Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:23 AM - Value of the List... (Matt Dralle)
1. 04:32 AM - Re: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit (Patrick ONeill)
2. 04:52 AM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (Phillips, Jack)
3. 05:25 AM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (gary)
4. 07:35 AM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (MauleDriver)
5. 09:24 AM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (Pascal)
6. 09:39 AM - Re: Fw: RV-A Nose gear AD ()
7. 09:40 AM - Re: Trim troubles and mods (gary)
8. 10:05 AM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (MauleDriver)
9. 10:41 AM - Re: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit (Bill DeRouchey)
10. 11:45 AM - Re: Trim troubles and mods (sergiolov)
11. 12:24 PM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (jdalton77)
12. 02:11 PM - Re: Trim troubles and mods (Bob-tcw)
13. 02:26 PM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (John W. Cox)
14. 02:38 PM - Wheel Fairing Air Access covers (Sam Marlow)
15. 03:12 PM - Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time (rv10builder)
16. 03:24 PM - Extra Rivethead Door Handles (bcondrey)
17. 03:37 PM - Re: Wheel Fairing Air Access covers (Bruce Patton)
18. 05:43 PM - Re: Extra Rivethead Door Handles (bcondrey)
19. 07:37 PM - Re: Wheel Fairing Air Access covers (Randy Lervold)
20. 07:59 PM - Re: Trim troubles and mods (kilopapa@antelecom.net)
21. 08:17 PM - RV Pilot at Whiteman (WHP) (Robin Marks)
22. 08:20 PM - Check those tires. (John Dunne)
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Subject: | Value of the List... |
If you look forward to checking your List email everyday (and a lot of you have
written to say that you do!), then you're probably getting at least $20 or $30
worth of Entertainment from the Lists each year. You'd pay twice that for a
subscription to some lame magazine or even a dinner out. Isn't the List worth
at least that much to you? Wouldn't it be great if you could pay that amount and
get a well-managed media source free of advertising, SPAM, and viruses? Come
to think of it, you do... :-)
Won't you please take a minute to make your Contribution today and support the
Lists?
Contribution Page:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Again, I want to say THANK YOU to everyone that has made a Contribution thus far
during this year's List Fund Raiser!! These Lists are made possible exclusively
through YOUR generosity!!
Thank you for your support!
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
Message 1
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Subject: | Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit |
Thanks Bill. That's great info for the alignment. It is also great to
hear
some results from the compass observations.
With the AHRS mounted so far aft of the lateral axis, are there any
artifacts in the attitude indication? It sounds like no, but that was
something I always wondered about.
Best Regards,
Patrick #40715
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
DeRouchey
Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:48 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
Two successful Xbow 420 installations:
Since the Xbow 420 incorporates orientation sensors and a three axis
magnetometer we located the unit close to the origin of all three axis
as
practical but moved outside the hard iron magnetic fields.
We constructed a flat plate approx .125 thick and installed it where the
rear seat shoulder harness cable is bolted to the upper longeron. It
spans
the fuselage width wise and we relocated the seat belt cable to the
front
lip of this plate. Used the same three holes on each side that was
originally for the shoulder harness anchor. Also over engineered it with
an
.063 Tee running laterally to stiffen any up and down vibrations. The
NAV420
is on the top and centered laterally.
I measured the magnetic fields around the elevator trim motor and the
elevator trim motor/battery and they will interfere with a compass 24"
away.
Do not underestimate the field around the small elevator trim motor - it
is
significant.
This location was outside both fore and aft magnetic fields and has a
significant advantage. If the plate is flat on the longeron and at right
angles to the yaw centerline it will automatically have two axis
perfectly
aligned. Simply run a string from front center to the tail center to
form
the yaw axis and center the NAV420 on this string to align the third
axis.
No installation correction was needed for either RV-10 with this
approach.
Do not even think of locating a magnetometer anywhere near the baggage
compartment. The magnetic interference can easily be significant and
uncontrollable.
Sorry I do not have a picture.
Bill DeRouchey
N939SB, flying
Patrick Thyssen <jump2@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Here is my mount for the 420 ahrs.
I can build a shelf on the four posts if I need to get it 6 inchs higher
away from battery and servo. I'm a good 20 " away now. Will try to demag
the
cable if not see about stainless.
Pat Thyssen
"Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr@sprint.com> wrote:
That nice gold finish is PPG Armor Grip. I think it is 900 and
901.
Thank You
Ray Doerr
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick
ONeill
Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 1:10 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
Thanks much for the pictures Ray! That helps a lot.
Unfortunately, I don't think I can use that as the AHRS station. The
xbow
NAV 420 has an integrated 3-axis magnetometer. I can imagine the grief
trying to situate it 6 inches from a main battery wire. So it's back to
the
shelf plan for me.
But that might be another useful station for something else. I'll have
to
keep that bracket in mind for the future.
By the way, how are you prepping the inside of the tail cone surfaces?
Is
that all just alodine? Looks great!
Anyone else currently flying with OP EFIS? Any location success stories
or
problems with the NAV 420 AHRS?
Best Regards,
Patrick #40715
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R
[NTK]
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 6:01 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
<> <> <>
<> <> <>
<> <> <>
I was working with Garmin here in Olathe on this bracket and
testing
it using my RV-10. Here are all the pictures I provided to Garmin
during
this process. Van's actually created the bracket with the feedback that
was
provided my Scott (Garmin) and myself.
By the way, I don't have either AHRS, but this bracket still
makes
an excellent support for a 1" x 8" board when you need to crawl back
into
the tail. We are still working on the bracket for the Magnometer,
problem
is finding a good location that is free of magnetic interference to the
standards which Garmin has set for the Certified installations.
Thank You
Ray Doerr
40250
N519RV
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick
ONeill
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 6:08 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
I just noticed that Van's is offering an AHRS mounting kit for the 10:
AHRS Mount Kit for the RV-10
Part Number = IF AHRS MOUNT-10
Description
Mount for Attitude Heading Reference System unit.
Provides parts to mount the AHRS unit for either the Garmin G900XT or
the
Grand Rapids EFIS. Locates unit behind baggage bulkhead on RV-7, RV-9,
and
RV-10.
Has anyone received one of these or better yet, any photos? I'm not
getting
a clear picture of what it entails from
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Subject: | Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
Hi Mike,
There is not a hard and fast rule about when the inspections need to be
done, but in general, before a section is closed up, an inspection is
probably appropriate. It was good for you to have the empennage
inspected since most of the skills required to build the airplane are
developed in that section.
Since you are building a Q/B, most of the structural work has been done
at the factory. I would have the T/C look at it when you've got most of
the systems work done (fuel system, electrical system, etc.) to make
sure you haven't created a dangerous situation with potential for
chafing fuel lines or electrical wires, etc. I've just finished the
empennage kit myself and have not yet gotten into the wing or fuselage
so I don't know exactly when in the sequence you get into the systems
work - it may be that comes in the finishing kit.
It doesn't hurt to have more than three inspections during the course of
the project,so I would recommend having the T/C look at your fuselage
when you have the fiberglass work completed, particularly if your T/C
knows something about fiberglass. I'm a T/C for our chapter, but my
expertise is more in woodwork, welding and fabric work, with some
experience in sheet metal (more being gained daily). This is my first
all metal airplane and I know next to nothing about fiberglass. Bear in
mind that very few T/C's are thoroughly knowledgeable about all aspects
of aircraft construction, so be sure to ask if yours has the knowledge
to really give you help on specific areas.
Jack Phillips
#40610
Empennage Tip Fairings
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AirMike
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 2:38 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B
fuse kit. I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit
appropriate?
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
_________________________________________________
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify
the sender
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk
- Portuguese
Message 3
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Subject: | Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
I tell folks, when you think about whether to have an inspection or not it
is time. Heck it is always a good time to talk airplanes with another nut,
co call your tech councilor and have a good time.
Gary
40274
The fuselage went to the paint shop yesterday
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Phillips, Jack
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:52 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
<Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
Hi Mike,
There is not a hard and fast rule about when the inspections need to be
done, but in general, before a section is closed up, an inspection is
probably appropriate. It was good for you to have the empennage
inspected since most of the skills required to build the airplane are
developed in that section.
Since you are building a Q/B, most of the structural work has been done
at the factory. I would have the T/C look at it when you've got most of
the systems work done (fuel system, electrical system, etc.) to make
sure you haven't created a dangerous situation with potential for
chafing fuel lines or electrical wires, etc. I've just finished the
empennage kit myself and have not yet gotten into the wing or fuselage
so I don't know exactly when in the sequence you get into the systems
work - it may be that comes in the finishing kit.
It doesn't hurt to have more than three inspections during the course of
the project,so I would recommend having the T/C look at your fuselage
when you have the fiberglass work completed, particularly if your T/C
knows something about fiberglass. I'm a T/C for our chapter, but my
expertise is more in woodwork, welding and fabric work, with some
experience in sheet metal (more being gained daily). This is my first
all metal airplane and I know next to nothing about fiberglass. Bear in
mind that very few T/C's are thoroughly knowledgeable about all aspects
of aircraft construction, so be sure to ask if yours has the knowledge
to really give you help on specific areas.
Jack Phillips
#40610
Empennage Tip Fairings
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AirMike
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 2:38 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B
fuse kit. I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit
appropriate?
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
_________________________________________________
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please
notify the sender
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands -
Norsk - Portuguese
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
I've been installing systems (wiring, brakes, fuel, control system,
strobe power) in the QB fuse for a few months. I plan for a formal TC
inspection before closing and riveting the baggage floor in place.
In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
Bill "finishing Andair valve, moving to control system" Watson
40605
Durham NC
AirMike wrote:
>
> I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B fuse kit.
I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit appropriate?
>
> --------
> OSH '08 or Bust
> Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
>
>
>
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal inspection
involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
-----
Not sure I understand. My TC came by, looked at the Empennage made some
comments, took out a sheet he sends to the EAA to maintain his TC status and
filled out " Reviewed RV-10 empennage, all work is satisfactory no problems
found"
We talked a little about the RV-10, about how I should squeeze the rivets a
little more (which my gauge would disagree with! )but otherwise seemed like
little other work for him. I am not saying this in a bad way he offered
great suggestions and I appreciated the visit and time he took to come by.
I can only think your TC believes he needs to do a thorough inspection, but
my understanding is they are just there to answer any questions and assure
they provide some guidance, not be an A&P and certify anything formally.
My next TC will be the same person who happens to be a DAR and knows the
RV's very well. Getting him has been tough but I want him to come by and
review the work now versus later when I go for the final inspection,
otherwise getting fellow builders has done the same for me than the TC..
which is what it sounds like your TC is doing. I don't even know how
important that form is anyway.. For my DAR it is "suggested to show that a
TC and/or other RV builders reviewed work and that I mention it somewhere in
a log".
Pascal
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "MauleDriver" <MauleDriver@nc.rr.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:31 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
>
> I've been installing systems (wiring, brakes, fuel, control system, strobe
> power) in the QB fuse for a few months. I plan for a formal TC inspection
> before closing and riveting the baggage floor in place.
>
> In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
> inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
> Bill "finishing Andair valve, moving to control system" Watson
> 40605
> Durham NC
>
>
> AirMike wrote:
>>
>> I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B fuse
>> kit. I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit
>> appropriate?
>>
>> --------
>> OSH '08 or Bust
>> Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Fw: RV-A Nose gear AD |
The AD only applies to 2 seat versions of RV's
===========================================================
From: "DejaVu" <wvu@ameritel.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Fw: RV-A Nose gear AD
FYI.
Anh
N591VU-105hrs
------------------
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 8:52 PM
Subject: [Mid-AtlRVwing] RV-A Nose gear AD
There is a Mandatory Service Bulletin 07-11-09 for all Tricycle Gear
RV,s. Check Van's site.
Turtle
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Message 7
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Subject: | : RV10-List:Trim troubles and mods |
Could you also design a time out feature in this circuit to eliminate the
runaway problem?
Gary
40274
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Curtis
Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 8:41 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List:Trim troubles and mods
When this was last discussed, a few folks ask me for resistor values. I did
a rough calculation and determined that about a 10 ohm resistor would be
required to get it down to ~7 volts (assuming .6 amp draw) but that resistor
would have to be quite large to dissipate nearly 3 watts.
I redesigned the speed controller by using the ubiquitous 780x power
regulator instead. In this case a 7806 regulates the input voltage down to
6 volts for up to 1 amp. The speed controller is activated by a switch on
the flap torque tube where ,when the flaps are up, power to the trim motor
is via the 7806 power regulator, any other flap position and trim motor runs
at full speed. Much more efficient and elegant compared to a resistor.
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/90Electrical/RV10PitchTrim.pdf
I encourage your development of products for the RV-10 and I think your trim
controller is an excellent product. However, we all have the tendency to
implement the "gold plated" solution when the more effective stainless steel
would do.
William
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
-------- Original Message --------
>
> I'd like to share some insights into the engineering design considerations
> regarding speed control circuits for DC motors. (the
> Ray-Allen style trim servo uses a brushed DC motor)
> I would discourage the use of a resistor type speed control for adjusting
> the travel speed on the trim servos used in our RV aircraft for the
> following reasons:
>
> Adding a series resistor to the trim motor limits the available current
to
> the motor and although it will slow the motor down it also limits the
> available motor torque (i.e.. its ability to move the attached control
> surface). This could be undesirable as the loading on the control
surface
> will vary with aircraft configuration and performance. Although you may
> "tune" the resistor combination to work in one flight regime it may not be
> what you need in another. Now perhaps there is a suitable compromise
> value you may find "works" for your plane, but have you tested it thru
> temperature, airspeed and aircraft loading extremes? The fundamental
> problem is that series resistor forms a voltage divider with the attached
> motor, as you load the motor down, its impedance drops, this means that
> more of the voltage available from the aircraft bus will be dropped across
> the resistor and less will be available for the motor as you load it down.
> This effectively makes this method susceptible to problems over full
> operating range of loads and supply voltages. Again, you may be able
find
> a "suitable" value that seems to work, but be careful to test over a wide
> range of conditions.
> A second, more long term problem associated with this method of speed
> control has to do with motor life. A brushed DC motor can develop a
> condition which will dramatically shorten its operating life if it is
speed
> controlled by reducing the available current available to the motor.
The
> phenomena is most prevalent in motors that are used for short durations or
> intermittent duty. The condition that is likely to develop is that the
> dust from the motor brushes will pack the slots of the motor's commutator.
> This dust is a combination of conductive particles (carbon from the
brushes)
> and any oil from the motor bearings. This substance is like a conductive
> paste and it gets wedged into the spaces between the commutator bars.
The
> paste effectively shorts out the motor over time. Normally, when the
motor
> is run at its designed voltage or when it controlled by reducing the
> available motor voltage, there is plenty of current available to burn off
> this conductive paste, and the motor lasts its full rated life.
However,
> if the motor is speed controlled by limiting the available current (eg.
> using a series resistor dropper circuit) the ability to burn off this
brush
> paste is greatly compromised. The brush pasted remains packed in the
> commutator and the motor effectively gets shorted out and stops moving.
> This usually is noticed when the motor is turned on, and the brush paste
> just cannot be cleared. The motor is then done. I've seen this
effect
> ruin dc motors within a dozen accumulated run hours.
>
> In the DC motor industry the accepted method of speed control for
> brushed DC motors is to reduce the motor voltage without limiting the
> available motor current. This is done by a number of methods which
include
> linear regulators, high frequency switching regulators or direct PWM
(pulse
> width modulation) to name a few. All of these techniques can reduce the
> average voltage to the motor without limiting the available motor current.
>
>
>
> Sorry for the long post, but sometimes the engineering that goes to
what
> seems to be relatively simple can have significant consequences.
>
>
> Bob Newman
> TCW Technologies
> www.tcwtech.com
>
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
I think we're talking about the same thing. I may be overstating the
'thorough' part. I was just trying to distinquish between asking him
question about a specific issue and doing a 'review'. Both he and I
want a review before I button up the floor, but I'll probably see him
several times in the interim.
Overstatement on my part.
Pascal wrote:
>
> In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
> inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
>
> -----
> Not sure I understand. My TC came by, looked at the Empennage made
> some comments, took out a sheet he sends to the EAA to maintain his TC
> status and filled out " Reviewed RV-10 empennage, all work is
> satisfactory no problems found"
> We talked a little about the RV-10, about how I should squeeze the
> rivets a little more (which my gauge would disagree with! )but
> otherwise seemed like little other work for him. I am not saying this
> in a bad way he offered great suggestions and I appreciated the visit
> and time he took to come by.
>
> I can only think your TC believes he needs to do a thorough
> inspection, but my understanding is they are just there to answer any
> questions and assure they provide some guidance, not be an A&P and
> certify anything formally.
>
> My next TC will be the same person who happens to be a DAR and knows
> the RV's very well. Getting him has been tough but I want him to come
> by and review the work now versus later when I go for the final
> inspection, otherwise getting fellow builders has done the same for me
> than the TC.. which is what it sounds like your TC is doing. I don't
> even know how important that form is anyway.. For my DAR it is
> "suggested to show that a TC and/or other RV builders reviewed work
> and that I mention it somewhere in a log".
>
> Pascal
> Do not archive
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "MauleDriver" <MauleDriver@nc.rr.com>
> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:31 AM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
>
>
>>
>> I've been installing systems (wiring, brakes, fuel, control system,
>> strobe power) in the QB fuse for a few months. I plan for a formal
>> TC inspection before closing and riveting the baggage floor in place.
>>
>> In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
>> inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
>> Bill "finishing Andair valve, moving to control system" Watson
>> 40605
>> Durham NC
>>
>>
>> AirMike wrote:
>>>
>>> I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B
>>> fuse kit. I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit
>>> appropriate?
>>>
>>> --------
>>> OSH '08 or Bust
>>> Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 9
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Subject: | Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit |
Absolutely not. In fact, I have not observed any negatives with my installation.
It could be because the XBOW NAV420 is an excellent gyro. It has published specifications
and each gyro is individually calibrated for the small difference
in sensors.
To finish off the installation - secure the gyro with brass bolts, washers, and
nuts. Tuck the GPS antenna underneath the vertical stablizer to fuselage fairing
as far forward as possible and centered on the vertical stab to minimize
the shadowing effect of the stab. My glass panel has a status that shows the
loss of this GPS signal and I have never lost coverage while flying.
Bill
Patrick ONeill <poneill@irealms.com> wrote:
Thanks Bill. That's great info for the alignment. It is also great to hear
some results from the compass observations.
With the AHRS mounted so far aft of the lateral axis, are there any artifacts
in the attitude indication? It sounds like no, but that was something I always
wondered about.
Best Regards,
Patrick #40715
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill DeRouchey
Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:48 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
Two successful Xbow 420 installations:
Since the Xbow 420 incorporates orientation sensors and a three axis magnetometer
we located the unit close to the origin of all three axis as practical but
moved outside the hard iron magnetic fields.
We constructed a flat plate approx .125 thick and installed it where the rear
seat shoulder harness cable is bolted to the upper longeron. It spans the fuselage
width wise and we relocated the seat belt cable to the front lip of this
plate. Used the same three holes on each side that was originally for the shoulder
harness anchor. Also over engineered it with an .063 Tee running laterally
to stiffen any up and down vibrations. The NAV420 is on the top and centered
laterally.
I measured the magnetic fields around the elevator trim motor and the elevator
trim motor/battery and they will interfere with a compass 24" away. Do not underestimate
the field around the small elevator trim motor - it is significant.
This location was outside both fore and aft magnetic fields and has a significant
advantage. If the plate is flat on the longeron and at right angles to the
yaw centerline it will automatically have two axis perfectly aligned. Simply
run a string from front center to the tail center to form the yaw axis and center
the NAV420 on this string to align the third axis. No installation correction
was needed for either RV-10 with this approach.
Do not even think of locating a magnetometer anywhere near the baggage compartment.
The magnetic interference can easily be significant and uncontrollable.
Sorry I do not have a picture.
Bill DeRouchey
N939SB, flying
Patrick Thyssen <jump2@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Here is my mount for the 420 ahrs.
I can build a shelf on the four posts if I need to get it 6 inchs higher away
from battery and servo. I'm a good 20 " away now. Will try to demag the cable
if not see about stainless.
Pat Thyssen
"Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr@sprint.com> wrote:
That nice gold finish is PPG Armor Grip. I think it is 900 and
901.
Thank You
Ray Doerr
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick
ONeill
Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 1:10 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
Thanks much for the pictures Ray! That helps a lot.
Unfortunately, I don't think I can use that as the AHRS station. The
xbow
NAV 420 has an integrated 3-axis magnetometer. I can imagine the grief
trying to situate it 6 inches from a main battery wire. So it's back to
the
shelf plan for me.
But that might be another useful station for something else. I'll have
to
keep that bracket in mind for the future.
By the way, how are you prepping the inside of the tail cone surfaces?
Is
that all just alodine? Looks great!
Anyone else currently flying with OP EFIS? Any location success stories
or
problems with the NAV 420 AHRS?
Best Regards,
Patrick #40715
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R
[NTK]
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 6:01 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
<> <> <>
<> <> <>
<> <> <>
I was working with Garmin here in Olathe on this bracket and
testing
it using my RV-10. Here are all the pictures I provided to Garmin
during
this process. Van's actually created the bracket with the feedback that
was
provided my Scott (Garmin) and myself.
By the way, I don't have either AHRS, but this bracket still
makes
an excellent support for a 1" x 8" board when you need to crawl back
into
the tail. We are still working on the bracket for the Magnometer,
problem
is finding a good location that is free of magnetic interference to the
standards which Garmin has set for the Certified installations.
Thank You
Ray Doerr
40250
N519RV
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick
ONeill
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 6:08 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Vans RV-10 AHRS Mounting Kit
I just noticed that Van's is offering an AHRS mounting kit for the 10:
AHRS Mount Kit for the RV-10
Part Number = IF AHRS MOUNT-10
Description
Mount for Attitude Heading Reference System unit.
Provides parts to mount the AHRS unit for either the Garmin G900XT or
the
Grand Rapids EFIS. Locates unit behind baggage bulkhead on RV-7, RV-9,
and
RV-10.
Has anyone received one of these or better yet, any photos? I'm not
getting
a clear picture of what it entails from
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: : RV10-List:Trim troubles and mods |
I am going to use your circuit for my trim. However, seems that there is a mistake
in the wiring of the relays,that in this configuration shorts the +12 to ground,
unless there is something of which I am not aware.
Sergio
RV8 82041, flying
RV10, finish kit
wcurtis(at)nerv10.com wrote:
> When this was last discussed, a few folks ask me for resistor values. I did
a rough calculation and determined that about a 10 ohm resistor would be required
to get it down to ~7 volts (assuming .6 amp draw) but that resistor would
have to be quite large to dissipate nearly 3 watts.
>
> I redesigned the speed controller by using the ubiquitous 780x power regulator
instead. In this case a 7806 regulates the input voltage down to 6 volts for
up to 1 amp. The speed controller is activated by a switch on the flap torque
tube where ,when the flaps are up, power to the trim motor is via the 7806
power regulator, any other flap position and trim motor runs at full speed. Much
more efficient and elegant compared to a resistor.
>
> http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/90Electrical/RV10PitchTrim.pdf
>
> I encourage your development of products for the RV-10 and I think your trim
controller is an excellent product. However, we all have the tendency to implement
the "gold plated" solution when the more effective stainless steel would
do.
>
> William
> http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
>
> ------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146263#146263
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
I asked my TC about this and his reponse was that he was a volunteer, and he
was there to offer any advice I might need, and to "get another set of eyes"
on the project and perhaps point out some problems he might see.
A TC is not an "inspector" like a DAR is, but more like your friendly
neighborhood builder that is more experience than I am. A TC visit(s) is not
required (although I would recommend it).
The forms he fills out are not for our planes, but for him to maintain his
status as a TC with EAA.
Jeff Dalton
Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder@verizon.net>
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:17 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
>
> In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
> inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
>
> -----
> Not sure I understand. My TC came by, looked at the Empennage made some
> comments, took out a sheet he sends to the EAA to maintain his TC status
> and filled out " Reviewed RV-10 empennage, all work is satisfactory no
> problems found"
> We talked a little about the RV-10, about how I should squeeze the rivets
> a little more (which my gauge would disagree with! )but otherwise seemed
> like little other work for him. I am not saying this in a bad way he
> offered great suggestions and I appreciated the visit and time he took to
> come by.
>
> I can only think your TC believes he needs to do a thorough inspection,
> but my understanding is they are just there to answer any questions and
> assure they provide some guidance, not be an A&P and certify anything
> formally.
>
> My next TC will be the same person who happens to be a DAR and knows the
> RV's very well. Getting him has been tough but I want him to come by and
> review the work now versus later when I go for the final inspection,
> otherwise getting fellow builders has done the same for me than the TC..
> which is what it sounds like your TC is doing. I don't even know how
> important that form is anyway.. For my DAR it is "suggested to show that a
> TC and/or other RV builders reviewed work and that I mention it somewhere
> in a log".
>
> Pascal
> Do not archive
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "MauleDriver" <MauleDriver@nc.rr.com>
> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:31 AM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
>
>
>>
>> I've been installing systems (wiring, brakes, fuel, control system,
>> strobe power) in the QB fuse for a few months. I plan for a formal TC
>> inspection before closing and riveting the baggage floor in place.
>>
>> In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
>> inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
>> Bill "finishing Andair valve, moving to control system" Watson
>> 40605
>> Durham NC
>>
>>
>> AirMike wrote:
>>>
>>> I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B
>>> fuse kit. I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit
>>> appropriate?
>>>
>>> --------
>>> OSH '08 or Bust
>>> Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: : RV10-List:Trim troubles and mods |
Don't forget to account for the heat-sinking of the linear regulator. If
your design assumtion is for 0.5 amps of current at 6 volts on the servo,
that leaves 8 volts across the regulator for a supply voltage of 14 volts.
The power dissipation in the regulator will be 8 x 0.5 = 4 watts. Also,
don't forget to handle raw electronic components such as voltage regulators
with proper static safe procautions. Avoid making walking wounded that are
likely to fail at the least timely moment. Good luck rolling your own.
-Bob Newman
www.tcwtech.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "sergiolov" <dd@vtesrl.it>
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 2:44 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List:Trim troubles and mods
>
> I am going to use your circuit for my trim. However, seems that there is a
> mistake in the wiring of the relays,that in this configuration shorts the
> +12 to ground, unless there is something of which I am not aware.
> Sergio
> RV8 82041, flying
> RV10, finish kit
>
>
> wcurtis(at)nerv10.com wrote:
>> When this was last discussed, a few folks ask me for resistor values. I
>> did a rough calculation and determined that about a 10 ohm resistor would
>> be required to get it down to ~7 volts (assuming .6 amp draw) but that
>> resistor would have to be quite large to dissipate nearly 3 watts.
>>
>> I redesigned the speed controller by using the ubiquitous 780x power
>> regulator instead. In this case a 7806 regulates the input voltage down
>> to 6 volts for up to 1 amp. The speed controller is activated by a
>> switch on the flap torque tube where ,when the flaps are up, power to the
>> trim motor is via the 7806 power regulator, any other flap position and
>> trim motor runs at full speed. Much more efficient and elegant compared
>> to a resistor.
>>
>> http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/90Electrical/RV10PitchTrim.pdf
>>
>> I encourage your development of products for the RV-10 and I think your
>> trim controller is an excellent product. However, we all have the
>> tendency to implement the "gold plated" solution when the more effective
>> stainless steel would do.
>>
>> William
>> http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
>>
>> ------
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146263#146263
>
>
>
Message 13
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Subject: | Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
The purpose for the paperwork is so that the EAA has a documented record
to track trends and quality of build progress and the work of their EAA
members. Some TCs may make brief and vague comments many are more
thorough. I do not see a value in generic phrases just to meet my quota
(of two per year). This year it has been six with two scheduled in the
next two weeks. We are volunteers because we agreed not to charge a fee.
Quality of build, safety and security of hardware, potential areas of
known issue and a personal perspective from "Walking the Walk" are the
desired outcome from TC visits. They serve a positive purpose for the
EAA, the builder and for the community.
I have seen some really good work which I think this web has helped to
elevate. Those who think the DAR is going to complete an extensive
"Inspection" may be dishearted at its conclusion only to be balanced by
the thrill of the "Pushing of Paperwork for the FAA".
- In Boston for the weekend
John Cox
TC only while conducting the progressives. Otherwise its just another
builder with an A&P with I/A who does it for a living and loves RV-10s
Do not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of jdalton77
Sent: Thu 11/15/2007 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
I asked my TC about this and his reponse was that he was a volunteer,
and he
was there to offer any advice I might need, and to "get another set of
eyes"
on the project and perhaps point out some problems he might see.
A TC is not an "inspector" like a DAR is, but more like your friendly
neighborhood builder that is more experience than I am. A TC visit(s) is
not
required (although I would recommend it).
The forms he fills out are not for our planes, but for him to maintain
his
status as a TC with EAA.
Jeff Dalton
Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder@verizon.net>
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:17 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
>
> In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
> inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
>
> -----
> Not sure I understand. My TC came by, looked at the Empennage made
some
> comments, took out a sheet he sends to the EAA to maintain his TC
status
> and filled out " Reviewed RV-10 empennage, all work is satisfactory no
> problems found"
> We talked a little about the RV-10, about how I should squeeze the
rivets
> a little more (which my gauge would disagree with! )but otherwise
seemed
> like little other work for him. I am not saying this in a bad way he
> offered great suggestions and I appreciated the visit and time he took
to
> come by.
>
> I can only think your TC believes he needs to do a thorough
inspection,
> but my understanding is they are just there to answer any questions
and
> assure they provide some guidance, not be an A&P and certify anything
> formally.
>
> My next TC will be the same person who happens to be a DAR and knows
the
> RV's very well. Getting him has been tough but I want him to come by
and
> review the work now versus later when I go for the final inspection,
> otherwise getting fellow builders has done the same for me than the
TC..
> which is what it sounds like your TC is doing. I don't even know how
> important that form is anyway.. For my DAR it is "suggested to show
that a
> TC and/or other RV builders reviewed work and that I mention it
somewhere
> in a log".
>
> Pascal
> Do not archive
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "MauleDriver" <MauleDriver@nc.rr.com>
> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:31 AM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tech Councelor - when is the right time
>
>
>>
>> I've been installing systems (wiring, brakes, fuel, control system,
>> strobe power) in the QB fuse for a few months. I plan for a formal
TC
>> inspection before closing and riveting the baggage floor in place.
>>
>> In watching my TC, he'll come by any time to advise but a formal
>> inspection involves paperwork and a thorough inspection.
>> Bill "finishing Andair valve, moving to control system" Watson
>> 40605
>> Durham NC
>>
>>
>> AirMike wrote:
>>>
>>> I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B
>>> fuse kit. I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit
>>> appropriate?
>>>
>>> --------
>>> OSH '08 or Bust
>>> Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 14
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Subject: | Wheel Fairing Air Access covers |
I've looked and looked on the web for these things. The little spring
assisted access door to put air in your tires, with wheel pants
installed. Does anybody remember the part #?
Thanks,
Sam Marlow
#40157 Flying now
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: Tech Councelor - when is the right time |
At first I can honestly say I was a little intimidated at the idea of a
tech counselor going over my project and offering constructive
criticism. In fact, just the opposite happened. I found that they
offer invaluable advise that has saved me time and money on my project!
I made countless decisions based upon their past experience. This was
especially important to me being a first time builder.
Find one (or two) and get them involved ASAP...you'll be glad you did.
(And a special thanks to my T.C.'s Mr. Cartwright and Mr. Masys for
their time!)
Brian Sutherland
Nashville, TN
Finishing!
http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder
AirMike wrote:
>
> I am a first time builder. I have done quite a bit of work on my Q/B fuse kit.
I got my empenage approved by a T/C. When is another visit appropriate?
>
> --------
> OSH '08 or Bust
> Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146097#146097
>
>
>
Message 16
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Subject: | Extra Rivethead Door Handles |
I ordered a set of the door handles and latching pins but decided to go with flush
door handles. I will keep the pins but will let the door handles go for same
price I paid - $78 for the pair plus $5 to cover shipping. Just received
today and still in the wrapping as delivered from Rivethead. These are direct
replacements for the exterior handles that you fabricate on manual page 45-9.
http://www.rivethead-aero.com/rv10_005.htm
As others have said, his products are terrific it's just his lack of responsiveness/communications
coupled with a multi-month delay that's the problem. I wanted
the pins and decided to go ahead and take delivery of the handles too since
I was sure that somebody would want them.
Bob #40105
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146322#146322
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: Wheel Fairing Air Access covers |
I believe that Aircraft Spruce has them. They are fragile and will break. I recommend
steel hole plugs, at your hardware store. Paint up a few extra, they
can get lost.
Bruce
Sam Marlow <sam@fr8dog.net> wrote:
I've looked and looked on the web for these things. The little spring assisted
access door to put air in your tires, with wheel pants installed. Does anybody
remember the part #?
Thanks,
Sam Marlow
#40157 Flying now
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: Extra Rivethead Door Handles |
That didn't take long! Handles are spoken for, but if you're interested let me
know just in case something falls through.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=146352#146352
Message 19
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Subject: | Re: Wheel Fairing Air Access covers |
I suspect you're describing these...
http://www.romeolima.com/RV3works/IdeasProducts/ideasproducts.htm#AccessD
oors
Randy Lervold
RV-3B, flying
----- Original Message -----
From: Sam Marlow
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 2:31 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Wheel Fairing Air Access covers
I've looked and looked on the web for these things. The little spring
assisted access door to put air in your tires, with wheel pants
installed. Does anybody remember the part #?
Thanks,
Sam Marlow
#40157 Flying now
Message 20
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Subject: | Re: : RV10-List:Trim troubles and mods |
Thanks for the informative and technical post. I like that.
Kevin
40494
----- Original Message Follows -----
From: "Bob-tcw" <rnewman@tcwtech.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List:Trim troubles and mods
rnewman@tcwtech.com>
>
>I'd like to share some insights into the engineering design
>considerations regarding speed control circuits for DC
>motors...........
>
>Bob Newman
>TCW Technologies
>www.tcwtech.com
Message 21
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Subject: | RV Pilot at Whiteman (WHP) |
I recall not too long ago there was a -10 builder based at Whiteman
(WHP).
I was hoping to speak with you regarding field specifics.
Robin
805-801-8550
Message 22
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Subject: | Check those tires. |
Had my first ever blow out in a nose tyre last night.
Hours on tyre..28 weeks calendar TSN.
Cycles on tyre..1..as in, I moved it one complete revolution in the shed.
Man, I was sure I should get at least 2 revolutions for my money.
Here's hoping I can get the old girl out of the shed without blowing out the
mains and skidding off into the pond.
John 40315 (instrument panel)
Do not archive
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