Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:23 AM - Retractable (Paul Walter)
2. 03:44 AM - New Service Letter for -10 (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
3. 03:44 AM - Re: Engine limts (Rob Kermanj)
4. 04:11 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Olson)
5. 04:36 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
6. 04:54 AM - Re: Retractable (GRANSCOTT@AOL.COM)
7. 05:53 AM - Re: Retractable (David McNeill)
8. 06:11 AM - Re: Retractable (Indran Chelvanayagam)
9. 06:40 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Olson)
10. 06:56 AM - Re: Retractable (Deems Davis)
11. 07:13 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
12. 07:47 AM - Re: Retractable (Chris W)
13. 09:05 AM - Re: Retractable (Indran Chelvanayagam)
14. 09:29 AM - Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Jon Reining)
15. 09:34 AM - Re: Re: Retractable ()
16. 10:07 AM - Re: Re: Retractable (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
17. 10:32 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Olson)
18. 10:38 AM - Re: Re: Retractable (John Jessen)
19. 10:49 AM - Brake master cylinders (pilotdds@aol.com)
20. 10:54 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (John Jessen)
21. 11:00 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
22. 11:04 AM - Re: Retractable (Lloyd, Daniel R.)
23. 11:17 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
24. 11:23 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Dj Merrill)
25. 11:27 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (Albert Gardner)
26. 11:39 AM - Re: Retractable (Mark Grieve)
27. 11:44 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
28. 11:49 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Deems Davis)
29. 12:09 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
30. 12:38 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Tim Olson)
31. 12:40 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Tim Olson)
32. 12:47 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (David McNeill)
33. 01:00 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance - pilot account (Eric Panning)
34. 01:36 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (linn Walters)
35. 02:00 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (Chris , Susie Darcy)
36. 02:10 PM - Re: Re: Retractable ()
37. 02:11 PM - test (Chris , Susie Darcy)
38. 02:30 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (LIKE2LOOP@aol.com)
39. 03:01 PM - Re: Retractable (Kelly McMullen)
40. 06:24 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (Jack Sargeant)
Message 1
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In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to adapt
a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how far
into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
Paul Walter
Message 2
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| Subject: | New Service Letter for -10 |
Any one notice this? http://www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/rv10_spur_gear.pdf
Not really a SL, just another oops/fyi.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
Recent RV-10 Build Activity
<http://www.mykitlog.com/display_project.php?project_id=22>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Engine limts |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10@gmail.com>
Thank you Robert. This will do fine.
Do not archive.
On 5/23/06, Robert G. Wright <armywrights@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
>
> From http://rvimg.com/tcds/ lycoming-io-540.pdf:
>
>
> Oil:------------ - --------------------Maximum -----Minimum
>
> Normal operation ---------------------95 p.s.i. ---55 p.s.i.
>
> Idling ------------------------- --------# ---------25 p.s.i.
>
> Starting, warm-up, Taxi and Take off: 115 p.s.i. -----#
>
> "#" indicates does not apply
>
>
> IO-540-D4A5--- p.s.i. at inlet to fuel injector ----Max. Injector
>
> ----------- Maximum ---Minimum --Minimum Idle----- -in Idle cutoff
>
>
> ------------- 45 ---------14 ---------12 ----------------55
>
>
> II. MODELS: IO-540-
>
> IO-540
>
> -D4A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4B5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4C5,
>
> -N1A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -R1A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4A5
>
>
> -
>
> -
>
> AEIO-540-
>
>
> -
>
> -D4A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4B5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4C5
>
>
> -
>
> -D4D5
>
>
> Type
>
> - -
>
>
> Rating
>
> 260-2700
>
>
> Takeoff and maximum continuous
>
>
> hp., rpm, full throttle at:
>
>
> sea level pressure altitude
>
>
> NOTE 1. Temperature Limits (Maximum permissible):
>
> Cylinder head (well type thermocouple) 500F
>
> Cylinder base 325F Cylinder base temperature limits are not applicable to
> engine models which
>
> incorporate internal piston cooling oil jets.
>
> Oil inlet 245F
>
>
> NOTE 9. For all models - ignition and center of gravity:
>
>
> C.G. location (dry with starter and generator installed)
>
>
> Models
>
> ------------------ Ignition, dual* +
>
> From front face of
>
> propeller mounting
>
> flange (in.)
>
> Off prop. shaft C.L. (in.)
>
> Vertical----------- -Lateral
>
>
> IO-540
>
>
> -D4A5
>
> TCM S6LN-200, S6LN-204
>
> -------------------- ----- 18.16
>
> 1.15 below
>
> 0.21 left
>
>
> I couldn't find a good source for a parallel valve engine, but Lycoming
> shows that for a K series (300 HP) motor, oil temps should be between 165F
> and 220F, whatever the Celsius equivalent is.
>
>
> Hopefully that will get you started.
>
>
> Rob Wright
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Rob Kermanj
> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 5:35 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Engine limts
>
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10@gmail.com>
>
>
> Good catch Robert!- I want the recommended D4A5 data.- I really appreciate
> it.
>
>
> Do not archive.
>
>
> On 5/21/06, Robert G. Wright <armywrights@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Robert G. Wright"
> <armywrights@adelphia.net>
>
> >
>
> > Before I go digging, want to make sure you want the A4D5, not the
>
> > recommended D4A5.
>
> >
>
> > Rob Wright
>
> >
>
> > -----Original Message-----
>
> > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>
> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf
> Of Rob Kermanj
>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 6:37 PM
>
> > To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>
> > Subject: RV10-List: Engine limts
>
> >
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10@gmail.com>
>
> >
>
> > I wonder if someone could send me the engine operating limits (RPM,
>
> > Oil Press, Temp, etc.) for for an IO540 A4D5?- Thanks.
>
> >
>
> > Do not archive
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
>
> -
>
> -
>
> -
>
>
Message 4
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--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to adapt
> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how far
> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
Message 5
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If retractable gear is so great, how come all Cirrus airplanes and all
Columbias (no slouches in performance) are fixed gear?
TDT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Tim Olson
Sent: Tue 5/23/2006 7:10 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to
adapt
> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how
far
> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
========================
=========
========================
=========
========================
=========
========================
=========
Message 6
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In a message dated 5/23/06 7:14:06 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
Tim@MyRV10.com writes:
If someone wants a retract,
Tim,
If one wanted to do this in the US, I think one might want to touch base
with an insurance agent to get an idea how much a jury rigged undercarriage
would increase your insurance cost...bet it would come close to doubling or more
rate increase over your normal rate with fixed gear.
Certainly the Bo, Commander, Mooney are good choices in single fan retract
GA area but if one wants a retract kit rather than jury rig an RV, it seems to
make more sense to buy a retract experimental with some experience...Lance,
(Wheeler) Express or the Raven kit. The Raven while a home built is based on
a former production aircraft (Piper Comanche); so it has some similarity to
a production product, this may or may not make any difference in your rates,
though.
Patrick
do not archive
Message 7
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--> RV10-List message posted by: "David McNeill" <dlm46007@cox.net>
Having owned a Cardinal RG for 28 years and 2500 hours I agree with Tim.
Never landed gear up but did have several XCs home with the gear left down
so maintenance could be done at home. Retractable gear benefits are a wash
for the increased maintenance and insurance costs and my gear version was
the final engineering level for the aircraft. A far more beneficial (again
with tradeoffs) was the turbonormalization. Fortunately the 10 is so over
powered by FAR standards that it will not be needed.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@avidyne.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:34 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Retractable
If retractable gear is so great, how come all Cirrus airplanes and all
Columbias (no slouches in performance) are fixed gear?
TDT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Tim Olson
Sent: Tue 5/23/2006 7:10 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to
adapt
> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how
far
> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
==========================================
Message 8
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Paul, do you have the website of the alleged Western Australian RV-10 RG
builder? I'm only aware of 5 kits (with one flying) in this state.
Indran Chelvanayagam
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Walter
Sent: Tuesday, 23 May 2006 3:22 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Retractable
Message 9
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--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Yeah, I didn't even mention the insurance, but it's significant.
When the rates got jacked up about 6 years ago, I remember
retracts were an extreme amount higher than fixed gear.
My guess is you'd be facing at least $2000-3000/year more
in our market if it was retractable.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
GRANSCOTT@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 5/23/06 7:14:06 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> Tim@MyRV10.com writes:
>
> < FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=Arial
> color=#000000 size =2>If someone wants a retract,
>
> Tim,
>
> If one wanted to do this in the US, I think one might want to touch base
> with an insurance agent to get an idea how much a jury rigge d
> undercarriage would increase your insurance cost...bet it would come
> close t o doubling or more rate increase over your normal rate with
> fixed gear.
>
> Certainly the Bo, Commander, Mooney are good choices in single
> fan retract GA area but if one wants a retract kit rather than jury rig
> an RV, it seems to make more sense to buy a retract experimental with
> some experience...Lance, (Wheeler) Express or the Raven kit. The Raven
> while a home built is based on a former production aircraft (Piper
> Comanche) ; so it has some similarity to a production product, this may
> or may not make any difference in your rates, though.
>
> Patrick
>
> do not archive
Message 10
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--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I'm suspicious of this rumor. The Lancair IV landing gear is a huge box
structure that would not fit into the RV10 fuse (unless you built on an
additional drag producing box-like structure on the bottom of the fuse
to house it (what's the point?) The 360/Legend gear would require being
mounted into the wing structure with several ribs removed/reengineered.
Then there's the mater of the nose gear, where would you stow it? Not to
mention the significant change that this would produce in the locations
of the wheels and the rotation moments for landing/takeoff and the
almost total rework of the engine mount, exhaust, and induction. There
are better solutions for an RG than the -10.
Deems Davis # 406
Fuse
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 11
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--> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
Taildragger retract . . .
TDT
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 9:53 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I'm suspicious of this rumor. The Lancair IV landing gear is a huge box
structure that would not fit into the RV10 fuse (unless you built on an
additional drag producing box-like structure on the bottom of the fuse
to house it (what's the point?) The 360/Legend gear would require being
mounted into the wing structure with several ribs removed/reengineered.
Then there's the mater of the nose gear, where would you stow it? Not to
mention the significant change that this would produce in the locations
of the wheels and the rotation moments for landing/takeoff and the
almost total rework of the engine mount, exhaust, and induction. There
are better solutions for an RG than the -10.
Deems Davis # 406
Fuse
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 12
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--> RV10-List message posted by: Chris W <3edcft6@cox.net>
It's my understanding that in a 200 mph airplane, if you can do retracts
with out adding too much weight, the best you are going to see is 15
knots. From what I have heard, you are very lucky to get that. It
seems until you have a plane that files closer to 300 mph, retracts
aren't worth the trouble.
--
Chris W
KE5GIX
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Message 13
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--> RV10-List message posted by: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva@netspace.net.au>
Paul - any chance of pointing us to the website you mentioned? As far as I'm
aware, there are only 5 RV10 kits (one flying) in Western Australia. Would
be good to contact another builder, especially if he's making serious mods.
Might also be able to post some photos on the list!
Indran Chelvanayagam
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to
> adapt a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure
> how far into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he
> should be able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any
> thoughts ?. As for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
Message 14
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| Subject: | Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining" <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his Cherokee
180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the beach at Alfonsina's
to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is just south of San Felipe
on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt strip paralleling the beach, great
relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our weather briefing.
It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay Area, and we'd probably
have to file on the way home depending on how it looked. About 75-80 miles
out, we could see buildup over the hills, called up flight service and got a
weather briefing, didn't look all too bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so
we filed IFR, received our pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon
in IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm
and encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then quickly
snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees
at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all over the place. This
lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and
maneuver to the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a great job and instinctively
reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was only +2C outside and raining but
no sign of icing), and did a great job getting us out of there. It was a really
tough spot, one that I hope to never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced
that the weather capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the capabilities
of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In other words, if ATC
can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is available to us so that
we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant on air traffic control's weather
radar? Would we still get weather in the cockpit if their's is out? Since
there was no lightning that I could see or hear, would a strike finder have
detected that? Short of an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were
planning on going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would
be nice to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like.
Can XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just showed up
(and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
Message 15
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--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a gear handle
on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the lights indicate gear
position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend they are up (or down).
Jim Combs
Do Not Archive
==========================================================
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time over the
life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and building time that could
be spent either flying or with the family or both? Not for me. Also, one
of the nicest things about the -10 is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast
without the many maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system
that will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If someone wants
a retract, they should consider actually building a retractible kit that was
designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane.
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that
make little sense for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and
yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Message 16
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--> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the
rush of disturbed air . . .
TDT
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
jim@combsfive.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend
they are up (or down).
Jim Combs
Do Not Archive
=========================================================
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that
you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Message 17
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|
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
If you can add engine noises, it could be something you
sell to current non-flying builders. They they won't
wear out their lips making the engine noises themselves
when they sit in their half-built planes. Then,
add a small vibrator from an old reclining chair...
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
> audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the
> rush of disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
> gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
> lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend
> they are up (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> ========================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
> over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
> building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
> both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that
> you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
> hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
> MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
> someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
> retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
> which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
> homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
> for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
> still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 18
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--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Tim, could you also add an intermittent, random failure of one of the
indicator lights, just for yucks! Would appreciate it. I miss suspense of
seeing 3-green.
John J
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim
Dawson-Townsend
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 10:05 AM
Subject: RE: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend"
--> <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the audio
system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the rush of
disturbed air . . .
TDT
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jim@combsfive.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a gear
handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the lights
indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend they are up
(or down).
Jim Combs
Do Not Archive
========================================================
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time over
the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and building time
that could be spent either flying or with the family or both? Not for me.
Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that you can own it and fly
reasonably fast without the many maintenance hassles that can come up with a
retract system that will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along
the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If someone
wants a retract, they should consider actually building a retractible kit
that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza, which would be an
awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the
ability to do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Message 19
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| Subject: | Brake master cylinders |
Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there should be
some sort of external return spring around the actuating shafts.I notice some
dragging when towing.
Message 20
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| Subject: | Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
My oh my oh my! Thank you for sharing this and thank goodness you got down
and safely so. I, too, am ready to spend whatever big bucks is required for
at least XM weather and some form of traffic / terrain. Am going to be very
interested in this thread.
John J
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the beach at
Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is just south of
San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt strip paralleling the
beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our weather
briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay Area, and we'd
probably have to file on the way home depending on how it looked. About
75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills, called up flight
service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too bad, but we couldn't
make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our pop-up, and were headed in at
8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of
a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and encountered severe turblance and very
near loss of control of the airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45
degrees to the right, then quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our
maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and
altitude were all over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC
gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was only
+2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job getting
us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to never be in
again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather capabilities of his
radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant on
air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in the
cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I could see or
hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of an on-board radar,
what are our options? Also, we were planning on going with the Chelton's
and I can definately see how that would be nice to know, even if its
synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM weather be displayed
on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
Message 21
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| Subject: | Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like
XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather isn't
real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good
trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other hand will
show you current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with
severe convective activity.
I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
========================
=========
========================
=========
========================
=========
========================
=========
Message 22
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|
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR@wernerco.com>
But for the retract, you would have to have the bass box to simulate the
thump from the door going up and closing!
Dan
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 1:31 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
If you can add engine noises, it could be something you
sell to current non-flying builders. They they won't
wear out their lips making the engine noises themselves
when they sit in their half-built planes. Then,
add a small vibrator from an old reclining chair...
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend"
<Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
> audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and
the
> rush of disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
> gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
> lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just
pretend
> they are up (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> =======================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
> over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
> building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
> both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is
that
> you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
> hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
> MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
> someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
> retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
> which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
> homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
> for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
> still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Weather capabilities and severe turbulence |
Y'all didn't hear it from me, but look for a new lightning/convective
activity sensor better than the 1980's-technology WX-500 coming fairly
soon to a dealer near you . . .
TDT
40025
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder
(Michael Sausen)
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 2:00 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
st-server@matronics.com <ailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com> ]
On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
<ttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
http://www.matronic ======== & Matronics
Email List ;
& --> <ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>
http://www.matronics.com/c ==============BR>
<ttp://www.matronics.com/contribution>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Dj Merrill <deej@deej.net>
>
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel.
> In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble,
> what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather
> dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get
> weather
>
You may consider looking into ADS-B. It does not cover all of the
US yet, but
it will over the next several years. Up front equipment costs, but no
monthly or other
subscription fees for traffic and weather information. The equipment is
really expensive
right now, but I hope it comes down by the time I need to buy to install.
http://www.adsb.gov/
http://www.ads-b.com/
-Dj
Message 25
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| Subject: | Weather capabilities and severe turbulence |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud@adelphia.net>
Although I learned to fly in Idaho where there was weather as well as high
terrain now almost all my flying is in the Southwest except for occasional
trips North. A trip from Reno to Yuma last Wed. afternoon (trying to get
home before the Presidential TFR Thursday) had me dodging much weather. My
Anywhere Map with XM weather worked very well. You can select various
weather displays but Nexrad, TAFS, and winds aloft are very useful in
flight. One very nice feature of ControlVisions's Anywhere Map is that the
cost of monthly updates is much less than most others and it does a good job
of driving my Navaid. The display is small but I mounted it on the side
instead of on the panel. For about $2K it's more than adequate for VFR
flying.
Albert Gardner
40-422
Yuma, AZ
Message 26
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--> RV10-List message posted by: Mark Grieve <mark@macomb.com>
I helped Van attach the wings to his sailplane one day and observed a
gear light on the dash. I asked if the flight engineer was supposed to
report "One Green" during the landing checklist.
Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
> audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the
> rush of disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
> gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
> lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend
> they are up (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> ========================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
> over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
> building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
> both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that
> you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
> hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
> MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
> someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
> retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
> which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
> homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
> for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
> still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Weather capabilities and severe turbulence |
(read in your best infomercial voice) And what would be the
approximate cost of such a wonderful new technology?
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
Recent RV-10 Build Activity
<http://www.mykitlog.com/display_project.php?project_id=22>
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim
Dawson-Townsend
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 1:17 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
Y'all didn't hear it from me, but look for a new lightning/convective
activity sensor better than the 1980's-technology WX-500 coming fairly
soon to a dealer near you . . .
TDT
40025
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder
(Michael Sausen)
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 2:00 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to avoid
unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like XM,
and also/or a Stormscope.? Remember that datalinked weather isn't real
time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good trend
and near real time weather.? Stormscopes on the other hand will show you
current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with severe
convective activity.
I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
http://www.matronic ===nbsp; & nbsp; & Matronics Email
List ; & amp; --> http://www.matronics.com/c
=====R>
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I flew with a Strikefinder in my B55 Baron's and they were VERY
effective in identifying thunderstorms, and much less expensive. I also
had onboard radar on one of them, and I preferred the Strikefinder data,
(The radar is sometimes dificult to interpret if you don't fly it
regularly (my case).
Deems Davis # 406
Fuse
http://deemsrv10.com/
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
> Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
> avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service
> like XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather
> isn't real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give
> you good trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other
> hand will show you current lightning which is almost always hand in
> hand with severe convective activity.
>
> I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS
> but it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment
> to make sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
>
>
> Michael Sausen
> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
> Do Not Archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of Jon Reining
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
> --> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>
> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in
> his Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on
> the beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's
> is just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
> strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>
> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
> Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how
> it looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the
> hills, called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't
> look all too bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR,
> received our pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in
> IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a
> thunderstorm and encountered severe turblance and very near loss of
> control of the airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees
> to the right, then quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our
> maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude
> and altitude were all over the place. This lasted for a full two
> minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to
> the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a !
> great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it
> was only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a
> great job getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one
> that I hope to never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced
> that the weather capabilities of his radar were down.
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel.
> In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble,
> what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather
> dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get
> weather in the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no
> lightning that I could see or hear, would a strike finder have
> detected that? Short of an on-board radar, what are our options?
> Also, we were planning on going with the Chelton's and I can
> definately see how that would be nice to know, even if its synthetic
> vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM weather be displayed on
> the Chelton?
>
> Jon Reining
> 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
> showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
>
>
> *http://www.matronic ======================== & Matronics
> Email List ; & -->
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.matronics.com/c
> =======================================
>
>
> *
>
>
> * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>
Message 29
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| Subject: | Weather capabilities and severe turbulence |
Heh, heh. That's not my department . . . but I think it will be priced
relatively aggressively for market penetration . . .
TDT
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder
(Michael Sausen)
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 2:44 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
From:
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
http://www.matronic =nbsp; & nbsp; & Matronics Email List ;
& amp; amp; --> http://www.matronics.com/c ==>
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Jon,
That's quite a story! Glad it all ended well for you.
You should feel comforted.... With the Chelton system,
you can currently get WSI, but I'm guessing a bit
later this year you'd be able to get XM. Both are
satellite based systems that have no ties to ATC.
WSI weather is actually what FSS uses themselves,
from what I've been told. With various packages,
you can have TFR's, lightning strikes, Nexrad,
and all the goodies you're looking for, and they are
very nicely used on the Chelton, because they'll
automatically overlay many functions right on your
main map page, or you can get a larger picture on a
zoom and pan-able page. So I think you'll be very
pleased.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Jon Reining wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>
> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in
> his Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on
> the beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's
> is just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500'
> dirt strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>
> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
> Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how
> it looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the
> hills, called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't
> look all too bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR,
> received our pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in
> IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a
> thunderstorm and encountered severe turblance and very near loss of
> control of the airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees
> to the right, then quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our
> maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at one point. Our
> attitude and altitude were all over the place. This lasted for a
> full two minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and
> maneuver to the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a ! great job and
> instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was only +2C
> outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
> getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope
> to never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the
> weather capabilities of his radar were down.
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel.
> In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble,
> what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather
> dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get
> weather in the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no
> lightning that I could see or hear, would a strike finder have
> detected that? Short of an on-board radar, what are our options?
> Also, we were planning on going with the Chelton's and I can
> definately see how that would be nice to know, even if its synthetic
> vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM weather be displayed on
> the Chelton?
>
> Jon Reining 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings
> and fuse just showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
>
>
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
I forgot to mention.... Jon, if you're not happy enough with
just Nexrad and strikes shown by XM/WSI, the Chelton will
also integrate to the WX-500 stormscope, so you can have that
too, on it's own dedicated page.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
> Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
> avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like
> XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather isn't
> real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good
> trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other hand will
> show you current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with
> severe convective activity.
>
> I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
> it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
> sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
>
>
> Michael Sausen
> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
> Do Not Archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of Jon Reining
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
> --> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>
> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
> Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
> beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
> just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
> strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>
> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
> Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
> looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
> called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
> bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
> pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
> pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
> encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
> airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
> quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
> probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
> over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
> clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
> CFI/CFII, did a !
> great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
> only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
> getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
> never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
> capabilities of his radar were down.
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
> other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
> available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
> on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
> the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
> could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
> an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
> going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
> to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
> XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
>
> Jon Reining
> 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
> showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
>
>
>
> *http://www.matronic ======================== & Matronics
> Email List ; & -->
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.matronics.com/c
> =======================================
>
>
>
>
> *
>
>
>
> * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>
Message 32
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|
| Subject: | Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "David McNeill" <dlm46007@cox.net>
Have 15 years using a Strikefinder and found them to be very helpful in
avoiding the bad stuff (turbulence and hail) Came through an area IMC at
5000 near Cross City Florida where there were no strikes and had a smooth
ride with moderate to very heavy rain. The airplane was leaking around the
doors. When I popped into blue sky I looked back and asked myself "Did I
come through that" a cliff of clouds with tops to FL400. At least in my book
the game is stay away from the strikes.
For the 10 I considered the Strikefinder but have delayed purchase and am
now experimenting with XM weather and Truemap software in my Glastar. I will
know more about using XM after the OSH trip and then perhaps can make an
informed decision on Strikefinder (cost $5000) or XM weather (monthly
charges forever).
----- Original Message -----
From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis@cox.net>
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
>
> I flew with a Strikefinder in my B55 Baron's and they were VERY effective
> in identifying thunderstorms, and much less expensive. I also had onboard
> radar on one of them, and I preferred the Strikefinder data, (The radar is
> sometimes dificult to interpret if you don't fly it regularly (my case).
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> Fuse
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
> RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
>
>> Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
>> avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like
>> XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather isn't
>> real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good
>> trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other hand will
>> show you current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with
>> severe convective activity.
>>
>> I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
>> it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
>> sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
>>
>>
>> Michael Sausen
>> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
>> Do Not Archive
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
>> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>] On
>> Behalf Of Jon Reining
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
>>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
>> --> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>>
>> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
>> Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the beach
>> at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is just south
>> of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt strip
>> paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>>
>> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
>> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay Area,
>> and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
>> looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
>> called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
>> bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our pop-up,
>> and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal, pretty
>> easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and encountered
>> severe turblance and very near loss of control of the airplane. We would
>> be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then quickly snapped to
>> 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at
>> one point. Our attitude and altitude were all over the place. This
>> lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000'
>> and maneuver to the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a !
>> great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
>> only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
>> getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
>> never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
>> capabilities of his radar were down.
>> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
>> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
>> other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
>> available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
>> on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
>> the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I could
>> see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of an
>> on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on going
>> with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice to
>> know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM
>> weather be displayed on the Chelton?
>>
>> Jon Reining
>> 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
>> showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
>> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
>>
>>
>>
>> *http://www.matronic ======================== & Matronics
>> Email List ; & -->
>> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.matronics.com/c
>> ======================================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>>
>> * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
>
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance - pilot account |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Eric Panning <ericmpmail-rv10@yahoo.com>
The pilot also had a write up on the Cherokee Chat
board:
"This weekend I flew my plane with a couple of friends
down to Alfonsina's for a batchelor party weekend. We
left OAK Thursday night, overnighted in Calexico and
made it to Alfonsina's by noon on Friday. We spent
that afternoon, and all day Saturday fishing, playing
in the beautiful warm water, eating great food and
consuming mass quantities of ice cold beer.
We were in the air at 8 AM this morning and screamed
back up to the border with the help of a 15-20 Kt
tailwind. After breakfast and a weather brief at
Calexico, we launched into uncertain conditions over
Southern California, the High Desert and the Central
Valley. A late season storm was approaching from the
southwest, very moist and unstable, with winds aloft
from the south at 25-50 Kts. Things were actually
quite doable over Southern California, and I was
enjoying the 30 Kt push towards home. We were able to
punch through a line of showers NW of Bakersfield
while maintaining VFR, but there was another band of
precip that was plopped over the last 100 miles of the
route. FSS advised me that there were multiple layers
from 2000 to FL200, light scattered rain showers and
the freezing level was around 9000 ft. Pilot reports
weren't indicating anything too scary, and most of the
reports were light rime icing at 12000 Ft.
Since I didn't want to scud-run into OAK, I filed in
the air and got direct Panoche VOR, direct OAK at
8000. Easy, straightworward, straight-in to the ILS
for 27R. We went into the goo about 25-30 miles south
of Panoche, and I was enjoying the challenge of
hand-flying my plane in real IFR, with the temps about
2 C. Things were going along just fine until we were
about 20 miles northwest of Panoche on V-301, when it
was as if somebody had turned on a blender and we were
in it! The instrument panel was an incomprehensible
blur. It was the most severe turbulence I've ever been
in, and we were in solid IMC. We must have flown into
an imbedded thunderstorm, and Center didn't have it on
their radar. I could barely control the plane. I
immediately informed Center of the situation and they
gave me a turn to the North and a descent to 6000 ft.
I fought with the plane to maintain control, just to
keep the wings somewhere near level and the airspeed
in the green while descending towards the Central
Valley and lower terrain. I kept telling myself not to
give up... Just fly the plane. It took me about 2 or 3
minutes to get down to 6000, but we were still in IMC,
though the turbulence had eased a bit. We were cleared
to 4000, and began to descend again. At 5500 I was
head down, on the gages when by friend Jon called
ground in sight, and at 4900 we were completely clear
of the base of a very angry-looking black cloud mass.
I told Center we were clear and he immediately issued
an Airmet for severe turbulence in the area, and began
deviating 3 other aircraft that were in-trail around
the area I encountered the turbulence. At that point I
heard him mention something about their weather radar
capability being INOP at the time... So I guess that
made me the canary in the coal mine.
Anyway, we made it into OAK with little fuss after
dodging a couple of showers near Livermore. 3 hours
block time CXL to OAK with a little excitement thrown
in for good measure.
Moral of story? No good deed goes unpunished? S#!t
happens? How about "Do not give up on the airplane!"?
Truly, one of the thoughts that went through my mind
as I was struggling to maintain control of the the
plane was "My wife is gonna kill me if I die now and
ruin our Italian vacation plans!"
I'm very happy to be alive, and to be able to write
this down for your perusal. Stay safe."
The Cherokee Board also discussed the XM weather and
the 396. What wasn't clear was if weather was down
locally for ATC or west coast. I use avwx.net on a
blackberry for ground planning and it's Nexrad service
was down on Sunday in the NW. NWS radar was still up
and running (can also download to blackberry). Lot's
of reasons not to rely on ATC for weather - see
www.avweb.com and ATC columns.
Eric
40150
Working on center section of fuselage
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Brake master cylinders |
pilotdds@aol.com wrote:
> Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there
> should be some sort of external return spring around the actuating
> shafts.I notice some dragging when towing.
All disc brakes drag .... just some more than others. As for the
spring, I'd recommend it. It'll surely take off some pressure, and
it'll make bleeding the brakes a lot easier. Doesn't take much piston
travel to shur off the valve.
Linn just my two pennies.
do not archive
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Brake master cylinders |
Not sure what you mean dragging when towing?? There are no external
springs. Check your nut are not to tight on pedal
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: pilotdds@aol.com
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 3:48 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there
should be some sort of external return spring around the actuating
shafts.I notice some dragging when towing.
Message 36
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--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Just think you wouldn't be spending $30+ per hour for fuel either just to land
where you took off from (Most of the time!)
Jim C
Do nOT archive.
.
Message 37
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TEST
do not archive
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Brake master cylinders |
In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time,
pilotdds@aol.com writes:
It seems there should be some sort of external return spring around the
actuating shafts.I notice some dragging when towing.
The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don't spring open, and will
touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are not
turning! As the pads wear, the contact often lightens up when the brakes are
NOT applied. Not a major issue.
Steve
Stephen G. Blank,DDS
RV-10 #40499 Finishing the HS
Cessna 170b Flyer
Port St Lucie, FL
772-475-5556 cell
Message 39
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--> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
Or, you could just buy a 20 yr old Mooney 201, miss all the great
building experience, choice of avionics experience, spend about the
same money, go the same speed, on 2-4gph less(have a 4 cyl engine with
cheaper overhaul) and have real operating gear....oh, and you lose one
cabin door, need ~2000 ft runways instead of 1000 ft and can't climb
as fast..........choices, choices.
Quoting John Jessen <jjessen@rcn.com>:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
>
> Tim, could you also add an intermittent, random failure of one of the
> indicator lights, just for yucks! Would appreciate it. I miss suspense of
> seeing 3-green.
>
> John J
>
> do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim
> Dawson-Townsend
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 10:05 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend"
> --> <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the audio
> system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the rush of
> disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a gear
> handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the lights
> indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend they are up
> (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> =======================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time over
> the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and building time
> that could be spent either flying or with the family or both? Not for me.
> Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that you can own it and fly
> reasonably fast without the many maintenance hassles that can come up with a
> retract system that will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along
> the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If someone
> wants a retract, they should consider actually building a retractible kit
> that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza, which would be an
> awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the
> ability to do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
> sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
Message 40
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| Subject: | Brake master cylinders |
All disc brakes depend on the minute wobble in the rotors to push the pucks
back when released. I've never seen any with return springs, and I don't
think that springs on the master cylinders would help either.
Jack & Cecilia Sargeant
1127 Patricia St.
Wichita, KS 67208-2642
316/682-5268
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of LIKE2LOOP@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:30 PM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, pilotdds
@aol.com writes:
The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don' t spring open, and
will touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the
wheels are not turning! As the pads wear, the contact of ten lightens up
when the brakes are NOT applied. Not a major issue.
Steve
Stephen G. Blank,DDS
RV-10 #40499 &n bsp; Finishing the HS
Cessna 170b Flyer
Port St Lucie, FL
772-475-5556 cell
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