---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 04/27/07: 24 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:39 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (John Testement) 2. 06:03 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Tim Olson) 3. 06:50 AM - Re: Wiring Diagram and/or Schematic Diagram of electrical system (Michael Wellenzohn) 4. 07:10 AM - Re: Poor idle on I0-540 (Jesse Saint) 5. 07:17 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Jesse Saint) 6. 08:00 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Pascal) 7. 08:03 AM - Aileron Trim Location (Niko) 8. 08:08 AM - Re: Purchase of an RV 10 Kit () 9. 08:44 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (John Jessen) 10. 08:55 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Paul Grimstad) 11. 09:03 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Scott Schmidt) 12. 09:24 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Tim Olson) 13. 09:54 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Kelly McMullen) 14. 10:23 AM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Tim Olson) 15. 10:37 AM - They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... (Steven Roberts) 16. 12:07 PM - Transition Training (ddddsp1@juno.com) 17. 12:50 PM - Re: They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... (Jesse Saint) 18. 01:06 PM - Re: Transition Training (John Jessen) 19. 03:45 PM - Re: Flying the RV10 for the first time (Kelly McMullen) 20. 06:40 PM - Re: They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... (bob.kaufmann) 21. 07:24 PM - Officially an RV Builder (Larry Rosen) 22. 08:30 PM - Re: Transition Training (Lloyd, Daniel R.) 23. 09:41 PM - Re: Officially an RV Builder (bruce breckenridge) 24. 09:46 PM - Re: Transition Training (bruce breckenridge) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:39:06 AM PST US From: "John Testement" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Dan, I can not agree with you more about the value of transition training. I trained a couple of weeks ago with Alex D in Texas. Yes there are a lot of new things us spam canners need to learn, unlearn, and adjust to. I think it would be a mistake to jump in your new 10 without the training (most insurers wouldn't let you). I will probably do a few more hours of dual just before mine is ready to fly - I am hoping it is just a couple of months now. John Testement HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt@roadmapscoaching.com"jwt@roadmapscoaching.com 40321 Richmond, VA Paint prep and LOTS of misc stuff - 90% done, 90% to go! do not archive _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lloyd, Daniel R. Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:25 AM Subject: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Hey guys, I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and trued out over 200MPH, did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first flight. I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us feel welcome! THX Dan Lloyd N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! Dan Lloyd Director of Information Technology Werner Company 93 Werner Road Greenville, PA 16125 HYPERLINK "mailto:lloyddr@wernerco.com"lloyddr@wernerco.com 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work 1-724-988-9230 cell "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"http://www.matronics.com/Navig ator?RV10-List 12:19 PM 12:19 PM ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:03:52 AM PST US From: Tim Olson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time (I'm sorry, I just can't resist) Yeah Dan, those big Lycomings....it's like "Yeeee Haw!" when you stuff that throttle into the panel, with all that torque and horsepower. Great engines, they are. ;) P-factor....you only had 3 hours in the -10, so you must have a small bladder. For me, I cured the P-Factor in my plane by carrying an old gatorade bottle on long x/c trip. (LOL) Oh, and don't even get me started on that miserable Ed Hayden... It's like the man's in his own world where everyone travels at 670,616,600 miles per hour (a few mph less than the speed of light), so that time moves so slowly it looks like he'll be done with his -10 "soon". I think he's delusional, perhaps. (reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_light ) For him, I'm thinking he'll be done in "November". (Now THAT one is just for good ol' Eddie boy!) ALL in good fun, of course. You guys is good people! Oh, and to the rest of you, take Dan's advice...get the training. It's comforting when you fly yours for the first time. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying do not archive Lloyd, Daniel R. wrote: > Hey guys, > I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the > factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more > days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast > bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, > but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps > in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and > trued out over 200MPH, > did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home > stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first > flight. > I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having > been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For > those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not > stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary > to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is > difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to > feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing > that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need > for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you > put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue > about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. > > While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured > Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, > the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he > helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. > What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait > to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that > makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us > feel welcome! > > THX > Dan Lloyd > N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! > > > Dan Lloyd > Director of Information Technology > Werner Company > 93 Werner Road > Greenville, PA 16125 > > _lloyddr@wernerco.com_ > 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work > 1-724-988-9230 cell > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:50:50 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Wiring Diagram and/or Schematic Diagram of electrical system From: "Michael Wellenzohn" Thanks you to all of you. I have now enough diagrams to go through. Take care Michael -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=109518#109518 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:10:46 AM PST US From: "Jesse Saint" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Poor idle on I0-540 The thing that comes to mind is a problem we just fixed on N416EC. The idle mixture was set WAY to rich. Check and see if the RPM comes up and it smoothens out if you spin the mixture cable out. If so, lean out the idle mixture on the fuel servo and you should be good to go. Jesse Saint Saint Aviation, Inc. jesse@saintaviation.com www.saintaviation.com Cell: 352-427-0285 Fax: 815-377-3694 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ted French Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2007 9:48 PM Subject: RV10-List: Poor idle on I0-540 My I0-540 does not like to run at idle. Anything below about 800 RPM runs the risk of the engine stopping, which it has done a few times when taxiing or on run-up It is equipped with a Lasar ignition with the warning light to tell you if it is running on the mags alone. Temps seem OK and it runs well once the power is put to it. The idle screw is in as far as it will go. The engine feels a bit rough when slowed down to 800 RPM or so Anyone have any ideas.? Ted French C-FXCS RV-10 Flying -- 12:19 PM ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:17:52 AM PST US From: "Jesse Saint" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time I guess that mainly depends on how much time and in how many other planes you have flown. My dad didn't get transition training, just took a demo flight at Van's (which is far from helpful in learning to fly the plane), and he had no problem (and now has over 400 safe hours in the -10). The plane really is not difficult to fly. I am not knocking transition training at all, but just offering a little more insight from experience. Do not archive. Jesse Saint Saint Aviation, Inc. jesse@saintaviation.com www.saintaviation.com Cell: 352-427-0285 Fax: 815-377-3694 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 8:38 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Dan, I can not agree with you more about the value of transition training. I trained a couple of weeks ago with Alex D in Texas. Yes there are a lot of new things us spam canners need to learn, unlearn, and adjust to. I think it would be a mistake to jump in your new 10 without the training (most insurers wouldn't let you). I will probably do a few more hours of dual just before mine is ready to fly - I am hoping it is just a couple of months now. John Testement jwt@roadmapscoaching.com 40321 Richmond, VA Paint prep and LOTS of misc stuff - 90% done, 90% to go! do not archive _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lloyd, Daniel R. Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:25 AM Subject: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Hey guys, I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and trued out over 200MPH, did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first flight. I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us feel welcome! THX Dan Lloyd N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! Dan Lloyd Director of Information Technology Werner Company 93 Werner Road Greenville, PA 16125 lloyddr@wernerco.com 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work 1-724-988-9230 cell href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com 12:19 PM ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:00:17 AM PST US From: "Pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Flying the RV10 for the first timeOther than expenses there can only be advantages to getting a Solid CFI to train you on the specific aircraft. I appreciate what Jesse is saying however. Some pilots ARE experienced and solid, as Jesse's father appears to be, than there those who have 10K hours and fill my NTSB reports each month. To each their own but I never forgot the stats I received from the MSF when getting my motorcycle license. "most fatalities occur with experienced riders on a new bike" As Lloyd mentioned there is the P-factor but what is not mentioned is the "tips and techniques" that an experienced pilot can teach a newby about that specific aircraft. (V speeds and how it looks, feels) Pascal Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Jesse Saint To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 7:17 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time I guess that mainly depends on how much time and in how many other planes you have flown. My dad didn't get transition training, just took a demo flight at Van's (which is far from helpful in learning to fly the plane), and he had no problem (and now has over 400 safe hours in the -10). The plane really is not difficult to fly. I am not knocking transition training at all, but just offering a little more insight from experience. Do not archive. Jesse Saint Saint Aviation, Inc. jesse@saintaviation.com www.saintaviation.com Cell: 352-427-0285 Fax: 815-377-3694 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 8:38 AM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: RE: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Dan, I can not agree with you more about the value of transition training. I trained a couple of weeks ago with Alex D in Texas. Yes there are a lot of new things us spam canners need to learn, unlearn, and adjust to. I think it would be a mistake to jump in your new 10 without the training (most insurers wouldn't let you). I will probably do a few more hours of dual just before mine is ready to fly - I am hoping it is just a couple of months now. John Testement jwt@roadmapscoaching.com 40321 Richmond, VA Paint prep and LOTS of misc stuff - 90% done, 90% to go! do not archive ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lloyd, Daniel R. Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:25 AM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Hey guys, I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and trued out over 200MPH, did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first flight. I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us feel welcome! THX Dan Lloyd N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! Dan Lloyd Director of Information Technology Werner Company 93 Werner Road Greenville, PA 16125 lloyddr@wernerco.com 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work 1-724-988-9230 cell href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?RV10-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://foru size=2>Version: 7.5.463 / 12:19 PM http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:03:58 AM PST US From: Niko Subject: RV10-List: Aileron Trim Location Has anyone mounted the aileron trim on to the right wing instead of the left? thanks Niko 40188 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:08:23 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: RV10-List: Purchase of an RV 10 Kit Larry, I have a 10 qb wing /fuse/ tail kit also --just finished my 8A, just thinking about not continueing tth 10, I have a 540 --it doesn't have to go with it-- call me if interested 479 629 1986 Ed 479 629 1986 Thanks ---- Larry Rosen he wrote: > > Answers to your questions below: > > Larry Rosen > RV-10 #356 > > > BARBARA HADATH wrote: > > > > Fellow Builders > > > > I am a new subscriber to the RV 10 list. I have built and am now > > flying a F1 Rocket from a parts kit. I have a wife and 2 children who > > have been enjoying the flying so much that they are now saying that I > > must start on a 4 seater. It looks like the RV 10 is the one for me to > > build. > > > > I have decided to go the QB route this time. It looks like the options > > are Electric trim, which I think may be a good idea for a side by side > > aircraft. > > > Electric elevator trim is standard. There is an option for aileron > trim, and DIY options for rudder trim. There are no manual trim options > > > > I wonder about the external steps, due to drag. Anybody have input or > > experience on this? > > > External steps are included with the kit. It would be difficult to > climb up into the plane without the steps. > > > > Map box. I would think this is a good idea and since I will go with a > > VFR panel I would think there must be lots of room on the panel. > > > With a VFR panel you could probably put in 2 map boxes. > > > > Fresh air vent? Any input here? > > > Standard are 2 vents up front and 2 vents for the rear passangers > Accuracy Avionics has an overhead > console that adds air vents. > > > > Are there other options I should consider? > > > Lots, for the tail kit they are limited to static ports and rudder > control fairings. Just get started, stay on this list, check out the > builders web sites and have fun building. If you could build a 4 > (without pre punched skins, the 10 will be a breeze). > > > > Is anybody aware of a QB kit out there in need of a home? > > > > I hope I will be able to contribute to the list and I look forward to > > the project. > > > > I am located at CYKF in Kitchener, Ontario. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Wayne Hadath > > > > http://www.justplane works.com/ > > > > > > > > * > > > > > > * > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:44:36 AM PST US From: "John Jessen" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time You know, this brings up some thoughts. First, Ed Hayden is one of the best. Anyone who gets the privilege of meeting this guy knows of what I speak. Second, let the list know when you (any you) are going where on RV-10 business. If Ed hadn't been available, I know 4 other guys in Oregon who would have been. I continue to be amazed at the quality of folks on this list, building or not, and as a community, it is one I want to be around. Third, this plane is amazing, as Dan just found out. I have been struggling whether or not I really have the time to finish the project, and shouldn't I, given my age, simply buy a fast certified and get to flying. Well, so, I've now flown a couple Bonanzas, and other fast supposedly 4-place planes, trying to determine what to do. Then good old Randy says, hey, hop in, I've got to have another pair of hands and eyes while I check out the new thingy that TT sent me. Well, Randy didn't really need another pair of eyes or hands, not really, he just wanted to get me up and into the air in his RV-10 to keep my spirits up. He's sneaky that way. What he also did was make me realize, once again, just how better the RV-10 is than even a pretty darn good Bonanza, just on flying qualities alone. It's an amazing difference, in just, how to put this, attitude, and I don't mean which side is up. I mean the feel of it. The sitting in it. The handling. The spirit. The feeling that flying it is fun. As in FUN. And this is a Van's SUV! I've flown the Cirrus 22, and that is really cool, but this, in my opinion, is just as cool, if not, er, cooler. So, Dan, I hear ya. John (I can't believe I'm still in builder exile) Jessen #40328 do not archive _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lloyd, Daniel R. Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:25 AM Subject: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Hey guys, I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and trued out over 200MPH, did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first flight. I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us feel welcome! THX Dan Lloyd N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! Dan Lloyd Director of Information Technology Werner Company 93 Werner Road Greenville, PA 16125 lloyddr@wernerco.com 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work 1-724-988-9230 cell ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:55:33 AM PST US From: "Paul Grimstad" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Flying the RV10 for the first timeDaniel Thanks for the encouragement. The builder spirit and enthusiasm are reaffirmed when we hear stories of passion flying the RV10. Glad to hear your having a good time, how much longer will it be to get your RV10E up flying? Paul Grimstad RV10 40450 Portland, Or. do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Lloyd, Daniel R. To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2007 9:25 PM Subject: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Hey guys, I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and trued out over 200MPH, did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first flight. I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us feel welcome! THX Dan Lloyd N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! Dan Lloyd Director of Information Technology Werner Company 93 Werner Road Greenville, PA 16125 lloyddr@wernerco.com 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work 1-724-988-9230 cell ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:03:25 AM PST US From: Scott Schmidt Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Awesome Dan, isn't that the most fun ever. Mike teaches you to fly the -10 like a tail dragger. Nose off the ground ASAP, don't even look at the airspeed, and let it fly itself off. This is typically not taught when flying spam cans. Budd Davidson one of the finest CFI's in the world teaches the same approach in the Pitts. You really learn what AOA achieves a smooth safe takeoff in a reasonable distance. I cannot tell you how happy you will be when you are sitting at the end of the runway in you new RV-10 and you push that throttle in and your not having to learn to fly the plane and watch all the engine instruments for problems. You know what stick force it takes to get the nose off. You know how much rudder it will take to keep it straight when you lift the nose off. Plus, going and flying with Mike is some of the cheapest flying you can do. Seems like it is around $130 an hour (plane + pilot)? To fly a 182 here in Utah the average rent is around $160 just for the plane. It is so beautiful to go flying around OR as well. Looking forward to the first flight post. Scott Schmidt scottmschmidt@yahoo.com ----- Original Message ---- From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2007 9:25:04 PM Subject: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Hey guys, I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and trued out over 200MPH, did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first flight. I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us feel welcome! THX Dan Lloyd N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! Dan Lloyd Director of Information Technology Werner Company 93 Werner Road Greenville, PA 16125 lloyddr@wernerco.com 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work 1-724-988-9230 cell ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 09:24:15 AM PST US From: Tim Olson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Fully agree with you there John. The people are just fantastic and the plane really shines. Just did my IPC and BFR Wednesday, and impressed the guy (a friend of mine) who's an airline pilot. He was amazed at the plane in general, and kept commenting on how well it flew, how fast it was, and how smooth it was. I MUCH prefer someone (if they have the skills), who's not afraid to FEEL out the plane when they jump in for a demo. 15 minutes after takeoff, he was trying 30/45/60 degree banks and loving it. He couldn't believe how advanced the instrumentation was, and said it's easier to fly an approach with what I've got than using everything he has in the DC9/727/757/747's that he's flown. Then yesterday, I read a review in Flying Mag's recent issue where they reviewed the Mooney Ovation3...their fast normally aspirated plane. I was again left impressed not with the Ovation, but with what we can do with our RV-10's. That Ovation was well over $400,000, and didn't cruise much faster, and almost completely had inferior performance specs to the -10 in most categories. Even the VNE was within a Knot or 2 of the -10. They went on to do a lot of detail on how with a G1000 and Garmin's new AP that you can now do some awesome vertically guided approaches and it's smooth. That's funny, I can do pretty much everything they described there, and it's just an experimental costing well under 1/2 the price! Not to mention there are many who can build a great plane for much less depending on their needs. (I've has someone say to me that the reason for some of Van's choices on his own plane may be to demonstrate how someone can build a nice but low-cost RV-10, as opposed to the common "loaded" RV-10) So from what I can tell, the Ovation3, and for that matter, most of the other High-performance singles, have very little additional benefits on us, if any, and for twice the price. Oh, and I haven't seen one of those factory model users groups that has anywhere near the camaraderie of what we have either...what a bonus! Great people is right! Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying do not archive John Jessen wrote: > You know, this brings up some thoughts. > > First, Ed Hayden is one of the best. Anyone who gets the privilege of > meeting this guy knows of what I speak. > > Second, let the list know when you (any you) are going where on RV-10 > business. If Ed hadn't been available, I know 4 other guys in Oregon > who would have been. I continue to be amazed at the quality of folks on > this list, building or not, and as a community, it is one I want to be > around. > > Third, this plane is amazing, as Dan just found out. I have been > struggling whether or not I really have the time to finish the project, > and shouldn't I, given my age, simply buy a fast certified and get to > flying. Well, so, I've now flown a couple Bonanzas, and other fast > supposedly 4-place planes, trying to determine what to do. Then good > old Randy says, hey, hop in, I've got to have another pair of hands and > eyes while I check out the new thingy that TT sent me. Well, Randy > didn't really need another pair of eyes or hands, not really, he just > wanted to get me up and into the air in his RV-10 to keep my spirits > up. He's sneaky that way. What he also did was make me realize, once > again, just how better the RV-10 is than even a pretty darn good > Bonanza, just on flying qualities alone. It's an amazing difference, in > just, how to put this, attitude, and I don't mean which side is up. I > mean the feel of it. The sitting in it. The handling. The spirit. > The feeling that flying it is fun. As in FUN. And this is a Van's > SUV! I've flown the Cirrus 22, and that is really cool, but this, in my > opinion, is just as cool, if not, er, cooler. > > So, Dan, I hear ya. > > John (I can't believe I'm still in builder exile) Jessen > #40328 > > do not archive > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Lloyd, > Daniel R. > *Sent:* Friday, April 27, 2007 12:25 AM > *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time > > Hey guys, > I have spent the past day out in Oregon with Mike Seager and flying the > factory 10. I now have 3 hours in type and 15 landings. I have two more > days to fly with him and try and get my mind wrapped around this fast > bird. I know many of you have 4/6/7/8 time, and the 10 is not the same, > but all I can say is WOOHOO! Put the throttle in and it instantly leaps > in the air, blink and we are passing through 2k ft. We flew North and > trued out over 200MPH, > did I say this plane is incredible?? 2.5 years and I am in the home > stretch, and I can not wait to fly my own, and finally report my first > flight. > I know it sounds funny, but we chose to build the 10 without ever having > been in one, and all of expectations have been met and exceeded. For > those of you in the same boat as myself, 150 hrs in SPAM cans, I can not > stress the value of transition training and spending the time necessary > to get used to these planes. Things are happening so fast that it is > difficult at first, but after several hours with Mike I am starting to > feel that with a couple hundred more I might make an RV pilot. One thing > that I find very funny is that I have heard about P-factor and the need > for right rudder, and thought I knew about it, but the first time you > put the throttle to 260 HP you quickly realize what you had no clue > about!!! Get the transition training so you are ready. > > While I have been out here I have met a couple of the guys and toured > Vans factory, too cool to say the least. But other than flying the 10, > the most memorable part of the trip is the hospitality of Ed Hayden, he > helped me around town, and took an afternoon to show me his project. > What a plane, all the bell's and whistles and then some! I can not wait > to reciprocate when he comes to town. It is the builder community that > makes this so much fun and Ed is a pillar of the community making us > feel welcome! > > THX > Dan Lloyd > N289DT RV10E Finally I can say finishing up!!! > > > Dan Lloyd > Director of Information Technology > Werner Company > 93 Werner Road > Greenville, PA 16125 > > _lloyddr@wernerco.com_ > 1-724-588-2000 *2408 work > 1-724-988-9230 cell > > > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > > * > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:54:01 AM PST US From: Kelly McMullen Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Is Van's spec of 211mph top speed = Vne, or is there some higher number? The Ovation airframe is virtually identical to the Acclaim, which has a max cruise of 237kts, or 273mph. Vne is something above that. The Ovation 3 has 310hp engine and noticeably better climb and cruise than earlier versions with 280hp. Of course the -10 has many other advantages, as you noted, esp $$$$ & ease of entry. The current Mooneys have much bigger baggage area than the -10. Tim Olson wrote: > - > Then yesterday, I read a review in Flying Mag's recent issue where > they reviewed the Mooney Ovation3...their fast normally aspirated > plane. I was again left impressed not with the Ovation, but with > what we can do with our RV-10's. That Ovation was well over $400,000, > and didn't cruise much faster, and almost completely had inferior > performance specs to the -10 in most categories. Even the VNE was > within a Knot or 2 of the -10. ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:23:28 AM PST US From: Tim Olson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time Well here I can't vouch for the accuracy of their article, but... I think the RV-10's VNE is 200kts roughly...or around 230mph. The VNE quoted in the Ovation3 article was probably in IAS, and I think it was 201kts IAS. So yeah, I guess the Vne isn't really that equal, given that we're supposed to be using TAS, and they quoted what I believe is IAS. But, they're not THAT much faster than the -10...oh, and they praised it's great climb, but the -10 handily outclimbs it. The baggage area though, you're right. The -10 has suited me well, but if there was one thing I'd like more of,it's baggage volume. We have lots, but my old plane had even more, and as long as the stuff wasn't too heavy you could carry some large things....like I stuffed in one of those 2 kid tow behind bike carriers once...a big plastic one. Can't do that in the -10. Nope, the planes are really apples and oranges, so while we can compare specs, it's still hard to really analyze to certain levels. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying do not archive Kelly McMullen wrote: > > Is Van's spec of 211mph top speed = Vne, or is there some higher number? > The Ovation airframe is virtually identical to the Acclaim, which has a > max cruise of 237kts, or 273mph. Vne is something above that. The > Ovation 3 has 310hp engine and noticeably better climb and cruise than > earlier versions with 280hp. > Of course the -10 has many other advantages, as you noted, esp $$$$ & > ease of entry. The current Mooneys have much bigger baggage area than > the -10. > > Tim Olson wrote: >> - >> Then yesterday, I read a review in Flying Mag's recent issue where >> they reviewed the Mooney Ovation3...their fast normally aspirated >> plane. I was again left impressed not with the Ovation, but with >> what we can do with our RV-10's. That Ovation was well over $400,000, >> and didn't cruise much faster, and almost completely had inferior >> performance specs to the -10 in most categories. Even the VNE was >> within a Knot or 2 of the -10. > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:37:08 AM PST US From: "Steven Roberts" Subject: RV10-List: They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... Flying the RV10 for the first timeOff topic, but check this site out... http://www.richard-seaman.com/Aircraft/AirShows/Nellis2006/Highlights/ind ex.html Steve Roberts Still lurking, but about to order the tail kit... ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 12:07:25 PM PST US From: "ddddsp1@juno.com" Subject: RV10-List: Transition Training I am going to get Training from Mike Seager in 2 weeks and was curious w ho else was near the Vans facility besides Ed Hayden. If ED and the res t of the RV builders will be available on May 8-12 I would love to see y our project, ride in your plane or just have some great hanger talk. Al so, where would you recommend staying while doing the trainsition traini ng. Just email me offline or call anytime to let me know. Thanks, DEAN 40449 402-560-9755

I am going to get Training from Mike Seager in 2 weeks and was curious who else was near the Vans facility besides Ed Hayden.  If ED and the rest of the RV builders will be available on May 8-12 I would love to see your project, ride in your plane or just have some gre at hanger talk.  Also, where would you recommend staying while doin g the trainsition training. 

Just email me offline or call anytime to let me know.

Thanks,

DEAN 40449

402-560-9755
________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 12:50:09 PM PST US From: "Jesse Saint" Subject: RE: RV10-List: They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... Fantastic pictures! Do not archive Jesse Saint Saint Aviation, Inc. jesse@saintaviation.com www.saintaviation.com Cell: 352-427-0285 Fax: 815-377-3694 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steven Roberts Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 1:36 PM Subject: RV10-List: They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... Off topic, but check this site out... http://www.richard-seaman.com/Aircraft/AirShows/Nellis2006/Highlights/index. html Steve Roberts Still lurking, but about to order the tail kit... ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:06:01 PM PST US From: "John Jessen" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Transition Training Better yet, we are having our NW RV-10 spring dinner on the 12th. Come to that and meet a whole gaggle of builders. The dinner is being hosted by Paul Grimstad. If all goes well we will have our biggest turnout, yet, complete with special guests. I'll send along the official invite. I won't be in town until the 12th, but you might want to drop by Bruce Breckenridge's hanger at Lenhardt's (5 miles from Aurora) and see what he's up to. He's right next to my hanger, so you can take a peek at mine as well. Randy Debauw is behind the two of us. Plenty to see. John Jessen do not archive _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ddddsp1@juno.com Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 3:05 PM Subject: RV10-List: Transition Training I am going to get Training from Mike Seager in 2 weeks and was curious who else was near the Vans facility besides Ed Hayden. If ED and the rest of the RV builders will be available on May 8-12 I would love to see your project, ride in your plane or just have some great hanger talk. Also, where would you recommend staying while doing the trainsition training. Just email me offline or call anytime to let me know. Thanks, DEAN 40449 402-560-9755 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:45:51 PM PST US From: Kelly McMullen Subject: Re: RV10-List: Flying the RV10 for the first time You are right. The -10 empty weight is close to my 200hp Mooney(empty 1645, gross 2575), so has better power to weight than Ovation grossing over 3300lbs and should climb better. Hmm, wonder how hard it would be to extend the baggage area in the -10. Maybe just for skiis, golf bag, etc. Tim Olson wrote: > > Well here I can't vouch for the accuracy of their article, but... > > I think the RV-10's VNE is 200kts roughly...or around 230mph. > The VNE quoted in the Ovation3 article was probably in IAS, > and I think it was 201kts IAS. So yeah, I guess the Vne isn't > really that equal, given that we're supposed to be using TAS, > and they quoted what I believe is IAS. But, they're not THAT > much faster than the -10...oh, and they praised it's great climb, > but the -10 handily outclimbs it. > > The baggage area though, you're right. The -10 has suited me > well, but if there was one thing I'd like more of,it's baggage > volume. We have lots, but my old plane had even more, and > as long as the stuff wasn't too heavy you could carry some > large things....like I stuffed in one of those 2 kid tow > behind bike carriers once...a big plastic one. Can't do that > in the -10. > > Nope, the planes are really apples and oranges, so while we > can compare specs, it's still hard to really analyze > to certain levels. > > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying > do not archive > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 06:40:28 PM PST US From: "bob.kaufmann" Subject: RE: RV10-List: They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... And both Rick and I should have our RV-10s there, and if not I'm going to twist Russ Daves arm out of the socket to get his there. Bob K _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steven Roberts Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 9:36 AM Subject: RV10-List: They need an RV10 at Nellis AFB Next Year... Off topic, but check this site out... http://www.richard-seaman.com/Aircraft/AirShows/Nellis2006/Highlights/index. html Steve Roberts Still lurking, but about to order the tail kit... ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 07:24:36 PM PST US From: Larry Rosen Subject: RV10-List: Officially an RV Builder Well it is 2 years and 5 days into my RV-10 build and this evening I officially became a RV builder. While drilling a #30 hole through the stainless FWF to mount a pass through, as my drill bit went through the stainless it slipped past the backing board and caught my finger. Fortunately it is only a slight gash. No stitches required. It's time to quit for the night, get a good night sleep and finish the final two holes in the morning. Be safe out there. -- Larry Rosen RV-10 #356 http://lrosen.nerv10.com ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 08:30:24 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Transition Training From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." John Does that mean tomorrow after I am done flying I can stop by and check out the project? I now have 7.1 hours, many landings, and am starting to feel like I have a little more control....especially when there is more weight in the back seat, but that is hard on the brakes. You will have to ask Ed about it! Dan N289DT Finally finishing it up! _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 4:05 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Transition Training Better yet, we are having our NW RV-10 spring dinner on the 12th. Come to that and meet a whole gaggle of builders. The dinner is being hosted by Paul Grimstad. If all goes well we will have our biggest turnout, yet, complete with special guests. I'll send along the official invite. I won't be in town until the 12th, but you might want to drop by Bruce Breckenridge's hanger at Lenhardt's (5 miles from Aurora) and see what he's up to. He's right next to my hanger, so you can take a peek at mine as well. Randy Debauw is behind the two of us. Plenty to see. John Jessen do not archive _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ddddsp1@juno.com Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 3:05 PM Subject: RV10-List: Transition Training I am going to get Training from Mike Seager in 2 weeks and was curious who else was near the Vans facility besides Ed Hayden. If ED and the rest of the RV builders will be available on May 8-12 I would love to see your project, ride in your plane or just have some great hanger talk. Also, where would you recommend staying while doing the trainsition training. Just email me offline or call anytime to let me know. Thanks, DEAN 40449 402-560-9755 href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic s .com/Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 09:41:53 PM PST US From: "bruce breckenridge" Subject: RV10-List: RE: Officially an RV Builder Drat! I haven't joined the club yet. Well, tomorrow starts another weekend at the hangar. No drilling planned, but I'll be using deck screws, a chop saw, and maybe a nail or two. Bruce 40018 Wing Stand ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 09:46:09 PM PST US From: "bruce breckenridge" Subject: RV10-List: RE: Transition Training Dan; Becky and I will be out at the hangar between noon and 2pm. We always welcome guests. The more visitors, the greater my chances of actually taking til 2014 to finish the plane!! We have a hangar phone - feel free to use it: 503-263-0052 (hangar 52). Bruce 40018 Wings ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rv10-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV10-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rv10-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv10-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.