Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:23 AM - Re: RV safety (Wayne Edgerton)
2. 05:44 AM - Re: RV safety (Tim Olson)
3. 05:45 AM - Re: RV safety (Rene Felker)
4. 06:51 AM - GRT EIS User Manual (Chris)
5. 06:58 AM - Re: Windscreen Crazing (Bobby J. Hughes)
6. 07:07 AM - Re: RV safety (GRANSCOTT@aol.com)
7. 07:10 AM - Re: GRT EIS User Manual (David McNeill)
8. 07:39 AM - Re: RV safety (David McNeill)
9. 07:49 AM - Re: Wheel pants/lower strut fairing (Roger Standley)
10. 08:42 AM - Re: RV safety (GRANSCOTT@aol.com)
11. 09:03 AM - Humbling Experience (James, Peter [SD])
12. 09:22 AM - Re: Humbling Experience (John Jessen)
13. 09:42 AM - Re: Humbling Experience (Tim Olson)
14. 12:51 PM - Re: RV safety (Sam Marlow)
15. 12:53 PM - Tools wanted (Matt Kuperus)
16. 01:04 PM - Re: RV safety (Condrey, Bob (US SSA))
17. 02:11 PM - Re: Tools wanted (Rick Sked)
18. 02:11 PM - Recommendations for front air vents (Fred Williams, M.D.)
19. 02:22 PM - Re: P-Mag! (Thane States)
20. 02:33 PM - Re: Humbling Experience (Rob Kermanj)
21. 02:47 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (Ben Westfall)
22. 02:52 PM - Re: P-Mag! (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
23. 02:54 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
24. 02:56 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (Deems Davis)
25. 03:30 PM - Re: Humbling Experience (John Testement)
26. 03:40 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (SteinAir, Inc.)
27. 04:02 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (Fred Williams, M.D.)
28. 05:09 PM - Pix (gary)
29. 05:21 PM - Re: Pix (Deems Davis)
30. 05:25 PM - Re: Pix (John Jessen)
31. 05:52 PM - Re: Pix (Robin Marks)
32. 06:29 PM - Re: GRT EIS User Manual (Chris)
33. 06:36 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (Chris)
34. 06:40 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (Tim Olson)
35. 06:40 PM - Cowling hinges (John Testement)
36. 06:42 PM - Re: AFS Systems .... and others (linn Walters)
37. 06:46 PM - Re: Pix (Tim Olson)
38. 07:08 PM - Re: Cowling hinges (Richard Sipp)
39. 07:38 PM - Andair problems (Bruce Snyder)
40. 08:08 PM - Re: Recommendations for front air vents (AirMike)
41. 09:22 PM - Re: AFS Systems .... and others (Robin Marks)
42. 09:57 PM - Re: Humbling Experience (Dave Saylor)
43. 10:22 PM - Re: AFS Systems .... and others (Randy Lervold)
Message 1
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Hi Dan,
I'm not familiar with the GRT system, but with the Chelton's when you
are loading an approach into your flight plan it allows you to select
VTF vectors to final. Does the GRT possible have that option somewhere
inside it? Also I think on the Chelton you can temporarily select OBS or
heading bug mode for vectors and then switch back to the approach at the
appropriate time.
Wayne Edgerton N602WT
Time: 10:36:09 AM PST US
From: Dan Masys <dmasys@cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV safety
With the latest database update on the GNS480 it suddenly decided
that approaches
to my home airport in Nashville can only be flown via STARS
(Standard Terminal
Arrival Routes) and the last time I was in the muck trying to get
home it
suprised me by asking me to choose a STAR before it would load the
approach.
Not even knowing what approach fixes where in each STAR, I fiddled
for a few minutes
then just asked for a vector to final on the ILS from approach
control,
which they provided. Ended up just hand flying the ILS with
traditional needle
displays since the fancy WAAS GPS was completely rigid in its
sequencing, and
not useful at that point. Good thing I have hand flown that
approach many
many times.
So my assessment of the fancy electronics is that they are
wonderful when everything
is going according to plan, but have way too many subtle failure
modes when
the game changes and one has to make a new plan while hurtling
along IMC at
200 mph. Yes, I will go back to school and figure out how to
insert STARS into
the flight planning, but remain suspicious of losing positional
awareness
when a surprise comes my way in an approach environment.
Message 2
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Someone will have to correct me if I'm wrong, but Wayne, I think
the issue is that if you use a GRT, the approaches and
all of that stuff is not actually *IN* the EFIS, it's just
displaying things from a 430/530(W)/480 and flying it. So if
you want to play with course changes and stuff, you have to
do it on those instruments. And, as you've found by now, the
stuff you're using is very quick and intuitive, so things like
the VTF and HDG selection are very quick and easy to use and
you get the benefit of having the whole approach displayed
on the MFD to see it all happen. So where you had to spend
your time learning the EFIS, they have to focus on learning
the GPS/NAV/COM plus the methods to display it on the EFIS.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Wayne Edgerton wrote:
> Hi Dan,
>
> I'm not familiar with the GRT system, but with the Chelton's when you
> are loading an approach into your flight plan it allows you to select
> VTF vectors to final. Does the GRT possible have that option somewhere
> inside it? Also I think on the Chelton you can temporarily select OBS or
> heading bug mode for vectors and then switch back to the approach at
> the appropriate time.
>
> Wayne Edgerton N602WT
>
>
>
> *Time: * */10:36:09 AM PST US/*
>
> *From: * */Dan Masys <dmasys@cox.net <mailto:dmasys@cox.net>>/*
>
> *Subject: * /*_Re: RV safety_*/
>
>
>
> With the latest database update on the GNS480 it suddenly decided
> that approaches
> to my home airport in Nashville can only be flown via STARS
> (Standard Terminal
> Arrival Routes) and the last time I was in the muck trying to get
> home it
> suprised me by asking me to choose a STAR before it would load the
> approach.
> Not even knowing what approach fixes where in each STAR, I fiddled
> for a few minutes
> then just asked for a vector to final on the ILS from approach
> control,
> which they provided. Ended up just hand flying the ILS with
> traditional needle
> displays since the fancy WAAS GPS was completely rigid in its
> sequencing, and
> not useful at that point. Good thing I have hand flown that
> approach many
> many times.
>
> So my assessment of the fancy electronics is that they are
> wonderful when everything
> is going according to plan, but have way too many subtle failure
> modes when
> the game changes and one has to make a new plan while hurtling
> along IMC at
> 200 mph. Yes, I will go back to school and figure out how to
> insert STARS into
> the flight planning, but remain suspicious of losing positional
> awareness
> when a surprise comes my way in an approach environment.
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 3
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Wayne, I just started to really figure out my GRT system, but what I think
is happening is that Dan and me are using the 480 (430 in my case) to enter
the flight plan and "execute" the approach. I know on the 430 I just select
the approach and then hit vectors to final, set the GRT to heading mod
(heading bug) and arm the system for the approach. The only thing I have
tested it on has been an ILS and once I get within 2.5 degrees of the
localizer course, the system automatically switches to nav mod and tracks
the localizer. Pretty cool for a guy who has never really had an autopilot
before and never flown a coupled approach.
It looks like the way the 480 handles the approaches into Nashiville has
changed in the 480?
Rene' Felker
RV-10 N423CF Flying
801-721-6080
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Edgerton
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 6:19 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: RV safety
Hi Dan,
I'm not familiar with the GRT system, but with the Chelton's when you are
loading an approach into your flight plan it allows you to select VTF
vectors to final. Does the GRT possible have that option somewhere inside
it? Also I think on the Chelton you can temporarily select OBS or heading
bug mode for vectors and then switch back to the approach at the appropriate
time.
Wayne Edgerton N602WT
Time:
10:36:09 AM PST US
From:
Dan Masys <dmasys@cox.net>
Subject:
Re: RV safety
With the latest database update on the GNS480 it suddenly decided that
approaches
to my home airport in Nashville can only be flown via STARS (Standard
Terminal
Arrival Routes) and the last time I was in the muck trying to get home
it
suprised me by asking me to choose a STAR before it would load the
approach.
Not even knowing what approach fixes where in each STAR, I fiddled for
a few minutes
then just asked for a vector to final on the ILS from approach
control,
which they provided. Ended up just hand flying the ILS with
traditional needle
displays since the fancy WAAS GPS was completely rigid in its
sequencing, and
not useful at that point. Good thing I have hand flown that approach
many
many times.
So my assessment of the fancy electronics is that they are wonderful
when everything
is going according to plan, but have way too many subtle failure modes
when
the game changes and one has to make a new plan while hurtling along
IMC at
200 mph. Yes, I will go back to school and figure out how to insert
STARS into
the flight planning, but remain suspicious of losing positional
awareness
when a surprise comes my way in an approach environment.
Message 4
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| Subject: | GRT EIS User Manual |
Does anyone have this manual in pdf they could send me? It seems to be missing
from GRT website.
Thanks
Chris #40072
do not archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Windscreen Crazing |
Mike,
Now that SNF is over I am waiting to hear from the windshield folks. How
long did it take for the crazing to start \ stop during your various
tests? Did it progress over time? Not sure what method I will use this
time but I may try the Sika-Flex or use the Hysol and flox method again.
Thanks,
Bobby
40116
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike Kraus
Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2008 11:59 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Windscreen Crazing
I had a similar issue with crazing that occurred under a tape line that
I used to mask off the top of the fiberglass edge at the base of the
windscreen. After replacing the windshield, I did a bunch of tests on
the old windscreen to see what would make it craze. I was able to get
cracks and crazing using the Van's recommended Weld-On when under
pressure (not a lot of pressure, but some pressure). I decided to
switch on my second install to Sika-Flex. I pooled acetone on the
window until it evaporated, no crazing. I then took the Sika-Flex
primer and applied it and let it air dry for a few minutes (not fully
cured, but dry to the touch). Then when I sprayed it with acetone, it
disintegrated the primer and proceeded to craze the windshield in that
area... Looks just like your window did.
I then took a fresh section, applied the primer and let it dry
overnight. I then sprayed it with the acetone and it would not remove
the primer and it did not craze the windscreen. I played around with it
again and if I sprayed the acetone before the primer was dry, it would
craze the window every time.
There clearly was some reaction with the Sika-Flex primer and acetone
while the primer was not fully cured. This never explained why my RV-10
windscreen crazed, but I have come to the conclusion to not use acetone
on my windscreen (even though others have used it for years with 'no
issues').
FYI, for removing the windscreen I took a router and set the depth to
the window thickness and routed around the edges where it was adhered.
It made a big mess, but it sure did a nice job and left a nice surface
to glue the new windshield to....
-Mike Kraus
RV-4 Flying
RV-10 FWF and wiring
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bobby J.
Hughes
Sent: Monday, April 07, 2008 1:04 PM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: RV10-List: Windscreen Crazing
Yesterday I decided to remove the protective coverings from all
my windows. The inside had the factory plastic coating still in place
and the outside had been covered with spraylat after installation of the
windscreen. I think the spraylat was applied in August 2006. Plane was
moved to the hanger via a wrecker in December 2006.
We used the lancair method and materials to glue in all of the
windows. Hysol mixed with flox. Only the windscreen has any signs of
crazing. We glued a lancair ES, Mark Ritters RV10 and mine within a few
months of each other. The ES is flying with no problems and Mark's plane
did not have any cracks using this method. Acetone was used on the glue
seam and frame but none touched any other part of the glass.
Any ideas?
Bobby J Hughes
40116
Message 6
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Guys and Gals...you may want to read that manual very carefully before
launching and trying to learn by flying...you'll spend too much heads down
time...most systems have a simulator mode or stand alone software simulators...you
might want to find a way to plug in your system on the ground and use the
simulator there so that when you get airborn spending fuel you're not waiting
time and altitude cranking dials and flipping screens learning...and please
consider taking along a safety pilot when out with your big screens
practicing...hopefully someone with TAA experience.
P
**************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money &
Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850)
Message 7
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| Subject: | GRT EIS User Manual |
Check http://www.grtavionics.com/default.aspx?id=4 its there under Sport
EFIs 2.24-08
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 6:49 AM
Subject: RV10-List: GRT EIS User Manual
Does anyone have this manual in pdf they could send me? It seems to be
missing from GRT website.
Thanks
Chris #40072
do not archive
Message 8
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It may be about time to remind ourselves of a prime directive .
If I can't fly IFR/IMC without the Autopilot, then I can't fly IFR.
I agree with RV Safety; learn how to tell the electronics how to do what you
want/need, don't depend on a working autopilot to do the job for you.
Take a look at www.flightaware.com (IFR plans and some flight following) and
stick in an N number of interest. Watch the groundspeed and altitude
excursions. Changes of 30-40 knots and 1000+ feet between minutes may
indicate a hand flyer who is not current to fly IFR without an autopilot (
or less likely very turbulent air and the PIC has requested the block
altitude).
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of GRANSCOTT@aol.com
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 7:05 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: RV safety
Guys and Gals...you may want to read that manual very carefully before
launching and trying to learn by flying...you'll spend too much heads down
time...most systems have a simulator mode or stand alone software
simulators...you might want to find a way to plug in your system on the
ground and use the simulator there so that when you get airborn spending
fuel you're not waiting time and altitude cranking dials and flipping
screens learning...and please consider taking along a safety pilot when out
with your big screens practicing...hopefully someone with TAA experience.
P
_____
It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL
<http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850> Money & Finance.
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Wheel pants/lower strut fairing |
Hi Lew,=0A=0AThank you for the photos. I've been doing the same
mod over the last few days so your post is timely and appreciated.
=0AI have also been thinking of the upper fairing and the only thing I
've come up with is using nut plates where accessibility will allow.
=0AAre you going to do anything about an access door for putting ai
r in the tires? I was thinking of a door like Cessna's, either spring
loaded or flush latched, maybe both. Since it would be a "curved" door
, the hinge will need some special attention to keep from binding. Any
thoughts?=0A=0ARoger=0A#40291=0A ----- Original Message
----- =0A From: Lew Gallagher<mailto:lewgall@charter.net> =0A
nt: Sunday, April 13, 2008 8:29 AM=0A Subject: RV10-List: Wheel pa
nts/lower strut fairing=0A=0A=0A --> RV10-List message poste
d by: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall@charter.net<mailto:lewgall@charter.net>
>=0A=0A If anyone is interested, I thought I'd post some pictur
es of how the wheel pants fiberglass work is turning out. This is usin
g Fred Williams' model. (THANKS FRED!) You can also see the covering o
f the hinge rivets on the strut pants. =0A=0A I forgot to take
pictures of the initial splitting of the lower fairings. I split them
first, then positioned them on the strut fairing with the wheels off t
he ground, strings pulled to the step, etc. then drilled and clecoed t
he halves to the wheel pants, then fiberglassed them in position, fill
ed the cleco holes, built up overlapping lips (2" glass cloth/resin) .
. and there you go. =0A=0A They sandwich together and hold the
strut pants perfectly in position, eliminates the screws on the lower
strut fairings. If you are planning on doing this, it's best to split
the fairing just forward of the apex of the strut curve -- otherwise
you have to spread the front lips to install them on the back half.
=0A=0A No Bondo -- you convinced me! Mixing the microbeads in t
he fiberglass (Western systems) is a bit more trouble, but it smooths
OK and no worries about bonding. With primer (2K urethane) they will s
lick up just fine. =0A=0A The plans for the upper strut fairing
s look a little dinky to me -- sheet metal screws? Has anyone improved
upon this? I guess it's not really critical and since they overlap th
e fuse and the wing joining panel, they have to be removable. =0A
=0A Probably a little weird, but this glass work gives me lots of
satisfaction. =0A=0A Later, - Lew=0A=0A --------=0A
non-pilot=0A crazy about building=0A NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40
549=0A doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0A Read this topic online here:=0A=0A http://forums.mat
ronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=176537#176537<http://forums.matronics.com
/viewtopic.php?p=176537#176537>=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A Attac
hments: =0A=0A http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_1_mediu
m_357.jpg<http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_1_medium_357.jpg>
=0A http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_2_medium_148.jpg<http
://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_2_medium_148.jpg>=0A http://f
orums.matronics.com//files/pants_3_medium_199.jpg<http://forums.matron
ics.com//files/pants_3_medium_199.jpg>=0A http://forums.matronics.
com//files/pants_4_medium_796.jpg<http://forums.matronics.com//files/p
ants_4_medium_796.jpg>=0A http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants
_5_medium_170.jpg<http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_5_medium_17
0.jpg>=0A http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_6_medium_133.jp
g<http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_6_medium_133.jpg>=0A ht
tp://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_7_medium_103.jpg<http://forums.
matronics.com//files/pants_7_medium_103.jpg>=0A http://forums.matr
onics.com//files/pants_8_medium_739.jpg<http://forums.matronics.com//f
iles/pants_8_medium_739.jpg>=0A http://forums.matronics.com//files
/pants_9_medium_192.jpg<http://forums.matronics.com//files/pants_9_med
=======================
=======================
onics.com/Navigator?RV10-List<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
=0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 10
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I know you're correct on being proficient on hand flying the
approaches...but going out and learning new electronics while flying is a bit
crazy to
me...one spends way too much head down time reading, selecting and looking for
buttons/switches/and moving screens about...sort not the time to learn with your
head down...makes one run into the ground or another plane a real
possibility.
It took me a couple of days in class, studying and sitting on the ground to
learn the G 1000 and autopilot system plus all the new places for radio and
phone on the audio panel presentation...if one were moving at 170kts you'll
cover a few miles in a minute while you glance down...it's really hard to
believe all the information you can go through quickly and what it takes to find
exactly what you want get it displayed and inserted into your flight plan.
It's pretty easy to fumble around for a few minutes...if you're going the Garmin
approach..you may want to look at their FITS program.
P
**************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money &
Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850)
Message 11
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| Subject: | Humbling Experience |
Dear -10 Listers,
I have debated for several days whether to hit the send button on this e-ma
il. I am not sure that it is my place to share this experience. I attende
d SNF this year and was pleased to look over all of the -10s that were in a
ttendance. It is exciting to know that my plane will sit in the same row w
ith these birds in the near future. But that's not the reason for this mes
sage.....
On the way home from SNF, we stopped in Georgia to look at a ground looped
Skybolt that one of my fellow chapter members is considering purchasing. D
uring the conversation with the salvage yard, I mentioned that I was buildi
ng an RV-10...and that unfortunately, one had gone down last week. The gen
t helping us stated that the plane was there.... Right next to where we wer
e standing. We wandered over and took a look...
I have never been humbled as much as I was at the Vietnam Memorial in Washi
ngton, D.C. While standing looking at the downed plane, I had a second mov
ing experience -- similar to that at "The Wall". I recognized the structur
es. I saw the parts that I am so intimately familiar with. I saw the deva
station that the passengers in this aircraft must have endured. I can only
hope that they did not suffer.
I am told that the field of debris was 600 feet long (2 football fields).
The first sign of contact was fiberglass imbedded 4" into tree tops. The l
ast item in the field was the engine. In all my days, I have never seen a
propeller as curled as this one. I am not familiar with all of the detai
ls..... but I can tell you this..... There were structures that had every
rivet sheared off. I recognized parts that I thought would be impossible t
o destroy...yet here they were in pieces. It was my familiarity with the p
arts and pieces that made this moment so significant. I cannot imagine wh
at was happening at the time the airframe came to this state of being. I d
id not know the pilot or passenger. I wish that I could have met them. I
am sure they were fine individuals, as all of the -10 builders seem to be.
Why am I writing this, you ask? I am not concerned about insurance or the
future of our small community of builders. I am not concerned about bent s
heet metal. I am writing this to encourage you, my airplane and aviation f
amily, to think twice before entering into an area filled with Thunderstorm
s. I have no idea what happened, but I do know that this one stop... this
10 minutes in Georgia... will change the way that I "pilot"...maybe for the
rest of my life. I have landed for weather before....and I will again.
>From now on...I will be much quicker to make a "NO GO" decision. I encoura
ge you to do the same. The boys from Lancair told harrowing tales of their
trip down this year...and how they had been at 400' AGL above an interstat
e to avoid towers. I was amazed that they survived their complete lack of
judgment. We all can suffer from "get-there-'it is"
This humbling moment in time, may save my life...and the lives of my passen
gers. I am sorry that others lost their lives in order to drive this home
for me.
Be safe my friends, I hope that I can meet each of you in person one day so
on.
Pete
RV-10 #40100
90% done, 90% to go.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Humbling Experience |
Peter, thanks. I am glad you hit the send button. Thoughtful and well
written. Thanks for sharing.
John Jessen
do not archive
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James, Peter [SD]
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 8:57 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Humbling Experience
Dear -10 Listers,
I have debated for several days whether to hit the send button on this
e-mail. I am not sure that it is my place to share this experience. I
attended SNF this year and was pleased to look over all of the -10s that
were in attendance. It is exciting to know that my plane will sit in the
same row with these birds in the near future. But that's not the reason for
this message...
On the way home from SNF, we stopped in Georgia to look at a ground looped
Skybolt that one of my fellow chapter members is considering purchasing.
During the conversation with the salvage yard, I mentioned that I was
building an RV-10.and that unfortunately, one had gone down last week. The
gent helping us stated that the plane was there.. Right next to where we
were standing. We wandered over and took a look.
I have never been humbled as much as I was at the Vietnam Memorial in
Washington, D.C. While standing looking at the downed plane, I had a second
moving experience -- similar to that at "The Wall". I recognized the
structures. I saw the parts that I am so intimately familiar with. I saw
the devastation that the passengers in this aircraft must have endured. I
can only hope that they did not suffer.
I am told that the field of debris was 600 feet long (2 football fields).
The first sign of contact was fiberglass imbedded 4" into tree tops. The
last item in the field was the engine. In all my days, I have never seen a
propeller as curled as this one. I am not familiar with all of the
details... but I can tell you this... There were structures that had every
rivet sheared off. I recognized parts that I thought would be impossible to
destroy.yet here they were in pieces. It was my familiarity with the parts
and pieces that made this moment so significant. I cannot imagine what was
happening at the time the airframe came to this state of being. I did not
know the pilot or passenger. I wish that I could have met them. I am sure
they were fine individuals, as all of the -10 builders seem to be.
Why am I writing this, you ask? I am not concerned about insurance or the
future of our small community of builders. I am not concerned about bent
sheet metal. I am writing this to encourage you, my airplane and aviation
family, to think twice before entering into an area filled with
Thunderstorms. I have no idea what happened, but I do know that this one
stop. this 10 minutes in Georgia. will change the way that I "pilot".maybe
for the rest of my life. I have landed for weather before..and I will
again. From now on.I will be much quicker to make a "NO GO" decision. I
encourage you to do the same. The boys from Lancair told harrowing tales of
their trip down this year.and how they had been at 400' AGL above an
interstate to avoid towers. I was amazed that they survived their complete
lack of judgment. We all can suffer from "get-there-'it is"
This humbling moment in time, may save my life.and the lives of my
passengers. I am sorry that others lost their lives in order to drive this
home for me.
Be safe my friends, I hope that I can meet each of you in person one day
soon.
Pete
RV-10 #40100
90% done, 90% to go.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Humbling Experience |
Pete,
Thanks for posting your story and feelings. We all need to be open
enough to reflect and allow some positive to come from all of the
past and future negatives we encounter in our hobby. If I had
a hundred bucks for every time I've been flying in my RV-10 and
pictured the "aftermath" article that my wrong decision would
make, I'd be able to pay for my plane. It can happen to any
of us, and we all just have to approach all of our decisions with
the proper respect. It is great that you told the story
as it will be a very close to home memory for those who are
faced with such decisions down the road.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
James, Peter [SD] wrote:
> Dear -10 Listers,
>
>
>
> I have debated for several days whether to hit the send button on this
> e-mail. I am not sure that it is my place to share this experience. I
> attended SNF this year and was pleased to look over all of the -10s that
> were in attendance. It is exciting to know that my plane will sit in
> the same row with these birds in the near future. But thats not the
> reason for this message..
>
>
>
> On the way home from SNF, we stopped in Georgia to look at a ground
> looped Skybolt that one of my fellow chapter members is considering
> purchasing. During the conversation with the salvage yard, I mentioned
> that I was building an RV-10and that unfortunately, one had gone down
> last week. The gent helping us stated that the plane was there. Right
> next to where we were standing. We wandered over and took a look
>
>
>
> I have never been humbled as much as I was at the Vietnam Memorial in
> Washington, D.C. While standing looking at the downed plane, I had a
> second moving experience -- similar to that at The Wall. I recognized
> the structures. I saw the parts that I am so intimately familiar with.
> I saw the devastation that the passengers in this aircraft must have
> endured. I can only hope that they did not suffer.
>
>
>
> I am told that the field of debris was 600 feet long (2 football
> fields). The first sign of contact was fiberglass imbedded 4 into tree
> tops. The last item in the field was the engine. In all my days, I
> have never seen a propeller as curled as this one. I am not familiar
> with all of the details.. but I can tell you this.. There were
> structures that had every rivet sheared off. I recognized parts that I
> thought would be impossible to destroyyet here they were in pieces. It
> was my familiarity with the parts and pieces that made this moment so
> significant. I cannot imagine what was happening at the time the
> airframe came to this state of being. I did not know the pilot or
> passenger. I wish that I could have met them. I am sure they were fine
> individuals, as all of the -10 builders seem to be.
>
>
>
> Why am I writing this, you ask? I am not concerned about insurance or
> the future of our small community of builders. I am not concerned about
> bent sheet metal. I am writing this to encourage you, my airplane and
> aviation family, to think twice before entering into an area filled with
> Thunderstorms. I have no idea what happened, but I do know that this
> one stop this 10 minutes in Georgia will change the way that I
> pilotmaybe for the rest of my life. I have landed for weather
> before.and I will again. From now onI will be much quicker to make a
> NO GO decision. I encourage you to do the same. The boys from
> Lancair told harrowing tales of their trip down this yearand how they
> had been at 400 AGL above an interstate to avoid towers. I was amazed
> that they survived their complete lack of judgment. We all can suffer
> from get-there-it is
>
>
>
> This humbling moment in time, may save my lifeand the lives of my
> passengers. I am sorry that others lost their lives in order to drive
> this home for me.
>
>
>
> Be safe my friends, I hope that I can meet each of you in person one day
> soon.
>
> Pete
>
> RV-10 #40100
>
> 90% done, 90% to go.
>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 14
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Does anyone know of a simulator for the GRT system? It would be great to
practice on the ground, without burning avgas!
Thanks
Sam Marlow
GRANSCOTT@aol.com wrote:
> Guys and Gals...you may want to read that manual very carefully before
> launching and trying to learn by flying...you'll spend too much heads
> down time...most systems have a simulator mode or stand alone software
> simulators...you might want to find a way to plug in your system on
> the ground and use the simulator there so that when you get airborn
> spending fuel you're not waiting time and altitude cranking dials and
> flipping screens learning...and please consider taking along a safety
> pilot when out with your big screens practicing...hopefully someone
> with TAA experience.
>
> P
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money & Finance
> <http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850>.
> *
>
>
> *
Message 15
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Hello all,
I've got an RV-8 quickbuild empennage on the way and am looking for used to
ols to buy. This is my first RV, so I don't have any tools to speak of. L
et me know if you're willing to part with any of yours. Thanks!
Matt
_________________________________________________________________
More immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.
http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refr
esh_instantaccess_042008
Message 16
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There is apparently a way to interface it into MS Flight Simulator
called GRTBridge. I haven't done it but there's plenty of discussion on
the GRT Yahoo forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GRT_EFIS/
Click on "Messages" and then search for "simulator" and pretty quick.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Marlow
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: RV safety
Does anyone know of a simulator for the GRT system? It would be great to
practice on the ground, without burning avgas!
Thanks
Sam Marlow
GRANSCOTT@aol.com wrote:
> Guys and Gals...you may want to read that manual very carefully before
> launching and trying to learn by flying...you'll spend too much heads
> down time...most systems have a simulator mode or stand alone software
> simulators...you might want to find a way to plug in your system on
> the ground and use the simulator there so that when you get airborn
> spending fuel you're not waiting time and altitude cranking dials and
> flipping screens learning...and please consider taking along a safety
> pilot when out with your big screens practicing...hopefully someone
> with TAA experience.
>
> P
>
>
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money & Finance
> <http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850>.
> *
>
>
> *
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Tools wanted |
Matt,
I sorta went this way in the beginning and found most people aren't parting
with tools in mass numbers, I would recommend checking into Avery's or Cle
aveland tools and look at their RV kits, it is really a pretty economical a
nd efficient way to get your start. You can add tools as you go as needed b
ut these kits will get you through the Emp kit. When you kit arrives, you m
ay find your self scrambling to get tools if you relying on people to put t
heirs up for sale but heck who knows!!
Rick Sked
40185
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Kuperus" <mattkuperus@hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 12:50:22 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: Tools wanted
Hello all,
I've got an RV-8 quickbuild empennage on the way and am looking for used to
ols to buy.=C2- This is my first RV, so I don't have any tools to speak o
f.=C2- Let me know if you're willing to part with any of yours.=C2- Tha
nks!
Matt
More immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.
====
=======================
==
Message 18
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| Subject: | Recommendations for front air vents |
Any recommendations for the front air vents?
Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
........ hit me . :-)
Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I just
added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do it
when I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be
"displeased" if you get flying before I do.
Fred Williams
40515.
Message 19
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I have first hand knowledge that they have not. My friend has them in
his RV-9. And on the way down to SNF, one would not stay timed, causing
high CHT. No one knows exactly why they have issues; software? heat?
who knows.
Do not archive!
----- Original Message -----
From: RV Builder (Michael Sausen)
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 1:59 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: P-Mag!
Anybody know if they have worked out the bugs in their 4cyl models
yet. History has been very hit and miss on those.
Michael
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 12:31 PM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: RV10-List: P-Mag!
I stopped by the E-Mag guys today and they now have a 6-cylinder
version on display. They said they have production units and will be
doing testing. They hope to be shipping by Oshkosh time and are taking
no-deposit waiting list orders via e-mail. I told them they can expect
to sell a lot of them. I think they said it will be about $1,275 for
the mag without the harness.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comht
tp://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Humbling Experience |
Thanks for sharing the details of the HORRIBLE accident. I Know how
you feel. I have witnessed another RV crash site and it is a sad and
humbling experience.
Rob.
On Apr 14, 2008, at 11:56 AM, James, Peter [SD] wrote:
> Dear -10 Listers,
>
> I have debated for several days whether to hit the send button on
> this e-mail. I am not sure that it is my place to share this
> experience. I attended SNF this year and was pleased to look over
> all of the -10s that were in attendance. It is exciting to know
> that my plane will sit in the same row with these birds in the near
> future. But that=92s not the reason for this message=85..
>
> On the way home from SNF, we stopped in Georgia to look at a ground
> looped Skybolt that one of my fellow chapter members is considering
> purchasing. During the conversation with the salvage yard, I
> mentioned that I was building an RV-10=85and that unfortunately, one
> had gone down last week. The gent helping us stated that the plane
> was there=85. Right next to where we were standing. We wandered over
> and took a look=85
>
> I have never been humbled as much as I was at the Vietnam Memorial
> in Washington, D.C. While standing looking at the downed plane, I
> had a second moving experience -- similar to that at =93The Wall=94.
I
> recognized the structures. I saw the parts that I am so intimately
> familiar with. I saw the devastation that the passengers in this
> aircraft must have endured. I can only hope that they did not suffer.
>
> I am told that the field of debris was 600 feet long (2 football
> fields). The first sign of contact was fiberglass imbedded 4=94 into
> tree tops. The last item in the field was the engine. In all my
> days, I have never seen a propeller as curled as this one. I am
> not familiar with all of the details=85.. but I can tell you this=85..
> There were structures that had every rivet sheared off. I
> recognized parts that I thought would be impossible to destroy=85yet
> here they were in pieces. It was my familiarity with the parts and
> pieces that made this moment so significant. I cannot imagine what
> was happening at the time the airframe came to this state of being.
> I did not know the pilot or passenger. I wish that I could have met
> them. I am sure they were fine individuals, as all of the -10
> builders seem to be.
>
> Why am I writing this, you ask? I am not concerned about insurance
> or the future of our small community of builders. I am not
> concerned about bent sheet metal. I am writing this to encourage
> you, my airplane and aviation family, to think twice before entering
> into an area filled with Thunderstorms. I have no idea what
> happened, but I do know that this one stop=85 this 10 minutes in
> Georgia=85 will change the way that I =93pilot=94=85maybe for the rest
of my
> life. I have landed for weather before=85.and I will again. =46rom
> now on=85I will be much quicker to make a =93NO GO=94 decision. I
> encourage you to do the same. The boys from Lancair told harrowing
> tales of their trip down this year=85and how they had been at 400=92
AGL
> above an interstate to avoid towers. I was amazed that they
> survived their complete lack of judgment. We all can suffer from
> =93get-there-=91it is=94
>
> This humbling moment in time, may save my life=85and the lives of my
> passengers. I am sorry that others lost their lives in order to
> drive this home for me.
>
> Be safe my friends, I hope that I can meet each of you in person one
> day soon.
> Pete
>
> RV-10 #40100
> 90% done, 90% to go.
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Recommendations for front air vents |
Stein has some for $90-100 per copy.
I don't recall if I sent out this link before but there are some pictures of
Dave Saylor's RV-10 here:
http://www.sinkrate.com/rv10/aircrafters-fiberglass-class/
that show some pictures of his completed wheel pants with a similar setup.
-Ben
40579.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams,
M.D.
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 2:07 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
Any recommendations for the front air vents?
Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
........ hit me . :-)
Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I just
added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do it
when I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be
"displeased" if you get flying before I do.
Fred Williams
40515.
Message 22
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|
One of the things I had heard in the past was that they were having issues
because the electronics in the mags did not like the heat. Makes sense I g
uess as most don't. I could see this leading to the very random failures t
hey were seeing. No idea if this still would be the case or if they finall
y licked it.
Michael
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Thane States
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 4:19 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: P-Mag!
I have first hand knowledge that they have not. My friend has them in his
RV-9. And on the way down to SNF, one would not stay timed, causing high C
HT. No one knows exactly why they have issues; software? heat? who knows.
Do not archive!
----- Original Message -----
From: RV Builder (Michael Sausen)<mailto:rvbuilder@sausen.net>
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 1:59 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: P-Mag!
Anybody know if they have worked out the bugs in their 4cyl models yet. Hi
story has been very hit and miss on those.
Michael
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@ma
tronics.com> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jes
se Saint
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 12:31 PM
Subject: RV10-List: P-Mag!
I stopped by the E-Mag guys today and they now have a 6-cylinder version on
display. They said they have production units and will be doing testing.
They hope to be shipping by Oshkosh time and are taking no-deposit waiting
list orders via e-mail. I told them they can expect to sell a lot of them
. I think they said it will be about $1,275 for the mag without the harnes
s.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com<mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
<>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 23
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| Subject: | Recommendations for front air vents |
Our illustrious Stein has a popular vent:
http://www.steinair.com/eyeballvents.htm
Looks like he is out of stock on some though. Stein, any idea when you will have
more?
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, M.D.
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 4:07 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
Any recommendations for the front air vents?
Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
........ hit me . :-)
Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I just
added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do it
when I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be
"displeased" if you get flying before I do.
Fred Williams
40515.
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Check out Stein, He's got the best prices on Vents, and they are TOP
quality. http://steinair.com/eyeballvents.htm
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Fred Williams, M.D. wrote:
> <drfred@suddenlinkmail.com>
>
> Any recommendations for the front air vents?
> Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
>
> Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
> Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
>
> ........ hit me . :-)
>
>
Message 25
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| Subject: | Humbling Experience |
Pete,
Thank you for this sobering write up. It is truly sad that we are having
to
learn lessons in such a painful way.
Yes, the RV-10 is a dream airplane for all of us, but at the same time
it is
HIGH PERFORMANCE airplane - that means it is fast. If you have been
flying a
C172, the 10 will be a whole new world. I really hope that all future 10
pilots take the time to get plenty of high performance training
especially
for IFR where things can happen really fast. I get a little nervous when
I
hear about 10 builders who do not have their license yet. Again I hope
they
don't fly their 10 until fully trained for this high-performance
machine.
Sorry to get on my soapbox, but needed to say this.
John Testement
HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt@roadmapscoaching.com"jwt@roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting
do not archive
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James, Peter
[SD]
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 11:57 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Humbling Experience
Dear -10 Listers,
I have debated for several days whether to hit the send button on this
e-mail. I am not sure that it is my place to share this experience. I
attended SNF this year and was pleased to look over all of the -10s that
were in attendance. It is exciting to know that my plane will sit in
the
same row with these birds in the near future. But that=92s not the
reason for
this message=85..
On the way home from SNF, we stopped in Georgia to look at a ground
looped
Skybolt that one of my fellow chapter members is considering purchasing.
During the conversation with the salvage yard, I mentioned that I was
building an RV-10=85and that unfortunately, one had gone down last week.
The
gent helping us stated that the plane was there=85. Right next to where
we
were standing. We wandered over and took a look=85
I have never been humbled as much as I was at the Vietnam Memorial in
Washington, D.C. While standing looking at the downed plane, I had a
second
moving experience -- similar to that at =93The Wall=94. I recognized
the
structures. I saw the parts that I am so intimately familiar with. I
saw
the devastation that the passengers in this aircraft must have endured.
I
can only hope that they did not suffer.
I am told that the field of debris was 600 feet long (2 football
fields).
The first sign of contact was fiberglass imbedded 4=94 into tree tops.
The
last item in the field was the engine. In all my days, I have never
seen a
propeller as curled as this one. I am not familiar with all of the
details=85.. but I can tell you this=85.. There were structures that
had every
rivet sheared off. I recognized parts that I thought would be
impossible to
destroy=85yet here they were in pieces. It was my familiarity with the
parts
and pieces that made this moment so significant. I cannot imagine what
was
happening at the time the airframe came to this state of being. I did
not
know the pilot or passenger. I wish that I could have met them. I am
sure
they were fine individuals, as all of the -10 builders seem to be.
Why am I writing this, you ask? I am not concerned about insurance or
the
future of our small community of builders. I am not concerned about
bent
sheet metal. I am writing this to encourage you, my airplane and
aviation
family, to think twice before entering into an area filled with
Thunderstorms. I have no idea what happened, but I do know that this
one
stop=85 this 10 minutes in Georgia=85 will change the way that I
=93pilot=94=85maybe
for the rest of my life. I have landed for weather before=85.and I will
again. From now on=85I will be much quicker to make a =93NO GO=94
decision. I
encourage you to do the same. The boys from Lancair told harrowing
tales of
their trip down this year=85and how they had been at 400=92 AGL above an
interstate to avoid towers. I was amazed that they survived their
complete
lack of judgment. We all can suffer from =93get-there-=91it is=94
This humbling moment in time, may save my life=85and the lives of my
passengers. I am sorry that others lost their lives in order to drive
this
home for me.
Be safe my friends, I hope that I can meet each of you in person one day
soon.
Pete
RV-10 #40100
90% done, 90% to go.
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"http://www.matronics.com/Na
vig
ator?RV10-List
"http://forums.matronics.com"http://forums.matronics.com
"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribut
ion
7.5.519 /
Checked by AVG.
4/13/2008
1:45 PM
Message 26
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| Subject: | Recommendations for front air vents |
We should have more of the smaller ones back in stock within a couple weeks.
Lockheed called and bought every last one we had on the shelf so the stock
situation has been hard to keep up with on those smaller ones! We're trying
to keep up, but when someone just buys all of them in one fell swoop it
takes us a bit to catch back up.
Cheers,
Stein
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of RV Builder
>(Michael Sausen)
>Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 4:52 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
><rvbuilder@sausen.net>
>
>Our illustrious Stein has a popular vent:
>
>http://www.steinair.com/eyeballvents.htm
>
>Looks like he is out of stock on some though. Stein, any idea
>when you will have more?
>
>Michael
>
>>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Deems, Michael and Ben.
Thanks.
Will give Stein a day to get over Sun -n Fun and call in am to see when
some will be available. He'll probably see this later today. Now I can
tell my wife I saved $100 today.
Fred Williams
>
Message 28
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I have been flying lots, but finally got the wheel pants on so took some pix
to motivate you "yet to fly" guys.
Gary
40274 Flying
Message 29
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That's it, just rub it in !!!!!!!!!!! >:o
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
gary wrote:
>
> I have been flying lots, but finally got the wheel pants on so took
> some pix to motivate you yet to fly guys.
>
>
Message 30
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Hanger is way too clean.......... ;-)
do not archive
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 5:04 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Pix
I have been flying lots, but finally got the wheel pants on so took some pix
to motivate you "yet to fly" guys.
Gary
40274 Flying
Message 31
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Beautiful plane & paint scheme. I hope my -10 will be larger because
there is no way I am going to fit in a plane that small. Oh, maybe it's
just a small photo...
Robin
Do Not Archive
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 5:04 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Pix
I have been flying lots, but finally got the wheel pants on so took some
pix to motivate you "yet to fly" guys.
Gary
40274 Flying
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: GRT EIS User Manual |
Just wanted to let you know I got a copy of the EIS 4000/6000 manual from
Marcus. As I told him the customer support from the list is second to none!
-Chris
#40072
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris" <toaster73@embarqmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 9:48 AM
Subject: RV10-List: GRT EIS User Manual
>
> Does anyone have this manual in pdf they could send me? It seems to be
> missing from GRT website.
> Thanks
> Chris #40072
>
> do not archive
>
>
>
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Fred,
I got 4 from a salvage yard not a scratch on them, nice Aluminum for less
than $100 after some negotiations. So there are other avenues.
-Chris
#40072
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@suddenlinkmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
> <drfred@suddenlinkmail.com>
>
> Deems, Michael and Ben.
> Thanks.
> Will give Stein a day to get over Sun -n Fun and call in am to see when
> some will be available. He'll probably see this later today. Now I can
> tell my wife I saved $100 today.
>
> Fred Williams
>
>>
>
>
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Having done it both ways now, I'd say ABSOLUTELY go with
the aluminum ones...the plastic ones suck.
Anyone want a hot deal on plastic vents? :)
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
Fred Williams, M.D. wrote:
> <drfred@suddenlinkmail.com>
>
> Any recommendations for the front air vents?
> Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
>
> Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
> Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
>
> ........ hit me . :-)
>
>
> Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I just
> added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do it
> when I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be
> "displeased" if you get flying before I do.
>
>
>
> Fred Williams
> 40515.
>
Message 35
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I am pretty much finished building and am sending the plane to my painter in
pieces.
I am really having a hard time getting the cowling hinges to go in. I
believe some eyelets may have been bent a little out of alignment during
paint prep. I would like to hear what others have done to realign the hinges
and get hinge pins to go in more easily.
John Testement
HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt@roadmapscoaching.com"jwt@roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting
Checked by AVG.
1:45 PM
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
John W. Cox wrote:
> This is a perfect question for Stein of SteinAir or Dewey Conroy of
> Pacific Coast Avionics. They are probably both taking all kinds of
> orders and will address this after returning. Many inquiring minds
> want to know exactly these questions.
>
>
>
> I would like to see an EFIS system which can annunciate remotely
> mounted and controlled avionics without taking the financial dive with
> the Garmin G900X national debt decision. I am impressed with Robin's
> purchase but it is too rich for my blood. Synthetic Vision, HITS,
> Chartview, SafeTaxi, Terrain, Traffic and Weather with the capability
> to go IFR. Vertical Autopilot GPS steer with the AFS 4500 is a great
> start.
>
>
>
> John
>
>
>
OK, while we're on the subject of the stuff panels are made of, does
anyone have any comments on the Odessey???
http://www.mglavionics.com/html/odyssey.html
I'm looking at that for my panel. I spent a lot of time looking at it
at Sun-N-Fun. Tell me why you think it's a good or bad purchase!!!
Linn
Message 37
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Beautiful! Wheel pants definitely pretty-up any RV-10!
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
gary wrote:
> I have been flying lots, but finally got the wheel pants on so took some
> pix to motivate you yet to fly guys.
>
>
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Cowling hinges |
John:
An old trick from years gone by:
Try beveling a piece of pin stock, chuck it in a battery powered drill
motor and move it in and out of the hindge at a low RPM.
Dick Sipp
RV10 N110DV 40065
----- Original Message -----
From: John Testement
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 9:38 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Cowling hinges
I am pretty much finished building and am sending the plane to my
painter in pieces.
I am really having a hard time getting the cowling hinges to go in. I
believe some eyelets may have been bent a little out of alignment during
paint prep. I would like to hear what others have done to realign the
hinges and get hinge pins to go in more easily.
John Testement
jwt@roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting
Checked by AVG.
4/13/2008 1:45 PM
Message 39
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I've had an ongoing problem with Andair and I thought that I'd give everyone
that was thinking about buying one of their products some insight into their
lack of responsiveness and customer service. I purchased a fuel valve for
my RV-10 before the valve extensions were available. At Oshkosh 2007 I
personally handed them the fuel valve I purchased to be exchanged for one
with a six inch extension. The receipt noted the serial number of the fuel
valve that I gave them along with a quote for the price of a valve with the
extension. I've been emailing every 2-3 weeks and I've called them a couple
of times but here I am almost 9 months later with no fuel valve despite
several promised shipping dates. I thought I was dealing with a reputable
company but my experience so far has been otherwise.
Bruce Snyder
40353
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
I ordered the one from Spruce, but the $56 is too small for the RV10 vent.
I had to return it. They were good on the refund.
Tim is correct on the metal ones. I bit the bullet and bought Van's vents for $145
(ouch). They do have a nice mounting flange that married up to the vent perfectly.
I am unimpressed by them at that price, but I tried the junks and Wentworth,
but could not get any. Stein's look good.
It just about kills me to think that I saw a bunch of them at a crash site a few
years ago and did not salvage them. They were in perfect condition. Good lesson.
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Ready to exit cabin top/door purgatory
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=176888#176888
Message 41
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| Subject: | AFS Systems .... and others |
Linn,
There has been a lot of discussion on the list of how many different
EFIS systems this category can support before the industry consolidates
leaving some panels without product innovation or support including
replacement parts. I know nothing about Odyssey and their backing (and
do not want to disparage them) but It does seem that Dynon & GRT on the
(relatively) lower end of the price spectrum continue to develop &
improve their already impressive & tested products. When one has spent
so much time & effort on your aircraft it would be a shame to be stuck
with a white elephant panel. Imagine having placed dual BMA EFIS One's
in your plane because of all the reported features. When you eventually
do offer your plane for sale the panel MAY eliminate many potential
buyers. I look at a lot of RV-6/7/8's with amazing construction &
beautiful paint then I see their panel and I think... yeeeeh... never
mind.
I don't know the ultimate difference in pricing between the Odyssey,
Dynon & GRT offerings but they can't be THAT far apart when viewed in
your overall -10 budget. I always say an aircraft is the airframe
design, engine/prop & avionics. I think we all agree you have made an
outstanding airframe selection, any of the approved engines are an
excellent choice for the -10, all that is left is your panel.
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A 400 Hours
RV-10 Sooner or Later, Probably Later
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 6:42 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: AFS Systems .... and others
John W. Cox wrote:
This is a perfect question for Stein of SteinAir or Dewey Conroy of
Pacific Coast Avionics. They are probably both taking all kinds of
orders and will address this after returning. Many inquiring minds want
to know exactly these questions.
I would like to see an EFIS system which can annunciate remotely mounted
and controlled avionics without taking the financial dive with the
Garmin G900X national debt decision. I am impressed with Robin's
purchase but it is too rich for my blood. Synthetic Vision, HITS,
Chartview, SafeTaxi, Terrain, Traffic and Weather with the capability to
go IFR. Vertical Autopilot GPS steer with the AFS 4500 is a great
start.
John
OK, while we're on the subject of the stuff panels are made of, does
anyone have any comments on the Odessey???
http://www.mglavionics.com/html/odyssey.html
I'm looking at that for my panel. I spent a lot of time looking at it
at Sun-N-Fun. Tell me why you think it's a good or bad purchase!!!
Linn
Message 42
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| Subject: | Humbling Experience |
Pete,
I know that feeling of wondering how on earth a (fill in the blank) could
have gotten twisted up that badly. I'm reminded just how fragile these
machines are; the occupants even more so.
Thanks for your well written post.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
do not archive
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James, Peter [SD]
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 8:57 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Humbling Experience
Dear -10 Listers,
I have debated for several days whether to hit the send button on this
e-mail. I am not sure that it is my place to share this experience. I
attended SNF this year and was pleased to look over all of the -10s that
were in attendance. It is exciting to know that my plane will sit in the
same row with these birds in the near future. But that's not the reason for
this message...
On the way home from SNF, we stopped in Georgia to look at a ground looped
Skybolt that one of my fellow chapter members is considering purchasing.
During the conversation with the salvage yard, I mentioned that I was
building an RV-10.and that unfortunately, one had gone down last week. The
gent helping us stated that the plane was there.. Right next to where we
were standing. We wandered over and took a look.
I have never been humbled as much as I was at the Vietnam Memorial in
Washington, D.C. While standing looking at the downed plane, I had a second
moving experience -- similar to that at "The Wall". I recognized the
structures. I saw the parts that I am so intimately familiar with. I saw
the devastation that the passengers in this aircraft must have endured. I
can only hope that they did not suffer.
I am told that the field of debris was 600 feet long (2 football fields).
The first sign of contact was fiberglass imbedded 4" into tree tops. The
last item in the field was the engine. In all my days, I have never seen a
propeller as curled as this one. I am not familiar with all of the
details... but I can tell you this... There were structures that had every
rivet sheared off. I recognized parts that I thought would be impossible to
destroy.yet here they were in pieces. It was my familiarity with the parts
and pieces that made this moment so significant. I cannot imagine what was
happening at the time the airframe came to this state of being. I did not
know the pilot or passenger. I wish that I could have met them. I am sure
they were fine individuals, as all of the -10 builders seem to be.
Why am I writing this, you ask? I am not concerned about insurance or the
future of our small community of builders. I am not concerned about bent
sheet metal. I am writing this to encourage you, my airplane and aviation
family, to think twice before entering into an area filled with
Thunderstorms. I have no idea what happened, but I do know that this one
stop. this 10 minutes in Georgia. will change the way that I "pilot".maybe
for the rest of my life. I have landed for weather before..and I will
again. From now on.I will be much quicker to make a "NO GO" decision. I
encourage you to do the same. The boys from Lancair told harrowing tales of
their trip down this year.and how they had been at 400' AGL above an
interstate to avoid towers. I was amazed that they survived their complete
lack of judgment. We all can suffer from "get-there-'it is"
This humbling moment in time, may save my life.and the lives of my
passengers. I am sorry that others lost their lives in order to drive this
home for me.
Be safe my friends, I hope that I can meet each of you in person one day
soon.
Pete
RV-10 #40100
90% done, 90% to go.
Message 43
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| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
Robin,
You raise an important consideration and one I gave serious weight to
myself in choosing an EFIS supplier. Personally though I think Dynon and
AFS have the greatest potential for longest term survival. Dynon because
of their market share due to being first to market and having the lowest
price points. Regarding AFS, you may not be aware that they have an OEM
relationship with Bendix/King Honeywell (the KFD 840 Primary Flight
Display), and also is the exclusive supplier of EFIS systems for the
Glasair TWT Sportsman program. This provides diversification and funding
for additional development and support resources that benefit those of
us with AFS branded products. As an AFS owner I am more familiar with
their situation than GRT, I hear great things from owners of their
products also, just didn't know if any of this was widely known.
I agree with those who think this market will likely experience some
consolidation as it matures, and that those still choosing their
avionics should consider this aspect as well.
Randy Lervold
RV-3B, www.rv3works.com
RV-8 www.rv-8.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Robin Marks
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 9:19 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: AFS Systems .... and others
Linn,
There has been a lot of discussion on the list of how many different
EFIS systems this category can support before the industry consolidates
leaving some panels without product innovation or support including
replacement parts. I know nothing about Odyssey and their backing (and
do not want to disparage them) but It does seem that Dynon & GRT on the
(relatively) lower end of the price spectrum continue to develop &
improve their already impressive & tested products. When one has spent
so much time & effort on your aircraft it would be a shame to be stuck
with a white elephant panel. Imagine having placed dual BMA EFIS One's
in your plane because of all the reported features. When you eventually
do offer your plane for sale the panel MAY eliminate many potential
buyers. I look at a lot of RV-6/7/8's with amazing construction &
beautiful paint then I see their panel and I think. yeeeeh. never mind.
I don't know the ultimate difference in pricing between the Odyssey,
Dynon & GRT offerings but they can't be THAT far apart when viewed in
your overall -10 budget. I always say an aircraft is the airframe
design, engine/prop & avionics. I think we all agree you have made an
outstanding airframe selection, any of the approved engines are an
excellent choice for the -10, all that is left is your panel.
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A 400 Hours
RV-10 Sooner or Later, Probably Later
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 6:42 PM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: AFS Systems .... and others
John W. Cox wrote:
This is a perfect question for Stein of SteinAir or Dewey Conroy of
Pacific Coast Avionics. They are probably both taking all kinds of
orders and will address this after returning. Many inquiring minds want
to know exactly these questions.
I would like to see an EFIS system which can annunciate remotely
mounted and controlled avionics without taking the financial dive with
the Garmin G900X national debt decision. I am impressed with Robin's
purchase but it is too rich for my blood. Synthetic Vision, HITS,
Chartview, SafeTaxi, Terrain, Traffic and Weather with the capability to
go IFR. Vertical Autopilot GPS steer with the AFS 4500 is a great
start.
John
OK, while we're on the subject of the stuff panels are made of, does
anyone have any comments on the Odessey???
http://www.mglavionics.com/html/odyssey.html
I'm looking at that for my panel. I spent a lot of time looking at it
at Sun-N-Fun. Tell me why you think it's a good or bad purchase!!!
Linn
http://www.matronic - MATRONICS available via the Web
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com===
================http://www.matronics.com/
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