastically. So the answer is to buy the powder and
> mix your own potent stuff. There's bunches of stuff in the archive.
>
> What I do with the pre-mix is spray it on the aluminum and wipe it around
> with a terry cloth rag (which will disintegrate after a while due to the
> acid) keeping the area wet. Then I let it dry. Hold on, no flames yet!
> Read the instructions on the bottle! Then I repeat the process again and
> instead of letting it dry, I wash with copious amounts of water. I still
> don't get the real golden color, but it's the best I can do.
>
> I'm buying some powder and will mix my own ..... and make whatever 'tubs'
> necessary to immerse my parts. For that golden color, I hope!!!
> Linn ..... workshop going up!
>
> Larry Rosen wrote:
>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>>
>> I just finished alodining my first batch of parts. I expected them to be
>> a golden color, but they came out a coffee brown. I am using PPG Chemfil
>> DX503. Did I not rinse the parts enough?
>>
>> Larry
>> #356
>> http://rv10pilot.home.comcast.net/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Color after Alodine |
--> RV10-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
Marcel, thanks for the input. The wimpy mix I was using on an existing
wing just didn't hack it. I get a better color after the second
application, which resulted in a very, very light golden color. It
seems that the fella with the brown color just left his in the soup too
long .... from all the posts.
Linn
do not archive
RAS wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "RAS"
> <deruiteraircraftservices@btinternet.com>
>
> Hi,
>
> Letting alodine dry in without rinse and then alodine again will
> guaranteed get you a coffee brown color. Once is enough. Alodine is a
> chemical conversion coating, when the chemical conversion has taken
> place, it will not do it again. A better way of doing this is to get a
> tank of either plastic or stainless steel, and dip all your parts for
> 5 minutes, lift them out and then rinse with clean water, then air dry.
> I hope this helps,
>
> Marcel
> RV7 testing
> RV10 building
> both in alodine
>
>
> --- Original Message ----- From: "linn walters" <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 10:24 PM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Color after Alodine
>
>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: linn walters <lwalters2@cfl.rr.com>
>>
>> Larry, depending on where you got your alodine ..... that may be all
>> you're going to get. Years ago you could buy liquid alodine that was
>> potent .... and you got the golden color. Along comes the EPA and
>> said chromium was harmful (isn't everything but pure air???) so the
>> concentration was cut drastically. So the answer is to buy the
>> powder and mix your own potent stuff. There's bunches of stuff in
>> the archive.
>>
>> What I do with the pre-mix is spray it on the aluminum and wipe it
>> around with a terry cloth rag (which will disintegrate after a while
>> due to the acid) keeping the area wet. Then I let it dry. Hold on,
>> no flames yet! Read the instructions on the bottle! Then I repeat the
>> process again and instead of letting it dry, I wash with copious
>> amounts of water. I still don't get the real golden color, but it's
>> the best I can do.
>>
>> I'm buying some powder and will mix my own ..... and make whatever
>> 'tubs' necessary to immerse my parts. For that golden color, I hope!!!
>> Linn ..... workshop going up!
>>
>> Larry Rosen wrote:
>>
>>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>>>
>>> I just finished alodining my first batch of parts. I expected them
>>> to be a golden color, but they came out a coffee brown. I am using
>>> PPG Chemfil DX503. Did I not rinse the parts enough?
>>>
>>> Larry
>>> #356
>>> http://rv10pilot.home.comcast.net/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
--
Message 4
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| Subject: | RE: Trim Cable Brackets |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Mike Kraus" <n223rv@wolflakeairport.net>
Take a magnet to either the nut or the plate. They are both supposed to
be stainless, if the magnet attaches to one of the pieces then it was
not stainless....
I had 4 of these in 2 kits.... 1 was all stainless and you could not
break it, 3 had a ferrous steel plate and you could bend it and it would
break shortly thereafter... I called Van's, they seemed surprised to
hear this, but had no problem sending me free replacements.... I think
you should all check yours out.
-Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric Panning
Subject: Re: RV10-List: RE: Trim Cable Brackets
--> RV10-List message posted by: Eric Panning
--> <ericmpmail-rv10@yahoo.com>
I had one of the nuts break off and I picked up two replacements from
Van's. The new ones are double welded (both sides of the nut edge) and
seem much stronger. The original ones were welded only on one edge of
the nut in a thin line.
I have not replaced them yet but will be investigating attaching via nut
plates instead of rivets. Van's thought this was ok when I talked to
them - provided there is enough room (attach plate area is small)
I recall they also mentioned that you can rotate it in
place with the nut riveted to the access panel but
only by a bend in the control cable to the limits.
If you build another solution, I suggest leaving space
for nut plates to attach - This would make it much
easier to adjust during rigging and also for future
tweaking or inspection.
Eric
Message 5
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| Subject: | RE: Trim Cable Brackets |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Mike Kraus" <n223rv@wolflakeairport.net>
Trust me, it was not stainless.....
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ned
Subject: Re: RV10-List: RE: Trim Cable Brackets
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Ned" <923te@cox.net>
There are several alloys of stainless steel that are magnetic
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Mike Kraus"
> --> <n223rv@wolflakeairport.net>
>
> Take a magnet to either the nut or the plate. They are both supposed
> to be stainless, if the magnet attaches to one of the pieces then it
> was not stainless....
>
> I had 4 of these in 2 kits.... 1 was all stainless and you could not
> break it, 3 had a ferrous steel plate and you could bend it and it
> would break shortly thereafter... I called Van's, they seemed
> surprised to hear this, but had no problem sending me free
> replacements.... I think you should all check yours out. -Mike
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric
> Panning
> Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:57 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: RE: Trim Cable Brackets
>
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Eric Panning
> --> <ericmpmail-rv10@yahoo.com>
>
>
> I had one of the nuts break off and I picked up two replacements from
> Van's. The new ones are double welded (both sides of the nut edge) and
> seem much stronger. The original ones were welded only on one edge of
> the nut in a thin line.
>
> I have not replaced them yet but will be investigating attaching via
> nut plates instead of rivets. Van's thought this was ok when I talked
> to them - provided there is enough room (attach plate area is small)
>
> I recall they also mentioned that you can rotate it in
> place with the nut riveted to the access panel but
> only by a bend in the control cable to the limits.
>
> If you build another solution, I suggest leaving space
> for nut plates to attach - This would make it much
> easier to adjust during rigging and also for future
> tweaking or inspection.
>
> Eric
>
>
>
Message 6
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d="scan'208"; a="69602157:sNHT30736000"
| Subject: | Rudder Trailing Edge |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Thanks, everyone, for your input. I will go to the hanger tonight and see
if I can get a measurement on how bad the bowing actually is and will report
back. I didn't do anything last night just so I could calm down. Went out
instead and had dinner with some distant relatives who were in town
visiting. Stayed away from the topic of airplanes.
Van's answered my question to them on this topic thusly...
= = = = = =
John,
Getting a slight bend in the trailing edge is only an esthetic thing not an
aerodynamic thing. If the bend is slight, I would leave it alone. You will
do more harm than good drilling out the rivets and breaking loose the tank
sealant. It may get straighter when you finish riveting. If it doesn't and
you can live with a slight bow, just move on.
Bruce Reynolds
brucer@vansaircraft.com
= = = = =
I replied with another question, namely wouldn't the bow effect trim? We'll
see what comes back.
John Jessen
(#328, Rudder)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Rudder Trailing Edge
--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
Run a string line down the trailing edge, Van's says to stay within 1/16" of
an inch. I recommend playing with putting a dowel under the high spot of the
hook which I interpret as a "bow" in the edge. Place the trailing edge with
the bow deflection or as you look at it so, "it smiles not frowns at you" on
a flat surface such as your back rivet plate. Put the dowel I find 3/4" or
larger under the lowest part or top of the radius of the hook/bow. Take your
time and work the piece by HAND, slowly applying pressure and moving the
dowel as you go. The aluminum assembly is flexible and you will have to
exceed what seems to be an amount that would make the edge go the other way
to far...hence SLOW. I had a simlilar instance on my flap...very slight.
Work the trailing edge with your hand pressure a little at a time a small
wood block works well too...you can work it out. For those who have not had
much experience manipulating aluminum it is very resilient, up to a point,
it likes s!
low steady pressure to give way, push it to hard and fast or use brute
force, it will snap, crack and split. With small pressures against the bend
you should be able to work it out, More that 1/4" will take some finesse,
post a photo, if your near Las Vegas I could show you the technique, I'll
step out of a PC explaination and tell ya....go at it like it's your best
gal....slow and easy....little at a time....it will work.
Rick S.
40185
Waiting on the Fuse delivery
Message 7
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| Subject: | Rudder Trailing Edge |
He already answered the trim question by saying it is "not an aerodynamic thing."
I'd be surprised if you get another response let alone a different one.
-----------------------------------------------------
Getting a slight bend in the trailing edge is only an esthetic thing not an
aerodynamic thing. If the bend is slight, I would leave it alone. You will
do more harm than good drilling out the rivets and breaking loose the tank
sealant. It may get straighter when you finish riveting. If it doesn't and
you can live with a slight bow, just move on.
Bruce Reynolds
brucer@vansaircraft.com
I replied with another question, namely wouldn't the bow effect trim? We'll
see what comes back.
John Jessen
(#328, Rudder)
Message 8
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| Subject: | Exterior lighting choices |
0.03 HTML_TEXT_AFTER_HTML BODY": rv10-list@matronics.com
Ok, I'm ordering accessories for the wings so I have them when I need them. Got
the wing kit for Rob's AOA system, ordered the Duckworks HID and the aileron
trim ($275 in case anyone is wondering) from Van's. Still need to order the
pitot tube, probably be the Gretz. Now I'm trying to decide on who to use for
my strobes/LED nav lights. Whelen is out because of the cost. So this leaves
me; Aeroflash, CreativAir, and GS-Air. Of course none of them were at Airventure.
First question, how many people out there experienced any problems with the strobes
being powered from a central power supply? If I end up getting strobes with
a central supply I will probably run the power leads in a dedicated conduit
as far away from the other leads, including the Archer Nav coax, as possible.
I would prefer strobes run from local power supplies but Aeroflash is the only
option of the three for this and I still need to price them out. I'll probably
get the Aeroflash for the tail strobe either way but I need to check the
flange dimensions so I can make sure it fit's ok.
Does anyone have any preference between GS-Air or Creativ-Air? They are both similar
and pretty much the same cost. Anyone currently using any of the above
that can give us a pirep?
Michael Sausen
-10 #352 wings
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: For Tim Olson |
Tim,
Thanks for the info. Got to the site ok.
What have they done about the Lyc crank problems?
How long a wait for yours??
Did you go with dual Lightspeeds? If yes, what about battery back up for
them?
Thanks - John
In a message dated 8/2/2005 9:48:33 PM Central Standard Time, Tim@MyRV10.com
writes:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Their prices were exactly as advertized on their web page. The total
package, with the Lightspeed Plasma III and all of the options I bought
(which didn't include an alternator) was just over $33,500. It's
not technically "zero time" since it's not done at the factory, so
it's an overhaul, but with an experimental, you still start the logs
at zero. Had it been certified, it may have been a different story.
Bart overhauls only to NEW limits though, so the crank is not
ground undersized and all parts that were not brand new should be
the same as new.
All of their contact info is at:
http://www.aerosportpower.com/
If you don't have access to the website, let me know and I'll
dig up the address and phone for you.
Tim
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
do not archive
GenGrumpy@aol.com wrote:
> Tim, how much did they charge you for the motor? Is it a zero time or
> rebuild?
>
> Do you have a name and phone number for them?
>
> Thanks
>
> John Miller
> 40404 empennage
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Exterior lighting choices |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
I'm kind of in the same boat as you....I really had wanted
to see some LED Nav light products at OSH, but nothing
but Whelen was there.
My plan currently is to go to CreativAir for the Strobes
and Nav's. I may end up with Perihelion for the Nav's,
as his engineering thoughts are impressive, but they're
kind of big and ugly and bulky....so more likely it'll
be creativair. As for strobes, I'm guessing that
a single power supply will be my choice too. I, like
you, wish I had separate ones out in the tips, but
it gets kind of pricey that way too. If you find
something out, post it here....I'll be buying soon, so
I'll be on the hunt also. Not much left to buy at this
point.
Tim
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
Current project: Fuselage
DO NOT ARCHIVE
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
> Ok, I'm ordering accessories for the wings so I have them when I need
> them. Got the wing kit for Rob's AOA system, ordered the Duckworks HID
> and the aileron trim ($275 in case anyone is wondering) from Van's.
> Still need to order the pitot tube, probably be the Gretz. Now I'm
> trying to decide on who to use for my strobes/LED nav lights. Whelen is
> out because of the cost. So this leaves me; Aeroflash, CreativAir, and
> GS-Air. Of course none of them were at Airventure.
>
> First question, how many people out there experienced any problems with
> the strobes being powered from a central power supply? If I end up
> getting strobes with a central supply I will probably run the power
> leads in a dedicated conduit as far away from the other leads, including
> the Archer Nav coax, as possible. I would prefer strobes run from local
> power supplies but Aeroflash is the only option of the three for
> this and I still need to price them out. I'll probably get the
> Aeroflash for the tail strobe either way but I need to check the flange
> dimensions so I can make sure it fit's ok.
>
> Does anyone have any preference between GS-Air or Creativ-Air? They are
> both similar and pretty much the same cost. Anyone currently using any
> of the above that can give us a pirep?
>
> Michael Sausen
> -10 #352 wings
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Exterior lighting choices |
Hello Micheal:
my exp is only with gs-air owners name is geovani , i have ordered wing position
& strob lights & the tail strob and position he has been very good to deal with
on my part , i am shure that some of the others are good also just don't have
the exp .
Brian Bollaert
#40200
----- Original Message -----
From: RV Builder (Michael Sausen)
To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>0.03 HTML_TEXT_AFTER_HTML BODY : rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 2:16 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Exterior lighting choices
Ok, I'm ordering accessories for the wings so I have them when I need them.
Got the wing kit for Rob's AOA system, ordered the Duckworks HID and the aileron
trim ($275 in case anyone is wondering) from Van's. Still need to order the
pitot tube, probably be the Gretz. Now I'm trying to decide on who to use
for my strobes/LED nav lights. Whelen is out because of the cost. So this leaves
me; Aeroflash, CreativAir, and GS-Air. Of course none of them were at Airventure.
First question, how many people out there experienced any problems with the strobes
being powered from a central power supply? If I end up getting strobes
with a central supply I will probably run the power leads in a dedicated conduit
as far away from the other leads, including the Archer Nav coax, as possible.
I would prefer strobes run from local power supplies but Aeroflash is the
only option of the three for this and I still need to price them out. I'll probably
get the Aeroflash for the tail strobe either way but I need to check the
flange dimensions so I can make sure it fit's ok.
Does anyone have any preference between GS-Air or Creativ-Air? They are both
similar and pretty much the same cost. Anyone currently using any of the above
that can give us a pirep?
Michael Sausen
-10 #352 wings
Message 12
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|
s=s1024; d=yahoo.com;
b=EnnEcfVnuNg1xBe1vLo27eV6zQbQddWaAI9HlE3semkmpHO2ZIrkHDMBE0O0ZEv9e8RcPUdSIR6xSGwSE15tiC2+E50NT1aQdUM59HAw57Oi8XQ39k84bBigktoqJSbsJVGWtN2Z4YroNOJBiu5gIOMlxmra1Q/hEJVlzYYN+PA=
;
| Subject: | IO540 experimental engine |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Robert <retiredpilot03-serv@yahoo.com>
Hey Guys,
Just received this link through the SERV
(Southeast RV Squadron) site. The first of many I
hope:
http://www.mattituck.com/tmx540.htm
Robert Vinroot
#40343 (fuselage)
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: For Tim Olson |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Hey John,
Glad you found their site. I don't know that they have anything
to actually "do" about the crank problem. I did specifically
ask Bart at OSH *Before* I picked up the engine, what
kind of potential they had for issues with the cranks...he said
that they do have the serial numbers on all parts in the engine,
so if it had been in that range, they'd know about it. So,
I don't think it's a big worry...they'd never knowingly sell you
a bad one.
I put money down on mine about April/May and picked it up at
OSH, but it was ready before that. My guess is that you could
have the engine in a month, but I think they quote more like
3-4 months.
I went with Single Lightspeed Plasma III and a single Mag.
I'm planning on running a main battery, and a smaller
aux. battery. The aux battery will be used during engine
start to prevent kickback on the lightspeed, and to power
my EIS and EFIS during engine start....it will also supply
voltage when my E-Bus switch is flipped. For my
lightspeed, I added a switch (3 way) that will toggle
between powering it from the Aux. Battery Bus and the
Main battery bus (normal). This is all probably not necessary,
considering I have a mag, but if I lose my alternator, it
would still be nice to have a well running engine.
Any more, fire away...
Tim
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
GenGrumpy@aol.com wrote:
> Tim,
>
> Thanks for the info. Got to the site ok.
>
> What have they done about the Lyc crank problems?
>
> How long a wait for yours??
>
> Did you go with dual Lightspeeds? If yes, what about battery back up
> for them?
>
> Thanks - John
>
> In a message dated 8/2/2005 9:48:33 PM Central Standard Time,
> Tim@MyRV10.com writes:
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Their prices were exactly as advertized on their web page. The total
> package, with the Lightspeed Plasma III and all of the options I bought
> (which didn't include an alternator) was just over $33,500. It's
> not technically "zero time" since it's not done at the factory, so
> it's an overhaul, but with an experimental, you still start the logs
> at zero. Had it been certified, it may have been a different story.
> Bart overhauls only to NEW limits though, so the crank is not
> ground undersized and all parts that were not brand new should be
> the same as new.
>
> All of their contact info is at:
> http://www.aerosportpower.com/
>
> If you don't have access to the website, let me know and I'll
> dig up the address and phone for you.
> Tim
>
> Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
> do not archive
>
> GenGrumpy@aol.com wrote:
> > Tim, how much did they charge you for the motor? Is it a zero
> time or
> > rebuild?
> >
> > Do you have a name and phone number for them?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > John Miller
> > 40404 empennage
>
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| Subject: | Re: IO540 experimental engine |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
No C'mon Robert....we don't need to be spreading that
kind of news around...it's only going to hurt the feelings
of people like me who just got a rebuilt engine for less
than $1,000 less. If you see any more of these low-priced
new engines, just keep them to yourself. ** Just kidding,
of course ** ;)
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
Robert wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Robert <retiredpilot03-serv@yahoo.com>
>
> Hey Guys,
>
> Just received this link through the SERV
> (Southeast RV Squadron) site. The first of many I
> hope:
>
> http://www.mattituck.com/tmx540.htm
>
> Robert Vinroot
> #40343 (fuselage)
>
>
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