---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 10/04/05: 30 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:40 AM - Re: aileron trim (Jim Wade) 2. 05:54 AM - Re: Soundproofing Material (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 3. 06:13 AM - Re: aileron trim (Condrey, Bob (US SSA)) 4. 06:17 AM - RV-10 propeller tests (LessDragProd@aol.com) 5. 07:37 AM - The next Reno? (slightly off topic) (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 6. 12:24 PM - Re: Cowling Quick Fastners (Dave & Brenda Emond) 7. 12:30 PM - Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (James Hein) 8. 12:59 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (Condrey, Bob (US SSA)) 9. 01:00 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (John Jessen) 10. 01:01 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (James Ochs) 11. 01:26 PM - Re: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners (SteinAir, Inc.) 12. 01:30 PM - Re: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners (Werner Schneider) 13. 01:31 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (Tim Olson) 14. 01:35 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (Tim Olson) 15. 01:57 PM - Re: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 16. 01:57 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto) 17. 02:09 PM - Re: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners (David Talley) 18. 03:18 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (James Hein) 19. 04:18 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (David McNeill) 20. 04:28 PM - Re: aileron trim (Jim Wade) 21. 05:42 PM - Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer (Sean Stephens) 22. 06:47 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (James Ochs) 23. 07:04 PM - Re: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners (John Mcmahon) 24. 07:30 PM - Re: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer (Chris) 25. 07:41 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (LarryRosen@comcast.net) 26. 08:12 PM - Re: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer (JOHN STARN) 27. 08:29 PM - Re: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! (Condrey, Bob (US SSA)) 28. 08:29 PM - Re: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer (Rick) 29. 09:16 PM - Re: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer (Sean Stephens) 30. 09:55 PM - Re: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners (Werner Schneider) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:40:50 AM PST US From: Jim Wade Subject: RE: RV10-List: aileron trim Thanks Jesse! Did a search for Aerotrim kit, no info. Where did you get yours? Do aileron and Rudder work together or separate? I am planning on having my elevator and aileron trim on the hat switch on the stick. Jim Wade -------Original Message------- From: Jesse Saint Subject: RE: RV10-List: aileron trim We have the AeroTrim kit installed for Aileron and Rudder. They are awesome! The rudder pedals are used strictly for ground control, nothing used in the air at all. Also, with that much fuel in the wings, you don=92t want to be fighting the ailerons all the time, and it is nice to take a little bit of torque off the auto pilot. We wouldn=92t have it any other way. Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse@itecusa.org www.itecusa.org W: 352-465-4545 C: 352-427-0285 F: 815-377-3694 From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Wade Subject: RV10-List: aileron trim Anyone putting aileron trim in?? Does the plane need one? Heard it mentioned a few times. Has anyone tried to attach a Rosen sunvisor to the cabin structure?? I have Rosen's in my T210 and they are great when the sun is bright, also you can move them to the side if needed. Would be a very nice addition with all that glass. Jim Wade 40383 ( no type this time) Slow build everything Fuselage ready to close floors and install panel. Wings ready for top skins. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:54:57 AM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Soundproofing Material From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" Larry, This is very similar to what I've been looking at using. http://www.quietcoat.com/index.html They are both viscoelastic materials similar to what our front seats are made of. Only difference is quiet coat is spray on and b-quiet is a mat with a butyl rubber adhesive and aluminum layer. The butyl adhesive will add a layer of high density to further assist in stopping the wave propagation from the skins but most of the work is done by the "smart" foam. The main job of the adhesive is to get the waves into the foam where they can be converted to heat. With the quiet coat being a spray on, it should have superior adhesion. The aluminum layer is primarily a heat shield and won't really add much other than weight. Not trying to change your mind, just trying to do a quick comparison. Either way both of these products should give equal or better performance to the heavier asphalt mats. Let us know how it works. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Flaps -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen Subject: RV10-List: Soundproofing Material --> RV10-List message posted by: Larry Rosen I am getting ready to close up the front floor boards. I know many are using the super Soundproofing sheets from Aircraft Spruce . However, this is the material that I am going to be using . It is B-Quiet Ultimate. A flexible composite material with an aluminum top layer. It is 1.6mm thick and weighs 0.35 lb/sqft. Larry Rosen 40356 N205EN (reserved) ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:13:35 AM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: aileron trim From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" I've got the Van's kit. It is a spring bias system driven by a servo, installation is in the wing at the inboard access panel. I considered the Aerotrim after seeing it at OSH but this seemed to be a cleaner installation. I'm not flying yet so can't provide feedback on functionality. Bob #40105 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Wade Subject: RV10-List: aileron trim Anyone putting aileron trim in?? Does the plane need one? Heard it mentioned a few times. Has anyone tried to attach a Rosen sunvisor to the cabin structure?? I have Rosen's in my T210 and they are great when the sun is bright, also you can move them to the side if needed. Would be a very nice addition with all that glass. Jim Wade 40383 ( no type this time) Slow build everything Fuselage ready to close floors and install panel. Wings ready for top skins. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:17:26 AM PST US From: LessDragProd@aol.com Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 propeller tests Hi All, Is anyone willing to test both the RV-10 MT Propeller and the RV-10 Hartzell propeller on their flying RV-10? Please contact me directly at _jim@lessdrag.com_ (mailto:jim@lessdrag.com) Van's Aircraft hasn't had time available with their RV-10 to test the RV-10 MT Propeller. The Hartzell propeller Van's Aircraft sells to RV-10 builders, model number C2YR-1BFP/F8068D, is unique to the RV-10. In talking with Hartzell, apparently the C2YR-1BFP/F8068D propeller can only be purchased from Van's Aircraft. And Van's Aircraft can only sell one Hartzell propeller to each builder. Do you see were this is going? Van;s Aircraft and the RV-10 builders are the only ones with the RV-10 Hartzell propeller. It looks like it is up to someone with a flying RV-10 with the RV-10 Hartzell propeller to step forward, if both propellers are to be tested on a common airframe. It might even be interesting to see how a standard Hartzell propeller compares to the RV-10 Hartzell propeller. Regards, Jim Ayers _jim@lessdrag.com_ (mailto:jim@lessdrag.com) (805) 795-5377 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:37:48 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: The next Reno? (slightly off topic) From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" Saw this over on the Canard Aviators list (sorry, still a canard lover at heart). http://msnbc.msn.com/id/9572408/ http://www.rocketracingleague.com/ Michael Sausen -10 #352 Flaps Do not archive ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:24:43 PM PST US From: "Dave & Brenda Emond" Subject: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners I recall reading about a quick fastner, one size that fits all. You adjust each fastner to suit the depth of the cowl material and anchor plate. I can't remember who makes them, or what they are called. I need some help???? Dave Emond #40159 Busy on Fuse Kit ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:30:57 PM PST US From: James Hein Subject: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! DNA: do not archive Its-Bogus: do not forward to list - No Plain-Text Section --- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:59:30 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" Although it's almost a necessity in parts of the fuselage, you can easily get by with just the snap bushings in the wings. Only thing I did was use the next larger size (625-7 called out, I used 625-8). For those new to the list, also consider that you may have wingtip nav antenna coax (one or both wings), marker beacon antenna coax, and/or the AOA pressure tap lines. My specific configuration included all of the above (navs in both wingtips), Whelen strobe/nav lights, Van's landing lights, heated pitot, standard stall warning and the TruTrak roll servo. Bob #40105 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein Subject: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! I've been trying to decide on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except what size? This stuff all has 1/8" walls, so add 1/4" to the I.D. to get the O.D. But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into trouble? would 3/4" (1.05" O.D) be too large? (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which has a 1/16" wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing for example) 1. Whelean Strobes 2. Duckworks HID lights 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a taxi light) 4. Nav lights 5. Heated Pitot 6. The Kit's stall warning system 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) 8. TruTrak roll servo If you've already done something similar, what is the wire bundle size? Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) to and ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:00:52 PM PST US From: "John Jessen" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! Make the Van's landing lights alternate on/off during approach and you have a list that is almost exactly mine. I'm going with an AOA and probably no extra tanks, but everything else looks great. Am therefore very interested in the responses to come. John Jessen 40328 HS _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein Subject: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! --> RV10-List message posted by: James Hein I've been trying to decide on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrte. So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except what size? This stuff all has 1/8" walls, so add 1/4" to the I.D. to get the O.D. But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into trouble? would 3/4" (1.05" O.D) be too large? (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which has a 1/16" wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing for example) 1. Whelean Strobes 2. Duckworks HID lights 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a taxi light) 4. Nav lights 5. Heated Pitot 6. The Kit's stall warning system 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) 8. TruTrak roll servo If you've already done something similar, what is the wire bundle size? Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:01:09 PM PST US From: James Ochs Subject: Re: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! --> RV10-List message posted by: James Ochs I think Tim used innerduct (interduct?) which is what I am planning on using. It's the orange stuff that they run fiber optic cable in from the telco providers. I managed to swipe H H H H appropriate about 50' of the stuff from a phone closet at a friends work that some unamed telco left there a year or two ago. It's corrugated, but I imagine if they use it for fiber it can't be all bad. I'm curious to know what you used that fell apart in the 20 years? I have plenty of time to make a switch in my plan since I haven't even gotten to the tailcone yet ;) Secondly, for these conduit runs, does one just make a new hole in the rib / bulkhead for it to pass through? any worries about structural integrity? I think the stuff I have is around 1 - 1-1/4 inches on the OD. Thanks, James #40400 elevators James Hein wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: James Hein I've been trying to decide > on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions > from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not > fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before > on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:26:04 PM PST US From: "SteinAir, Inc." Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners They are "skybolt" fasteners and are really quite nice to use. They aren't cheap, but then again you get what you pay for! After using both the hinge pins and fasteners, I'll never go back to hinge pins again. http://www.skybolt.com Cheers, Stein. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dave & Brenda Emond Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 2:24 PM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners I recall reading about a quick fastner, one size that fits all. You adjust each fastner to suit the depth of the cowl material and anchor plate. I can't remember who makes them, or what they are called. I need some help???? Dave Emond #40159 Busy on Fuse Kit ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:30:28 PM PST US From: Werner Schneider Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners --> RV10-List message posted by: Werner Schneider http://www.milspecproducts.com/index.htm I'm using them in the Glastar 140 hrs without any problems br Werner Dave & Brenda Emond wrote: > I recall reading about a quick fastner, one size that fits all. You > adjust each fastner to suit the depth of the cowl material and anchor > plate. I can't remember who makes them, or what they are called. I > need some help???? > > Dave Emond > > #40159 > Busy on Fuse Kit ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:31:36 PM PST US From: Tim Olson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson I have similar stuff, without the van's tip lights and the fuel pump. I ran my TruTrak servo wires in the same place the pitot line is run in the opposite wing. May as well run it there, since it's not being used for anything else, and is closer to the servo. I ran my strobe wires in snap bushings towards the rear of the wing. No big reason...just because. Considering this, there is a fair amount of space left over in my standard Van's conduit. So if you did something similar, you wouldn't need to worry about going anywhere near 1". I think 1" might be pushing it anyway. Tim James Hein wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: James Hein I've been trying to decide > on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions from > the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not fond of > corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before on other > applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. > > So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except what > size? This stuff all has 1/8" walls, so add 1/4" to the I.D. to get the > O.D. > > But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into trouble? > would 3/4" (1.05" O.D) be too large? > > (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which has a > 1/16" wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) > > I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing for > example) > 1. Whelean Strobes > 2. Duckworks HID lights > 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a > taxi light) > 4. Nav lights > 5. Heated Pitot > 6. The Kit's stall warning system > 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) > 8. TruTrak roll servo > > If you've already done something similar, what is the wire *bundle* size? > > Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? > > -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:35:42 PM PST US From: Tim Olson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson I did use innerduct, but that was in the fuselage to go to the tail. My runs to the wingtips seem to be great on space, given the way I laid it out (you'll see in my other reply). I think that people with an EFIS should for sure consider some alternative for the front to tail run. There I think you'll run out of space really quick. That 1" innerduct I think will be perfect for that location....one per side. Glad to hear you were able to "Procure" (same as "swipe" ;) ) some for yourself. I think it should last a good long time. It lasts for years and years in commercial buildings. As for that hole size....given the location for front to tail, it didn't seem to structurally be very bad. I don't think I'd like to run it to the wingtips though. I think I've even heard something somewhere about a max size hole in the wing ribs, and I don't think it was that big. But, I don't know where I heard that. Tim James Ochs wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: James Ochs > > I think Tim used innerduct (interduct?) which is what I am planning on > using. It's the orange stuff that they run fiber optic cable in from > the telco providers. I managed to swipe H H H H appropriate about 50' > of the stuff from a phone closet at a friends work that some unamed > telco left there a year or two ago. It's corrugated, but I imagine if > they use it for fiber it can't be all bad. I'm curious to know what you > used that fell apart in the 20 years? I have plenty of time to make a > switch in my plan since I haven't even gotten to the tailcone yet ;) > > Secondly, for these conduit runs, does one just make a new hole in the > rib / bulkhead for it to pass through? any worries about structural > integrity? I think the stuff I have is around 1 - 1-1/4 inches on the OD. > > Thanks, > James > #40400 elevators > > James Hein wrote: > >> --> RV10-List message posted by: James Hein I've been trying to decide >> on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions >> from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not >> fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before >> on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. >> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:57:23 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" I believe Skybolt also has complete kits for the RV's. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Flaps do not archive ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of SteinAir, Inc. Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners They are "skybolt" fasteners and are really quite nice to use. They aren't cheap, but then again you get what you pay for! After using both the hinge pins and fasteners, I'll never go back to hinge pins again. http://www.skybolt.com Cheers, Stein. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dave & Brenda Emond Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 2:24 PM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners =09 =09 I recall reading about a quick fastner, one size that fits all. You adjust each fastner to suit the depth of the cowl material and anchor plate. I can't remember who makes them, or what they are called. I need some help???? Dave Emond #40159 Busy on Fuse Kit ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:57:43 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! Sounds about right. I used thin wall ABS irrigation pipe somewhere around 7/8". Should be pulling all my wires in about 3-4 weeks and I'll know if it's enough then. For me it's: LEFT WING -Nav Ant -Position lights -strobe -Duck HID -pitot heat -TT AP Servo (run separate) -AOA tap (run separate) -Pitot tube (run with AOA tap) RIGHT WING -Nav Ant -MB antenna -Position lights -strobe -Duck HID (maybe) -Trim servo (Run separately) Couple things to note, I ran some of those separate mainly because the existing tooling holes in the ribs made it more convenient and I wouldn't have to tap off the conduit. No stall warning wiring because the AOA is much more accurate as a stall warning device so I didn't install the stall vane. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Flaps do not archive ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US SSA) Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! Although it's almost a necessity in parts of the fuselage, you can easily get by with just the snap bushings in the wings. Only thing I did was use the next larger size (625-7 called out, I used 625-8). For those new to the list, also consider that you may have wingtip nav antenna coax (one or both wings), marker beacon antenna coax, and/or the AOA pressure tap lines. My specific configuration included all of the above (navs in both wingtips), Whelen strobe/nav lights, Van's landing lights, heated pitot, standard stall warning and the TruTrak roll servo. Bob #40105 ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein Subject: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! I've been trying to decide on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except what size? This stuff all has 1/8" walls, so add 1/4" to the I.D. to get the O.D. But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into trouble? would 3/4" (1.05" O.D) be too large? (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which has a 1/16" wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing for example) 1. Whelean Strobes 2. Duckworks HID lights 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a taxi light) 4. Nav lights 5. Heated Pitot 6. The Kit's stall warning system 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) 8. TruTrak roll servo If you've already done something similar, what is the wire bundle size? Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:09:12 PM PST US From: David Talley Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners --> RV10-List message posted by: David Talley Try the following link (this one works): http://www.milspecproducts.com/ On Oct 4, 2005, at 3:29 PM, Werner Schneider wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: Werner Schneider > > http://www.milspecproducts.com/index.htm > > I'm using them in the Glastar 140 hrs without any problems > > br Werner > > Dave & Brenda Emond wrote: > > >> I recall reading about a quick fastner, one size that fits all. >> You adjust each fastner to suit the depth of the cowl material and >> anchor plate. I can't remember who makes them, or what they are >> called. I need some help???? >> Dave Emond >> #40159 >> Busy on Fuse Kit >> > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:18:21 PM PST US From: James Hein Subject: Re: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! DNA: do not archive Its-Bogus: do not forward to list - No Plain-Text Section --- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:18:51 PM PST US From: "David McNeill" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! One thing to consider; check what happens if you have an electrical fire or smoldering due to a short. Will the conduit give off poisonous fumes and will they get to the cabin? ----- Original Message ----- From: RV Builder (Michael Sausen) To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 1:57 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! Sounds about right. I used thin wall ABS irrigation pipe somewhere around 7/8". Should be pulling all my wires in about 3-4 weeks and I'll know if it's enough then. For me it's: LEFT WING -Nav Ant -Position lights -strobe -Duck HID -pitot heat -TT AP Servo (run separate) -AOA tap (run separate) -Pitot tube (run with AOA tap) RIGHT WING -Nav Ant -MB antenna -Position lights -strobe -Duck HID (maybe) -Trim servo (Run separately) Couple things to note, I ran some of those separate mainly because the existing tooling holes in the ribs made it more convenient and I wouldn't have to tap off the conduit. No stall warning wiring because the AOA is much more accurate as a stall warning device so I didn't install the stall vane. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Flaps do not archive From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US SSA) Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 3:01 PM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! Although it's almost a necessity in parts of the fuselage, you can easily get by with just the snap bushings in the wings. Only thing I did was use the next larger size (625-7 called out, I used 625-8). For those new to the list, also consider that you may have wingtip nav antenna coax (one or both wings), marker beacon antenna coax, and/or the AOA pressure tap lines. My specific configuration included all of the above (navs in both wingtips), Whelen strobe/nav lights, Van's landing lights, heated pitot, standard stall warning and the TruTrak roll servo. Bob #40105 From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 2:29 PM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! I've been trying to decide on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except what size? This stuff all has 1/8" walls, so add 1/4" to the I.D. to get the O.D. But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into trouble? would 3/4" (1.05" O.D) be too large? (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which has a 1/16" wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing for example) 1. Whelean Strobes 2. Duckworks HID lights 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a taxi light) 4. Nav lights 5. Heated Pitot 6. The Kit's stall warning system 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) 8. TruTrak roll servo If you've already done something similar, what is the wire bundle size? Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 04:28:07 PM PST US From: Jim Wade Subject: RE: RV10-List: aileron trim Thanks Michael, will check on the Van's trim option. I still want to look at the aerotrim also, but haven't found it yet. Jim Wade Mississippi -------Original Message------- From: RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Subject: RE: RV10-List: aileron trim Yep, going with the Van's aileron trim option. Don't know if it's on their web page or not, came out the same time as OSH. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Flaps From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Wade Subject: RV10-List: aileron trim Anyone putting aileron trim in?? Does the plane need one? Heard it mentioned a few times. Has anyone tried to attach a Rosen sunvisor to the cabin structure?? I have Rosen's in my T210 and they are great when the sun is bright, also you can move them to the side if needed. Would be a very nice addition with all that glass. Jim Wade 40383 ( no type this time) Slow build everything Fuselage ready to close floors and install panel. Wings ready for top skins. ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 05:42:39 PM PST US From: Sean Stephens Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens Just wanted to double check with someone else that has done the tanks. When I tighten up the drain and the finger strainer, they do not tighten up all the way to the stop nuts. Is that what everyone else is seeing? Thanks, Sean #40303 (tanks finally done!!!!!! after 49 hours of yuk) ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:47:23 PM PST US From: James Ochs Subject: Re: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! --> RV10-List message posted by: James Ochs Won't you have the same problem with the insulation on the wire itself? Short of explosion proof conduit and fittings and connections I don't see how to avoid that particular scenario... James David McNeill wrote: > One thing to consider; check what happens if you have an electrical > fire or smoldering due to a short. Will the conduit give off poisonous > fumes and will they get to the cabin? > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* RV Builder (Michael Sausen) > *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com > *Sent:* Tuesday, October 04, 2005 1:57 PM > *Subject:* RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! > > Sounds about right. I used thin wall ABS irrigation pipe somewhere > around 7/8". Should be pulling all my wires in about 3-4 weeks and > I'll know if it's enough then. For me it's: > LEFT WING > -Nav Ant > -Position lights > -strobe > -Duck HID > -pitot heat > -TT AP Servo (run separate) > -AOA tap (run separate) > -Pitot tube (run with AOA tap) > RIGHT WING > -Nav Ant > -MB antenna > -Position lights > -strobe > -Duck HID (maybe) > -Trim servo (Run separately) > Couple things to note, I ran some of those separate mainly because > the existing tooling holes in the ribs made it more convenient and > I wouldn't have to tap off the conduit. No stall warning wiring > because the AOA is much more accurate as a stall warning device so > I didn't install the stall vane. > Michael Sausen > -10 #352 Flaps > do not archive > > *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of > *Condrey, Bob (US SSA) > *Sent:* Tuesday, October 04, 2005 3:01 PM > *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! > > Although its almost a necessity in parts of the fuselage, you can > easily get by with just the snap bushings in the wings. Only thing > I did was use the next larger size (625-7 called out, I used > 625-8). For those new to the list, also consider that you may have > wingtip nav antenna coax (one or both wings), marker beacon > antenna coax, and/or the AOA pressure tap lines. > > My specific configuration included all of the above (navs in both > wingtips), Whelen strobe/nav lights, Vans landing lights, heated > pitot, standard stall warning and the TruTrak roll servo. > > Bob #40105 > > > *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *James > Hein > *Sent:* Tuesday, October 04, 2005 2:29 PM > *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! > > I've been trying to decide on what type and size of conduit to > use, and would like suggestions from the group. I would rather not > use Van's conduit because I am not fond of corrugated conduit and > If it it like the stuff I used before on other applications, after > 20 years or so it will disintegrate. > > So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except > what size? This stuff all has 1/8" walls, so add 1/4" to the I.D. > to get the O.D. > > But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into > trouble? would 3/4" (1.05" O.D) be too large? > > (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which > has a 1/16" wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) > > I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing > for example) > 1. Whelean Strobes > 2. Duckworks HID lights > 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a > taxi light) > 4. Nav lights > 5. Heated Pitot > 6. The Kit's stall warning system > 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) > 8. TruTrak roll servo > > If you've already done something similar, what is the wire > *bundle* size? > > Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? > > -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) > > ==================================== > ==================================== > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 07:04:45 PM PST US From: "John Mcmahon" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners Skybolt Fastners ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave & Brenda Emond To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 2:23 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners I recall reading about a quick fastner, one size that fits all. You adjust each fastner to suit the depth of the cowl material and anchor plate. I can't remember who makes them, or what they are called. I need some help???? Dave Emond #40159 Busy on Fuse Kit ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 07:30:41 PM PST US From: "Chris" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer --> RV10-List message posted by: "Chris" I believe they are pipe threads. -Chris L 40072 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sean Stephens" Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer > --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens > > Just wanted to double check with someone else that has done the tanks. > > When I tighten up the drain and the finger strainer, they do not tighten > up all the way to the stop nuts. Is that what everyone else is seeing? > > Thanks, > > Sean #40303 (tanks finally done!!!!!! after 49 hours of yuk) > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 07:41:42 PM PST US From: LarryRosen@comcast.net Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! Bob #40105 Are you able to fit all the wires through the 625-8 snap bushings? What size wire did you use for the services? Someone asked what size holes can be drilled in the ribs. Vans does have a positon on this. You can see it here and select Routing of wires and tubes in the Wing. The main wire routing hole can be able to be drilled out to 3/4" and use a SB750-10 bushing wiht a 5/8" ID. Larry Rosen 40356 N205EN (reserved) From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_16939_1128479856_1 Although it's almost a necessity in parts of the fuselage, you can easily get by with just the snap bushings in the wings. Only thing I did was use the next larger size (625-7 called out, I used 625-8). For those new to the list, also consider that you may have wingtip nav antenna coax (one or both wings), marker beacon antenna coax, and/or the AOA pressure tap lines. My specific configuration included all of the above (navs in both wingtips), Whelen strobe/nav lights, Van's landing lights, heated pitot, standard stall warning and the TruTrak roll servo. Bob #40105 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein Subject: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! I've been trying to decide on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except what size? This stuff all has 1/8" walls, so add 1/4" to the I.D. to get the O.D. But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into trouble? would 3/4" (1.05" O.D) be too large? (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which has a 1/16" wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing for example) 1. Whelean Strobes 2. Duckworks HID lights 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a taxi light) 4. Nav lights 5. Heated Pitot 6. The Kit's stall warning system 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) 8. TruTrak roll servo If you've already done something similar, what is the wire bundle size? Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) to and --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_16939_1128479856_1 Although its almost a necessity in parts of the fuselage, you can easily get by with just the snap bushings in the wings. Only thing I did was use the next larger size (625-7 called out, I used 625-8). For those new to the list, also consider that you may have wingtip nav antenna coax (one or both wings), marker beacon antenna coax, and/or the AOA pressure tap lines. My specific configuration included all of the above (navs in both wingtips), Whelen strobe/nav lights, Vans landing lights, heated pitot, standard stall warning and the TruTrak roll servo. Bob #40105 From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein 2:29 PM Subject: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions!

I've been trying to decide on what type and size of conduit to use, and would like suggestions from the group. I would rather not use Van's conduit because I am not fond of corrugated conduit and If it it like the stuff I used before on other applications, after 20 years or so it will disintegrate. So, I'm thinking of PVC electrical conduit. So far so good, except what size? This stuff all has 1/8 walls, so add 1/4 to the I.D. to get the O.D. But, how far can I enlarge the rib holes before I get into trouble? would 3/4 (1.05 O.D) be too large? (I did look at Teflon conduit/tubing, from McMaster-Carr, which has a 1/16 wall, but it's $5 per foot! Ouch!) I plan on having the following installed in the wings (left wing for example) 1. Whelean Strobes 2. Duckworks HID lights 3. Van's Landing Light (yep, both; Van's tip light to be used as a taxi light) 4. Nav lights 5. Heated Pitot 6. The Kit's stall warning system 7. Facet Fuel pump for tip tank transfer (3amp) 8. TruTrak roll servo If you've already done something similar, what is the wire bundle size? Decisions, Decisions... What have I gotten myself into? -Jim 40384 (Still deburring the wing ribs..) --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_16939_1128479856_1-- ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:12:10 PM PST US From: "JOHN STARN" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer <4343214C.50203@cox.net> <007301c5c954$bf718190$0201a8c0@toast> --> RV10-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" Both the male & female "pipe" threads are tapered. IF it had tighten up to the tank nut something was wrong. Either they are not matching threads (pipe vs tube) or overtightened. Do not overtighten them. KABONG N561FS HRII. (GBA & GWB) Do Not Archive. PS: ANY form of pipe/thread dope/lube goes on the MALE side ONLY. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Chris" > > I believe they are pipe threads. -Chris L > 40072 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sean Stephens" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 8:41 PM > Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer > > >> --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens >> >> Just wanted to double check with someone else that has done the tanks. >> >> When I tighten up the drain and the finger strainer, they do not tighten >> up all the way to the stop nuts. Is that what everyone else is seeing? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Sean #40303 (tanks finally done!!!!!! after 49 hours of yuk) ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 08:29:22 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" --> RV10-List message posted by: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" All are through the bushings except for the TT roll servo which goes through the same holes that the pitot lines uses on the other wing. I can get details of the wire sizes tomorrow PM but they were sized to keep the voltage drop to less than .5 volts with a min size of #22. Antennas are all RG-400. AOA lines run through bushings with the wires. Bob -------------------------- Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com Subject: RE: RV10-List: Conduit, Wires, Decisions! Bob #40105 Are you able to fit all the wires through the 625-8 snap bushings? What size wire did you use for the services? Someone asked what size holes can be drilled in the ribs. Vans does have a positon on this. You can see it here and select Routing of wires and tubes in the Wing. The main wire routing hole can be able to be drilled out to 3/4" and use a SB750-10 bushing wiht a 5/8" ID. Larry Rosen 40356 N205EN (reserved) ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 08:29:36 PM PST US From: Rick Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer --> RV10-List message posted by: Rick Sean, They are NPT or National Pipe Thread. This type of thread is tapered and the more you tighten it the further and tighter it gets until you give up or it strips out. Put some fuel lube on the male part of the threads, a little goes a long way. Snug up the inner fitting first then while holding the inner fitting tighten the outer. During your leak checks you can snug these fittings until any leaks stop if you find any. I suggest for now you apply a little lube and just hand tighten until final assembly. Then tighten all the fittings. My plan is to put some fuel in the tanks and flush them a bit prior to connecting them to the fuselage feeds. Then pull the drains and get rid of the excess fuel and reinstall them. At this stage just put,em back into the holes for storage and contamination prevention. Rick S. 40185 Fuselage ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 09:16:15 PM PST US From: Sean Stephens Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Drain And Finger Strainer --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens Thanks all for the replies. I did it right then. I put a bit of ez-turn on them and snugged them up good. Thanks again for the confirmation. -Sean do not archive Rick wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: Rick > > Sean, > > They are NPT or National Pipe Thread. This type of thread is tapered and the more you tighten it the further and tighter it gets until you give up or it strips out. Put some fuel lube on the male part of the threads, a little goes a long way. Snug up the inner fitting first then while holding the inner fitting tighten the outer. During your leak checks you can snug these fittings until any leaks stop if you find any. I suggest for now you apply a little lube and just hand tighten until final assembly. Then tighten all the fittings. My plan is to put some fuel in the tanks and flush them a bit prior to connecting them to the fuselage feeds. Then pull the drains and get rid of the excess fuel and reinstall them. At this stage just put,em back into the holes for storage and contamination prevention. > > Rick S. > 40185 > Fuselage > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 09:55:43 PM PST US From: Werner Schneider Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Cowling Quick Fastners --> RV10-List message posted by: Werner Schneider seems the link had changed, here directly to the item you're looking at: http://www.milspecproducts.com/245213info.htm and the pricing: http://www.milspecproducts.com/c-lockprice.htm they seem to be a tad cheaper then skybolt (but look the same) Werner Werner Schneider wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: Werner Schneider > > http://www.milspecproducts.com/index.htm > > I'm using them in the Glastar 140 hrs without any problems > > br Werner > > Dave & Brenda Emond wrote: > >> I recall reading about a quick fastner, one size that fits all. You >> adjust each fastner to suit the depth of the cowl material and anchor >> plate. I can't remember who makes them, or what they are called. I >> need some help???? >> >> Dave Emond >> >> #40159 >> Busy on Fuse Kit > >