Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:57 AM - Re: Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces (Tim Olson)
2. 04:08 AM - Re: Static problems (Tim Olson)
3. 04:21 AM - Re: Static problems (Jack Sargeant)
4. 05:02 AM - Re: Painting fuel tanks (Wayne Edgerton)
5. 05:05 AM - Re: Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces (Wayne Edgerton)
6. 05:42 AM - Re: Re: Static problems (Sam Marlow)
7. 05:45 AM - Re: Static problems (Sam Marlow)
8. 05:47 AM - Re: Static problems (Sam Marlow)
9. 06:54 AM - Re: Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces (Lloyd, Daniel R.)
10. 07:21 AM - Another RV-10 flies in Southern California (Pascal)
11. 09:04 AM - Dynon Deliveries (Cal Hoffman)
12. 09:58 AM - Re: Dynon Deliveries (Jesse Saint)
13. 10:31 AM - Re: Static problems (Scott Gesele)
14. 10:56 AM - FW: RV-List: Dynon EFIS (Lloyd, Daniel R.)
15. 11:17 AM - Re: Magnetometer location (was Dynon Deliveries) (Vernon Smith)
16. 11:34 AM - Re: Potential Gotcha on HS stabilizer attachment (looking (Bill Reining)
17. 12:01 PM - Re: Static problems (Dave Saylor)
18. 12:03 PM - Starter damage after kick back on hot start (Randy DeBauw)
19. 12:07 PM - Re: Magnetometer location (was Dynon Deliveries) (John Testement)
20. 12:19 PM - Re: Dynon Deliveries ()
21. 12:34 PM - smaller diameter scat tubing in the tunnel? (Chris Johnston)
22. 03:17 PM - Re: Re: Potential Gotcha on HS stabilizer attachment (looking (Dsyvert@aol.com)
23. 03:17 PM - Re: Starter damage after kick back on hot start (Marcus Cooper)
24. 04:38 PM - Re: Static problems (Sam Marlow)
25. 04:43 PM - Re: Static problems (Sam Marlow)
26. 09:57 PM - Re: Starter damage after kick back on hot start (Werner Schneider)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces |
The flaps and ailerons will come out better painted separately and
they're easy to remove. The tanks could be painted either way but
you'll have to be REALLY careful if you paint them off the plane because
when you torque down the screws you're likely to crack the paint in
the dimple. Painting over the screws eliminates that, but you may
crack the paint IF, and that's a big if, you end up removing the
tanks. I figure with luck, you'll be removing the tanks about the
same time 15 years from now that you want a new paint job.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
John Gonzalez wrote:
>
> What are the benefits to painting them seperately?
>
> My question is: are most people painting their control surfaces
> seperately so the paint will be evenly distributed into the recesses or
> is simply moving the control surface up and down enough to get the paint
> in there?
>
> John G.
>
>
>> From: "The McGough Family" <VHMUM@bigpond.com>
>> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
>> Subject: RV10-List: Painting fuel tanks
>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:53:34 +1000
>>
>>
>> Just wondering if people are taking there fuel tanks off to paint the
>> wings
>>
>> Chris 388
>>
>>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Static problems |
I'm going to combine 4 replies into one.
Sam Marlow wrote:
## I installed the Cleveland Tool flush ports.
Well, if they're the old flush flat Cleveland ports, then that's good
for at least about 1/3 of your 20kt error right there. If they're the
domed ones, they may have less error.
##I just had a static check by an avionics shop, no leaks, IFR
certified. I'm baffled.
Did they check the PITOT system for leakdown too? The IFR static
test is far far more relaxed on the pitot side than the static side,
and they really only bother to test for leaks in many cases. The
suggestion given to use surgical tubing and check for leakdown is
a good one...even if they said it passed.
## I have both EFIS and analog, and they agree with each other.
Of course...even a leaky system could possibly have a pressure
inside it that's common along the whole system, so that doesn't
surprise me.
## Good thought but I have full size backup instruments, and the EFIS
agrees with the analog readings.
Full size, or small, the leaks could be anywhere, if they exist.
From what I've read, it's very hard to get pitot errors from
mis-angled pitots without it being a really big angle error. If
your pitot is mounted in the standard way, and sits down low enough
from the wing, and there are no bugs and stuff in it, then it is
not likely the problem. That really brings you back to either
a pitot leak, static problem, or port type/position problem. There's
not going to be a silver bullet, so it's just time to roll up
the sleeves and start digging. I replaced my static ports even
after the plane was painted. If yours are the flat ones I'd
start there and then fly the 4-way GPS and see where you're at.
It's not going to come free, so it'll just take some time,
and eventually you should be able to get within a couple KTS.
Tim
Message 3
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How are your altimeter and vertical speed indicators? If they are correct
then it's unlikely that you have a static issue since they also use the
static port for their sensing. Only the airspeed uses the pitot, however,
so I'd start looking there. Possibly a kink in the pitot line, or a pinch,
or something restricting it.
Jack & Cecilia Sargeant
1127 Patricia St.
Wichita, KS 67208-2642
316/683-5268
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Sam Marlow
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 9:13 AM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: RV10-List: Static problems
I'm having static problems, I think, not sure where to look though.
Indicated airspeed seams to be accurate on the bottom end but 20 to 30 knots
slow at cruise, verified with chase plane. The static was checked and
certified IFR by an avionics shop, with no leaks. Looking for ideas......
Thanks,
Sam
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Painting fuel tanks |
I was at Grady's yesterday, Glo Custom Painting, ands I noticed on
a plane there were painting that they had removed almost all the screws
in the tank when they painted it to fill the dimple holes with paint but
they didn't remove the tank.
Wayne Edgerton #40336
newbie flying
Time: 07:54:07 PM PST US
From: "The McGough Family" <VHMUM@bigpond.com>
Subject: Painting fuel tanks
Just wondering if people are taking there fuel tanks off to paint
the wings
Chris 388
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces |
In the case of Glo Customs method, they remove all the control surfaces
before painting and then paint each seperately.
Wayne Edgerton #40336
Time: 09:04:56 PM PST US
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo@msn.com>
Subject: Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces
What are the benefits to painting them seperately?
My question is: are most people painting their control surfaces
seperately
so the paint will be evenly distributed into the recesses or is
simply
moving the control surface up and down enough to get the paint in
there?
John G.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Static problems |
Thanks.
Do not archive.
AirMike wrote:
>
> My I.A. friend suggested that it could be water accumulating.
> He told me to put a sump in my system. Spruce sells a cheap sump.
> I was directed to put a low point in the static lines for water to accumulate.
> Had to run my lines up the port side, so after routing them high, they dropped
down to the floor aft of the baggage bay.
>
> Good luck - hope this helps
>
> --------
> OSH '08 or Bust
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120657#120657
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Static problems |
Thanks Tim, this is a tough one, I guess it'll just take some digging.
Sam
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> I'm going to combine 4 replies into one.
>
>
> Sam Marlow wrote:
> ## I installed the Cleveland Tool flush ports.
>
> Well, if they're the old flush flat Cleveland ports, then that's good
> for at least about 1/3 of your 20kt error right there. If they're the
> domed ones, they may have less error.
>
>
> ##I just had a static check by an avionics shop, no leaks, IFR
> certified. I'm baffled.
>
> Did they check the PITOT system for leakdown too? The IFR static
> test is far far more relaxed on the pitot side than the static side,
> and they really only bother to test for leaks in many cases. The
> suggestion given to use surgical tubing and check for leakdown is
> a good one...even if they said it passed.
>
>
> ## I have both EFIS and analog, and they agree with each other.
>
> Of course...even a leaky system could possibly have a pressure
> inside it that's common along the whole system, so that doesn't
> surprise me.
>
>
> ## Good thought but I have full size backup instruments, and the EFIS
> agrees with the analog readings.
>
> Full size, or small, the leaks could be anywhere, if they exist.
> From what I've read, it's very hard to get pitot errors from
> mis-angled pitots without it being a really big angle error. If
> your pitot is mounted in the standard way, and sits down low enough
> from the wing, and there are no bugs and stuff in it, then it is
> not likely the problem. That really brings you back to either
> a pitot leak, static problem, or port type/position problem. There's
> not going to be a silver bullet, so it's just time to roll up
> the sleeves and start digging. I replaced my static ports even
> after the plane was painted. If yours are the flat ones I'd
> start there and then fly the 4-way GPS and see where you're at.
> It's not going to come free, so it'll just take some time,
> and eventually you should be able to get within a couple KTS.
>
> Tim
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Static problems |
I've ran the lines to check for kinks etc, nothing I can see. It's a
tough one for sure.
Jack Sargeant wrote:
> How are your altimeter and vertical speed indicators? If they are
> correct then it's unlikely that you have a static issue since they
> also use the static port for their sensing. Only the airspeed uses
> the pitot, however, so I'd start looking there. Possibly a kink in
> the pitot line, or a pinch, or something restricting it.
>
>
> Jack & Cecilia Sargeant
> 1127 Patricia St.
> Wichita, KS 67208-2642
> 316/683-5268
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]*On Behalf Of *Sam Marlow
> *Sent:* Monday, June 25, 2007 9:13 AM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RV10-List: Static problems
>
> I'm having static problems, I think, not sure where to look
> though. Indicated airspeed seams to be accurate on the bottom end
> but 20 to 30 knots slow at cruise, verified with chase plane. The
> static was checked and certified IFR by an avionics shop, with no
> leaks. Looking for ideas......
> Thanks,
> Sam
>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 9
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| Subject: | Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces |
Paint them apart, and if stripes transition the gap make sure you check
for conformity.
Dan
N289DT RV10E (This thing is taking forever to get back from paint)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 12:05 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Painting fuel tanks, control surfaces
<indigoonlatigo@msn.com>
What are the benefits to painting them seperately?
My question is: are most people painting their control surfaces
seperately
so the paint will be evenly distributed into the recesses or is simply
moving the control surface up and down enough to get the paint in there?
John G.
>From: "The McGough Family" <VHMUM@bigpond.com>
>To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RV10-List: Painting fuel tanks
>Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:53:34 +1000
>
<VHMUM@bigpond.com>
>
>Just wondering if people are taking there fuel tanks off to paint the
wings
>
>Chris 388
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Another RV-10 flies in Southern California |
I know John and spoke with him. He had a great flight and Dave flew
chase.
--------------
Congratulations to John Rost for making the first flight of his RV-10 at
Chino Airport on Sunday afternoon, June 24, 2007.
The flight went off perfectly and John built a very nice airplane.
Congratulations John!
Dave Klages
RV-8 - N808DK - "Hog"
Message 11
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| Subject: | Dynon Deliveries |
If anyone has any influence with Dynon, I need help.
Dynon has now slipped the delivery of my D-10 EMS to 15 July for the
instrument and September for the wiring and probe kit (O-540). My
original order date was 1 March, through Spruce, with a 21 May delivery
date!!
That is 105 days for the instrument and 150 days plus for the
wiring/probes.
I cannot install my engine until I have the wiring runs complete and may
have to look at an alternative..
Cal Hoffman (40119)
Change the world one loan at a time - visit Kiva.org to find out how
Message 12
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| Subject: | Dynon Deliveries |
You should be able to install your engine before doing the wiring. It is a
little easier to get the wiring in first, but you don't have to.
Do not archive
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
www.saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cal Hoffman
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 12:06 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Dynon Deliveries
If anyone has any influence with Dynon, I need help.
Dynon has now slipped the delivery of my D-10 EMS to 15 July for the
instrument and September for the wiring and probe kit (O-540). My original
order date was 1 March, through Spruce, with a 21 May delivery date!!
That is 105 days for the instrument and 150 days plus for the wiring/probes.
I cannot install my engine until I have the wiring runs complete and may
have to look at an alternative..
Cal Hoffman (40119)
Change the world one loan at a time - visit Kiva.org to find out how
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Static problems |
> Time: 07:13:44 AM PST US
> From: Sam Marlow <sam@fr8dog.net>
> Subject: RV10-List: Static problems
>
> I'm having static problems, I think, not sure where
> to look though.
> Indicated airspeed seams to be accurate on the
> bottom end but 20 to 30
> knots slow at cruise, verified with chase plane. The
> static was checked
> and certified IFR by an avionics shop, with no
> leaks. Looking for
> ideas......
> Thanks,
> Sam
>
There are three potential sources for your error:
pitot, static, or instrument.
Pitot:
Is your pitot installed exactly per Van's
instructions? If not, what changes have been made? A
pitot leak can be checked, and the instruments checked
for error, by using the method contained in the
following link:
http://www.iflyez.com/manometer.shtml
Many heated pitot tubes have a drain port. Ensure
that it is covered when performing the test. You may
want to try a test flight with the drain port covered.
All the drain port does is allow an exit path for
water. Don't fly in the rain with the drain covered.
Static:
Just because the system was checked for leaks during
an IFR cert, does not rule out static errors. You
mentioned flush ports. These have been the cause of
numerous static errors on the RV fleet. Static errors
may be a function of airspeed. You can use GPS
altitude to determine if you have a static error that
is a function of airspeed. In VFR, severe clear,
conditions, start with the aircraft at rest on the
ground. Adjust the altimeter setting until the
altimeter matches the GPS altitude. Go fly. Start at
a safe altitude and Vs+10 kts. Record both the GPS
altitude and indicated altitude at various airspeeds
as the aircraft accelerates to cruise. Repeat as the
aircraft is slowed from cruise to Vs+10 kts (power at
idle). Perform this test while maintaining a specific
indicated altitude. Obtain the local altimeter
setting and land. If the above test shows the
indicated altitude to be less than the GPS altitude,
then your static port is reading a higher than ambient
pressure. This will cause an airspeed error.
Instrument:
The pitot test above will check both the pitot system
for leaks, and the accuracy of the instruments.
Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097
Message 14
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| Subject: | FW: RV-List: Dynon EFIS |
for those that are looking for a Dynon
Dan
N289DT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill VonDane
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 1:19 PM
Subject: RV-List: Dynon EFIS
--> RV-List message posted by: Bill VonDane <bill@vondane.com>
Sorry for the advertisement, but I thought this would be useful to
someone on the list...
I am a Dynon dealer and have an extra EFIS-D100 and EMS-D120 ready to
ship that a customer decided he didn't want, so if anyone is in the
market to get one now instead of in 12 week PLEASE CONTACT ME OFF
LIST...
I would like to sell as a complete system...
-Bill VonDane
www.epanelbuilder.com
bill@epanelbuilder.com
719-510-0854
Message 15
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| Subject: | Magnetometer location (was Dynon Deliveries) |
Talking about wiring Dynons. Where are people mounting their magnetometer?
If it is behind the baggage area at longron level is there any magnetic int
erference with the two cables for the rear seat shoulder harnesses? Or shou
ld it be mounted higher or in the wing tip?
Vern Smith (#324 fuselage)
From: jesse@saintaviation.comTo: rv10-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: RV10-L
ist: Dynon DeliveriesDate: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:57:52 -0400
You should be able to install your engine before doing the wiring. It is a
little easier to get the wiring in first, but you don=92t have to.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
www.saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail to go? Get your Hotmail, news, sports and much more! Check out the
New MSN Mobile!
http://mobile.msn.com
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Potential Gotcha on HS stabilizer attachment (looking |
What did Van's say?
I'd be very interested in their opinion whether this is indeed a critical
area. Has anyone talked to them about this issue? If I missed it in the
thread, my apologies.
Bill (and Jon) Reining
40514
Message 17
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Sam,
When we get static checks, they only test the pitot system if we ask. Even
then it's an "information only" type check, no certification. There's no
requirement for a pitot check in 91.411/413, so having the static system IFR
certified could still leave you with a pitot problem.
If you are looking for a pitot leak, remember that it won't show up as a low
airspeed indication with the test I suggested. Airspeed will go to whatever
you put in, then bleed off. If the leak is pretty big, you might not see
any indication at all, but since you are getting something close at lower
speeds, I doubt you have a huge leak.
The fact that two instruments agree pretty well rules out instrument error
but not a leak common to both.
What happens when you open the alternate static port?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Marlow
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 9:02 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Static problems
I just had a static check by an avionics shop, no leaks, IFR certified. I'm
baffled.
Message 18
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| Subject: | Starter damage after kick back on hot start |
We about a week ago I gave a friend a ride in Central Washington. It
was in the low 90's deg oat. I dropped him off and I was on the ground
for 5 - 8 min. When I tried my normal hot restart I have been using for
2 years experienced a kick back. This was not normal at all and to keep
it from doing it again I went full rich on mix and ran fuel pump for 5
seconds or so to add some cold fuel to the cylinders. I knew that it
would give me a flooded condition but that was my intent. This added
cool fuel the intake and I was able to make a flooded hot start with no
problem. Here is the issue. Immediately after the kick back the
starter started to make a grinding noise much like the old Chevy
starters that needed shimming. I pulled apart the starter last night
and looked it over. It looked fine. I called SkyTec this morning and the
confirmed that a kick back will almost always cause a bent shaft in the
starter. They make the starter so that it will give way on kick backs
and save the ring gear. They said that to replace every part in the
starter cost 150.00 buck and is a lot cheaper than messing with a new
flywheel ring gear. I agree!. So be aware if a kick back happens to you
and a new noise develops. Randy 40006
Message 19
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| Subject: | Magnetometer location (was Dynon Deliveries) |
I put my magnetometer (Pinpoint) in the 1st inboard wing bay just next
to
the access cover. I don't have any data yet on how it will work there. I
do
believe that it is out of the way of any interference.
John Testement
HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt@roadmapscoaching.com"jwt@roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Paint prep and LOTS of misc stuff
do not archive
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Smith
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 2:16 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Magnetometer location (was Dynon Deliveries)
Talking about wiring Dynons. Where are people mounting their
magnetometer?
If it is behind the baggage area at longron level is there any magnetic
interference with the two cables for the rear seat shoulder harnesses?
Or
should it be mounted higher or in the wing tip?
Vern Smith (#324 fuselage)
_____
From: jesse@saintaviation.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Dynon Deliveries
You should be able to install your engine before doing the wiring. It
is a
little easier to get the wiring in first, but you don=92t have to.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
HYPERLINK "mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com"jesse@saintaviation.com
HYPERLINK "http://www.saintaviation.com/" \nwww.saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
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5:32 PM
5:32 PM
Message 20
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| Subject: | Dynon Deliveries |
Cal:
I ordered dual GRT EFIS this past spring. I was quoted 8 weeks, and it
arrived in 9, all in one box...complete. I am still in the process of
installing, so I can't address the quality of the unit, however, the
customer service was more than I expected.
Steve Mills N750SM (reserved)
RV-10 40486 Slow-build
Naperville, Illinois
Finishing kit Eggenfellner E6-T
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Cal Hoffman
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 11:06 AM
To: RV 10 List
Subject: RV10-List: Dynon Deliveries
If anyone has any influence with Dynon, I need help.
Dynon has now slipped the delivery of my D-10 EMS to 15 July for the
instrument and September for the wiring and probe kit (O-540). My original
order date was 1 March, through Spruce, with a 21 May delivery date!!
That is 105 days for the instrument and 150 days plus for the
wiring/probes.
I cannot install my engine until I have the wiring runs complete and may
have to look at an alternative..
Cal Hoffman (40119)
Change the world one loan at a time - visit Kiva.org to find out how
Message 21
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| Subject: | smaller diameter scat tubing in the tunnel? |
Hey all -
Perused the archives but could find nothing relating, so here goes...
has anyone thought about using smaller diameter scat tubing in the
tunnel to route heat to the rear pax? I know you'd need to neck it down
somehow to attach, but it'd make the tunnel a bit less tight with
everything that's going on in there. what say you all?
cj
#40410
fuse/finishing
www.perfectlygoodairplane.net
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Potential Gotcha on HS stabilizer attachment (looking |
Bill,
I will send it to them and let everyone know.
Dave Syvertson
40625
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Starter damage after kick back on hot start |
Randy,
I had exactly the same thing happen after one of my first few starts,
hadn't even flown the airplane yet. I did some research on the list and
found this to not be uncommon. While avoidable I guess, I opted for the
heavier duty starter per others recommendations and it's been great ever
since. If I remember correctly it also has a different failure mode that
enables you to replace one part vs. the whole starter. I recommend you do a
search on the list for similar issues.
Marcus
40286
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Randy DeBauw
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 1:55 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Starter damage after kick back on hot start
We about a week ago I gave a friend a ride in Central Washington. It was in
the low 90's deg oat. I dropped him off and I was on the ground for 5 - 8
min. When I tried my normal hot restart I have been using for 2 years
experienced a kick back. This was not normal at all and to keep it from
doing it again I went full rich on mix and ran fuel pump for 5 seconds or so
to add some cold fuel to the cylinders. I knew that it would give me a
flooded condition but that was my intent. This added cool fuel the intake
and I was able to make a flooded hot start with no problem. Here is the
issue. Immediately after the kick back the starter started to make a
grinding noise much like the old Chevy starters that needed shimming. I
pulled apart the starter last night and looked it over. It looked fine. I
called SkyTec this morning and the confirmed that a kick back will almost
always cause a bent shaft in the starter. They make the starter so that it
will give way on kick backs and save the ring gear. They said that to
replace every part in the starter cost 150.00 buck and is a lot cheaper than
messing with a new flywheel ring gear. I agree!. So be aware if a kick back
happens to you and a new noise develops. Randy 40006
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Static problems |
Thanks Scott, I'll try that ASAP, will let the world know the results!
Scott Gesele wrote:
>
>
>
>> Time: 07:13:44 AM PST US
>> From: Sam Marlow <sam@fr8dog.net>
>> Subject: RV10-List: Static problems
>>
>> I'm having static problems, I think, not sure where
>> to look though.
>> Indicated airspeed seams to be accurate on the
>> bottom end but 20 to 30
>> knots slow at cruise, verified with chase plane. The
>> static was checked
>> and certified IFR by an avionics shop, with no
>> leaks. Looking for
>> ideas......
>> Thanks,
>> Sam
>>
>>
> There are three potential sources for your error:
> pitot, static, or instrument.
>
> Pitot:
> Is your pitot installed exactly per Van's
> instructions? If not, what changes have been made? A
> pitot leak can be checked, and the instruments checked
> for error, by using the method contained in the
> following link:
>
> http://www.iflyez.com/manometer.shtml
>
> Many heated pitot tubes have a drain port. Ensure
> that it is covered when performing the test. You may
> want to try a test flight with the drain port covered.
> All the drain port does is allow an exit path for
> water. Don't fly in the rain with the drain covered.
>
> Static:
> Just because the system was checked for leaks during
> an IFR cert, does not rule out static errors. You
> mentioned flush ports. These have been the cause of
> numerous static errors on the RV fleet. Static errors
> may be a function of airspeed. You can use GPS
> altitude to determine if you have a static error that
> is a function of airspeed. In VFR, severe clear,
> conditions, start with the aircraft at rest on the
> ground. Adjust the altimeter setting until the
> altimeter matches the GPS altitude. Go fly. Start at
> a safe altitude and Vs+10 kts. Record both the GPS
> altitude and indicated altitude at various airspeeds
> as the aircraft accelerates to cruise. Repeat as the
> aircraft is slowed from cruise to Vs+10 kts (power at
> idle). Perform this test while maintaining a specific
> indicated altitude. Obtain the local altimeter
> setting and land. If the above test shows the
> indicated altitude to be less than the GPS altitude,
> then your static port is reading a higher than ambient
> pressure. This will cause an airspeed error.
>
> Instrument:
> The pitot test above will check both the pitot system
> for leaks, and the accuracy of the instruments.
>
>
>
> Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
> in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
> http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097
>
>
>
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Static problems |
It jumps 20 + knots when disconnected! I watched the pitot test, he put
a reference speed of 150kts in the test box, and my airspeed indicated
148kts. I don't understand what's happening here, but not giving up yet.
Thanks for the response!
Dave Saylor wrote:
> Sam,
>
> When we get static checks, they only test the pitot system if we ask.
> Even then it's an "information only" type check, no certification.
> There's no requirement for a pitot check in 91.411/413, so having the
> static system IFR certified could still leave you with a pitot problem.
>
> If you are looking for a pitot leak, remember that it won't show up as
> a low airspeed indication with the test I suggested. Airspeed will go
> to whatever you put in, then bleed off. If the leak is pretty big,
> you might not see any indication at all, but since you are getting
> something close at lower speeds, I doubt you have a huge leak.
>
> The fact that two instruments agree pretty well rules out instrument
> error but not a leak common to both.
>
> What happens when you open the alternate static port?
>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters LLC
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA
> 831-722-9141
> 831-750-0284 CL
> www.AirCraftersLLC.com
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Sam Marlow
> *Sent:* Monday, June 25, 2007 9:02 PM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Static problems
>
> I just had a static check by an avionics shop, no leaks, IFR
> certified. I'm baffled.
>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Starter damage after kick back on hot start |
We had that failure a month ago in Whitehorse, a Glastar with an O-360
and a Prince prop and ignition about 3 deg to much on advance, the
starter bracket cracked so we had to wait for another one to replace it
and then adjust ignition first. Light props are more prone to be victim
to that then "heavy" metal props with more momentum.
br Werner
Marcus Cooper wrote:
>
> Randy,
>
> I had exactly the same thing happen after one of my first few starts,
> hadnt even flown the airplane yet. I did some research on the list
> and found this to not be uncommon. While avoidable I guess, I opted
> for the heavier duty starter per others recommendations and its been
> great ever since. If I remember correctly it also has a different
> failure mode that enables you to replace one part vs. the whole
> starter. I recommend you do a search on the list for similar issues.
>
> Marcus
>
> 40286
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Randy DeBauw
> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 26, 2007 1:55 PM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RV10-List: Starter damage after kick back on hot start
>
> We about a week ago I gave a friend a ride in Central Washington. It
> was in the low 90s deg oat. I dropped him off and I was on the ground
> for 5 8 min. When I tried my normal hot restart I have been using
> for 2 years experienced a kick back. This was not normal at all and to
> keep it from doing it again I went full rich on mix and ran fuel pump
> for 5 seconds or so to add some cold fuel to the cylinders. I knew
> that it would give me a flooded condition but that was my intent. This
> added cool fuel the intake and I was able to make a flooded hot start
> with no problem. Here is the issue. Immediately after the kick back
> the starter started to make a grinding noise much like the old Chevy
> starters that needed shimming. I pulled apart the starter last night
> and looked it over. It looked fine. I called SkyTec this morning and
> the confirmed that a kick back will almost always cause a bent shaft
> in the starter. They make the starter so that it will give way on kick
> backs and save the ring gear. They said that to replace every part in
> the starter cost 150.00 buck and is a lot cheaper than messing with a
> new flywheel ring gear. I agree!. So be aware if a kick back happens
> to you and a new noise develops. Randy 40006
>
> * *
> * *
> **
> **
> **
> **
> **
> **
> * *
> *
>
>
> *
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