Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:37 AM - Re: Climb rates at full gross (Dsyvert@aol.com)
2. 06:14 AM - Re: The Perfect Panel...major alterations (Marcus Cooper)
3. 09:05 AM - Re: The Perfect Panel...major alterations (John W. Cox)
4. 10:17 AM - Re: Trueflight 190 (KiloPapa)
5. 12:03 PM - Re: IFR EFIS (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
6. 02:34 PM - Re: empty weight (John W. Cox)
7. 02:44 PM - Spring Flying (John W. Cox)
8. 03:56 PM - Pneumatic Rivet Squeezer (Jay Brinkmeyer)
9. 04:41 PM - Re: empty weight (dougpflyrv@aol.com)
10. 05:03 PM - Re: empty weight (Mark Ritter)
11. 05:45 PM - Re: Gas leak (orchidman)
12. 06:04 PM - DVD - Pop Up Display (Robin Marks)
13. 06:25 PM - Re: DVD - Pop Up Display (Rene)
14. 06:31 PM - Sound proofing the 10 ? (John Hurst)
15. 06:50 PM - Re: Re: Rosen Sun Visor Group Buy (Don Fanning)
16. 07:06 PM - Re: DVD - Pop Up Display (Robin Marks)
17. 07:19 PM - PRK surgery (Dave Leikam)
18. 07:55 PM - Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? (John W. Cox)
19. 08:09 PM - Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? (Jay Rowe)
20. 08:10 PM - Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? (Cory Emberson)
21. 08:22 PM - Re: empty weight (ddddsp1@juno.com)
22. 08:23 PM - Re: PRK surgery (Neal George)
23. 08:31 PM - Re: PRK surgery (linn Walters)
24. 08:38 PM - Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? (John Hurst)
25. 08:38 PM - Re: empty weight (PILOTDDS@aol.com)
26. 08:43 PM - Re: PRK surgery (Lloyd, Daniel R.)
27. 08:51 PM - Re: PRK surgery (Tim Olson)
28. 09:11 PM - Re: empty weight (Marcus Cooper)
29. 09:21 PM - Re: DVD - Pop Up Display (Marcus Cooper)
30. 10:22 PM - Re: empty weight (Bill DeRouchey)
31. 10:47 PM - Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? (Ben Westfall)
32. 11:12 PM - Re: Aero Composit Prop (KiloPapa)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Climb rates at full gross |
Tim,
Tim Olson just added as section called "Tim's RV-10 FAQ" that is located
3 lines below the picture of his plane on his home page. A lot of good info.
I've copied below what he put in that section that I believe answers you
question for his configuration. He has a Hartzell though.
How fast does it go, and how fast does it climb?
The RV-10 has an approximate top speed of about 183-185kts if you equip it
with a a standard 260Hp IO-540. Refer to _Van's Aircraft_
(http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/rv-10int.htm) for their official specs, but what is listed
_here_ (http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/why/index.html) might be a fair guide
too. You can expect to cruise x/c at between 160 and 170kts. Climb while solo
is about 2100-2200fpm, and climb with 2 front seaters should easily make
1700fpm. Loaded up full, you may see an anemic reduced climb of only
1500-1600fpm on a warm day. Even up at 10,000' MSL, your climb will likely approach
900-1000fpm. In short, yeah, it is plenty fast.
Dave Syvertson
Sugar Land, TX
40625
QB fuselage
do not archieve
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 2
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| Subject: | The Perfect Panel...major alterations |
As to defining a "major alteration", here's an excerpt from the operating
limitations assigned to my RV-10 last August (sorry for the picture format,
I need to rescan the source someday). It specifically mentions changing the
"make and model" of a prop or engine in case that helps.
Marcus
40286
Great statement Bobby. Now here is a new question that goes to the
heart of Amateur Built (current rules).
Does a total change-out of engine type, prop type or major alteration to
an airframe (Down the Road) require a revisit by a DAR or PAI? Or does
the repairman have the latitude to alter the engine/prop/panel from
basic VFR to EFIS/IFR without a trail of paperwork and new set of eyes?
What latitude for modification is legal and appropriate for a kit
designed and tested VAN's RV-10?
"Round Two" - No bio required "Do you feel Lucky?"
John Cox A&P with IA
40600
Message 3
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| Subject: | The Perfect Panel...major alterations |
You win the prize Marcus. I would have added the change of
instrumentation and panel layout as well. Although notification and
request for concurrence to the FSDO was not required. Just your stated
ability to do so in the Operating Limitations. Though there is no
baseline... more than 5% BHP increase is discussed as being major.
Certification that it continues to meet the initial safe operation
perimeters is required. The EAA office can assist in making sure the
back door is left open.
Without such a clause the "Door is Closed". Once certified as
Experimental you are good to experiment every week as long as you opened
the door in the approved documents.
So placing a Thunderbolt IO-580 should really rattle some windows.
John C.
40600
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 6:13 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: The Perfect Panel...major alterations
As to defining a "major alteration", here's an excerpt from the
operating limitations assigned to my RV-10 last August (sorry for the
picture format, I need to rescan the source someday). It specifically
mentions changing the "make and model" of a prop or engine in case that
helps.
Marcus
40286
Great statement Bobby. Now here is a new question that goes to the
heart of Amateur Built (current rules).
Does a total change-out of engine type, prop type or major alteration to
an airframe (Down the Road) require a revisit by a DAR or PAI? Or does
the repairman have the latitude to alter the engine/prop/panel from
basic VFR to EFIS/IFR without a trail of paperwork and new set of eyes?
What latitude for modification is legal and appropriate for a kit
designed and tested VAN's RV-10?
"Round Two" - No bio required "Do you feel Lucky?"
John Cox A&P with IA
40600
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Trueflight 190 |
Nice write-up. Thanks.
Kevin
40494
tail/empennage
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Scott Schmidt
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 8:44 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Trueflight 190
I am actually in the process of purchasing that system. After reading
about and talking with them I am very impressed with it and I recently
received a free Samsung Q1 and thought I might as well give it a try.
It has all the weather that the 496 has plus more, and you can get all
the approach charts, taxi diagrams, and low IFR charts on it. Your plane
can overlay on all the charts I just mentioned as well. The also have
all the IFR approaches loaded into the system so you can fly the
approach on the moving map. They said within the next couple of week
they will have forward 3D synthetic vision with HITS. Later this year
they will have outputs for digital autopilots. For around $2500 for a
total system they seem pretty cool. www.aviationsafety.com
<snipped>
This selection is as frustrating as planning the perfect panel. Once
I get it I will let you know how I like it.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt@yahoo.com
Message 5
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You could also use the search feature on Matronics site or just check the forum
subject headers in that site.
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2007 10:53 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: IFR EFIS
>Does anyone know of a RV10 forum that reasonably limits itself to
builder's issues, as this was at one time?
I hear Van's has email support for builder issues :)
Other than that, the "search messages" in my email program works wonders
for filtering what I want to find information on. I now have 20,148
messages in my archive (from even before the Yahoo!s came over)
-Jim 40384
Chris Hukill wrote:
> You guys are confusing EFIS with FMS. An EFIS system (electronic
> flight instrumentation system) is just an electronic visual
> presentation of the required flight instruments for IFR (or VFR)
> flight. The first EFIS systems I flew in jets only gave you attitude
> and heading info, as the pitot static instruments were still steam
> gauges. There are still lots of JurassicJets out there flying with
> these early systems. There is no such thing as an
> "IFR EFIS" system, as if it's legal for Part 23 or 25 aircraft it's
> STC'd, and if it's legal for a homebuilt, it must be approved by the
> builder (you). The FAA only cares that the EFIS provides the flight
> instrument information to the pilot that's specified in the
> regs. Sorry Tim, a Dynon is just as "legal" as your Chelton.
> The FMS (flight management system) however is required to be
> certified IFR and has to have a current database, even in a homebuilt.
> A G430 is a FMS for example. When Chelton or whomever decides to
> combine the functions of both an EFIS system and FMS, then the
> requirement still stands that the FMS function be IFR certified (with
> or without approach capability), and the database be current.
> Does anyone know of a RV10 forum that reasonably limits itself to
> builder's issues, as this was at one time?
> Wading thru 92 rambling posts searching for some useful information
> for my build is becoming too time consuming to continue my daily lurk!
> Chris Hukill
>
>*
>
>
>*
>
Message 6
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This is a request for others of the 80 RV-10s to post their empty weight
for those of us still building.
John Cox
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 5:49 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: empty weight
Tim 1,685
Randy 1,625
Vic 1,665
Chuck 1,615
Rob 1,558
Chuck and Vic weight from <http://www.rvproject.com/wab/>
Rob, looks like you have the light weight machine. Which prop? With or
without wheel pants?
Larry Rosen
http://lrosen.nerv10.com
Message 7
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It's time for some John Jessen levity and flight time after all the IFR
build data.
http://cgi-bin.simradar.com/video_delivery/3145/vftc.ram
Now if you could just update the Xplane with the current RV10 data set
from Tim's numbers.
http://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?autocom=dlmanager&do=viewfile&fid
=45
93
John Cox
#600
Message 8
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| Subject: | Pneumatic Rivet Squeezer |
Steve,
Contact me offline if you're still looking.
Regards,
Jay Brinkmeyer
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Stella
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 2:55 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Pneumatic Rivet Squeezer
Is there anyone selling a Pneumatic Rivet Squeezer?
Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when.
http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: empty weight |
EW 1673, no paint or interior other than seats
Doug Preston
40372
N372RV
-----Original Message-----
From: John W. Cox <johnwcox@pacificnw.com>
Sent: Sun, 27 May 2007 4:33 pm
Subject: RE: RV10-List: empty weight
This is a request for others of the 80 RV-10s to post their empty weight
for those of us still building.
John Cox
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 5:49 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: empty weight
Tim 1,685
Randy 1,625
Vic 1,665
Chuck 1,615
Rob 1,558
Chuck and Vic weight from <http://www.rvproject.com/wab/>
Rob, looks like you have the light weight machine. Which prop? With or
without wheel pants?
Larry Rosen
http://lrosen.nerv10.com
________________________________________________________________________
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: empty weight |
N410MR EW 1,667. Interior and paint.
>From: dougpflyrv@aol.com
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: empty weight
>Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 19:39:45 -0400
>
>
>EW 1673, no paint or interior other than seats
>
>Doug Preston
>
>40372
>
>N372RV
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: John W. Cox <johnwcox@pacificnw.com>
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Sent: Sun, 27 May 2007 4:33 pm
>Subject: RE: RV10-List: empty weight
>
>
>
>This is a request for others of the 80 RV-10s to post their empty weight
>for those of us still building.
>
>John Cox
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
>Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 5:49 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: empty weight
>
>
>Tim 1,685
>Randy 1,625
>Vic 1,665
>Chuck 1,615
>Rob 1,558
>
>Chuck and Vic weight from <http://www.rvproject.com/wab/>
>
>Rob, looks like you have the light weight machine. Which prop? With or
>
>without wheel pants?
>
>Larry Rosen
>http://lrosen.nerv10.com
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
_________________________________________________________________
More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live Hotmail.
Message 11
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apilot2(at)gmail.com wrote:
> Your friendly NAPA or Autozone, etc. auto parts store, in their
> (aircraft) sealant's area. Right along with their Form a gasket,
> Permatex #2 & #3, epoxies, etc.
I found it in the aircraft supply section of Autozone. Previously in this thread,
it was referenced as 'Loctite 290' but all I found was 'Permatex' and their
number was PX # 29000. It is labeled 'Threadlocker Green' and 'Penetrating
Formula' so I am sure it is the correct item.
The good news is that today I tested both tanks and they got a green light, no
bubbles detected. This last week I had been baloon testing and they were going
down at a VERY slow rate which I attribute to the fact that you blow up a baloon,
tie it off and it will still go down over the course of a couple days.
So to go the extra mile, I soaped up the tanks and I am a happy camper [Laughing]
Gary
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=115110#115110
Message 12
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| Subject: | DVD - Pop Up Display |
RV-10 list,
Let me preface this post with the fact that I have a
nervous flying wife & daughter that need a distraction while traveling
in general aviation.
I was planning on including a 7" DVD pop-up display (with XM, iPod, CD
etc...) on my -10 panel plus two LCD displays in the headrests. The DVD
I ordered a nice 1 din unit at a good price on ebay ($329.00 pop up unit
only, no rear LCD's) When it arrived it was MUCH heavier than I
anticipated. I assumed that they would all be about the same weight (3-5
lbs.) so I didn't do a lot of research. My stout little unit weighs in
at 9.50 lbs before I add the rear displays. I see a few units that are
5-6 lbs but they are 2.5 times more expensive.
I was hoping to avoid lap dvd players or laptops so the pax can all have
the same dvd experience and at the same time avoid all the extra loose
hardware and chargers flying around the cabin in the case of a
unscheduled landing.
I would appreciate any suggestions as long as they don't include finding
a way to get the family into flying. I am sure when we start doing real
x-country trips on a more regular basis they will naturally (and slowly)
become more comfortable with GA travel.
Thanks in advance,
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A Fly
RV-10 parts, parts, parts
Message 13
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| Subject: | DVD - Pop Up Display |
I put a PAV80 in my panel and have two remote screens for the back
seats.
It is made by PS Engineering
(www.ps-engineering.com/entertainment.shtml.
Watch out for the price.
I am not flying yet, so I can not vouch for how well it works...
Rene'
40322 Finish or something like it..
N423CF
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 7:05 PM
Subject: RV10-List: DVD - Pop Up Display
RV-10 list,
Let me preface this post with the fact that I have a
nervous
flying wife & daughter that need a distraction while traveling in
general
aviation.
I was planning on including a 7" DVD pop-up display (with XM, iPod, CD
etc.)
on my -10 panel plus two LCD displays in the headrests. The DVD I
ordered a
nice 1 din unit at a good price on ebay ($329.00 pop up unit only, no
rear
LCD's) When it arrived it was MUCH heavier than I anticipated. I
assumed
that they would all be about the same weight (3-5 lbs.) so I didn't do a
lot
of research. My stout little unit weighs in at 9.50 lbs before I add the
rear displays. I see a few units that are 5-6 lbs but they are 2.5 times
more expensive.
I was hoping to avoid lap dvd players or laptops so the pax can all have
the
same dvd experience and at the same time avoid all the extra loose
hardware
and chargers flying around the cabin in the case of a unscheduled
landing.
I would appreciate any suggestions as long as they don't include finding
a
way to get the family into flying. I am sure when we start doing real
x-country trips on a more regular basis they will naturally (and slowly)
become more comfortable with GA travel.
Thanks in advance,
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A Fly
RV-10 parts, parts, parts
Message 14
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| Subject: | Sound proofing the 10 ? |
I have been lurking on this group for months and appreciate Everyone=A2s id
eas, suggestions, and opinions. Thanks to all. =0A =0ANow I need to ask for
advise/recommendations. I have searched this site as well as vansairforce.
net and haven=A2t found a lot of information posted pertaining to insulatio
n &/or soundproofing the RV-10. Is anyone other than Deems & Curtis soundp
roofing their aircraft? I=A2m working on the fuse and am trying to weigh th
e options, Pros vs. Cons. My thinking is that I will add something that is
approved to deaden the noise. It's what is available that has me perplexed.
Any recommendations would be appreciated. Sorry to delve off the panel dis
cussion topic, but I need to think about installation before laying the flo
ors/side panels of the fuse. Specifically, I'm looking for materials like w
hats available from aircraft spruce and SoundExproducts. http://www.aircra
ftspruce.com/catalog/appages/soundproofinstall.php. And this link I copied
from Curtis http://www.soundexproducts.com/information.html =0A =0A =0AThan
ks=0AJohn =0A#40102
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Rosen Sun Visor Group Buy |
Upps! I forgot who was listening! The Columbia was trying to get airborn
after a bad landing attempt, and miraculously busted my windshield with his
right wheel, then his prop clipped my prop, and something busted the spinner
and scrapped across the top cowl. The Sirus and Cessna 421 next in the line
were totaled. There was virtually nothing left of the Columbia, which is
under the remains of the 421 in the picture.
Now I am back to dreaming of flying the RV10 again.
Don
On 5/26/07, linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> Don, don't you know it's in poor taste to post like that??? 4,283 folks
> out there are now wondering about your mishap. I hate to tell ya, but since
> you blabbed to the whole group instead of directly to Jessee, it's time to
> come clean. And not a 'do not archive' anywhere!!!
> Linn
>
> Don Fanning wrote:
>
> Jesse,
>
> I am confirmed for the visors.
>
> Do not send them, however, due to the damage on the plane. I will
> probably be sending you the plane on a flat-bed truck shortly, if it is
> confirmed that you can help me rebuild the damage.
>
> Can you give me a rough estimate from the pics? For insurance. Of course
> we don't know how much damage is done until we thoroughly inspect it.
>
> Anyhow we can make this installation of the visors at that time.
>
> Don F.
>
>
> On 5/22/07, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
> >
> > >
> >
> > I have you on my list for the Rosen Visors. Please reply to this e-mail
> > and
> > let me know if you want a full set for $317.97 plus shipping or a half
> > set
> > for $168.99. Please include on your e-mail the desired shipping address
> > and
> > phone number. I will e-mail an invoice that you can send in with a
> > check
> > after I figure out the shipping charges. I should be able to do a
> > flat-rate
> > USPS box or something like that. I do accept paypal, but they charge a
> > fee,
> > so I would need the fee added to the amount you send.
> >
> > GOD BLESS!
> >
> > Jesse Saint
> > Saint Aviation, Inc.
> > jesse@saintaviation.com
> > www.saintaviation.com
> > Cell: 352-427-0285
> > Fax: 815-377-3694
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jim berry
> > Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2007 11:24 PM
> > To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RV10-List: Re: Rosen Sun Visor Group Buy
> >
> >
> > Jesse,
> >
> > The holes on my brace are 3/4" ctc in both axes. And please put me down
> > for
> > a set also.
> >
> > Jim Berry
> > 40482 Finishing
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=106637#106637
> > Liberty University
> > Of: 434-592-4127
> > Cel: 434-944-5347
> > email: <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=106637#106637>
> > drdonfa@gmail.com
> > Skype: drdonfanning
> > MSN Messenger: dfanning@liberty.edu
> > Web: www.luglobal.com
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
Don
Liberty University
Of: 434-592-4127
Cel: 434-944-5347
email: drdonfa@gmail.com
Skype: drdonfanning
MSN Messenger: dfanning@liberty.edu
Web: www.luglobal.com
Message 16
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| Subject: | DVD - Pop Up Display |
Rene, I found the weight of the PS head unit in the data sheets (2.8
lbs) but once you add the one screen (to be comparable to my head unit)
it's probably 4.5 lbs lighter than my unit. Unfortunately as a certified
unit I am more likely to remove my spleen (to save weight) than spend
$3,000 + $800 + 3 x $400... $4,000 for my family's aviation
entertainment. (insert additional cheep jokes here)
I am sure the PS is a great unit and maybe after I burn up my unit two
or three times the PS would have made more sense. I am sure your system
is going to be fantastic.
Thanks for your input.
Robin
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rene
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 6:25 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: DVD - Pop Up Display
I put a PAV80 in my panel and have two remote screens for the back
seats. It is made by PS Engineering
(www.ps-engineering.com/entertainment.shtml.
Watch out for the price.
I am not flying yet, so I can not vouch for how well it works.....
Rene'nd the
40322 Finish or something like it....
N423CF
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 7:05 PM
Subject: RV10-List: DVD - Pop Up Display
RV-10 list,
Let me preface this post with the fact that I have a
nervous flying wife & daughter that need a distraction while traveling
in general aviation.
I was planning on including a 7" DVD pop-up display (with XM, iPod, CD
etc...) on my -10 panel plus two LCD displays in the headrests. The DVD
I ordered a nice 1 din unit at a good price on ebay ($329.00 pop up unit
only, no rear LCD's) When it arrived it was MUCH heavier than I
anticipated. I assumed that they would all be about the same weight (3-5
lbs.) so I didn't do a lot of research. My stout little unit weighs in
at 9.50 lbs before I add the rear displays. I see a few units that are
5-6 lbs but they are 2.5 times more expensive.
I was hoping to avoid lap dvd players or laptops so the pax can all have
the same dvd experience and at the same time avoid all the extra loose
hardware and chargers flying around the cabin in the case of a
unscheduled landing.
I would appreciate any suggestions as long as they don't include finding
a way to get the family into flying. I am sure when we start doing real
x-country trips on a more regular basis they will naturally (and slowly)
become more comfortable with GA travel.
Thanks in advance,
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A Fly
RV-10 parts, parts, parts
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
Message 17
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Have any of the pilots on this list had PRK surgery or LASIK and how do
you like the results for flying?
I know this is way off the building subject but I would like to put this
question out to a large number of pilots. If you feel it is not
appropriate for this list, just let it die.
Thanks.
Dave Leikam
40496
do not archive
Message 18
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| Subject: | Sound proofing the 10 ? |
John, insulation whether Sound Attenuating or Thermal adds weight. Your
use of the work "Approved" may just imply compliant with FAR 25.283 fire
retardant "Flame Spread" standards. On the other hand as the builder,
anything you use becomes approved by your use and your DAR's acceptance,
as there is no standard. So what are your objectives again? I am a fan
of Zetex for the firewall. Remember that all insulation should be able
to be removed for future inspection of corrosion. Great insulation does
not absorb moisture but allows it to pass through like a band-aid.
Dan Newland did an article for Sport Aviation in April 2005 on this
exact subject, but my archive PDF was 15 meg so check the EAA archives.
We don't need screams from the " tin can and string crowd".
John
#40600
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hurst
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 6:30 PM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: RV10-List: Sound proofing the 10 ?
I have been lurking on this group for months and appreciate
Everyone=A2s ideas, suggestions, and opinions. Thanks to all.
Now I need to ask for advise/recommendations. I have searched this
site as well as vansairforce.net and haven=A2t found a lot of
information posted pertaining to insulation &/or soundproofing the
RV-10. Is anyone other than Deems & Curtis soundproofing their
aircraft? I=A2m working on the fuse and am trying to weigh the options,
Pros vs. Cons. My thinking is that I will add something that is approved
to deaden the noise. It's what is available that has me perplexed. Any
recommendations would be appreciated. Sorry to delve off the panel
discussion topic, but I need to think about installation before laying
the floors/side panels of the fuse. Specifically, I'm looking for
materials like whats available from aircraft spruce and SoundExproducts.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/soundproofinstall.php.
And this link I copied from Curtis
http://www.soundexproducts.com/information.html
Thanks
John
#40102
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? |
John: For better or for worse I have soundproofed/insulated my 10. I
primarily used Aircraft Spruce "Super Soundproofing Sheet" (pn 09-42719,
etc) in various thicknesses. Every external panel and floorboard (and
even the baggage door) has this stuff attached to the fuse skin (using a
spray on adhesive recommended by Sir Tim) using various thicknesses.
Under the front floorboards and forward tunnel I also put a layer of
heat/fire insulation (obtained from Abby at Flightlline). I did all
this primarily for the insulation factors since I live and fly in
Maine---and what with the ANR headsets, noise reduction was of secondary
importance. Fitting all the spaces was a bit of a chore but since the
two sides are mirror images you only have to measure and cut once for
every two spaces (and even less than that with some of the floor spaces
all the same size). I used some butcher paper initially to make the
patterns---if I had been thinking I could have marked these up as to
their location and sent them on to another builder. I would guess it
took me about 8 hours to do the whole plane, not counting the firewall
which I have yet to do. It does add some weight---maybe in the order of
5-10 lbs. Hope it keeps me warm. Jay Rowe
----- Original Message -----
From: John Hurst
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 9:30 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Sound proofing the 10 ?
I have been lurking on this group for months and appreciate
Everyone=A2s ideas, suggestions, and opinions. Thanks to all.
Now I need to ask for advise/recommendations. I have searched this
site as well as vansairforce.net and haven=A2t found a lot of
information posted pertaining to insulation &/or soundproofing the
RV-10. Is anyone other than Deems & Curtis soundproofing their
aircraft? I=A2m working on the fuse and am trying to weigh the options,
Pros vs. Cons. My thinking is that I will add something that is approved
to deaden the noise. It's what is available that has me perplexed. Any
recommendations would be appreciated. Sorry to delve off the panel
discussion topic, but I need to think about installation before laying
the floors/side panels of the fuse. Specifically, I'm looking for
materials like whats available from aircraft spruce and SoundExproducts.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/soundproofinstall.php.
And this link I copied from Curtis
http://www.soundexproducts.com/information.html
Thanks
John
#40102
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
5/26/2007 10:47 AM
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? |
Hi John and all...
The June Kitplanes issue has an article on soundproofing- it was
centered on Rick Lindstrom's Zenith 601XL, but I would imagine that the
non-model-specific information may be helpful.
best,
Cory
John W. Cox wrote:
> John, insulation whether Sound Attenuating or Thermal adds weight.
> Your use of the work "Approved" may just imply compliant with FAR
> 25.283 fire retardant "Flame Spread" standards. On the other hand as
> the builder, anything you use becomes approved by your use and your
> DAR's acceptance, as there is no standard. So what are your
> objectives again? I am a fan of Zetex for the firewall. Remember
> that all insulation should be able to be removed for future inspection
> of corrosion. Great insulation does not absorb moisture but allows it
> to pass through like a band-aid.
>
> Dan Newland did an article for Sport Aviation in April 2005 on this
> exact subject, but my archive PDF was 15 meg so check the EAA
> archives. We don't need screams from the " tin can and string crowd".
>
> John
>
> #40600
>
Message 21
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40449 WT. 1614 EVERYTHING less fuel!
DEAN
Message 22
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Dave -
I started wearing glasses at age 12, contacts at 16, hard lenses (to correct
horrible astigmatism) at 17. I could read without my lenses, but couldn't
see anything more than 3-ft away.
I had LASIK at 41 (almost three years ago). When I sat down on the table, I
couldn't make out the logo on my shoes (and I'm usually the short guy in the
room). Two minutes later, I was seeing 20/15. The left eye has drifted a
little, but I expected it to - the astigmatism was really bad, and I didn't
expect him to get it all. As the technology improves and if it gets any
worse, I may have it tweaked in another five years or so.
It greatly improved my flying (and everything else). No more issues with
dirt in my eyes, wind in my face, halos, foggy spots, fingerprints, focus
shifting, slipped lenses, dropped lenses, etc, etc.
Best $4000 I ever spent. Don't pay any attention to the ads - do you really
want to trust your sight to a bunch of folks who NEED to advertise to get
your money (those would be ... trainees)? Find a doc who doesn't advertise,
and who won't cut on just anybody.
After you do a little reading and a few interviews, I don't think you'll
consider PRK.
Neal George
RV-7 N8ZG
Cowling!
Have any of the pilots on this list had PRK surgery or LASIK and how do you
like the results for flying?
I know this is way off the building subject but I would like to put this
question out to a large number of pilots. If you feel it is not appropriate
for this list, just let it die.
Thanks.
Dave Leikam
40496
do not archive
Message 23
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I had Lasik done about 5 years ago. I was 20/400, correctable 20/20 with
glasses, primarily for severe astigmatism. After my surgery I was 20/20
left eye and 20/35 in the right eye. Like most old farts, I wear glasses
for reading. I have no issues with flying as I have a bifocal set of
sunglasses with the bifocals set a little further out for the instrument
panel. However, at night it's a different animal. Without glasses the
full moon looks like an upside down micky mouse head, with the 'ears'
being less bright copies of the moon. Street lights a block away have
little daggers of light (about 3 principle ones) coming out from the
light that disappear as the street light gets closer. None of this is a
major negative, but shows that Lasik isn't perfect. I'd do it over
again in a heartbeat.
Linn
Dave Leikam wrote:
> Have any of the pilots on this list had PRK surgery or LASIK and how
> do you like the results for flying?
> I know this is way off the building subject but I would like to put
> this question out to a large number of pilots. If you feel it is not
> appropriate for this list, just let it die.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Dave Leikam
> 40496
>
> do not archive
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Sound proofing the 10 ? |
John,=0A =0AThat's what concerns me. All the references that I've read stat
e that I should use contact cement (or some state that one side of the insu
lating material contains an adhesive) all of which would prevent inspection
of the aluminum structure. And yes I did mean "Approved" in the sense of t
he FAR rule. A product that will NOT absorb moisture or odor, is long lasti
ng and durable. Application for both sound and thermal barrier, more so on
the sound side. As far as weight is concerned, I didn't think that it woul
d add a considerable amount, possibly 8-10 pounds. That is just an estimat
e and I didn't think that it was an issue for my family. Considering that o
ur total weight is ~ 550 pounds (4 people).=0A =0AAlso, I'm presently looki
ng for the April 2005 Sport Aviation issue to see what's recommended. It's
on the EAA website but not linkable, its on page 52 Taming the Noise http:
//www.eaa.org/benefits/sportaviation/0504_toc.html=0A=0A=0AJohn=0A#40102=0A
=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: John W. Cox <johnwcox@pacificnw.com>
=0ATo: rv10-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 10:54:43 PM=0AS
ubject: RE: RV10-List: Sound proofing the 10 ?=0A=0A=0AJohn, insulation whe
ther Sound Attenuating or Thermal adds weight. Your use of the work
=9CApproved=9D may just imply compliant with FAR 25.283 fire retardan
t =9CFlame Spread=9D standards. On the other hand as the build
er, anything you use becomes approved by your use and your DAR=99s ac
ceptance, as there is no standard. So what are your objectives again? I a
m a fan of Zetex for the firewall. Remember that all insulation should be
able to be removed for future inspection of corrosion. Great insulation do
es not absorb moisture but allows it to pass through like a band-aid.=0ADan
Newland did an article for Sport Aviation in April 2005 on this exact subj
ect, but my archive PDF was 15 meg so check the EAA archives. We don
=99t need screams from the =9C tin can and string crowd=9D.=0AJ
ohn=0A#40600=0AFrom: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv1
0-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hurst=0ASent: Sunday, May 27
, 2007 6:30 PM=0ATo: rv10-list@matronics.com=0ASubject: RV10-List: Sound pr
oofing the 10 ?=0AI have been lurking on this group for months and apprecia
te Everyone=CA=BCs ideas, suggestions, and opinions. Thanks to all. =0A =0A
Now I need to ask for advise/recommendations. I have searched this site as
well as vansairforce.net and haven=CA=BCt found a lot of information posted
pertaining to insulation &/or soundproofing the RV-10. Is anyone other th
an Deems & Curtis soundproofing their aircraft? I=CA=BCm working on the fus
e and am trying to weigh the options, Pros vs. Cons. My thinking is that I
will add something that is approved to deaden the noise. It's what is avail
able that has me perplexed. Any recommendations would be appreciated. Sorry
to delve off the panel discussion topic, but I need to think about install
ation before laying the floors/side panels of the fuse. Specifically, I'm l
ooking for materials like whats available from aircraft spruce and SoundExp
roducts. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/soundproofinstall.p
hp. And this link I copied from Curtis http://www.soundexproducts.com/infor
mation.html =0A =0A =0AThanks=0AJohn =0A#40102=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/N
=======================
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: empty weight |
728 dd---1613 with paint no fairings
**************************************
See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 26
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Dave
Give me a call, I had PRK over 10 years ago and it was the best thing I
ever did. I was worse than 20/400 and today I am at 20/20.
Dan
N289DT RV10E
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Leikam
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 11:19 PM
Subject: RV10-List: PRK surgery
Have any of the pilots on this list had PRK surgery or LASIK and how do
you like the results for flying?
I know this is way off the building subject but I would like to put this
question out to a large number of pilots. If you feel it is not
appropriate for this list, just let it die.
Thanks.
Dave Leikam
40496
do not archive
Message 27
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|
Dave, I had it done just over a year ago. Got LASIK with INTRALASE.
Was supposed to have lots of benefits over a knife sliced flap, and
have better results.
Tested at 20/15 the next day, month, and year. No dry eyes, no
issues. Couldn't be happier. The best almost 4 grand I ever
spent on my body. Make sure to do some searches on that specific
procedure, Intralase. It's pretty new, and has some added benefits.
The doc that did me said that after he had a few dozen more patients
he was going to use that exclusively because the results he was
seeing were better than the other, and it wasn't worth having
a 2 tiered price scheme if you could consistently get better results
with the intralase. It was one of those "custom" jobs, not just
the plain jane. No halos, no nuthin' to report to the negative.
Tim
Dave Leikam wrote:
> Have any of the pilots on this list had PRK surgery or LASIK and how do
> you like the results for flying?
> I know this is way off the building subject but I would like to put this
> question out to a large number of pilots. If you feel it is not
> appropriate for this list, just let it die.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Dave Leikam
> 40496
>
> do not archive
Message 28
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Empty weight 1568, no paint or wheelpants and only upholstered seats for
interior.
Marcus
40286
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John W. Cox
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 4:34 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: empty weight
This is a request for others of the 80 RV-10s to post their empty weight
for those of us still building.
John Cox
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 5:49 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: empty weight
Tim 1,685
Randy 1,625
Vic 1,665
Chuck 1,615
Rob 1,558
Chuck and Vic weight from <http://www.rvproject.com/wab/>
Rob, looks like you have the light weight machine. Which prop? With or
without wheel pants?
Larry Rosen
http://lrosen.nerv10.com
Message 29
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| Subject: | DVD - Pop Up Display |
Robin,
I had the same concern and went with the cheapest pop-up DVD player I
could find on eBay. Shipped from China but works great overall. It was a
little heavy, although I didn't actually weigh it. The performance of the
-10 is so great that a few extra pounds is well worth keeping the family
happy. My wife measures trips in how many DVDs to take and loves it. The
only drawback with the el cheapo is it doesn't like heat too much. If I
leave it powered off until at cruise there's no issues, but on a warm day
down low it will start to skip and go stupid so I'm working on better
cooling air for it.
Marcus
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 8:05 PM
Subject: RV10-List: DVD - Pop Up Display
RV-10 list,
Let me preface this post with the fact that I have a nervous
flying wife & daughter that need a distraction while traveling in general
aviation.
I was planning on including a 7" DVD pop-up display (with XM, iPod, CD etc.)
on my -10 panel plus two LCD displays in the headrests. The DVD I ordered a
nice 1 din unit at a good price on ebay ($329.00 pop up unit only, no rear
LCD's) When it arrived it was MUCH heavier than I anticipated. I assumed
that they would all be about the same weight (3-5 lbs.) so I didn't do a lot
of research. My stout little unit weighs in at 9.50 lbs before I add the
rear displays. I see a few units that are 5-6 lbs but they are 2.5 times
more expensive.
I was hoping to avoid lap dvd players or laptops so the pax can all have the
same dvd experience and at the same time avoid all the extra loose hardware
and chargers flying around the cabin in the case of a unscheduled landing.
I would appreciate any suggestions as long as they don't include finding a
way to get the family into flying. I am sure when we start doing real
x-country trips on a more regular basis they will naturally (and slowly)
become more comfortable with GA travel.
Thanks in advance,
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A Fly
RV-10 parts, parts, parts
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: empty weight |
N939SB. 1628 with 16lbs heavier IO-540-N1, heavy alternator, and heavy starter.
Prototype IFR glass panel, paint, interior, flying.
Bill DeRouchey
Mark Ritter <mritter509@msn.com> wrote:
N410MR EW 1,667. Interior and paint.
>From: dougpflyrv@aol.com
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: empty weight
>Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 19:39:45 -0400
>
>
>EW 1673, no paint or interior other than seats
>
>Doug Preston
>
>40372
>
>N372RV
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: John W. Cox
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Sent: Sun, 27 May 2007 4:33 pm
>Subject: RE: RV10-List: empty weight
>
>
>
>This is a request for others of the 80 RV-10s to post their empty weight
>for those of us still building.
>
>John Cox
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
>Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 5:49 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: empty weight
>
>
>Tim 1,685
>Randy 1,625
>Vic 1,665
>Chuck 1,615
>Rob 1,558
>
>Chuck and Vic weight from
>
>Rob, looks like you have the light weight machine. Which prop? With or
>
>without wheel pants?
>
>Larry Rosen
>http://lrosen.nerv10.com
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
_________________________________________________________________
More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live Hotmail.
Message 31
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| Subject: | Sound proofing the 10 ? |
How many "linear ft" of this stuff are people buying?
Ben
40579 (fuse bottom skins)
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Rowe
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 8:09 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Sound proofing the 10 ?
John: For better or for worse I have soundproofed/insulated my 10. I
primarily used Aircraft Spruce "Super Soundproofing Sheet" (pn 09-42719,
etc) in various thicknesses. Every external panel and floorboard (and even
the baggage door) has this stuff attached to the fuse skin (using a spray on
adhesive recommended by Sir Tim) using various thicknesses. Under the front
floorboards and forward tunnel I also put a layer of heat/fire insulation
(obtained from Abby at Flightlline). I did all this primarily for the
insulation factors since I live and fly in Maine---and what with the ANR
headsets, noise reduction was of secondary importance. Fitting all the
spaces was a bit of a chore but since the two sides are mirror images you
only have to measure and cut once for every two spaces (and even less than
that with some of the floor spaces all the same size). I used some butcher
paper initially to make the patterns---if I had been thinking I could have
marked these up as to their location and sent them on to another builder. I
would guess it took me about 8 hours to do the whole plane, not counting the
firewall which I have yet to do. It does add some weight---maybe in the
order of 5-10 lbs. Hope it keeps me warm. Jay Rowe
----- Original Message -----
From: John Hurst <mailto:johnh38@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 9:30 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Sound proofing the 10 ?
I have been lurking on this group for months and appreciate Everyone?s
ideas, suggestions, and opinions. Thanks to all.
Now I need to ask for advise/recommendations. I have searched this site as
well as vansairforce.net and haven?t found a lot of information posted
pertaining to insulation &/or soundproofing the RV-10. Is anyone other than
Deems & Curtis soundproofing their aircraft? I?m working on the fuse and am
trying to weigh the options, Pros vs. Cons. My thinking is that I will add
something that is approved to deaden the noise. It's what is available that
has me perplexed. Any recommendations would be appreciated. Sorry to delve
off the panel discussion topic, but I need to think about installation
before laying the floors/side panels of the fuse. Specifically, I'm looking
for materials like whats available from aircraft spruce and SoundExproducts.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/soundproofinstall.php. And
this link I copied from Curtis
http://www.soundexproducts.com/information.html
Thanks
John
#40102
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_____
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| Subject: | Re: Aero Composit Prop |
Prop looks good!
Kevin
40494
----- Original Message -----
From: Albert Gardner
To: ibspud@roadrunner.com
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2007 11:16 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Aero Composit Prop
I picked up my prop in Redding, CA, Thursday at American Propeller.
AeroComposites send the blades and hub there for assembly. It was crated
very well but the size of the box made me wonder if I needed a bigger
engine. Fortunately, when I opened the box the prop was much smaller
than the box.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
40-422
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