Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:55 AM - Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set (John Jessen)
2. 12:55 AM - Re: Priming in a confined space (John Jessen)
3. 03:05 AM - Re: FLYING!!!! (Jim & Julie Wade)
4. 05:37 AM - Re: Priming in a confined space (Jesse Saint)
5. 05:51 AM - Re: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set (Fixitauto@aol.com)
6. 06:38 AM - Re: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set (jdalton77)
7. 06:54 AM - Re: Swivel Flush set (Paul Grimstad)
8. 07:10 AM - Re: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set (Tim Olson)
9. 07:41 AM - Re: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set (John Gonzalez)
10. 07:41 AM - Re: Priming in a confined space (johngoodman)
11. 09:43 AM - Re: Priming in a confined space ()
12. 12:54 PM - Filler wars - Part I (Deems Davis)
13. 01:22 PM - Re: Filler wars - Part I (Rick)
14. 02:58 PM - Re: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy (Cal Hoffman)
15. 03:16 PM - Hugo Rv10#40456 ()
16. 03:33 PM - Re: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy (BPA)
17. 04:14 PM - Re: Filler wars - Part I (John Dunne)
18. 04:58 PM - Re: MVP-50 Fuel Flow Transducer (W. Curtis)
19. 05:38 PM - Re: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set (bob.kaufmann)
20. 05:51 PM - Direct2 issue (Wayne Edgerton)
21. 06:56 PM - [ John W. Cox ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
22. 06:57 PM - Chelton SV-10 package (Wayne Edgerton)
23. 07:00 PM - Backup Instrumentation (Tim Olson)
24. 07:04 PM - [ Alf Olav Frog / Norway ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
25. 07:08 PM - Re: Direct2 issue (Tim Olson)
26. 07:14 PM - Opinion regarding air vents (Deems Davis)
27. 07:18 PM - Re: Direct2 issue (Mark Ritter)
28. 07:25 PM - Re: Filler wars - Part I (Deems Davis)
29. 07:32 PM - Re: Filler wars - Part I/cabin cover (Chris , Susie Darcy)
30. 07:42 PM - Re: Opinion regarding air vents (Tim Olson)
31. 09:22 PM - Re: Priming in a confined space (John W. Cox)
32. 10:16 PM - Re: Opinion regarding air vents (JSMcGrew@aol.com)
33. 10:42 PM - Re: Direct2 issue (kilopapa@antelecom.net)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
I like 'em because they make bigger smilies. Easier for hanger visitors to
see. And comment on.
John J
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:38 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
Yes, Get one!
Deems Davis # 406
Panel/Finishing
http://deemsrv10.com/
dsyvert@aol.com wrote:
> Does anyone have any expeience with the flush rubber guard swivel
> rivet set? Is it a big improvement?
>
> Thanks
> Dave Syvertson
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> *Check out the new AOL*
>
<http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/1615326657x4311227241x4298082137/aol?redir=ht
tp%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eaol%2Ecom%2Fnewaol>.
> Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access
> to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail
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>
>
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>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Priming in a confined space |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Also, brush-less exhaust fan.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:44 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
Not only the heater but the WATER HEATER if it is in your garage....pilot
light in there and the WHOOSH as it kicks off to reheat may be the last
thing you hear.
Rick S.
40185
-----Original Message-----
>From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>Sent: Oct 2, 2006 4:44 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
>
>--> RV10-List message posted by: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>
>A supplied air respirator makes all the difference in the world. I
>started with a dual carbon filter respirator and for Xmas I got a hobby
>air. The first time I used supplied air I didn't even know there were
>any fumes in the garage. I could not smell a thing. I cannot say the
>same for the carbon filter respirator. A local RV-9 builder uses the
>exhaust from a shop vac (cleaned of course) to supply breathing air,
>and it works well.
>
>I use Tim's method to keep the room safe from an explosion. Heat it
>up, turn off the heater. Paint away with an exhaust fan, and then open
>up the garage doors to let the fumes escape.
>
>Larry Rosen
>#356
>
>Les Kearney wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca>
>>
>> Hi
>> As part of my self education process I have been reading various
>> links for priming info.
>>
>> I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an
>> option I won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing.
>>
>> That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By
>> safely I mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my
>> natural gas garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to
toxic fumes.
>>
>> Inquiring minds need to know ....
>>
>> Les Kearney
>> RV10 Wannabe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 3
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--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwade@msdeltawireless.com>
No Zach, the certified on Van's sell. I don't usually keep planes long, so I build
with the idea I might sell one day, so I go with what I feel will be what
they want. However I have a feeling I will keep this one a lot longer than most.
There is nothing out there at the price that will touch it in speed manuverabilty
and looks.
Jim
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65408#65408
Message 4
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| Subject: | Priming in a confined space |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jesse Saint" <jesse@itecusa.org>
Better yet, just go in there to paint with a lit cigarette and no mask and
get it over with. "Too much hastle, this airplane building stuff!" Just go
out and buy a Cessna. Oh, wait...I mean...OK, go with the other suggestions
after all.
Do not archive.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse@itecusa.org
www.itecusa.org
W: 352-465-4545
C: 352-427-0285
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 3:54 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Also, brush-less exhaust fan.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:44 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
Not only the heater but the WATER HEATER if it is in your garage....pilot
light in there and the WHOOSH as it kicks off to reheat may be the last
thing you hear.
Rick S.
40185
-----Original Message-----
>From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>Sent: Oct 2, 2006 4:44 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
>
>--> RV10-List message posted by: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>
>A supplied air respirator makes all the difference in the world. I
>started with a dual carbon filter respirator and for Xmas I got a hobby
>air. The first time I used supplied air I didn't even know there were
>any fumes in the garage. I could not smell a thing. I cannot say the
>same for the carbon filter respirator. A local RV-9 builder uses the
>exhaust from a shop vac (cleaned of course) to supply breathing air,
>and it works well.
>
>I use Tim's method to keep the room safe from an explosion. Heat it
>up, turn off the heater. Paint away with an exhaust fan, and then open
>up the garage doors to let the fumes escape.
>
>Larry Rosen
>#356
>
>Les Kearney wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca>
>>
>> Hi
>> As part of my self education process I have been reading various
>> links for priming info.
>>
>> I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an
>> option I won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing.
>>
>> That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By
>> safely I mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my
>> natural gas garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to
toxic fumes.
>>
>> Inquiring minds need to know ....
>>
>> Les Kearney
>> RV10 Wannabe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
--
--
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set |
THAT BRINGS UP THE BIG ? JUST HOW MANY RIVETS ARE THERE IN THE AIR PLANE.
I WAS THINKING I COUNTED 18,262 .(OR WAS DAYS IN MY LIFE)
ROGER FITZ
40079
DO NOT ARCHIEVE
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set |
I always so 20,000 when people ask. Sounds impressive.
----- Original Message -----
From: Fixitauto@aol.com
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
THAT BRINGS UP THE BIG ? JUST HOW MANY RIVETS ARE THERE IN THE AIR
PLANE.
I WAS THINKING I COUNTED 18,262 .(OR WAS DAYS IN MY LIFE)
ROGER FITZ
40079
DO NOT ARCHIEVE
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Swivel Flush set |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Paul Grimstad" <bldgrv10450@comcast.net>
Doc
The first thing I did was grind the red rubber head down on my swivel, but
try this tip.
I use 2" clear standard US Postal packaging tape over the head of the rivet
gun.
The tape is tough and lasts a long time. In combination with a strip of the
same tape on the skin, and at times I tape right over the special back rivet
tape. Rivet manufactured heads set down tight and flush. The result is no
marking on the skins when riveting. I remove the tape right away and use a
product called SEM Solve as adhesive remover. There are different qualities
of packaging tape and it's cheap but the postal standard works best and
pulls right off no problem. I know that it all gets covered with paint but I
wish I had used this method when riveting the VS.
Let me know what you think of this method.
Might there be any other little tips or tricks that the list should know
about or try?
Paul Grimstad
RV10 40450 fuselage (refinishing shop floor)
Portland, OR
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com>
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 7:00 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Swivel Flush set
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Fred Williams, M.D."
> <drfred@cox-internet.com>
>
> My 2 cents.
>
> I bought one of the flush sets with the rubber gaurd. Tried it a few
> times, but because I had difficulty compressing the rubber, the
> manufactured head would not sit down flush. Took the rubber ring off and
> have been using it that way since. Didn't think about trimming the rubber
> flush with the head. I like it better overall because it has a larger
> radius than the smaller one that came with my tool kit. The smaller one
> seems to leave a small depression secondary to it's smaller radius curve.
> Dr Fred.
>
> 40515
>
> having fun with proseal
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
At one point, someone said there were over 14,000 in the wings
alone, which was similar to a complete RV-4. So my guess
would be 29,674.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
jdalton77 wrote:
> I always so 20,000 when people ask. Sounds impressive.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Fixitauto@aol.com <mailto:Fixitauto@aol.com>
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com <mailto:rv10-list@matronics.com>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 03, 2006 8:51 AM
> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
>
> THAT BRINGS UP THE BIG ? JUST HOW MANY RIVETS ARE THERE IN THE AIR
> PLANE.
> I WAS THINKING I COUNTED 18,262 .(OR WAS DAYS IN MY LIFE)
>
> ROGER FITZ
> 40079
> DO NOT ARCHIEVE
>
> *
>
> s.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo@msn.com>
That should look great, just barely seeing any rivets through the paint
looks cool. When you don't see the rivets under the paint, but know they
should be there, then that's not too cool.
Can't say I won't have any masking with filler but I've tried my best to
minimize it.
Next plane will be plastic, but need a real shop disconnected from the house
for that.
These controlled collisions between gun, rivet and bucking bar leave me
longing for something different in the future.
John G. 409
Do NOt Archive.
>From: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
>Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 17:41:44 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
>
>--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
>
>Yeah right, only skill and practice will do that...ain't no swivel on the
>bucking bar and that is the ONLY tool that ever marked my skins. A slightly
>missplaced bucking bar will do the same in reverse, get a good flush set
>with a rubber perimeter ring that's trimmed flush with the surface of the
>rivet set, or you will need help buckng all your rivets. (wobble wobble)
>
>It's easy to hold the rivet gun flush, it's the bucking bar that's often
>blind and tough to align...not the rivet gun. YMMV...IMHO...just my
>2cents...all that stuff....I'm done riveting so 16,000 of them give me some
>street cred... :) (Insert young nephews lingo here)
>
>PS...talk to a "real" sheet metal guy and see what he uses..."what do you
>mean 2X..3X"...we sign out a gun and a rivet set with bars and get to
>it...use the trigger...you mean there are different size guns beside light
>and heavy??
>
>Really...conversation with a 767 sheet metal guy who riveted on my airplane
>with such skill it was mind boggling....
>
>practice makes perfect...wait till you see my next RV...Sh$t....hope my
>better half didn't hear that.
>
>Rick S.
>40185
>
>do not archive
>
>-----Original Message-----
> >From: John Kirkland <jskirkland@webpipe.net>
> >Sent: Oct 2, 2006 4:55 PM
> >To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: RV10-List: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
> >
> >--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Kirkland" <jskirkland@webpipe.net>
> >
> >Worth every penny. Goodbye smilies.
> >
> >--------
> >RV-10 #40333
> >N540XP (reserved)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Read this topic online here:
> >
> >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65335#65335
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Priming in a confined space |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "johngoodman" <johngoodman@earthlink.net>
Les,
Have you considered getting somebody else to do it for you? Maybe you could make
a deal with some paint shop.
John
--------
#40572 Empennage HS
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65473#65473
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Priming in a confined space |
--> RV10-List message posted by: <mgeans@provide.net>
Les,
I don't have an RV-10 or an RV anything. But finally after
about a year of watching the post, I think I might actually
have 2 cents to say about something.
There was also an excellent paint booth article in
Kitplanes in May of 05. They talk a lot about combustion
and keeping particulates from ignition sources and even how
to build an air filter/motor roll-around assembly. It may
cost $7.50 if you are not a Kitplanes online member to
download the article, but I recently reviewed it from my
saved 05 edition and it would be worth it to glean the
knowledge. Heres a link
http://www.kitplanes.com/issues/22_5/shop_talk/7103-1.phtml
I painted my truck project 2 years ago and here is the
account, then a little to add to Tim's 2 cents about a roof
vent fan.
I was rebuilding a Nissan truck and did a frame up priming,
painting etc. I too worked in cold Michigan. I built a
booth from Wal-mart 4-mil "clear" plastic. I had 2 box
fans that I duct taped as an air source and created an
approx 3' diameter plastic tube attached to the booth with
another box fan on the end as an exit fan. The tube was
long enough to go outside during sessions and bring back in
when I was done. I built an assembly that held 3 16 x25
furnace filters in front of the exit fan. With 2 sources
and one exit the booth "inflated" when in session. I
covered the floor with plastic and duct taped all the edges
of the plastic "box" created by taping and fastening the
plastic to my open ceiling with 1x2 wood furring strips to
create a room within the garage. If I did it again I would
have taped all the seams with duct tape as I did, then
placed 2 additional strips of tape to increase the contact
area of the seam. But I also sand blasted in my booth,
which took a toll on the seams. Sand blast - paint -
switch out parts - recycle sand and start over. I also
used a kerosene "torpedo" heater and kept a thermometer in
the booth. Heating the booth for painting and not have the
heat go to the rafters prepped my painting area much
quicker. Some if not all paints have a working temperature
recommended for application. I was using PPG industrial
paint. I kept the sealed paints/primers/activators in a
cooler (for smell) in the house to stay within temperature.
I would heat the booth to approximately 80 degrees or as
high as it would go when the unheated garage was 30 or
less. I paid attention to the air temperature and also the
temperature of the substrate painting. No good to have the
air 80 and the metal 55 when the paint calls for 65 degrees
or higher. The booth worked really well once I ventilated
it. At first it wasn't ventilated and would fog up quick.
Also the bulging sides would create more room to walk
around a large part.
I used my sandblasting hood (harbor freight and tools)
for painting also and scribed and broke 1/16 pieces of
Plexiglas from the local hardware and duct taped it into
the pocket in the hood.
(http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=38375
Heres the hood next to the blasting unit. I have seen the
hood for sale individually at our local retail store, but
cant find it on the web. A quick call to H.F. should turn
up a hood only availability) This sealed the opening from
paint getting into the hood and allowed good "glass" from
session to session as I replaced it. In a paint mist, it
unavoidably gets on the Plexiglas and quickly degrades the
vision. This kept paint from skin/eyes. I wore a $15 paint
suit from the paint shop and latex gloves, again from
harbor freight ($5/box/100pr). In the end, with the suit,
gloves and hood skin exposure is virtually eliminated. I
wore a 2 canister 1/2 mask with 3M charcoal filters and
"felt" pre filters (buy plenty, change every 2-3 sessions
or as needed). This keeps the larger particulates from
saturating the charcoal filter.
This did me very well and was a good alternate to a
positive flow hood, which I don't know if the vision
portion is replaceable and for how much, who knows. (like
in the article) Maybe its glass and can be cleaned with a
razor blade after each session, which would be ideal.
Tip on 1/2 masks. When painting you should smell no odor
whatsoever. From my NBC (nuclear-biological-chemical)
training in the military, they taught that you should cover
the air inlets to a gas mask with your palms and attempt to
inhale, if the mask, gas or 1/2, sucks to your face with no
leaks, it is sealing properly. If not then or after a
couple of minutes of painting perform a second sealing test
and it allows odors through, adjust the straps until it
does.
Fans. Painting professionals will explain the dangers
of combustion and sources of ignition. Light bulbs and fan
motors they pay attention to. With the clear 4 mil
plastic all your lighting can be outside your painting
booth ( used 2 sets of halogen flood lamps) and have light
bulbs/electricity outside the fuel source. The box fans
providing a source of fresh air so the fuel source never
connects with the motor parts/switches/electricity. The
exhaust fan had the 3 filters in front of it, so I was
confident that this would stop enough particulates to
degrade the air going into the fan from being combustible.
So, if you dont build a booth and use a roof fan that
has a compatible motor for a painting environment (refer to
Kitplanes article though the authors motor looks to be a
bit the equivalent of a Lyc 720 on a RV-3).
Afterthoughts: It was a couple of years ago, but I
think I even positioned the tornado heater in the garage
but far enough away from the fresh air fans that I had a
fresh air source that was also heated, but outside the
booth. I used bricks to weigh down the plastic flap that
let the parts in-out (refer to paint booth flaps in
article). I overlapped the side and the door like you
would overlap the 2 sides of a rain coat on a blustery day,
which when inflated pressed against one another and sealed
for a good air flow. If I needed to exit/enter during a
session, I just opened the flap and stepped out and mad
sure that the 2 overlapped again so as not to lose air
pressure.
Hope this helps you and others out Les. Sorry for the long
read.
Matt Geans,
Aspiring builder
On Mon, 02 Oct 2006 11:11:52 -0500
Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson
> <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> I officially suggest a supplied air respirator for
> painting
> and priming. I did not use one myself, but used a good
> silicon dual cartridge half-mask respirator. A full face
> one would be one step better yet, as you can absorb
> chemicals through your eyes. So use the advice of the
> paint shops and real experts (not me) and use your best
> judgment on what you want for protective gear for your
> body.
>
> As far as priming and explosions though, here was what I
> had to do...living in Wisconsin and priming in zero
> degree
> weather:
>
> I had a kerosene torpedo heater as my garage heat. You
> surely
> wouldn't want that thing going off during a priming
> session.
> So, I heated the garage to 75-80 degrees with the heater
> in advance of the priming. Then I unplugged the heater
> and did the priming. As soon as I finished priming, I
> rolled
> open the garage door and the hot air carried all of the
> visible fumes away real fast. The hard part for me was
> that
> I don't have a finished ceiling, so I had to open a rear
> entrance door in the garage and point a fan up into the
> ceiling to force the fumes out of the ceiling.
>
> As soon as it was clear, I rolled the door down and
> took a sniff and turned the heater back on. I doubt with
> most primers you'd build up the level of fumes necessary
> to explode just from the offgassing primer, but again,
> maybe consult experts on that, or maybe knock out
> a small hole high in the garage wall for a small fan that
> you can keep running during the primer drying time to
> exhaust the fumes. I will say that I absolutely was
> aware of the fume/explosion risk, but tempered that
> knowledge with a bit of practicality that there are
> indeed
> upper and lower explosive limits to chemicals...and the
> key is staying well away from the limits. For me
> though, I had good luck with the above.
>
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
> Les Kearney wrote:
> >--> RV10-List message posted by: Les Kearney
> <kearney@shaw.ca>
> >
> >Hi
> >As part of my self education process I have been reading
> various links for
> >priming info.
> >
> >I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm
> days - an option I
> >won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing.
> >
> >That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated
> garage. By safely I
> >mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by
> my natural gas
> >garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due
> to toxic fumes.
> >
> >Inquiring minds need to know ....
> >
> >Les Kearney
> >RV10 Wannabe
> >
>
>
> page,
>
> Forums!
>
>
> Admin.
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Filler wars - Part I |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and
figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins"
left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the
depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior
appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper
'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The
Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from
wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was
doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of
the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24
months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o
! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically
demonstrate the results.
So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And
where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience
particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The
application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic
only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long
to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many
coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface.
Let the games begin
Deems Davis # 406
Panel/Finishing
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 13
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|
| Subject: | Re: Filler wars - Part I |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
Only at 120 degrees Deems, press on cause it is only 120 for about 10 minutes in
the morning then it's way past that for the rest of the day ;)
I heard the Evercoat lightweight Rage Gold filler was good. I hope cause I used
it on my HS tips but alas I did use lightweight cloth prior to a very thin coat.
Rick S.
40185
-----Original Message-----
>From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
>Sent: Oct 3, 2006 12:53 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I
>
>--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
>
>I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and
>figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins"
>left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the
>depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior
>appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper
>'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The
>Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from
>wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was
>doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of
>the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24
>months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o
>! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically
>demonstrate the results.
>
>So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And
>where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience
>particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The
>application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic
>only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long
>to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many
>coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface.
>
>Let the games begin
>
>Deems Davis # 406
>Panel/Finishing
>http://deemsrv10.com/
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy |
Are the hoses the same for the O-540?
Cal
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: W. Curtis
To: RV10-List@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 3:21 PM
Subject: RV10-List: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy
Gents,
I've been out of commission for the last few weeks but I wanted to
give you an update on the proposed group buy of the IO-540 hoses from
aircrafthose.com. Basically the reply from aircrafthose.com was that
because the 124J (Teflon hoses with integral fire) hoses were a
specialty item, the price of $495 would be the best they could do even
though I had 15 RV-10 builders ready to order. So to summarize $495 for
the Teflon hoses with Integral Firesleeve and $432 Teflon with External
Firesleeve. Ask for Ashley.
Stratoflex Teflon with Integral Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10 ($495)
111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214) (IO-540
Man Press.)
124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124J001-4CR0154)
(IO-540 Fuel Press.)
124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124J001-4CR0272)
(IO-540 Oil Press.)
124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124J001-6CR0140)
(IO-540 Fuel Supply)
124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124J001-6CR0254)
(IO-540 Fuel Line)
124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124J001-8CR0164) (Oil
cooler)
124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124J001-8CR0270) (Oil
cooler)
Stratoflex Teflon with External Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10 ($432)
111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214) (IO-540
Man Press.)
124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124001-4CR0154) (IO-540
Fuel Press.)
124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124001-4CR0272) (IO-540
Oil Press.)
124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124001-6CR0140) (IO-540
Fuel Supply)
124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124001-6CR0254) (IO-540
Fuel Line)
124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124001-8CR0164) (Oil
cooler)
124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124001-8CR0270) (Oil
cooler)
William Curtis
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
Message 15
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|
--> RV10-List message posted by: <gommone7@bellsouth.net>
Hi all,by chance any body have a picture or idea how pass the wires from the wing
to the fuselage,I thinks is a no brainer,but I allway ask before made a hole,yes
allready call Van ,but curiosly that instruction come if you purchase there
harness,or pay for the instructions.I'm still not grab(yah sure)after 50.000
dol kit I must to pay for a hole instruction ,but recive a free autopilot
servo bracket for a tru track system,hummm.
thanks ,hugo
do not archive
Message 16
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|
| Subject: | IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy |
Fuel line hoses MAY be a little different in length, but I think the
rest of the hoses are the same. However, the hose from the servo to the
flow divider won't be used obviously on the O-540. I think that would
be the 524-6CR
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cal Hoffman
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 4:00 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy
Are the hoses the same for the O-540?
Cal
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: W. Curtis <mailto:wcurtis@core.com>
To: RV10-List@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 3:21 PM
Subject: RV10-List: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy
Gents,
I've been out of commission for the last few weeks but I wanted
to give you an update on the proposed group buy of the IO-540 hoses from
aircrafthose.com. Basically the reply from aircrafthose.com was that
because the 124J (Teflon hoses with integral fire) hoses were a
specialty item, the price of $495 would be the best they could do even
though I had 15 RV-10 builders ready to order. So to summarize $495 for
the Teflon hoses with Integral Firesleeve and $432 Teflon with External
Firesleeve. Ask for Ashley.
Stratoflex Teflon with Integral Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10
($495)
111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214)
(IO-540 Man Press.)
124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124J001-4CR0154)
(IO-540 Fuel Press.)
124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124J001-4CR0272)
(IO-540 Oil Press.)
124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124J001-6CR0140)
(IO-540 Fuel Supply)
124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124J001-6CR0254)
(IO-540 Fuel Line)
124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124J001-8CR0164)
(Oil cooler)
124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124J001-8CR0270)
(Oil cooler)
Stratoflex Teflon with External Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10
($432)
111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214)
(IO-540 Man Press.)
124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124001-4CR0154)
(IO-540 Fuel Press.)
124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124001-4CR0272)
(IO-540 Oil Press.)
124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124001-6CR0140)
(IO-540 Fuel Supply)
124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124001-6CR0254)
(IO-540 Fuel Line)
124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124001-8CR0164)
(Oil cooler)
124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124001-8CR0270)
(Oil cooler)
William Curtis
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic
s
.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://wiki.matronics.com">http://wiki.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 17
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| Subject: | Filler wars - Part I |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Dunne" <acs@acspropeller.com.au>
Deems, recommendations from the local Aero Structures group here..
Hysol EA934NA or EA960F. Check with Loctite Aerospace group www.loctite.com
they should have a data chart for cross referencing applications.
A question for you..... how well did your cabin cover align with your
tailcone top skin F-1074? I seem to have zero gap at the very top but up to
.125" at the side skin junctions (F1073) All else seems to be trimmed
John 40315
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, 4 October 2006 5:54 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and
figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins"
left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the
depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior
appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper
'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The
Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from
wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was
doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of
the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24
months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o
! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically
demonstrate the results.
So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And
where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience
particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The
application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic
only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long
to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many
coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface.
Let the games begin
Deems Davis # 406
Panel/Finishing
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | RE: MVP-50 Fuel Flow Transducer |
The EI FT-60 Fuel Flow Transducer, while a different form factor than the FloScan,
is electrically compatible with the FloScan. EI went with their own design
to reduce cost and because they thought they could improve it. One of the improvement
was a "straight thru" flow design. In the FloScan, supposedly the
fuel has to do a 90 degree turn to exit.
As to them not wanted it mounted "rigid", I'm not sure what the logic is here.
Both units have an internal impeller and would be equally susceptible to any
vibration. In my Cardinal I've have the EI Fuel Flow instrument with the original
FloScan transducer mounted rigidly to the firewall, though the lines to it
are flexible. It is mounted just after the main fuel line outlet from the firewall,
before the mechanical fuel pump and NOT adjacent to the spider.
Since I was already an EI customer, I ordered one of their new transducers "real
cheap" telling them it was a spare for the FlowScan. It was actually for the
RV-10. I talked to EI at length at OSH and it WILL be mounted
Not sure who you spoke to at EI but unless I hear it from Mac Speed, it's not gospel.
Also not sure what to make of the "push-pull" stuff, but in the world
of fluid dynamics, flow is flow.
The EI FT-60 (Red Cube) Fuel Flow Transducer, while a different form factor than
the FloScan, is electrically compatible with the FloScan. EI went with their
own design they said, to reduce cost and because they thought they could improve
it. One of the improvement was a "straight thru" flow design. In the FloScan,
supposedly the fuel has to do a 90 degree turn to exit.
As to them not wanted it mounted "rigid", I'm not sure what the logic is here.
Both units have an internal impeller and would be equally susceptible to any
vibration. In my Cardinal I've have the EI Fuel Flow instrument with the original
FloScan transducer mounted rigidly to the firewall, though the lines to it
are flexible. It is mounted just after the main fuel line outlet from the firewall,
before the mechanical fuel pump and NOT adjacent to the spider.
Not sure who you spoke to at EI but unless I hear it from Mac Speed, I have to
take it with a grain of salt. Also, not sure what to make of the "push-pull"
stuff, but in the world of fluid dynamics, flow is flow weather it is push or
pulledyou are measuring flow not pressure. Reading the install manual for the
FT-60 it only mentions that the fuel line out from the transducer NOT drop down
and that the wires should NOT be pointing down. It also cautions that the
transducer should NOT be installed next to the exhaust system.. Excessive heat
can damage the system. Now if you are placing it before the fuel goes into the
divider, even below the engine this is a high temperature environmentyou may
want to check with them again and inquire why they are contradicting their documentation.
Since I was already an EI customer, I ordered one of their new transducers "at
a really good price" telling them it was a spare for the FlowScan. It is actually
for the RV-10 to be used with the Grand Rapid EIS. I talked to EI at length
at OSH and they did not mention any of the push-pull, rigid mounting or any
of these issues. I modified the FloScan mount to accept the new EI transducer
and Ill let you know how it works out. Nothing in the documentation contradicts
locating it in the tunnel.
>If anyone is going to use the MVP-50 from Electronis Intl like I am, you might
>save yourself some time and NOT install the fuel-flow transducer bracket in the
tunnel.
> EI does NOT use the FlowScan transducer. They use their own that they designed.
>They do not want it mounted "rigid." They want it mounted on a flex line
>just before the fuel goes into the divider. They told me they reason for that
>is that they want fuel "PUSHED" into the Transducer and not possibly "PULLED"
>by the engine fuel pump.
>
>Zack
>
>--------
>RV8 #80125
>RV10 # 40512
William Curtis
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "bob.kaufmann" <bob.kaufmann@cox.net>
Tim
I think that you missed those rivets by the baggage door, there were 29,678.
:>)
Bob K
Fiberglass itches. Do not archive or any such foolish thing.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
At one point, someone said there were over 14,000 in the wings
alone, which was similar to a complete RV-4. So my guess
would be 29,674.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
jdalton77 wrote:
> I always so 20,000 when people ask. Sounds impressive.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Fixitauto@aol.com <mailto:Fixitauto@aol.com>
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com <mailto:rv10-list@matronics.com>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 03, 2006 8:51 AM
> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
>
> THAT BRINGS UP THE BIG ? JUST HOW MANY RIVETS ARE THERE IN THE AIR
> PLANE.
> I WAS THINKING I COUNTED 18,262 .(OR WAS DAYS IN MY LIFE)
>
> ROGER FITZ
> 40079
> DO NOT ARCHIEVE
>
> *
>
> s.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>
Message 20
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|
Stein,
I just was looking at the Direct2 sales literature and it's absolutely
amazing how much false information there is in their material as it
relates to the wiring package.
I know your very busy, but just skim through this and see how false
their claims are. Look at the bottom where they discuss their detailed
SV10 wiring manual, which I highlighted in RED.
Stein, I believe they need to refund me at least $1500, which I think
you said is the extra price it cost me to go with them, because 1 - they
haven't delivered as promised and 2 they haven't delivered what they
promised. With no wiring instructions to speak of this is an absolute
joke for people like me with little or no wiring experience. Based on
this literature that I excerpted from their web site they've made some
fairly serious miss statements, almost boarding on fraud.
Money isn't so much the issue with me, although as with everyone it's
important, like the other fellow you told me about, but more that I
think I've been duped. I paid them a long way in advanced for a product
that they couldn't deliver on a timely basis and really on the wiring
part couldn't even deliver. I like you as a person and I think you and
your staff are a pretty honest group but this type of think reflects
badly on you also because I relied on your expertise on what and who I
should go with. I know that you've told me they duped you also, so I'll
accept that explanation but I think they need to feel some of this pain
also by having to rebate for what they didn't or can't deliver.
I know we've discussed this on the phone but I just wanted to reiterate
it in writing. I usually a fairly understanding person when it comes to
delays but this is getting beyond reasonable.
Wayne
Service, support, and training from Direct-To Avionics completes the
package.
Direct-To Avionics was created to be the ultimate resource for Chelton's
experimental line of synthetic vision EFIS. We took part in
its development and continue developing, evaluating and exhaustively
testing future Chelton Experimental and Certifi ed systems.
We have an intimate working knowledge of electronic flight systems and
pass this along to our customers with complete and
dedicated support-from technical, to training, to warranty. When you
choose Chelton you'll be completely supported by
Direct-To Avionics. Our support and dedication to our customers leads
the industry.
Installation simplified for the RV-10.
To make installation surprisingly easy, the SV-10 comes complete with an
integrated
wire harness engineered and fitted specifically for the RV-10. It
combines over130
electrical connections! It's not just a harness for your Chelton EFIS;
it includes wiring
from wingtip to wingtip and firewall to rudder. This harness, built to
exacting standards,
is supplied by an aerospace company who also manufactures harnesses for
the
F-22, F-16, Airbus, Boeing, and others. Included in your harness are
connections
for your Chelton EFIS and the new Pinpoint Inertial GADAHRS.
Wiring is also provided for interfaces such as the Trutrak
Autopilot-with pitch and
roll servos, Garmin SL-30 Nav/Com, datalink, and PS Engineering audio
panel.
We've even included wiring for aircraft systems such as electric pitch
and roll trim,
control stick functions, outside air temperature probe, nav and strobe
lights, landing light, pitot heat and
door ajar sensors.
Following the detailed SV-10 manual for installing your aircraft harness
system is easy-it's
designed for those with basic wiring skills. In your manual you'll find
photographs depicting an installation of the SV-
10 harness in an RV-10. Test your wiring, install your harness and
components, and give it power. The
aircraft harness is designed to eliminate the majority of complicated
wiring for your RV-10, so we've
included it with the Chelton SV-10 system to simplify your installation,
saving you as much time as possible
and getting you and your RV-10 in the air faster!
The Chelton EFIS SV-10
With this special package you receive
the following components:
Our integrated System harness is custom fi tted
Message 21
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| Subject: | [ John W. Cox ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: John W. Cox <johnwcox@pacificnw.com>
Lists: RV-List,RV10-List
Subject: Hartzell Composite Prop
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/johnwcox@pacificnw.com.10.03.2006/index.html
----------------------------------------------------------
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
----------------------------------------------------------
Message 22
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| Subject: | Chelton SV-10 package |
I don't know if there are any of you who are considering ordering the
Chelton SV10 package. If there are, based on my experience, I would
recommend that you not take their wiring package. When I was at
Sun-N-Fun I changed my original Chelton order over to the SV-10 package
which include the WAAS receiver and a wiring package. They told me it
should deliver by June or July. We are now in Oct and I still don't have
everything.
But my biggest complaint is with the wiring package. I've received some
of it in pieces and I'm still not sure if I have everything. I'm
definitely not a skilled wiring person and that is the reason that I
wanted their wiring package, because of their reputation of having
quality products. When I received the first bundle of wires it was for
the left and right wing. There was absolutely no instructions with it. I
called them and they sent me a very short sheet saying what the pins
were for. Possible for a very experienced person that would be enough
but not for a neophyte like me. Below is the instructions for the pilot
wing.
SV-10 Pilot Wing
24 Pin AMP CPC
1. Roll Servo Power
2. Roll Servo Ground
3. Roll Servo Pin 5
4. Roll Servo Pin 2
5. Roll Servo Pin 3
6. Roll Servo Pin 6
7. Roll Servo Pin 4
8. Roll Servo Shields
9. Aileron Trim
10. Aileron Trim
11. Pitot Heat Power
12. Landing Light Power
13. Landing Light Power
14. Nav Light Power
15. Strobe Light (W)
16. Strobe Light (B)
17. Strobe Light (O)
18. Strobe Light Shields
19. N/C
20. N/C
21. N/C
22. N/C
23. N/C
24. N/C
For me this just isn't enough. I've received another one a little more
detailed but almost like someone's notes on how it works. Their
literature leads one to believe that it comes with a detailed
installation manual. Not true. If I were to do it over again I would
order the wiring package from Van's. It's cheaper and their instruction
write up, I've seen it, is very good like the rest of the 10 manuals.
I'm not out trying to burn crosses out in front of someone's building
but this has been one of my bigger mistakes on this project and I hope
others will not make the same mistake that I did.
Wayne Edgerton #40336
Message 23
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| Subject: | Backup Instrumentation |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
So with pretty much every EFIS we've now heard that there's a problem
of one sort of another. For those who are planning an EFIS, even
a reliable and expensive one, don't forget to put backup gauges in
for the critical stuff. I've seen a few EFIS-only panels already,
and I can't help but think there's something to be said for
non-electric, or at least self contained backups.
Check out this story on a G1000.
http://www.alexisparkinn.com/nwpilot's_tranatlantic_flight.htm
And I got a copy of this service alert from Avidyne.
http://www.myrv10.com/files/avidyne/SA-05-001.pdf
You'll see that even they now specify backup instruments after
having issues with their systems.
So I haven't heard of an EFIS yet that doesn't have at least some
issue. Dynon's were previously famous for losing attitude when
the system loses airspeed. BMA has had all sorts of things.
Chelton has had the Crossbow 425 stuff. OP tech has had some
interesting issues. So plan your panels accordingly....and
remember these things are programmed by humans....hopefully not
the same ones who wrote Windows 95. :)
--
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Message 24
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| Subject: | [ Alf Olav Frog / Norway ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Alf Olav Frog / Norway <ao.frog@c2i.net>
Lists: RV-List,RV3-List,RV4-List,RV6-List,RV7-List,RV8-List,RV9-List,RV10-List
Subject: Trimtab problems are history!
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/ao.frog@c2i.net.10.03.2006/index.html
----------------------------------------------------------
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
----------------------------------------------------------
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Direct2 issue |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
For what it's worth, if there are lots of people out there waiting
for wiring harnesses, I hate to say "I told you", but it's really
not hard to do the airframe wiring, and the Chelton harnesses aren't
rocket science to build. I'd encourage people to just wire the
thing themselves, but get Stark or whoever you get the garmin
items from to wire hareness to those systems. There's much
less to wiring the Chelton than you'd think, other than the
screen interconnect harnesses....which would be the ones I'd
try to buy if possible. Besides this is the fact that no matter
how hard they try to standardize a wiring harness, there are going
to be far too many variations in what's needed and how long
the cables will be...
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Wayne Edgerton wrote:
> *Stein,*
>
> *I just was looking at the Direct2 sales literature and it's absolutely
> amazing how much false information there is in their material as it
> relates to the wiring package. *
>
>
> *Installation simplified for the RV-10.*
>
> To make installation surprisingly easy, *the SV-10* *comes complete with
> an integrated*
>
> *wire harness engineered and fitted specifically for the RV-10*. *It
> combines over130*
>
> *electrical connections!* *Its not just a harness for your Chelton
> EFIS; it includes wiring*
>
> *from wingtip to wingtip and firewall to rudder. This harness, built to
> exacting standards,*
>
> *is supplied by an aerospace company who also manufactures harnesses for
> the*
>
> *F-22, F-16, Airbus, Boeing, and others. Included in your harness are
> connections*
>
> *for your Chelton EFIS and the new Pinpoint Inertial GADAHRS.*
>
> Wiring is also provided for interfaces such as the Trutrak
> Autopilotwith pitch and
>
> roll servos, Garmin SL-30 Nav/Com, datalink, and PS Engineering audio panel.
>
> Weve even included wiring for aircraft systems such as electric pitch
> and roll trim,
>
> control stick functions, outside air temperature probe, nav and strobe
> lights, landing light, pitot heat and
>
> door ajar sensors.
>
> *_Following the detailed SV-10 manual for installing your aircraft
> harness system is easyits _*
>
> *_designed for _**_those with basic wiring skills_. _In your manual
> youll find photographs depicting an installation of the SV-_*
>
> *_10 harness in an RV-10. Test your wiring, install your harness and
> components, and give it power. The_*
>
> *_aircraft harness is designed to eliminate the majority of complicated
> wiring for your RV-10, so weve_*
>
> *_included it with the Chelton SV-10 system to simplify your
> installation, saving you as much time as possible_*
>
> *_and getting you and your RV-10 in the air faster!_*
>
> *The Chelton EFIS SV-10*
>
> With this special package you receive
>
> the following components:
>
> / /
>
> /Our integrated System harness is custom fi tted/
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Opinion regarding air vents |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
For those of you that are flying or for those of you that have spent
some time in one of the transition aircraft. How would you assess the
need/desirability of overhead fresh-air vents? I've read comments that
the standard Van's vents provide an abundance of air, however most of it
is aimed to low (gonad refrigerant). If the Naca Vents were ducted to
provide fresh air to the pilot/copilot face/head/trunk from a little
higher on the instrument panel,would the overhead vents still be worth
having ? I've got the Cabin cover off and now would be the right time
to add something if it's necessary, If it's not that's one modification
I'd be happy to forgo.
Deems Davis # 406
Panel/Finishing
http://deemsrv10.com/
Where it's only 120 degrees for just a few minutes in the am b4 heading
up to really hot. (It's OCT and stilllllllll 100!)
Message 27
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|
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509@msn.com>
Wayne,
WOW - I cancelled my order with Direct2 early on (received a prompt refund
of my deposit) and went with a dual screen GRT and MX 20 setup. I cancelled
after getting cold feet on the cost and not because of a problem with
Direct2. The GRT, MX 20 with XM weather and radio coupled with a G430, TT
Sorcerer A/P and SL30 makes for a pretty capable panel and great folks to
deal with.
Hope it all works out for you. I purchased my GRT EFIS from Stein and
received excellent service. I beleive he is one of the "good" guys. Even
got a $9,000 T-shirt out of the deal. Garmin avionics were ordered from
John Stark and the Sorcerer from Alex DeDominicis - no T-shirts but again
you won't find better people to deal with.
I flew with Alex to get some RV-10 experience and had no problem with the
first flight (or subsequent flights for that matter) in N410MR.
One of my GRT units went black. I shipped it back to GRT and got a very
quick turn around.
Mark
N410MR (Flying)
>From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e@grandecom.net>
>To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RV10-List: Direct2 issue
>Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2006 19:49:50 -0500
>
>Stein,
>
>I just was looking at the Direct2 sales literature and it's absolutely
>amazing how much false information there is in their material as it relates
>to the wiring package.
>
>I know your very busy, but just skim through this and see how false their
>claims are. Look at the bottom where they discuss their detailed SV10
>wiring manual, which I highlighted in RED.
>
>Stein, I believe they need to refund me at least $1500, which I think you
>said is the extra price it cost me to go with them, because 1 - they
>haven't delivered as promised and 2 they haven't delivered what they
>promised. With no wiring instructions to speak of this is an absolute joke
>for people like me with little or no wiring experience. Based on this
>literature that I excerpted from their web site they've made some fairly
>serious miss statements, almost boarding on fraud.
>
>Money isn't so much the issue with me, although as with everyone it's
>important, like the other fellow you told me about, but more that I think
>I've been duped. I paid them a long way in advanced for a product that they
>couldn't deliver on a timely basis and really on the wiring part couldn't
>even deliver. I like you as a person and I think you and your staff are a
>pretty honest group but this type of think reflects badly on you also
>because I relied on your expertise on what and who I should go with. I know
>that you've told me they duped you also, so I'll accept that explanation
>but I think they need to feel some of this pain also by having to rebate
>for what they didn't or can't deliver.
>
>I know we've discussed this on the phone but I just wanted to reiterate it
>in writing. I usually a fairly understanding person when it comes to delays
>but this is getting beyond reasonable.
>
>Wayne
>
>
>Service, support, and training from Direct-To Avionics completes the
>package.
>
>Direct-To Avionics was created to be the ultimate resource for Chelton's
>experimental line of synthetic vision EFIS. We took part in
>
>its development and continue developing, evaluating and exhaustively
>testing future Chelton Experimental and Certifi ed systems.
>
>We have an intimate working knowledge of electronic flight systems and pass
>this along to our customers with complete and
>
>dedicated support-from technical, to training, to warranty. When you choose
>Chelton you'll be completely supported by
>
>Direct-To Avionics. Our support and dedication to our customers leads the
>industry.
>
>Installation simplified for the RV-10.
>
>To make installation surprisingly easy, the SV-10 comes complete with an
>integrated
>
>wire harness engineered and fitted specifically for the RV-10. It combines
>over130
>
>electrical connections! It's not just a harness for your Chelton EFIS; it
>includes wiring
>
>from wingtip to wingtip and firewall to rudder. This harness, built to
>exacting standards,
>
>is supplied by an aerospace company who also manufactures harnesses for the
>
>F-22, F-16, Airbus, Boeing, and others. Included in your harness are
>connections
>
>for your Chelton EFIS and the new Pinpoint Inertial GADAHRS.
>
>Wiring is also provided for interfaces such as the Trutrak Autopilot-with
>pitch and
>
>roll servos, Garmin SL-30 Nav/Com, datalink, and PS Engineering audio
>panel.
>
>We've even included wiring for aircraft systems such as electric pitch and
>roll trim,
>
>control stick functions, outside air temperature probe, nav and strobe
>lights, landing light, pitot heat and
>
>door ajar sensors.
>
>Following the detailed SV-10 manual for installing your aircraft harness
>system is easy-it's
>
>designed for those with basic wiring skills. In your manual you'll find
>photographs depicting an installation of the SV-
>
>10 harness in an RV-10. Test your wiring, install your harness and
>components, and give it power. The
>
>aircraft harness is designed to eliminate the majority of complicated
>wiring for your RV-10, so we've
>
>included it with the Chelton SV-10 system to simplify your installation,
>saving you as much time as possible
>
>and getting you and your RV-10 in the air faster!
>
>The Chelton EFIS SV-10
>
>With this special package you receive
>
>the following components:
>
>Our integrated System harness is custom fi tted
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Filler wars - Part I |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
Thanks John, it looks like I need EA960F (Fast). now if I can find a
place that distributes it. I can't say as how the cabin cover aligns
because I haven't put it on with the F1074 skin yet, I'll let you know
what it looks like when I do.
Deems Davis # 406
Panel/Finishing
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Filler wars - Part I/cabin cover |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM@bigpond.com>
John mine was the same!
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Dunne" <acs@acspropeller.com.au>
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 9:13 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "John Dunne" <acs@acspropeller.com.au>
>
> Deems, recommendations from the local Aero Structures group here..
> Hysol EA934NA or EA960F. Check with Loctite Aerospace group
> www.loctite.com
> they should have a data chart for cross referencing applications.
> A question for you..... how well did your cabin cover align with your
> tailcone top skin F-1074? I seem to have zero gap at the very top but up
> to
> .125" at the side skin junctions (F1073) All else seems to be trimmed
> John 40315
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> Sent: Wednesday, 4 October 2006 5:54 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
>
> I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and
> figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins"
> left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the
> depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior
> appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper
> 'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The
> Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from
> wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was
> doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of
> the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24
> months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o
> ! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically
> demonstrate the results.
>
> So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And
> where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience
> particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The
> application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic
> only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long
> to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many
> coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface.
>
> Let the games begin
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> Panel/Finishing
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
>
>
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Opinion regarding air vents |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Howdy Deems,
Personally, I still think the vents are one of the biggest design flaws
keeping it from being perfect. Even if you put the vents up higher
on the panel, you may want to redesign things a little. I've now found
when flying in rain that indeed the rain does come in the vents, and
if you close them, a puddle will form and it will bubble water into
the plane. So at minimum, some drains might be a good idea, that drain
to tubes out the floor. But even then you'd be stuck with keeping the
vents closed in the rain. So to me, overhead vents would be a great
thing to have. I used to use my overhead vents nearly year round
in my old plane...I just liked a little fresh air on my face. But
when you're limited to only the 2 big vents up front, it's just
not as easy to make things comfortable. Once some people get flying
with overhead consoles and everything is plug-n-play, I may actually
add one to mine.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Deems Davis wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
>
>
> For those of you that are flying or for those of you that have spent
> some time in one of the transition aircraft. How would you assess the
> need/desirability of overhead fresh-air vents? I've read comments that
> the standard Van's vents provide an abundance of air, however most of it
> is aimed to low (gonad refrigerant). If the Naca Vents were ducted to
> provide fresh air to the pilot/copilot face/head/trunk from a little
> higher on the instrument panel,would the overhead vents still be worth
> having ? I've got the Cabin cover off and now would be the right time
> to add something if it's necessary, If it's not that's one modification
> I'd be happy to forgo.
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> Panel/Finishing
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
> Where it's only 120 degrees for just a few minutes in the am b4 heading
> up to really hot. (It's OCT and stilllllllll 100!)
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Priming in a confined space |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox@pacificnw.com>
Two years ago Hoyt Fleming (Boise - N727TF)the proud owner of a newly
painted experimental was having some touch-up done on one wing. The
Painter (a true professional and veteran) had correctly drained the wing
tank. Unfortunately, like so many experimental guys, he does not
regularly ground the aircraft in the hangar. Secondly, he left the tank
cap ajar. Third, he should have noticed when the hair on his arm began
to raise that the low humidity and friction from sanding was creating
static. The ensuing combustion was quickly extinguished but the
internal tank began burning (smoldering) at the wing root.
Final outcome, the engine went to another builder, the rest was toast.
Want to take bets on how many of you guys working canopies aren't
regularly grounded? Be safe, ground it from the beginning and continue
the good habit.
The Turbanator
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 5:36 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jesse Saint" <jesse@itecusa.org>
Better yet, just go in there to paint with a lit cigarette and no mask
and
get it over with. "Too much hastle, this airplane building stuff!"
Just go
out and buy a Cessna. Oh, wait...I mean...OK, go with the other
suggestions
after all.
Do not archive.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse@itecusa.org
www.itecusa.org
W: 352-465-4545
C: 352-427-0285
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 3:54 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Also, brush-less exhaust fan.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:44 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
Not only the heater but the WATER HEATER if it is in your
garage....pilot
light in there and the WHOOSH as it kicks off to reheat may be the last
thing you hear.
Rick S.
40185
-----Original Message-----
>From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>Sent: Oct 2, 2006 4:44 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space
>
>--> RV10-List message posted by: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen@comcast.net>
>
>A supplied air respirator makes all the difference in the world. I
>started with a dual carbon filter respirator and for Xmas I got a hobby
>air. The first time I used supplied air I didn't even know there were
>any fumes in the garage. I could not smell a thing. I cannot say the
>same for the carbon filter respirator. A local RV-9 builder uses the
>exhaust from a shop vac (cleaned of course) to supply breathing air,
>and it works well.
>
>I use Tim's method to keep the room safe from an explosion. Heat it
>up, turn off the heater. Paint away with an exhaust fan, and then open
>up the garage doors to let the fumes escape.
>
>Larry Rosen
>#356
>
>Les Kearney wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca>
>>
>> Hi
>> As part of my self education process I have been reading various
>> links for priming info.
>>
>> I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an
>> option I won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing.
>>
>> That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By
>> safely I mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my
>> natural gas garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to
toxic fumes.
>>
>> Inquiring minds need to know ....
>>
>> Les Kearney
>> RV10 Wannabe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
--
--
Message 32
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|
| Subject: | Re: Opinion regarding air vents |
In my opinion, the stock vents are quite adequate for cooling. You can point
them up toward your face if you need it, or elsewhere if you don't want all
that wind blowing on your microphone. For a while I had diverted the
passenger vent for avionics cooling... I was able to keep the most finicky passengers
happy in 100 deg weather by directing the pilot's vent cross cockpit.
Personally, I would not spend the effort or panel space raising the stock
vents higher or installing overhead vents.
Jim
40134 - Flying
Jim "Scooter" McGrew
Graduate Student
Humans and Automation Lab (_http://halab.mit.edu_
(https://webmail.mit.edu/horde/services/go.php?url=http://halab.mit.edu) )
Department of Aeronautics and Astronautics
Massachusetts Institute of Technology
In a message dated 10/3/2006 10:15:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
deemsdavis@cox.net writes:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
For those of you that are flying or for those of you that have spent
some time in one of the transition aircraft. How would you assess the
need/desirability of overhead fresh-air vents? I've read comments that
the standard Van's vents provide an abundance of air, however most of it
is aimed to low (gonad refrigerant). If the Naca Vents were ducted to
provide fresh air to the pilot/copilot face/head/trunk from a little
higher on the instrument panel,would the overhead vents still be worth
having ? I've got the Cabin cover off and now would be the right time
to add something if it's necessary, If it's not that's one modification
I'd be happy to forgo.
Deems Davis # 406
Panel/Finishing
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 33
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--> RV10-List message posted by: kilopapa@antelecom.net
Your system sound nice. What is displayed on the MX20? Is
it a standalone moving map?
Thanks,
Kevin
40494
----- Original Message Follows -----
From: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509@msn.com>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Direct2 issue
... and went with a dual screen
>GRT and MX 20 setup. I cancelled after getting cold feet
>on the cost and not because of a problem with Direct2.
>The GRT, MX 20 with XM weather and radio coupled with a
>G430, TT Sorcerer A/P and SL30 makes for a pretty capable
>panel and great folks to deal with.
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