Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:49 AM - Re: Quick Question (gary)
2. 06:53 AM - Re: Quick Question (John Strain)
3. 06:56 AM - Re: Section 40 Flap System and Mid Cabin Deck (johngoodman)
4. 07:28 AM - Good used O-540 engines for sale (evmeg@snowcrest.net)
5. 08:40 AM - Wire Brands/Types/Sources (AirMike)
6. 09:03 AM - Re: Wire Brands/Types/Sources ()
7. 09:07 AM - Re: Wire Brands/Types/Sources (pascal)
8. 09:19 AM - Re: Wire Brands/Types/Sources (Jesse Saint)
9. 09:27 AM - Hysol 9360 Window install update (RobHickman@aol.com)
10. 09:35 AM - Re: Re: SB work (MauleDriver)
11. 10:17 AM - Re: Quick Question (William Curtis)
12. 11:02 AM - Re: Re: Quick Question ()
13. 11:07 AM - Re: Hysol 9360 Window install update (David Maib)
14. 11:16 AM - Re: Quick Question (John Jessen)
15. 11:23 AM - Re: Hysol 9360 Window install update (Jim Berry)
16. 11:36 AM - Re: Hysol 9360 Window install update (Bobby J. Hughes)
17. 11:40 AM - Re: Hysol 9360 Window install update (Dave Saylor)
18. 12:12 PM - Re: Quick Question (Robin Marks)
19. 02:15 PM - Cabin Floor Panels (Jeff Carpenter)
20. 02:25 PM - Re: Quick Question (William Curtis)
21. 02:41 PM - Flightline Interiors trim (Marcus Cooper)
22. 02:49 PM - Re: Cabin Floor Panels (William Curtis)
23. 02:55 PM - Chrome Plating the steps (Jeff Carpenter)
24. 03:28 PM - Re: Flightline Interiors trim (Tim Olson)
25. 03:43 PM - Re: Flightline Interiors trim (GenGrumpy@aol.com)
26. 04:11 PM - Re: Chrome Plating the steps (Dave Saylor)
27. 06:49 PM - Re: Chrome Plating the steps (Robin Marks)
28. 08:20 PM - Re: Alternator belt (Bill Schlatterer)
29. 09:05 PM - Re: Cabin Floor Panels (Dave Leikam)
30. 09:36 PM - Cost to build to date (Rick Sked)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Now you know why I go back and forth from Minnesota to Georgia. Can't stand
the cold or the heat. Now I have the best of both worlds.
Gary
40274 Flying
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 11:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
OK, I'll jump on this one as well. My original budget was $129K. I was
doing just fine until OSH 2006, and I saw Debbie and Jim' s beautiful
-10. I returned from that with a new standard for completion. My
previous 'good enough' just .... wasn't anymore. My original time
estimate was 14-16 months, After all I was now retired, and I had been
routinely working 50-60 hour weeks, so 40 hour weeks should be a
breeze.............. yeah right. The painter is scheduled to pick it up
next week. that's the last big check I'll have to write (I hope), and
that will bring me to $190k. As some know I've got an appetite for some
'alterations' and that has played a big part in the cost increase, but
an even BIGGER part in the time increases. I decided to go slo build
not so much for financial reasons, but more for 'ego satisfaction'
reasons. (I even built, wired and silkscreened my own panel) While the
project started out as a 'kit' somewhere along the way it transformed
into something else. The more of my time I invested in it, and with the
even bigger amount of thought that I invested in it. It wasn't just a
'kit' anymore it was something much more personal, and that relegated
the financial parts of the decisions to a second tier. I applaud those
that can continue to completion with their projects and maintain a
dispassionate and purely objective perspective. I'm not one of them. So
while the costs are significantly beyond my original estimate, and in my
former worklife I was always able to operate at or below budget, I'm
strangely (?) comfortable in this situation.
What I'm not comfortable with is the $#!!$#$$ heat of AZ summers. when
the plane returns from paint, it will sit in the hangar where the temps
are +15 degrees from OAT until it is bearable (OCT). If I weren't
operating on an FAA mandated 'time-delay' I'd be much more anxious about
that
As it is, its nice to know I've got 5 more months to evaluate any
additional 'alterations' ...........And their associated costs =-O
Deems Davis # 406
7months down and 5 to go
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Deems,
Think AC. Cold, cool, air conditioning....
Temptations helper
John Strain
Flightline AC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 9:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
OK, I'll jump on this one as well. My original budget was $129K. I was
doing just fine until OSH 2006, and I saw Debbie and Jim' s beautiful
-10. I returned from that with a new standard for completion. My
previous 'good enough' just .... wasn't anymore. My original time
estimate was 14-16 months, After all I was now retired, and I had been
routinely working 50-60 hour weeks, so 40 hour weeks should be a
breeze.............. yeah right. The painter is scheduled to pick it up
next week. that's the last big check I'll have to write (I hope), and
that will bring me to $190k. As some know I've got an appetite for some
'alterations' and that has played a big part in the cost increase, but
an even BIGGER part in the time increases. I decided to go slo build
not so much for financial reasons, but more for 'ego satisfaction'
reasons. (I even built, wired and silkscreened my own panel) While the
project started out as a 'kit' somewhere along the way it transformed
into something else. The more of my time I invested in it, and with the
even bigger amount of thought that I invested in it. It wasn't just a
'kit' anymore it was something much more personal, and that relegated
the financial parts of the decisions to a second tier. I applaud those
that can continue to completion with their projects and maintain a
dispassionate and purely objective perspective. I'm not one of them. So
while the costs are significantly beyond my original estimate, and in my
former worklife I was always able to operate at or below budget, I'm
strangely (?) comfortable in this situation.
What I'm not comfortable with is the $#!!$#$$ heat of AZ summers. when
the plane returns from paint, it will sit in the hangar where the temps
are +15 degrees from OAT until it is bearable (OCT). If I weren't
operating on an FAA mandated 'time-delay' I'd be much more anxious about
that
As it is, its nice to know I've got 5 more months to evaluate any
additional 'alterations' ...........And their associated costs =-O
Deems Davis # 406
7months down and 5 to go
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Section 40 Flap System and Mid Cabin Deck |
Ben,
I want to thank you for relating your experiences with Section 40. I just finished
it yesterday heeding your comments. You saved me a lot of grief, although
getting those nuts torqued in the outboard cavities is still a problem.
Thanks,
John
> We just finished section 40 last night, installing the Flap Systems, and I thought
I would write up my experiences to hopefully save some of you the time and
frustrations that my wife and I endured while I created all sorts of new cuss
words installing the flap torque tubes.
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=190080#190080
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Good used O-540 engines for sale |
Ok guys, I had a ton of response on my post about an engine we have, but
got frustrated in my efforts to get ahold of the engine logs. I did
finally get them (there are 2 engines available). Short story is an Aero
Commander got smashed up by a goofball in a van so the airframe got
scrapped and the engines are good used mid time and complete. The
accesories are there, but you will want to replace the old heavy starters
and generators. No damage history on either engine. The airplane was being
flown in part 135 for a fire watch and was subject to 100 hour
inspections. At least at the time of the incident aprox. 2 years ago
everything was in compliance. The lycoming crank AD's are covered. We just
borrowed a boroscope and had a look inside and it all appears super clean
inside. They are both O-540-A2B models. The left engine has 930 hours
since TBO (serial RL 10791-40) and the right engine has 992 since TBO
(serial RL 15696-40). I was planning on using one on my RV 10, but I had
to sell the project and start over on a 9A. You can look up the airplane
if you like, the tail number is N55BW. Asking price is $13K each as is
where is. They are on pallets and we have a forklift to load them.
Feel free to email or call with questions.
Evan Johnson
evmeg@snowcrest.net
(530)351-1776 cell
---------------------------------------------
This message was sent using SnowCrest WebMail.
http://www.snowcrest.net
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Wire Brands/Types/Sources |
I purchased the Vans basic wiring kit which as worked out so so, but I am at the
point where I need to purchase some more wire for the trim, lights, and misc
systems. Any suggestions for brands and sources. Also fire resistance.
--------
OSH '08 or Bust (busted) be there in "09
Q/B Kit - exited cabin top/door purgatory
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=190103#190103
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Wire Brands/Types/Sources |
http://www.steinair.com/wire.htm
>
> From: "AirMike" <Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>
> Date: 2008/06/27 Fri AM 10:36:56 EST
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Wire Brands/Types/Sources
>
>
> I purchased the Vans basic wiring kit which as worked out so so, but I am at
the point where I need to purchase some more wire for the trim, lights, and misc
systems. Any suggestions for brands and sources. Also fire resistance.
>
> --------
> OSH '08 or Bust (busted) be there in "09
> Q/B Kit - exited cabin top/door purgatory
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=190103#190103
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Wire Brands/Types/Sources |
Try:
WireMasters, Inc.
Phone: 800-635-5342
good pricing and great service.
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "AirMike" <Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 8:36 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Wire Brands/Types/Sources
>
> I purchased the Vans basic wiring kit which as worked out so so, but I am
> at the point where I need to purchase some more wire for the trim, lights,
> and misc systems. Any suggestions for brands and sources. Also fire
> resistance.
>
> --------
> OSH '08 or Bust (busted) be there in "09
> Q/B Kit - exited cabin top/door purgatory
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=190103#190103
>
>
>
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Wire Brands/Types/Sources |
Steinair.com
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
On Jun 27, 2008, at 11:36 AM, AirMike wrote:
>
> I purchased the Vans basic wiring kit which as worked out so so, but
> I am at the point where I need to purchase some more wire for the
> trim, lights, and misc systems. Any suggestions for brands and
> sources. Also fire resistance.
>
> --------
> OSH '08 or Bust (busted) be there in "09
> Q/B Kit - exited cabin top/door purgatory
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=190103#190103
>
>
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Hysol 9360 Window install update |
I installed the windows five days ago using Hysol from Lancair
_http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=9360-QT_
(http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=9360-QT)
and last night I had one of them just pop out when I slightly pressed on it.
I then proceeded to easily pop the other side window out. Naturally this
occurred right after I had spent the last two days fabricating and sanding the
front windshield faring. After much advice from all the neighbors we
decided to remove the front fairing and test the windshield and it popped right
out
also
I believe that the problem was caused by me not roughing up the windows near
enough on the glue joint, although I am not sure. The 9360 bonded to the
fiberglass and did not bond at all to the window. Lancair says "we have used
this for over 10 years without a problem on the windows" and that they always
rough up both surfaces with 60 grit sand paper before bonding the window.
I am now going to do a test bond on some scrap window with roughing up the
surface before I decide what to do.
The learning curve continues......
Rob Hickman
RV-10 (without windows)
**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Completed the job in 6 unhurried hours on an assembled fuselage without
the tail surfaces installed.
Drilling out the rivets was pretty easy. Sharp bits help. So does a
12" bit and an angle drill for 2 or 4 of them.
Was able to power squeeze all the doubler rivets and all the horizontal
tail deck rivets with the exception of 4. Used a hand squeezer on the 6
or 8 rivets that go into the vertical tab at the front.
Bill Watson
Durham NC
See you at Oshkosh
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Quick Question |
Rick,
Did you have one (or both) of those aforementioned women do the math on your spending?:-)
Maybe they did a little "shopping" on their own.
By my calculation you have $92,000 in the RV-10 kit, Engine and Prop and another
$45,000 in Avionics. Assuming another $10,000 in paint and $5,000 for the Oxygen
system, this all totals $152,000. That means you spent another $38,000!
on interior and "other stuff." That's a lot of "stuff."
I'm working on finishing up the exterior and I still have yet to purchase any major
avionics. I'm always intrigued by the builders that have barely finished
major airframe components and have panels bought, built and paid for only to
sit there for the next few years while products evolve. While all other components
in aviation tend to go up in price, avionics are the only component that
you are most often better off waiting until the last possible moment to buy.
Better products become available, prices go down or you get more for the same
price. If my avionics package began to approach $50K, I'd seriously look at
the G900X system. I'm $20K below that threshold so no G900X for me.
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/91Panel/index.html
-------- Original Message --------
>
> Boy have I been waiting for this...I'm not sure I'll answer anything but I'm
sure I'll RAMBLE!!!!
>
> I have pretty much paid for everything at this point, Firewall forward is done,
avionics/electrical are done, interior is halfway with the seats completed
by Classic Aero, Barretts did the engine, standard induction with chrome package,
and custom paint yeah I know CJ, chrome don't get you home. My panel is pretty
crowded but I think very functional full IFR. The bits and pieces are as
follows. 2 AFS 3500, Mx-20 MFD, GNS-480, TT RV-10 AP, PMA 8000 audio, SL-30, GDL-69A,
330 remote transponder, Mt. High 4 place pulse demand O2, Midcontinent
CDI works off GPS & NAV, Back up Airspeed, TT turn and bank and altimeter, fully
lighted fiberglass panel/console and overhead. I went with the MT 3 blade,
one because it look cool, second becasue Russ Daves ran super smooth..I would
go Hartzell if I had to do it over...why? Stinking cowl is a bear to R & R and
I'm not sure it's really worth the extra dollars. The little stuff will eat
you up on the build, FWF package is 5 grand no matter !
>
> how you cut it, Van's or piece it out still about 5 grand. so many otehr things
that just creep up, nuts, epoxy, door handles...oh yeah, mine are the flush
billets...another $500. So where am I going with this??? I'll break it down-
>
> My original budget was $150,000 max....40 for the kit, 40 for the prop engine,
40 for the panel and 5 for the interior and 8 for paint. The balance was for
what I didn't know...boy what you don't know...add braided brake lines/fuel lines,
O2...oh yeah...GDL-69...gotta have it, XM music, weather?? Well heck only
another $3500!!!, overhead console..SURE!!! Right now minus paint and carpet/sidepanels
I'm just about at 190K...I haven't added the 6-32 locknuts for the
baffling rods to the mix yet.
>
> Nutshell engine about 43K, prop almost 9K, avionics, O2 and electrical stuff
including wiring, batteries etc...easily 80k, what really kicks your butt is SHIPPING...and
it's gonna get worse with fuel costs now.
>
> I have no regrets on what I have spent, I really think it is all recoverable
at sale, those close to me know how I like to build so selling this is an option
for me...blood sweat and tears, everything I put in this I did for resale...but
that was not my goal..I have no plans to sell in the near future, short distant
maybe but not near.
>
> Here is my advice if I was going to do it again.
>
> Seriously look at your mission, day night VFR is a good mission...everything
I have ever flown was day/night VFR...because the IFR stuff was always broke..isn't
that why we built our own? because the stuff I was renting was junk. I'm
not IFR rated...only want to be in case I get stuck...I have all the time in
the world to wait out weather.
>
> My ideal RV-10 for me, with hindsight would be...same engine...Barrett's you
guys rock...little more cash but worth it, avionics? 2 AFS 4500's, 430/530 GPS/Nav/COM,
TT AP, gotta have a good AP with vertical guidance, if anything it will
allow your PAX properly instructed to get you into the field...nuther story
all together.
>
> Portable O2..., basic transponder, good backup NAV/COM,
>
> Sooooo much more to have a good talk about...and I'm not even flying it yet.
For those wondering....I have to final rivet the cabin top, do the windshield,
put on the door which have been fitted and a boat load of body work, paint and
final interior plus the fairings and pants which have been fabbed just not final
fitted.
>
> I would have been done by now...I'll make a few excuses...one I lost my Dad in
December...kicked my ass, still does. I could not get my head in the game for
three months, two...heh heh...multiple complications from multiple women...nuff
said...46 in years...18 at heart. Burnout and summer heat...Deems and David
can understand the summer heat. Expect burnout, it comes. Seems the last "few"
items take HOURS to complete.
>
> I have and never will set a date for this to fly...it will happen when I go to
grab a part and there are none left...I think September.
>
> So...My initial budget??? I exceeded it by about 50K...only because I could...but
I was realistic in the beginning, I found myself with too fat a wallet and
a whole bunch of GEE WHIZ!!! I gotta have that. Let's finish this over a brew
at RV-10 central in about 6 weeks.
>
> Whew!!!
>
> Rick Sked
> 40185
> please DO NOT ARCHIVE....(especially the women part)
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tim Olson" <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 7:07:27 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
>
>
> Hey Rick,
>
> Now that you're this far along....give your opinion as to how your views
> may or may not have shifted on what you feel the "average" builder will
> put into their RV-10. What was your original budget and thoughts,
> and how did that come out?
>
> For me, I probably ended up 40-60K over what I originally intended,
> starting out and allowing creep as I went along. Just wondering
> if you have a perspective change.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
> Rick Sked wrote:
> >
> > LOL.....I want a $150K RV-10....Seems mine has slightly exceeded that amount
> >
> > Rick Sked
> > 40185
> > do not archive
>
>
>
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Quick Question |
>
> From: "William Curtis" <wcurtis@nerv10.com>
> Date: 2008/06/27 Fri PM 12:29:29 EST
> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
>
>
> Rick,
>
> Did you have one (or both) of those aforementioned women do the math on your
spending?:-) Maybe they did a little "shopping" on their own.
>
Having been to Rick's place, I can confirm that they done a little shopping on
their own. :^) Of course having a burst water pipe and damaging most of the
house, didn't help at all. It's an open ticket to go spend. If it were my project,
I would have been shut done so quick. Rick is certainly a better man than
I am in this regards.
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hysol 9360 Window install update |
Rob,
I was just a couple of days from bonding my windows in with Hysol 9360 when your
post came in. Needless to say, we are on hold until we get some answers here.
We are going to test some scrap materials as well, but will be very interested
in hearing how your tests come out.
Timing is Everything.
David Maib
40559
On Friday, June 27, 2008, at 11:35AM, <RobHickman@aol.com> wrote:
>
>I installed the windows five days ago using Hysol from Lancair
>_http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=9360-QT_
>(http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=9360-QT)
>
>and last night I had one of them just pop out when I slightly pressed on it.
>I then proceeded to easily pop the other side window out. Naturally this
>occurred right after I had spent the last two days fabricating and sanding the
>front windshield faring. After much advice from all the neighbors we
>decided to remove the front fairing and test the windshield and it popped right
out
>also
>
>I believe that the problem was caused by me not roughing up the windows near
>enough on the glue joint, although I am not sure. The 9360 bonded to the
>fiberglass and did not bond at all to the window. Lancair says "we have used
>this for over 10 years without a problem on the windows" and that they always
>rough up both surfaces with 60 grit sand paper before bonding the window.
>
>I am now going to do a test bond on some scrap window with roughing up the
>surface before I decide what to do.
>
>The learning curve continues......
>
>Rob Hickman
>RV-10 (without windows)
>
>
>
>
>**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
>fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)
>
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Ok, the gauntlet has been thrown, not sure in which direction, but heaved it
has been. I'm going for the under. VFR helps, but with a hole for a 430
when affordable. Can I do it for $100k? We'll see....
John J (GlaStar almost back in the air; then wings abuilding)
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Sked
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 8:06 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
Boy have I been waiting for this...I'm not sure I'll answer anything but I'm
sure I'll RAMBLE!!!!
I have pretty much paid for everything at this point, Firewall forward is
done, avionics/electrical are done, interior is halfway with the seats
completed by Classic Aero, Barretts did the engine, standard induction with
chrome package, and custom paint yeah I know CJ, chrome don't get you home.
My panel is pretty crowded but I think very functional full IFR. The bits
and pieces are as follows. 2 AFS 3500, Mx-20 MFD, GNS-480, TT RV-10 AP, PMA
8000 audio, SL-30, GDL-69A, 330 remote transponder, Mt. High 4 place pulse
demand O2, Midcontinent CDI works off GPS & NAV, Back up Airspeed, TT turn
and bank and altimeter, fully lighted fiberglass panel/console and overhead.
I went with the MT 3 blade, one because it look cool, second becasue Russ
Daves ran super smooth..I would go Hartzell if I had to do it over...why?
Stinking cowl is a bear to R & R and I'm not sure it's really worth the
extra dollars. The little stuff will eat you up on the build, FWF package is
5 grand no matter !
how you cut it, Van's or piece it out still about 5 grand. so many otehr
things that just creep up, nuts, epoxy, door handles...oh yeah, mine are the
flush billets...another $500. So where am I going with this??? I'll break it
down-
My original budget was $150,000 max....40 for the kit, 40 for the prop
engine, 40 for the panel and 5 for the interior and 8 for paint. The balance
was for what I didn't know...boy what you don't know...add braided brake
lines/fuel lines, O2...oh yeah...GDL-69...gotta have it, XM music, weather??
Well heck only another $3500!!!, overhead console..SURE!!! Right now minus
paint and carpet/sidepanels I'm just about at 190K...I haven't added the
6-32 locknuts for the baffling rods to the mix yet.
Nutshell engine about 43K, prop almost 9K, avionics, O2 and electrical stuff
including wiring, batteries etc...easily 80k, what really kicks your butt is
SHIPPING...and it's gonna get worse with fuel costs now.
I have no regrets on what I have spent, I really think it is all recoverable
at sale, those close to me know how I like to build so selling this is an
option for me...blood sweat and tears, everything I put in this I did for
resale...but that was not my goal..I have no plans to sell in the near
future, short distant maybe but not near.
Here is my advice if I was going to do it again.
Seriously look at your mission, day night VFR is a good mission...everything
I have ever flown was day/night VFR...because the IFR stuff was always
broke..isn't that why we built our own? because the stuff I was renting was
junk. I'm not IFR rated...only want to be in case I get stuck...I have all
the time in the world to wait out weather.
My ideal RV-10 for me, with hindsight would be...same engine...Barrett's you
guys rock...little more cash but worth it, avionics? 2 AFS 4500's, 430/530
GPS/Nav/COM, TT AP, gotta have a good AP with vertical guidance, if anything
it will allow your PAX properly instructed to get you into the
field...nuther story all together.
Portable O2..., basic transponder, good backup NAV/COM,
Sooooo much more to have a good talk about...and I'm not even flying it yet.
For those wondering....I have to final rivet the cabin top, do the
windshield, put on the door which have been fitted and a boat load of body
work, paint and final interior plus the fairings and pants which have been
fabbed just not final fitted.
I would have been done by now...I'll make a few excuses...one I lost my Dad
in December...kicked my ass, still does. I could not get my head in the game
for three months, two...heh heh...multiple complications from multiple
women...nuff said...46 in years...18 at heart. Burnout and summer
heat...Deems and David can understand the summer heat. Expect burnout, it
comes. Seems the last "few" items take HOURS to complete.
I have and never will set a date for this to fly...it will happen when I go
to grab a part and there are none left...I think September.
So...My initial budget??? I exceeded it by about 50K...only because I
could...but I was realistic in the beginning, I found myself with too fat a
wallet and a whole bunch of GEE WHIZ!!! I gotta have that. Let's finish this
over a brew at RV-10 central in about 6 weeks.
Whew!!!
Rick Sked
40185
please DO NOT ARCHIVE....(especially the women part)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Olson" <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 7:07:27 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
Hey Rick,
Now that you're this far along....give your opinion as to how your views may
or may not have shifted on what you feel the "average" builder will
put into their RV-10. What was your original budget and thoughts,
and how did that come out?
For me, I probably ended up 40-60K over what I originally intended, starting
out and allowing creep as I went along. Just wondering if you have a
perspective change.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Rick Sked wrote:
>
> LOL.....I want a $150K RV-10....Seems mine has slightly exceeded that
> amount
>
> Rick Sked
> 40185
> do not archive
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hysol 9360 Window install update |
Rob,
I did my windows and windscreen with Hysol several months ago, and did scuff the
surface. Did the same with some cutoff plexi and fiberglass from the windscreen
and cabin top. After curing for 1 week I was unable to break the bond without
having the plexi break first. Good luck. I would not look forward to doing
the windows a second time.
Jim Berry
40482
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=190125#190125
Message 16
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Hysol 9360 Window install update |
Rob,
The Lancair ES I help with used a Hysol and flox mix for bonding the
windshield. Not sure if this was the approved factory method or not.
Roughed up and cleaned both surfaces. I used the same method for my
windows and they seem to be solid. I will verify tomorrow.
Bobby Hughes 40116
(Very satisfied AFS customer)
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
RobHickman@aol.com
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 10:25 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Hysol 9360 Window install update
I installed the windows five days ago using Hysol from Lancair
http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=9360-QT
and last night I had one of them just pop out when I slightly pressed on
it. I then proceeded to easily pop the other side window out.
Naturally this occurred right after I had spent the last two days
fabricating and sanding the front windshield faring. After much advice
from all the neighbors we decided to remove the front fairing and test
the windshield and it popped right out also
I believe that the problem was caused by me not roughing up the windows
near enough on the glue joint, although I am not sure. The 9360 bonded
to the fiberglass and did not bond at all to the window. Lancair says
"we have used this for over 10 years without a problem on the windows"
and that they always rough up both surfaces with 60 grit sand paper
before bonding the window.
I am now going to do a test bond on some scrap window with roughing up
the surface before I decide what to do.
The learning curve continues......
Rob Hickman
RV-10 (without windows)
________________________________
Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used
cars <http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007> .
Message 17
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Hysol 9360 Window install update |
Bummer.
I used Hysol for my windshield in the joggle area and per plans for the base
fairing. We put some thin BID over the Hysol junction.
We had the same thing happen with a IV-P windshield. After much running
about and loud talking, we decided it had not cured long enough--only 24
hours. Sounds like you waited longer but if it was cool (below 70F) I might
think it didn't cure fully.
60 grit is pretty severe. 80-120 is fine. Everything has to be clean,
clean, clean. The data says use alcohol but we generally use acetone to
degrease everything just before applying the Hysol. Some people get nervous
with acetone around the windows we've never had a problem.
FWIW, Lancair puts their windows in from the inside, and lays up a pretty
thick layer of BID over the seam. That's really a better way to build it.
You get a cleaner installation but you do have to work inside.
A little heat and a dull chisel should remove the old (new?) Hysol from the
fiberglass.
Here's a fun read:
http://www.loctite.it/int_henkel/loctite/binarydata/pdf/ACF205.pdf
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
RobHickman@aol.com
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 9:25 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Hysol 9360 Window install update
I installed the windows five days ago using Hysol from Lancair
http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=9360-QT
and last night I had one of them just pop out when I slightly pressed on it.
I then proceeded to easily pop the other side window out. Naturally this
occurred right after I had spent the last two days fabricating and sanding
the front windshield faring. After much advice from all the neighbors we
decided to remove the front fairing and test the windshield and it popped
right out also
I believe that the problem was caused by me not roughing up the windows near
enough on the glue joint, although I am not sure. The 9360 bonded to the
fiberglass and did not bond at all to the window. Lancair says "we have
used this for over 10 years without a problem on the windows" and that they
always rough up both surfaces with 60 grit sand paper before bonding the
window.
I am now going to do a test bond on some scrap window with roughing up the
surface before I decide what to do.
The learning curve continues......
Rob Hickman
RV-10 (without windows)
_____
Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used
<http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007> cars.
Message 18
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Rick,
$38,000 sounds about right (to a little low) for the "other
stuff." Door handles, OH consoles, 3rd party Intersection Fairings, oil
quick drain, powder coating, tools, abrasives all add up. I applaud and
appreciate those that take Vans plans, a basic panel, mid time engine
and homemade interior to build a cross country machine for almost half
of my completed -10.
When I give first time flights to friends, young eagles etc...
in my 6A I tell the PAX that what amazes me most about these planes
(referring to the 2 place RV's) is a person earning an average income
can with time and dedication can create a machine in his garage that
will take him and a companion wherever they want to go. Literally. Jon
Johanson's story is an inspiration to me and an example of how sheet
metal & rivets can change someone life and network of friends.
Regarding the panel costs I looked at all my options for a
complete IFR panel and no matter how I mixed and matched components once
I added the Garmin radio/transponder stack and almost any dual/triple
EFIS package (except Dynon) plus the challenge of getting each of these
different components from 5+ different manufacturers to work together my
costs were in the same ball park as the G900X I ultimately ordered. Plus
the G900X has dual 16 Watt Comm's. Then add the WX/Traffic package to
the Garmin and you have taken another step up in costs however at most I
spent $20K more than a comparable component panel but every time I
penciled it out the high end components . Yes I know it's $20K that
could be used for other items on the plane or as the very last resort
send my daughter to college. I asked Hannah when she was really young
"what would you like more, a big shiny new airplane or a college
education" she jumped up and down and said "Airpane, Airpane" so I am
basically following her wishes...
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William
Curtis
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 10:29 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
Rick,
Did you have one (or both) of those aforementioned women do the math on
your spending?:-) Maybe they did a little "shopping" on their own.
By my calculation you have $92,000 in the RV-10 kit, Engine and Prop and
another $45,000 in Avionics. Assuming another $10,000 in paint and
$5,000 for the Oxygen system, this all totals $152,000. That means you
spent another $38,000! on interior and "other stuff." That's a lot of
"stuff."
I'm working on finishing up the exterior and I still have yet to
purchase any major avionics. I'm always intrigued by the builders that
have barely finished major airframe components and have panels bought,
built and paid for only to sit there for the next few years while
products evolve. While all other components in aviation tend to go up
in price, avionics are the only component that you are most often better
off waiting until the last possible moment to buy. Better products
become available, prices go down or you get more for the same price. If
my avionics package began to approach $50K, I'd seriously look at the
G900X system. I'm $20K below that threshold so no G900X for me.
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/91Panel/index.html
-------- Original Message --------
>
> Boy have I been waiting for this...I'm not sure I'll answer anything
but I'm sure I'll RAMBLE!!!!
>
> I have pretty much paid for everything at this point, Firewall forward
is done, avionics/electrical are done, interior is halfway with the
seats completed by Classic Aero, Barretts did the engine, standard
induction with chrome package, and custom paint yeah I know CJ, chrome
don't get you home. My panel is pretty crowded but I think very
functional full IFR. The bits and pieces are as follows. 2 AFS 3500,
Mx-20 MFD, GNS-480, TT RV-10 AP, PMA 8000 audio, SL-30, GDL-69A, 330
remote transponder, Mt. High 4 place pulse demand O2, Midcontinent CDI
works off GPS & NAV, Back up Airspeed, TT turn and bank and altimeter,
fully lighted fiberglass panel/console and overhead. I went with the MT
3 blade, one because it look cool, second becasue Russ Daves ran super
smooth..I would go Hartzell if I had to do it over...why? Stinking cowl
is a bear to R & R and I'm not sure it's really worth the extra dollars.
The little stuff will eat you up on the build, FWF package is 5 grand no
matte!
r !
>
> how you cut it, Van's or piece it out still about 5 grand. so many
otehr things that just creep up, nuts, epoxy, door handles...oh yeah,
mine are the flush billets...another $500. So where am I going with
this??? I'll break it down-
>
> My original budget was $150,000 max....40 for the kit, 40 for the prop
engine, 40 for the panel and 5 for the interior and 8 for paint. The
balance was for what I didn't know...boy what you don't know...add
braided brake lines/fuel lines, O2...oh yeah...GDL-69...gotta have it,
XM music, weather?? Well heck only another $3500!!!, overhead
console..SURE!!! Right now minus paint and carpet/sidepanels I'm just
about at 190K...I haven't added the 6-32 locknuts for the baffling rods
to the mix yet.
>
> Nutshell engine about 43K, prop almost 9K, avionics, O2 and electrical
stuff including wiring, batteries etc...easily 80k, what really kicks
your butt is SHIPPING...and it's gonna get worse with fuel costs now.
>
> I have no regrets on what I have spent, I really think it is all
recoverable at sale, those close to me know how I like to build so
selling this is an option for me...blood sweat and tears, everything I
put in this I did for resale...but that was not my goal..I have no plans
to sell in the near future, short distant maybe but not near.
>
> Here is my advice if I was going to do it again.
>
> Seriously look at your mission, day night VFR is a good
mission...everything I have ever flown was day/night VFR...because the
IFR stuff was always broke..isn't that why we built our own? because the
stuff I was renting was junk. I'm not IFR rated...only want to be in
case I get stuck...I have all the time in the world to wait out weather.
>
> My ideal RV-10 for me, with hindsight would be...same
engine...Barrett's you guys rock...little more cash but worth it,
avionics? 2 AFS 4500's, 430/530 GPS/Nav/COM, TT AP, gotta have a good AP
with vertical guidance, if anything it will allow your PAX properly
instructed to get you into the field...nuther story all together.
>
> Portable O2..., basic transponder, good backup NAV/COM,
>
> Sooooo much more to have a good talk about...and I'm not even flying
it yet. For those wondering....I have to final rivet the cabin top, do
the windshield, put on the door which have been fitted and a boat load
of body work, paint and final interior plus the fairings and pants which
have been fabbed just not final fitted.
>
> I would have been done by now...I'll make a few excuses...one I lost
my Dad in December...kicked my ass, still does. I could not get my head
in the game for three months, two...heh heh...multiple complications
from multiple women...nuff said...46 in years...18 at heart. Burnout and
summer heat...Deems and David can understand the summer heat. Expect
burnout, it comes. Seems the last "few" items take HOURS to complete.
>
> I have and never will set a date for this to fly...it will happen when
I go to grab a part and there are none left...I think September.
>
> So...My initial budget??? I exceeded it by about 50K...only because I
could...but I was realistic in the beginning, I found myself with too
fat a wallet and a whole bunch of GEE WHIZ!!! I gotta have that. Let's
finish this over a brew at RV-10 central in about 6 weeks.
>
> Whew!!!
>
> Rick Sked
> 40185
> please DO NOT ARCHIVE....(especially the women part)
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tim Olson" <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 7:07:27 PM (GMT-0800)
America/Los_Angeles
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
>
>
> Hey Rick,
>
> Now that you're this far along....give your opinion as to how your
views
> may or may not have shifted on what you feel the "average" builder
will
> put into their RV-10. What was your original budget and thoughts,
> and how did that come out?
>
> For me, I probably ended up 40-60K over what I originally intended,
> starting out and allowing creep as I went along. Just wondering
> if you have a perspective change.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
> Rick Sked wrote:
> >
> > LOL.....I want a $150K RV-10....Seems mine has slightly exceeded
that amount
> >
> > Rick Sked
> > 40185
> > do not archive
>
>
>
Message 19
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Cabin Floor Panels |
I'm at the point of riveting in the cabin floor panels and wonder if
I should hold off for any antennae or electrical run considerations.
What say you?
Jef Carpenter
40304
Message 20
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
>Regarding the panel costs I looked at all my options for a complete IFR panel
and no matter how I mixed and matched components once I added the Garmin radio/transponder
stack and almost any dual/triple EFIS package (except Dynon) plus
the challenge of getting each of these different components from 5+ different
manufacturers to work together my costs were in the same ball park as the G900X
I ultimately ordered. Plus the G900X has dual 16 Watt Comm's.
This thread has segwayed from wing tiedown hight, to jacks, to RV-10 cost and now
to panel costs. Maybe we should talk about primers next.
Must be that new math I keep hearing about. These are my numbers for some different
configurations.
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/91Panel/index.html
>From my calculation, a basic non-syn vision G900X is still $41,500 more than my
(AFS-EFIS AFS-EM, GNS-430, GTX-330, PS-8000B, Icom A210, TruTrak IIVSG) configuration.
Even if I were to add a second GNS-430 for a ~comparable~ (and I use
that term loosely) system, I'm still $34,000 away from a G900X. I'd love to
have a G900X, but no matter how thick a rose colored glasses I put on, I can't
justify it.
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/
-------- Original Message --------
> X-Rcpt-To: <wcurtis@nerv10.com>
>
>
> Rick,
> $38,000 sounds about right (to a little low) for the "other
> stuff." Door handles, OH consoles, 3rd party Intersection Fairings, oil
> quick drain, powder coating, tools, abrasives all add up. I applaud and
> appreciate those that take Vans plans, a basic panel, mid time engine
> and homemade interior to build a cross country machine for almost half
> of my completed -10.
> When I give first time flights to friends, young eagles etc...
> in my 6A I tell the PAX that what amazes me most about these planes
> (referring to the 2 place RV's) is a person earning an average income
> can with time and dedication can create a machine in his garage that
> will take him and a companion wherever they want to go. Literally. Jon
> Johanson's story is an inspiration to me and an example of how sheet
> metal & rivets can change someone life and network of friends.
> Regarding the panel costs I looked at all my options for a
> complete IFR panel and no matter how I mixed and matched components once
> I added the Garmin radio/transponder stack and almost any dual/triple
> EFIS package (except Dynon) plus the challenge of getting each of these
> different components from 5+ different manufacturers to work together my
> costs were in the same ball park as the G900X I ultimately ordered. Plus
> the G900X has dual 16 Watt Comm's. Then add the WX/Traffic package to
> the Garmin and you have taken another step up in costs however at most I
> spent $20K more than a comparable component panel but every time I
> penciled it out the high end components . Yes I know it's $20K that
> could be used for other items on the plane or as the very last resort
> send my daughter to college. I asked Hannah when she was really young
> "what would you like more, a big shiny new airplane or a college
> education" she jumped up and down and said "Airpane, Airpane" so I am
> basically following her wishes...
>
> Robin
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William
> Curtis
> Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 10:29 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
>
>
> Rick,
>
> Did you have one (or both) of those aforementioned women do the math on
> your spending?:-) Maybe they did a little "shopping" on their own.
>
> By my calculation you have $92,000 in the RV-10 kit, Engine and Prop and
> another $45,000 in Avionics. Assuming another $10,000 in paint and
> $5,000 for the Oxygen system, this all totals $152,000. That means you
> spent another $38,000! on interior and "other stuff." That's a lot of
> "stuff."
>
> I'm working on finishing up the exterior and I still have yet to
> purchase any major avionics. I'm always intrigued by the builders that
> have barely finished major airframe components and have panels bought,
> built and paid for only to sit there for the next few years while
> products evolve. While all other components in aviation tend to go up
> in price, avionics are the only component that you are most often better
> off waiting until the last possible moment to buy. Better products
> become available, prices go down or you get more for the same price. If
> my avionics package began to approach $50K, I'd seriously look at the
> G900X system. I'm $20K below that threshold so no G900X for me.
>
> William
> http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/91Panel/index.html
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> >
> > Boy have I been waiting for this...I'm not sure I'll answer anything
> but I'm sure I'll RAMBLE!!!!
> >
> > I have pretty much paid for everything at this point, Firewall forward
> is done, avionics/electrical are done, interior is halfway with the
> seats completed by Classic Aero, Barretts did the engine, standard
> induction with chrome package, and custom paint yeah I know CJ, chrome
> don't get you home. My panel is pretty crowded but I think very
> functional full IFR. The bits and pieces are as follows. 2 AFS 3500,
> Mx-20 MFD, GNS-480, TT RV-10 AP, PMA 8000 audio, SL-30, GDL-69A, 330
> remote transponder, Mt. High 4 place pulse demand O2, Midcontinent CDI
> works off GPS & NAV, Back up Airspeed, TT turn and bank and altimeter,
> fully lighted fiberglass panel/console and overhead. I went with the MT
> 3 blade, one because it look cool, second becasue Russ Daves ran super
> smooth..I would go Hartzell if I had to do it over...why? Stinking cowl
> is a bear to R & R and I'm not sure it's really worth the extra dollars.
> The little stuff will eat you up on the build, FWF package is 5 grand no
> matte!
> r !
> >
> > how you cut it, Van's or piece it out still about 5 grand. so many
> otehr things that just creep up, nuts, epoxy, door handles...oh yeah,
> mine are the flush billets...another $500. So where am I going with
> this??? I'll break it down-
> >
> > My original budget was $150,000 max....40 for the kit, 40 for the prop
> engine, 40 for the panel and 5 for the interior and 8 for paint. The
> balance was for what I didn't know...boy what you don't know...add
> braided brake lines/fuel lines, O2...oh yeah...GDL-69...gotta have it,
> XM music, weather?? Well heck only another $3500!!!, overhead
> console..SURE!!! Right now minus paint and carpet/sidepanels I'm just
> about at 190K...I haven't added the 6-32 locknuts for the baffling rods
> to the mix yet.
> >
> > Nutshell engine about 43K, prop almost 9K, avionics, O2 and electrical
> stuff including wiring, batteries etc...easily 80k, what really kicks
> your butt is SHIPPING...and it's gonna get worse with fuel costs now.
> >
> > I have no regrets on what I have spent, I really think it is all
> recoverable at sale, those close to me know how I like to build so
> selling this is an option for me...blood sweat and tears, everything I
> put in this I did for resale...but that was not my goal..I have no plans
> to sell in the near future, short distant maybe but not near.
> >
> > Here is my advice if I was going to do it again.
> >
> > Seriously look at your mission, day night VFR is a good
> mission...everything I have ever flown was day/night VFR...because the
> IFR stuff was always broke..isn't that why we built our own? because the
> stuff I was renting was junk. I'm not IFR rated...only want to be in
> case I get stuck...I have all the time in the world to wait out weather.
> >
> > My ideal RV-10 for me, with hindsight would be...same
> engine...Barrett's you guys rock...little more cash but worth it,
> avionics? 2 AFS 4500's, 430/530 GPS/Nav/COM, TT AP, gotta have a good AP
> with vertical guidance, if anything it will allow your PAX properly
> instructed to get you into the field...nuther story all together.
> >
> > Portable O2..., basic transponder, good backup NAV/COM,
> >
> > Sooooo much more to have a good talk about...and I'm not even flying
> it yet. For those wondering....I have to final rivet the cabin top, do
> the windshield, put on the door which have been fitted and a boat load
> of body work, paint and final interior plus the fairings and pants which
> have been fabbed just not final fitted.
> >
> > I would have been done by now...I'll make a few excuses...one I lost
> my Dad in December...kicked my ass, still does. I could not get my head
> in the game for three months, two...heh heh...multiple complications
> from multiple women...nuff said...46 in years...18 at heart. Burnout and
> summer heat...Deems and David can understand the summer heat. Expect
> burnout, it comes. Seems the last "few" items take HOURS to complete.
> >
> > I have and never will set a date for this to fly...it will happen when
> I go to grab a part and there are none left...I think September.
> >
> > So...My initial budget??? I exceeded it by about 50K...only because I
> could...but I was realistic in the beginning, I found myself with too
> fat a wallet and a whole bunch of GEE WHIZ!!! I gotta have that. Let's
> finish this over a brew at RV-10 central in about 6 weeks.
> >
> > Whew!!!
> >
> > Rick Sked
> > 40185
> > please DO NOT ARCHIVE....(especially the women part)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tim Olson" <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> > To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 7:07:27 PM (GMT-0800)
> America/Los_Angeles
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
> >
> >
> > Hey Rick,
> >
> > Now that you're this far along....give your opinion as to how your
> views
> > may or may not have shifted on what you feel the "average" builder
> will
> > put into their RV-10. What was your original budget and thoughts,
> > and how did that come out?
> >
> > For me, I probably ended up 40-60K over what I originally intended,
> > starting out and allowing creep as I went along. Just wondering
> > if you have a perspective change.
> >
> > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> > do not archive
> >
> >
> > Rick Sked wrote:
> > >
> > > LOL.....I want a $150K RV-10....Seems mine has slightly exceeded
> that amount
> > >
> > > Rick Sked
> > > 40185
> > > do not archive
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 21
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Flightline Interiors trim |
I have installed the Flightline Interior and really like it a lot. Easy to
install and looks great. The trim around the windows also looks really
nice, however it has shrunk some and therefore pulled away from the edges
never to return.
Has anyone else had any issues like this? The edging isn't terribly
expensive but if there's something I can do to prevent this from happening
again I'd sure like to. I'll fire a message off to Abbey as well to see if
they have any guidance.
BTW, 330 hours and no cracks on the SB issue.
Marcus
Message 22
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Cabin Floor Panels |
No reason I see to hold off. You can put the transponder antenna in the tunnel
and for any belly antenna, they are typically located under the rear seats /
baggage area.
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/08fuselage/index35.html
-------- Original Message --------
> X-Rcpt-To: <wcurtis@nerv10.com>
>
>
> I'm at the point of riveting in the cabin floor panels and wonder if
> I should hold off for any antennae or electrical run considerations.
> What say you?
>
> Jef Carpenter
> 40304
>
Message 23
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Chrome Plating the steps |
How much should I expect to pay to have my steps chrome plated?
Jeff Carpenter
40304
Message 24
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flightline Interiors trim |
I haven't seen this on mine, but, the trim is made out of various
fabrics or materials depending on your interior choice, right? So,
one fabric may have shrinkage while another might not....or perhaps
people use various selections of adhesives? I used gel contact
cement on mine. Just wonder if it was that particular material.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Marcus Cooper wrote:
> I have installed the Flightline Interior and really like it a lot. Easy
> to install and looks great. The trim around the windows also looks
> really nice, however it has shrunk some and therefore pulled away from
> the edges never to return.
>
>
>
> Has anyone else had any issues like this? The edging isnt terribly
> expensive but if theres something I can do to prevent this from
> happening again Id sure like to. Ill fire a message off to Abbey as
> well to see if they have any guidance.
>
>
>
> BTW, 330 hours and no cracks on the SB issue.
>
>
>
> Marcus
>
>
Message 25
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flightline Interiors trim |
I've got Abby's interior also, but have not yet seen this. Mine has been i
n
since last summer.
grumpy-N184JM
do not archive
In a message dated 6/27/2008 5:30:02 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
Tim@MyRV10.com writes:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com>
I haven't seen this on mine, but, the trim is made out of various
fabrics or materials depending on your interior choice, right? So,
one fabric may have shrinkage while another might not....or perhaps
people use various selections of adhesives? I used gel contact
cement on mine. Just wonder if it was that particular material.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Marcus Cooper wrote:
> I have installed the Flightline Interior and really like it a lot. Easy
> to install and looks great. The trim around the windows also looks
> really nice, however it has shrunk some and therefore pulled away from
> the edges never to return.
>
>
>
> Has anyone else had any issues like this? The edging isn=99t terri
bly
> expensive but if there=99s something I can do to prevent this from
> happening again I=99d sure like to. I=99ll fire a message off
to Abbey as
> well to see if they have any guidance.
>
>
>
> BTW, 330 hours and no cracks on the SB issue.
>
>
>
> Marcus
>
>
**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050
000000007)
Message 26
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Chrome Plating the steps |
Mine were $150.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Carpenter
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 2:53 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Chrome Plating the steps
How much should I expect to pay to have my steps chrome plated?
Jeff Carpenter
40304
Message 27
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Chrome Plating the steps |
I powder coated mine as part of a batch which really reduces the
cost/unit.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 4:09 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Chrome Plating the steps
Mine were $150.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff
Carpenter
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 2:53 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Chrome Plating the steps
How much should I expect to pay to have my steps chrome plated?
Jeff Carpenter
40304
Message 28
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Any reputable auto parts store will sell Gates Belts or can interchange the
part number. Gates is a first choice in the parts business. Specs on the
7365 at
http://www.gatespowerpro.com/Comergent/en/US/adirect/gates?cmd=catProductDet
ail
Hope this helps!
Bill S
7a Ark
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Dunne
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 5:21 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Alternator belt
Anyone know the actual length of the alternator belt to suit the standard
alternator as supplied by Vans?
I was supplied a standard belt at 37.6" (Korean made 37A19773-376) but I'm
guessing the maximum I can use is around 32-33''?
I know this was mentioned recently as a Gates number 7365 XL110925 but when
I mention these numbers around here I get blank looks.
Do these numbers somehow equate to the length of belt?
Any clues appreciated
John 40315
Message 29
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Cabin Floor Panels |
Jeff, nothing under the floors for me. Never even removed them from the
QB.
I mounted two commant antennas and ran conduit under the rear baggage floors
similar to Tim Olson and Deems Davis. Then bought an air blind rivet gun
and locked 'em all down.
PS - It's much warmer here now.
Dave Leikam
#40496 N89DA (Reserved)
Muskego, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Carpenter" <jeff@westcottpress.com>
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 4:12 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Cabin Floor Panels
>
> I'm at the point of riveting in the cabin floor panels and wonder if I
> should hold off for any antennae or electrical run considerations. What
> say you?
>
> Jef Carpenter
> 40304
>
>
>
Message 30
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Cost to build to date |
Since my midnight rant revealed my darkest secrets I figured I outta put out some
more accurate numbers, FWIW Dewar's white label DOES NOT make you better at
this :)
Some of my spreadsheet numbers
Engine $44,000
Panel $78,000 includes panel and assembly, O2 and GDL 69A, Jepp subscription
Prop $9000
Seats $3800k
Kit 40,000 with shipping
FWF $5,000
wire & terminals plus a few special tools $1,200
Antennas $500
Hardware including handles and sheet/angle and nuts and bolts, clamps wire ties
etc, $2500
Composite stuff, epoxy glass cloth, fillers, primers etc $1500
Rudder trim $400
Batteries-$220
overhead-$1000
Stein vents $600
Totals $185,220
Add $2000 to finish interior
$8000 to paint
Brings me around $195,000
So Booya!!! (thats gang speak for a shotgun blast) William!!! I was really coming
off the cuff last night, I pulled rounded numbers tonight from my spreadsheet,
I still have a boat load of nickel and dime spruce invoices to input but I'm
still around 200K all said and done but it's still half of a similarly equipped
Cirrus.
Bottom line, if I had ran my build like I run my own personal finances I would
have really held to the budget, I set aside $175 as my original no kidding budget,
even though I shot for $150 and failed. heck I failed at the $175 part!!
Understand that there is at least $5000 in tools I have not even considered in
this which really is in there somewhere.
I strived to make this the best equipped and finished aircraft I could build, for
example I have at least $300 in adel clamps for the hoses and wiring, I have
a bunch left over but ordered so I would not run out while building, I have
a full set and sizes of AN bolts/nuts/washers/rivets you name it.... you could
say I set up a repair shop. Some of the hoses ran over $100 each with internal
fire sleeved hoses....bottom line....I dated my behind off, kept some very special
friends happy...AND managed to take one of them otta town a few times...and
almost finished this airplane. Plus I work about 10 to 11 hours a day at
least 6 days a week on average at the largest construction project in this Country's
history. Can all that fit on my headstone?
So....Leaso learned? figure it's gonna cost you at least 20 grand more than you
figured...unless your Dutch...then it will only be about $60 thousand, I think
that's what Van said his cost a month ago :)
Oh yeah, about $800 a year in builders risk insurance.
Rick Sked, single, catch me if you can! But I'm feeling like I'm ready to be caught
by one of them.
40185
Almost done...sorta
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "William Curtis" <wcurtis@nerv10.com>
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 10:29:29 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
Rick,
Did you have one (or both) of those aforementioned women do the math on your spending?:-)
Maybe they did a little "shopping" on their own.
By my calculation you have $92,000 in the RV-10 kit, Engine and Prop and another
$45,000 in Avionics. Assuming another $10,000 in paint and $5,000 for the Oxygen
system, this all totals $152,000. That means you spent another $38,000!
on interior and "other stuff." That's a lot of "stuff."
I'm working on finishing up the exterior and I still have yet to purchase any major
avionics. I'm always intrigued by the builders that have barely finished
major airframe components and have panels bought, built and paid for only to
sit there for the next few years while products evolve. While all other components
in aviation tend to go up in price, avionics are the only component that
you are most often better off waiting until the last possible moment to buy.
Better products become available, prices go down or you get more for the same
price. If my avionics package began to approach $50K, I'd seriously look at
the G900X system. I'm $20K below that threshold so no G900X for me.
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/91Panel/index.html
-------- Original Message --------
>
> Boy have I been waiting for this...I'm not sure I'll answer anything but I'm
sure I'll RAMBLE!!!!
>
> I have pretty much paid for everything at this point, Firewall forward is done,
avionics/electrical are done, interior is halfway with the seats completed
by Classic Aero, Barretts did the engine, standard induction with chrome package,
and custom paint yeah I know CJ, chrome don't get you home. My panel is pretty
crowded but I think very functional full IFR. The bits and pieces are as
follows. 2 AFS 3500, Mx-20 MFD, GNS-480, TT RV-10 AP, PMA 8000 audio, SL-30, GDL-69A,
330 remote transponder, Mt. High 4 place pulse demand O2, Midcontinent
CDI works off GPS & NAV, Back up Airspeed, TT turn and bank and altimeter, fully
lighted fiberglass panel/console and overhead. I went with the MT 3 blade,
one because it look cool, second becasue Russ Daves ran super smooth..I would
go Hartzell if I had to do it over...why? Stinking cowl is a bear to R & R and
I'm not sure it's really worth the extra dollars. The little stuff will eat
you up on the build, FWF package is 5 grand no matte!
r !
>
> how you cut it, Van's or piece it out still about 5 grand. so many otehr things
that just creep up, nuts, epoxy, door handles...oh yeah, mine are the flush
billets...another $500. So where am I going with this??? I'll break it down-
>
> My original budget was $150,000 max....40 for the kit, 40 for the prop engine,
40 for the panel and 5 for the interior and 8 for paint. The balance was for
what I didn't know...boy what you don't know...add braided brake lines/fuel lines,
O2...oh yeah...GDL-69...gotta have it, XM music, weather?? Well heck only
another $3500!!!, overhead console..SURE!!! Right now minus paint and carpet/sidepanels
I'm just about at 190K...I haven't added the 6-32 locknuts for the
baffling rods to the mix yet.
>
> Nutshell engine about 43K, prop almost 9K, avionics, O2 and electrical stuff
including wiring, batteries etc...easily 80k, what really kicks your butt is SHIPPING...and
it's gonna get worse with fuel costs now.
>
> I have no regrets on what I have spent, I really think it is all recoverable
at sale, those close to me know how I like to build so selling this is an option
for me...blood sweat and tears, everything I put in this I did for resale...but
that was not my goal..I have no plans to sell in the near future, short distant
maybe but not near.
>
> Here is my advice if I was going to do it again.
>
> Seriously look at your mission, day night VFR is a good mission...everything
I have ever flown was day/night VFR...because the IFR stuff was always broke..isn't
that why we built our own? because the stuff I was renting was junk. I'm
not IFR rated...only want to be in case I get stuck...I have all the time in
the world to wait out weather.
>
> My ideal RV-10 for me, with hindsight would be...same engine...Barrett's you
guys rock...little more cash but worth it, avionics? 2 AFS 4500's, 430/530 GPS/Nav/COM,
TT AP, gotta have a good AP with vertical guidance, if anything it will
allow your PAX properly instructed to get you into the field...nuther story
all together.
>
> Portable O2..., basic transponder, good backup NAV/COM,
>
> Sooooo much more to have a good talk about...and I'm not even flying it yet.
For those wondering....I have to final rivet the cabin top, do the windshield,
put on the door which have been fitted and a boat load of body work, paint and
final interior plus the fairings and pants which have been fabbed just not final
fitted.
>
> I would have been done by now...I'll make a few excuses...one I lost my Dad in
December...kicked my ass, still does. I could not get my head in the game for
three months, two...heh heh...multiple complications from multiple women...nuff
said...46 in years...18 at heart. Burnout and summer heat...Deems and David
can understand the summer heat. Expect burnout, it comes. Seems the last "few"
items take HOURS to complete.
>
> I have and never will set a date for this to fly...it will happen when I go to
grab a part and there are none left...I think September.
>
> So...My initial budget??? I exceeded it by about 50K...only because I could...but
I was realistic in the beginning, I found myself with too fat a wallet and
a whole bunch of GEE WHIZ!!! I gotta have that. Let's finish this over a brew
at RV-10 central in about 6 weeks.
>
> Whew!!!
>
> Rick Sked
> 40185
> please DO NOT ARCHIVE....(especially the women part)
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tim Olson" <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 7:07:27 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Quick Question
>
>
> Hey Rick,
>
> Now that you're this far along....give your opinion as to how your views
> may or may not have shifted on what you feel the "average" builder will
> put into their RV-10. What was your original budget and thoughts,
> and how did that come out?
>
> For me, I probably ended up 40-60K over what I originally intended,
> starting out and allowing creep as I went along. Just wondering
> if you have a perspective change.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
> Rick Sked wrote:
> >
> > LOL.....I want a $150K RV-10....Seems mine has slightly exceeded that amount
> >
> > Rick Sked
> > 40185
> > do not archive
>
>
>
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|